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View Full Version : NBA.com piece on Bosh: Nowhere to hide.



spreadeagle
11-03-2010, 10:29 PM
HANG TIME HEADQUARTERS – One of the main reasons Chris Bosh decided to take his talents to South Beach and join LeBron James and Dwyane Wade was exposure. He wanted more of it and knew he’d get it there as opposed to what he’d experienced in Toronto.

Be careful what you ask for Chris, because you’re probably getting more than you bargained for these days. And it’s not just from NBA types who have raised eyebrows about Bosh’s performance so far (he’s averaging 13 points, 6.4 rebounds and 1.4 assists for the 4-1 Heat). It’s coming from all directions.

Sports Illustrated NFL guru Peter King chimed in on Bosh in his Monday Morning Quarterback:

I know less about the NBA than I know about Norwegian politics. But I did leave the basketball game wondering how in the world anyone would think Chris Bosh is on LeBron’s and Dwyane Wade’s level. It should be the Big Two and Three-Quarters in Miami instead of the Big Three, shouldn’t it?

It’s one thing for the basketball punditry to question Bosh’s ability to thrive alongside James and Wade, but when an impartial observer like King decides to take that shot, it makes you wonder.

Even more curious are the words of one of Bosh’s former teammates in Toronto, who painted an interesting picture on the state of affairs post-Bosh in a Raptors uniform, courtesy of my main man Marc J. Spears of Yahoo! Sports (who continues to hit home runs early in the season).

Jarrett Jack, one of Bosh’s best friends since their days at Georgia Tech, offered this extremely insightful take:

“Sometimes when you play with a superstar or an All-Star type of guy, you tend to defer,” he said. “I think all of us do. ‘Get it to Chris, or get it to LeBron [James] or get it to Dwyane [Wade],’ without doing your normal, instinctive, aggressive thing. [With Bosh gone], it allows people to spread their wings, grow and see where they are as players for an overall season, which is kind of cool. We don’t have to worry about, if we don’t get him 25 shots, it’s going to be hell on Earth. It’s kind of cool being able to go out there and play.”

Bosh still has plenty of time to find his groove and do exactly the same for the Heat, “just go out there and play.”

We are, as Heat fans reminded us here at the hideout last week after that loss in Boston, just days into a season that will stretch into the summer of 2011.

We’re not writing Bosh off . Not yet. We’ll wait on the real Bosh to show up.http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2010/11/03/everybody-hates-on-chris/?ls=iref:nbahpt1

But hey if they win a bunch of rings who cares what his stats are right?....If they win that is..if not hes first to go lol

beasted86
11-03-2010, 10:37 PM
If the Heat weren't blowing out teams then his stats would be a lot closer to his normal average.... same with Wade & LeBron.

The Heat haven't won a game by less than 23 since the Philly game.

justinnum1
11-03-2010, 10:52 PM
The heat are 4-1...the only stat that matters to these guys.

Wilson
11-03-2010, 11:00 PM
These things go in cycles. To draw a comparison, there have been times where Pau Gasol has gone a week or two averaging 15 and 6 for the Lakers, but you don't hear anyone questioning him.

These guys in Miami are still figuring each other out and blowing teams out (so not playing in the fourth quarter). Eventually you'll see teams throw much of their attention to the perimeter to stop LeBron and Wade, then Bosh will stretch his legs inside and put up 20 and 10 again. Then when teams give him more attention LeBron and Wade will get some room back. And the cycle will continue.

Chris Bosh and the Heat will be fine...

Geargo Wallace
11-03-2010, 11:13 PM
it's really not a big deal. If the team was doing worse than his whole "wanting to be noticed" thing would bite him in the ***.

avrpatsfan
11-03-2010, 11:17 PM
The heat are 4-1...the only stat that matters to these guys.
This. This is just like the 2007 Celtics, just bigger egos. Stats aren't everything to these guys and I respect that. That's why they joined forces.

el_primo_nano
11-03-2010, 11:19 PM
Bosh was the most overhyped free agent ever. what did he ever do at Toronto? He is good, not great. Amare would have been a better fit, and they would have dominated more than they already are. Watch out for Dwight dominating that team because even if Bosh is to defend him, he will still drop 25 on him EASY

spreadeagle
11-03-2010, 11:23 PM
Bosh was the most overhyped free agent ever. what did he ever do at Toronto? He is good, not great. Amare would have been a better fit, and they would have dominated more than they already are. Watch out for Dwight dominating that team because even if Bosh is to defend him, he will still drop 25 on him EASY

I also think Amare would have been better...glad they didnt sign him:D

spreadeagle
11-03-2010, 11:27 PM
Bosh was the most overhyped free agent ever. what did he ever do at Toronto? He is good, not great. Amare would have been a better fit, and they would have dominated more than they already are. Watch out for Dwight dominating that team because even if Bosh is to defend him, he will still drop 25 on him EASY

Not sure bout the Magic but boston with KG Shaq Jermain Big Baby and Perkins is gunna be a PROBLEM

Wade>You
11-03-2010, 11:36 PM
I think Bosh does need to step his game up.

As for Jarrett Jack's comment: your team is 1-3 and you're a likely candidate to have the worst record this season because you don't have Chris Bosh.

hotpotato1092
11-03-2010, 11:39 PM
I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with Chris Bosh, he's just not a superstar. Anyone can masquerade as a star in Toronto playing with the immortal Andrea Bargnani and Jose Calderon, I don't see why more people (myself included, I drank the Bosh kool aid for a while) didn't immediately smell a rat. How was he any different than Zach Randolph (sans the personality)? He was just putting up stats on bad teams. Now that he's playing not only with real stars, but with real role players, it was inevitable that his production was going to go down. I may hate Chris Bosh, but he is a good player. Just not a great one. If you try to make the claim that he's near Pau Gasol's level (which seems to be the fashionable argument nowadays) then you just don't know basketball. Chris Bosh is what he is, a very good mid range shooting big man who can rebound and run the floor. He is not a true low post big man and he is not a superstar. Please heat fans, stop trying to make the claim that he is.

spreadeagle
11-03-2010, 11:43 PM
I think Bosh does need to step his game up.

As for Jarrett Jack's comment: your team is 1-3 and you're a likely candidate to have the worst record this season because you don't have Chris Bosh.

Ha, agreed...glad you guys can get out there and play but damn you gunna lose most nights

spreadeagle
11-03-2010, 11:46 PM
I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with Chris Bosh, he's just not a superstar. Anyone can masquerade as a star in Toronto playing with the immortal Andrea Bargnani and Jose Calderon, I don't see why more people (myself included, I drank the Bosh kool aid for a while) didn't immediately smell a rat. How was he any different than Zach Randolph (sans the personality)? He was just putting up stats on bad teams. Now that he's playing not only with real stars, but with real role players, it was inevitable that his production was going to go down. I may hate Chris Bosh, but he is a good player. Just not a great one. If you try to make the claim that he's near Pau Gasol's level (which seems to be the fashionable argument nowadays) then you just don't know basketball. Chris Bosh is what he is, a very good mid range shooting big man who can rebound and run the floor. He is not a true low post big man and he is not a superstar. Please heat fans, stop trying to make the claim that he is.

I think is obvious his scoring would go down...I think he will be around 16 a game...but his rebounds need to rise! if he doesnt get 10 11 12 a night instead of 6 a game its gunna be a problem against Lakers Boston Bulls

Rego247
11-03-2010, 11:51 PM
I think Bosh does need to step his game up.

As for Jarrett Jack's comment: your team is 1-3 and you're a likely candidate to have the worst record this season because you don't have Chris Bosh.

possibly, but its not like we got anywhere last year with kris.

hotpotato1092
11-03-2010, 11:52 PM
Just a thought (not meant to be taken as bashing) but wouldn't the Heat have been better off either signing Carlos Boozer or trading for Al Jefferson? I mean that adds a different dimension to the offense, those guys can actually play on the low block. If you have Wade/LeBron on the perimeter and one of those two in the post, doesn't that scare you more than Bosh hanging 15 feet from the basket? Honestly I think LeBron and Wade expected Bosh to carry much more weight, and at some point it's gonna get awkward when an elite big man destroys him, or he gets a favorable match up but can't take advantage. "Yeah Chris, we're buddies and all, but you gotta do your ****ing job". I feel like it'd be better for chemistry if it was LeBron and Wade, then everyone else, by hyping Bosh as much as they did they also exposed him to far more potential criticism and scapegoating, which extends to LeBron and Wade as well, if the #3 were more of a supporting type both on and off the court (this is where Jefferson comes to mind for me) I feel like the chain of command is far clearer and simpler. I think there's something about trios that the media loves to jump on, I never remember Kobe and Shaq getting this kind of attention, but the media wouldn't leave Boston's big three alone. That, and they wouldn't have to deal with Bosh's asinine comments. The basketball side is simple, they have no low post presence, with or without Bosh, but I think the chemistry side might be even bigger. Just food for thought.

hotpotato1092
11-03-2010, 11:55 PM
I think is obvious his scoring would go down...I think he will be around 16 a game...but his rebounds need to rise! if he doesnt get 10 11 12 a night instead of 6 a game its gunna be a problem against Lakers Boston Bulls

I completely agree with that, but in Toronto who was he fighting with for rebounds? He was on the floor with Bargnani most of time, obviously that doesn't impede his ability to rebound. Now not only does he share the rebounding load with LeBron and Wade, but their starting center (Joel Anthony) is there specifically to rebound and block shots. His ability hasn't changed, just his teammates. He's really gonna have to step it up if he expects to be any sort of factor against the Lakers. As for the Celtics, he honestly just looked terrified of KG, I think that's gotta be the biggest problem.

Wilson
11-04-2010, 12:00 AM
I completely agree with that, but in Toronto who was he fighting with for rebounds? He was on the floor with Bargnani most of time, obviously that doesn't impede his ability to rebound. Now not only does he share the rebounding load with LeBron and Wade, but their starting center (Joel Anthony) is there specifically to rebound and block shots. His ability hasn't changed, just his teammates. He's really gonna have to step it up if he expects to be any sort of factor against the Lakers. As for the Celtics, he honestly just looked terrified of KG, I think that's gotta be the biggest problem.

Again, I'd like to draw comparisons between Chris Bosh and Pau Gasol. It took Gasol some time to adjust to that same thing when he came to LA (fighting with Lamar Odom for boards, not necessarily blocks) and being scared of KG. But over time he adjusted and became a better player.

While I don't think Bosh has a basketball IQ as high as Pau's, I do think it shows that you can't call Bosh a disappointment already. Him and Pau have almost identical stories right now, and we've seen how it turned out for Pau. There's no reason to believe (in my opinion at least) that history won't repeat itself.

spreadeagle
11-04-2010, 12:04 AM
Again, I'd like to draw comparisons between Chris Bosh and Pau Gasol. It took Gasol some time to adjust to that same thing when he came to LA (fighting with Lamar Odom for boards, not necessarily blocks) and being scared of KG. But over time he adjusted and became a better player.

While I don't think Bosh has a basketball IQ as high as Pau's, I do think it shows that you can't call Bosh a disappointment already. Him and Pau have almost identical stories right now, and we've seen how it turned out for Pau. There's no reason to believe (in my opinion at least) that history won't repeat itself.

Bosh in his early days in Toronto was a beast..he dunked,drove to the hoop..was a real force.Then he got comfortable hanging on the peremiter shooting jumpers.Thats not what Miami needs.Time to get dirty in the paint Bosh.He dont play like this no more http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K63oBLz9rM

ink
11-04-2010, 12:05 AM
I think Bosh does need to step his game up.

As for Jarrett Jack's comment: your team is 1-3 and you're a likely candidate to have the worst record this season because you don't have Chris Bosh.

No, not because of Chris Bosh's absence. Possibly because the team was built around Chris Bosh, which is a mistake. He just isn't that good. I can guarantee that few are missing Bosh this year because we knew he had to move on and no matter how much time he was given he wouldn't have turned into a leader. He's not a bad third option on a good team but I've been noticing him being the 5th best scorer this year. He should have signed somewhere else where they had a big man (ahem, Noah).

beasted86
11-04-2010, 12:10 AM
Do people really think Bosh forgot how to score and rebound in 7 months? Do they think he's taking what the defense gives to him or do they think he's just playing passive?

Also, I'd like to know why any player who can hit a 14-18 footer somehow impedes Wade & James on the floor?

I also want to hear what is your take on whether you think Bosh is performing better than Boozer or Amare potentially could on the other side of the basketball that people always forget? (hint: defense)

Rego247
11-04-2010, 12:10 AM
No, not because of Chris Bosh's absence. Possibly because the team was built around Chris Bosh, which is a mistake. He just isn't that good. I can guarantee that few are missing Bosh this year because we knew he had to move on and no matter how much time he was given he wouldn't have turned into a leader. He's not a bad third option on a good team but I've been noticing him being the 5th best scorer this year. He should have signed somewhere else where they had a big man (ahem, Noah).

cosign x100.

hotpotato1092
11-04-2010, 12:12 AM
Again, I'd like to draw comparisons between Chris Bosh and Pau Gasol. It took Gasol some time to adjust to that same thing when he came to LA (fighting with Lamar Odom for boards, not necessarily blocks) and being scared of KG. But over time he adjusted and became a better player.

While I don't think Bosh has a basketball IQ as high as Pau's, I do think it shows that you can't call Bosh a disappointment already. Him and Pau have almost identical stories right now, and we've seen how it turned out for Pau. There's no reason to believe (in my opinion at least) that history won't repeat itself.

I will agree that to an extent they are similar, but remember there are some differences. Pau had Kobe and Phil there to show him the way, LeBron and Wade are fantastic players, but are they mentors? And I'm not even gonna bring up Spoelstra. I just feel like Pau's situation gave him way more room to grow. Second, I saw Pau Gasol lead three seperate Memphis teams to the playoffs in a LOADED western conference, whereas I believe Bosh only led Toronto to one season over .500. Now obviously neither of them ever won a playoff series, but I'd seen more out of Pau before his move than Bosh. Third, honestly I just think Pau has a way higher basketball IQ than Bosh. Not that I'm saying he's an idiot, but Pau is one of the smartest players in the league and always has been, I don't see Bosh near that level. Last, Bosh is facing an entirely different set of challenges. The expectations of this Heat team are enormous, the weight of them may be too much for him to bear. Remember this isn't a guy any of us would call a warrior, I mean for christ's sake he sat himself out of the end of the regular season when his team needed him because of his own upcoming free agency. Bottom line is I see validity in your point, I just think the circumstances are a bit too different.

spreadeagle
11-04-2010, 12:12 AM
Do people really think Bosh forgot how to score and rebound in 7 months? Do they think he's taking what the defense gives to him or do they think he's just playing passive?

Also, I'd like to know why any player who can hit a 14-18 footer somehow impedes Wade & James on the floor?

I also want to hear what is your take on whether you think Bosh is performing better than Boozer or Amare potentially could on the other side of the basketball that people always forget? (hint: defense)

Not Boozer "might have been cheaper though" but Amare just has that dominant bigman presence that most great teams need.Hes a bit more feared in the paint

hotpotato1092
11-04-2010, 12:17 AM
Do people really think Bosh forgot how to score and rebound in 7 months? Do they think he's taking what the defense gives to him or do they think he's just playing passive?

Also, I'd like to know why any player who can hit a 14-18 footer somehow impedes Wade & James on the floor?

I also want to hear what is your take on whether you think Bosh is performing better than Boozer or Amare potentially could on the other side of the basketball that people always forget? (hint: defense)

He doesn't impede LeBron and Wade, but he's not what they need. If they had a true low post threat (a la Boozer, or Jefferson, or even Amare although he's better in other ways) they'd be unstoppable. Their offense would be too multidimensional to stop. Bosh has been good defensively, but nothing to write home about. Remember this is a guy who was a borderline liability defensively in Toronto some of the time, so I'd be thrilled with the level he's at now. Their defense has been so good because of how relentless LeBron and Wade have been on the perimeter, Bosh has been good but he's nowhere near their level. When those two want to be they can be DPOY level defenders, Bosh isn't near that class. Bottom line is Chris Bosh is a good player and the right fit on some teams, I just think Miami would have been better off with a different big man.

beasted86
11-04-2010, 12:18 AM
No, not because of Chris Bosh's absence. Possibly because the team was built around Chris Bosh, which is a mistake. He just isn't that good. I can guarantee that few are missing Bosh this year because we knew he had to move on and no matter how much time he was given he wouldn't have turned into a leader. He's not a bad third option on a good team but I've been noticing him being the 5th best scorer this year. He should have signed somewhere else where they had a big man (ahem, Noah).

:confused:

Bosh shouldn't have signed where it gives him a great chance to win multiple championships and get exposure and play with two of the best passing perimeter players in the league?

spreadeagle
11-04-2010, 12:21 AM
:confused:

Bosh shouldn't have signed where it gives him a great chance to win multiple championships and get exposure and play with two of the best passing perimeter players in the league?

Tough to say.If they win great decision,if they lose he will catch most the blame...and the coach lol

beasted86
11-04-2010, 12:30 AM
He doesn't impede LeBron and Wade, but he's not what they need. If they had a true low post threat (a la Boozer, or Jefferson, or even Amare although he's better in other ways) they'd be unstoppable. Their offense would be too multidimensional to stop. Bosh has been good defensively, but nothing to write home about. Remember this is a guy who was a borderline liability defensively in Toronto some of the time, so I'd be thrilled with the level he's at now. Their defense has been so good because of how relentless LeBron and Wade have been on the perimeter, Bosh has been good but he's nowhere near their level. When those two want to be they can be DPOY level defenders, Bosh isn't near that class. Bottom line is Chris Bosh is a good player and the right fit on some teams, I just think Miami would have been better off with a different big man.

Bosh was a borderline liability? What team were you guys watching?

Defensive ratings for all rotational post players on Raptors 09-10:
Johnson - 110
Bosh - 111
Nesterovic - 112
Bargnani - 113
Turkoglu - 113
Wright - 115
Derozan -115

For what I've seen, this is the same Bosh from the '08 Olympics. Not exactly a Dwight Howard, but a guy who really puts in the effort and shows good fundamentals.... which tells me the problem was exclusively with the Raptors coaching & roster support. Just by those defensive ratings being poor all around, that pretty much tells us all the team's coaching of defense is a failure.

Wilson
11-04-2010, 12:31 AM
I will agree that to an extent they are similar, but remember there are some differences. Pau had Kobe and Phil there to show him the way, LeBron and Wade are fantastic players, but are they mentors? And I'm not even gonna bring up Spoelstra. I just feel like Pau's situation gave him way more room to grow. Second, I saw Pau Gasol lead three seperate Memphis teams to the playoffs in a LOADED western conference, whereas I believe Bosh only led Toronto to one season over .500. Now obviously neither of them ever won a playoff series, but I'd seen more out of Pau before his move than Bosh. Third, honestly I just think Pau has a way higher basketball IQ than Bosh. Not that I'm saying he's an idiot, but Pau is one of the smartest players in the league and always has been, I don't see Bosh near that level. Last, Bosh is facing an entirely different set of challenges. The expectations of this Heat team are enormous, the weight of them may be too much for him to bear. Remember this isn't a guy any of us would call a warrior, I mean for christ's sake he sat himself out of the end of the regular season when his team needed him because of his own upcoming free agency. Bottom line is I see validity in your point, I just think the circumstances are a bit too different.

I never considered the leadership. I think LeBron and Wade can help Bosh with his game but I don't know if they can help him deal with the pressure he's under. Pat Riley is there but I don't know how much contact he has with the players throughout the season. That's a great point.

Focus is something else I didn't consider. Pau is not a guy who is terribly interested in the media attention, whereas Bosh seems to want it. If that distracts him from the business on the court it could really hurt the team.

John Walls Era
11-04-2010, 12:38 AM
Bosh was the most overhyped free agent ever. what did he ever do at Toronto? He is good, not great. Amare would have been a better fit, and they would have dominated more than they already are. Watch out for Dwight dominating that team because even if Bosh is to defend him, he will still drop 25 on him EASY

You say this for every Miami Heat related thread. Riley obviously knows what hes doing... if he wanted Amare, he could've gotten him. But they don't want him.

beasted86
11-04-2010, 12:42 AM
I think you guys will find a way to knitpick the Heat either way.

At the end of the day their record is 4-1. As long as they are winning in dominating fashion, I hope Bosh and the rest of the guys continue doing whatever they have been doing.

If we had Boozer or Al Jefferson and they weren't scoring, the problem people would say is they aren't mobile or athletic enough to run with the team in transition or hit the jumper and we should have gotten... instead. If we had Amare or Lee and he wasn't scoring, people would say it's because the Heat aren't playing enough in transition cause those guys are only good on uptempo teams we should have gotten... instead. If we have Bosh or Dirk and they aren't scoring, the problem people would say is they don't play out of the post enough and we should have gotten... instead.

The thing everyone needs to understand is there isn't any "problem" until the team is losing.

Ebbs
11-04-2010, 12:44 AM
Just a stupid article IMO. I figured atleast 2 of the 3 stats significantly drop. You can't have 3 superstars all putting up the same numbers they did individually. Heat are winning so people need to chill.

John Walls Era
11-04-2010, 12:45 AM
If a team wins 80% of the games it plays and the 3rd best player on the team is only avg. 14 and 6 then its not a big deal at all.

ink
11-04-2010, 01:20 AM
:confused:

Bosh shouldn't have signed where it gives him a great chance to win multiple championships and get exposure and play with two of the best passing perimeter players in the league?

Bosh should have signed somewhere where he was a better fit and would have made a major contribution to the team other than attracting Lebron. We already know that he can ride Wade and Lebron's coattails to a ring but according to him that wasn't enough. How times change when the easy prospects of a championship are right in front of you. My question is when exactly he realized he was a 3rd-4th option.

Btw my skepticism doesn't just come after he decided to try free agency (which he earned). It comes from the time when he declared he wanted to be the MVP (which he did not earn, ever). This is classic hubris for a player that never really understood his own limitations.

Hoopsadvocate
11-04-2010, 01:27 AM
LOL at the people who think amare would be a better fit. Amare is a worse rebounder so wed be even weaker at the supposed thing we need more of. And he isnt exactly a good defender he only provides a post presence on offense and we dont need more offense.

Same with boozer except he may provide a bit more of a lift on the boards but then we sacrifice length on defense.

You cant expect a 3rd option to be getting 20 10 a game especially when were winning most of our games in blowouts.

justinnum1
11-04-2010, 01:30 AM
LOL at the people who think amare would be a better fit. Amare is a worse rebounder so wed be even weaker at the supposed thing we need more of. And he isnt exactly a good defender he only provides a post presence on offense and we dont need more offense.

Same with boozer except he may provide a bit more of a lift on the boards but then we sacrifice length on defense.

You cant expect a 3rd option to be getting 20 10 a game especially when were winning most of our games in blowouts.

Seriously, Bosh is the best 3rd option in the league, and he is comftorable with that. The fact that we are blowing teams out and our stars are playing 30 minutes a game, plus we don't have miller, plus bosh is playing sub par is pretty encouraging.

Bosh will figure out his role, and be ubber effective when he does.

davids22
11-04-2010, 01:32 AM
I understand what some of the posters are tryin to say. I DO agree that their game would be more unstoppable if they had a more dominant low post man.

HOWEVER

The heat are 4-1, which means they're WINNING (on pace for 64+ wins. Stupid stat I know)
So their is NO problem with what a player is doing if the team is winning.

Now as to the debate of Bosh wanting to be the most hyped...
he obviously know he was going to be a 3rd option here. If he couldn't see that and HONESTLY THOUGHT he was on Lebron and Wades level, then Bosh is the dumbest person ever. I'm putting my chips on Bosh understanding that he would be a 3rd option, NOT the man on the team, and is riding along for the rings. These players DO NOT care about stats.

justinnum1
11-04-2010, 01:36 AM
People just need to get used to the fact that these 3 guys are putting the team ahead of themselves. I bet bosh would come off the bench if that was what was best for the team(just an example). At the end of the day, these guys want to have several rings, more than 3, and they are developing the kind of mentality, and work ethic that will be required to accomplish that.

beasted86
11-04-2010, 01:38 AM
Bosh should have signed somewhere where he was a better fit and would have made a major contribution to the team other than attracting Lebron. We already know that he can ride Wade and Lebron's coattails to a ring but according to him that wasn't enough. How times change when the easy prospects of a championship are right in front of you. My question is when exactly he realized he was a 3rd-4th option.

Yeah, you are right.

No bait on Bulls fans, but joining a team that could barely edge out a crappy Raptors team for an 8th seed and .500 record should have been his top priority this summer. What was he thinking? Money? Fame? Championships? What do us crazy fans think these guys are playing the game for?

Either way, like I said while the Heat are winning games, I'll leave you guys to figure out what the "problem" is, and who should have done what.

justinnum1
11-04-2010, 01:42 AM
Yeah, you are right.

No bait on Bulls fans, but joining a team that could barely edge out a crappy Raptors team for an 8th seed and .500 record should have been his top priority this summer. What was he thinking? Money? Fame? Championships? What do us crazy fans think these guys are playing the game for?

Either way, like I said while the Heat are winning games, I'll leave you guys to figure out what the "problem" is, and who should have done what.

:clap:

ink
11-04-2010, 01:44 AM
Yeah, you are right.

No bait on Bulls fans, but joining a team that could barely edge out a crappy Raptors team for an 8th seed and .500 record should have been his top priority this summer. What was he thinking? Money? Fame? Championships? What do us crazy fans think these guys are playing the game for?


The Bulls-Heat online rivalry is tedious and stupid frankly. So I don't want any part of it. Seems to me the Heat weren't that Hot last year either and yes, if Bosh had joined the Bulls it would have been a far better match for him. He would have made a much bigger contribution to THAT team, he would have been paired with a very good C, and he would have had more impact. Basically he would have EARNED what he gets rather than being carried. Right now he is just the guy that enticed Lebron to sign with Miami.

Yunqn
11-04-2010, 01:52 AM
Just a thought (not meant to be taken as bashing) but wouldn't the Heat have been better off either signing Carlos Boozer or trading for Al Jefferson? I mean that adds a different dimension to the offense, those guys can actually play on the low block. If you have Wade/LeBron on the perimeter and one of those two in the post, doesn't that scare you more than Bosh hanging 15 feet from the basket? Honestly I think LeBron and Wade expected Bosh to carry much more weight, and at some point it's gonna get awkward when an elite big man destroys him, or he gets a favorable match up but can't take advantage. "Yeah Chris, we're buddies and all, but you gotta do your ****ing job". I feel like it'd be better for chemistry if it was LeBron and Wade, then everyone else, by hyping Bosh as much as they did they also exposed him to far more potential criticism and scapegoating, which extends to LeBron and Wade as well, if the #3 were more of a supporting type both on and off the court (this is where Jefferson comes to mind for me) I feel like the chain of command is far clearer and simpler. I think there's something about trios that the media loves to jump on, I never remember Kobe and Shaq getting this kind of attention, but the media wouldn't leave Boston's big three alone. That, and they wouldn't have to deal with Bosh's asinine comments. The basketball side is simple, they have no low post presence, with or without Bosh, but I think the chemistry side might be even bigger. Just food for thought.



i said this since they formed.. chris bosh is super hyped to be along with 2 of the top 3 players in the league..boozer was their guy.. that down low 20-10 boards by using his size and strength to get all of his stats.. thats how boozer works.. he's a post up guy and you can run him with pick and pop.. even amare.. they needed a guy down low.. bosh to me is a oversized sf tryingto be a mismatch..my pf rankings are

dirk
gasol
boozer
bosh/amare(and those two are only there because of the talent at the pf spot thats dropping off because of players aging in t.d and k.g)and they are a tie because amare impacts the game but doesnt play defense bosh puts up numbers but doesnt impact the game.. look at amare doing good in n.y and how bad bosh did in toronto.. and toronto had the better team on paper.. they were a 5th seed last year and just slipped out.. bosh cant dominat.. and al jefferson is the monte ellis of big men.. but no one wants to admit it.. monte needs to get his shots to be effective.. the only reason jeff exploded in miny and is struggling now with arugably the best set up man in deron and better team is he cant be effective with low amount of touches and shots.. jeff shot a ton in miny..i dont want to hear he had too or he got doubled every time.. he still took loads of shots and now is back to the boston guy..

Yunqn
11-04-2010, 01:58 AM
i bet ya trade chris bosh for chris paul in a sign and trade lol ..

beasted86
11-04-2010, 02:01 AM
The Bulls-Heat online rivalry is tedious and stupid frankly. So I don't want any part of it. Seems to me the Heat weren't that Hot last year either and yes, if Bosh had joined the Bulls it would have been a far better match for him. He would have made a much bigger contribution to THAT team, he would have been paired with a very good C, and he would have had more impact. Basically he would have EARNED what he gets rather than being carried. Right now he is just the guy that enticed Lebron to sign with Miami.

When I said no bait, I really meant it. Go search my posts and you'll find I don't get into it with Bulls fans as much as a lot of others. My main point was making the Bulls a priority to sign with is just as absurd as saying he should have made it a priority to re-sign with the Raptors. Sorry, but it's just as stupid when you really think about it when they were the same tier of teams. In all truth I'll even admit joining the Heat with no James/Johnson/Gay would have been just as stupid... he had to have known James or some other major player was coming.

And I don't know how much Heat basketball you actually watch if you think Bosh is being carried anywhere. He's equally as important as Wade & James on this team. I know without him this team wouldn't be half as good. To add, I also know that from watching them for whatever stupid reasoning opponents are doubling Bosh more than Wade & LeBron for right now. Soon enough Chris will get his when they figure out they've been getting blown out by a tune of 23+ by doubling Chris instead of the other two. But if you guys still think there's a problem going on, you can keep posting and try and figure it out guys. Have at it, good night.

ink
11-04-2010, 02:10 AM
When I said no bait, I really meant it. Go search my posts and you'll find I don't get into it with Bulls fans as much as a lot of others. My main point was making the Bulls a priority to sign with is just as absurd as saying he should have made it a priority to re-sign with the Raptors. Sorry, but it's just as stupid when you really think about it when they were the same tier of teams. In all truth I'll even admit joining the Heat with no James/Johnson/Gay would have been just as stupid... he had to have known James or some other major player was coming.

You seem to have forgotten that for most of last season the Heat were no better than either of those teams. At all. The reason Bosh wanted to sign there was because he had an arrangement with his genuine All Star buddies. The Bulls were definitely a more complete team than either the Raptors or the Heat last year.


And I don't know how much Heat basketball you actually watch if you think Bosh is being carried anywhere.

I've watched him for 7 years and know his tendencies. And I've seen every Heat game that was broadcast here this year. He doesn't look that indispensable.

Yunqn
11-04-2010, 02:26 AM
LOL at the people who think amare would be a better fit. Amare is a worse rebounder so wed be even weaker at the supposed thing we need more of. And he isnt exactly a good defender he only provides a post presence on offense and we dont need more offense.

Same with boozer except he may provide a bit more of a lift on the boards but then we sacrifice length on defense.

You cant expect a 3rd option to be getting 20 10 a game especially when were winning most of our games in blowouts.

what length if he never uses it?

chris bosh is similar but different from amare in a way..

amare doesnt want to be around the guy who shoots and would rather yell in a attempt to scare the player.. and bosh would rather just stand around him and see what he does without doing anything to him.. the heat i can bet a million dollars if i had would be better with even josh smith..

boozer would have been their best fit..next to dirk because dirk doesnt play scared on d.. he doesnt rack up blks but you can see that the defense doesnt take much of a hit in dallas when dirk plays center and they have a sf at pf.. bosh is overrated be honest... hes a good player.. but in the same class as david lee truthfully.. and i truly mean that.. bosh will always be a guy who needs the ball.. his rebounds were only because his center avg 5..bosh isnt a post up option either.... or at all..

mjt20mik
11-04-2010, 02:30 AM
Lol. This is an amusing thread. Lots of back and forth. To be honest, I find this article stupid. He sacrificed to play in Miami with 2 superstars. It's logical to see his numbers go down. I mean coach Spo is using Bosh perfectly in Miami, and kudos for him for that. He's a lot more decisive and doesn't kill plays by just holding on the ball for 18 secs.

I think he's just getting flamed on cause of what he said. I mean you say you want to be the man, then leave your team to become the 3rd option. I mean how do you change from wanting to be the star to essentially becoming a role player. I find that, in its entirety, just funny.

mohye
11-04-2010, 02:34 AM
Seriously, Bosh is the best 3rd option in the league, and he is comftorable with that. The fact that we are blowing teams out and our stars are playing 30 minutes a game, plus we don't have miller, plus bosh is playing sub par is pretty encouraging.

Bosh will figure out his role, and be ubber effective when he does.

A Healthy Bynum is a better 3rd option and a much superior defender then Bosh..if you switched Bynum for Bosh the Heat might be unbeatable..of course when Bynum is healthy

FOBolous
11-04-2010, 02:35 AM
omg this is ********. when you put 3 superstars together...their stats are bound to suffer. Lebron is averaging a whole 10 points less than what he averaged last year...so what? does it mean Lebron "lost his touch" and can't score anymore? no. that means he has better teammates.

samething with Bosh. Bosh is playing alongside 2 of the league's most prolific scorers. his stats are bound to suffer. put him on any other team and i bet you he'll average 20 ppg again.

mjt20mik
11-04-2010, 02:36 AM
omg this is ********. when you put 3 superstars together...their stats are bound to suffer. Lebron is averaging a whole 10 points less than what he averaged last year...so what? does it mean Lebron "lost his touch" and can't score anymore? no. that means he has better teammates.

samething with Bosh. Bosh is playing alongside 2 of the league's most prolific scorers. his stats are bound to suffer. put him on any other team and i bet you he'll average 20 ppg again.

2 and 3/4. Get it right!

:p

FOBolous
11-04-2010, 02:37 AM
A Healthy Bynum is a better 3rd option and a much superior defender then Bosh..if you switched Bynum for Bosh the Heat might be unbeatable..of course when Bynum is healthy

that's true. and that's because Bynum's skill set is more suited as a complimentary player than Bosh is. but if you were to start a franchise...who would you choose to be your franchise player? Bosh or Bynum? Bosh. Cause Bosh has the ability to carry the team while Bynum does not.

D1JM
11-04-2010, 02:40 AM
I think the heat go as far as wade takes them. The only game they lost is when wade had his worst game.

D1JM
11-04-2010, 02:41 AM
that's true. and that's because Bynum's skill set is more suited as a complimentary player than Bosh is. but if you were to start a franchise...who would you choose to be your franchise player? Bosh or Bynum? Bosh. Cause Bosh has the ability to carry the team while Bynum does not.

I think odom is a better third option

davids22
11-04-2010, 03:49 AM
All this thread has become is a bash-on-Bosh thread. NO ONE CARES AT ALL THAT BOSH'S STATS ARE DOWN, NOT EVEN BOSH. The point is, he's on a team to be a role player and do what he has been. The team is winning because of it. There is absolutely no problem. Stop coming in here and attacking Bosh, saying "Oh he needs the ball to thrive". Obviously he does, but guess what, it doesn't matter if he doesnt get 20 shots a game anymore, because Lebron and Wade are picking up the slack. AND THEYRE WINNING.

Bottom line, HEAT IS WINNING. And all these Heat haters are just grabbing on to everything they can to pick at this team, calling out Bosh's play style and saying how "Oh your team could be MORE dominant if blah blah blah".

At least bring the discussion into some relevance, like talking about how the Heat will be vulnerable against Boston in the playoffs. IMO only team that can beat the Heat in a 7 game series is Boston. The magic have no one to cover Lebron and Wade. I dont care if Dwight would dominate, because so would Lebron and Wade.

el_primo_nano
11-04-2010, 08:31 AM
Amare would have been the perfect signing cause he will slam it on anybody. Thankfully Lebron is a fool and took Bosh instead.

tcav701
11-04-2010, 08:33 AM
I said it a million times, Miami fans are going to hate Bosh by year 3.

NBAfan4life
11-04-2010, 09:21 AM
The Bulls-Heat online rivalry is tedious and stupid frankly. So I don't want any part of it. Seems to me the Heat weren't that Hot last year either and yes, if Bosh had joined the Bulls it would have been a far better match for him. He would have made a much bigger contribution to THAT team, he would have been paired with a very good C, and he would have had more impact. Basically he would have EARNED what he gets rather than being carried. Right now he is just the guy that enticed Lebron to sign with Miami.

I like a lot of the points you have made about bosh in this thread. IMO which really doesn't mean that much Bosh will get just a little more credit than Robert Horry got for his rings.

Raoul Duke
11-04-2010, 09:25 AM
He'll eventually have a few games where he puts up huge numbers and the criticism will subside. It would also be wise to consider that these guys have only been playing together for a few games. The "distribution of wealth" will work itself out a little more evenly by the all-star break.

RulerSlick
11-04-2010, 09:31 AM
Amare would have been the perfect signing cause he will slam it on anybody. Thankfully Lebron is a fool and took Bosh instead.

Amare isn't better than Bosh lol. I was LOL'ing my azz off the other night watching Amare stumble and fumble when the Knicks played Portland the other night

imagesrdecievin
11-04-2010, 10:09 AM
I haven't read the whole thread - so it's probably been said already:

who cares what Bosh(or any of the three for that matter) do during the regular season. The Heat will sleepwalk their way to 50 wins and then the season will really begin for them.

They joined forces to win a championship and to evaluate any of their play before the playoffs begins is pretty much for our entertainment only.

el_primo_nano
11-04-2010, 10:14 AM
Amare isn't better than Bosh lol. I was LOL'ing my azz off the other night watching Amare stumble and fumble when the Knicks played Portland the other night

yes he is. at least he can go pound for pound with the best. I cant wait to see Bosh get dominated down below by the bigs of the league. At this point Demarcus Cousins is gonna be busting Bosh's ***. He put in work last night on Pau, and Pau is no slouch, so just imagine what he'll do to that bum Bosh.. Pau, Dwight, Amare, Boozer can all have a day with this guy

beasted86
11-04-2010, 10:28 AM
yes he is. at least he can go pound for pound with the best. I cant wait to see Bosh get dominated down below by the bigs of the league. At this point Demarcus Cousins is gonna be busting Bosh's ***. He put in work last night on Pau, and Pau is no slouch, so just imagine what he'll do to that bum Bosh.. Pau, Dwight, Amare, Boozer can all have a day with this guy

Are you mad at him?

Bosh has dominated all his opponents defensively so far. Between Bosh & Haslem, I feel the Heat have a top 5 defensive duo at the position. We'll see what happens because it hasn't been good for opponents so far:

Garnett 10 PTS
Brand 12 PTS
R. Lewis 2 PTS
Smith + Favors 13 PTS
Love 20 PTS

So far it doesn't look like anyone is going off on him. We'll see what David West, Paul Millsap, and KG can do in the next couple.

Knickrocketsfan
11-04-2010, 10:46 AM
Everyone should just leave the heat alone, they are 4-1 and have been winning in dominate fashion recently. Bosh is doing what he is suppose to do for the most part... I would like to see him post up and go to the rim instead of a fade away jumper...

What I am concerned about with the heat is the fact that Lebrons Cavs have done this before they won 67 games... the heat really shouldn’t worry about the regular season and use this as their dress rehearsal for the playoff. Hey anyone can win games against lower level teams the task at hand is not become the Mavs, or the Cavs, who lost when they were the number 1 seed winning 65+ games

ragee
11-04-2010, 11:04 AM
Everyone knew that this would happen other than Heat fans... Wade, Lebron and Bosh can't keep up with their previous stats! Is that a bad thing? No... Does that make Bosh less of a player? I don't think so... Does that mean the Heat has lesser chance of winning the title? Definitely no... They are proving that they can work well together and they have a very promising start so far...

omdigga
11-04-2010, 11:09 AM
The heat are 4-1...the only stat that matters to these guys.

exactly.. if they were losing then i can see his stats being an issue..

daleja424
11-04-2010, 11:09 AM
I dont think anyone on Miami wants to hide... they have won 4 straight games by an average of 23.5 points...

mavwar53
11-04-2010, 11:29 AM
I agree he isn't as good as someone getting paid what he is should be but as a 3rd option behind LBJ and Wade do you expect him to 24 and 10? Yes his FG% is down but we are just 5 games into the season. In no way am I a fan of the Heat but there seem to be some haters.

Gibby23
11-04-2010, 11:30 AM
Seriously, Bosh is the best 3rd option in the league, and he is comftorable with that. The fact that we are blowing teams out and our stars are playing 30 minutes a game, plus we don't have miller, plus bosh is playing sub par is pretty encouraging.

Bosh will figure out his role, and be ubber effective when he does.

No he isn't, it shouldn't be hard for a big man to get his points on a team that has no post threat. He has no post game and there is no reason for him not to rebound because he sure isn't scoring. I would take Odom or Bynum over him as a 3rd option. But then again, Bosh might be a better fit for the style the lakers play.

NFLNBA
11-04-2010, 11:49 AM
The Heat are blowing crap teams away besides the Magic! We seen what happened to them against the Celtics they were down 18 at points in the game! The east is so easy to cruise through!

Lets just try something, flip the Lakers and Heat put Lakers in the East and Heat in he west garentee you Lakers in the east would win 72 games easy and the Heat would lose 10+ more games

Gibby23
11-04-2010, 11:50 AM
James and Wade should just get the ball to Chris alot in the next 2 or 3 games and tell him to go to work. They would still win, and it will help Bosh get his game going.

Hangtime
11-04-2010, 02:17 PM
Get Bosh the ball in these games where they have garbage time. They are up by 20 or 30 points, let Bosh work offensively in the post against these teams. It could really help his game. It will be critical against the Celtics, which is the only team they need to woory about in the east.

el_primo_nano
11-04-2010, 02:41 PM
Are you mad at him?

Bosh has dominated all his opponents defensively so far. Between Bosh & Haslem, I feel the Heat have a top 5 defensive duo at the position. We'll see what happens because it hasn't been good for opponents so far:

Garnett 10 PTS
Brand 12 PTS
R. Lewis 2 PTS
Smith + Favors 13 PTS
Love 20 PTS

So far it doesn't look like anyone is going off on him. We'll see what David West, Paul Millsap, and KG can do in the next couple.

not mad all, i juts feel that he is overhyped

thescore53
11-04-2010, 03:09 PM
Are you mad at him?

Bosh has dominated all his opponents defensively so far. Between Bosh & Haslem, I feel the Heat have a top 5 defensive duo at the position. We'll see what happens because it hasn't been good for opponents so far:

Garnett 10 PTS
Brand 12 PTS
R. Lewis 2 PTS
Smith + Favors 13 PTS
Love 20 PTS

So far it doesn't look like anyone is going off on him. We'll see what David West, Paul Millsap, and KG can do in the next couple.

bosh was never horrible on defense. his perimeter D was avctually i think one of the best for a bigman. but his post one on one D isnt good at all and i would attribute that to his frame.

guys he has to worry about is

gasol
bynum
randolph
duncan.
amare.

this from wat i catch from him with the raptors. i dont thnk it matters cause he's not suppose to be a defensive anchor he's good enough its not like he's totally incompetent on defensive.

D1JM
11-04-2010, 03:12 PM
doesnt matter how good you are during the season or how close you are to beating the bulls record because Playoffs is a different monster. Just ask lebron

daleja424
11-04-2010, 03:36 PM
you fail to see that Bosh, James Jones, Carlos Arroyo, Udonis Haslem, and Big Z also all had subpar performance. The whole team was out of synch....not just Wade.

thescore53
11-04-2010, 03:40 PM
Like i said its my opinion. The only game that wade plays terrible they lose, while lebron in that game had like 30 points. The past four games that they won, Wade has been great. Its only a small sample size, but that is what i have observed.

bosh and wade were shut down that game. its not his fault they didnt play well.

Slimsim
11-04-2010, 03:41 PM
i Think Boozer would have been a better fit in Miami. Bosh should had went to Chicago were he would had been a legit number 2 option.

D1JM
11-04-2010, 03:43 PM
you fail to see that Bosh, James Jones, Carlos Arroyo, Udonis Haslem, and Big Z also all had subpar performance. The whole team was out of synch....not just Wade.

Their contributions help, but wade has a bigger impact in the game than those players.

daleja424
11-04-2010, 03:43 PM
GREAT post Beasted. i love how people always throw out their "predictions" that arent based on any actual fact...

daleja424
11-04-2010, 03:44 PM
Their contributions help, but wade has a bigger impact in the game than those players.

the heat lost by 8 points. if any two of those six guys have an average game it is virtually a tie.

thescore53
11-04-2010, 03:47 PM
Their contributions help, but wade has a bigger impact in the game than those players.

also they were all playing horiblly inculding james. it was only when lbj caught fire when they made the comeback,. the next games werent against top teams except for orl. and wade always does well against them. but its obvious the biggest factor so far is lebron.

D1JM
11-04-2010, 03:48 PM
i Think Boozer would have been a better fit in Miami. Bosh should had went to Chicago were he would had been a legit number 2 option.

Bosh would of benefited from a center like noah, but Bosh is younger so he still has time to improve his inside game. However, he does need to contribute more on rebounding. I was kinda surprised too that Lebron doesnt have a single offensive rebound.

h2r09
11-04-2010, 04:15 PM
whoever has been saying bosh's game doesnt fit is absolutely idiotic. his game fits the best out of the available free agent pf's. the heat are looking to run with lebron and wade, not slow down and feed the ball into a post. bosh can get his and doesnt need to slow the team down like boozer would have done. amare would also have been ok but he has no jump shot, is older, has a bad history of injuries, and doesnt rebound or play defense well.

anyone sayng otherwise that bosh is the best fit has no idea what the heat are looking to do.

ink
11-04-2010, 07:59 PM
I dont think anyone on Miami wants to hide... they have won 4 straight games by an average of 23.5 points...

The article is only about Bosh. Not Miami. It's Bosh that they're suggesting is hiding, and it's a point worth discussing. Let me put it this way: Bosh spent the last 3-4 years EMPHATICALLY pointing out that he was a #1, that he was an MVP, that he was one of the elite players in the league, and then this year he has blamed his lack of exposure on the market he played for. He set the standard he's being held to himself, and then some. He is the one who has made this an issue for several years, and you know that I know what I'm talking about because I have watched just about every game he's played in his career.

So now this journalist is calling him out. It's fair game.

It has nothing to do with sacrificing stats or whether the Heat are a great team. It's about Bosh setting a standard, demanding attention, and then having nowhere to hide. He demanded that people look at him. We're smart enough to know that his stats will drop because he will be sharing the ball with 2 top 5 players in the league. We can adjust for that.

My point in this has been that if he really wanted to live up to HIS OWN DEMANDS to be recognized, he would have been better off with a team which suited him better. He has played for 7 years without any protection from a true centre. Chicago would have offered him an incredible complementary piece in Noah. He would have been set up to rise to the challenge he set for himself. He may very well win a championship or two or three in Miami, but he will not have justified the claims he has made for the last 3-4 years. He will be the beneficiary of playing with two of the league's absolute best. If Bosh hadn't made such a big deal of it before, it wouldn't be an issue at all right now. But he did make the claims and he can't take it back now.

h2r09
11-04-2010, 08:05 PM
so? who cares? he saw the oppurtunity to give up a few points and superstardom to create a dynasty and win a lot more than he would have anywhere else, he shouldnt be blamed if that is what forced him to change his mind. If anything this just further suggests that nothing was planned between these guys for a long time as people who love conspiracies theories are suggesting.

people just need to stop taking every single comment these guys make as if it is 100% what they will always feel. Stop acting as if you never say anything you change your mind about later on.

h2r09
11-04-2010, 08:08 PM
dont know why people say amare doesnt have a jumper. he's very efficient doesnt take too much only when its a good shot.

please, amare doesnt have close to the mid range game that bosh does. not even close. bosh is a great mid range guy.

ink
11-04-2010, 08:15 PM
so? who cares? he saw the oppurtunity to give up a few points and superstardom to create a dynasty and win a lot more than he would have anywhere else, he shouldnt be blamed if that is what forced him to change his mind. If anything this just further suggests that nothing was planned between these guys for a long time as people who love conspiracies theories are suggesting.

people just need to stop taking every single comment these guys make as if it is 100% what they will always feel. Stop acting as if you never say anything you change your mind about later on.

I don't really know what you're talking about or why you quoted me since none of what you said relates to what I posted.

He spent years making claims and complaining that he was being ignored. Now he has nowhere to hide since the spotlight is on him. How is that hard to understand? He said "LOOK AT ME" again and again and again. Well, Chris, we're looking, you wanted the attention.