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StealingSigns
07-31-2010, 11:51 PM
Who do you see as possible waiver deal targets?

For me it is Jason Frasor, and possibly John Buck.

I think contenders will do the c***blocking thing on Downs, possibly Gregg, and for sure Bautista.

Jayson Stark put out a nifty article on August waiver deals a few years back:




* Virtually every player in the major leagues will be placed on waivers this month, whether a team intends to trade that player or not. If nothing else, the sheer volume of names can at least disguise players whom clubs do want to sneak through so they can be dealt.
* If a player isn't claimed by any team in either league, he can be traded until the end of the month to anyone.
* If a player is claimed, but only by one team, the player can be traded only to the team that claims him.
* If a player is claimed by more than one team, the club with the worst record in that player's league gets priority -- and the player can be traded only to that team.
* If a player is claimed only by teams in the other league, the club with the worst record in the other league gets priority -- and the player can be traded just to that team.
* If a deal can't be worked out or the team doesn't want to trade that player, he can be pulled back off waivers once in August. If he is placed on waivers again before September, he can't be recalled a second time.
* Or, if a team is just hoping to dump a player's salary, it can simply allow a team which claimed that player to have him for a small waiver fee. If that happens, the team that gets the player has to pay his entire salary. That's how the Yankees were stuck with Jose Canseco and the Padres were stuck with Randy Myers in recent years: They claimed those players, thinking they were just blocking other teams from getting them. Instead, their old clubs said: "You claimed him. You got him." This happened with Rios last year. It worked out for Chicago in the end, but it was a small gamble.
* In the past, many teams claimed players just to keep them from being traded to contenders with a better record. This year, that isn't expected to happen as often, because most teams can't afford to get stuck with a big contract if they're awarded a player they really didn't want.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&id=1860265

Gibby
08-01-2010, 12:06 AM
there is no way Buck or Fasor clears waivers. both have interest from teams but didnt get traded because jays didnt get a right deal so dont you think those teams will claim them if they dont have to give up anything. Plus their contracts are cheap so their is really not a reason why they would clear waivers

StealingSigns
08-01-2010, 12:14 AM
They don't have to clear waivers for a deal to be made. The teams that are out of the races have little interest in Buck or Frasor.

BIGdanielBABY
08-01-2010, 12:18 AM
there is no way Buck or Fasor clears waivers. both have interest from teams but didnt get traded because jays didnt get a right deal so dont you think those teams will claim them if they dont have to give up anything. Plus their contracts are cheap so their is really not a reason why they would clear waivers

If i am understanding the article correctly, you can put Buck/Frasor/Downs on waivers. Teams can then put a 'claim' on that player and a trade can occur between us or another team. If a deal is not agreed upon we can either 'pull back' the player from waivers or simply give them to the claiming team. And if we put them on waivers again, then we cannot pull them back regardless.

So even if frasor or buck don't clear waivers, it's not like we're going to give them away just like that.

StealingSigns
08-01-2010, 12:23 AM
Perfect example from a Jays standpoint: David Cone in 1992. They had to pony up the future NL MVP to get him, but it shows big deals can be consummated in August.

http://www.nytimes.com/1992/08/28/sports/baseball-blue-jays-are-true-to-their-tradition-of-late-season-deals.html

B2theRY
08-01-2010, 12:24 AM
that is correct

Gibby
08-01-2010, 12:24 AM
They don't have to clear waivers for a deal to be made. The teams that are out of the races have little interest in Buck or Frasor.

even if they dont have interest they can be dicks about it. They know toronto isnt going to give up type B free agents with cheap salaries. they will go in with mindset at worst we will pay less than a million for supplementary round picks.

StealingSigns
08-01-2010, 12:28 AM
Oh man, this NY Times article is a blast from the past:


Jeff Kent, the primary player the Mets got for Cone, will very likely wind up as a utility infielder, an executive of another club said yesterday, and the player to be named, presumably Ryan Thompson, a six-year minor leaguer, is projected as a reserve outfielder at best. The Blue Jays will pay $910,714 of Cone's $4.25 million salary, but that's a relatively small premium to pay for post-season insurance, especially for a team that draws 4 million fans to the gold mine known as the Skydome.

Gibby
08-01-2010, 12:34 AM
Oh man, this NY Times article is a blast from the past:

The salary maybe why other teams didnt want to claim. that wont be problem with buck and frasor.

I could see some guy like Overbay involved in a waiver deal though

StealingSigns
08-01-2010, 12:34 AM
even if they dont have interest they can be dicks about it. They know toronto isnt going to give up type B free agents with cheap salaries. they will go in with mindset at worst we will pay less than a million for supplementary round picks.

That is always a possibility, but keep in mind almost every player goes on waivers. Teams usually place ALL their players on waivers for this very reason, just to cause chaos and confusion to combat this type of waiver signing. There are a lot of players on the bubble, so teams will not be just targeting the jays in this scenario.

You raise a good point. Somehow waiver deals always seem to trickle through though each August.

boilerguy2412
08-01-2010, 06:51 AM
teams like the O's and Royals wouldn't put claims on guys like Buck or Fraser, it just doesn't happen. The only time a team may claim someone is if they don't want another team to get him, see Randy Myers. Even in the odd chance that they do the Jays would work out a trade with another team anyways that they wanted to trade him to. Kazmir was traded last in August.

Gibby
08-02-2010, 12:34 AM
teams like the O's and Royals wouldn't put claims on guys like Buck or Fraser, it just doesn't happen. The only time a team may claim someone is if they don't want another team to get him, see Randy Myers. Even in the odd chance that they do the Jays would work out a trade with another team anyways that they wanted to trade him to. Kazmir was traded last in August.

Kazmir was a differrent story because of his salary.
10:$8M, 11:$12M, 12:$13.5M club option ($2.5M buyout)

Teams like Os and Royals were afraid Rays were just doing a salary dump and were scared to claim him and get stuck with that contract.

but the jays players were talking about make a fraction of what kazmir make so teams wont be afraid to claim him. Teams know a salary dump of players like Frasor,Buck doesnt make sense, expecially since the cost the rest of the year is minimal and they have type B status.

Nofear
08-02-2010, 08:35 AM
Forget the trades, lets reinstall this policy


Last season, the Blue Jays acquired Tom Candiotti on June 27; in 1990, they traded for Bud Black on Sept. 17. They won the division championship last year but lost the year before. Three-Year Rule

They lost both players to free agency. The reason: the so-called club policy against giving pitchers contracts for more than three years. Black and Candiotti each wanted more than three years, left the Blue Jays and got four, Black from San Francisco and Candiotti from Los Angeles.

A Vernon Wells three year deal. Thats better than anything we'll ever get for Buck, Frasor, Gregg or Downs.

T.O. Fan
08-02-2010, 09:40 AM
I'd say Overbay and possibly Frasor are the most likely to be moved before the waiver deadline.

B2theRY
08-02-2010, 02:15 PM
teams like the O's and Royals wouldn't put claims on guys like Buck or Fraser, it just doesn't happen. The only time a team may claim someone is if they don't want another team to get him, see Randy Myers. Even in the odd chance that they do the Jays would work out a trade with another team anyways that they wanted to trade him to. Kazmir was traded last in August.

why not?
they'll get picks if the player turns down arbritation.

conway429
08-02-2010, 02:33 PM
Oh man, this NY Times article is a blast from the past:

hah thats funny, thats the same thing that stuck out in my mind when I read the article...
things were so different 20 yrs ago

wowzman
08-03-2010, 01:16 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/jon_heyman/08/02/waivers.trades/index.html

A selection of players that are may be involved in waiver deadline deals. Both Bautista (not likely) and Vernon (possible but has NTC) are mentioned.

GNick
08-03-2010, 01:31 PM
If catcher goes down on another team see chance Buck gets moved for top prospect. But little chance for Frazer or Downs gets moved

BlueJayFanDan
08-03-2010, 02:57 PM
I am pretty convinced Buck will be moved at some point.

2009mvp
08-03-2010, 03:00 PM
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/jon_heyman/08/02/waivers.trades/index.html

A selection of players that are may be involved in waiver deadline deals. Both Bautista (not likely) and Vernon (possible but has NTC) are mentioned.

A team would have to have some pretty big balls to put a claim on Vernon.

anotherqtip420
08-03-2010, 07:02 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&page=starting9/100803

What you guys think if AA put in a claim for Chone Figgins and made him our new 3rd baseman??? Alot of $$$ money left on his deal but he would give us alot more speed at the top of the line up. I'd personally take a shot on him and hope a change of scenery would help.

Bob Loblaw
08-03-2010, 07:10 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&page=starting9/100803

What you guys think if AA put in a claim for Chone Figgins and made him our new 3rd baseman??? Alot of $$$ money left on his deal but he would give us alot more speed at the top of the line up. I'd personally take a shot on him and hope a change of scenery would help.

Would not like that at all.

Eagles4Lyfe
08-03-2010, 07:40 PM
ya i wouldnt approve either we have lewis and can fill that position with a younger cheaper guy, figgens has struggled this year for the most part so i wouldnt take the chance on that hefty contract...
AA was on the fan and hes like its harder to make deals through waiver so he doesnt expect anything really significant to happen and he said theres offers on tables that he would look at in the summer time if their still there

BlueJayCarter
08-03-2010, 07:47 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&page=starting9/100803

What you guys think if AA put in a claim for Chone Figgins and made him our new 3rd baseman??? Alot of $$$ money left on his deal but he would give us alot more speed at the top of the line up. I'd personally take a shot on him and hope a change of scenery would help.

I would not like that move at all ... it doesn't make any sense for Blue Jays to do that.

BlueJayCarter
08-03-2010, 07:48 PM
Overbay might be moved . . . But I don't see to much.