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JasonJohnHorn
11-28-2010, 02:47 AM
With LA and the Spurs playing so well, the Heat so drastically underachieving, it seems the Mavs may have gone unnoticed by a lot of fans.

Dirk is Dirk and is putting out the same all-star performance he's been putting out for years now, Kidd is slowed a little, but is still very effective, Terry, Marion and Haywood coming off the bench right now makes for likely the best three-man combo the league has coming off the bench, and what I think is the most important piece they have added: Tyson Chandler.

If Chandler stays healthy and provides the interior defence and monster rebounding that helped the Hornets push the spurs to game 7 in the conference semis a couple years back, this Mavs team will finally have the one thing it has sorely been lacking every since they drafted Dirk: A dominant interior presence. And yes, Chandler is capable of being DOMINANT in the paint. He is one of the best shot blockers the league has, and one of the best rebounders when he's playing his game, and the last few games he has been playing his game.

So, the question now is: Is this the best tems Cuban has yet to put on the floor?

I am not a Mavs fan, and certainly not a Cuban fan, but as a nuetral fan looking over across the league, I sincerely think this Mavs squad is better than any team in the East outside of Boston, and I believe they are the only team with the depth and talent required to beat the Lakers or Spurs (though I would still take LA in a 7-game series).

thoughts?

ink
11-28-2010, 02:53 AM
No offence to Mavs fans but I haven't seen anything that special about this team. They're good, but they've been consistently good for a decade.

Raph12
11-28-2010, 02:54 AM
Deja vu... There was a thread just like this last season, you know when the Mavs lost in the 1st round after finishing 2nd in the West.

ChiSox219
11-28-2010, 02:58 AM
They'll have a good regular season but I'm skeptical when it comes to the playoffs. They severally lack athleticism and I could see the Thunder tearing them apart in a 7 game series.

Tyson Chandler does look like an all-star though.

LTBaByyy
11-28-2010, 03:00 AM
Deja vu... There was a thread just like this last season, you know when the Mavs lost in the 1st round after finishing 2nd in the West.

You have no reason to hate, what have the magic done?

We have a better record than yall without our starting 2 guard that hasnt played a game yet

We beat boston, okc, hornets, spurs, and miami which were all undefeated or on winning streaks except miami

Were a top 3/4 defense in the league which has never happened (check stats)

We are a different team than last year and the past, watch a mavs game first THIS season b4 you talk bc I believe yall have as many finals appearances and championships as us

Give some props dude no need to bash

stlbest5in2013
11-28-2010, 03:03 AM
its not that they are unnoticed. its the fact they were the odds on favorite to win it all, and got knocked out by the 8th seed a few years ago. plus they have always been known as a soft team since cuban owned them, not his fault.

i, and as i think, others feel that they have to prove more than what they have so far early this year. its not personal, but people have been fooled by this team many many times

lakers4sho
11-28-2010, 03:14 AM
Mavs are a good regular season team; they have always been since the early 2000's. Whether that will translate to playoff success [ however you want to define such a term ] this time around is yet to be determined.

momoneyyyy
11-28-2010, 03:18 AM
im excited for the mavs this year i cant wait for them to play the lakers and show everyone what they are really about. they have the size for the lakers so that shouldnt be that much of a problem. i cant wait im predicting that to be the wcf but maybe im just being a homer.

DoJoTheSlasher
11-28-2010, 03:25 AM
Just look at my sig for Chandlers last 3 games :)

This year, I really do think we will go to the WCF. Dampier was NEVER this dominant on either side of the court like Chandler has been. Chandler is an ELITE center in terms of rebounding and defense and should easily get top 5 DPOY voting. Dirk is top 5 in the game still and Kidd is still an elite floor leader. Terry is on and off.... as is Butler. Marion is a very good bench player who is capable of locking down anyone and coming in the game and giving 12 points and 7 boards. All of this, and Roddy Beaubois, who really could average 17-20 ppg this year hasn't played yet.

Butler, Terry and Haywood are the 3 that we need to watch. All three, especially Haywood and Butler have been pretty much worthless.

I predict we go to the WCf and lose in 6 or 7 to LA. This year, we actually are legit.

redsox0717
11-28-2010, 03:27 AM
This thread would not have been created if the Mavericks did not beat the Heat. So this is the best Mavericks team just because they are off to a decent start? NO.

DoJoTheSlasher
11-28-2010, 03:30 AM
Why are we "better" and legit contenders to win the Western Conference? DEFENSE

Tyson Chandler, Deshawn Stevenson and Shawn Marion have anchored this defense which has caused Kidd, Terry, Nowitzki, Butler and other players like Mahinmi to play solid defnse in their little time. Chandler, Marion and Stevenson are all REALLY good defenders with Chandler and Marion being among the tops at their postions.

Sadds The Gr8
11-28-2010, 03:33 AM
This is the time of year where the dominate...create this thread in April and i'll be impressed.

numba1CHANGsta
11-28-2010, 03:35 AM
The 2006 Mavs team was the best but this year's team is very solid

John Walls Era
11-28-2010, 03:39 AM
In the last 2 years, I've said the Mavs were going to win, but they fail to even make it pass the first round. Lets talk about this when they make the Western Finals.

Dol-Fan
11-28-2010, 03:42 AM
They're really good and keep adding nice pieces, but they also get older every year. I want to see how they hold up over the year.

jimbobjarree
11-28-2010, 04:13 AM
decent start, I dont get why we need a thread about them, when like 6 or 7 other teams have the same(ish) record as them, and they're only 3rd in their own division. I mean, who hasnt beat the Heat, although beating the Spurs was impressive.

The Jazz beat the hornets and Lakers these past few days, maybe I should make a thread like this for them too?

ragee
11-28-2010, 04:45 AM
Mavs fan here... You know who the best Mavs team is? The one that lost to the Warriors in the first round a couple of seasons ago... That is if you want you are going to base it in regular season performance... There is no doubt we are one of the best teams during the regular seasons but since Wade beat us in the finals a couple of years ago, we haven't really able to carry that success in the playoffs... So until that happens, I am not going to make any bold statements...

What I like about the Mavs right now is that we are really playing good defense... I think Chandler is a great addition to our team... He is giving us the toughness, heart and hustle that we are lacking... Other than that, it is the same old Mavs... This team has the talent to beat any team in the playoffs but if other players aside from Dirk can't score consistently in the playoffs, it is going to be tough for us to advance...

JayW_1023
11-28-2010, 04:57 AM
I like their team, and if Cuban for once stops tinkering with their line-up midseason, I can see them as a contender. But they need to prove they are also great as a postseason squad instead of just a great regular season squad.

Stuckey#3
11-28-2010, 04:59 AM
This is the best Mavs team in a few years. Now they just have to trade Haywood to the Pistons for Rip Hamilton and they can win a ship.

JayW_1023
11-28-2010, 05:10 AM
^^^
Disagreed. Against big teams like LA, San Antonio and Boston they could use all the solid bigs they have.

In fact, the reason they are playing well is their added size and rebounding prowess. Trading Haywood is a mistake because how many teams have a backup center that would start on most teams?

Baller1
11-28-2010, 05:13 AM
Every single year, it's the same thing.

Regular season team, nothing more to it. So I don't really pay much attention to them, they're just there to screw everyone else out of a better seed.

Mavrix
11-28-2010, 05:50 AM
You have no reason to hate, what have the magic done?

We have a better record than yall without our starting 2 guard that hasnt played a game yet

We beat boston, okc, hornets, spurs, and miami which were all undefeated or on winning streaks except miami

Were a top 3/4 defense in the league which has never happened (check stats)

We are a different team than last year and the past, watch a mavs game first THIS season b4 you talk bc I believe yall have as many finals appearances and championships as us

Give some props dude no need to bash
Lovin this post

Mavrix
11-28-2010, 05:51 AM
Every single year, it's the same thing.

Regular season team, nothing more to it. So I don't really pay much attention to them, they're just there to screw everyone else out of a better seed.

Your Thunder are NOT that important. Just an FYI.

Mavrix
11-28-2010, 05:53 AM
Mavs fan here... You know who the best Mavs team is? The one that lost to the Warriors in the first round a couple of seasons ago... That is if you want you are going to base it in regular season performance... There is no doubt we are one of the best teams during the regular seasons but since Wade beat us in the finals a couple of years ago, we haven't really able to carry that success in the playoffs... So until that happens, I am not going to make any bold statements...

What I like about the Mavs right now is that we are really playing good defense... I think Chandler is a great addition to our team... He is giving us the toughness, heart and hustle that we are lacking... Other than that, it is the same old Mavs... This team has the talent to beat any team in the playoffs but if other players aside from Dirk can't score consistently in the playoffs, it is going to be tough for us to advance...Agree to this completely.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 06:04 AM
Your Thunder are NOT that important. Just an FYI.

:laugh2: Long time no talk.

Hey, why don't you climb back into that hole you went into when the Mavericks got embarrassed by San Antonio.

I think I speak for everyone when I say we missed your complete bias in every post you make. Because I remember this exact situation last season when the Mavs won 13 in a row.

:laugh2:

Mochalman
11-28-2010, 06:05 AM
Every single year, it's the same thing.

Regular season team, nothing more to it. So I don't really pay much attention to them, they're just there to screw everyone else out of a better seed.

till the Thunder get past the first round or the finals i wouldnt think you have room to talk

Baller1
11-28-2010, 06:08 AM
till the Thunder get past the first round or the finals i wouldnt think you have room to talk

A decade of disappointment, compared to a breakout year that no one expected to happen.

Get out of here.

Mochalman
11-28-2010, 06:13 AM
A decade of disappointment, compared to a breakout year that no one expected to happen.

Get out of here.

yeaaaaaah, no thanks I like being here.

Jenceman
11-28-2010, 06:26 AM
A decade of disappointment, compared to a breakout year that no one expected to happen.

Get out of here.

Yeah **** the Mavs

NFC west for the win right baller?

Jenceman
11-28-2010, 06:34 AM
A decade of disappointment, compared to a breakout year that no one expected to happen.

Get out of here.

Yeah **** the Mavs

NFC west for the win right baller?

OA SLAY
11-28-2010, 07:17 AM
17 games, relax

Rangerchick
11-28-2010, 08:39 AM
There are a few things I'm still waiting on:

How about we wait to see if Chandler can actually stay healthy for the whole season for the first time in 3 years? The downside of that is if he can he's going to have a lot of teams after him in the offseason and he could leave as a FA after the season.

Also, still hope we can land a better backup PF at the deadline. Marion is too undersized and Cardinal/Ajinca/Mahinmi are deep subs. I wonder if Shawne Williams can keep his head on straight with the Legends, enough so we end up buying his contract and he gives us some decent minutes at PF.

Also, once Beaubois comes back we'll have a deeper bench with Stevenson back to being a niche 10-min/game backup SG/SF/defensive stopper he's supposed to be. He's overexposed as a starter.

I'd like to see how the team does at full strength for the entire season.

ragee
11-28-2010, 08:57 AM
A decade of disappointment, compared to a breakout year that no one expected to happen.

Get out of here.

A decade of disappointment? How many teams have won a title this decade? How was the Mavs before this decade? Sure, we haven't gotten a title yet but I am sure we have accomplished more than what the Mavs of the 90s accomplished... I am also sure we have accomplished more the most of the teams in the league...

I like the Thunder and they have great potential but I wouldn't talk big on your team when they have yet to prove anything as well... What have the Sonics/Thunder franchise done in this decade? I do hope you guys would go far and maybe get a championship if none of my teams could get it but there is on flaw in your roster that is really hard to fill... You guys lack a good center... Good luck with that...

ragee
11-28-2010, 09:00 AM
This is the best Mavs team in a few years. Now they just have to trade Haywood to the Pistons for Rip Hamilton and they can win a ship.

Hell no! It took us forever to get a good center! Now that we got 2, I think it would be better to hold on to them... Plus, Haywood is our insurance policy just in case Chandler gets injured or walks next season(crossing all my fingers)...

tangent12
11-28-2010, 09:02 AM
Look good during the season and just fail miserably come playoff time. Story of their life.

Hunter48MVP
11-28-2010, 11:50 AM
Deja vu... There was a thread just like this last season, you know when the Mavs lost in the 1st round after finishing 2nd in the West.

Exactly. They are good in the regular season but, they choke to much in the playoffs. And why are talking about the Mavs being the best team yet? because they won against the Heat. So does this mean the Pacers get won too?

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 11:54 AM
until they prove they aren't simply a 55 win team in the regular season and then knockout material in the playoffs, they don't get the nod from me personally.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 01:50 PM
until they prove they aren't simply a 55 win team in the regular season and then knockout material in the playoffs, they don't get the nod from me personally.

Aww cut it out. Minnesota is what a 10-15 win team. Mavs have been one of the most consistent teams in the NBA over the last 10 years. miami, La, boston, detroit, and san antonio are the only teams that have won a ring since 2000. I don't understand the hate.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 01:57 PM
Yeah **** the Mavs

NFC west for the win right baller?

:laugh2: hell yeah.

At least an NFC West team has to win this week, since AZ and SF play each other...

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 01:58 PM
Aww cut it out. Minnesota is what a 10-15 win team. Mavs have been one of the most consistent teams in the NBA over the last 10 years. miami, La, boston, detroit, and san antonio are the only teams that have won a ring since 2000. I don't understand the hate.

why attack Minnesota? I am aware of their standings...
I don't hate the Mavs in the slightest. But it is what it is dude. They have yearly been a team that wins ungodly amounts of regular season games, only to have a meltdown in the playoffs at some point. Dirk is one of my favorite players. The only player I don't like in fact is Terry (I don't want to go off on a tangent but it started way back in college since I freakin hate Zona).
Simply put, they are always a team that comes up short. So when someone creates a thread about how awesome the Mavs are this season, I point out that until they prove they can win 55+ games and do something with it, nothing has changed for me.

Hope that clears it up. Again, not sure why you need to bring Minny into this. Am I not allowed to point out faults or trends in any team better than mine?

Baller1
11-28-2010, 01:58 PM
A decade of disappointment? How many teams have won a title this decade? How was the Mavs before this decade? Sure, we haven't gotten a title yet but I am sure we have accomplished more than what the Mavs of the 90s accomplished... I am also sure we have accomplished more the most of the teams in the league...

I like the Thunder and they have great potential but I wouldn't talk big on your team when they have yet to prove anything as well... What have the Sonics/Thunder franchise done in this decade? I do hope you guys would go far and maybe get a championship if none of my teams could get it but there is on flaw in your roster that is really hard to fill... You guys lack a good center... Good luck with that...

I'm not talking about the Thunder. This thread is about the Mavs, and the Mavs are choke-artists. It's just the truth. So until they prove me otherwise, I don't take anything they do seriously.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 01:59 PM
why attack Minnesota? I am aware of their standings...
I don't hate the Mavs in the slightest. But it is what it is dude. They have yearly been a team that wins ungodly amounts of regular season games, only to have a meltdown in the playoffs at some point. Dirk is one of my favorite players. The only player I don't like in fact is Terry (I don't want to go off on a tangent but it started way back in college since I freakin hate Zona).
Simply put, they are always a team that comes up short. So when someone creates a thread about how awesome the Mavs are this season, I point out that until they prove they can win 55+ games and do something with it, nothing has changed for me.

Hope that clears it up. Again, not sure why you need to bring Minny into this. Am I not allowed to point out faults or trends in any team better than mine?

Same thing they tried with me, apparently bringing out the truth about the Mavs results in an attack on our teams that are completely irrelevant to the discussion? I don't get it either.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:00 PM
I'm not talking about the Thunder. This thread is about the Mavs, and the Mavs are choke-artists. It's just the truth. So until they prove me otherwise, I don't take anything they do seriously.

Yea because the Sonics/Thunder have just been world beaters. If I remember correctly you guys went home in the first round just like we did.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:04 PM
Yea because the Sonics/Thunder have just been world beaters. If I remember correctly you guys went home in the first round just like we did.

I guess you can't comprehend what I said. Read contextually dude. This thread is about the Mavs, and I gave my opinion on the Mavs. Stop bringing up irrelevant concepts.

But since you want to go that route, at least we made the Lakers work. The Mavs just got an ***-whooping from the lower seeded Spurs. Therefore, they again choked in the playoffs and are the choke-artists of the NBA.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:05 PM
why attack Minnesota? I am aware of their standings...
I don't hate the Mavs in the slightest. But it is what it is dude. They have yearly been a team that wins ungodly amounts of regular season games, only to have a meltdown in the playoffs at some point. Dirk is one of my favorite players. The only player I don't like in fact is Terry (I don't want to go off on a tangent but it started way back in college since I freakin hate Zona).
Simply put, they are always a team that comes up short. So when someone creates a thread about how awesome the Mavs are this season, I point out that until they prove they can win 55+ games and do something with it, nothing has changed for me.

Hope that clears it up. Again, not sure why you need to bring Minny into this. Am I not allowed to point out faults or trends in any team better than mine?


But here's the problem: You're a smart guy and before this convo I would have thought you watched alot of NBA Basketball. Now if you have watched Mavs basketball this year you would know that they are getting it done on the defensive end. The Mavs are top 5 in EVERY defensive category and they are the makeup of the team is totally different. Add that to the facct that one of our top young scorers hasn't played a game this year. I see us getting to 60 wins this year and our defense will win a championship....

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:07 PM
I guess you can't comprehend what I said. Read contextually dude. This thread is about the Mavs, and I gave my opinion on the Mavs. Stop bringing up irrelevant concepts.

But since you want to go that route, at least we made the Lakers work. The Mavs just got an ***-whooping from the lower seeded Spurs. Therefore, they again choked in the playoffs and are the choke-artists of the NBA.


We lost 4-2 how did we get an *** whooping? Idk how you can expect us to not get at your team when you're talking crap about ours. Add that to the fact that your team isn't anywhere near ours.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:08 PM
But here's the problem: You're a smart guy and before this convo I would have thought you watched alot of NBA Basketball. Now if you have watched Mavs basketball this year you would know that they are getting it done on the defensive end. The Mavs are top 5 in EVERY defensive category and they are the makeup of the team is totally different. Add that to the facct that one of our top young scorers hasn't played a game this year. I see us getting to 60 wins this year and our defense will win a championship....

But here's the actual problem: LA, Miami, SA, and Boston are all superior teams, with Orlando, Chicago, Utah, NO, and OKC being arguably superior.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:10 PM
But here's the actual problem: LA, Miami, SA, and Boston are all superior teams, with Orlando, Chicago, Utah, NO, and OKC being arguably superior.


Problem is we've beat Miami, San Antonio, and Boston convincingley. We stopped NO 12-0 win streak and we just whooped OKC ***... We hadn't played Orlando and Utah but they *** whooping coming soon. Chicago beat us but we were without a starter.... Do you watch NBA basketball or do you just say whatever comes to mind?

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:13 PM
Problem is we've beat Miami, San Antonio, and Boston convincingley. We stopped NO 12-0 win streak and we just whooped OKC ***... We hadn't played Orlando and Utah but they *** whooping coming soon. Chicago beat us but we were without a starter.... Do you watch NBA basketball or do you just say whatever comes to mind?

Whooped OKC's ***? We led the entire game and went cold in the fourth. You're clueless.

But let me ask you this, didn't you beat all those teams last season? I thought so. I'm going to dig up this same thread last season. At least Mavrix waited until late in the season to make this thread. :laugh2:

Jays Claw
11-28-2010, 02:14 PM
It seems as if the Mavs consistently win 50+ games each season, only to stink it up in the playoffs.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 02:14 PM
But here's the problem: You're a smart guy and before this convo I would have thought you watched alot of NBA Basketball. Now if you have watched Mavs basketball this year you would know that they are getting it done on the defensive end. The Mavs are top 5 in EVERY defensive category and they are the makeup of the team is totally different. Add that to the facct that one of our top young scorers hasn't played a game this year. I see us getting to 60 wins this year and our defense will win a championship....

and I am saying I have to see it to believe it.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:20 PM
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=461549

This is a fun one. :laugh2:

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:22 PM
Whooped OKC's ***? We led the entire game and went cold in the fourth. You're clueless.

But let me ask you this, didn't you beat all those teams last season? I thought so. I'm going to dig up this same thread last season. At least Mavrix waited until late in the season to make this thread. :laugh2:

I didn't create the thread. And also our defense was led by Erick Dampier lol... I don't thnk anyone believed we were beating anybody or going anywhere with Erick Dampier as an nba starter. Things really change you know when you have a competent, real NBA center..... And I think we've shown that this year.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:24 PM
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460653&page=25

Another one, because it's funny.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 02:25 PM
Whooped OKC's ***? We led the entire game and went cold in the fourth. You're clueless.

But let me ask you this, didn't you beat all those teams last season? I thought so. I'm going to dig up this same thread last season. At least Mavrix waited until late in the season to make this thread. :laugh2:


You call it going cold in the 4th. I call it OKC choking AT HOME in the 4th. OKC is overrated. Durant is a great player but outside of that everyone else is a guy. Sure you can run and play fastbreak ball, but when the playoffs came last year and it was a half court game you couldn't handle it. OKC isn't going anywhere cuz there bigs are garbage. You know that

Baller1
11-28-2010, 02:27 PM
You call it going cold in the 4th. I call it OKC choking AT HOME in the 4th. OKC is overrated. Durant is a great player but outside of that everyone else is a guy. Sure you can run and play fastbreak ball, but when the playoffs came last year and it was a half court game you couldn't handle it. OKC isn't going anywhere cuz there bigs are garbage. You know that

A Mavs fan talking about OKC choking. That, everyone, is irony.

But you're right, Russell Westbrook is just "a guy".

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 02:30 PM
the last thing I am adding, is that I think the Mavs have been one of the best regular season teams in the last decade. But a team with a payroll in the 80-90 million dollar range had better get some wins

Mavs fans, until your team wins a ring with the roster, and payroll you have, nobody is going to take them for more than a 55+ win team that can't get it done in the playoffs. You should know this before you even start threads like this. Its not baiting saying this, its a summarization of general fan's opinion on the Mavs.

Relax, and enjoy the season.

Dr Cyanide 28
11-28-2010, 02:30 PM
the mavs are a solid team. i would not be the least bit surprised if they end up being the representative for the western conference in the finals. as previously stated, the defense is what sets this team apart from teams in the past. however, this team is also much older than teams in the past so I would like to see how the season progresses before anointing them anything beyond a very good regular season team. This team is good, make no mistake, but my fears for them is that age will catch up. (altho same argument could be made for the spurs so i guess u never really can tell) In a seven game series, Id still take the lakers over the mavs, but man would it be a great series to watch.

Dr Cyanide 28
11-28-2010, 02:31 PM
the last thing I am adding, is that I think the Mavs have been one of the best regular season teams in the last decade. But a team with a payroll in the 80-90 million dollar range had better get some wins

Mavs fans, until your team wins a ring with the roster, and payroll you have, nobody is going to take them for more than a 55+ win team that can't get it done in the playoffs. You should know this before you even start threads like this. Its not baiting saying this, its a summarization of general fan's opinion on the Mavs.

Relax, and enjoy the season.

you are a voice of reason and i love you for it no homo

GSwarriors4LIFE
11-28-2010, 03:02 PM
This is the time of year where the dominate...create this thread in April and i'll be impressed.

Could not have said it better. Always a good regular season team, but will choke sometime in the playoffs.

MacFitz92
11-28-2010, 03:22 PM
the last thing I am adding, is that I think the Mavs have been one of the best regular season teams in the last decade. But a team with a payroll in the 80-90 million dollar range had better get some wins

Mavs fans, until your team wins a ring with the roster, and payroll you have, nobody is going to take them for more than a 55+ win team that can't get it done in the playoffs. You should know this before you even start threads like this. Its not baiting saying this, its a summarization of general fan's opinion on the Mavs.

Relax, and enjoy the season.


It seems as if the Mavs consistently win 50+ games each season, only to stink it up in the playoffs.

It's fair to claim this, but you have to look at it from this perspective. They've always been one of the best scoring teams with a mediocre defense.

If you look at the last two years, they have several new players including 3 starters. Caron Butler, Tyson Chandler, and Roddy Beaubois. Also Shawn Marion, Brendan Haywood, etc.

Obviously Dirk Nowitzki is the best player on the team, but if you were to ask me who is the 2nd most important, I'd tell you Tyson Chandler. Yes, the same Tyson Chandler that wasn't suppose to be a starter (behind Haywood). He's an animal, and his intensity is what anchors one of the best defenses in the league. Dirk has also played much improved defense and is an above average defender nowadays (if you don't believe me watch him).

This team is one of the deepest, best defensive teams with proven scorers in Dirk, Terry, Butler, and (soon to be) Roddy Beaubois.

Kidd - Barea
Roddy - Terry - Stevenson
Butler - Marion
Dirk - Marion
Chandler - Haywood

The team has a different vibe from previous years, and we now have two centers capable when we've never had one. We don't have to shoot well to beat the best teams, our defense allows us to have off nights.

Tyson Chandler will probably be the reason to our success this year. If you ask me he's playing like a top 5 center, and his defense is right up there with the best.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 03:29 PM
Every year, the Mavs have a great regular season team. That's it. We'll see during these playoffs whether or not they prove themselves or not.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 03:36 PM
It's fair to claim this, but you have to look at it from this perspective. They've always been one of the best scoring teams with a mediocre defense.

If you look at the last two years, they have several new players including 3 starters. Caron Butler, Tyson Chandler, and Roddy Beaubois. Also Shawn Marion, Brendan Haywood, etc.

Obviously Dirk Nowitzki is the best player on the team, but if you were to ask me who is the 2nd most important, I'd tell you Tyson Chandler. Yes, the same Tyson Chandler that wasn't suppose to be a starter (behind Haywood). He's an animal, and his intensity is what anchors one of the best defenses in the league. Dirk has also played much improved defense and is an above average defender nowadays (if you don't believe me watch him).

This team is one of the deepest, best defensive teams with proven scorers in Dirk, Terry, Butler, and (soon to be) Roddy Beaubois.

Kidd - Barea
Roddy - Terry - Stevenson
Butler - Marion
Dirk - Marion
Chandler - Haywood

The team has a different vibe from previous years, and we now have two centers capable when we've never had one. We don't have to shoot well to beat the best teams, our defense allows us to have off nights.

Tyson Chandler will probably be the reason to our success this year. If you ask me he's playing like a top 5 center, and his defense is right up there with the best.


new aquisitions tend to play better than normal, then regress to the mean.

But sure, the makeup of the Mavs is different, and playoff built. Its just difficult for the general fan to believe Tyson Chandler all of a sudden propels a roster, that has been more talented than 28 other rosters any given year, to a championship.

And quite honestly, I want Dirk to win a ring. But I have to see the Mavs not meltdown in the playoffs before I can admit belief in them

drobe86
11-28-2010, 04:17 PM
new aquisitions tend to play better than normal, then regress to the mean.

But sure, the makeup of the Mavs is different, and playoff built. Its just difficult for the general fan to believe Tyson Chandler all of a sudden propels a roster, that has been more talented than 28 other rosters any given year, to a championship.

And quite honestly, I want Dirk to win a ring. But I have to see the Mavs not meltdown in the playoffs before I can admit belief in them


It may be different for the GENERAL fan to believe, but a true basketball fan knows you aren't winning a championship without a real C. The Mavs now have 2 so how do you attack us. Tyson Chandler is a top 5 center in the NBA when healthy. I think its fair to say in 2010 he's healthy...........

abe_froman
11-28-2010, 04:25 PM
ask me again come playoff time.they always do well in the regular season,so this really shouldnt surprise anyone

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 04:28 PM
It may be different for the GENERAL fan to believe, but a true basketball fan knows you aren't winning a championship without a real C. The Mavs now have 2 so how do you attack us. Tyson Chandler is a top 5 center in the NBA when healthy. I think its fair to say in 2010 he's healthy...........

haha, how am I attacking? you guys have got to calm down and realize not everyone thinks Tyson Chandler is the answer to the Mavs problem.
You haven't had a single injury to a player that matters, and there are 66 games to go. The Mavs continually win tons of games then flameout in the playoffs. I don't think even knowledgeable fans think the addition of Chandler is enough to make the Mavs THAT much better.

You guys need to relax. How dare someone not think the Mavs will win the title!!!! Calm down. Its a long season, and the Mavs are the ones that need to prove themselves. Not their critics

drobe86
11-28-2010, 04:37 PM
haha, how am I attacking? you guys have got to calm down and realize not everyone thinks Tyson Chandler is the answer to the Mavs problem.
You haven't had a single injury to a player that matters, and there are 66 games to go. The Mavs continually win tons of games then flameout in the playoffs. I don't think even knowledgeable fans think the addition of Chandler is enough to make the Mavs THAT much better.

You guys need to relax. How dare someone not think the Mavs will win the title!!!! Calm down. Its a long season, and the Mavs are the ones that need to prove themselves. Not their critics


I'm cool man but heres my problem. If you have ever watched the Mavs play you would know that have NEVER played defense. With addition of guys like Chandler, Marion, Butler, Stevenson, Haywood thats no longer the case. Add that to the fact that we're top 5 in EVERY statistical category, how can you say that he doesnt make the mavs THAT much better? I mean logic tells you that a team that goes from 28th-30th in defense to top 5 in EVERY category means they got better you know.......

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 04:47 PM
I'm cool man but heres my problem. If you have ever watched the Mavs play you would know that have NEVER played defense. With addition of guys like Chandler, Marion, Butler, Stevenson, Haywood thats no longer the case. Add that to the fact that we're top 5 in EVERY statistical category, how can you say that he doesnt make the mavs THAT much better? I mean logic tells you that a team that goes from 28th-30th in defense to top 5 in EVERY category means they got better you know.......

and they need to prove that they got better when it matters most. Not now. That is what people are trying to say.

You can post and post and post on how much better YOU think the Mavs got. But nobody cares until playoffs. The Mavs always have a great record. A person who understand basketball obviously knows its HOW you win that matters, but the fact is, Dallas needs to prove their improvements will translate to wins that mean something. Playoff wins

Geargo Wallace
11-28-2010, 04:48 PM
yes it is the best Mavs team. Like c'mon ppl they beat the defending champs the Miami Heat!

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 04:50 PM
in a rational way, a Mavs fan needs to explain to me why it isn't fair to question the Mavs. What have they historically done over the past 10 years to make fans believe they now will contend with LA, Boston, Orlando, etc for the ring? Is it not fair that non-Mav's fans simply say, "then they need to prove it", when the statment is made that this is the best Mavs team?

Nobody that provides a rational explanation stating that the Mavs have always won a ton of regular season games and then flamed out eventually in the playoffs deserves to be called a hater. They are simply stating fact, and asking Mav's fans to wait and see when it matters most.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 04:50 PM
I'm cool man but heres my problem. If you have ever watched the Mavs play you would know that have NEVER played defense. With addition of guys like Chandler, Marion, Butler, Stevenson, Haywood thats no longer the case. Add that to the fact that we're top 5 in EVERY statistical category, how can you say that he doesnt make the mavs THAT much better? I mean logic tells you that a team that goes from 28th-30th in defense to top 5 in EVERY category means they got better you know.......

You had all those players last season with the exception of Chandler. Say what you want, but the Mavs are choke-artists, and that's everyone's point. We do this every season.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 04:51 PM
in a rational way, a Mavs fan needs to explain to me why it isn't fair to question the Mavs. What have they historically done over the past 10 years to make fans believe they now will contend with LA, Boston, Orlando, etc for the ring? Is it not fair that non-Mav's fans simply say, "then they need to prove it", when the statment is made that this is the best Mavs team?

Nobody that provides a rational explanation stating that the Mavs have always won a ton of regular season games and then flamed out eventually in the playoffs deserves to be called a hater. They are simply stating fact, and asking Mav's fans to wait and see when it matters most.

Exactly.

Geargo Wallace
11-28-2010, 04:57 PM
You had all those players last season with the exception of Chandler. Say what you want, but the Mavs are choke-artists, and that's everyone's point. We do this every season.

I believe you are correct but I don't think it's fair to completely rule out the possibility that they have changed since last season. It's not totally fair. The team can mature somewhat even though they are a bunch of old farts.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 04:57 PM
in a rational way, a Mavs fan needs to explain to me why it isn't fair to question the Mavs. What have they historically done over the past 10 years to make fans believe they now will contend with LA, Boston, Orlando, etc for the ring? Is it not fair that non-Mav's fans simply say, "then they need to prove it", when the statment is made that this is the best Mavs team?

Nobody that provides a rational explanation stating that the Mavs have always won a ton of regular season games and then flamed out eventually in the playoffs deserves to be called a hater. They are simply stating fact, and asking Mav's fans to wait and see when it matters most.


Well its not fair to question the Mavs because it isn't the same team. People don't understand that we used to start ERICK DAMPIER I mean really? Hows a team gonna win with him he's the epitome of garbage. Yea the older Mavs teams you could question and I questioned them because they played 0 defense. If you watched the Mavs other ppl would know this. All these psd posters are saying the same things oh well the Mavs choked and blah blah blah. But, any knowledgeable fan would know that the Mavs were not built for championship basketball. Now they are and the statistics show that....

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:00 PM
You had all those players last season with the exception of Chandler. Say what you want, but the Mavs are choke-artists, and that's everyone's point. We do this every season.


You are right but it was a midseason trade. Nobody's winning a championship with a brand new core that you acquired midseason. The Lakers didn't even win it the first year they got Pau Gasol. It took a full summer and training camp for them to get acclimated. Why can't we get the same? People just think its like a microwave and you just heat it up and its ready to go. With moving parts things take time......

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:07 PM
Well its not fair to question the Mavs because it isn't the same team. People don't understand that we used to start ERICK DAMPIER I mean really? Hows a team gonna win with him he's the epitome of garbage. Yea the older Mavs teams you could question and I questioned them because they played 0 defense. If you watched the Mavs other ppl would know this. All these psd posters are saying the same things oh well the Mavs choked and blah blah blah. But, any knowledgeable fan would know that the Mavs were not built for championship basketball. Now they are and the statistics show that....

hahaha, you are like talking to a wall on this subject.
Fine.
I will be shocked to the point of being speechless if the Mavs don't win it all this season

:worthy:

How dare someone question the Mavs after their total dominance when it matters most

we are done with this one

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:10 PM
You are right but it was a midseason trade. Nobody's winning a championship with a brand new core that you acquired midseason. The Lakers didn't even win it the first year they got Pau Gasol. It took a full summer and training camp for them to get acclimated. Why can't we get the same? People just think its like a microwave and you just heat it up and its ready to go. With moving parts things take time......

There is a big difference with the Lakers. They already had a player named Kobe Bryant. Adding Gasol was just the cherry on top of the cake.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:10 PM
hahaha, you are like talking to a wall on this subject.
Fine.
I will be shocked to the point of being speechless if the Mavs don't win it all this season

:worthy:

How dare someone question the Mavs after their total dominance when it matters most

we are done with this one


So let me ask you this.... you're telling the me that even though the makeup of this years Mavs team is different than any other team they've had the last 10 yrs that you shuld look at them the same?

MacFitz92
11-28-2010, 05:10 PM
Every year, the Mavs have a great regular season team. That's it. We'll see during these playoffs whether or not they prove themselves or not.

Did you not comprehend what I was saying? They have a great defense which is consistent, good shooting isn't always consistent.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:12 PM
Did you not comprehend what I was saying? They have a great defense which is consistent, good shooting isn't always consistent.

I wasn't responding to you. I just stated my opinion.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:13 PM
There is a big difference with the Lakers. They already had a player named Kobe Bryant. Adding Gasol was just the cherry on top of the cake.


And the Lakers STILL didn't win a ring that year. That's all I'm saying man, it took time...

Ebbs
11-28-2010, 05:13 PM
As a long times Mavs fan the team has looked really good. But even as a fan I'm skeptical as we usually are elite in the regular season and then we go on to blow chunks in the playoffs.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:16 PM
So let me ask you this.... you're telling the me that even though the makeup of this years Mavs team is different than any other team they've had the last 10 yrs that you shuld look at them the same?

the makeup hasn't changed enough for me to think they now all of a sudden have become a legit threat to win a title.
The problem is, they have won tons of regular season games for a long time now, to flame out in the playoffs. Until they change this in the win department, I see no reason to think this is a better team that the one that made a finals run for example. I understand they have done this or that. But they have so many years of proof showing us that they classicly meltdown at some point in the playoffs, that pretty much all non Mavs fans (and Mavs fans should think this way too), are taking a wait and see approach with them. I never said they can't win it all. I am simply saying we go through this conversation every single year about the Mavs.
Let them show me, and everyone else that this is the best team they have had. Until then, why should any of us believe differently?

This isn't an up and coming team that just needs to get over the hill. Its a historical underachiever in the playoffs with much of the roster and concepts of the team unchanged. They need to prove it.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 05:16 PM
You are right but it was a midseason trade. Nobody's winning a championship with a brand new core that you acquired midseason. The Lakers didn't even win it the first year they got Pau Gasol. It took a full summer and training camp for them to get acclimated. Why can't we get the same? People just think its like a microwave and you just heat it up and its ready to go. With moving parts things take time......

That's not what you guys were saying last season.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 05:18 PM
As a long times Mavs fan the team has looked really good. But even as a fan I'm skeptical as we usually are elite in the regular season and then we go on to blow chunks in the playoffs.

Thank you. A rational, unbaised thought from a Mavs fan.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:19 PM
And the Lakers STILL didn't win a ring that year. That's all I'm saying man, it took time...

Yea, it took a year to get it done, but I don't see a player like Kobe, Duncan or Shaq who can dominate games in this Mavs team. Dirk is an excellent player but he is nowhere close to those players when they won multiple championships.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:24 PM
Yea, it took a year to get it done, but I don't see a player like Kobe, Duncan or Shaq who can dominate games in this Mavs team. Dirk is an excellent player but he is nowhere close to those players when they won multiple championships.

Obviously Dirk is not a top 10 player of all time like the guys you just listed, but he is a capable "best" player for a championship team.
They just have a history (and different ways of doing it) of melting down in the playoffs. And the BEST team they had got the one matchup problem in the entire NBA it had haha. Just victims of circumstance much of the time. Kind of like the Jazz of the 90's.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:24 PM
Yea, it took a year to get it done, but I don't see a player like Kobe, Duncan or Shaq who can dominate games in this Mavs team. Dirk is an excellent player but he is nowhere close to those players when they won multiple championships.

Man cut it out, Dirk is better than Duncan and Shaq. The only difference is he has never the supporting cast that those 2 players have had. Stop looking at their rings with stacked teams and look at the player. Dirk has better skills than both players offensively and rebounds good in his own right...

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:25 PM
Obviously Dirk is not a top 10 player of all time like the guys you just listed, but he is a capable "best" player for a championship team.
They just have a history (and different ways of doing it) of melting down in the playoffs. And the BEST team they had got the one matchup problem in the entire NBA it had haha. Just victims of circumstance much of the time. Kind of like the Jazz of the 90's.


Duncans not top 10 all time either. He's benefited froma Hall of Famer in the admiral and perennial all stars in parker and Ginobili. Put Dirk in the same situation and wins the same rings if not more....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:27 PM
Man cut it out, Dirk is better than Duncan and Shaq. The only difference is he has never the supporting cast that those 2 players have had. Stop looking at their rings with stacked teams and look at the player. Dirk has better skills than both players offensively and rebounds good in his own right...

he was referring to when Duncan and Shaq were winning championships as the best player on their team.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:27 PM
Man cut it out, Dirk is better than Duncan and Shaq. The only difference is he has never the supporting cast that those 2 players have had. Stop looking at their rings with stacked teams and look at the player. Dirk has better skills than both players offensively and rebounds good in his own right...

I was referring to Duncan and Shaq when they won multiple championships. Read my whole post. And Dirk has had a good supporting cast every year, that's why we have this thread every year. But like Hawkeye said, they were victims of circumstance.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:28 PM
Duncans not top 10 all time either. He's benefited froma Hall of Famer in the admiral and perennial all stars in Duncan and Ginobili. Put Dirk in the same situation and wins the same rings if not more....

are you insane?
Please give me your top 10. And if it has Roy Tarpley, Dirk Nowitzki, Mark Aguirre, or any other Mav in it that any of us have watched play I will puke

Geargo Wallace
11-28-2010, 05:32 PM
are you insane?
Please give me your top 10. And if it has Roy Tarpley, Dirk Nowitzki, Mark Aguirre, or any other Mav in it that any of us have watched play I will puke

this.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:32 PM
I was referring to Duncan and Shaq when they won multiple championships. Read my whole post. And Dirk has had a good supporting cast every year, that's why we have this thread every year. But like Hawkeye said, they were victims of circumstance.



So Dirk has had a better supporting cast than Duncan? Dirk hasn't had anyone near the levels of Ginobili and parker in their primes.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:35 PM
So Dirk has had a better supporting cast than Duncan? Dirk hasn't had anyone near the levels of Ginobili and parker in their primes.

I never said he had a better supporting cast than Duncan, but Dirk certainly had good complimentary players around him. Maybe Duncan has been and is a better player than Dirk ;)

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:36 PM
are you insane?
Please give me your top 10. And if it has Roy Tarpley, Dirk Nowitzki, Mark Aguirre, or any other Mav in it that any of us have watched play I will puke
Cmon Hawkeye I'm not that much of a homer.

1. Bill Rusell
2. Michael Jordan
3. Magic Johnson
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Oscar Robertson
6. Larry Bird
7. Jerry West
8. Isiah Thomas
9. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
10. Clyde Drexler

drobe86
11-28-2010, 05:37 PM
I never said he had a better supporting cast than Duncan, but Dirk certainly had good complimentary players around him. Maybe Duncan has been and is a better player than Dirk ;)


Really? Check your statistics... better yet just look at what each guy is doing now.... Dirks top 5 scoring and still averaging 8 rebs a game. Duncan is scoring in single digits most nights lol....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:39 PM
Really? Check your statistics... better yet just look at what each guy is doing now.... Dirks top 5 scoring and still averaging 8 rebs a game. Duncan is scoring in single digits most nights lol....

for the 4th time, he is talking about when those players LED THEIR TEAMS TO RINGS. They were all better players then Dirk is now, or has been

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:41 PM
Cmon Hawkeye I'm not that much of a homer.

1. Bill Rusell
2. Michael Jordan
3. Magic Johnson
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Oscar Robertson
6. Larry Bird
7. Jerry West
8. Isiah Thomas
9. Kareem Abdul Jabbar
10. Clyde Drexler

Clyde Drexler? Thomas? Are you serious? Over Duncan?

I won't even get into a debate about how wrong you are having Jordan #2, and Jabbar #9. And Oscar is too high as well dude.
Duncan is a top 10 player of all time, and the best PF to ever play most likely.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 05:42 PM
Really? Check your statistics... better yet just look at what each guy is doing now.... Dirks top 5 scoring and still averaging 8 rebs a game. Duncan is scoring in single digits most nights lol....

Duncan is still the better rebounder and better defender, while averaging less than 30 MPG. I'll give you this: Dirk is the better offensive player now.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:43 PM
I have NEVER put someone's ridiculous post as my signature, but saying Duncan isn't a top 10 player of all time almost warrants a first for me

Baller1
11-28-2010, 05:51 PM
He's only saying that to make Dirk look better. And I would argue Shaq as a top 10, possibly top 5 as well.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 05:57 PM
He's only saying that to make Dirk look better. And I would argue Shaq as a top 10, possibly top 5 as well.

Shaq is for sure top 10 ever. Absolutely no doubt

Baller1
11-28-2010, 06:52 PM
Shaq is for sure top 10 ever. Absolutely no doubt

I agree.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 07:27 PM
Shaqs a journeyman big man that rode elite sgs to titles.... Kobe, Wade, even penny in the early 90's. He has no skills, can't handle the ball, can't shoot, etc. He's just a big body with a little athletic ability. All he ever did was turn around and dunk on ppl and thats not all that impressive considering how big he was.... Ppl say he's top 5 but had nowhere near the skills of Chamberlain, Russell, Olajuwon, or even Ewing. The only thing i can give you is that he's big.....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 07:38 PM
Shaqs a journeyman big man that rode elite sgs to titles.... Kobe, Wade, even penny in the early 90's. He has no skills, can't handle the ball, can't shoot, etc. He's just a big body with a little athletic ability. All he ever did was turn around and dunk on ppl and thats not all that impressive considering how big he was.... Ppl say he's top 5 but had nowhere near the skills of Chamberlain, Russell, Olajuwon, or even Ewing. The only thing i can give you is that he's big.....

Kobe rode Shaq for 3 rings, and Wade can thank your Mavs gameplan defensively for his ring.
Little athletic ability? haha. I don't care how someone gives me 30/13/3

Can I ask how old you are? Its a serious question too.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 07:40 PM
Kobe rode Shaq for 3 rings, and Wade can thank your Mavs gameplan defensively for his ring.
Little athletic ability? haha. I don't care how someone gives me 30/13/3

Can I ask how old you are? Its a serious question too.

I was honestly about to ask that exact same thing.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 07:42 PM
Kobe rode Shaq for 3 rings, and Wade can thank your Mavs gameplan defensively for his ring.
Little athletic ability? haha. I don't care how someone gives me 30/13/3

Can I ask how old you are? Its a serious question too.


The Heat were simply a better team, and really that Mavs team overachieved to even reach the Finals. That being said, I'm 25 and have watched a lot of NBA. I value skills and what a player can do on the floor more than how many rings you have and etc. Anybody can win a ring. John Salley got rings, Robert Horry, Fisher etc.... Those guys aren't better than Dirk or etc... That's just how I look at things. You look at things differently thats fine.....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 07:54 PM
The Heat were simply a better team, and really that Mavs team overachieved to even reach the Finals. That being said, I'm 25 and have watched a lot of NBA. I value skills and what a player can do on the floor more than how many rings you have and etc. Anybody can win a ring. John Salley got rings, Robert Horry, Fisher etc.... Those guys aren't better than Dirk or etc... That's just how I look at things. You look at things differently thats fine.....


I don't care about rings necessarily. But leading talented rosters to rings is absolutely necessary to climb into the "all time" discussion. And Shaq LED the Lakers to 3 rings, and was a huge part of another.
The very fact that you don't have Jordan #1 on your list, and leave out Shaq and Duncan from your top ten tells me all I need to know about your ability to sit back and evaluate. Clyde Drexler?????????????????? Really????? Great player. Top 20? Absolutely not.
And comparing role players to Shaq isn't really going to help your point, if you ever had one in this thread.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 08:05 PM
I don't care about rings necessarily. But leading talented rosters to rings is absolutely necessary to climb into the "all time" discussion. And Shaq LED the Lakers to 3 rings, and was a huge part of another.
The very fact that you don't have Jordan #1 on your list, and leave out Shaq and Duncan from your top ten tells me all I need to know about your ability to sit back and evaluate. Clyde Drexler?????????????????? Really????? Great player. Top 20? Absolutely not.
And comparing role players to Shaq isn't really going to help your point, if you ever had one in this thread.

I mean whatever man. You see shaq as being great, I see him as a guy that rode elite sgs to rings. He didn't lead anything. I don't understand why we can't disagree. What makes you right? I don't see the problem having Russell over Jordan, in fact I've seen plenty of list that had Russell over Jordan. thats the only thing I hate about psd. You posters think everything you say is right. Then you talk about how good Duncan is, and he benefitted from a Hall of Famer in the Admiral, and Parker and Ginobili who are 2 perennial all stars. If you put any great player on those teams they win the same amount of rings.... I'm talkin Lakers and Spurs

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 08:21 PM
I mean whatever man. You see shaq as being great, I see him as a guy that rode elite sgs to rings. He didn't lead anything. I don't understand why we can't disagree. What makes you right? I don't see the problem having Russell over Jordan, in fact I've seen plenty of list that had Russell over Jordan. thats the only thing I hate about psd. You posters think everything you say is right. Then you talk about how good Duncan is, and he benefitted from a Hall of Famer in the Admiral, and Parker and Ginobili who are 2 perennial all stars. If you put any great player on those teams they win the same amount of rings.... I'm talkin Lakers and Spurs

so does every analyst, fan, former player, and pretty much anyone who understands what motion offense is.
I know not everything I say is THE WAY. But I know Michael Jordan was the best basketball player to ever play in the NBA. Go check out the comparison forum, and JB provided an educational piece for fans such as yourself.

Hey, how many rings did the Admiral have before Duncan got there? I can't remember...

drobe86
11-28-2010, 08:32 PM
so does every analyst, fan, former player, and pretty much anyone who understands what motion offense is.
I know not everything I say is THE WAY. But I know Michael Jordan was the best basketball player to ever play in the NBA. Go check out the comparison forum, and JB provided an educational piece for fans such as yourself.

Hey, how many rings did the Admiral have before Duncan got there? I can't remember...

Jordan was great. But so was Bill Russell. Dude averaged 25 rebounds a game lol... I think people are so amazed at how exciting Jordan was to watch and etc. People get so caught up in entertainment and etc that nobody wants to talk about substance. Russell is everything the NBA is all about. Grit, Determination, Defense... Watching Russell brings tears to my eyes. He left everything on the floor. Every Night, didn't take a night off, didn't think he was better than anybody. He just kept working....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 08:36 PM
Jordan was great. But so was Bill Russell. Dude averaged 25 rebounds a game lol... I think people are so amazed at how exciting Jordan was to watch and etc. People get so caught up in entertainment and etc that nobody wants to talk about substance. Russell is everything the NBA is all about. Grit, Determination, Defense... Watching Russell brings tears to my eyes. He left everything on the floor. Every Night, didn't take a night off, didn't think he was better than anybody. He just kept working....

in an era with a pace that the NBA hasn't matched in years. It is well known that early in the C's run, Russell wasn't even their best player and dealt with injuries.
I am glad you have a mancrush on Russell, but he isn't a top 5 player when the smoke clears.

Boom.Boom
11-28-2010, 08:55 PM
No offence to Mavs fans but I haven't seen anything that special about this team. They're good, but they've been consistently good for a decade.

they've been consistently great.

lakers4sho
11-28-2010, 08:58 PM
um, how did this conversation get from Mavs being the best team to Bill Russell? I'm confused :shrug:

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 09:04 PM
um, how did this conversation get from Mavs being the best team to Bill Russell? I'm confused :shrug:

then read thru. It basically was stated that Duncan wasn't a top 10 player of all time, thru various lines of posts. I asked the poster to name is top 10 then, and he had Russell #1. No bueno

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 09:22 PM
then read thru. It basically was stated that Duncan wasn't a top 10 player of all time, thru various lines of posts. I asked the poster to name is top 10 then, and he had Russell #1. No bueno

Honestly, the poster you were arguing with made no sense. How can Shaq not be in the top 10 discussion? Saying he rode elite SGs to championships is the dumbest thing I've heard. He clearly has something against Shaq.

_KB24_
11-28-2010, 09:23 PM
Kobe rode Shaq for 3 rings, and Wade can thank your Mavs gameplan defensively for his ring.
Little athletic ability? haha. I don't care how someone gives me 30/13/3

Can I ask how old you are? Its a serious question too.

No need to bring in a whole other topic in here. And it's ludicrous to even state that, Kobe in no way shape or form "rode" along with Shaq for the 3-peat. :rolleyes:

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 09:27 PM
No need to bring in a whole other topic in here. And it's ludicrous to even state that, Kobe in no way shape or form "rode" along with Shaq for the 3-peat. :rolleyes:

may have been an extreme word, but Kobe was more replaceable than Shaq on those rings.
And yes, its off topic, but the poster said Shaq rode an elite SG. Which couldn't be farther from the truth.

Read thru the thread. And put your Kobe love away for 2 seconds, and take the rest in.

_KB24_
11-28-2010, 09:32 PM
may have been an extreme word, but Kobe was more replaceable than Shaq on those rings.
And yes, its off topic, but the poster said Shaq rode an elite SG. Which couldn't be farther from the truth.

Read thru the thread. And put your Kobe love away for 2 seconds, and take the rest in.

I did, and you look equally as dumb for responding to that one fan. Why would you even be going back and forth with him for a good 5 pages when he was saying the exact same thing? :eyebrow:

And again, saying Kobe "rode" along for the 3-peat is just flat out stupid.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 09:35 PM
If what Hawkeye were saying was true why did the lakers get rid of shaq and not kobe? Kobe didn't need shaq and i think he's proven that. Hell Dwayne will eventually get another and prove he didnt need shaq. Meanwhile, Shaqs getting his jon salley on and trying to go to whatever team is contending lol..

Baller1
11-28-2010, 09:42 PM
If what Hawkeye were saying was true why did the lakers get rid of shaq and not kobe? Kobe didn't need shaq and i think he's proven that. Hell Dwayne will eventually get another and prove he didnt need shaq. Meanwhile, Shaqs getting his jon salley on and trying to go to whatever team is contending lol..

Kobe didn't need Shaq?! Of course not, because now he has Pau. Kobe has had just as much, if not more, help in his career than Shaq. What are you talking about?

Baller1
11-28-2010, 09:46 PM
I did, and you look equally as dumb for responding to that one fan. Why would you even be going back and forth with him for a good 5 pages when he was saying the exact same thing? :eyebrow:

And again, saying Kobe "rode" along for the 3-peat is just flat out stupid.

No it's not. Shaq was irreplacable, Kobe was not.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 09:50 PM
No it's not. Shaq was irreplacable, Kobe was not.


So why did the lakers not miss a beat and continue winning championships, while shaq just tries to get on whatever team he thinks is going to win the title?

_KB24_
11-28-2010, 09:54 PM
No it's not. Shaq was irreplacable, Kobe was not.

Where the hell in my post did I talk about a player being replaceable or not? I'm saying its stupid to even think that Kobe "rode" along for the 3-peat. P-Jax himself said that Kobe was the ideal man to compliment Shaq during the 3-peat years when asked about how a Jordan/Shaq duo would work.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 09:54 PM
So why did the lakers not miss a beat and continue winning championships, while shaq just tries to get on whatever team he thinks is going to win the title?

Shaq won his 4th ring before Kobe did. You're so clueless.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 09:55 PM
Where the hell in my post did I talk about a player being replaceable or not? I'm saying its stupid to even think that Kobe "rode" along for the 3-peat. P-Jax himself said that Kobe was the ideal man to compliment Shaq during the 3-peat years when asked about how a Jordan/Shaq duo would work.

I think any elite wing player would have complimented Shaq in his prime.

_KB24_
11-28-2010, 09:57 PM
I think any elite wing player would have complimented Shaq in his prime.

I think I rather trust that guy with 11 rings on his bloody fingers if you ask me.... :shrug::

Baller1
11-28-2010, 09:58 PM
I think I rather trust that guy with 11 rings on his bloody fingers if you ask me.... :shrug::

I personally think he's overrated, but that's just me.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 10:00 PM
Where the hell in my post did I talk about a player being replaceable or not? I'm saying its stupid to even think that Kobe "rode" along for the 3-peat. P-Jax himself said that Kobe was the ideal man to compliment Shaq during the 3-peat years when asked about how a Jordan/Shaq duo would work.

I will put it more acceptable for you. The poster I answered said Shaq RODE elite shooting guards for his rings. I am sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo sorry that you were offended by my use of the term when replying, but the fact is, Shaq was 1a to that relationship during those three rings.
Why are you getting into that argument when you didn't even engage the original portion of that argument?
Fact: Shaq was more important to the Lakers 3 peat than Kobe.

You already know this, and you know me. To think I would make that statement outright, in a non response to the poster I answered, is stupid

drobe86
11-28-2010, 10:04 PM
Shaq won his 4th ring before Kobe did. You're so clueless.

And what's he done since? We'll wait...

_KB24_
11-28-2010, 10:05 PM
I will put it more acceptable for you. The poster I answered said Shaq RODE elite shooting guards for his rings. I am sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo sorry that you were offended by my use of the term when replying, but the fact is, Shaq was 1a to that relationship during those three rings.
Why are you getting into that argument when you didn't even engage the original portion of that argument?
Fact: Shaq was more important to the Lakers 3 peat than Kobe.

You already know this, and you know me. To think I would make that statement outright, in a non response to the poster I answered, is stupid

We've already made our amends Hawkeye, I'm not offended at all. I just think it's dumb to state that a player like Kobe "rode" along for rings no matter what the context. You shouldn't have even gave the kid so much time responding back and forth, you saw his Top 10. Whatever, I'll leave it at that.

Baller1
11-28-2010, 10:05 PM
And what's he done since? We'll wait...

He's 38. Big men normally begin to decline in their early 30's. He's a top 10 player, I'm done arguing with someone so young.

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 10:05 PM
This conversation has deviated from its original mean which is that the Mavs time after time have shown they are a great regular season team but struggle in the playoffs.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 10:09 PM
He's 38. Big men normally begin to decline in their early 30's. He's a top 10 player, I'm done arguing with someone so young.



So what your essentially saying anyone with rings, that title chases is great in your opinion. So Jon Salley= Shaq.... Not my opinion its yours....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 10:10 PM
We've already made our amends Hawkeye, I'm not offended at all. I just think it's dumb to state that a player like Kobe "rode" along for rings no matter what the context. You shouldn't have even gave the kid so much time responding back and forth, you saw his Top 10. Whatever, I'll leave it at that.

fair enough. I literally responded with the exact same term as the poster, since he used that term about Shaq.
And yes, I am done with the kid. Let him get out of the hole he has dug

drobe86
11-28-2010, 10:15 PM
fair enough. I literally responded with the exact same term as the poster, since he used that term about Shaq.
And yes, I am done with the kid. Let him get out of the hole he has dug


Yea you should be done. You've made statements like saying Marvin Williams good. Jordan is better than Russell when Russell won a title 11 of 12 years while playing. You talk about how great Love is when he has had 4 20 rebound games, and Russell averaged that for a career. Then you say the Mavs aren't a better team when their roster and their record say otherwise. I'm done arguing as well. Enjoy the great Kevin Love and watch this 'great' help his team get to all of 20 wins, while I watch Dirk and the Mavs get to 60 wins and win an NBA title.... See you in june chump

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 10:18 PM
Yea you should be done. You've made statements like saying Marvin Williams good. Jordan is better than Russell when Russell won a title 11 of 12 years while playing. You talk about how great Love is when he has had 4 20 rebound games, and Russell averaged that for a career. Then you say the Mavs aren't a better team when their roster and their record say otherwise. I'm done arguing as well. Enjoy the great Kevin Love and watch this 'great' help his team get to all of 20 wins, while I watch Dirk and the Mavs get to 60 wins and win an NBA title.... See you in june chump

When I read your posts, I think Mavrix is writing them.

kdspurman
11-28-2010, 10:19 PM
Duncans not top 10 all time either. He's benefited froma Hall of Famer in the admiral and perennial all stars in parker and Ginobili. Put Dirk in the same situation and wins the same rings if not more....

The original question, yes i think the mavs look very good this year. Maybe their best team yet. However to say dirk is better than duncan is crazy. I guarantee if u put dirk on that 2005 championship team vs the pistons no way can he handle the physicallity of that series. he is not a game changer. on the flip side i think if you put duncan in place of dirk in place of dirk maybe dallas has a ring. DUncan makes his teammates better by drawing double teams, and being a great passer and defender. Im offended you think dirk is better lol... I also dont think duncan would have folded against the warriors as dirk did. But yes mavs look good this year. should be an interesting season

Baller1
11-28-2010, 10:23 PM
When I read your posts, I think Mavrix is writing them.

:laugh2:

I swear I think the same thing!

Mplsman
11-28-2010, 10:24 PM
Yea you should be done. You've made statements like saying Marvin Williams good. Jordan is better than Russell when Russell won a title 11 of 12 years while playing. You talk about how great Love is when he has had 4 20 rebound games, and Russell averaged that for a career. Then you say the Mavs aren't a better team when their roster and their record say otherwise. I'm done arguing as well. Enjoy the great Kevin Love and watch this 'great' help his team get to all of 20 wins, while I watch Dirk and the Mavs get to 60 wins and win an NBA title.... See you in june chump

Yes, because that happens often. Good luck rebuilding after you're eliminated from the first round once again.

stlbest5in2013
11-28-2010, 10:35 PM
so if the mavs are sooo good after beating the heat, then the bulls are the best team ever, because they beat the mavs in dallas

SouljahPhil...
11-28-2010, 10:45 PM
Mavs have always been a good regular season team...I think they would finish 2nd or 3rd in the west..Want I want to see is how they do in the playoffs..

Super_Spammer
11-28-2010, 10:48 PM
mavs suck drobe is a f@g

JasonJohnHorn
11-28-2010, 11:04 PM
This thread would not have been created if the Mavericks did not beat the Heat. So this is the best Mavericks team just because they are off to a decent start? NO.

That is not the reason the thread was started. it was started because the Mavs are close to the top of the league and for the first time since Dirk came to the team have a center that can dominate the boards and provide top tier post defense.

justinnum1
11-28-2010, 11:11 PM
Mavs are always really good in the regular season, then they fall off in the playoffs. Happens every year.

JasonJohnHorn
11-28-2010, 11:19 PM
I understand how most think the Mavs are not a playoff team, but I think this year things are different. Their bench looks great, and more importantly Chandler is the most dominant center they've had since Dirk came to the team, and the rebounding and interior D he provides makes them a better playoff team.

Last year there was a similar thread. Is asked the same question: Is this the best Mavs team yet? My answer last year was: Yes, but so what, their best team so far failed to win. This year my answer is still a yes, but I believe this Mavs team now has the tools required to compete in the playoffs.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 11:24 PM
I understand how most think the Mavs are not a playoff team, but I think this year things are different. Their bench looks great, and more importantly Chandler is the most dominant center they've had since Dirk came to the team, and the rebounding and interior D he provides makes them a better playoff team.

Last year there was a similar thread. Is asked the same question: Is this the best Mavs team yet? My answer last year was: Yes, but so what, their best team so far failed to win. This year my answer is still a yes, but I believe this Mavs team now has the tools required to compete in the playoffs.

JJ, do you think its fair for non-Mav's fans, or fans in general, to take a wait and see approach with this team? They have had 0 injuries, and still have 5-6 teams with better win margins.
That is the ENTIRE point of the thread as far as many non-Mav's fans are concerned.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 11:31 PM
JJ, do you think its fair for non-Mav's fans, or fans in general, to take a wait and see approach with this team? They have had 0 injuries, and still have 5-6 teams with better win margins.
That is the ENTIRE point of the thread as far as many non-Mav's fans are concerned.

And how have they had 0 injuries? caron butler and shawn marion have both missed time this season. That just goes to show that you don't watch the Mavs.....

Chacarron
11-28-2010, 11:34 PM
And how have they had 0 injuries? caron butler and shawn marion have both missed time this season. That just goes to show that you don't watch the Mavs.....

Don't forget Roddy.

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 11:37 PM
And how have they had 0 injuries? caron butler and shawn marion have both missed time this season. That just goes to show that you don't watch the Mavs.....

Marion hasn't missed a game. Butler 3 games. wow.
look around homes. Most teams have guys who haven't even played a game yet, and those players were looked at as contributors.

30 teams times 82 games. I have the NBA package, and watch every team a minimum of 10 times a year. If you are only interested in fans who have watched every single Mavs games, go to your team forum, and post there.

I have watched them 3 times so far. Probably seen them play 150 games in the last 8 years or so. I am comfortable talking about the. When you talk about Love, or the Wolves, you should make sure and feel the same.

drobe86
11-28-2010, 11:40 PM
Marion hasn't missed a game. Butler 3 games. wow.
look around homes. Most teams have guys who haven't even played a game yet, and those players were looked at as contributors.

30 teams times 82 games. I have the NBA package, and watch every team a minimum of 10 times a year. If you are only interested in fans who have watched every single Mavs games, go to your team forum, and post there.

I have watched them 3 times so far. Probably seen them play 150 games in the last 8 years or so. I am comfortable talking about the. When you talk about Love, or the Wolves, you should make sure and feel the same.


Yea I've got NBA League pass as well and I've watched all 82 games for the last 2 years. I've watched 2 Klove games this season and I'll admit they both were impressive. And Marion has missed 2 gms this season to be exact. You also seem to forget about a little fellow named Roddy Beaubois who is our most explosive player. He hasn't played 1 minute this season. I'll leave it alone, but promise me you'll eat crow when we do damage in the playoffs this season....

Hawkeye15
11-28-2010, 11:44 PM
Yea I've got NBA League pass as well and I've watched all 82 games for the last 2 years. I've watched 2 Klove games this season and I'll admit they both were impressive. And Marion has missed 2 gms this season to be exact. You also seem to forget about a little fellow named Roddy Beaubois who is our most explosive player. He hasn't played 1 minute this season. I'll leave it alone, but promise me you'll eat crow when we do damage in the playoffs this season....

well, espn needs to be corrected, cause the Mavs are 12-4, and Marion shows to have played 16 games.

RB is a nice role player. He is just a guy really. (wink, your term)

And I don't think I will be eating crow dude. I would love to see Dirk win a ring. But that roster has years of historical proof on why it won't win a ring. I will side with that versus your speculation

drobe86
11-28-2010, 11:54 PM
well, espn needs to be corrected, cause the Mavs are 12-4, and Marion shows to have played 16 games.

RB is a nice role player. He is just a guy really. (wink, your term)

And I don't think I will be eating crow dude. I would love to see Dirk win a ring. But that roster has years of historical proof on why it won't win a ring. I will side with that versus your speculation

Roddy B is just a guy? Lol.... Dude can give you 40 on any given night. He torched San Antonio gm 6 but Carlisle the idiot took him out. With starters minutes he can average 20 ppg.... Your talking about the roster has years of statistical proof but I can't see how because most of the core of our team just arrived in 2009-2010. You seem to forget that Marion, Butler, Haywood, Beaubois, Chandler just got here. Those 5 guys are in the top 7 of the rotation. Only Terry and Dirk are on the Mavs from where the Mavs teams crumbled in the playoffs. On the outside looking in I could see why people say they don't believe the Mavs will do anything, but when you look closely the Mavs have really improved our team. If we had the same roster from the crumbling years I could see your point, but we don't. And that's why I'm having trouble seeing why people make the same age old argument that we're just having a good regular season and won't do anything in April.

LTBaByyy
11-29-2010, 12:21 AM
well, espn needs to be corrected, cause the Mavs are 12-4, and Marion shows to have played 16 games.

RB is a nice role player. He is just a guy really. (wink, your term)

And I don't think I will be eating crow dude. I would love to see Dirk win a ring. But that roster has years of historical proof on why it won't win a ring. I will side with that versus your speculation

Roddy B is just a nice role player???? Wow.

You must have never seen the guy play lol Your not just a role player when your the 2nd option on a contending team

He is our starting SG this year and this is the year that he is supposed to be the 2nd option and a BIG part of our succes

So we beat all these Championship contenders w/o him, it's gonna be amazing

Baller1
11-29-2010, 01:22 AM
Yea I've got NBA League pass as well and I've watched all 82 games for the last 2 years. I've watched 2 Klove games this season and I'll admit they both were impressive. And Marion has missed 2 gms this season to be exact. You also seem to forget about a little fellow named Roddy Beaubois who is our most explosive player. He hasn't played 1 minute this season. I'll leave it alone, but promise me you'll eat crow when we do damage in the playoffs this season....

Heard that last year.

ragee
11-29-2010, 01:30 AM
Roddy B is just a nice role player???? Wow.

You must have never seen the guy play lol Your not just a role player when your the 2nd option on a contending team

He is our starting SG this year and this is the year that he is supposed to be the 2nd option and a BIG part of our succes

So we beat all these Championship contenders w/o him, it's gonna be amazing

When the F#$K is he coming back anyway??? I can't beat my friend in 2K11 coz I can't play Roddy! Hahahaha...