PDA

View Full Version : Diamondbacks listening to offers for Upton



VRP723
11-16-2010, 05:37 PM
To clarify: For #Diamondbacks to trade Upton, it would have to be "big." On Drew, they'd need to be "blown away." Mis-read my notes! #MLB

http://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/4577609358770176

VRP723
11-16-2010, 05:39 PM
I saw this yesterday and brushed it off, but it looks like it has legs. In my opinion there is zero justification for trading Upton. I'm stunned.

Melo15
11-16-2010, 05:43 PM
Highly doubt anything ends up happening.

torontosports10
11-16-2010, 05:49 PM
Sounds like another Delmon Young for Garza type deal brewing.

NYYCowboys
11-16-2010, 05:51 PM
Yankees get on this...

SB75
11-16-2010, 05:55 PM
Are the D-Backs in salary dumping mode?

Zmaster52
11-16-2010, 05:56 PM
The idea of Upton on the Mets gives me wood.

VRP723
11-16-2010, 05:58 PM
Sounds like another Delmon Young for Garza type deal brewing.

The only difference being Upton accomplished more in one season at 21 years old than Delmon Young has ever done. Upton's way more polished than Delmon was at that time.

papipapsmanny
11-16-2010, 06:12 PM
Red Sox please get in on this

chcfan4life
11-16-2010, 06:19 PM
And did they not just sign Upton to a 6-yr deal this past season???

samevans7
11-16-2010, 06:24 PM
BOS get: SS Stephen Drew and OF Justin Upton

ARI get: SS Jose Iglesias, P Casey Kelly, OF Jacoby Ellsbury, P Felix Doubrunt, 3B Will Middlebrooks, P Anthony Ranaudo, 1B Lars Anderson, and C Luis Exposito

that good enough?

bringbackfredex
11-16-2010, 06:36 PM
Don't be surprised if the Phillies end up landing him. A young, less expensive right handed hitting right fielder is exactly what they need to replace Werth. It comes down to whether or not they'll give up enough out of the farm system to satisfy the DBacks, but they do have the prospects to get him.

Should be very interesting as to how this develops.

C-ross12
11-16-2010, 06:47 PM
The cubs better at least check this.

dodgersuck
11-16-2010, 06:52 PM
I don't see them moving Upton, I am pretty sure this is a comment that was made by Towers getting blown out of proportion

ugafan
11-16-2010, 07:19 PM
Don't be surprised if the Phillies end up landing him. A young, less expensive right handed hitting right fielder is exactly what they need to replace Werth. It comes down to whether or not they'll give up enough out of the farm system to satisfy the DBacks, but they do have the prospects to get him.

Should be very interesting as to how this develops.

Dom Brown?

Agar81
11-16-2010, 07:28 PM
Nick Cafardo says the Yanks have called. Get it done Cash :pray:

The_Franchise13
11-16-2010, 07:33 PM
Giants? Please.

Can't stand pat and hope the hitters that got it done (barely) with career years do it again...

bringbackfredex
11-16-2010, 07:38 PM
Dom Brown?

I hope not, if they included him I would be pissed. Brown is pretty much untouchable at this point because Ibanez is also going to be out the door after next season.

The Phillies would look to give one of their best pitching prospects and other prospects. To be honest, if they included Drew I would even consider trading Rollins as a part of it, even though that will never happen.

dodgersuck
11-16-2010, 08:12 PM
:laugh: you would be mad if the Phillies had to give up Brown to get Upton?

Upton>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Brown

d79cheese
11-16-2010, 08:21 PM
I hope not, if they included him I would be pissed. Brown is pretty much untouchable at this point because Ibanez is also going to be out the door after next season.

The Phillies would look to give one of their best pitching prospects and other prospects. To be honest, if they included Drew I would even consider trading Rollins as a part of it, even though that will never happen.

i would send brown in a package for upton in a heartbeat. upton is only a week and half older then brown, already has had very good success in the majors, and has much more potential then brown. last year he signed a 6 year 51 million dollar contract, so he is extremely affordable over the next 5 seasons. the phillies are running the risk of becoming to left handed in their lineup with brown hitting in the middle with utley and howard. getting upton to play right field would give them a proven offensive force for years to come.

bringbackfredex
11-16-2010, 08:23 PM
:laugh: you would be mad if the Phillies had to give up Brown to get Upton?

Upton>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Brown

Yeah because it would negate the purpose of getting Upton. The Phillies realistically need two outfielders, Ibanez is pretty much useless at this point and his deal expires after next year.

The Phillies have a bunch of other top of the line prospects, it isn't necessary to include Brown.

C-ross12
11-16-2010, 08:32 PM
Yeah because it would negate the purpose of getting Upton. The Phillies realistically need two outfielders, Ibanez is pretty much useless at this point and his deal expires after next year.

The Phillies have a bunch of other top of the line prospects, it isn't necessary to include Brown.

From my understanding, Domonic Brown is the star in the phillies system. For a player thats 23 and MLB Proven like Upton.. Brown would most likely have to be included. At least if I were Towers I'd definately ask for him.

It would be like the Yanks refusing to include Montero.

Or the Red Sox refusing to add Kelly / Kalish.

Or the Cubs refusing to add Brett Jackson / Chris Archer.

I mean its great to think about, but its not likely to happen.

d79cheese
11-16-2010, 08:34 PM
Yeah because it would negate the purpose of getting Upton. The Phillies realistically need two outfielders, Ibanez is pretty much useless at this point and his deal expires after next year.

The Phillies have a bunch of other top of the line prospects, it isn't necessary to include Brown.

but brown is the phillies top prospect and most major league ready player. he plays the same position as upton, so the dbacks would def. ask for brown as part of the deal to replace him, especially since they don't really have any major league ready outfield prospects for the next year or two. and since they really don't need to move upton, they can ask for ALOT in return (kinds like the royals and greinke). if the phillies want to get him they more then likely will have to make a package around brown.

the purpose of getting upton would be to replace werth for years to come, and upton would more then likely do that better then brown will.

lvlheaded
11-16-2010, 08:40 PM
Mets don't have what it takes to get done but I would literally cry... Three way trade

Mets Get: Upton and Scutaro

D-Backs Get: Reyes, Mejia, Nieuwenhuis, Esposito, Kelly

Redsox Get: Drew, Gee, Duda, Holt

I'm probably being totally unrealistic but again, I would cry

sexicano31
11-16-2010, 08:41 PM
Dom Brown?

as a starting point yes

jd25213
11-16-2010, 09:10 PM
^^^not again

EaglesJackson10
11-16-2010, 09:16 PM
I hope not, if they included him I would be pissed. Brown is pretty much untouchable at this point because Ibanez is also going to be out the door after next season.

The Phillies would look to give one of their best pitching prospects and other prospects. To be honest, if they included Drew I would even consider trading Rollins as a part of it, even though that will never happen.

No one is untouchable. Giving up Brown for him would be an easy decision for me. Same age. But one has accomplished a lot more and probably has a higher ceiling. Not to mention the fact that he is right handed. If you are going to give up Domonic Brown this is the perfect guy to exchange hiim for.

More-Than-Most
11-16-2010, 09:19 PM
I hope not, if they included him I would be pissed. Brown is pretty much untouchable at this point because Ibanez is also going to be out the door after next season.

The Phillies would look to give one of their best pitching prospects and other prospects. To be honest, if they included Drew I would even consider trading Rollins as a part of it, even though that will never happen.

I would give up Brown but not a ton more.

Jeffy25
11-16-2010, 09:23 PM
I don't even want to imagine what it would take to get Upton. It would be the world ten times over. His contract is good, his age is great, and he has proven his talent is amazing.

We are talking the potential to have Albert's bat, with Francouer's defense in right at the very best.

Literally, any team asking for him, would need to open up their minor league system, and the D'backs can just pick anyone they want, no limit on the number of players.

If I think Rasmus can fetch a valuable return, Upton would take a world of talent to get.

Let's start with Rasmus for Upton? Haha, I don't see why the D'Backs would trade their young franchise star when his contract is still good when they can finally have talented players called up. I would keep him, and it would take the world to move him.

Jeffy25
11-16-2010, 09:24 PM
No one is untouchable. Giving up Brown for him would be an easy decision for me. Same age. But one has accomplished a lot more and probably has a higher ceiling. Not to mention the fact that he is right handed. If you are going to give up Domonic Brown this is the perfect guy to exchange hiim for.

Brown would be a great starter for Upton.

You would have to give up a little more likely.

I have no idea why the D'backs would even consider trading him away though, they don't really need to.

papipapsmanny
11-16-2010, 09:37 PM
Kelly, Reddick, Anderson, and a lesser prospect for him

He is young and productive, but he isn't that productive and Ks a lot, but he is still a solid very young player

The_Franchise13
11-16-2010, 09:42 PM
Jonathan Sanchez or MadBum (pref to give up Sanchez), Zach Wheeler and Thomas Neal.

Probably not even close to enough.

jon32
11-16-2010, 09:54 PM
Toronto gets Upton

Diamondbacks get Z. Stewart, J.P Arencibia and Adam Lind.

iggypop123
11-16-2010, 09:57 PM
i love the hot stove but i hate it for this reason. something that shouldnt garner reports does. its just a team calling and asking whats up and them saying nothing man

Jeffy25
11-16-2010, 10:45 PM
With Kevin Towers back at the helm of a Major League franchise, we can be assured of one thing – he’ll create enough trade rumors to keep Tim Dierkes busy for life. If loose lips really did sink ships, Towers could take out an armada in a matter of minutes. Today’s rumor du jour is that the Diamondbacks will be willing to listen to calls for young right fielder Justin Upton. In reality, most every GM is willing to listen to calls for most every player on their roster, so this probably doesn’t mean anything. But, just for fun, let’s figure out what Upton might be worth if Arizona really did put him on the market.

Every discussion has to start with his age. He turned 23 in August, so most organizations still have highly regarded prospects older than he is, and yet, he’s already accumulated +7.7 WAR in what amounts to about three big league seasons. Even with his step back in 2010, he was an above major league right fielder at a time when most kids his age are trying to prove themselves in Double-A.

So, while we can dissect Upton’s strengths and weaknesses based on his big league performance to date, we have to keep his youth in mind. Most players who get to the big leagues as quickly as Upton turn out to be very good players, or even superstars. His potential is obvious.

However, there is a gap between what Upton could be and what he currently is. His blend of power and athleticism has allowed him to succeed despite a lack of contact, but if he’s going to make the leap to the next level, he’s going to have to figure out how to stop striking out so often. In fact, Upton is the only player in major league history to strike out 400 times by the end of his age 22 season.

Even if you lower the bar too 300 strikeouts at this point in a career, only Jose Canseco whiffed with anything approaching the same consistency – 24.6 percent of his plate appearances resulted in strikeouts, still trailing the 25.9 percent mark set by Upton so far. If you drop down to 200 strikeouts, you finally find three players with a higher strikeout rate than Justin Upton through age 22 – his brother B.J (26.3%), Sammy Sosa (26.3%), and Reggie Jackson (29.0%).

Those comparisons are a bit of a mixed bag. Canseco and Sosa have obvious clouds hanging over their heads, while the elder Upton hasn’t turned into the player that Tampa Bay was hoping for as of yet. Jackson is the guy who offers hope, as he got his contact problems under control in his mid-20s and developed into one of the best sluggers of all time.

Trading for Upton comes with a huge potential payoff, but reaching superstar status now looks a little less likely than it did a year or two ago. So, while a team acquiring Upton could hope for a big return, they’d also have to keep in mind that he might end up settling in as a good-not-great player. Let’s look at both scenarios and his estimated value for both over the next five years.

Good Player, Not A Superstar

2011 – +3.5 WAR, $17.5 million value, $4.25 million salary
2012 – +4.0 WAR, $20.8 million value, $6.75 million salary
2013 – +4.5 WAR, $24.8 million value, $9.75 million salary
2014 – +4.5 WAR, $25.7 million value, $14.25 million salary
2015 – +5.0 WAR, $30.0 million value, $14.5 million salary

Total: +21.5 WAR, $118.7 million value, $49.5 million salary

That puts Upton at about $70 million in surplus value over what his contract will pay him between 2011 and 2015.

Upton Becomes Elite

2011 – +4.5 WAR, $22.5 million value, $4.25 million salary
2012 – +5.0 WAR, $26.0 million value, $6.75 million salary
2013 – +5.5 WAR, $30.25 million value, $9.75 million salary
2014 – +6.0 WAR, $34.25 million value, $14.25 million salary
2015 – +6.5 WAR, $39.0 million value, $14.5 million salary

Total: +27.5 WAR, $152.0 million value, $49.5 million salary

In the best case scenario outcome, Upton is worth over $100 million beyond what he’ll be paid by the time he reaches free agency. This is the Reggie Jackson payoff, essentially. And this is why every team in baseball will at least be exploring whether Upton is priced to move or not.

These are not the only two outcomes, of course. He could regress (ZIPS lists his number one comparison as Danny Tartabull, for instance) or get injured. My expectations of continued salary inflation over the next five years could be wildly wrong. Teams will have to look at the broad spectrum of possible returns if they give up the farm to get Upton. However, given that he’s already a good player and wouldn’t need to improve much to be worth well more than his contract, and that he offers the upside to be among the best values in the game, the market for Upton is likely to be overflowing with interested teams.

And in the end, I expect Arizona will come to the realization that they should probably just hang onto their young right fielder.

From fangraphs

samevans7
11-16-2010, 10:47 PM
Mets don't have what it takes to get done but I would literally cry... Three way trade

Mets Get: Upton and Scutaro

D-Backs Get: Reyes, Mejia, Nieuwenhuis, Esposito, Kelly

Redsox Get: Drew, Gee, Duda, Holt

I'm probably being totally unrealistic but again, I would cry

BOS would not give up their top prospect and a good catching prospects for much lesser prospects, while getting an upgrade in SS, which is not really needed. The reason why Boston signed Scutaro was bc he was a good 2 year solution for when Iglesias was developing.... When Scut's contract ends, Iglesias starts.... why lose Kelly, and then technically Iglesias too? 0% chance Boston would do that

kmo429
11-16-2010, 11:02 PM
Mets don't have what it takes to get done but I would literally cry... Three way trade

Mets Get: Upton and Scutaro

D-Backs Get: Reyes, Mejia, Nieuwenhuis, Esposito, Kelly

Redsox Get: Drew, Gee, Duda, Holt

I'm probably being totally unrealistic but again, I would cry

If youre a mets fan... :laugh: No way. If they asked for Reyes, i'm hanging up the phone.

No, I'm not saying Reyes is better than Upton. I'm saying it's a step sideways in an outfield that already has Bay, Pagan, and Beltran. Only way we do this is if we get to include Beltran, and DBacks are rreally in rebuild mode. Reyes as a leadoff guy and great fielding shortstop and a very fast guy who wreaks havoc on the bases, has more value than an upgrade in an already very good hitting and fielding outfield.

DR. Pepper
11-16-2010, 11:06 PM
the rays should get this him to add some production to the lineup after crawford and pena walk plus longoria and upton would rake in the middle of tht lineup

TO to the CHI
11-16-2010, 11:23 PM
I think some of the posts are pretty amusing in this thread. I am all for someone determining that they don't want Upton for their team (though I cannot understand why), but if you are going to suggest a hypothetical offer at least be somewhat realistic. For example, obviously if the Mets were making an offer and the DBacks wanted Reyes, that would be an easy decision (though again if the concern is an outfield glut that is a different situation). The Cubs likely would struggle to get a deal done without some of the top level prospects that other teams could offer. The Phillies simply don't have the pieces without including Brown.

I am a Jays fan and I recognize that without Snyder or Drabek there is no discussion and that it would take much more.

As for why the DBacks would trade him, I could see how it might make sense if they could get a massive package.

EAGLES3658
11-16-2010, 11:25 PM
Kelly, Reddick, Anderson, and a lesser prospect for him

He is young and productive, but he isn't that productive and Ks a lot, but he is still a solid very young player

That doesnt even come close.

lvlheaded
11-16-2010, 11:41 PM
If youre a mets fan... :laugh: No way. If they asked for Reyes, i'm hanging up the phone.

No, I'm not saying Reyes is better than Upton. I'm saying it's a step sideways in an outfield that already has Bay, Pagan, and Beltran. Only way we do this is if we get to include Beltran, and DBacks are rreally in rebuild mode. Reyes as a leadoff guy and great fielding shortstop and a very fast guy who wreaks havoc on the bases, has more value than an upgrade in an already very good hitting and fielding outfield.

Well the reason for making the trade from the Mets point of view is yes you lose Reyes, but you may lose him next off season for nothing anyway. By trading him now you get Upton who is only 23 and is very productive.

The Mets outfielders have spent a lot of time injured over the last few years so it could be time for a change. Not to mention Beltran is 32, Bay is 33, and Pagan is 29, a shot of youth could be beneficial to the team. It also give you the option to trade one of Pagan or Beltran to upgrade at 2B or even make a trade to replace Reyes at SS.

Honestly the Mets would have no chance at Upton without including Reyes unless they trade Davis, Wright, or Pelfrey.

Now you have a younger core with Davis, Upton, and Wright, and you are saving the money you'd spend on a Reyes contract.

koldjerky
11-16-2010, 11:48 PM
i love the hot stove but i hate it for this reason. something that shouldnt garner reports does. its just a team calling and asking whats up and them saying nothing man

What would you rather talk about in the off-season?

Speculation is the best part of the winter.

Public Enemy #1
11-17-2010, 12:18 AM
I doubt they trade him. Doesn't make any sense, he is young, affordable, and has the potential to become an All Star for years to come. Why give him up on him so soon?

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 12:24 AM
If youre a mets fan... :laugh: No way. If they asked for Reyes, i'm hanging up the phone.

No, I'm not saying Reyes is better than Upton. I'm saying it's a step sideways in an outfield that already has Bay, Pagan, and Beltran. Only way we do this is if we get to include Beltran, and DBacks are rreally in rebuild mode. Reyes as a leadoff guy and great fielding shortstop and a very fast guy who wreaks havoc on the bases, has more value than an upgrade in an already very good hitting and fielding outfield.

And Upton is of greater value than Bay, Pagan and Beltran.

So hanging up the phone on Towers might not be a great idea.


Either way, they wouldn't want Reyes. Or any over paid veterans, they will want high level prospects only for him.

jd_azsportsfan
11-17-2010, 12:41 AM
hey guys as a dback fan (ya we exsist) there is no way hes goin anyware trust me also i dont think towers is gonna trade upton unless the giants gives us bumgardner and posey lol

Halopower31
11-17-2010, 01:40 AM
how about Angels get upton?
Angels:Upton
D-Backs: Peter bourjous, Andrew Romine ( gives more SS flexibility), Trevor Bell, and Trevor Reckling

or

Angels:Upton
D-Backs: Peter Bourjous, Andrew Romine, Trevor Reckling, and Tyler Chatwood

Hunter48MVP
11-17-2010, 02:09 AM
Of course Boston are going to be interested. They are interested in every player in baseball

Melo15
11-17-2010, 12:00 PM
#Diamondbacks have growing belief will trade Upton based on ton of interest. Will not trade Drew.

http://twitter.com/Joelsherman1/status/4925491836358656

jtsunami
11-17-2010, 12:04 PM
Cubs trade: Colvin, Vitters, and Jay Jackson.

Probably not enough, but I would have to be talked into including McNutt, Archer, or Brett Jackson.

m26555
11-17-2010, 12:04 PM
Apparently, the Marlins are the favorite to acquire him:


Arizona badly wants to rebuild its bullpen, add to its rotation and address first base. The Marlins were described by one official with knowledge of the Diamondbacks' plans as having the most interest in Upton for a while. Florida is among the organizations that most favors scouting and tools, and one AL personnel man described Upton as "a tool shed."

With a new ballpark due to open in 2012, the Marlins could in theory try to build around two of the most interesting young outfielders in the game, Upton and their own Mike Stanton. One executive even suggested a package of outfield prospect Logan Morrison and righty Ricky Nolasco, who has won at least 13 games three straight seasons, would probably get a deal done.


Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_sports/arizona_gauging_interest_in_upton_Dg7gLRj91uLiQ75A DlHiNP#ixzz15YYDQ1CS

TheRuckus
11-17-2010, 12:06 PM
Apparently, the Marlins are the favorite to acquire him:

That sounds like pure speculation, not an actual indication of them being a favorite.

I'm jizzing my pants imagining Upton in a Phillies uniform right now.

Melo15
11-17-2010, 12:07 PM
If the Marlins can get him for Morrison and Nolasco then you have to pull the trigger in my opinion

m26555
11-17-2010, 12:11 PM
If the Marlins can get him for Morrison and Nolasco then you have to pull the trigger in my opinion
Eh, as a Marlins' fan, I don't like that deal. I place a ridiculous amount of value on Morrison, and I don't want to trade one of our key pitchers. I love Upton, but I don't like the price.

Melo15
11-17-2010, 12:13 PM
Eh, as a Marlins' fan, I don't like that deal. I place a ridiculous amount of value on Morrison, and I don't want to trade one of our key pitchers. I love Upton, but I don't like the price.

Well from what I've read with the saved money from Uggla that they were going hard to bring Pavano back which would be huge in my opinion. I think at that point this trade is a little easier to swallow.

koldjerky
11-17-2010, 12:13 PM
Eh, as a Marlins' fan, I don't like that deal. I place a ridiculous amount of value on Morrison, and I don't want to trade one of our key pitchers. I love Upton, but I don't like the price.

But speaking of "price," Upton has a very friendly contract through 2015.

m26555
11-17-2010, 12:15 PM
Well from what I've read with the saved money from Uggla that they were going hard to bring Pavano back which would be huge in my opinion. I think at that point this trade is a little easier to swallow.
No doubt that would be huge, but I'd rather have four good pitchers instead of three.

jtsunami
11-17-2010, 12:17 PM
That's it???? Morrison and Nolasco?

Wells, J.Jackson, and Colvin. Done.

Melo15
11-17-2010, 12:18 PM
No doubt that would be huge, but I'd rather have four good pitchers instead of three.

Fair enough. I just think Upton, Stanton and Hanley together would be huge for the Marlins. Upton's K rate scares me a little bit but really other than that I would go all out for him.

Halopower31
11-17-2010, 12:41 PM
Angels trade Ervin Santana, Mark Trumbo, and Peter Burjous for Upton.
Then Angels go trade for Greinke =)

Halopower31
11-17-2010, 12:42 PM
or Mark Trumbo, Kevin Jepsen, izturs, and Bourjous for Upton

m26555
11-17-2010, 01:55 PM
That sounds like pure speculation, not an actual indication of them being a favorite.

I'm jizzing my pants imagining Upton in a Phillies uniform right now.

A small canvassing of executives said they viewed the early favorites to land Upton as the Marlins and Rays, though the Yankees and Red Sox were cited as teams to watch.


http://www.fishstripes.com/2010/11/17/1819759/marlins-interested-in-justin-upton

North Country
11-17-2010, 02:04 PM
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/dailypitch/post/2010/11/yankees-red-sox-justin-upton-trade-talks/1


Yet, while the Yankees' package has not met the Diamondbacks' demands, according to officials from New York and Arizona, the Red Sox still are engaged in talks.

"If somebody wants to overpay,'' Diamondbacks GM Kevin Towers said, "I'll be more than willing to listen. It's just a thing where people are kicking the tires right now. That's it.'

bringinwood
11-17-2010, 02:21 PM
Any reports of " the leading candidates to land him ", at this point, are completely useless...

Any team that doesn't inquire about Upton is nuts and their GM should be fired...


With that said, this isn't a deal that is going to happen this week or month... This is a deal that will linger out if it happens at all...

Towers need to get the best package for his most valuable asset if he, indeed, intends on trading him...

He will make sure that several teams are bidding against each other so he can deliver a Bedardesque haul...

Chances of him getting dealt are still slim...

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 02:41 PM
I personally, would really like to know what it would take to put Justin in Tampa with his brother.

What a lineup he could be in the middle of!

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 02:43 PM
Morrison and Nolasco for Upton?

As a Marlins executive, you HAVE to get that deal done.

It would be a steal. I know you like Morrision, but Upton is Morrison times 10.

Nolasco can be replaced if you need him to be, and he could possibly get paid as much as Upton after arb is done.

dodgersuck
11-17-2010, 03:37 PM
^^That was what I thought when I saw the rumor that said Morrison+Nolasco would land Upton. Marlins have to pull the trigger on that if it's true.

TheRuckus
11-17-2010, 03:51 PM
http://www.fishstripes.com/2010/11/17/1819759/marlins-interested-in-justin-upton

If the Rays really want him, the Marlins can't hope to match what they could offer.

I have a hard time believing the Diamondbacks would want anything other than a clutch of top prospects.

RATTLER14
11-17-2010, 03:55 PM
To all the people saying he should go to atlanta, his contract has a no trade clause to 5 teams and the braves are one of them. also, ive seen upton play just about all his pro games and the things he can do on a baseball field are unbelievable.. the diamondbacks arent going to settle AT ALL. remember what towers was asking for peavy? multiply that by like 5.. dom brown, cole hamels and a prospect is what i was hearing earlier. so all the people who were like joba chamberlain, a couple prospects (not montero or anyone worth mentioning) and a bullpen guy, go punch yourself in the face because you are a ******.

TheRuckus
11-17-2010, 04:00 PM
dom brown, cole hamels and a prospect is what i was hearing earlier.

Not only would I not do that as a Phillies fan, it doesn't make sense to me that Arizona would want a pitcher in his arbitration years.

If they're serious about trading Upton - and I still don't really get why they would be - the only smart move is to load up the farm.

papipapsmanny
11-17-2010, 04:52 PM
get it done Red Sox

Ellsbury, Kelly, Doubront, and Anderson... anyone

J_M_B
11-17-2010, 05:16 PM
According to Joel Sherman of the New York Post


"He would be a tough guy to move," acknowledged Diamondbacks general manager Kevin Towers. "But you always seek out the information on what teams will do because you never know if, to get one player, a team will grossly overpay." One executive told Sherman that a package of Logan Morrison and Ricky Nolasco from the Marlins would be enough to get a deal done.

Melo15
11-17-2010, 05:27 PM
Bob Nightengale from USA TODAY just told us that he thinks it's the Red Sox or nobody in the Justin Upton trade discussions with Arizona

http://twitter.com/jimbowdenxmfox

1903
11-17-2010, 05:32 PM
Diamondbacks are looking to deplete someones farm.

Melo15
11-17-2010, 05:34 PM
Diamondbacks are looking to deplete someones farm.

As they should. With how young Upton is and the talent he has they should only deal him if they get a very big return.

1903
11-17-2010, 05:41 PM
As they should. With how young Upton is and the talent he has they should only deal him if they get a very big return.

I agree, just stating why they would consider trading Upton. Seems like some people don't understand why they would do it.

HuRRiCaNeS324
11-17-2010, 05:56 PM
Please God let this happen :pray:

Hanley Stanton Upton in the middle would be nasty for the next 10 years.

HuRRiCaNeS324
11-17-2010, 05:59 PM
http://twitter.com/jimbowdenxmfox

great... i hate conflicting report with a passion. Now im not gonna look into this as much cuz were gonna have a bunch of different rumors which means nothing is gonna happen in the end.

samevans7
11-17-2010, 05:59 PM
yeah why would ARI take Morrison and Nolasco when they can get Ells, Kelly, and Doubrunt?

PatelJ1010
11-17-2010, 06:25 PM
If the Diamondbacks do trade Drew they might want a HUGE package of prospects with SP/RP(Like Eric Bedard trade / Dan Haren trade(Oak-AZ)) .... I think the Red Sox only pursue him if they get miss-out on Werth/Crawford...Yankees dont need unless they trade OF...I really darkhouse team is the Mariners and Nationals...but otherwise i dont see a deal happening

jd25213
11-17-2010, 07:52 PM
^^^Right, we don't NEED Upton, it's just a WANT by most Yankees fans.

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 10:00 PM
There is no reason to move Upton for a major league current ball player.

He will only be moved for prospects

Reggie Miller
11-17-2010, 10:30 PM
pitching pitching pitching, maybe zach grienke?

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 10:55 PM
pitching pitching pitching, maybe zach grienke?

only prospects

AZCardsFan
11-17-2010, 11:02 PM
God I hope not.

trevhipp7
11-17-2010, 11:44 PM
Would this be a fair trade?

MIN gets: Upton

ARI gets: Kyle Gibson, Aaron Hicks, Jaosn Kubel, Liam Hendricks

thats 2 top 30 prospects, a top 7 org. spec and a 25 HR OF replacement.
Gibson will be ready sometime this year. Hicks and Hendricks prolly next year.
I posted it in the Twins forum and have heard that is too much to give for Upton and Im a Twins fan so I think hearing that prolly means its either just right or not enough lol

Jeffy25
11-17-2010, 11:51 PM
Would this be a fair trade?

MIN gets: Upton

ARI gets: Kyle Gibson, Aaron Hicks, Jaosn Kubel, Liam Hendricks

thats 2 top 30 prospects, a top 7 org. spec and a 25 HR OF replacement.
Gibson will be ready sometime this year. Hicks and Hendricks prolly next year.
I posted it in the Twins forum and have heard that is too much to give for Upton and Im a Twins fan so I think hearing that prolly means its either just right or not enough lol

I would think so, but honestly, Towers might want only specs, and ask for you to keep Kubel and ask for Wilson Ramos or Sano.

Just saying what the D'Backs might want most, I think your offer is fair.

Mell413
11-17-2010, 11:58 PM
I would think so, but honestly, Towers might want only specs, and ask for you to keep Kubel and ask for Wilson Ramos or Sano.

Just saying what the D'Backs might want most, I think your offer is fair.

I think it's a fair offer, but isn't Ramos gone?

Jeffy25
11-18-2010, 12:03 AM
I think it's a fair offer, but isn't Ramos gone?

You might be right, Jesse Crain trade?

I don't remember, you could be right.

a 2 second google search would do it for me haha, but I really don't care enough to look.

If I was Towers, long story short, I would say, you keep Kubel, give me another top prospect.

But that is just me. The team should just keep loading up whatever talent they can one day find.

trevhipp7
11-18-2010, 12:04 AM
Ya I dont think the Twins could do that because the system is already a bit thin...

Mell413
11-18-2010, 12:05 AM
You might be right, Jesse Crain trade?

I don't remember, you could be right.

a 2 second google search would do it for me haha, but I really don't care enough to look.

If I was Towers, long story short, I would say, you keep Kubel, give me another top prospect.

But that is just me. The team should just keep loading up whatever talent they can one day find.

Capps

Jeffy25
11-18-2010, 12:06 AM
Sounds like Rockies are really pursuing too?

Could be speculation and rumors, but that is what I am hearing/reading

Mell413
11-18-2010, 12:10 AM
I'd love for the Cubs to get him. I think I would be willing to include any prospect with the exception of Brett Jackson to get him.

Jeffy25
11-18-2010, 12:16 AM
I'd love for the Cubs to get him. I think I would be willing to include any prospect with the exception of Brett Jackson to get him.

Can your Cubbies afford him? It's going to be after 2012 until you unload a lot of your salary, and isn't the team making commitments to rebuild?

Why abandon all of that for one 'could be' superstar?

Mell413
11-18-2010, 12:20 AM
Can your Cubbies afford him? It's going to be after 2012 until you unload a lot of your salary, and isn't the team making commitments to rebuild?

Why abandon all of that for one 'could be' superstar?

Could they? yes. Most of our salaries are gone after 2011. We have 62 committed in 2012, but that probably goes down in the 50s assuming Byrd and Samardzija are gone. I doubt they get him, but if we were going to give up some prospects I'd rather it be for a 23 year old OF.

ZioAx
11-18-2010, 12:28 AM
get him Theo

Halopower31
11-18-2010, 12:54 AM
Angels get Upton
D-Backs get Peter Bourjous, Andrew Romine, Trevor Reckling, and Kevin Jepsen

lavell12
11-18-2010, 06:45 AM
If the Braves are still in on him:

Randall Delgado, Mike Minor, Stephen Marek, and Jordan Schafer.

Tone091
11-18-2010, 09:30 AM
All I have to say is Carl Crawford and Jason Werth better sign soon, or they may be taking a pay cut. If the Red Sox get him, both Werth and Crawford can be had for a few million less.

Halopower31
11-18-2010, 12:25 PM
You think it would be possible that the Angels could make a trade for upton then sign crawford to have the best outfield ever?

CAIN=FUTURE
11-18-2010, 12:34 PM
Hahaha the D-Back are just realizing what no one else has yet... no other team has a chance in the NL West against the Giants for the next 7 years.

StriveGreatness
11-18-2010, 12:38 PM
I hope the Tigers trade for him.

Arizona gets Ryan Perry, Scott Sizemore, Ryan Raburn, Casey Crosby and Armando Galaragga

Detroit gets Justin Upton

ugafan
11-18-2010, 12:43 PM
I hope the Tigers trade for him.

Arizona gets Ryan Perry, Scott Sizemore, Ryan Raburn, Casey Crosby and Armando Galaragga

Detroit gets Justin Upton
Nowhere close to enough.

They'd start with Austin Jackson and Turner and go from there.

ugafan
11-18-2010, 12:45 PM
Hahaha the D-Back are just realizing what no one else has yet... no other team has a chance in the NL West against the Giants for the next 7 years.

7 years?
Do you think before you type?
It's idiotic to say that. The Rockies can compete and once the Dodgers sale inevitably occurs, they'll compete too. 7 years is a ridiculous amount of time.

StriveGreatness
11-18-2010, 12:54 PM
Nowhere close to enough.

They'd start with Austin Jackson and Turner and go from there.

Then hell no. I wouldn't give A-Jax and Turner up.

raps14
11-18-2010, 01:48 PM
From Rosenthal:

#BlueJays showing strong interest in J. Upton. Were unspecified team mentioned previously. Update soon on FOXSports.com. #Diamondbacks #MLB

raps14
11-18-2010, 01:49 PM
I wonder what it would take?

dodgersuck
11-18-2010, 01:55 PM
Snider+ prospects? or Drabek+Lind?

raps14
11-18-2010, 01:59 PM
Jays wont trade Snider, but I'm guessing it would be Drabek,Cecil +++

Dol-Fan
11-18-2010, 02:00 PM
Jays wont trade Snider, but I'm guessing it would be Drabek,Cecil +++

For Upton? Yes they will.

It will probably take Snider + Drabek + Stewart to land Upton.

Madness23
11-18-2010, 02:01 PM
i would like to trade pitching for Upton but not Snider, he may end up being better than Justin anyway !! maybe JPA and some pitching combinasion ( marcum+rzep+mills)

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:03 PM
For Upton? Yes they will.

It will probably take Snider + Drabek + Stewart to land Upton.

Lmao, That will never happen dude.

Snider has potential to bet better then Justin.

That trade would never happen.

dodgersuck
11-18-2010, 02:04 PM
Yeah trading Snider would seem somewhat pointless because he could be a star. I think Marcum+Drabek+Lind would get it done for sure.

Eagles4Lyfe
11-18-2010, 02:06 PM
For Upton? Yes they will.

It will probably take Snider + Drabek + Stewart to land Upton.

this is what i was exactly thinking.. I seriously wouldn't mind this but i would try everything to try and take snider out

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:08 PM
Yeah trading Snider would seem somewhat pointless because he could be a star. I think Marcum+Drabek+Lind would get it done for sure.

Yea there would be absolutely no point of us trading a potential future star(Snider) +Drabek+++++ for a potential star(Upton)? Makes no sense.

Madness23
11-18-2010, 02:09 PM
Yeah trading Snider would seem somewhat pointless because he could be a star. I think Marcum+Drabek+Lind would get it done for sure.

maybe a bit much to me but sounds about right, still needs some retooling !!! if u include drabek, lind souldn't be there, maybe some arms (rzep+mills) we have tons of pitching anyway

dodgersuck
11-18-2010, 02:11 PM
Rzep isn't very good. Maybe Marcum, Stewart, Lind, bullpen arms

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:12 PM
Rzep isn't very good. Maybe Marcum, Stewart, Lind, bullpen arms

Rzep sucks...fringe mlb pitcher.

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:14 PM
Ken Rosenthal
Updated Nov 18, 2010 12:32 PM ET

ORLANDO

The Blue Jays, a team deep in high-end pitching prospects, have expressed strong interest in trading for Diamondbacks right fielder Justin Upton, major-league sources say.

The Jays, after winning 85 games and finishing fourth in the highly competitive AL East last season, are showing a renewed aggressiveness this offseason.

Upton, 23, would be a more logical fit than second baseman Dan Uggla, whom the Jays tried to acquire from the Marlins earlier in the week.

While Uggla stood to earn $10 million-plus in arbitration and then become a free agent, Upton is under contract through 2015 and guaranteed $49.5 million over those five seasons.

The Red Sox, thought to be a possible front-runner in the Upton trade discussions, are now on the “backburner,” sources say.

Roughly half the major-league clubs have expressed interest in Upton. The Diamondbacks are making it clear to potential suitors that they intend to “win” any Upton trade.

An official from one interested club said the D-Backs want four top prospects for Upton. The Yankees, among other teams, are balking at that price.

The Diamondbacks, judging by the level of interest, are confident a deal is possible, sources say. Upton's contract enables him to reject trades to four clubs, but his list is not expected to be a factor.

The Red Sox are interested in Upton, but also working multiple fronts, including the pursuits of free-agent outfielders Carl Crawford and Jayson Werth, and their own free agents, catcher Victor Martinez and third baseman Adrian Beltre.

Which other clubs are interested in Upton? Perhaps the better question is, which clubs are not?

Here are three teams that could come up with intriguing prospect combinations that fit Arizona's needs.

Yankees: Towers is familiar with the New York farm system after working for the Yankees last season. The Yankees could probably build a competitive offer with some combination of catcher Jesus Montero, right-handed starter Ivan Nova, left-handed starter Manuel Banuelos and infielder Brandon Laird, who's being blocked by both Alex Rodriguez and Mark Teixeira.

Angels: Upton would cost them players, but he'd be more affordable than Crawford, their perceived top target in free agency. Outfielder Mike Trout is one of the “it” prospects in baseball right now, but it remains to be seen if GM Tony Reagins would include him in an offer. Reagins also has attractive depth at catcher, along with power arms Jordan Walden and Kevin Jepsen coming out of the bullpen. After outfielder Peter Bourjos struggled offensively in the big leagues, would Towers buy low?

A's: GM Billy Beane is always aggressive, and even after trading Vin Mazzaro, he has a stockpile of young starters from which to trade. The team's bullpen depth should be restored as well, with the returns of Joey Devine and Jerry Blevins from injury. And Oakland could use a big bat in right field; the team's .628 OPS at the position was the worst in the majors last season.



Low-revenue club such as the Royals, Rays and Marlins appear to be less likely landing spots, in part because of the steep price in prospects and because Upton will earn $14.25 million and $14.5 million in the final two years of his contract.

Upton, though immensely talented, is not necessarily a sure thing.

Some teams harbor reservations about his makeup, a shoulder injury that limited him to only five games after Aug. 30 and his statistics outside of Arizona's hitter-friendly Chase Field.

Other clubs view Upton as a player who only stands to improve as he enters his prime, and a player who could benefit from changing teams.

Upton hit 26 home runs and produced an .899 OPS in 2009, prompting the Diamondbacks to sign him to a six-year, $51.25 million extension last March.

He dropped to 17 homers and a .799 OPS last season. His salaries in the final two years of his deal — $14.25 million and $14.5 million — are considered steep by some low-revenue teams.

The Diamondbacks have discussed three-team, and possibly four-team, trades with the Red Sox, sources said. But as of Wednesday night, there was little momentum for a deal.

DodgersFanFor23
11-18-2010, 02:15 PM
Hahaha the D-Back are just realizing what no one else has yet... no other team has a chance in the NL West against the Giants for the next 7 years.

Giants would be lucky to get to the playoffs again next year... Seeing as they barely squeezed in this year.

Dol-Fan
11-18-2010, 02:15 PM
this is what i was exactly thinking.. I seriously wouldn't mind this but i would try everything to try and take snider out

I would too, but this is what it's going to take

This is for the guy laughing at what I said it will take to get Upton. Upton is a former #1 overall pick that has already put up 20/20, plays WAY better D than Snider does (not that Snider's is bad). Yes, Upton regressed a little bit this year but his career numbers far eclipse what Snider's done. He put up a ~.900 OPS (.898 to be exact) at age 22, and a .823 OPS for his career. Snider (in far less time) has put up an OPS of .764 over his career. Yes, Snider is one year younger - but Upton is much further along for his age, was much further along when he was Snider's age, and has a much higher ceiling.

Madness23
11-18-2010, 02:18 PM
Rzep isn't very good. Maybe Marcum, Stewart, Lind, bullpen arms

im just saying that u r penciling TO's ace, To's (potential) next ace, former young (27) all star ++ sorry who the hell r we trading for here, pujols ????

Eagles4Lyfe
11-18-2010, 02:21 PM
I would too, but this is what it's going to take

This is for the guy laughing at what I said it will take to get Upton. Upton is a former #1 overall pick that has already put up 20/20, plays WAY better D than Snider does (not that Snider's is bad). Yes, Upton regressed a little bit this year but his career numbers far eclipse what Snider's done. He put up a ~.900 OPS (.898 to be exact) at age 22, and a .823 OPS for his career. Snider (in far less time) has put up an OPS of .764 over his career. Yes, Snider is one year younger - but Upton is much further along for his age, was much further along when he was Snider's age, and has a much higher ceiling.

well said i mean if their asking for ellsbury from the redsox their definitely asking for snider from us no doubt..

TheRuckus
11-18-2010, 02:29 PM
It's hilarious how many people have no idea how good Justin Upton is and can be.

Most guys his age are still in Double-A, not putting up 20/20 seasons in the majors.

Eagles4Lyfe
11-18-2010, 02:35 PM
It's hilarious how many people have no idea how good Justin Upton is and can be.

Most guys his age are still in Double-A, not putting up 20/20 seasons in the majors.

exactly and a couple of idiots in the MLB mock offseason traded him for nothing :facepalm:

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:36 PM
It's hilarious how many people have no idea how good Justin Upton is and can be.

Most guys his age are still in Double-A, not putting up 20/20 seasons in the majors.

Snider is younger and has MUCH higher power potential. I'm not knocking Upton he is a great player I would love to have him, just not at the cost of Snider it would be pointless.

Dol-Fan
11-18-2010, 02:37 PM
Snider is younger and has MUCH higher power potential. I'm not knocking Upton he is a great player I would love to have him, just not at the cost of Snider it would be pointless.

Much higher power potential? Got numbers to back that up?

CityofTreez
11-18-2010, 02:40 PM
Snider is younger and has MUCH higher power potential. I'm not knocking Upton he is a great player I would love to have him, just not at the cost of Snider it would be pointless.

Alot of teams are being put in this dilemma, unfortunately my Phillies are thinking of trading Dom Brown for Upton! Not with it at all!

raps14
11-18-2010, 02:43 PM
Much higher power potential? Got numbers to back that up?

Snider already has a higher HR/162 than Upton is a year younger 45 pounds heavier and has a power stroke.

Madness23
11-18-2010, 02:44 PM
you know what, i would take my chances with snider and keep our pitching arsenal as it is !! go ask jays fans how gaston was a braking factor for snider development, watch out next year IMO

Kelly Gruber
11-18-2010, 02:45 PM
Potential is through the roof with Upton. Love to have him. Doubt the Jays would include Snider though, no point. Not that Upton isn't worth it, just doesn't make sense. We have a couple OF prospects in lower levels and if they want a guy to play now, Lind would be the guy. Probably no pitching prospect I wouldn't give up for him, and that includes Drabek.

I think he'll end up going for 2 real good prospects, a decent one, and someone that can play now. Make no mistake this will be a huge package if a trade goes down. He's got a big contract for what he's done, but this guy oozes 5-tool potential.

Jays101
11-18-2010, 03:06 PM
when comparing upton and snider... sure upton is much more heralded, theres alot more known of what he can be. But watching snider, i really think this guy can be one of the best players in the league. Upton is a great player whose got all the tools, a classic five tooler who can do it all, while snider is more of a power masher with a good batting average.

Breaking it down:
Hitting for Power... Snider > Upton
Hitting for Average... Snider = Upton
Baserunning... Upton > Snider
Fielding... Upton > Snider
Arm.. Snider = Upton

It depends on how you see it, snider could potentially hit for better average as well, some people may say uption has a better arm... But what is of more value, defence or power?

Beyond the tool analysis, the intangibles are what i think sets these two apart. No offence to upton, but rumor has it hes not the easiest to get along with and has a cocky attitude, i mean theres a reason why arizona would wanna trade this guy(talent clearly aint it). Travis snider is one of the most articulate and humble young men i have ever hear speak; also one of the most well-liked in the club house and considering all hes been through in his life and his ambition for greatness, Snider is a true winner.

Breaking it down, as a jays fan... yea sure, ill say it, Upton probably has more natural talent than Snider, but i truly beleive Snider will be the better player overall over the course of their careers.

Jeffy25
11-18-2010, 04:09 PM
Breaking it down:
Hitting for Power... Snider > Upton
Hitting for Average... Snider = Upton
Baserunning... Upton > Snider
Fielding... Upton > Snider
Arm.. Snider = Upton


Hold on now.

This isn't exactly true...at least not the power part.

Upton and Snider basically have same career ISO, while Upton has posted better Slugging and batting averages.

couple that with an additional 25 points in BABIP, and Upton is the superior hitter (so far, they are only 22).

That and Upton has played a **** ton more games, that experience really does matter, and is part of the attractiveness that is Upton. Young and has played quite a bit.

Oh, and Upton's arm is considered better by fangraphs...of course limited sample size for Snider, but that is because he hasn't played as much.

I would rather have Upton than Snider if I were starting a franchise today.


And I think you really missed the bus on the rest of your post.

You think Upton has attitude problems? You sure you aren't confusing him with his brother?

And just because some team asked for Upton, and that the D'Backs are willing to listen to offers doesn't mean he is a problem.

God, same thing was said about Rasmus. Just because a team will 'hear' offers doesn't mean the guy is some Manny Ramirez, Randy Moss problem in the club house.

Eagles4Lyfe
11-18-2010, 04:29 PM
did this guy really say he'd take snider over upton, snider cant steal bases like upton nor have the speed he does, upton has more range and is better defensively, uptons more of a better avg hitter so far snider still has to show he can do that..
Dont get me wrong as a jays fan i love snider and would welcome a upton/snider tandem i just hope its possible to get im without snider

bomber0104
11-18-2010, 04:49 PM
I dont think anyone is saying Snider is better than Upton. Snider has the potential to be a beast and so does Upton (he has shown more obviously) but is the difference between the 2 worth trading 3 top prospects. That is the problem.

Lind I have no problem dealing but I'm not too sure how excited the D'backs are to have him play on the field

kyubi256
11-18-2010, 05:33 PM
Looking at BJ Upton... I would be hesitant to give up a lot for Justin Upton. He could be a guy with great potential but just a "above-average" starter... Not a star

Jeffy25
11-18-2010, 05:48 PM
The season that Upton put up at 21 years old gives plenty of people a reason to believe he will be a star.

bringinwood
11-18-2010, 06:05 PM
This kid is one of the most talented athletes, at any level, of anyone's organization...

There is not one prospect that a team shouldn't be willing to part with in an attempt to gain his services...

I love how fans fall in love with their prospects without judging the talent that they would be gaining for those prospects...

As a Phils fan, I would gladly give up Domonic Brown ( last years number 1 overall prospect in baseball ) + for a shot at him...


That being said, it's a sad day in baseball when an organization is so scrounged to save money that they have to field offers for a guy of his potential...

bomber0104
11-18-2010, 08:48 PM
This kid is one of the most talented athletes, at any level, of anyone's organization...

There is not one prospect that a team shouldn't be willing to part with in an attempt to gain his services...

I love how fans fall in love with their prospects without judging the talent that they would be gaining for those prospects...

As a Phils fan, I would gladly give up Domonic Brown ( last years number 1 overall prospect in baseball ) + for a shot at him...


That being said, it's a sad day in baseball when an organization is so scrounged to save money that they have to field offers for a guy of his potential...

the thing is.. the Backs are looking for more than 1 prospect. I'm pretty sure the Jays would jump at a Snider for Upton trade straight up just like the Phillies would with Brown. But the Backs want at least 2 more high end prospects and 1 or 2 mid level guys

Eagles4Lyfe
11-18-2010, 11:06 PM
lets not forget he practically missed the last month which is why its not fair to show he regressed a lot because who knows what he would have done in the final month

lovingTO
11-19-2010, 12:14 AM
I would welcome the addition of upton to the jays. I trust AA will pull the trigger if the deals reasonable.

mwoodri
11-19-2010, 01:04 AM
Who trades Justin Upton?

The Jokemaker
11-19-2010, 01:38 AM
Who trades Justin Upton?

A team with many holes

kyubi256
11-19-2010, 02:26 AM
exactly and a couple of idiots in the MLB mock offseason traded him for nothing :facepalm:

Are you talking about yourself and brewerboy? Cause both of you were the D'Backs... And I wouldn't say you traded him for nothing... You did not get the better end of the deal but you did get an ace.

Jeffy25
11-19-2010, 02:35 AM
Apparently a three team trade that would send Upton to the Cardinals. Rasmus to the Red Sox, and four prospects to the D'Backs. One from the Cardinals, three from the Red Sox.


Really complicated, really interesting if two of the top young players in the league were to be traded in one single trade this off-season.


Highly unlikely.

But Upton with Pujols and Holliday.....****

kyubi256
11-19-2010, 02:52 AM
^Source?

It would be very interesting if Ellsbury is dealt also...

Cardinals get: Justin Upton
Red Sox get: Colby Rasmus
D'Backs get: Jacoby Ellsbury, Daniel Bard, Prospect (Cards), and Prospect (Red Sox)

Three young players in one deal

Jeffy25
11-19-2010, 02:54 AM
^Source?

It would be very interesting if Ellsbury is dealt also...

Cardinals get: Justin Upton
Red Sox get: Colby Rasmus
D'Backs get: Jacoby Ellsbury, Daniel Bard, Prospect (Cards), and Prospect (Red Sox)

Three young players in one deal

I'm looking for a source online, I heard it on the radio today. So how credible this is, I have zero clue.

More-Than-Most
11-19-2010, 06:20 AM
[FOX Sports] Red Sox trade talks stalled on Justin Upton - "Another unspecified team made a strong push... and roughly half of the 30 clubs have expressed interest. The Diamondbacks are making it clear to potential suitors they intend to "win" any trade involving Upton... An official from one interested club said the D-Backs want four top prospects for Upton. The Yankees, among other teams, are balking at that price."

I want upton but not that damn bad

Swishalicious
11-19-2010, 07:27 AM
^Source?

It would be very interesting if Ellsbury is dealt also...

Cardinals get: Justin Upton
Red Sox get: Colby Rasmus
D'Backs get: Jacoby Ellsbury, Daniel Bard, Prospect (Cards), and Prospect (Red Sox)

Three young players in one deal

Idk, the Red Sox shouldn't give up on Jacoby Ellsbury cause he had one dreadful DL season. And if they do, they should be the ones going after Justin Upton IMO.

Swishalicious
11-19-2010, 07:40 AM
welcome to: *****************************

The website wholesale for many kinds of fashion shoes, like the nike,jordan,prada,****, also including the jeans,shirts,bags,hat and the decorations. All the products are free shipping, and the the price is competitive, and also can accept the paypal payment.,after the payment, can ship within short time.


free shipping

competitive price

any size available

accept the paypal

*****************************


jordan shoes $32

nike shox $32

Christan Audigier bikini $23

Ed Hardy Bikini $23

Smful short_t-shirt_woman $15

ed hardy short_tank_woman $16

Sandal $32

christian louboutin $80

Sunglass $15

COACH_Necklace $27

handbag $33

AF tank woman $17

puma slipper woman $30

*****************************

OMG, can u just die or something!!

shortfuze
11-19-2010, 08:53 AM
i am still really new at looking into prospects and draft picks and things of that nature. i have been watching baseball for years, just not the developmental side. before we traded doc last year i heard we had one of the worst systems in baseball. when the jays traded doc and got back some great prospects, the jays system started to get a lot better. would it be smart to trade 4-5 top prospects for 1 guy and is our prospect pool deep enough to make a trade like that.

Madness23
11-19-2010, 09:25 AM
i am still really new at looking into prospects and draft picks and things of that nature. i have been watching baseball for years, just not the developmental side. before we traded doc last year i heard we had one of the worst systems in baseball. when the jays traded doc and got back some great prospects, the jays system started to get a lot better. would it be smart to trade 4-5 top prospects for 1 guy and is our prospect pool deep enough to make a trade like that.

we have a lot of starting pitchers candidates ( a hot commodity i baseball) we can afford to trade any pitchers we want, field players is another debate

P.s i dont want to trade Snider for Upton, the move will bites us down the road

BRADY4MVP
11-19-2010, 11:05 AM
Apparently a three team trade that would send Upton to the Cardinals. Rasmus to the Red Sox, and four prospects to the D'Backs. One from the Cardinals, three from the Red Sox.


Really complicated, really interesting if two of the top young players in the league were to be traded in one single trade this off-season.


Highly unlikely.

But Upton with Pujols and Holliday.....****

def. wouldnt mind seeing rasmus come to the sox, but the package IMO would have to be much different than Upton... I know it's a 3 team trade, but there is NO WAY they offer close to as much for this deal than upton straight up.


Idk, the Red Sox shouldn't give up on Jacoby Ellsbury cause he had one dreadful DL season. And if they do, they should be the ones going after Justin Upton IMO.


exactly. If they are going to invlove ellsbury and bard, it has to be for upton/agon/ that sort of player. while i think rasmus is going to be pretty good, I dont see the same talent as upton.

--

this type of player is exactly what teams stock up talent for in the minors (obv. besides promoting to the majors). An extremely talented player who is under team control for years, very reasonably, is worth the prospects.

hell, look at when the sox traded for pedro... main components of the trade...tony armas jr. and carl pavano. prospects are just that....



just my .02

todu82
11-19-2010, 11:16 AM
Upton would be a great fit on any team but he's not worth 4 top prospects.

Tone091
11-19-2010, 02:40 PM
I hear the O's are in on it, not sure why unless he can play 1B or 3B. Doesn't make sense to me. But, either way he is a good talent, it can't be no worse than what we have.

theLgndKllr35
11-19-2010, 03:22 PM
I for one hope they hold onto him, they suck for another 2 years, Upton complains his way out and they get severely lower value for him than they should have.

The_Franchise13
11-19-2010, 04:06 PM
Posted this in the Giants forum as well...

To humor myself a bit I was thinking of what type of package it would take to pry Justin Upton from AZ. Do the Giants have enough? etc..

I consider Lincecum and Posey as close to untouchable as possible. Obviously no one is untouchable, but trading those two would hurt the franchise too much unless it was a gross overpayment (and I mean GROSS). In a sense Cain is slightly a step behind those two.

Towers said he wanted 2 "A" Grade Prospects, "B" Grades.

With that said, the best value I could come up with was...

MadBum/Sanchez (their pick), Belt, Wheeler, Runzler and Neal.

The extra prospect to make up value that Wheeler and Runzler don't really have. It's still not enough for a 5 year controlled Justin Upton, heh.

I read something on Fangraphs the other day, too lazy to link, it should be easy to find though. It was Dave Cameron talking Justin Upton. Speaking on what the Phillies might give up, he figured Dominic Brown and Cole Hamels would be what AZ asks for. Upton is that valuable. Figuring that Upton and Carl Crawford will perform similarly the next 5 years but Crawford will cost you 100M+ while Upton will cost 50M.

Now with that thinking...

My question to you becomes, would you guys do a package that's along the lines of...

Matt Cain, Belt, Wheeler, "B" Prospect, "B" Prospect, "C" Prospect

for Upton?

I personally wouldn't. Not that the value isn't there, it's much closer with Cain in there. I feel it would rock the boat too much for the Giants. A case where I feel Cain is worth more to the Giants than his trade value would be. Thoughts?

bringinwood
11-19-2010, 04:21 PM
Posted this in the Giants forum as well...

To humor myself a bit I was thinking of what type of package it would take to pry Justin Upton from AZ. Do the Giants have enough? etc..

I consider Lincecum and Posey as close to untouchable as possible. Obviously no one is untouchable, but trading those two would hurt the franchise too much unless it was a gross overpayment (and I mean GROSS). In a sense Cain is slightly a step behind those two.

Towers said he wanted 2 "A" Grade Prospects, "B" Grades.

With that said, the best value I could come up with was...

MadBum/Sanchez (their pick), Belt, Wheeler, Runzler and Neal.

The extra prospect to make up value that Wheeler and Runzler don't really have. It's still not enough for a 5 year controlled Justin Upton, heh.

I read something on Fangraphs the other day, too lazy to link, it should be easy to find though. It was Dave Cameron talking Justin Upton. Speaking on what the Phillies might give up, he figured Dominic Brown and Cole Hamels would be what AZ asks for. Upton is that valuable. Figuring that Upton and Carl Crawford will perform similarly the next 5 years but Crawford will cost you 100M+ while Upton will cost 50M.

Now with that thinking...

My question to you becomes, would you guys do a package that's along the lines of...

Matt Cain, Belt, Wheeler, "B" Prospect, "B" Prospect, "C" Prospect

for Upton?

I personally wouldn't. Not that the value isn't there, it's much closer with Cain in there. I feel it would rock the boat too much for the Giants. A case where I feel Cain is worth more to the Giants than his trade value would be. Thoughts?

There isn't one player in baseball, right now, with the talent makeup of Justin Upton...

That prospect, let alone established player, is definitely not there... So, Towers would be able to cherry pick any teams top two prospects...

However, an overpayment to the tune of what Seattle payed for Erik Bedard might be a bit much...

I can't see a team giving up more than 3 prospects...

Regardless of the talent level, this isn't the NBA... You can't win ballgames with one player on the diamond, regardless of that one player...

Halladay
11-19-2010, 06:35 PM
How many teams would match a starting offer of Snider/Drabek and Stewart? Those are pretty significant prospects.

DieHardColtsfan
11-19-2010, 06:42 PM
How many teams would match a starting offer of Snider/Drabek and Stewart? Those are pretty significant prospects.

I wouldn't offer that if I'm the Blue Jays.. Too much IMO. Yet thats the price so :shrug:

Halladay
11-19-2010, 06:46 PM
I wouldn't offer that if I'm the Blue Jays.. Too much IMO. Yet thats the price so :shrug:

I don't think think it's an overpayment. Neither Snider/Drabek or Stewart are franchise players where as Upton probably is. Any of the three will be lucky to be as good as Upton. That's the way I see it. We're also stacked with pitching prospects so It wouldn't be the end of the world if we dealt a few.

CWBYHTR
11-19-2010, 07:11 PM
The DBacks need to dump at least 20 mill I'm salary so you bet they're looking to move Upton and Drew.

The_Franchise13
11-19-2010, 07:14 PM
The DBacks need to dump at least 20 mill I'm salary so you bet they're looking to move Upton and Drew.

Dumping Upton for salary purposes seems soo.... wrong? He's cheap, he's good. They really should find someone else to trade.

What would it take to get Drew from AZ?

Jeffy25
11-19-2010, 07:35 PM
The DBacks need to dump at least 20 mill I'm salary so you bet they're looking to move Upton and Drew.

He makes like 4 million next season.............

koldjerky
11-19-2010, 07:54 PM
Upton's contract jumps in a couple seasons so I guess that could be why. I don't understand why Upton though when you got a guy like Chris Young who makes more next season and it wouldn't be too stupid giving him up.

They wouldn't get back as much back in return but at least they aren't getting rid of a franchise player.

zambo4president
11-19-2010, 08:50 PM
Giants should try and move Sanchez and Bumgarner or maybe something around Cain. J Up would be a big hep to them.

Sportfan
11-19-2010, 09:30 PM
How many teams would match a starting offer of Snider/Drabek and Stewart? Those are pretty significant prospects.
Red Sox apparently offered Ellsbury Bard and Doubront/Kalish


Why the **** would the Diamondbacks trade Upton to the Giants?

d79cheese
11-19-2010, 10:05 PM
Giants should try and move Sanchez and Bumgarner or maybe something around Cain. J Up would be a big hep to them.

the giants don't have the prospects to get a deal like this done. the giants would have to part with probably sanchez and bumgarner along with belt (thier top prospect) and another 2 mid level prospects. the dbacks would not want matt cain because after this season, his contract jumps to 15 million and then is a free agent after 2012. there is not one player that is probably worth both sanchez, bumgarner, and belt.

ugafan
11-19-2010, 10:09 PM
I still think it's incredibly dumb of them to trade a guy like him who's as good as he is and under control for as long as he is and how cheap he'll be.

d79cheese
11-19-2010, 10:23 PM
4 teams we know Upton won't be going to:


The Athletics, Indians, Royals and Tigers are the four clubs on Upton's no-trade list, tweets FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal. Upton can be dealt to any of the other 25 teams without his approval.

North Country
11-19-2010, 11:39 PM
4 teams we know Upton won't be going to:

I could see why someone wouldn't want to live in Detroit, Cleveland or Oakland. Never been to Kansas City.

drew_ellis_23
11-19-2010, 11:41 PM
I see Big Z and the M's wrapping this up shortly

ZioAx
11-19-2010, 11:43 PM
I could see why someone wouldn't want to live in Detroit, Cleveland or Oakland. Never been to Kansas City.

Who cares about KC the city, the team is pathetic. The Jay's AA team near my place could whoop them.

NateyB24
11-19-2010, 11:45 PM
I see Big Z and the M's wrapping this up shortly

Z isn't going to trade for him this is a rebuild year and Pineda and Ackley are untouchables anyways. Besides hes a right handed hitter=goona suck in Safeco. Also hes injured his shoulder that should give caution to any team trading for him.

ZioAx
11-19-2010, 11:51 PM
Z isn't going to trade for him this is a rebuild year and Pineda and Ackley are untouchables anyways. Besides hes a right handed hitter=goona suck in Safeco. Also hes injured his shoulder that should give caution to any team trading for him.

:nod: Beltre says hi

JermanJaysFan
11-19-2010, 11:56 PM
I still think it's incredibly dumb of them to trade a guy like him who's as good as he is and under control for as long as he is and how cheap he'll be.

It is not dumb if they get someone to overpay for him.

Kenny Powders
11-20-2010, 12:06 AM
As a Jays fan, I would be willing to give up Drabek, Arencibia, Stewart, Alverez. Pitching and catching are our strengths, so we can recover from this. A potential outfield of Snider, Gose, Upton with Romero, Morrow, Cecil, Marcum on the hill four out of five starts means that we'll become a player in the Al East

d79cheese
11-20-2010, 12:42 AM
:nod: Beltre says hi

so does his .253/.307/.409 career line at safeco

Halopower31
11-20-2010, 01:23 AM
Angels get Upton and Reynolds.
D-Backs get: Peter Bourjous,Kevin Jepsen, Mark Trumbo, Mike Napoli, Alberto Callaspo, Trevor Reckling.

CAIN=FUTURE
11-20-2010, 03:28 AM
the giants don't have the prospects to get a deal like this done. the giants would have to part with probably sanchez and bumgarner along with belt (thier top prospect) and another 2 mid level prospects. the dbacks would not want matt cain because after this season, his contract jumps to 15 million and then is a free agent after 2012. there is not one player that is probably worth both sanchez, bumgarner, and belt.

Jonathan Sanchez, Madison Bumgarner, and Brandon Belt... I'll take Alber Pujols. There is no way the D-Backs are dumb enough to put Upton with Posey, and the Panda on the Giants.

CAIN=FUTURE
11-20-2010, 03:32 AM
Giants should try and move Sanchez and Bumgarner or maybe something around Cain. J Up would be a big hep to them.

If the Giants traded Bumgarner and Sanchez in the same deal for anyone i'd kill myself.

I would take a dream rotation of...
Lincecum
Bumgarner
Cain
Sanchez
Zito

Over any single hitter in baseball.

EDIT: With the possibility of Dan Runzler as a starter next season may make Jonathan Sanchez available to haul in a big bat for the Giants.

boomheadshot45
11-20-2010, 03:32 AM
Why would you trade 2 pitchers of your starting rotation (with no replacements) and your best prospect for Justin Upton? Way too much for him.

d79cheese
11-20-2010, 03:46 AM
Jonathan Sanchez, Madison Bumgarner, and Brandon Belt... I'll take Alber Pujols. There is no way the D-Backs are dumb enough to put Upton with Posey, and the Panda on the Giants.

i wouldn't trade those three for albert pujols now because of his age and his upcoming pay day.

BayHuStLE
11-20-2010, 04:50 AM
giants please get..
Sabean doesnt even have a phone, FML :mad::facepalm:

The_Jamal
11-20-2010, 05:25 AM
No, unless we can get away without dealing one of our ML starting arms/Posey. Which won't happen since we are in the division

Hopper15
11-20-2010, 09:36 AM
The Giants are the last team Kevin Towers would deal Upton to right now.

CAIN=FUTURE
11-20-2010, 02:41 PM
The Giants are the last team Kevin Towers would deal Upton to right now.

This. But can you imagine if he did? I think a lot of teams would be uneasy about trading any young talent to the Giants.

metsgiants5710
11-20-2010, 02:55 PM
sandy alderson better call josh towers now. Glad to see Omar's already making decisions in arizona.

treeleaf
11-20-2010, 04:07 PM
Jays would get upton way way befor the giants
Bungardner and sanches would NOT go down soo u guys are idiots for thinking that
If the giants were offering that towers woulda signed the papers already

ZioAx
11-20-2010, 04:56 PM
Theo pulls it off. GET HIM

JOSKOMANG4
11-21-2010, 03:13 PM
If the Mets can trade Beltran for a front line starter.... I say we trade for Justin UPton.

- Trade K.Rod(eat 8million of 11.5 owed), OF F.Mart, & RHP J.Mejia to the D Backs for J.Upton.

- Trade OF Beltran(eat 13million of 18 owed) to the Astros for LHP W.Rodriguez

LIneup:

1. Reyes-SS
2. Pagan-CF
3. Wright-3b
4. Bay-LF
5. Upton-RF
6. I.Davis-1b
7. D.Murphy-2b
8. J.Thole- C

Rotation:

LHP Santana
LHP W.Rodriguez
RHP Pelfrey
LHP J.Niese
RHP RA Dickey

koreancabbage
11-21-2010, 03:34 PM
If the Giants traded Bumgarner and Sanchez in the same deal for anyone i'd kill myself.

I would take a dream rotation of...
Lincecum
Bumgarner
Cain
Sanchez
Zito

Over any single hitter in baseball.

EDIT: With the possibility of Dan Runzler as a starter next season may make Jonathan Sanchez available to haul in a big bat for the Giants.

no you won't lol

BeantownBill
11-21-2010, 03:45 PM
If the Mets can trade Beltran for a front line starter.... I say we trade for Justin UPton.

- Trade K.Rod(eat 8million of 11.5 owed), OF F.Mart, & RHP J.Mejia to the D Backs for J.Upton.

- Trade OF Beltran(eat 13million of 18 owed) to the Astros for LHP W.Rodriguez

LIneup:

1. Reyes-SS
2. Pagan-CF
3. Wright-3b
4. Bay-LF
5. Upton-RF
6. I.Davis-1b
7. D.Murphy-2b
8. J.Thole- C

Rotation:

LHP Santana
LHP W.Rodriguez
RHP Pelfrey
LHP J.Niese
RHP RA Dickey

Arizona is looking for 4 prospects in return, at least 2 of whom are major league ready. The above proposal is, no offense, a joke and whomever made the call of behalf of the Mets would likely get hung up on.

Actually, both of those deals are laughable.

BeantownBill
11-21-2010, 03:52 PM
As a Jays fan, I would be willing to give up Drabek, Arencibia, Stewart, Alverez. Pitching and catching are our strengths, so we can recover from this. A potential outfield of Snider, Gose, Upton with Romero, Morrow, Cecil, Marcum on the hill four out of five starts means that we'll become a player in the Al East

Provided they can ever make that many starts as a unit.

BeantownBill
11-21-2010, 03:56 PM
If youre a mets fan... :laugh: No way. If they asked for Reyes, i'm hanging up the phone.

No, I'm not saying Reyes is better than Upton. I'm saying it's a step sideways in an outfield that already has Bay, Pagan, and Beltran. Only way we do this is if we get to include Beltran, and DBacks are rreally in rebuild mode. Reyes as a leadoff guy and great fielding shortstop and a very fast guy who wreaks havoc on the bases, has more value than an upgrade in an already very good hitting and fielding outfield.

:laugh2:

koreancabbage
11-21-2010, 04:01 PM
Provided they can ever make that many starts as a unit.

what do you mean? with the exception of Morrow, who they are easing into a SP over his misuse in Seattle, everyone pitched over 170 innings.

This is a young and brilliant staff, all of whom have positively progressed over the last two years.

with that said, no way we trade that much for Upton, since noone else is offering that much for Upton either.

FWBrodie
11-22-2010, 02:03 PM
I think the Mariners can get it done without including Smoak or Ackley via a package built around Michael Pineda.

Pineda, Michael Saunders, Nick Franklin, and David Aardsma... something along those lines. They may also try to pull Stephen Drew.

celtisox41
11-22-2010, 03:44 PM
I think the Mariners can get it done without including Smoak or Ackley via a package built around Michael Pineda.

Pineda, Michael Saunders, Nick Franklin, and David Aardsma... something along those lines. They may also try to pull Stephen Drew.

That wouldn't get it done for the mariners. The diamonbacks wanted bard, ellsbury, and something like anderson or rizzo, casey kelly, and more prospects. They were even talking about buchholz. So saying your going to get upton AND drew for just that isn't going to happen

FWBrodie
11-22-2010, 03:53 PM
That wouldn't get it done for the mariners. The diamonbacks wanted bard, ellsbury, and something like anderson or rizzo, casey kelly, and more prospects. They were even talking about buchholz. So saying your going to get upton AND drew for just that isn't going to happen

That's not what I said. That was just for Upton, but I speculated that they may try to pull Drew too by including more since Franklin is their current future at SS. Pineda is a huge centerpiece. If Arizona is serious about wanting to compete next season without Upton, I could see Figgins being on the table as well. Right now it sounds like Arizona is confused about what they want for themselves. They need to face reality, they won't be a good team next season regardless of what they decide to do.

Maintain87
11-22-2010, 04:29 PM
That's not what I said. That was just for Upton, but I speculated that they may try to pull Drew too by including more since Franklin is their current future at SS. Pineda is a huge centerpiece. If Arizona is serious about wanting to compete next season without Upton, I could see Figgins being on the table as well. Right now it sounds like Arizona is confused about what they want for themselves. They need to face reality, they won't be a good team next season regardless of what they decide to do.

Wont happen....Justin Upton has four teams on his no-trade list, tweets Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports: the Athletics, Mariners, Tigers, and Royals. A previous Rosenthal report had included the Indians instead of the Mariners. Rosenthal tweets that the Mariners indeed have interest, but they'd be very reluctant to meet Arizona's starting point of Dustin Ackley.

The Royals, Blue Jays, Marlins, Orioles, Red Sox, and Yankees are reportedly among the other interested teams. On Friday, Joel Sherman of the New York Post reported that the D'Backs were approached by 15-16 teams about Upton at the GM Meetings, five of which "showed a strong inclination to push talks further along." The Yankees are not among the five.

FWBrodie
11-22-2010, 04:52 PM
Wont happen....Justin Upton has four teams on his no-trade list, tweets Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports: the Athletics, Mariners, Tigers, and Royals. A previous Rosenthal report had included the Indians instead of the Mariners. Rosenthal tweets that the Mariners indeed have interest, but they'd be very reluctant to meet Arizona's starting point of Dustin Ackley.

The Royals, Blue Jays, Marlins, Orioles, Red Sox, and Yankees are reportedly among the other interested teams. On Friday, Joel Sherman of the New York Post reported that the D'Backs were approached by 15-16 teams about Upton at the GM Meetings, five of which "showed a strong inclination to push talks further along." The Yankees are not among the five.

That was pure speculation on Rosenthal's part.

boomheadshot45
11-22-2010, 08:47 PM
That was pure speculation on Rosenthal's part.
Yet realistic speculation. If the Tigers wanted Upton, they would have to give up Turner. If the Giants wanted Upton, they would have to give up Brandon Belt. If the Angels wanted him, they would have to give up Trout or Conger. You need to give up an A level prospect to get Upton.

FWBrodie
11-22-2010, 10:14 PM
WTF do you think Michael Pineda is?

ESaady
11-23-2010, 05:43 PM
Doesn't look like he's gonna be dealt.


Two general managers that spoke to Arizona Diamondbacks general manager Kevin Towers recently described him as growing more pessimistic that a deal can get done for OF Justin Upton, FOXSports.com's Ken Rosenthal reports. The Toronto Blue Jays have enough young pitching to acquire Upton, but it's unsure if they're willing to do it. The Cincinnati Reds and Washington Nationals, while possibly interested, don't appear to match up for one reason or another, sources say. The D-Backs likely will lay low until the winter meetings, then resume active discussions.



Updating previous reports, Arizona Diamondbacks CEO Derrick Hall said OF Justin Upton will likely be with the team on Opening Day, MLB.com's Steve Gilbert reports.

Il Mago 7
11-24-2010, 10:28 PM
The Jays Want Him But I wouldnt Give Up Snider I Would Give Up Drabek and 3 othe good pros[pects

homie564
11-24-2010, 10:46 PM
WTF do you think Michael Pineda is?

compare your offer to what they asked of the redsox (based on rumors I've heard)

One of Buccholz/Kelly
Daniel Bard
One of Rizzo/Anderson
Jacoby Ellsbury
and two B-C level prospects (Middlebrooks, Bowden, Exposito, Lavarnway, Doubront, Pimental, etc.)


Buccholz or Kelly alone is probably worth that whole package you proposed. Pineada is about as valuable as Bard Rizzo and Anderson are both A level prospects and everyone knows jacoby ellsbury... plus 2 of those other guys who will be #3-#4 starters in the majors or every day starters/great platoon players.... that package is outrageous compared to that one proposed by you.

papipapsmanny
11-24-2010, 11:00 PM
If I am the Sox I would offer Kelly, Anderson, Bowden, Ellsbury, and some lesser spec for Upton, the D-backs are not getting what they want, which basically means they will keep him, unless the demands are lowered

koreancabbage
11-24-2010, 11:25 PM
The Jays Want Him But I wouldnt Give Up Snider I Would Give Up Drabek and 3 othe good pros[pects

WHY wouldn't you give up SNider? Upton is the better player and 1 year older if i'm not mistaken. Snider is just potential which is might not even come to living up to, not in body type like that anyways.

Upton addresses our need of a leadoff hitter while Snider hits somewhere in the 6-8 range and he hasn't shown glimpse of hitting a high average in the league either.

FWBrodie
11-24-2010, 11:36 PM
compare your offer to what they asked of the redsox (based on rumors I've heard)

One of Buccholz/Kelly
Daniel Bard
One of Rizzo/Anderson
Jacoby Ellsbury
and two B-C level prospects (Middlebrooks, Bowden, Exposito, Lavarnway, Doubront, Pimental, etc.)


Buccholz or Kelly alone is probably worth that whole package you proposed. Pineada is about as valuable as Bard Rizzo and Anderson are both A level prospects and everyone knows jacoby ellsbury... plus 2 of those other guys who will be #3-#4 starters in the majors or every day starters/great platoon players.... that package is outrageous compared to that one proposed by you.

Michael Pineda is a better prospect than Casey Kelly... so no.

After that you listed about 20 prospects so not really sure what you're trying to say. That the Redsox top 20 prospects are more valuable than 4 of the Mariners top 6? Great detective work.

FYI Saunders was BA's #30 prospect entering 2010 and Franklin will easily be top 50 in this years' ranking.

So Pineda, Saunders, Franklin, Lueke/Aardsma is just as "outrageous" if not more so than that pile of backslashes you've placed names on either side of.

homie564
11-24-2010, 11:41 PM
Michael Pineda is a better prospect than Casey Kelly... so no.

After that you listed about 20 prospects so not really sure what you're trying to say. That the Redsox top 20 prospects are more valuable than 4 of the Mariners top 6? Great detective work.

FYI Saunders was BA's #30 prospect entering 2010 and Franklin will easily be top 50 in this years' ranking.

So Pineda, Saunders, Franklin, Lueke/Aardsma is just as "outrageous" if not more so than that pile of backslashes you've placed names on either side of.

stopped reading after there...

that's embarrassing to even say.

FWBrodie
11-25-2010, 12:03 AM
stopped reading after there...

that's embarrassing to even say.

Well you're right about being embarassed, just for the wrong reason.

homie564
11-25-2010, 12:06 AM
Well you're right about being embarassed, just for the wrong reason.

pineada hasn't even been ranked on a single top 50 list I've seen.. Kelly sits consistently in the mid-low 20s....

FWBrodie
11-25-2010, 12:13 AM
pineada hasn't even been ranked on a single top 50 list I've seen.. Kelly sits consistently in the mid-low 20s....

A) It's Pineda
B) Find yourself an updated list. You could start with Baseball America's midseason ranking: http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2010/2610314.html
C) Pineda is about to be top 10 on everyone's new 2011 lists.

homie564
11-25-2010, 12:32 AM
A) It's Pineda
B) Find yourself an updated list. You could start with Baseball America's midseason ranking: http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2010/2610314.html
C) Pineda is about to be top 10 on everyone's new 2011 lists.

there's a few guys on the list I'll be totally honest with you.. that I've never even heard of.. casey kelly is definitely better than pineda... kelly had a down year in double a.. his numbers weren't as high as people would have like but his stuff, velocity, control, mechanics and everything were there.. Had he put his numbers up again... he's in a class with the likes of teheran and hellickson

Halopower31
11-25-2010, 12:49 AM
Would a deal of Peter Bourjous, Kevin Jepsen, Mike Napoli, Izturs? cuz Towers said he wants major leauge players

2009mvp
11-25-2010, 01:25 AM
A) It's Pineda
B) Find yourself an updated list. You could start with Baseball America's midseason ranking: http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2010/2610314.html
C) Pineda is about to be top 10 on everyone's new 2011 lists.

Ouch. Showed that guy.

FWBrodie
11-25-2010, 05:19 AM
there's a few guys on the list I'll be totally honest with you.. that I've never even heard of.. casey kelly is definitely better than pineda... kelly had a down year in double a.. his numbers weren't as high as people would have like but his stuff, velocity, control, mechanics and everything were there.. Had he put his numbers up again... he's in a class with the likes of teheran and hellickson

Casey Kelly is in no way shape or form better than Pineda, who is likely to start the season in a big league rotation whether it be with Seattle or another squad. ...and he's a year younger than Kelly.

TO to the CHI
11-25-2010, 09:07 AM
there's a few guys on the list I'll be totally honest with you.. that I've never even heard of.. casey kelly is definitely better than pineda... kelly had a down year in double a.. his numbers weren't as high as people would have like but his stuff, velocity, control, mechanics and everything were there.. Had he put his numbers up again... he's in a class with the likes of teheran and hellickson


I will never understand posts like this. You openly admit that you lack the knowledge to talk about the subject (to wit "there's a few guys on the list ..... I've never heard of") yet you feel qualified to say Kelly is a better spec than Pineda. We get it. You're a Red Sox fan and are going to have a bias towards Red Sox prospects. The reality is that Pineda was outstanding last year while Kelly struggled a bit at Double A. Does that conclusively mean Pineda is better? No. Does it mean that there is a legitimate discussion to be had on the topic and that Baseball America, at a minimum, thinks Pineda is better? Yes.

Get over yourself man. I don't like the Mariners, but the package that was mentioned by Brodie would be legit if Upton would consider going there.

bomber0104
11-25-2010, 10:32 AM
there's a few guys on the list I'll be totally honest with you.. that I've never even heard of.. casey kelly is definitely better than pineda... kelly had a down year in double a.. his numbers weren't as high as people would have like but his stuff, velocity, control, mechanics and everything were there.. Had he put his numbers up again... he's in a class with the likes of teheran and hellickson

Its insane how overrated Kelly is by everyone. The truth is the guy has yet to post any kind of numbers in the minors to warrant all the hype. Give me Pineda everyday of the week

homie564
11-25-2010, 11:30 AM
I will never understand posts like this. You openly admit that you lack the knowledge to talk about the subject (to wit "there's a few guys on the list ..... I've never heard of") yet you feel qualified to say Kelly is a better spec than Pineda. We get it. You're a Red Sox fan and are going to have a bias towards Red Sox prospects. The reality is that Pineda was outstanding last year while Kelly struggled a bit at Double A. Does that conclusively mean Pineda is better? No. Does it mean that there is a legitimate discussion to be had on the topic and that Baseball America, at a minimum, thinks Pineda is better? Yes.

Get over yourself man. I don't like the Mariners, but the package that was mentioned by Brodie would be legit if Upton would consider going there.

my argument is that after one year a guy like pineada can be "easily better" than kelly is a joke.. casey kelly is an outstanding prospect.. i have no bias towards anything.. but my point to start this wasn't even that pineda is better than kelly or w.e. I'll admit I haven't brushed up lately this past season on the prospects I knew was of last years lists and even the lists I googled came up as apparently last years lists. that package he mentioned however is nowhere near the asking price... to think that package was even remotely close to what was asked of the red sox is awful to say.

FWBrodie
11-25-2010, 11:48 AM
there's a few guys on the list I'll be totally honest with you.. that I've never even heard of.. casey kelly is definitely better than pineda... kelly had a down year in double a.. his numbers weren't as high as people would have like but his stuff, velocity, control, mechanics and everything were there.. Had he put his numbers up again... he's in a class with the likes of teheran and hellickson

You admit your ignorance and then continue to stick to your obviously unfounded claim. Give me a break. Michael Pineda is better than Kelly across the board and further along in his development at a younger age to boot.

FWBrodie
11-25-2010, 12:12 PM
my argument is that after one year a guy like pineada can be "easily better" than kelly is a joke.. casey kelly is an outstanding prospect.. i have no bias towards anything.. but my point to start this wasn't even that pineda is better than kelly or w.e. I'll admit I haven't brushed up lately this past season on the prospects I knew was of last years lists and even the lists I googled came up as apparently last years lists. that package he mentioned however is nowhere near the asking price... to think that package was even remotely close to what was asked of the red sox is awful to say.

First of all, you have no idea what was asked of the Red Sox. Second, you just admitted you have little to no knowledge of what is going on in minor league baseball and specifically who these prospects are. You'd never even heard of Michael Pineda, one of the top 2 or 3 SP prospects in baseball!

Show me this divine request the D-backs alledgedly made, hell show me a clear request you think they made without saying "or" or "/" and listing Boston's entire farm.

Pineda is obviously a better headliner than Kelly. Saunders was #30 for Baseball America going into last season and is already in the big leagues at the position Upton would be vacating and can play CF. Nick Franklin is one of the top 3 SS specs in the game, will be somewhere in everyone's top 50, and is coming off a debut season in which he out-OPSed Aaron Hicks (a top prospect that is two years older FYI) in the Midwest League as a SS who is projected to stick. Plus a closer in David Aardsma. Let's see this HEAVEN PACKAGE that is "embarassing" and "obnoxious" and that my suggestion is not "remotely close" to.

...or you could just admit that you have no idea what you're talking about and that you're a homer who's baseball awareness doesn't span beyond a love affair with your favorite team... which is fine, just don't act like you're any more than that and don't talk down to people when you're clearly in over your head.

fifajade5
11-25-2010, 01:00 PM
Just noticed that on Uptons wiki page it has his teams listed:

D'backs (2007-present)
Red Sox (2010-present)

haha some Red Sox fan must be playing mind games.

homie564
11-25-2010, 10:11 PM
First of all, you have no idea what was asked of the Red Sox. Second, you just admitted you have little to no knowledge of what is going on in minor league baseball and specifically who these prospects are. You'd never even heard of Michael Pineda, one of the top 2 or 3 SP prospects in baseball!

Show me this divine request the D-backs alledgedly made, hell show me a clear request you think they made without saying "or" or "/" and listing Boston's entire farm.

Pineda is obviously a better headliner than Kelly. Saunders was #30 for Baseball America going into last season and is already in the big leagues at the position Upton would be vacating and can play CF. Nick Franklin is one of the top 3 SS specs in the game, will be somewhere in everyone's top 50, and is coming off a debut season in which he out-OPSed Aaron Hicks (a top prospect that is two years older FYI) in the Midwest League as a SS who is projected to stick. Plus a closer in David Aardsma. Let's see this HEAVEN PACKAGE that is "embarassing" and "obnoxious" and that my suggestion is not "remotely close" to.

...or you could just admit that you have no idea what you're talking about and that you're a homer who's baseball awareness doesn't span beyond a love affair with your favorite team... which is fine, just don't act like you're any more than that and don't talk down to people when you're clearly in over your head.

ok.. I'm pretty sure I admitted i had not seen an updated list that was my bad..... but please tell me where i said i had never heard of pineda? I know plenty about baseball

and


the Diamondbacks are believed to want young outfielder Jacoby Ellsbury and top young reliever Daniel Bard, among others, included in any Upton bid.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/baseball/mlb/11/18/justin.upton/index.html#ixzz16LjtbNsy

and they want another MLB ready prospect it said in a different article (Kalish Doubront Anderson Rizzo etc)

that package i typed was a speculated upon trade offer by the guys on sports talk radio which i heard a couple days ago (can't remember exactly when i apologize for that) but every tabloid believes those two would be definites in any trade aswell as another top prospect and an MLB ready prospect. hense a wise assumption of something like the asking price being something ALONG THE LINES OF

Kelly, Ellsbury, Bard, Rizzo/Doubront/Kalish (probably would never happen with him he's too loved by the fans) and possibly other prospects.

I never called Kelly like the best prospect in the league or anything so I don't understand the whole homer thing, and i never called your proposal "embarrassing" it's just simply not enough based on the outrageous asking price from Arizona. and I will firmly stand by my belief that kelly is a better prospect than pineda and will be a better pitcher than pineda.

homie564
11-25-2010, 10:18 PM
Its insane how overrated Kelly is by everyone. The truth is the guy has yet to post any kind of numbers in the minors to warrant all the hype. Give me Pineda everyday of the week

a list of his FIP since leaving High School

Greenville 2009- 2.14
Salem 2009- 3.26
Portland 2010- 3.97 (not nearly as bad as everyone thought)

bomber0104
11-26-2010, 12:29 AM
a list of his FIP since leaving High School

Greenville 2009- 2.14
Salem 2009- 3.26
Portland 2010- 3.97 (not nearly as bad as everyone thought)

its not bad but its nothing special for a guy that gets all the praise he does

tc2deuce
11-26-2010, 12:58 AM
the kid just turned 21

nithanyo
11-26-2010, 01:51 AM
Jays think the asking price is too high and are out of it

Mc Lovin
11-26-2010, 02:16 AM
I'm not too familiar with the National League like I am with the American League. In football and basketball I know everything there is to know about every player on every single team but, with baseball I just follow the Red Sox and I only know basically about American League players because they only have a couple games a year against the National League so, my question is this. Would the Red Sox be better off signing Jason Werth or trading for Justin Upton? Who's the better all around player?

theLgndKllr35
11-26-2010, 02:24 AM
I'm not too familiar with the National League like I am with the American League. In football and basketball I know everything there is to know about every player on every single team but, with baseball I just follow the Red Sox and I only know basically about American League players because they only have a couple games a year against the National League so, my question is this. Would the Red Sox be better off signing Jason Werth or trading for Justin Upton? Who's the better all around player?

Hands down Jayson Werth; however, it's widely speculated Upton will have a better future, seeing as he's only 20.

Mc Lovin
11-26-2010, 02:27 AM
Hands down Jayson Werth; however, it's widely speculated Upton will have a better future, seeing as he's only 20.

Upton is only 20? Wow I would say the Sox trade for him considering Werth is looking for 17 or 18 million and he's already 31 years old.

theLgndKllr35
11-26-2010, 04:39 AM
Upton is only 20? Wow I would say the Sox trade for him considering Werth is looking for 17 or 18 million and he's already 31 years old.

Not at the price the Diamondbacks want. The Sox are betting off spending around 16 on Werth annually for 5 years, and let their top prospects actually play. They should be good players in this league someday.

misterd
11-26-2010, 04:46 AM
I don't know enough about the other team's farm systems to say who has a better package, but I think it is obvious Towers is the one in the driver's seat here.

Yes, he wants to move Upton to restock his team. He wants about 4 players, 2 of which likely need to be MLB ready.

But Upton is young, desirable, and under team control for a long time. He doesn't HAVE to move him now, and risk losing him or paying some obscene salary.

If the Sox or Jays or whomever can't blow him away today, he knows his leverage is likely to grow as the teams get deeper into the season.

He's also more likely to get a better return if he doesn't act desperate. If teams know he's willing to start the season with Upton, they know they can't hold back in their offer.

For once I am glad my team isn't in this sweepstakes.

Mc Lovin
11-26-2010, 05:48 AM
Not at the price the Diamondbacks want. The Sox are betting off spending around 16 on Werth annually for 5 years, and let their top prospects actually play. They should be good players in this league someday.

You don't think The D-Backs would take Ellsbury and one other prospect for Upton? The Sox don't want Ellsbury but he's still a pretty good player and young.

FWBrodie
11-26-2010, 06:04 AM
Justin Upton is 23. C'mon people. Let's get our facts straight.

treeleaf
11-26-2010, 06:51 AM
Ellesbury+ could be beat by the jays in a heartbeat...sorry towers is not a complete idiot

torontosports10
11-26-2010, 08:23 AM
You don't think The D-Backs would take Ellsbury and one other prospect for Upton? The Sox don't want Ellsbury but he's still a pretty good player and young.

There is a reason you guys also have him available. And no it wouldnt even be close for him and one other prospect.

They asked for Ellsbury,Bard, and 2 top specs. Think Kelly, Ingelas(sp), Raunando etc.


Ellesbury+ could be beat by the jays in a heartbeat...sorry towers is not a complete idiot

Ya....no. Seeing as we have excellent pitching depth, a lot of which would do great in the NL West, I'd probably skip a few heartbeats if I were you and not just blow smoke out of your ***.

Shifty1 69
11-26-2010, 09:13 AM
Ellesbury+ could be beat by the jays in a heartbeat...sorry towers is not a complete idiot


There is a reason you guys also have him available. And no it wouldnt even be close for him and one other prospect.

They asked for Ellsbury,Bard, and 2 top specs. Think Kelly, Ingelas(sp), Raunando etc.



Ya....no. Seeing as we have excellent pitching depth, a lot of which would do great in the NL West, I'd probably skip a few heartbeats if I were you and not just blow smoke out of your ***.

I may be reading this wrong... but it looks as tho Treeleaf is saying the Jays could put together a better package and that you are saying the same thing... so why the hostility?? ;):facepalm::D

TO to the CHI
11-26-2010, 09:39 AM
I may be reading this wrong... but it looks as tho Treeleaf is saying the Jays could put together a better package and that you are saying the same thing... so why the hostility?? ;):facepalm::D

you're reading it correctly. Torontosports has a reading comprehension issue combined with a bug in his *** and that caused his post

torontosports10
11-26-2010, 11:43 AM
;)

JOSKOMANG4
11-26-2010, 12:42 PM
3 way trade!

- Mets acquire OF J.Upton

- Red Sox acquire OF J.bay & SS J.Reyes

- D Backs acquire IF J.Lowrie, OF JD Drew, and Sox 2 prospects( LHP Daubrant & IF O.Tejada).

celtisox41
11-26-2010, 01:29 PM
There is a reason you guys also have him available. And no it wouldnt even be close for him and one other prospect.

They asked for Ellsbury,Bard, and 2 top specs. Think Kelly, Ingelas(sp), Raunando etc.

Ya....no. Seeing as we have excellent pitching depth, a lot of which would do great in the NL West, I'd probably skip a few heartbeats if I were you and not just blow smoke out of your ***.

If that's the asking price the red sox are better off keeping their prospects. Maybe if it was just ellsbury, kelly, ranaudo and more but i would hate them trading bard kelly and iglesias. Its not worth it

celtisox41
11-26-2010, 01:31 PM
3 way trade!

- Mets acquire OF J.Upton

- Red Sox acquire OF J.bay & SS J.Reyes

- D Backs acquire IF J.Lowrie, OF JD Drew, and Sox 2 prospects( LHP Daubrant & IF O.Tejada).

The first part sounds good but the d-backs would never take just lowrie drew and those prospects. Maybe lowrie, debront, kelly, and the top 2 prospects from the mets

Madness23
11-26-2010, 02:00 PM
i for one, think that towers is stupid, he consider trading Upton ( everyone knows it by now) then ask for the moon ( i know thats a strategy) but im a jays fan and i won't trade Snider ++ for Upton, let alone add drabek !!! now lets sit and see whats wrong with justin that they made him available !!! good luck finding a package of 3/4 top 5 prospects from any team

Swishalicious
11-26-2010, 03:40 PM
The first part sounds good but the d-backs would never take just lowrie drew and those prospects. Maybe lowrie, debront, kelly, and the top 2 prospects from the mets

D'backs wouldn't do that trade though... what are they going to do with JD Drew at this stage in the game?

Halopower31
11-26-2010, 04:30 PM
Does anyone see the Angels getting in the mix with a trade of maybe a center piece of Bourjous and Jepsen?

celtisox41
11-27-2010, 12:58 PM
D'backs wouldn't do that trade though... what are they going to do with JD Drew at this stage in the game?

I didn't put JD Drew in the second trade because i know they won't want him