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View Full Version : How should the draft order or lottery be decided?



LTBaByyy
07-31-2010, 03:43 AM
It seems like there is something fishy about the lottery balls being chosen
bc they never show them pick the team live, they just show the team on a card after all the teams been picked, didnt they used to choose the ping pong balls live?

How would you go about the draft order? Especially the lottery...

VIP1349
07-31-2010, 03:49 AM
Yeah it can seem fishy sometimes this year we had that girl whose husband died from Washington there and she won it, Chicago some how ending up with the 1st pick to take hometown boy Rose, there's been a few times that it's like how'd that happen. But don't really mind my Nuggets take the draft year after year. Would be cool to see the balls pop out, would be cooler that way.

carson005
07-31-2010, 03:53 AM
The odds of the lottery are kind of out of wack, in the NHL the team who finishes last has like an 90% chance of getting the #1 pick

abe_froman
07-31-2010, 03:53 AM
same.you'll never stop people from believing in conspiracy theories as long as they want to.so why change to accommodate those that will never be satisfied?

Sandman
07-31-2010, 03:55 AM
It seems like there is something fishy about the lottery balls being chosen
bc they never show them pick the team live, they just show the team on a card after all the teams been picked, didnt they used to choose the ping pong balls live?

How would you go about the draft order? Especially the lottery...

well the lottery came about because it was decided that a team shouldnt be able to tank for the #1 pick but at the same time, the worst teams should get first crack at new players. any solution has to meet those two guidelines.

maybe there shouldn't be as many teams in the lottery. say 4 or 5. if that.

abe_froman
07-31-2010, 03:58 AM
The odds of the lottery are kind of out of wack, in the NHL the team who finishes last has like an 90% chance of getting the #1 pick

a players impact on the outcome of games(and impact on a franchise's fortunes as a whole)are alot greater in the nba than nhl.

nhl-you get the 1st pick in the draft,well good chance your team is still in the basement
nba-1st pick in the draft,you'll probably be perennial contenders for most of the next 10 years ,unless you **** up badly

bholly
07-31-2010, 04:03 AM
They don't show it live on TV because they want to make a show out of revealing the cards. They do, however, have a representative from every team in the room to watch it happen, along with others. Are you suggesting some teams are sending guys who agree to their team being screwed as part of some sort of conspiracy?

DodgerBulls
07-31-2010, 04:05 AM
I think the best way is for them to play a basketball video game. That way, its video game skills but has to be played in front of live fans. They can't conspire, the NBA, just depends on the team's video game player.

VIP1349
07-31-2010, 04:07 AM
They don't show it live on TV because they want to make a show out of revealing the cards. They do, however, have a representative from every team in the room to watch it happen, along with others. Are you suggesting some teams are sending guys who agree to their team being screwed as part of some sort of conspiracy?
You saying you trust Chris Webber?

DodgerBulls
07-31-2010, 04:08 AM
They don't show it live on TV because they want to make a show out of revealing the cards. They do, however, have a representative from every team in the room to watch it happen, along with others. Are you suggesting some teams are sending guys who agree to their team being screwed as part of some sort of conspiracy?

The balls can however be rigged, heavier balls than light ones.. just like when u heat the dice in casinos...

Sandman
07-31-2010, 04:17 AM
a players impact on the outcome of games(and impact on a franchise's fortunes as a whole)are alot great in the nba than nhl.

nhl-you get the 1st pick in the draft,well good chance your team is still in the basement
nba-1st pick in the draft,you'll probably be perennial contenders for most of the next 10 years ,unless you **** up badly

depends on the year. i think the NHL 1st pick would be more of a sure thing, whereas the NBA 1st pick has more potential to flop.

From 97-07

Tim Duncan
Michael Olowokandi
Elton Brand
Kenyon Martin
Kwame Brown
Yao Ming
LeBron James
Dwight Howard
Andrew Bogut
Andrea Bargnani
Greg Oden

Joe Thornton
Vincent Lecavalier
Patrik Stefan
Rick DiPietro
Ilya Kovalchuk
Rick Nash
Marc-Andre Fleury
Alexander Ovechkin
Sidney Crosby
Erik Johnson
Patrick Kane

With the exception of DiPietro, all these guys are still top players. And DiPietro's been banged up bad, its not because of talent. Could compare him to both Yao and Oden.

Sandman
07-31-2010, 04:18 AM
They don't show it live on TV because they want to make a show out of revealing the cards. They do, however, have a representative from every team in the room to watch it happen, along with others. Are you suggesting some teams are sending guys who agree to their team being screwed as part of some sort of conspiracy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mN3OGRGybA

gbpackers12
07-31-2010, 04:20 AM
I actually like the draft the way it is for the NBA. I say leave it alone.

abe_froman
07-31-2010, 04:24 AM
depends on the year. i think the NHL 1st pick would be more of a sure thing, whereas the NBA 1st pick has more potential to flop.

From 97-07

Tim Duncan
Michael Olowokandi
Elton Brand
Kenyon Martin
Kwame Brown
Yao Ming
LeBron James
Dwight Howard
Andrew Bogut
Andrea Bargnani
Greg Oden

Joe Thornton
Vincent Lecavalier
Patrik Stefan
Rick DiPietro
Ilya Kovalchuk
Rick Nash
Marc-Andre Fleury
Alexander Ovechkin
Sidney Crosby
Erik Johnson
Patrick Kane

With the exception of DiPietro, all these guys are still top players. And DiPietro's been banged up bad, its not because of talent. Could compare him to both Yao and Oden.
i guess i was saying it badly.my point wasnt "sure thing" or not,or that nhl number 1 picks had a sketchier history of being top level guys.my point was top level player in the nba has a greater impact(basically get one top level guy and your set,just get not so bad guys around him and your a contender).where as in the nhl you need more than just one great player to have championship dreams

for example:

get a young tim duncan+a bunch of retards,your making the playoffs(maybe a contender)
get alex ovechin and a bunch of retards,your still in the basement

Sandman
07-31-2010, 04:28 AM
Ok, I think we're on the same page. In the NBA one guy can be a difference maker, way more so than in other sports. Where in the NHL a lot of those guys haven't been on good teams, the NBA picks that went well, went far.

Kyben36
07-31-2010, 05:02 AM
rock paper sizors tourny

Kevj77
07-31-2010, 05:21 AM
Part of the reason we got the lottery was how the Lakers acquired Magic and Worthy. Lakers ended up with the top pick from a trade as defending champions just a few years after taking Magic with the top pick. The Magic pick was compensation for another team signing a FA. Teams used to have to give up draft picks to sign FA.

The lottery made it so that would likely never happen again, teams can protect lottery picks in trades and to discourage tanking. The lottery is fine and not rigged. It's just based to much on luck.

SugeKnight
07-31-2010, 05:30 AM
NFL style wouldnt work, but how bout 2 separate lotteries. A lottery for 1-7 and 8-14. 1-7 have the lottery for the first pick and 8-14 have a lottery for the eighth pick. All teams have an even chance to win their lottery

John Walls Era
07-31-2010, 05:41 AM
I don't mind it that much. You're still guaranteed a top 3 pick if you are the worst team in the league.

bholly
07-31-2010, 05:41 AM
You saying you trust Chris Webber?

Sure. But why? Was he a team's representative or something?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mN3OGRGybA

Have you seen the pingpong ball machine? You really think they're controlling which balls come out?
Pretty sure the whole reason of using it is because it's clearly not controllable - so they can avoid the frozen/bent envelope arguments.

magichatnumber9
07-31-2010, 06:55 AM
The lottery keeps teams from tanking. At least that's the theory behind it. Stupid if you ask me.

Khalifa21
07-31-2010, 09:01 AM
I think they're should be a higher chance of the number 1 pick for the worst team, maybe something like a 30-40% chance.

How many times has the worst team got the number 1 pick? The last time I can remember was the Cavs in 2003.

arkanian215
07-31-2010, 10:49 AM
It seems like there is something fishy about the lottery balls being chosen
bc they never show them pick the team live, they just show the team on a card after all the teams been picked, didnt they used to choose the ping pong balls live?

How would you go about the draft order? Especially the lottery...

It's not done live probably because the way they decide the first pick is anti climatic. If you watched the pre-lotto coverage they show how the order is decided. It's much more interesting to go from 14 to 1 instead of 1 down to 14. There's an auditor from Ernst and Young in there as reps from each team.

I'm guessing those same reps are the folks who sit out on stage during the "reveal" so they know who won already when they're out there.

JWO35
07-31-2010, 11:54 AM
Why can't they just have a tournament for the #1 overall pick. Single elimination NCAA Style tournament....The worst teams would be the highest seeds(which means homecourt advantage throughout).

daleja424
07-31-2010, 11:57 AM
I like the lottery. I think that it doesnt reward the floppers.

I do think it would be cool for them to do it live though. The only thing is that they way they do it is by numbers, like a real lottery, so it would be tricky.

hgtiger32
07-31-2010, 12:09 PM
I don't mind it that much. You're still guaranteed a top 3 pick if you are the worst team in the league.

haha nice sig dude

Bryrob58
07-31-2010, 12:18 PM
No team should be able to rise or drop more than 3 spots, and it should only be 6 teams or so. That would mean that #1 could have #3 at worst, and #6 could have #4 at best. Also, #1 should have more than a 50% chance of getting the #1 pick.

#1 - 51%
#2 - 29%
#3 - 20%

Since #4,5, and 6 can't move up to #1, you put their pick pong balls in according to what pick it is. #4 would be introduced after #1 was established. #5 comes in after #2 is picked. And so on.

Any feedback?

Tmath
07-31-2010, 12:43 PM
I find it fishy the year the the rules changed where you couldn't sign high school players is when the raptors got the number 1 pick. We could of had Durant.

xbrackattackx
07-31-2010, 12:55 PM
Gm's in Cage Matches is the only right answer.

DCSportsIsPain
07-31-2010, 12:55 PM
It isn't as simple as just throwing the balls into the hopper and drawing them out.
There are more of some numbers than of others. That is how the lottery is weighted.
Which teams get which numbers is based upon their seasons standings.
It would be very difficult to rig the lottery when the manner in which it is weighted requires 1,000 different combinations to be assigned to the 13 draft lottery teams.

How The NBA Draft Lottery Works (http://www.nba.com/features/lottery2004_details.html)

DerekRE_3
07-31-2010, 01:04 PM
Even though the Kings get screwed every lottery I don't mind it. It got us Tyreke and Cousins, and last year we only moved down 2 spots, an improvement to the 3 spots we moved down in 2009.

DenButsu
07-31-2010, 01:15 PM
I really don't have a problem with how it's run now. I think there's a pretty good balance between redistribution of talent, and not guaranteeing the success of taking a dive. Factors like that will always be at odds with each other, but the medium that has been struck now is a pretty happy one, I think. I definitely agree with the basic prinicples that teams that don't make the playoffs are in the lottery, and teams that do aren't; and that the odds for getting a higher pick increase in proportion to how bad the team's season was - but not so much that it's direct or guaranteed.

I'm not saying the system *couldn't* be improved upon. But as is, it seems pretty reasonable and fair to me.

Chacarron
07-31-2010, 01:34 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mN3OGRGybA

Interesting video.

xbrackattackx
07-31-2010, 01:36 PM
Lightsaber Duels.

j-bay
07-31-2010, 01:41 PM
tazer gun matches
capture the flag
dodgeball
ping pong

HiphopRelated
07-31-2010, 02:19 PM
It's fine how it is

LTBaByyy
07-31-2010, 03:55 PM
They need to figure something out lol there's a lot of coincendences for the 1st picks lately

bholly
07-31-2010, 06:29 PM
It's not done live probably because the way they decide the first pick is anti climatic. If you watched the pre-lotto coverage they show how the order is decided. It's much more interesting to go from 14 to 1 instead of 1 down to 14. There's an auditor from Ernst and Young in there as reps from each team.

I'm guessing those same reps are the folks who sit out on stage during the "reveal" so they know who won already when they're out there.

Nope, those guys have no idea either. The guys who get sent are usually GMs/owners/presidents in order to legitimize it, and once they're in the room they're locked in (no cellphones or anything) until the show is over and it's public.
You can see the types of people in the room in 2009 here:
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/05/15/givony.draftcolumn.lottery/index.html

jrm2054
07-31-2010, 07:21 PM
I think it should only be the 5 worst teams and go
worst team has 35% chance
2nd 25%
3rd 20%
4th 10%
5th 10%

NYKalltheway
07-31-2010, 07:42 PM
I think it should only be the 5 worst teams and go
worst team has 35% chance
2nd 25%
3rd 20%
4th 10%
5th 10%


5 teams, all 20% chance. So that no team wanting to have the worse record.

_Supreme_
07-31-2010, 09:28 PM
They should just get rid of the whole shady lottery and do it like the NFL does it.

Sadds The Gr8
07-31-2010, 09:51 PM
they should just show the lottery draws live. It's stupid that they don't


They should just get rid of the whole shady lottery and do it like the NFL does it.

then there'd be hardcore tanking.

IDB Josh M
07-31-2010, 10:23 PM
Why can't they just have a tournament for the #1 overall pick. Single elimination NCAA Style tournament....The worst teams would be the highest seeds(which means homecourt advantage throughout).

That's actually not a bad idea. They should call it the toilet bowl.

knickerbockerny
07-31-2010, 10:23 PM
I think the NBA should place some type of substantial player bonus based on were your team finishes in the conference seeding, each player and coach receive the same amount. Then players on the teams who miss the players don't get the bonus. This would force teams/players to give it their all and try to make the playoffs and grab the bonus.

And after that have a lottery between the 1st through 3rd worst teams. Each team has a 33% shot at the first pick. The remaining lottery picks and picks in general are determined based on record.

There has to be some kind of incentive for the players to make the playoffs, the owners have (playoffs revenue), but the players don't have any.

Mochalman
07-31-2010, 10:25 PM
put every team in the lottery, make it more interesting. I wanna see a top 5 team with the number 1 pick.

knickerbockerny
07-31-2010, 10:26 PM
That's actually not a bad idea. They should call it the toilet bowl.

That would exactly be exciting, the owners and fans would love this.

Shahrose
08-01-2010, 01:53 AM
it should be like the nfl and the worst team, record-wise, should get the first pick. dont they "deserve" it?

blastmasta26
08-01-2010, 02:02 AM
it should be like the nfl and the worst team, record-wise, should get the first pick. dont they "deserve" it?
They do, in a sense, but the whole reason the lottery was developed was to prevent tanking for the 1st pick.

put every team in the lottery, make it more interesting. I wanna see a top 5 team with the number 1 pick.
That would be very interesting, but it would kill any other team's chances of competing. Imagine if the Lakers got John Wall?

Mochalman
08-01-2010, 05:17 AM
That would be very interesting, but it would kill any other team's chances of competing. Imagine if the Lakers got John Wall?

be a whole lot better than going to the Wizards

jmtapia
08-01-2010, 05:19 AM
only bottom 5 have a shot at the Top 5 picks.

blastmasta26
08-01-2010, 10:10 AM
Mochalman, I disagree. John Wall can basically save the franchise, he would've made the Lakers unstoppable. Even Miami would have trouble with LA. The lottery system intends to make the NBA more balanced, including all teams would defeat the purpose. I think the lottery system is fine, but they shoild show the whole process live to prevent any allegations of fixing it.

dbeastly
08-01-2010, 10:12 AM
The way the NFL does it. Because of what happened with the Bulls a few years ago.