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View Full Version : NBA All Time Redraft Playoffs: 3) Phili 76ers v. 6)New York Knicks (Please Vote)



Mile High Champ
10-25-2010, 12:48 PM
Every once in a while, the fantastic and committed users of PSD participate in the NBA All time redraft. Players that were eligible to be drafted must have played in the 1980-81 or beyond. The intention of this rule was to ensure that PSD community had better knowledge of the players being drafted and voted on. Please take the time to look over the players and the teams and vote for the better squad. We thank you for your time as your votes are important to determining an NBA ALL Time Redraft champion.

Please evaluate each player based on how well they played in their prime; injuries have no bearing on this game what so ever. Most of the GMís have taken the time to create a clubhouse with stats for their player which is based on each playerís best s 3 consecutive seasons.

3) Philadelphia 76ers v. 6) New York Knicks

76ers Clubhouse (http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showpost.php?p=14911526&postcount=4)
Knicks Clubhouse

76ers have home court advantage

76ers Depth Chart
PG: Nate "Tiny" Archibald/Rod Strickland
SG: Clyde Drexler/Michael Ray Richardson
SF: Rudy Tomjanovich/Xavier McDaniel/Kelly Tripucka
PF: Spencer Haywood/Dino Radja
C: Jack Sikma/P.J Brown/Olden Polynice

Knicks Depth Chart
C - Bill Cartwright / Maurice Lucas / Theo Ratliff
PF - Wes Unseld / Kermit Washington
SF - Kevin Durant / Sean Elliott
SG - Kobe Bryant / Paul Pressey / Hubert Davis
PG - Fat Lever / Kevin Porter

Knicks Write Up

I know a lot of people prefer head to head matchups but I recommend skipping down to the overall to read a quicker summary of this series.

PG Ė Fat Lever vs. Tiny Archibald
As a former player and now coach, Iíve always had a particular viewpoint on the style of point guards. They need to be strong on ball defenders and unselfish teammates. Looking at the league leaders in assists from the past 2/3 decades you will notice that Nash, Paul, Kidd, Stickland, Jackson, Stockton, Magic, Isiah, Kevin Porter (my backup PG), etc. almost all were over .500 (not Jackson) and made the playoffs. They were unselfish teammates and many of them (Paul/Kidd/Stockton) were strong on ball defenders. In the early 70s Tiny led the league in assists and yet his team finished 36-46. Thatís because he was a terrible defensive player and was shooting twice as much as he was setting up teammates! Archibald averaged 26.3 FGA while his next highest teammate only shot 12.6 FGA. For such a high volume player he had no perimeter touch. He was an embarrassing 22% 3pt shooter and his shooting efficiency only got worse in the playoffs. Iím not saying heís a bad player. Far from it. But when you look at the rest of this team you will see a player like Tiny Archibald does not fit in. Meanwhile Fat Lever is an all-defensive team member whose 19-9-8 averages are about as close to Oscar Robertsonís triple double as Magic and LeBron have ever come. Iíd rather have Fat Lever on my particular team but Tiny is the better player so he gets the edge.

Edge: Sixers (Tiny)

SG: Kobe Bryant vs. Clyde Drexler
Kobe is the more efficient scorer, the better perimeter player, and the much better defensive player (9x All-Defensive 1st team to 0). Clyde is another player on his team whose numbers dropped in the playoffs while Kobeís stay consistent. Anyone who watched Clyde in that Bulls series saw him wilt under the pressure of being the man on the biggest stage. Heís a #2 masquerading as a #1. Itís worth noting that Clyde is only a 32% 3pt shooter.

Edge: Knicks (Kobe)

SF Ė Kevin Durant vs. Rudy Tomjanovich
Rudy T was a slow mediocre defender who was a 20ppg scorer in the 70s when the game was slower and less athletic. When the leagues merged he was still a solid starter which is a testament to his game but I donít see him as someone who could have kept up with the league and even attempt to guard someone as dynamic as Durant. Rudy T barely got to the foul line(4 FTA) while Durant consistently gets to the line (8 FTA per game). Rudy T has no perimeter shot 26.2% 3pt while Durant can light it up from anywhere on the floor. This is no contest. Tomjanovich is just another inefficient overall scorer who has no perimeter game while Durant is an elite scorer with an emerging defensive presence.

Edge: Knicks (Durant)

PF Ė Wes Unseld vs. Spencer Haywood
Do you prefer style or substance? Haywood was a 6í8, 220lbs PF who took 22 FGA per game and managed to only make 46% of them and had a pathetic TS% of 52% despite being a post player. Wes Unseld was 6í7, 245lbs PF/C who took around 12 shots per game but made 50% of them and had a solid 54% TS. He also out rebounded Haywood 17.3 to 13 and was MILES and MILES better than Haywood as a passer and team player. Red Auerbach called Unseld one of the best passing bigs of all-time and Bill Simmons ranked him as the #41 best player of all-time. Haywood? Not on the list. What kind of effect did Unseld have on a team? Well besides being one of the greatest rebounders of all-time, he was the king of the outlet pass. Kevin Loughery (a starting guard in his twenties when Wes joined the bullets) took a leap from 17ppg on 40% shooting to 22PPG to 44% and Loughery said it was ďall because of him (Unseld).Ē Imagine what would happen if Unseld was throwing outlet passes to Kobe Bryant and Kevin Durant instead of Kevin Loughery? Unseld set screens, rebounder, played the post like an animal on both ends, and is the perfect PF for a winning team.

Edge: Knicks (Unseld)

C Ė Bill Cartwright vs. Jack Sikma
Bill Cartwright was 7í1, 245lbs center who averaged 19-8 on 55% FG (over 60% TS) in his prime while playing stellar defense. Jack Sikma was 6í11, 230lbs center who averaged 19-11 on 46%FG (54%TS) while playing above stellar defense. Sikma is better but I have a hard time imagining this matchup swinging a series. Cartwright is a winner and Lucas (20-10, all defensive 1st team) as my backup center destroys P.J. Brown (10-8, all defensive 2nd team)

Edge: Sixers (Sikma)

Bench: Porter / Pressey / Elliot / Washington / Lucas vs. Stickland / Richardson / McDaniel / Radja / PJ

I have 3 all-defensive FIRST TEAM players, an 2x NBA Champion, and a PG who led the leagues in assists 3 times. He has very strong backup guards (especially Michael Ray) but then a weak backup frontcourt for an all-time redraft. Mo Lucas is the star of my bench and heíll help give me the overall edge in the frontcourt. He was the #1 option of the Portland Trailblazers CHAMPIONSHIP team and heís coming off my bench to matchup against PJ Brown and Dino Radja. Heís got an edge in the backcourt but Porter can pass and Pressey was a great defender who averaged 15-7-5 in his prime. He could pass, score, and defend.

Edge: Knicks slightly

Overall:
I have a team that is exactly that. A team. Lever, Kobe, Porter, and Unseld distributing the ball. Cartwright and Lucas scoring on the low block. Unseld, Lucas, Washington grabbing all the rebounds. Scorers like Kobe, Durant, and Elliot (40% 3pt shooter) lighting it up on the perimeter and getting to the foul line (Kobe, Durant). All-Defensive team players like Fat Lever (PG), Kobe(wing), Pressey(wing), Washington(big), Lucas(big), Ratliff(big). Two league MVPs and Finals MVPs in Kobe and Unseld. Iím built for the playoffs. With great balance, teamwork, and proven winners. Meanwhile, his team has high volume scorers like Tiny, Haywood, and Drexler. None of whom score efficiently. Heís got no perimeter shooters even on his bench. And heís only got one great defender in Sikma in his starting lineup. The Knicks matchup extremely well with the Sixers and we take this series comfortably. Knicks advance.

76ers Did not Send a Write up in.

Hellcrooner
10-25-2010, 12:57 PM
MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more depth in the 76ers And a better Inside Scoring on the starters.

Sixers 4-0

lakers4sho
10-25-2010, 02:05 PM
MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more depth in the 76ers And a better Inside Scoring on the starters.

Sixers 4-0

Give me a couple servings of Sixers 4-0 as well.

NYKalltheway
10-25-2010, 02:11 PM
Frontline is not looking good for the Knicks, rest of the game is pretty much even. Sixers in 5 or 6. Sixers look bad without a write up though...

KnicksorBust
10-25-2010, 02:49 PM
MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more depth in the 76ers And a better Inside Scoring on the starters.

Sixers 4-0

I hate knowing that I'm starting every series down 0-1 because this guy can't handle the fact that I was the first (of many) GMs to vote him out of the playoffs. Tell me the glaring weaknesses on my bench. Please. How does he have this overwhelming edge on the bench? You don't like the fact that I have 3 all-defensive 1st team players on my bench (Pressey, Washington, Lucas) with Ratliff on reserve? You don't like that I have a 3x league leader in assists (Kevin Porter) to distribute? You don't like that I have two double digit rebounders (former all stars Kermit Washington/ Mo Lucas) to protect the boards? You don't like that I have a 2x all-star and former starting SF for the NBA Champion Spurs in Sean Elliottt, who can shoot lights out from the perimeter (scored in the high teens while shooting +40% from 3pt in his prime)? Mo Lucas was the #1 scoring option on the '77 Blazers team that won the chip and you still hate on my bench. Ridiculous. Now run and hide because you have no argument. Luckily, people don't put much credit in things you say.

Baller1
10-25-2010, 03:42 PM
At first I was tempted to say the 76ers because of the Sikma/Haywood combo and big names coming off the bench. But looking at it, the Knicks are absolutely stacked. I don't care what era you're in, a Durant/Kobe combo at the wings is absolutely brutal. Then throw in Fat Lever dishing it to these guys, damn.

Knicks in 6.

zambo4president
10-25-2010, 03:51 PM
:laugh2: What a surprise, they see Kobe and Durant and **** themselves.

Hellcrooner
10-25-2010, 03:54 PM
:laugh2: What a surprise, they see Kobe and Durant and **** themselves.

add that to KNICKS name.


What a shame.

Hellcrooner
10-25-2010, 03:57 PM
I hate knowing that I'm starting every series down 0-1 because this guy can't handle the fact that I was the first (of many) GMs to vote him out of the playoffs. Tell me the glaring weaknesses on my bench. Please. How does he have this overwhelming edge on the bench? You don't like the fact that I have 3 all-defensive 1st team players on my bench (Pressey, Washington, Lucas) with Ratliff on reserve? You don't like that I have a 3x league leader in assists (Kevin Porter) to distribute? You don't like that I have two double digit rebounders (former all stars Kermit Washington/ Mo Lucas) to protect the boards? You don't like that I have a 2x all-star and former starting SF for the NBA Champion Spurs in Sean Elliottt, who can shoot lights out from the perimeter (scored in the high teens while shooting +40% from 3pt in his prime)? Mo Lucas was the #1 scoring option on the '77 Blazers team that won the chip and you still hate on my bench. Ridiculous. Now run and hide because you have no argument. Luckily, people don't put much credit in things you say.

Yah well, i didnt feel like it was woth trying to explain why a team wi 12 yess the WHOLE roester having ben MULTIPLE times allsatsrs, with a ton of Dpoys including a paleyr that was there 10 straight times ( oh yeah my team had no Defense in your opinion....) deserved to be in playofs to someone that clearly does not have an idea bout it.

Baller1
10-25-2010, 04:19 PM
:laugh2: What a surprise, they see Kobe and Durant and **** themselves.

Yeah because Kobe and Durant are nothing, right?

Hellcrooner
10-25-2010, 04:25 PM
Yeah because Kobe and Durant are nothing, right?

togheter they probalby are a trouble about touches and whos boss.

zambo4president
10-25-2010, 04:27 PM
Yeah because Kobe and Durant are nothing, right?

Yeah because Tiny Archibald, Clyde Drexler, Jack Sikma and Rudy T are nothing right? This is an All-Time ReDraft, Kevin Durant has played 3 seasons. Tiny and Drex are top 50 players and legends. But Kobe and Durant are all over sportscenter now, so they must be better than his whole balanced team right? :pity:

Baller1
10-25-2010, 04:28 PM
Every single team in these all-time redrafts would have trouble sharing the ball considering every team has 3-5 superstars.

Hellcrooner
10-25-2010, 04:30 PM
Every single team in these all-time redrafts would have trouble sharing the ball considering every team has 3-5 superstars.

Not if oen of the stars is a Duncan, Magic, Kidd etc.

Baller1
10-25-2010, 04:32 PM
Yeah because Tiny Archibald, Clyde Drexler, Jack Sikma and Rudy T are nothing right? This is an All-Time ReDraft, Kevin Durant has played 3 seasons. Tiny and Drex are top 50 players and legends. But Kobe and Durant are all over sportscenter now, so they must be better than his whole balanced team right? :pity:

Read the writeup for the Knicks. It was a great writeup that compared the players brilliantly.

Did I say they would win only because of Kobe and Durant. You need some help with your reading comprehension.

Baller1
10-25-2010, 04:34 PM
Not if oen of the stars is a Duncan, Magic, Kidd etc.

None of those players are on the 76ers.

John Walls Era
10-25-2010, 05:05 PM
You gotta admit, KOB was smart in assembling this team. Kobe + Durant covers 99% of nba fans faves.

zambo4president
10-25-2010, 06:52 PM
Read the writeup for the Knicks. It was a great writeup that compared the players brilliantly.

Did I say they would win only because of Kobe and Durant. You need some help with your reading comprehension.

Im a GM in the All-Time Redraft I understand whats going on, I don't need the Knicks writeup to tell me who wins this game. Did I say you only said they would win because of Kobe and Durant? Oh that's right I didn't, so you can take your reading comprehension and get to work buddy.

zambo4president
10-25-2010, 06:53 PM
Now not taking anything away from KoB because I liked his team alot before the Cartwright trade, his strategy was genious with Kobe and KD and obviously its in full display right now.

Westbrook36
10-25-2010, 07:01 PM
At first I was tempted to say the 76ers because of the Sikma/Haywood combo and big names coming off the bench. But looking at it, the Knicks are absolutely stacked. I don't care what era you're in, a Durant/Kobe combo at the wings is absolutely brutal. Then throw in Fat Lever dishing it to these guys, damn.

Knicks in 6.

Durant is average, if that in an All-Time ReDraft. It's like starting Thad Young, or worse, in a current NBA ReDraft. The 76ers aren't stacked?


Frontline is not looking good for the Knicks, rest of the game is pretty much even. Sixers in 5 or 6. Sixers look bad without a write up though...

:(, been super busy. Then Steel is going through a divorce it seems (He isn't positive though).

Westbrook36
10-25-2010, 07:06 PM
I come in here and the Knicks gain four straight votes :laugh2:, looks like I'm badluck. Anyway it was fun building the team, personally the winner of this most likely won't be the best team, however thats the way the cookie crumbles in a All-Time. Props to Steel who was the man with building the bench.

Sixerlover
10-25-2010, 07:22 PM
I loved the Tiny / Drexler backcourt and the Haywood / Sikma frontcourt. Thought they could be scary come playoff time.

NYKalltheway
10-25-2010, 08:04 PM
Tiny, Haywood & Sikma are not so famous are they?
You even search Nate Archibald on google and you get the "Gossip Girl" guy first!!!

Also I was not a fan of the Unseld pick, not because he wasn't a good player, he was great, but it was supposed to be a 80-81 onwards draft and Unseld barely played 1 season during that time. Even so, the Knicks frontline is inferior to the 76ers one, and even if Knicks GM makes a solid point about Drexler not being #1, I gotta say that I think Clyde the Glide is a better overall player than Kobe (same Kobe who needed Shaq's shadow or Gasol's talents to be proclaimed as the best.. so not many differences in the two players right? Except that Clyde had to beat Michael Jordan)

KnicksorBust
10-25-2010, 08:05 PM
Average westbrook? Just plain wrong.

Small Forward - Kevin Durant- 25.2 PPG | 6.2 RPG | 2.7 APG | 1.2 SPG | 0.9 BPG | 46% FG% | 36% 3P% | 88% FT% | 57% TS | (2007-2010)

How many players in NBA History have a higher career scoring average with a higher career true shooting percentage?
Zero. Even if we limit just to players peak seasons to avoid the end of career decline, only guys like Jordan, LeBron, and Robinson pass him. He's an unbelievable offensive player (who was 5th in the NBA in defensive win shares last year) who because of Kobe will spend this whole playoffs being guarded by the opposing teams #2 wing defender.

BTW: Sorry to hear about Steel. He's a good guy. Hope everything works out for him and hope to see you in the next one. :) You weren't as active as normal this time around.

KnicksorBust
10-25-2010, 08:08 PM
Tiny, Haywood & Sikma are not so famous are they?
You even search Nate Archibald on google and you get the "Gossip Girl" guy first!!!

Also I was not a fan of the Unseld pick, not because he wasn't a good player, he was great, but it was supposed to be a 80-81 onwards draft and Unseld barely played 1 season during that time. Even so, the Knicks frontline is inferior to the 76ers one, and even if Knicks GM makes a solid point about Drexler not being #1, I gotta say that I think Clyde the Glide is a better overall player than Kobe (same Kobe who needed Shaq's shadow or Gasol's talents to be proclaimed as the best.. so not many differences in the two players right? Except that Clyde had to beat Michael Jordan)

Any time I think you're about to make a good post that I could respond to you have to ruin it.

Raps18-19 Champ
10-25-2010, 08:45 PM
I wonder if Kobe and T-Mac would have done better.

NYKalltheway
10-25-2010, 10:36 PM
Is it wrong to prefer Drexler to Kobe? For me Drexler was 2nd to Michael Jordan during their prime. And I think we've established that my opinion on present NBA, does that comment really surprise you?

Clyde Drexler.. I know what you're gonna say. Only once 1st All-NBA team yada yada yada... we all know that story. For me, Clyde>Kobe. I'd love either of them on my team, but I'd prefer Drexler, is that a crime? I know for a fact I'm not the only one that shares that view

I see you're a stats lover.

Kobe>Drexler in: Ppg and turnovers(!) per game
Drexler>Kobe in: Apg, steals per game, rebounds per game, blocks per game and fouls(!) per game

And points per game is inflated for Kobe as he has a freaking 35ppg in 2005-6(after the rules changes that made it much easier to score) and on...

Westbrook36
10-25-2010, 10:37 PM
Average westbrook? Just plain wrong.

Small Forward - Kevin Durant- 25.2 PPG | 6.2 RPG | 2.7 APG | 1.2 SPG | 0.9 BPG | 46% FG% | 36% 3P% | 88% FT% | 57% TS | (2007-2010)

How many players in NBA History have a higher career scoring average with a higher career true shooting percentage?
Zero. Even if we limit just to players peak seasons to avoid the end of career decline, only guys like Jordan, LeBron, and Robinson pass him. He's an unbelievable offensive player (who was 5th in the NBA in defensive win shares last year) who because of Kobe will spend this whole playoffs being guarded by the opposing teams #2 wing defender.

BTW: Sorry to hear about Steel. He's a good guy. Hope everything works out for him and hope to see you in the next one. :) You weren't as active as normal this time around.

Not plain wrong at all.

I don't care if his stat lines is 40 PPG, 10 RPG, 10 APG. The man has played three seasons in the NBA and shouldn't have even been allowed to be drafted. This is a NBA All-Time ReDraft, which should have been long time players. Not someone who has busted onto the court in the last five years and been productive.

I'm well aware of how impressive he has been up to this point, which is perfectly fine. You can attempt to spin this into something positive, but the fact of the matter is that Durant shouldn't be starting on an NBA All-Time ReDraft. My simple opinion and the reason why I didn't select any current NBA players outside of P.J Brown who is at the very end of his career, if he hasn't already retired. All the current picks were reaches (Outside of a few people in the group of Dirk, Nash, Kidd, Etc) in the GM Pool, however the general fan will simply think Kevin Durant is the next best thing. I'm aware of what the rules allowed you to do, but that doesn't make it right.

I wasn't going to win either way with this type of team and the ability to draft current players. Just my simple opinion, not a fan of the current players regardless of the rules, which would make me ignorant in a sense :cool:.

Baller1
10-26-2010, 01:15 AM
Durant is average, if that in an All-Time ReDraft. It's like starting Thad Young, or worse, in a current NBA ReDraft. The 76ers aren't stacked?



:(, been super busy. Then Steel is going through a divorce it seems (He isn't positive though).

All my possible bias aside, Durant is an incredible player no matter which era you put him in. The sample size to base him off of is small, and I'll give you that; but just because he hasn't had the chance to do it for multiple seasons doesn't mean I wouldn't be able to compete with the aforementioned legends in this thread.

Hellcrooner
10-26-2010, 03:05 AM
Not plain wrong at all.

I don't care if his stat lines is 40 PPG, 10 RPG, 10 APG. The man has played three seasons in the NBA and shouldn't have even been allowed to be drafted. This is a NBA All-Time ReDraft, which should have been long time players. Not someone who has busted onto the court in the last five years and been productive.

I'm well aware of how impressive he has been up to this point, which is perfectly fine. You can attempt to spin this into something positive, but the fact of the matter is that Durant shouldn't be starting on an NBA All-Time ReDraft. My simple opinion and the reason why I didn't select any current NBA players outside of P.J Brown who is at the very end of his career, if he hasn't already retired. All the current picks were reaches (Outside of a few people in the group of Dirk, Nash, Kidd, Etc) in the GM Pool, however the general fan will simply think Kevin Durant is the next best thing. I'm aware of what the rules allowed you to do, but that doesn't make it right.

I wasn't going to win either way with this type of team and the ability to draft current players. Just my simple opinion, not a fan of the current players regardless of the rules, which would make me ignorant in a sense :cool:.

Next itime around it has to be players drafted before 1990 to avoid the Flavour of the moment effect with exciting youngesters and active legends.

Baller1
10-26-2010, 03:31 AM
Im a GM in the All-Time Redraft I understand whats going on, I don't need the Knicks writeup to tell me who wins this game. Did I say you only said they would win because of Kobe and Durant? Oh that's right I didn't, so you can take your reading comprehension and get to work buddy.

Well considering you basically accused me of falling for the "Durant/Kobe combo", I was drawing assumptions from your statement. When in fact I didn't vote for the Knicks simply because they have Kobe and Durant. Good try though.

Khalifa21
10-26-2010, 09:36 AM
Knicks