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Mile High Champ
08-28-2010, 12:56 PM
Hey guys, Some of you may remember that for the last two years I have conducted a poll at the end of the season that had PSD users vote for the top 10 players at each position. Its is now that time to vote! I would like to start this up once more considering the NBA season is now over and we can get to this discussion since lots has changed since the start of last season. Please TRY AND VOTE FOR THE BEST PLAYER AND DON'T BE A HOMER. I will leave the poll open for one day and than we can carry on to the next best player at that position. I will add more players after each round. I have also included the results of those last 2 years so everyone can see how much things have changed...Enjoy.

REMEMBER this is based on who is the best player, not the player who has the potential to be the best.

PF Rankings

1) Pau Gasol
2)
3)
4)
5)
6)
7)
8)
9)
10)


2009 Off-Season PF Rankings

1) Tim Duncan
2) Kevin Garnett
3) Dirk Nowitzki
4) Chris Bosh
5) Amare Stoudemire
6) Pau Gasol
7) Carlos Boozer
8) Antawn Jamison
9) Rashard Lewis
10) David West

2008 Off-Season PF rankings

1) Tim Duncan
2) Kevin Garnett
3) Amare Stoudemire
4) Chris Bosh
5) Dirk Nowitzki
6) Elton Brand
7) Carlos Boozer
8) Pau Gasol
9) Antawn Jamison
10) David West

Gators123
08-28-2010, 12:56 PM
Dirk

Mile High Champ
08-28-2010, 12:57 PM
Dirk should of been easily number 1 but I guess number 2 will have to do. Can't believe Gasol took home top spot.

Mile High Champ
08-28-2010, 01:00 PM
Boozer.. really?? How is he better than Duncan, Dirk & maybe even Bosh??

stejay
08-28-2010, 01:01 PM
I think imma be controversial, and go KG....

Avenged
08-28-2010, 01:04 PM
Tim Duncan for me.

He's still very good overall and is very efficient ranking #5.

Gators123
08-28-2010, 01:06 PM
1. Pau
2. Dirk
3. Duncan
4. Bosh
5. Amare

Sadds The Gr8
08-28-2010, 01:06 PM
Disco

BRAVESFALCONS44
08-28-2010, 01:07 PM
Boozer

LastChanceToWin
08-28-2010, 01:09 PM
Pau blows ****. I am not even going to vote because he isn't even top 3 PF.

HuRRiCaNeS324
08-28-2010, 01:12 PM
Boozer shouldnt be there....

unleashthebeast
08-28-2010, 01:16 PM
Pau blows ****. I am not even going to vote because he isn't even top 3 PF.

he might be 3rd but duncan and dirk shouldve easily been top 2. too many lakers homers or something i guess

Niro
08-28-2010, 01:21 PM
dirk

Antipod
08-28-2010, 01:23 PM
Dirk the man Novvitzki :D

JordansBulls
08-28-2010, 01:26 PM
Duncan.

Why would it be Dirk, when Duncan just beat him without HCA last season?

nycericanguy
08-28-2010, 01:26 PM
Dirk should of been easily number 1 but I guess number 2 will have to do. Can't believe Gasol took home top spot.

offensively yes, but there are 2 sides of the court. Duncan is the best PF in the game today at both ends. Great passer also & shotblocker. Scoring isnt everything.

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 01:32 PM
It has to be Nowitzki.

Mile High Champ
08-28-2010, 01:41 PM
offensively yes, but there are 2 sides of the court. Duncan is the best PF in the game today at both ends. Great passer also & shotblocker. Scoring isnt everything.

Two years ago yes but like KG, Duncan showed last year he has started to turn down hill.

J_M_B
08-28-2010, 01:43 PM
This spot should really be Pau Gasol, but since he went #1, Dirk.

Chris Bosh is #3.

KH12
08-28-2010, 01:45 PM
Why is Boozer on this list? Then why is Amar'e on this list?

Last year:
Boozer: 59.9 TS%, 56.2 eFG%, 19.4 TRB%, 102 DRtg, 4.6 DWS
Stoudemire: 61.5 TS%, 55.7 eFG%, 14.5 TRB%, 109 DRtg, 2.5 DWS

Last year in Playoffs:
Boozer: 53.7 TS%, 53 eFG%, 19.3 TRB%
Stoudemire: 58.9 TS%, 51.9 eFG%, 10.9 TRB%

D-Will4Prez
08-28-2010, 01:50 PM
Duncan.

Why would it be Dirk, when Duncan just beat him without HCA last season?

This.

What?
08-28-2010, 01:55 PM
this poll should really have just been Dirk and Duncan if you don't vote for one of those 2 then your clearly just being a homer

D-Will4Prez
08-28-2010, 01:58 PM
MHC, do you have Jefferson listed as PF or C?

Ebbs
08-28-2010, 02:01 PM
Dirk should of been easily number 1 but I guess number 2 will have to do. Can't believe Gasol took home top spot.

Me either if Dirk some how loses to Duncan here im goign to quit PSD lol.


Duncan.


Why would it be Dirk, when Duncan just beat him without HCA last season?

yea it was Duncan alone that beat Dirk . . . :eyebrow:

Chacarron
08-28-2010, 02:02 PM
Dirk.

Ebbs
08-28-2010, 02:05 PM
Why is Boozer on this list? Then why is Amar'e on this list?

Last year:
Boozer: 59.9 TS%, 56.2 eFG%, 19.4 TRB%, 102 DRtg, 4.6 DWS
Stoudemire: 61.5 TS%, 55.7 eFG%, 14.5 TRB%, 109 DRtg, 2.5 DWS

Last year in Playoffs:
Boozer: 53.7 TS%, 53 eFG%, 19.3 TRB%
Stoudemire: 58.9 TS%, 51.9 eFG%, 10.9 TRB%

ol thats not gonna help your cause. I bet only 25% od posters on PSD have any idea what any of those stats mean. If you dont explain them or just use PPG, RPG, APG people are lost in translation lol.

Ovratd1up
08-28-2010, 02:08 PM
Duncan is extremely underrated.

tredigs
08-28-2010, 02:10 PM
Two years ago yes but like KG, Duncan showed last year he has started to turn down hill.

Unlike Garnett, he hasn't had any serious injury concerns. You can chalk him up for about ~80 games every single year, and then the playoffs. Even with his slight athletic regression, top to bottom I still have Duncan as the best PF in the game (though I have no problem with Gasol or Dirk getting the nod - there's a case for both). Without getting too deep into advanced stats or the intangibles, the bottom line is that Timmy is the greatest PF to ever live, and his decline is minimal at this point.

So, Duncan again here for me.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 02:11 PM
Duncan is extremely underrated.

Definitely.

Age will do that to a player.

TheWatcher34
08-28-2010, 02:14 PM
voting Pau Gasol as the TOP PF in the whole league just shows how little knowledge people on PSD really have. i am pissed at your incompetence.

tredigs
08-28-2010, 02:17 PM
voting Pau Gasol as the TOP PF in the whole league just shows how little knowledge people on PSD really have. i am pissed at your incompetence.

Your choice, and your reasoning?

I voted Duncan, but Gasol has his case (as does Dirk). I want to hear yours.

Ovratd1up
08-28-2010, 02:18 PM
This spot should really be Pau Gasol, but since he went #1, Dirk.

Chris Bosh is #3.

Bosh is a better scorer now, but that comes nowhere near overcoming Ducan's still vastly superior defense and his overall awesomeness/leadership vs. Bosh's... lack there of.



Hey guys did you know last year Ducan averaged 20.6/11.6/3.6 per 36?
TS% of .560, TRB% of 18.9%, 17.8 AST%.

You guys all think Duncan is the best PF of all time?
Well all of these numbers are above his career average.


But he's slowing down so much!!!

FaM0us Skins
08-28-2010, 02:19 PM
Duncan should be number 1. But I voted for him to be number 2

MacFitz92
08-28-2010, 02:20 PM
Dirk should of been easily number 1 but I guess number 2 will have to do. Can't believe Gasol took home top spot.

Very shocked. Pau isn't a superstar, Dirk is. Really a testament to how many Laker Homers there are on PSD.

Ovratd1up
08-28-2010, 02:21 PM
Definitely.

Age will do that to a player.
Two years ago yes but like KG, Duncan showed last year he has started to turn down hill.

He's averaging less minutes, but in those minutes he's actually playing slightly better than he has in the past 4-5 years, and he is above his career averages in most of the important categories.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 02:29 PM
Duncan's ppg for last season were 17.9, 10 rebounds (2.8 offensive, 7.3 defensive), 3.2 assists, 1.5 blocks, 0.6 steals, and his shooting percentage is at 51% while playing less minutes and ranks #5 in efficiency. Not to mention he's the better defender as well.

Dirk ppg was 25 a game, 7.7 rebounds, 2.7 assists, 0.9 steals, 1 block for game and shoots 48% from the field.

Both have very similar stats, only that Dirk makes more points but Duncan pretty much has him beat in every other aspect of the game slightly.

Kashmir13579
08-28-2010, 02:36 PM
duncan, amare, dirk. in that order

Slimsim
08-28-2010, 02:37 PM
Dirk

goose15
08-28-2010, 02:37 PM
Dirk

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 02:55 PM
This is Dirk IMO

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 02:56 PM
What i question is how in both polls so far Bosh is ahead of Amare but a month ago when we had a poll of who was better Amare absolutely blasted Bosh. Are PSD fans having a change of heart as the time passes because from checking the votes its not only Heat fans voting for Bosh. I guess the #4 ranking would tell us what we need to know.

unleashthebeast
08-28-2010, 02:57 PM
Very shocked. Pau isn't a superstar, Dirk is. Really a testament to how many Laker Homers there are on PSD.

this

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 02:58 PM
I went with Duncan. But looks like Dirk is going to win this one and I ain't mad at that. Kinda disappointed Pau is first though.

kswissdaf
08-28-2010, 02:58 PM
Dirk is def #1

Ovratd1up
08-28-2010, 02:58 PM
I went with Duncan. But looks like Dirk is going to win this one and I ain't mad at that. Kinda disappointed Pau is first though.

This exactly.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 03:01 PM
You guys should go look at the #1 PF thread and see who voted for Gasol.

I'd say about more than half of them aren't Laker fans just by glancing at the list and there's just no way there are 113 Lakers fans voting.

Kashmir13579
08-28-2010, 03:01 PM
I went with Duncan. But looks like Dirk is going to win this one and I ain't mad at that. Kinda disappointed Pau is first though.

he won by a landslide too. my problem with it is that if you put dirk, amare, or bosh on the lakers they still would've won 2 rings. imo.

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 03:02 PM
Very shocked. Pau isn't a superstar, Dirk is. Really a testament to how many Laker Homers there are on PSD.

Well hear what go back and click on the number next to the votes and look at the amount non-laker posters who voted for Pau.

Ovratd1up
08-28-2010, 03:06 PM
he won by a landslide too. my problem with it is that if you put dirk, amare, or bosh on the lakers they still would've won 2 rings. imo.

Dirk probably, Amare probably not, and Bosh, there's a decent chance. But Pau fits the system absolutely perfectly, if anything you could've replaced Kobe with Brandon Roy and they would've still easily won two in a row.

dwadefan03
08-28-2010, 03:07 PM
dirk

JordansBulls
08-28-2010, 03:23 PM
Me either if Dirk some how loses to Duncan here im goign to quit PSD lol.



yea it was Duncan alone that beat Dirk . . . :eyebrow:

:confused:

Avenged
08-28-2010, 03:26 PM
Well hear what go back and click on the number next to the votes and look at the amount non-laker posters who voted for Pau.

Pretty much what I finished stating a couple of posts up.

It wasn't only Laker fans voting, in fact it was more of other fans voting for Gasol than actual Laker fans.

jimbobjarree
08-28-2010, 03:29 PM
tim duncan

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 03:30 PM
Pretty much what I finished stating a couple of posts up.

It wasn't only Laker fans voting, in fact it was more of other fans voting for Gasol than actual Laker fans.

If they even took the time to actually read the arguments posted they would have actually realised that for the most part it was non-laker fans who was saying Pau. And I am not even a laker fan.

beasted86
08-28-2010, 03:32 PM
Please TRY AND VOTE FOR THE BEST PLAYER AND DON'T BE A HOMER.

Decent try, but can we all agree this is a useless disclaimer?

Bruno
08-28-2010, 03:37 PM
You guys should go look at the #1 PF thread and see who voted for Gasol.

I'd say about more than half of them aren't Laker fans just by glancing at the list and there's just no way there are 113 Lakers fans voting.

A lot of the Pau voters are anti-Kobe people who want to make a point that he has the best PF in the game on his team. Which isn't far from the truth, I just wouldn't put him at #1.

I hope he plays like the clear cut #1 PF this year, were gona need it against Miami and Boston.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 03:40 PM
A lot of the Pau voters are anti-Kobe people who want to make a point that he has the best PF in the game on his team. Which isn't far from the truth, I just wouldn't put him at #1.

I hope he plays like the clear cut #1 PF this year, were gona need it against Miami and Boston.

Whatever their reasoning was, it doesn't mean we're homers just because Pau Gasol won simply because the majority who voted for him weren't Laker fans.

Anti Kobeism (LOL) aside, many provided plenty of facts and rational reasonings onto why Gasol is #1.

Not many people in this thread are doing that, most are just saying "Dirk because Gasol shouldn't have been #1" or something along those lines.

REALLYYYYY?
08-28-2010, 03:42 PM
Boozer shouldnt be there....

He is probably better than amare and perhaps better than your bosh.

Hustlenomics
08-28-2010, 03:46 PM
He is probably better than amare and perhaps better than your bosh.

no he isn't

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 03:48 PM
Whatever their reasoning was, it doesn't mean we're homers just because Pau Gasol won simply because the majority who voted for him weren't Laker fans.

Anti Kobeism (LOL) aside, many provided plenty of facts and rational reasonings onto why Gasol is #1.

Not many people in this thread are doing that, most are just saying "Dirk because Gasol shouldn't have been #1" or something along those lines.

Exactly, more posters provided evidence to back Pau than for Dirk, TD or anyone else.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-28-2010, 04:11 PM
:laugh2:

How did Pau take #2?

Kakaroach
08-28-2010, 04:12 PM
Dirk for sure here, I voted him for #1.

thescore53
08-28-2010, 04:18 PM
He is probably better than amare and perhaps better than your bosh.

better than him in what ? water polo ?

NYMetros
08-28-2010, 04:22 PM
Dirk should have been #1 easily. Amazing how disrespected he gets.
How are there 8 votes for Amare? I know there are a lot of Knicks homers on the site, but seriously? I can see how Duncan got 25 votes, but Amare shouldn't even be in consideration.

Jewelz0376
08-28-2010, 04:24 PM
I voted for Dirk to be #1 but its arguable he's better than Pau so I don't have any problem with him going #1....but Dirk is def #2 then with Duncan in 3rd...

Enemey
08-28-2010, 04:35 PM
I voted for Tim Duncan

thekmp211
08-28-2010, 04:45 PM
voted duncan. rebounding and defense.

it's not disrespect that had dirk at number 2 (or rather, not at number one), just opinion. pretty much every response i've read on either of these polls has stipulated that a legitimate argument could be made for of these three guys. these are all opinions, in the end.

DoJoTheSlasher
08-28-2010, 04:49 PM
Duncan.

Why would it be Dirk, when Duncan just beat him without HCA last season?

How is Derrick Rose better than Mo Williams when Williams beat him in the playoffs?

Dirk was by far the best player in the series. It just so happens the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th best players played for SA.

VinceCarter
08-28-2010, 04:58 PM
Duncan for the second time.

Wow Lakers homers made Gasol #1 :pity:

My top 3 would be Duncan, Dirk, Gasol. THIS POLL IS GOING TO BE BACKWARDS :facepalm: :laugh2:

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 05:00 PM
How is Derrick Rose better than Mo Williams when Williams beat him in the playoffs?

Dirk was by far the best player in the series. It just so happens the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th best players played for SA.

Are you seriously going to use that as your case against him? Please come better than that or you'd get slaughter.

PS I also voted for Dirk. But a case like that makes you look like you have run out of good arguments.

RocketsRule
08-28-2010, 05:04 PM
I actually agree with Gasol being number 1. But now there's no question that Dirk is number 2, with Duncan coming in close at number 3.

dc5jdm
08-28-2010, 05:08 PM
gasol
dirk
duncan
amare
bosh
that order

dc5jdm
08-28-2010, 05:09 PM
its amazing how bosh is considered top 3??

DoJoTheSlasher
08-28-2010, 05:09 PM
Are you seriously going to use that as your case against him? Please come better than that or you'd get slaughter.

PS I also voted for Dirk. But a case like that makes you look like you have run out of good arguments.

It is perfectly relevant if the same can be said for Dirk/Duncan. Just because Duncan's team won makes Duncan > Dirk? All time he is better but it is not close today.....

IversonIsKrazy
08-28-2010, 05:36 PM
I haven't voted or bin on this site for a while, how the hell was Pau voted #1 over Dirk, and Duncan??

Eyegazym27
08-28-2010, 05:48 PM
Dirk/Duncan = 1a/1b in my book. then Pau. a second option is not the best at his position. not to mention when he was the first option his team was worthless..

greg_ory_2005
08-28-2010, 06:28 PM
Disco Dirk

SA5195
08-28-2010, 06:29 PM
Dirk

Cap'nCrunch40
08-28-2010, 06:30 PM
Dirk would be Number 2, Duncan and Bosh will probably follow him.

xbrackattackx
08-28-2010, 06:38 PM
Gotta be Duncan, I laugh at all the people who call Euro big men soft when they are leading the polls for top 2 big guys in the NBA. ha.

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 06:44 PM
It's quite clear that Dirk is owning this poll. Shouldn't we move on to #3 now?

Jewelz0376
08-28-2010, 07:03 PM
It's quite clear that Dirk is owning this poll. Shouldn't we move on to #3 now?

This

#3 will be interesting between Bosh and Duncan

Cano4prez
08-28-2010, 07:12 PM
Gotta be Dirk. Voted for him last poll too

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 07:20 PM
This

#3 will be interesting between Bosh and Duncan

I really don't think it should be much of a competition to be honest. And I'm not saying this cause Bosh left Toronto, but Duncan is clearly the better choice among the two.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:23 PM
hater bro. honestly... bosh over duncan and its not that close. duncan's career is on its last leg.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:24 PM
do I want an 18/10 guy who can barely move anymore or a 24/11 guy entering his prime?... hmmmm

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 07:25 PM
I really don't think it should be much of a competition to be honest. And I'm not saying this cause Bosh left Toronto, but Duncan is clearly the better choice among the two.

All of us ("us" - the non homer/intelligent NBA fans) know that Duncan should be #3. However, it's going to be tough to get him there considering all the Heat fans/homers who'll vote for Bosh.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:26 PM
All of us ("us" - the non homer/intelligent NBA fans) know that Duncan should be #3. However, it's going to be tough to get him there considering all the Heat fans/homers who'll vote for Bosh.

you mean bitter canadians?

you cant call heat fans biased and in the same sentence make an unbiased statement about chris bosh. There is a pretty evident conflict of interest... no?

RocketsRule
08-28-2010, 07:28 PM
Duncan is by far better than Bosh. Unlike Bosh, Duncan actually plays defense and wins games.

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 07:28 PM
do I want an 18/10 guy who can barely move anymore or a 24/11 guy entering his prime?... hmmmm

But the poll (and this entire set of polls) is based on this past season. Duncan doesn't score as much as Bosh but his defense alone puts him way over Bosh.

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 07:29 PM
All of us ("us" - the non homer/intelligent NBA fans) know that Duncan should be #3. However, it's going to be tough to get him there considering all the Heat fans/homers who'll vote for Bosh.

lol. Don't worry, all the homer Laker fans and Bulls fans well help us ;)

Jewelz0376
08-28-2010, 07:31 PM
do I want an 18/10 guy who can barely move anymore or a 24/11 guy entering his prime?... hmmmm

I'd say their rebounding is pretty close to equal..Bosh is better on O but then Duncan is better on D..

KH12
08-28-2010, 07:32 PM
Duncan is by far better than Bosh. Unlike Bosh, Duncan actually plays defense and wins games.

Chris Bosh has more SportsCenter's Top 10 plays, he wins.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:33 PM
That may be true. TD is still a beter defender. but if we were considering that he should be number 1 ahead of pau and dirk.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:34 PM
by your ratoinal...his offense is on par with gasol, but his d is better... he wins

and in the case of dirk, he is wayyy better defensively...

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 07:35 PM
Duncan is by far better than Bosh. Unlike Bosh, Duncan actually plays defense and wins games.

False.

It might have seemed like Duncan was the better defensive player last year, however Bosh scored a higher DRtg. (101 DRtg vs. 111 DRtg). Although Duncan did have higher DWS (4.5) compared to Bosh's (1.7).

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:39 PM
no. you want drtg to be lower... its how many points an opponent scores on you with 100 possesions.

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 07:40 PM
No. You want DRtg to be lower.

Snap!

I forgot about that with all the confusion going on. :o

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:40 PM
then again...wade had a drtg of 103 and kobe of 104... but try explaining to a laker fan that dwade is as good defensively as kobe.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:42 PM
or try explaining that lebron has a drtg of 101 compared to artest at 105 to them.

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 07:43 PM
That may be true. TD is still a beter defender. but if we were considering that he should be number 1 ahead of pau and dirk.

I actually voted for Duncan in the first and the second poll.

DoJoTheSlasher
08-28-2010, 07:43 PM
by your ratoinal...his offense is on par with gasol, but his d is better... he wins

and in the case of dirk, he is wayyy better defensively...

Saying Duncan > Bosh is unthinkable but you can say Duncan is better than Dirk today??

I think That Marion Chalmers and Joel Anthony need to be mentioned as the best PG/C in the league.

Oh and in the case of Dirk and Bosh, Dirk is wayyyyyyy better offensively.

td0tsfinest
08-28-2010, 07:46 PM
then again...wade had a drtg of 103 and kobe of 104... but try explaining to a laker fan that dwade is as good defensively as kobe.

I can agree with you on that. I thought Wade should've been on the first team all-defensive over Kobe. But thats off-topic and a discussion for another time.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:47 PM
Saying Duncan > Bosh is unthinkable but you can say Duncan is better than Dirk today??

I think That Marion Chalmers and Joel Anthony need to be mentioned as the best PG/C in the league.

Oh and in the case of Dirk and Bosh, Dirk is wayyyyyyy better offensively.

i didnt say that. I said that you cant have it both ways.

and no he isn't. he is a better shooter. no dubt. but to make a blanket statement that dirk is better offensively seems a little short sighted. Dirk averaged 25 a game on 48% shooting while bosh averaged 24 a game on 52% shooting... and dirk played a minute and a half more each game...so they scored at almost an identical rate

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:48 PM
I can agree with you on that. I thought Wade should've been on the first team all-defensive over Kobe. But thats off-topic and a discussion for another time.

:) I know. my point is just that some people agree with stat only when it suits them... :)

Rndy
08-28-2010, 07:51 PM
False.

It might have seemed like Duncan was the better defensive player last year, however Bosh scored a higher DRtg. (101 DRtg vs. 111 DRtg). Although Duncan did have higher DWS (4.5) compared to Bosh's (1.7).

:facepalm: If you are going to use advanced stats at least understand them. Anyone can copy and paste and say SEE!!!.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:52 PM
dude. he made a mistake. calm down.

Rndy
08-28-2010, 07:56 PM
He just didn't know. The worse part is trying to cover it up, instead of admitting he didn't know.

daleja424
08-28-2010, 07:58 PM
so what if he didnt know? he thought he did so he provided a stat. is it really that stupid of a mistake to think that a higher rating would be better... :eyebrow:

that stat is counterintuitive.... not that big of a deal

Jays Claw
08-28-2010, 08:12 PM
He just didn't know. The worst part is trying to cover it up, instead of admitting he didn't know.

How was I trying to cover it up?

I truly forgot that when looking at DRtg statistics, you want it to be lower. If I was trying to "cover it up", I could have easily gone back and edited my post.

Rndy
08-28-2010, 08:13 PM
so what if he didnt know? he thought he did so he provided a stat. is it really that stupid of a mistake to think that a higher rating would be better... :eyebrow:

that stat is counterintuitive.... not that big of a deal

Nope not a big deal at all I can totally see why someone would make that mistake. However saying he forgot is weird, although I'd probably make excuses if I was calling out someone and was wrong.

Anyways back on topic Boozer for President! but will settle for # 6-7 PF.

Rndy
08-28-2010, 08:16 PM
How was I trying to cover it up?

I truly forgot that when looking at DRtg statistics, you want it to be lower. If I was trying to "cover it up", I could have easily gone back and edited my post.

I guess man.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 08:30 PM
If you look at the advance stats, Duncan and Bosh are similar in comparison but Duncan does hold wider gaps in some statistics. Defensively, Duncan is better. His production is still top notch.

The next poll will be close if people vote fair (not just by name).

TheTakeOver24
08-28-2010, 08:37 PM
I voted for Bosh even though I know he's not the 2nd best pf in the game... why? because Pau Gasol was voted best pf... so we are definitely not voting for real.

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 08:40 PM
Why is Bosh getting so much love/respect all of a sudden? I mean wasn't he the most hated PF in the NBA just a month ago. Some posters even said he isn't even a top 10 PF (dumbasses). Now suddenly there's a debate for him at #3. I'm confused. :confused:

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 08:47 PM
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=507780

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=509654

to all the posters debating you can use these as some reference, insight, reminders and a little history lesson.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 08:47 PM
Why is Bosh getting so much love/respect all of a sudden? I mean wasn't he the most hated PF in the NBA just a month ago. Some posters even said he isn't even a top 10 PF (dumbasses). Now suddenly there's a debate for him at #3. I'm confused. :confused:

Heat fans.

You can't blame them, if they can back it up then they have a legitimate argument. If they can't, then.....

49erGiantLaker
08-28-2010, 08:49 PM
I went with Dirk.

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 08:49 PM
Heat fans.

You can't blame them, if they can back it up then they have a legitimate argument. If they can't, then.....

No bro I am not talking about just Heat fans because from watching who chose Bosh it wasn't just them. Its making me wonder if people are actually starting to have a change of heart towards him. Hey I guess its as they say time heals everything. ;)

jackdawson
08-28-2010, 08:53 PM
Tim Duncan easily for me although I am not surprised about the poll. After all this is PSD. Tim Duncan is the most efficient big man in the league. Just because the spurs as a team a falling doesn't mean Timmy's production went down. He has been the same man as he was in his championship years.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 08:56 PM
No bro I am not talking about just Heat fans because from watching who chose Bosh it wasn't just them. Its making me wonder if people are actually starting to have a change of heart towards him. Hey I guess its as they say time heals everything. ;)

I'm looking at the poll, and a number of them have voted for Bosh.

Anyways, their stats are similar, should be interesting.

MacFitz92
08-28-2010, 10:16 PM
Last thing I'm saying about Pau getting voted as the #1 PF in the NBA.

You can't be the best PF in the game if you aren't a #1 scoring option, unless you have exceptional defense, which Pau Gasol doesn't have. Anyone who thinks Pau Gasol is a better power forward than Dirk Nowitzki is one of three things.

1). Laker's Fan
2). Ignorant
3). Wrong

pebloemer
08-28-2010, 10:22 PM
Last thing I'm saying about Pau getting voted as the #1 PF in the NBA.

You can't be the best PF in the game if you aren't a #1 scoring option, unless you have exceptional defense, which Pau Gasol doesn't have. Anyone who thinks Pau Gasol is a better power forward than Dirk Nowitzki is one of three things.

1). Laker's Fan
2). Ignorant
3). Wrong

Is it now impossible for Wade to surpass Kobe as the best SG in the game because Wade is no longer the #1 scoring option?

WeAreClutch
08-28-2010, 10:32 PM
pau gasol is not in my top three

MacFitz92
08-28-2010, 10:34 PM
Is it now impossible for Wade to surpass Kobe as the best SG in the game because Wade is no longer the #1 scoring option?

There's a difference from not being the #1 scoring option on a team that has the best player in the league, and not being able to be a #1 scoring option on a team.

WeAreClutch
08-28-2010, 10:38 PM
Gasol Brothers

Pau 18.3 11.3 1.7 18 million 7'0'' 30 yrs

Marc 14.3 9.3 1.6 3 million 7'1'' 25 yrs

I would take Marc

soundjunkies2
08-28-2010, 10:41 PM
Gasol Brothers

Pau 18.3 11.3 1.7 18 million 7'0'' 30 yrs

Marc 14.3 9.3 1.6 3 million 7'1'' 25 yrs

I would take Marc

I'm pretty sure you're in the minority on that one.

soundjunkies2
08-28-2010, 10:43 PM
There's a difference from not being the #1 scoring option on a team that has the best player in the league, and not being able to be a #1 scoring option on a team.

But Pau has proven to be able to be the #1 option on a team. He just didn't have the supporting cast around him.

Avenged
08-28-2010, 10:43 PM
Wow, this thread has hit an all-time low.

It's arguable that Dirk deserved the #1 spot, whether they're #1 options or not, the stats say otherwise. Both of them are relatively close regardless.

But Marc Gasol?

Iggz53
08-28-2010, 10:49 PM
Timmy D.

Dirk is still a hell of a scorer but when you factor in defense, rebounding, passing, intelligence, and other intangibles, it isn't even close.

blacknell
08-28-2010, 10:50 PM
Dirk should be number 1 by far he is alot better than Gasol and is the number 1 option on his team.. Gasol couldn't win a game till he played with Bryant

NYMetros
08-28-2010, 10:52 PM
When you have the best player in the game on your team, you can't really blame Gasol for not being the #1 option on offense. If Dirk was on the Lakers, would he be the #1 scoring option? I doubt it.

Gators123
08-28-2010, 10:53 PM
Dirk should be number 1 by far he is alot better than Gasol and is the number 1 option on his team.. Gasol couldn't win a game till he played with Bryant

Gasol should of been finals MVP

Swashcuff
08-28-2010, 10:55 PM
Dirk should be number 1 by far he is alot better than Gasol and is the number 1 option on his team.. Gasol couldn't win a game till he played with Bryant

and thats all his fault right?

oh and I thought we were talking about who is the best right now not 3-4 years ago.

WeAreClutch
08-28-2010, 10:58 PM
im not saying Marc is a better choice for the lakers

i would prefer Marc over Pau on my team

Pau is definitely the choice of the two if trying to win a championship this season

Wade>You
08-28-2010, 11:05 PM
Chris Bosh.

pebloemer
08-28-2010, 11:37 PM
There's a difference from not being the #1 scoring option on a team that has the best player in the league, and not being able to be a #1 scoring option on a team.

I guess we have disagreements about the Memphis Grizzlies between 2003 and 2006 where Gasol led a very mediocre team to three straight playoff appearances when he was clearly the #1 scoring option on his team.

We also have disagreements about players' abilities to evolve and improve throughout the careers under new coaches and in new situations.

AlphaClose 007
08-28-2010, 11:42 PM
Dirk or Stoudemire

kdspurman
08-28-2010, 11:57 PM
I just dont understand... This is saying best Power Forward. Dirk is NOT a power forward! He's a 7'0 SG or SF. Tim Duncan should be here easily. I understand Pau getting 1 no argument.. But seriously? Dirk? He's not a power forward... I posted this in the last forum but its closed.. If he was a power forward he wouldve dominated those little golden state warriors in 07 like a power forward should. The guy has an amazing shot, dont get me wrong, but in all honesty that's about it. I'm not biased i hate playing him cause i feel he never misses, but his game is pretty much 1 dimensional. Check out the link below. (with a couple paragraphs about him)

"Nowitzki doesn't like to be defended by physical players. Even though Nowitzki got to the line 7.2 times per game, most of his free throw attempts come from a defender running at him and hitting his arm on his shot. Very rarely will you see Nowitzki be underneath the basket to get a three point play opportunity.

According to 82games.com Nowitzki 83 percent of his shots were jumpers while 17 percent of his shots came from within close. Now, compared to other power forwards in the league there's no percentage even close to that number. Why? Cause nearly all power forwards in the NBA have the ability to post up and score from the inside."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/388309-why-dirk-nowitzki-is-not-the-best-power-forward-in-the-nba

MacFitz92
08-29-2010, 12:23 AM
I just dont understand... This is saying best Power Forward. Dirk is NOT a power forward! He's a 7'0 SG or SF. Tim Duncan should be here easily. I understand Pau getting 1 no argument.. But seriously? Dirk? He's not a power forward... I posted this in the last forum but its closed.. If he was a power forward he wouldve dominated those little golden state warriors in 07 like a power forward should. The guy has an amazing shot, dont get me wrong, but in all honesty that's about it. I'm not biased i hate playing him cause i feel he never misses, but his game is pretty much 1 dimensional. Check out the link below. (with a couple paragraphs about him)

"Nowitzki doesn't like to be defended by physical players. Even though Nowitzki got to the line 7.2 times per game, most of his free throw attempts come from a defender running at him and hitting his arm on his shot. Very rarely will you see Nowitzki be underneath the basket to get a three point play opportunity.

According to 82games.com Nowitzki 83 percent of his shots were jumpers while 17 percent of his shots came from within close. Now, compared to other power forwards in the league there's no percentage even close to that number. Why? Cause nearly all power forwards in the NBA have the ability to post up and score from the inside."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/388309-why-dirk-nowitzki-is-not-the-best-power-forward-in-the-nba

Did you seriously quote bleacher report? Enough Said.

daleja424
08-29-2010, 12:26 AM
seriously. dirk is a pf because he guards pfs and pfs guard him. who cares if he doesnt fit your mold, or even the nba mold, for what a pf should be.

Avenged
08-29-2010, 12:30 AM
I just dont understand... This is saying best Power Forward. Dirk is NOT a power forward! He's a 7'0 SG or SF. Tim Duncan should be here easily. I understand Pau getting 1 no argument.. But seriously? Dirk? He's not a power forward... I posted this in the last forum but its closed.. If he was a power forward he wouldve dominated those little golden state warriors in 07 like a power forward should. The guy has an amazing shot, dont get me wrong, but in all honesty that's about it. I'm not biased i hate playing him cause i feel he never misses, but his game is pretty much 1 dimensional. Check out the link below. (with a couple paragraphs about him)

"Nowitzki doesn't like to be defended by physical players. Even though Nowitzki got to the line 7.2 times per game, most of his free throw attempts come from a defender running at him and hitting his arm on his shot. Very rarely will you see Nowitzki be underneath the basket to get a three point play opportunity.

According to 82games.com Nowitzki 83 percent of his shots were jumpers while 17 percent of his shots came from within close. Now, compared to other power forwards in the league there's no percentage even close to that number. Why? Cause nearly all power forwards in the NBA have the ability to post up and score from the inside."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/388309-why-dirk-nowitzki-is-not-the-best-power-forward-in-the-nba

Dirk is not a SF let alone a SG.

You're quoting Bleacher Report, and although some of the stuff actually made some sense, like Daleja said, he guards PF's, PF's guard him.

Spurred1
08-29-2010, 12:36 AM
I just dont understand... This is saying best Power Forward. Dirk is NOT a power forward! He's a 7'0 SG or SF. Tim Duncan should be here easily. I understand Pau getting 1 no argument.. But seriously? Dirk? He's not a power forward... I posted this in the last forum but its closed.. If he was a power forward he wouldve dominated those little golden state warriors in 07 like a power forward should. The guy has an amazing shot, dont get me wrong, but in all honesty that's about it. I'm not biased i hate playing him cause i feel he never misses, but his game is pretty much 1 dimensional. Check out the link below. (with a couple paragraphs about him)

"Nowitzki doesn't like to be defended by physical players. Even though Nowitzki got to the line 7.2 times per game, most of his free throw attempts come from a defender running at him and hitting his arm on his shot. Very rarely will you see Nowitzki be underneath the basket to get a three point play opportunity.

According to 82games.com Nowitzki 83 percent of his shots were jumpers while 17 percent of his shots came from within close. Now, compared to other power forwards in the league there's no percentage even close to that number. Why? Cause nearly all power forwards in the NBA have the ability to post up and score from the inside."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/388309-why-dirk-nowitzki-is-not-the-best-power-forward-in-the-nba

The writer of that article is an absolute douche bag. Not for the article on Dirk, but another one he wrote. An ignorant, pathetic little man with no compassion.

sargon21
08-29-2010, 12:38 AM
its ridiculous that gasol got #1, just look at what he did in memphis, nothing- meanwhile look at what dirk does with his team as the main option, same with TD

meloman1592
08-29-2010, 12:40 AM
Dirk is easily # 1 with gasol #2 and amare # 3

TheTakeOver24
08-29-2010, 12:41 AM
its ridiculous that gasol got #1, just look at what he did in memphis, nothing- meanwhile look at what dirk does with his team as the main option, same with TD

The Bulls fan is right... wow I never thought id say that.

Avenged
08-29-2010, 12:43 AM
Yep, forgot we're ranking careers here.

Duncan should be #1 and Garnett #2 if that were the case.

MacFitz92
08-29-2010, 12:43 AM
seriously. dirk is a pf because he guards pfs and pfs guard him. who cares if he doesnt fit your mold, or even the nba mold, for what a pf should be.

Exactly.

Chacarron
08-29-2010, 12:55 AM
its ridiculous that gasol got #1, just look at what he did in memphis, nothing- meanwhile look at what dirk does with his team as the main option, same with TD

Duncan won championships as a first option. Nowitzki lost in the Finals and lost as a #1 seed to the Warriors. It's ridiculous using team success as a measure of a player's ranking. Dirk should be #2 and Duncan #3 at this point in their careers.

Jewelz0376
08-29-2010, 01:04 AM
its ridiculous that gasol got #1, just look at what he did in memphis, nothing- meanwhile look at what dirk does with his team as the main option, same with TD

Why do people keep saying this?? I voted for Dirk to be #1 also, but Gasol is a better player now then he was in Memphis, so what he did there 4 yrs ago doesn't matter...

sargon21
08-29-2010, 01:23 AM
The Bulls fan is right... wow I never thought id say that.

haha good to see


Why do people keep saying this?? I voted for Dirk to be #1 also, but Gasol is a better player now then he was in Memphis, so what he did there 4 yrs ago doesn't matter...

because he hasn't drastically improved from then till now, and when he was the main option on that team, he wasn't mentioned anywhere near the top PF in the game but now all of a sudden when he goes and plays with kobe he's #1 -- that makes no sense


Duncan won championships as a first option. Nowitzki lost in the Finals and lost as a #1 seed to the Warriors. It's ridiculous using team success as a measure of a player's ranking. Dirk should be #2 and Duncan #3 at this point in their careers.

:laugh2: you're making my point for me, if team success shouldn't be taken into account then why is gasol getting all this love when he wasn't in memphis, along with dirk and duncan just being better players -- if dallas had gasol they would be nowhere near where dallas was

soundjunkies2
08-29-2010, 01:36 AM
haha good to see



because he hasn't drastically improved from then till now, and when he was the main option on that team, he wasn't mentioned anywhere near the top PF in the game but now all of a sudden when he goes and plays with kobe he's #1 -- that makes no sense



:laugh2: you're making my point for me, if team success shouldn't be taken into account then why is gasol getting all this love when he wasn't in memphis along with dirk and duncan just being better players -- if dallas had gasol they would be nowhere near where dallas was

If team success shouldn't be taken into account then why did you bring up Pau's time in Memphis. Of course Pau is getting more love now because of where he is playing. He's getting noticed and seen more playing on the biggest stage.

sargon21
08-29-2010, 01:51 AM
^ because apparently people think he drastically improved btwn that time span which he didn't, so if he wasn't close to the #1 PF at that time, then why does he deseve it now??

DoubleDragon
08-29-2010, 01:55 AM
If team success shouldn't be taken into account then why did you bring up Pau's time in Memphis. Of course Pau is getting more love now because of where he is playing. He's getting noticed and seen more playing on the biggest stage.

Not to mention he's consistent, clearly versatile, a finesse player who's added more power over the last 2 seasons, improved hook, short to midrange shot, who has also had to step-up to Center at the drop of a dime (with Bynum's glass knee). One of the best, if not the best passing bigs, amazing ball handler for a 7 footer. He's flourished as an individual and as a team player. Europe's MVP as well. Enough with the sour grapes Laker haters. It's a poll, get over it and quit wasting space with your ignorant gripes. If you think someone's better, then I'm sure you voted for them. If they didn't win, it's nothing personal. IMO, these are the qualities I voted Pau in for.

I'm sure some idiot's gonna come back with a brilliant rebuttal:facepalm:

That being said. I like Dirk at #2, and YES, I do think it's close and quite frankly wouldn't be too upset if 1 and 2 were flipped. I certainly wouldn't incessantly whine, as do some children do on here. Gotta give Dirk his props, he's a monster.

Neither are quite at the level of Duncan in his prime, but few are.
All these listed PF's deserve respect nonetheless. Not a big fan of lists, but if someone asks, what the heck:o

I'm done now;)

YankeesNets11
08-29-2010, 02:00 AM
Dirk, he should have been first imo.

Basketash
08-29-2010, 02:03 AM
Duncan

REALLYYYYY?
08-29-2010, 02:05 AM
duncan, amare, dirk. in that order

:o

Amare?

Reallyyyyyyyyyyy?

Avenged
08-29-2010, 02:22 AM
^ because apparently people think he drastically improved btwn that time span which he didn't, so if he wasn't close to the #1 PF at that time, then why does he deseve it now??


2005-2006

Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
1 Pau Gasol 2005-06 25 80 3135 22.7 .555 .504 7.5 20.0 13.8 23.7 0.8 3.9 13.8 26.4 111 100 6.6 5.4 12.0 0.184
2 Dirk Nowitzki 2005-06 27 81 3089 28.1 .589 .515 4.6 23.4 14.2 14.7 1.0 2.1 7.9 30.0 123 103 13.5 4.3 17.7 0.275



This past season

Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
1 Pau Gasol 2009-10 29 65 2403 22.9 .593 .536 11.4 22.7 17.1 15.0 0.8 3.5 12.5 21.4 120 102 6.8 4.2 11.0 0.220
2 Dirk Nowitzki 2009-10 31 81 3039 22.9 .578 .498 3.1 20.1 11.7 13.0 1.2 2.0 7.8 28.8 116 105 8.4 3.9 12.3 0.194

Dirk had Gasol beat in pretty much every major category during Gasol's years in Memphis.

But this past season, they're near identical with Gasol actually leading in more categories than not.

Gasol has simply gotten better and has excelled in Los Angeles.

Venomous88
08-29-2010, 02:38 AM
Dirk. He's better than Gasol

ecorrea
08-29-2010, 03:40 AM
who actually voted boozer??

gasol
duncan/nowitzki
bosh
boozer/amare

Law25
08-29-2010, 04:30 AM
I still think Ducan is the best PF. And i LOVE Pau's game, and im an Lakers fan. BUT if Gasol and Ducan switch teams where would Gasol be ranked? or if he was still with the Grizz? See my point :)

icej
08-29-2010, 04:41 AM
This should be called #2 PF in NBA today.

Duncan still has very good claim in this by today, but should win #1 among the choices by default if this is for career.

The Raven
08-29-2010, 04:54 AM
Dirk

YoungOne
08-29-2010, 05:58 AM
Boozer.. really?? How is he better than Duncan, Dirk & maybe even Bosh??

bulls homers ;)

todu82
08-29-2010, 08:14 AM
Dirk Nowitski

JasonJohnHorn
08-29-2010, 08:58 AM
Duncan is still the best power forward in the league. Pau is a very close second (although PSD voters seem to disagree with me). Duncan is the best defensive PF in the league, he has a great mid-range jumper, solid post moves, great ball handling, or rather passing skills, and is a strong facilitator who draws defenders when he doesnt even have the ball in his hand and opens things up for the rest of the guys on the floor just by being there.

Pau is awesome to, and I have great respect for him and all aspects of his game, so I can understand why many feel he is the best PF in the league and wouldnt put up an argument with somebody who chose him, but anybody else... there is just PF in the league that is in the same class as Duncan and Pau in my opinion. Some may be better rebounders, some may have post moves that as good, or mid range jumpers that as as good (Dirk is likely the best shooter as his position, but he isnt as strong a rebounder or defneder as Pau and Duncan) or even passing skills that as good, but nobody has the complete package that Duncan and Pau have. Nobody.

pebloemer
08-29-2010, 10:07 AM
its ridiculous that gasol got #1, just look at what he did in memphis, nothing- meanwhile look at what dirk does with his team as the main option, same with TD

Where did he lead Memphis?

Further than Kobe led the Lakers without Shaq until Pau's arrival.
Further than Wade has ever led the Heat since Shaq's departure.

If you are going to compare where Dirk has led Dallas and where Pau led Memphis you at least have to take into account supporting casts.

dhopisthename
08-29-2010, 11:07 AM
Where did he lead Memphis?

Further than Kobe led the Lakers without Shaq until Pau's arrival.
Further than Wade has ever led the Heat since Shaq's departure.

If you are going to compare where Dirk has led Dallas and where Pau led Memphis you at least have to take into account supporting casts.

what? kobe and wade both led their teams to the playoffs and I think none of them ever left the first round so how did he take them further?

dhopisthename
08-29-2010, 11:33 AM
I don't think Chris Bosh is getting enough love he averaged (24/10.8) which only Nowitzki averaged more points(25/7.7) and gasol more rebounds(18.3/11.3). He also had the highest per of any of them. Now offensive stats are not everything but they should count for something

daleja424
08-29-2010, 11:36 AM
I think the point is that Chris Bosh is the best statistical PF in the game. So even if you want to talk about other factors like defense and intangibles, which you should, its hard to see how 3-4 PFs can be ranked ahead of him given his stats.

Avenged
08-29-2010, 11:48 AM
Chris Bosh is being ranked where he should be so far - and that's nowhere near the top 2 - if you want to argue he's #3 go ahead, but he is not top 2 as of right now. Atleast not yet.

Khalifa21
08-29-2010, 11:50 AM
I voted for Amar'e cos I wanna show him some love but it's Dirk and he's ran away with it.

bigsams50
08-29-2010, 11:52 AM
Voted Dirk

thescore53
08-29-2010, 12:00 PM
I think the point is that Chris Bosh is the best statistical PF in the game. So even if you want to talk about other factors like defense and intangibles, which you should, its hard to see how 3-4 PFs can be ranked ahead of him given his stats.


I don't think Chris Bosh is getting enough love he averaged (24/10.8) which only Nowitzki averaged more points(25/7.7) and gasol more rebounds(18.3/11.3). He also had the highest per of any of them. Now offensive stats are not everything but they should count for something

cause he did it on a bad team. on a contract year. stats dont mean much especially when bosh loves patting them.

Avenged
08-29-2010, 12:50 PM
Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
1 Bosh 2009-10 25 70 2526 25.0 .592 .522 9.9 25.2 17.7 11.5 0.9 2.1 10.7 28.7 117 111 7.9 1.7 9.6 0.182


Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
2 Duncan 2009-10 33 78 2438 24.7 .560 .519 10.8 26.8 18.9 17.8 1.0 3.5 10.1 26.0 116 101 6.4 4.5 10.9 0.215


Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
3 Gasol 2009-10 29 65 2403 22.9 .593 .536 11.4 22.7 17.1 15.0 0.8 3.5 12.5 21.4 120 102 6.8 4.2 11.0 0.220


Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
4 Dirk 2009-10 31 81 3039 22.9 .578 .498 3.1 20.1 11.7 13.0 1.2 2.0 7.8 28.8 116 105 8.4 3.9 12.3 0.194

All of them are pretty close with Bosh being the worse defender of the bunch. I mean, you got to take in success and intangibles to decide this, that's why a lot of people have no problem going with Pau/Dirk/Duncan for #1 since they're all close. Thing about Bosh is, he's clearly the youngest of the bunch and is about to emerge his prime.

n83417
08-29-2010, 12:57 PM
Duncan is better than Pau and Dirk. Dirk should be 3-4. Considering he doesn't play defense, block shots or rebound, He is basically a PF with a SFs game.

Avenged
08-29-2010, 01:04 PM
Duncan is better than Pau and Dirk. Dirk should be 3-4. Considering he doesn't play defense, block shots or rebound, He is basically a PF with a SFs game.

Dirk is the 3rd best defender of what should be the top 4.

His offensive game is really good though and his D is somewhat underrated.

REALLYYYYY?
08-29-2010, 01:12 PM
Duncan
Dirk
Pau
Bosh
Boozer
KG? Amare?

thescore53
08-29-2010, 01:13 PM
I think the point is that Chris Bosh is the best statistical PF in the game. So even if you want to talk about other factors like defense and intangibles, which you should, its hard to see how 3-4 PFs can be ranked ahead of him given his stats.

he's 3rd or fourth if u wanna put duncan ahead of him. he def better than both amare and bozzer.i dont think anyone is gonna argue that other than knicks and bulls fans

pebloemer
08-29-2010, 01:15 PM
what? kobe and wade both led their teams to the playoffs and I think none of them ever left the first round so how did he take them further?

Memphis won 50 games with Pau leading them. My point is neither Kobe nor Wade were able to lead their team without any help either, so holding it against Gasol for not being able to lead his team to a championship in Memphis is a very flawed argument as a reason for Dirk being better. Games are played 5 on 5 and players' supporting casts has a lot to do with team success.

Ovratd1up
08-29-2010, 01:45 PM
do I want an 18/10 guy who can barely move anymore or a 24/11 guy entering his prime?... hmmmm

Who'd you vote for for #3 in the SG poll?

A 21.5/4.4/4.7 guy that has peaked in Brandon Roy or a 25.5/4.0/5.3 entering his prime in Monta Ellis?


hmmmm....

Ovratd1up
08-29-2010, 01:46 PM
he's 3rd or fourth if u wanna put duncan ahead of him. he def better than both amare and bozzer.i dont think anyone is gonna argue that other than knicks and bulls fans

What if Knicks and Bulls fans win the argument?

beasted86
08-29-2010, 01:53 PM
Dirk is the 3rd best defender of what should be the top 4.

His offensive game is really good though and his D is somewhat underrated.

His defense is underrated, but the stats lie.

People who look at defensive rating and defensive WS to compare individual player defense are plain stupid. Michael Beasley was the 20th & 21st best player in the NBA (not among PFs, I said the WHOLE NBA) in defensive rating and defensive win shares respectively.

That alone tells you how accurate those stats are (see: worthless).

Chacarron
08-29-2010, 01:57 PM
:laugh2: you're making my point for me, if team success shouldn't be taken into account then why is gasol getting all this love when he wasn't in memphis, along with dirk and duncan just being better players -- if dallas had gasol they would be nowhere near where dallas was


I don't exactly know what you mean in the bolded part, but these rankings are for right now, not 3 years ago.

blacknell
08-29-2010, 04:21 PM
and thats all his fault right?

oh and I thought we were talking about who is the best right now not 3-4 years ago.

Me 2 thats why i said dirk is better.. Dirk wins 50 plus games a season by himself and doesn't have the 2nd best player in the NBA to ride on his back... Dirk gives you 25 10 a game and he can do more than gasol can

daleja424
08-29-2010, 04:22 PM
moving on

Hawkeye15
08-29-2010, 09:20 PM
#3 is up. Thanks for voting