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View Full Version : If Lebron's a "quitter" or whatever, then what's D-Wade?



davids22
07-12-2010, 06:40 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 06:50 PM
Wade was never perceived to be such a douche. More people like him, so that obviously helps. But there's more than just that. Lebron made us think he wanted to chase MJ, then quit that pursuit. It died July 8th. If he just wants to win, that's fine with me. But if you make the decision to chase MJ and then go to MIA (killing his chances), you quit that chase. He quit his chase of MJ, not the Cavs. Wade never marketed himself as someone who was interested in the chase.

And to the people to think that MJ played w/ talent so this doesn't kill Lenron;s chances: Wade is too good to be a sidekick to the greatest. He is a superstar. If Lebron had signed w/ the Knicks and joined Amare or lured Bosh to CLE, he would still be in the chase. Because those are sidekicks. Wade is a top 3 NBA player - Pippen never was. Playing w/ talent is a necesity. But a sidekick of Wade's caliber is too much.

PLAYERS FAN
07-12-2010, 06:52 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

Jaji
07-12-2010, 07:01 PM
Wade was never perceived to be such a douche. More people like him, so that obviously helps. But there's more than just that. Lebron made us think he wanted to chase MJ, then quit that pursuit. It died July 8th. If he just wants to win, that's fine with me. But if you make the decision to chase MJ and then go to MIA (killing his chances), you quit that chase. He quit his chase of MJ, not the Cavs. Wade never marketed himself as someone who was interested in the chase.

And to the people to think that MJ played w/ talent so this doesn't kill Lenron;s chances: Wade is too good to be a sidekick to the greatest. He is a superstar. If Lebron had signed w/ the Knicks and joined Amare or lured Bosh to CLE, he would still be in the chase. Because those are sidekicks. Wade is a top 3 NBA player - Pippen never was. Playing w/ talent is a necesity. But a sidekick of Wade's caliber is too much.

Actually, LeBron is chasing Warren Buffet more than MJ.

But anyways, your complete dissing of Scottie Pippen tells me you either a) are 15 or b) have a basketball IQ comparable to Kobe Bryant's shooting percentage in game 7.

Scottie Pippen was a 3x All-NBA 1st teamer and a member of the 50th anniversary team. He's also a HOFer, something Amare and Bosh will never be.

Dwyane Wade is NOT on LeBron's level. Period.

valade16
07-12-2010, 07:01 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

So I guess those guys never wanted Pippen, Shaq, gasol, or McHale on their teams eh? :eyebrow:

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:01 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

this crap gets old. None of them are quitters. People who are quitters are people like Shaq who quit on the Heat mid season and end up being traded to a contender. I've been a heat fan since day one and my favorite players went Glen Rice to Alonzo Mourning to Dwyane Wade. If Wade would have left the Heat to Chicago it would have sucked but no way would i sit around and call him a quitter because he changed teams for better chances at winning a title. Anyone who sits around and criticizes these players for putting themselves in the best position to win and be happy is simply bitter. the end

northsider
07-12-2010, 07:02 PM
A mastermind.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:05 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

this is sooooo comical. Did he not ask to be traded after losing in the playoffs after shaq left?????? Funny how you guys put Kobe on this pedestal of almighty loyalty when its far from the case. No Gasol no contract extension from Kobe believe that. Kobe is a legend on the court but as for this so called loyalty thing, stop.

shen
07-12-2010, 07:08 PM
Wade plays heart out every game. Lebron just didn't seem to care in Celtics series. Wade already got his ring. Wade is far more mentally tough then James.

Wade could have gone elsewhere to team up with Lebron but chose to be loyal. I would take Wade over Lebron any day of the week.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 07:08 PM
Actually, LeBron is chasing Warren Buffet more than MJ.

But anyways, your complete dissing of Scottie Pippen tells me you either a) are 15 or b) have a basketball IQ comparable to Kobe Bryant's shooting percentage in game 7.

Scottie Pippen was a 3x All-NBA 1st teamer and a member of the 50th anniversary team. He's also a HOFer, something Amare and Bosh will never be.

Dwyane Wade is NOT on LeBron's level. Period.

I never said that they were as good as Pippen. But Wade is too good as a #2 player for a GOAT. Wade is the 3rd best player in the NBA. Pippen was an amazing player. But he was never as good (in relation to his peers) as Wade is. Part of that is Pippen was in MJ's shadow for his prime and was never given the chance to be a #1 like Wade has. Pippen, while he could have been a #1 for a very good team (IMO), was never one, except for a two year stretch when MJ retired. That's fact. Wade has been a #1 player on a title team. That's why he is too accomplished individually to be a sidekick for the GOAT.

michelangelo
07-12-2010, 07:10 PM
The differences are as follows:

1. the expectations for Wade are much lower: he's never been considered to be the great all around player mentioned in the same breath as Kobe or LeBron, much less Michael Jordan

2. he didn't hold a press conference in prima donna drama queen fashion to announce his free agency signing decision.

3. he's already won a ring.

4. he stayed with, rather than leaving, his original team.

5. his conduct overall, shows fewer signs of vanity.

6. he's taken nasty hits on the court, and gets back up without complaint. LeBron winces and exaggerates "injuries" as an easy excuse if he doesn't win, which invariably happens during playoff time.

7. Wade is not as gifted, and therefore, incites less envy.

In other words, there is convincing and broad evidence that points to a lack of character in LeBron, and an abundance of it with Wade.

Heck, Wade even managed to get along with Shaq, who is NOTORIOUS for calling out "his" star 2 guards. :)

DKGiants
07-12-2010, 07:11 PM
D-Wade is awesome. im a Knicks fan and I actually love D-Wade and how he portrays himself to the media and the fans. hes a standup guy, might be sneaky behind closed doors but i wouldnt know seems like he might be just from hanging out with Pat Riley too much lol who knows.

Nothing is D-Wade's fault.. I'd shake his hand if i saw him just because he knew that if he brought Lebron and Bosh to HIS TEAM and HIS CITY that he'd win a bunch of championships. He is starting to hit that age where hes not gonna be able to take out top teams by himself and he knew that bringing Lebron and Bosh he would be a beast for even more years to come then if he was alone. Also why would he leave Miami when they are gonna retire his number eventually? he brought them there 1st title along with shaq..

Now I used to love Lebron even more then Wade but I didnt realize until after "The Decision" that Lebron's actually a coward. yes i was mad that he didnt come to NY, but its not that. Just how he seemed in interviews like he was hot sh1t and he seemed to me like a scumbag and a low life. lost all respect for him and Bosh just sucks. he got lucky with being on that team..

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:13 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

here's a link in case you need reminding of how Kobe has to be called a quitter also if they call Wade, Lebron or Bosh quitters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIGaKTvBVY&feature=related

Said he wants to be traded for two reason. to be on a team that is a contender and because of the whole why was shaq traded fiasco.

PLAYERS FAN
07-12-2010, 07:15 PM
So I guess those guys never wanted Pippen, Shaq, gasol, or McHale on their teams eh? :eyebrow:

None of those guys was a two-time MVP and a rival competitor. This is not a knock on Wade. Their was a reason Shaq luv playing with Wade than Kobe!

michelangelo
07-12-2010, 07:16 PM
While I tend to feel that the anti LeBron hate is completely overblown, it's pretty obvious that objective and valid criticism is coming from nearly all quarters, not just from Cleveland or the other teams and communities he's jilted.

Many, many sports journalists and fans are spewing criticism with an intensity, in a volume, with a level of vile which is almost without precedent.

Even when athletes such as Kobe Bryant and OJ Simpson were accused of very serious moral and criminal offenses, there were still supporters and sympathizers.

In the case of LeBron, NO ONE sympathizes and pretty much everyone outside of a limited number of Heat fans are absolutely indignant.

LeBron crossed the line, man.



D-Wade is awesome. im a Knicks fan and I actually love D-Wade and how he portrays himself to the media and the fans. hes a standup guy, might be sneaky behind closed doors but i wouldnt know seems like he might be just from hanging out with Pat Riley too much lol who knows.

Nothing is D-Wade's fault.. I'd shake his hand if i saw him just because he knew that if he brought Lebron and Bosh to HIS TEAM and HIS CITY that he'd win a bunch of championships. He is starting to hit that age where hes not gonna be able to take out top teams by himself and he knew that bringing Lebron and Bosh he would be a beast for even more years to come then if he was alone. Also why would he leave Miami when they are gonna retire his number eventually? he brought them there 1st title along with shaq..

Now I used to love Lebron even more then Wade but I didnt realize until after "The Decision" that Lebron's actually a coward. yes i was mad that he didnt come to NY, but its not that. Just how he seemed in interviews like he was hot sh1t and he seemed to me like a scumbag and a low life. lost all respect for him and Bosh just sucks. he got lucky with being on that team..

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:17 PM
D-Wade is awesome. im a Knicks fan and I actually love D-Wade and how he portrays himself to the media and the fans. hes a standup guy, might be sneaky behind closed doors but i wouldnt know seems like he might be just from hanging out with Pat Riley too much lol who knows.

Nothing is D-Wade's fault.. I'd shake his hand if i saw him just because he knew that if he brought Lebron and Bosh to HIS TEAM and HIS CITY that he'd win a bunch of championships. He is starting to hit that age where hes not gonna be able to take out top teams by himself and he knew that bringing Lebron and Bosh he would be a beast for even more years to come then if he was alone. Also why would he leave Miami when they are gonna retire his number eventually? he brought them there 1st title along with shaq..

Now I used to love Lebron even more then Wade but I didnt realize until after "The Decision" that Lebron's actually a coward. yes i was mad that he didnt come to NY, but its not that. Just how he seemed in interviews like he was hot sh1t and he seemed to me like a scumbag and a low life. lost all respect for him and Bosh just sucks. he got lucky with being on that team..

haha, that could be the case. Riley is a snake in the grass. We love our snake though.

DerekRE_3
07-12-2010, 07:18 PM
Wade already won a title and didn't leave his team.

PLAYERS FAN
07-12-2010, 07:21 PM
here's a link in case you need reminding of how Kobe has to be called a quitter also if they call Wade, Lebron or Bosh quitters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIGaKTvBVY&feature=related

Said he wants to be traded for two reason. to be on a team that is a contender and because of the whole why was shaq traded fiasco.

I don't see Wade wanting Lebron to play with him is being a quitter! I personally think the Heat was a contender when they got Bosh!

cheetos185
07-12-2010, 07:23 PM
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2010/07/11/covers/front071110.jpg

PLAYERS FAN
07-12-2010, 07:26 PM
this is sooooo comical. Did he not ask to be traded after losing in the playoffs after shaq left?????? Funny how you guys put Kobe on this pedestal of almighty loyalty when its far from the case. No Gasol no contract extension from Kobe believe that. Kobe is a legend on the court but as for this so called loyalty thing, stop.

When I say Jordan,Kobe and Bird minded. I'm saying having the main man mentality!

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:27 PM
While I tend to feel that the anti LeBron hate is completely overblown, it's pretty obvious that objective and valid criticism is coming from nearly all quarters, not just from Cleveland or the other teams and communities he's jilted.

Many, many sports journalists and fans are spewing criticism with an intensity, in a volume, with a level of vile which is almost without precedent.

Even when athletes such as Kobe Bryant and OJ Simpson were accused of very serious moral and criminal offenses, there were still supporters and sympathizers.

In the case of LeBron, NO ONE sympathizes and pretty much everyone outside of a limited number of Heat fans are absolutely indignant.

LeBron crossed the line, man.

it's because he did it on live tv and joined forces with Wade and Bosh. Had Lebron simply signed with the knicks this wouldnt be an issue. This man cant win. Everyone had it like this

going to NY to be in the biggest market where he would get huge endorsements
going to NJ and the owner that promised to make him a billionaire.
going to chicago in a big market and a solid core already in place.
Staying in Cleveland which is his home and could offer him the most money.
Nobody had him going to Miami other than stephen a smith and everyone called him crazy.

So Lebron turned down the larger markets, the chance at playing in NYC, CHI and also turned down more money from the cavs. He then signed for less money to play with the HEAT. How is this man crossing the line? if you ask me the only thing he did wrong was do it on live tv. Turned down so much to playfor less money with his friends and everyone hates him for it. If you ask me these media people and fans are the ones crossing the line. The only ones who have any right to anger towards lebron are cavs fans but that goes with ANY fan base that loses a start player. You know how many times thats happened in the history of sports. Too many.

greek miami hea
07-12-2010, 07:28 PM
one of the greatest of all times!(as lebron)

mser58
07-12-2010, 07:31 PM
this is sooooo comical. Did he not ask to be traded after losing in the playoffs after shaq left?????? Funny how you guys put Kobe on this pedestal of almighty loyalty when its far from the case. No Gasol no contract extension from Kobe believe that. Kobe is a legend on the court but as for this so called loyalty thing, stop.

No way, Kobe is like Jeter after these past two championships, he will always be a laker

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:32 PM
When I say Jordan,Kobe and Bird minded. I'm saying having the main man mentality!

Bird didnt do it by himself. Mchale, Parish and co would beg to differ. Jordan is the only one in my time who has been the main man and won other than maybe Wade in 06. Kobe had Shaq in his prime and couldnt win again until that ridiculous Gasol trade. Dont get me wrong. I love Kobe as a player because he is one of the best i've ever seen but i'm using him as an example of how even the great ones have the desire to change teams if their not happy with their current team. they shouldnt be hated for it. Nobody will ever be Jordan including Lebron and Co. Kobe is as close as it gets in terms of play but Kobe has been blessed with good supporting casts when he wins and a great coach. Lebron had mike brown

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:36 PM
No way, Kobe is like Jeter after these past two championships, he will always be a laker

I said "no gasol trade no contract extension" meaning had they not traded for gasol he wouldnt have signed again because no way the lakers win without gasol.. Listen to the clip i posted which was before the gasol trade. Kobe is a laker for life now. im not saying he's leaving but he would have had the lakers not went out and got him help. Kobe is not a loser and wouldnt not have continued to lose.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:41 PM
I don't see Wade wanting Lebron to play with him is being a quitter! I personally think the Heat was a contender when they got Bosh!

I hear ya, im just saying how can these guy be hated for wanting to play together. The mastermind behind all of this is Riley. He had this vision 3 years ago and heat fans were skeptical at first. These kinda of chances dont happen often and teh only reason it did was beacuse these 3 were drafted the same year and signed deals were they were all free agents at the same time. How can anyone not understand the excitement these guys probably had when they realized they could all play together. I would have done the same thing if i was lebron hands down. Cant imagine what playing with 3 good friends would be like. im sure they will have the time of their lives unless they lose of course.

bringinwood
07-12-2010, 07:44 PM
He's a cheerio...


All these " If this then what is that " questions remind me of the Netflix radio ads...

If Rome wasn't built in a day, what was ???

LMAO...

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 07:46 PM
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2010/07/11/covers/front071110.jpg

your sig comment is ridiculous. Do you even know your facts. that was on 4 hours notice and there was some 5,000 fans who werent even let in the building.

Bruno
07-12-2010, 07:48 PM
The LBJ MJ comparisons never made sense. LBJ is way more like Magic.

Kyben36
07-12-2010, 07:50 PM
the greatest thing is, if James woudl have stayed, and Bosh went to Houston ( or whatever ) this hole trator talk would be one wade, wade was very comited to Miami, but knew if things didnt turn out, he needed a backup plan, thats where Chicago and NY fell in. if it wasnt for Bosh going to Miami, there is a good chance that James doest go either ,with that said, Wade would probably leave, and Heat fans would be distraught. it would not be the same as James leaving his home town, but still, he would be a trator in a big way. Miami would be screwed.

HE is also known right now as the huge Douche bag who would do dirty recruiting behind the back of the NBA.

shep33
07-12-2010, 07:56 PM
Fans in Chicago are pretty upset at Wade, and I think he somehow slid under the radar of his actions, unlike LBJ.

I like Wade, but man I think it was a terrible move by him saying that he was interested in Chicago when he clearly wasn't. Everybody now knows that he and Bosh at the very least knew they'd join up for a couple months now. The whole "my family is in Chicago bit", i think was kinda low. If his kids were in Chicago, and he was obsessed on being with them there, as a father you would go in a heartbeat. But I'm pretty sure he's gonna get custody of them either way, crazy stuff with his wife I read/heard somewhere. But he was never serious about Chicago, and he probably should've never played the whole family bit out there... That's just my opinion though, I know i might get bashed for it, but I just think he should've left that out of the media.

Kyben36
07-12-2010, 07:59 PM
Fans in Chicago are pretty upset at Wade, and I think he somehow slid under the radar of his actions, unlike LBJ.

I like Wade, but man I think it was a terrible move by him saying that he was interested in Chicago when he clearly wasn't. Everybody now knows that he and Bosh at the very least knew they'd join up for a couple months now. The whole "my family is in Chicago bit", i think was kinda low. If his kids were in Chicago, and he was obsessed on being with them there, as a father you would go in a heartbeat. But I'm pretty sure he's gonna get custody of them either way, crazy stuff with his wife I read/heard somewhere. But he was never serious about Chicago, and he probably should've never played the whole family bit out there... That's just my opinion though, I know i might get bashed for it, but I just think he should've left that out of the media.

YOu can quote me to infinity, IF LBJ and Bosh went somewhere else, Wade would have left miami, because he would not want to play alone. with that said, it iddnt happen that way, but wade is not as loyal as people thing, he had a backup plan.

shep33
07-12-2010, 08:01 PM
I don't think Wade is a quitter, but like LBJ his legacy takes a hit. Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, never played with 2 of the top 10 players in the league, especially within a very weak eastern conference. If we're talking individual legacies then yeah it takes a hit, but I mean they can still be known as one of the best teams ever, no question about that.

But they have to win 3 rings in a row at least. They'll be looked at as "well Kobe and Shaq won 3 in a row, Mike had 2, 3-peats etc." They've got a lot of pressure on them, but they should be able to handle it I'd think.

Draco
07-12-2010, 08:01 PM
Wade was never perceived to be such a douche. More people like him, so that obviously helps. But there's more than just that. Lebron made us think he wanted to chase MJ, then quit that pursuit. It died July 8th. If he just wants to win, that's fine with me. But if you make the decision to chase MJ and then go to MIA (killing his chances), you quit that chase. He quit his chase of MJ, not the Cavs. Wade never marketed himself as someone who was interested in the chase.

And to the people to think that MJ played w/ talent so this doesn't kill Lenron;s chances: Wade is too good to be a sidekick to the greatest. He is a superstar. If Lebron had signed w/ the Knicks and joined Amare or lured Bosh to CLE, he would still be in the chase. Because those are sidekicks. Wade is a top 3 NBA player - Pippen never was. Playing w/ talent is a necesity. But a sidekick of Wade's caliber is too much.

Oh, there's enough hate to go around between Bosh, Wade and Lebron. All of them strung along teams with the possibility of signing when the only possibility they had in mind was Miami.

This has been rehashed over and over and the same people seem not to consider that Bosh and Wade were making documentaries and twittering obnoxious messages (perhaps the latter was only in Bosh's case) while making the recruiting process a charade. We can also speculate about tampering (In my mind, it's a certainty that Wade tampered while he was under contract.. whether that can be proven or not is irrelevant to me)

Hawkeye15
07-12-2010, 08:01 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

agreed dude

Hawkeye15
07-12-2010, 08:03 PM
I have said it before, LeBron is getting crapped on while Wade and Bosh are getting off scott free. This has been in the works for a while. They all three should be admired to a point, for forgoing egos, and needing to be the star. They obviously want to win, period.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:04 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

And Kobe can't be put on the same sentence with Jordan and Bird. Sorry but thanks to Shaq. On a side note: T-mac could win titles with this Lakers team as the Man. That's how good the Lakers as a team.

SF25
07-12-2010, 08:05 PM
Not a lot of people dislike Wade. He's great both on and off the court so a lot of people like him. I've actually never meant one person who dislikes him. He doesn't have the huge ego like LeBron or Kobe.

mdm692
07-12-2010, 08:05 PM
Simple if Lebron is a quitter D-wade is a savior...

the reason is lebron needs dwade more than wade needs lebron...

as you can see no matter how bad things get and how crappy his team is wade NEVER gives up...just look at how they were 2 games down in the finals of 2006...or maybe this years playoff series against the celtics...he never ever gave up always thought he had a chance...just look at his 40+ pt performance...

and on a side note wade only needed a good supporting cast plus a big man...thats why lebron is only on the ride to win a championship...

if lebron wanted to win a championship and solidify his career as one of the games greats he shoulda gone to new york where he would be the number one option...with a great supporting cast

D-Leethal
07-12-2010, 08:06 PM
Loyal to his franchise, and an NBA champion and finals MVP

heatfan03
07-12-2010, 08:08 PM
The differences are as follows:

1. the expectations for Wade are much lower: he's never been considered to be the great all around player mentioned in the same breath as Kobe or LeBron, much less Michael Jordan

2. he didn't hold a press conference in prima donna drama queen fashion to announce his free agency signing decision.

3. he's already won a ring.

4. he stayed with, rather than leaving, his original team.

5. his conduct overall, shows fewer signs of vanity.

6. he's taken nasty hits on the court, and gets back up without complaint. LeBron winces and exaggerates "injuries" as an easy excuse if he doesn't win, which invariably happens during playoff time.

7. Wade is not as gifted, and therefore, incites less envy.

In other words, there is convincing and broad evidence that points to a lack of character in LeBron, and an abundance of it with Wade.

Heck, Wade even managed to get along with Shaq, who is NOTORIOUS for calling out "his" star 2 guards. :)

to say wade hasn't been mentioned in the same breath as kobe lebron and MJ is ridiculous. You obviously don't watch the sport if you think this. lets remember the 2006 NBA finals performance wade put on which many say was better than Jordan did over a NBA finals series ala http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2008/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FinalsPerformances-1

think about what your saying here.

and to the OP Wade will damn well be remembered for his NBA Finals performance not just what happens with the "three kings"

uchiha
07-12-2010, 08:08 PM
remember when Kobe requested a trade? I do.

mdm692
07-12-2010, 08:11 PM
YOu can quote me to infinity, IF LBJ and Bosh went somewhere else, Wade would have left miami, because he would not want to play alone. with that said, it iddnt happen that way, but wade is not as loyal as people thing, he had a backup plan.

not really, if the head woulda signed say rudy gay and stoudemire or just stoudemire...hell even if they woulda signed boozer and a good supporting cast wade woulda stayed why cuz wade is a TRUE COMPETITOR he actually cares about winnig and thanks to lebron wades legacy will always be better than LBJ...

Championships=Greatness

Shaq and Kobe+great supporting cast=3
shaq and wade+descent supporting cast=1
shaq and lebron+good supporting cast=0

so when it comes to legacies
MJ>>KOBE>>>WADE>>>>LEBRON

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:15 PM
God some people are just haters!! Can't wait for the season to start and see the blowouts!

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 08:15 PM
remember when Kobe requested a trade? I do.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIGaKTvBVY&feature=related

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 08:15 PM
I hear ya, im just saying how can these guy be hated for wanting to play together. The mastermind behind all of this is Riley. He had this vision 3 years ago and heat fans were skeptical at first. These kinda of chances dont happen often and teh only reason it did was beacuse these 3 were drafted the same year and signed deals were they were all free agents at the same time. How can anyone not understand the excitement these guys probably had when they realized they could all play together. I would have done the same thing if i was lebron hands down. Cant imagine what playing with 3 good friends would be like. im sure they will have the time of their lives unless they lose of course.

No. He got lucky. He tried to deal for Artest. He tried to sign Odom. Those moves would have eliminated this possibility. He missed out on both. What he did great was rebounding in a big way.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 08:17 PM
I never said that they were as good as Pippen. But Wade is too good as a #2 player for a GOAT. Wade is the 3rd best player in the NBA. Pippen was an amazing player. But he was never as good (in relation to his peers) as Wade is. Part of that is Pippen was in MJ's shadow for his prime and was never given the chance to be a #1 like Wade has. Pippen, while he could have been a #1 for a very good team (IMO), was never one, except for a two year stretch when MJ retired. That's fact. Wade has been a #1 player on a title team. That's why he is too accomplished individually to be a sidekick for the GOAT.

I'm not talking about Pippen compared to Bosh and Stoudemire. I'm talking about Pippen compared to Wade. Wade is too good to be a sidekick? That's a slap in Pippen's face. Pippen is 3x All NBA 1st team. Wade has never done that. Wade as an undisputed #1 has never been out of the 1st round.

He won the Finals as Shaq's sidekick. He was the new Penny/Kobe. Sure he got Finals MVP but that's because a) Dallas had no one who could guard him and b) Shaq was there. It's like when a father lifts his son up closer to the basket to make it easier for him to make a shot. Wade has shown what he can do alone and its not much. Wade needs LeBron waaaayyyy more than LeBron needs Wade in terms of winning. Wade and company just got handled in the 1st round. Did you miss that? I know it was kinda brief.

mdm692
07-12-2010, 08:21 PM
God some people are just haters!! Can't wait for the season to start and see the blowouts!

there is no haters lebron is a big baby and heat would of been way better off without him...more money to have an actual good supporting cast...say lebron or bosh go down with an injury whose coming off the bench pat riley??

so far you guys have Chalmers/Wade/Lebron/Bosh/Hasslem/Miller

what is that a 6 man rotation

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 08:21 PM
No. He got lucky. He tried to deal for Artest. He tried to sign Odom. Those moves would have eliminated this possibility. He missed out on both. What he did great was rebounding in a big way.

the only thing that wouldnt have happened is Lebron. If Miami got Odom/artest we would have signed Bosh and Wade. The point is Riley planned this 3 years ago. didnt want any salaries that went beyond 2010. Say what you want but Riley did plan for this it just happened to work out the Heat ended up with only Chalmer and his 800K contract on the payroll. that allowed him to make this happen.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 08:22 PM
Wade plays heart out every game. Lebron just didn't seem to care in Celtics series. Wade already got his ring. Wade is far more mentally tough then James.

Wade could have gone elsewhere to team up with Lebron but chose to be loyal. I would take Wade over Lebron any day of the week.

Delonte West was boning his mom. I could see if it was Rondo, then he would have lit it up. But your own teammate? That's low. I wouldn't have went all out for them (him) either to tell you the truth.

flimflamman
07-12-2010, 08:25 PM
Wade is fantastic. I am a Knicks fan and D Wade is a player you covet. He has shown the heart of a champion. He beat Lebron and then made him his assistant.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 08:27 PM
I'm not talking about Pippen compared to Bosh and Stoudemire. I'm talking about Pippen compared to Wade. Wade is too good to be a sidekick? That's a slap in Pippen's face. Pippen is 3x All NBA 1st team. Wade has never done that. Wade as an undisputed #1 has never been out of the 1st round.

He won the Finals as Shaq's sidekick. He was the new Penny/Kobe. Sure he got Finals MVP but that's because a) Dallas had no one who could guard him and b) Shaq was there. It's like when a father lifts his son up closer to the basket to make it easier for him to make a shot. Wade has shown what he can do alone and its not much. Wade needs LeBron waaaayyyy more than LeBron needs Wade in terms of winning. Wade and company just got handled in the 1st round. Did you miss that? I know it was kinda brief.

O my god no! Shaq was past his prime at the time. Wade was clearly #1.

And that's the key to my point. Pippen was a great player. He was a beast, even when MJ briefly left. He was an all-world defensive player. He revolutionized the "point forward" spot. But he never won as a #1. He was drafted by CHI while MJ was there. He was always a part of MJ's shadow. Wade has too much of a legacy ON HIS OWN to be a sidekick to a GOAT. Lebron can stilll be one of the best, but teaming up w/ such a highly accomplished sidekick will forever be a deterrent to him if he wants to be the GOAT. If you look at his past, Lebron has played into the attention of trying to become the best ever. That's why I argue the idea that he quit on the Cavs by leaving (he had every right to leave), but say instead that he quit on the legacy he sold us all that he was trying to build.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 08:29 PM
the only thing that wouldnt have happened is Lebron. If Miami got Odom/artest we would have signed Bosh and Wade. The point is Riley planned this 3 years ago. didnt want any salaries that went beyond 2010. Say what you want but Riley did plan for this it just happened to work out the Heat ended up with only Chalmer and his 800K contract on the payroll. that allowed him to make this happen.

Exactly. He planned for Bosh all along. I predicted that years ago. But I mean this Big 3 stuff was a product of a lot of chips falling into place (missed moves Riley tried for, Redd spurning CLE, Booz leaving).

drew_ellis_23
07-12-2010, 08:29 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

So to be a superstar, you can't have other superstars on your team? I view Wade the same. Nobody can win with a cast of crap around them. Lebron had a desent cast and they were maybe a player away from being a dynasty. He quit on them. Wade wanted to get more talent on his team so he went for the best. Being a superstar doesnt mean you can play with other superstars. That is like ugly people that hang out with uglier people to make them selves look better. So you are saying Wade plays with crappy players to make himself appear better? Wade stayed home. He could have split to the Bulls or something. He stayed loyal.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:30 PM
there is no haters lebron is a big baby and heat would of been way better off without him...more money to have an actual good supporting cast...say lebron or bosh go down with an injury whose coming off the bench pat riley??

so far you guys have Chalmers/Wade/Lebron/Bosh/Hasslem/Miller

what is that a 6 man rotation

Say Kobe and Gasol both go down with an injury....Say Jordan and Pippen go down with an injury...say mom and dad go down with an injury while having intercourse...who's is coming off the bench to give you birth??:facepalm::facepalm:

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 08:30 PM
there is no haters lebron is a big baby and heat would of been way better off without him...more money to have an actual good supporting cast...say lebron or bosh go down with an injury whose coming off the bench pat riley??

so far you guys have Chalmers/Wade/Lebron/Bosh/Hasslem/Miller

what is that a 6 man rotation

you fail to realize how good those 3 are. the fact they we still got Haslem and Miller with those 3 is amazing. we have like 80 million worth of talent and we're only paying them around 60 mil.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 08:32 PM
Exactly. He planned for Bosh all along. I predicted that years ago. But I mean this Big 3 stuff was a product of a lot of chips falling into place (missed moves Riley tried for, Redd spurning CLE, Booz leaving).

I will agree with that.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:33 PM
I'm not talking about Pippen compared to Bosh and Stoudemire. I'm talking about Pippen compared to Wade. Wade is too good to be a sidekick? That's a slap in Pippen's face. Pippen is 3x All NBA 1st team. Wade has never done that. Wade as an undisputed #1 has never been out of the 1st round.
He won the Finals as Shaq's sidekick. He was the new Penny/Kobe. Sure he got Finals MVP but that's because a) Dallas had no one who could guard him and b) Shaq was there. It's like when a father lifts his son up closer to the basket to make it easier for him to make a shot. Wade has shown what he can do alone and its not much. Wade needs LeBron waaaayyyy more than LeBron needs Wade in terms of winning. Wade and company just got handled in the 1st round. Did you miss that? I know it was kinda brief.


You sure your are on the right forum, talking basketball, and today is monday???

donthatemiami
07-12-2010, 08:37 PM
Sounds like the NBA version of The Day After Tomorrow.


Say Kobe and Gasol both go down with an injury....Say Jordan and Pippen go down with an injury...say mom and dad go down with an injury while having intercourse...who's is coming off the bench to give you birth??:facepalm::facepalm:

showtym24
07-12-2010, 08:44 PM
here's a link in case you need reminding of how Kobe has to be called a quitter also if they call Wade, Lebron or Bosh quitters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIGaKTvBVY&feature=related

Said he wants to be traded for two reason. to be on a team that is a contender and because of the whole why was shaq traded fiasco.

You fail to realize lebron was on a 60 win team. While kobe was stuck with a 45 win team with smush parker and kwame brown starting. :facepalm:

mdm692
07-12-2010, 08:45 PM
Say Kobe and Gasol both go down with an injury....Say Jordan and Pippen go down with an injury...say mom and dad go down with an injury while having intercourse...who's is coming off the bench to give you birth??:facepalm::facepalm:

truth is all fans that wet themselves for lebron will be whining and crying later when they dont win anything and get eliminated in the playoffs by either celtics magic, maybe even new york or the bulls. . .

showtym24
07-12-2010, 08:48 PM
And Kobe can't be put on the same sentence with Jordan and Bird. Sorry but thanks to Shaq. On a side note: T-mac could win titles with this Lakers team as the Man. That's how good the Lakers as a team.

Judging from these comments its likely you started following basketball last thursday. :laugh2:

mdm692
07-12-2010, 08:49 PM
you fail to realize how good those 3 are. the fact they we still got Haslem and Miller with those 3 is amazing. we have like 80 million worth of talent and we're only paying them around 60 mil.

yeah they are amazing...and it is a good deal but they also need to rest they are people what are the big three going to average 40+ min a night or what

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:51 PM
Judging from these comments its likely you started following basketball last thursday. :laugh2:

6/24 shooting and still win....Oh, well where is T-mac, Vinsanity, AI.....nvm ;)

drew_ellis_23
07-12-2010, 08:51 PM
Thunder will be putting these guys out every year in the finals very soon. Durant, Westbrook, Green is going to be the next dynasty. That team just needs a Center.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 08:51 PM
You fail to realize lebron was on a 60 win team. While kobe was stuck with a 45 win team with smush parker and kwame brown starting. :facepalm:

The Cavs still weren't a contender. What was their record against Boston and Orlando in the regular season?

There's really 2 reasons for LeBron's teams winning more. 1) The East is overall weaker than the West. 2) LeBron is better :D.

drew_ellis_23
07-12-2010, 08:52 PM
How so? The guy said "what if LeBron and Bosh both go down with an injury, what's gonna happen to the Heat?" So I replied the above. Now prove what you just said or else I would just assume you are another bitter and butthurt YELLOW.

If Lebron, and Bosh go down then you will have the 09/10 version of the Heat. Cause the rest of the team was crap. Wade and Haslem was really all they had.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:55 PM
truth is all fans that wet themselves for lebron will be whining and crying later when they dont win anything and get eliminated in the playoffs by either celtics magic, maybe even new york or the bulls. . .

How did you exactly quote me :confused: Your bitterness doesn't relate my post :facepalm:

RapOZo
07-12-2010, 08:59 PM
a hustler

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 08:59 PM
If Lebron, and Bosh go down then you will have the 09/10 version of the Heat. Cause the rest of the team was crap. Wade and Haslem was really all they had.

OK. I am assuming the chances of both Kobe and Gasol OR Rondo and Pierce OR Dwight and Jameer going down with an injury are equal to that of Bron and Bosh. So now tell me what's gonna happen to those teams. Are the gonna stay the same? Would the bulls win if Jordan and Pippen were injured? See how stupid of a comment you made?

WELCOME and ANYTIME ;)

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:00 PM
6/24 shooting and still win....Oh, well where is T-mac, Vinsanity, AI.....nvm ;)

Yup had to be last thursday.

drew_ellis_23
07-12-2010, 09:01 PM
OK. I am assuming the chances of both Kobe and Gasol OR Rondo and Pierce OR Dwight and Jameer going down with an injury are equal to that of Bron and Bosh. So now tell me what's gonna happen to those teams. Are the gonna stay the same? Would the bulls win if Jordan and Pippen were injured? See how stupid of a comment you made?

WELCOME and ANYTIME ;)

Blazers lost Oden, and Roy, and most other starters at one time or another so anything can happen.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:03 PM
You fail to realize lebron was on a 60 win team. While kobe was stuck with a 45 win team with smush parker and kwame brown starting. :facepalm:

Wow, So you're setting a level for when it's ok to quit? so it's ok to quit when your team blows but not ok if you win 60 games. Thats not what everyone is arguing about. they're calling him a quitter for leaving the cavs period. I'm not even saying Kobe is a quitter im just saying even the great Kobe wanted out at one point. And Wade never wanted out even when he won 15 games. true story. you act like the cavs were stacked or something. The lakers team was waaaaaaayy more stacked then Lebrons. These players have huge ego's and want to win. some are about money but most want to win. thats what Lebron is trying to do. nothing wrong with that no matter where the trio formed.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:04 PM
Thunder will be putting these guys out every year in the finals very soon. Durant, Westbrook, Green is going to be the next dynasty. That team just needs a Center.

haha,

Lebron > Durant ever will be
Wade > the rest of the Thunder combined.

the end

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:05 PM
The Cavs still weren't a contender. What was their record against Boston and Orlando in the regular season?

There's really 2 reasons for LeBron's teams winning more. 1) The East is overall weaker than the West. 2) LeBron is better :D.

Number 1 overall seed in the NBA but werent contenders? OK. Heat fans. Gotta love em.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 09:06 PM
O my god no! Shaq was past his prime at the time. Wade was clearly #1.

And that's the key to my point. Pippen was a great player. He was a beast, even when MJ briefly left. He was an all-world defensive player. He revolutionized the "point forward" spot. But he never won as a #1. He was drafted by CHI while MJ was there. He was always a part of MJ's shadow. Wade has too much of a legacy ON HIS OWN to be a sidekick to a GOAT. Lebron can stilll be one of the best, but teaming up w/ such a highly accomplished sidekick will forever be a deterrent to him if he wants to be the GOAT. If you look at his past, Lebron has played into the attention of trying to become the best ever. That's why I argue the idea that he quit on the Cavs by leaving (he had every right to leave), but say instead that he quit on the legacy he sold us all that he was trying to build.

Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now. He got a Finals MVP but if Shaq got it no one would be shocked. Shaq was still averaging 20 a game that year and there is NO WAY Miami wins that title without him. And what happened when Shaq left? Miami's "undisputed #1" couldn't get out of the 1st round in a weak Eastern conference. They were lucky not to be swept this past season.

LeBron is saving Wade's legacy. He will forever be known as LeBron's sidekick when its all said and done, there's no doubt about that. LeBron could have teamed up with a lot of guys and still been successful. LeBron carried his team to the Finals ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has proved he can't even get out of the first round by himself. And its not like Wade is a young buck like Durant. He's 3 and a half years older than LeBron. 2 years from now, he'll be in decline. Meanwhile LeBron is just entering his prime. Don't be shocked if LeBron wins some more titles after Wade is gone.

Basically what I'm saying is Pippen is over Wade. At least right now. Wade will undoubtedly add a few more ships to his resume as LeBron's sidekick but to say he's "too good to be a sidekick" is disrespectful to Pippen who accomplished way more.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 09:06 PM
Blazers lost Oden, and Roy, and most other starters at one time or another so anything can happen.

Exactly, that's why it's a BS argument against the Heat. It can happen to any team and that team wouldn't be the same if that happened.

First it was about filling out the roster and now after seeing that bench will be balanced enough, people have started saying these kinda "What if ...injury..." BS!

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:07 PM
Wow, So you're setting a level for when it's ok to quit? so it's ok to quit when your team blows but not ok if you win 60 games. Thats not what everyone is arguing about. they're calling him a quitter for leaving the cavs period. I'm not even saying Kobe is a quitter im just saying even the great Kobe wanted out at one point. And Wade never wanted out even when he won 15 games. true story. you act like the cavs were stacked or something. The lakers team was waaaaaaayy more stacked then Lebrons. These players have huge ego's and want to win. some are about money but most want to win. thats what Lebron is trying to do. nothing wrong with that no matter where the trio formed.

Pre 08? Not a chance in hell.

LA_Raiders
07-12-2010, 09:09 PM
Abut the same, he should have said something... Wade & Bosh + a core team thats an awesome team, to let LeBroom in, he looks like a coward too (ala Lebroom).

3 top 10 players in the same team is BS...

I wouldnt allow that even while playing for fun, I love the challenge to play the best, not play with the best...

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 09:09 PM
Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now.


Thanks for my future sig. I am just too excited to replace my BIG 3 sig with this one. But I am saving it for my next sig ;)

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:10 PM
Exactly, that's why it's a BS argument against the Heat. It can happen to any team and that team wouldn't be the same if that happened.

First it was about filling out the roster and now after seeing that bench will be balanced enough, people have started saying these kinda "What if ...injury..." BS!

no matter what we will be hated. If we win the title everyone will come up with 1,000 reasons to downgrade what we did. If we lose everyone will talk smack. This is new territory for heat fans as the lakers usually take up all the hate in the league. Has to be nice for lakers fans to have some other team take some of the hate. good lord people are negative and bitter

Viper2000
07-12-2010, 09:10 PM
injuries are a huge part of this; if Bynum doesn't come back strong from his knee injury or if LeBron gets "injured" in the playoffs again that can greatly affect things. Look at Game 6 when Perk went down for the Celts. the whole feeling of that series shifted immediately.

I don't blame LeBron for "chasing rings" although in '06 he did say that he would not do that; but I am very glad that many people will stop ranking him near MJ or Kobe for that matter. for Wade, nothing but upside. People don't think he's dooshy either; much more enjoyable guy. significantly more well spoken then LeBron. two words, media training

ldawg
07-12-2010, 09:11 PM
Wade is a home town hero has his own county...lol. Of all the super stars him and Duncan name is Flawless. He came into the league and made a man for himself no pay per view to see the man child etc. He will be a bigger Hero now that he brought the over hype, gifted Lebron jack of all trade a master of none to Follow him in Miami. When he is Done his name will for ever be the face of Miami a Legend For giving Miami their 1st title and getting Lebron over there. The owner need to give Wade shares for that. Lebron on the other hand was viewed as the best player to ever hit the NBA Mj, Magic Bird all in one. had the Nba in the Palm of his hand. His team lead the nba for two Seasons and he won MVP. With Shaq $$ off the books they could have add to what they had built but he Panic left in fear he would never lead his team. Its a bit weird to leave a top 4 team to Join another dudes team that were worst than yours. Why did he not lure Bosh or Amare? Seven years went up in flames No longer can he be considered a legend in his home town and worst not even Miami Because Wade already hand them their 1st title. He will be know as they guy who came to help Wade in Miami. However he will still be remembered for his talents, That you cannot take he walking triple dub machine. Look at Shaq team hoping and he left a bad taste when ever he leaves. but how can you ever forget shaq even if he don't have a home he can call his own that he built. Shaq has under achieve but he is biggest strongest guy to ever play in the nba and for that his name will always be remembered and he did earn 4 rings and many MVPs. But What team bows when he comes into town? He will never be a Legend and i think Lebron has cross that line. One ring with Cavs was bigger than the ones he might get in Miami.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:11 PM
Thanks for my future sig. I am just too excited to replace my BIG 3 sig with this one. But I am saving it for my next sig ;)

:clap:

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:12 PM
Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now. He got a Finals MVP but if Shaq got it no one would be shocked. Shaq was still averaging 20 a game that year and there is NO WAY Miami wins that title without him. And what happened when Shaq left? Miami's "undisputed #1" couldn't get out of the 1st round in a weak Eastern conference. They were lucky not to be swept this past season.

LeBron is saving Wade's legacy. He will forever be known as LeBron's sidekick when its all said and done, there's no doubt about that. LeBron could have teamed up with a lot of guys and still been successful. LeBron carried his team to the Finals ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has proved he can't even get out of the first round by himself. And its not like Wade is a young buck like Durant. He's 3 and a half years older than LeBron. 2 years from now, he'll be in decline. Meanwhile LeBron is just entering his prime. Don't be shocked if LeBron wins some more titles after Wade is gone.

Basically what I'm saying is Pippen is over Wade. At least right now. Wade will undoubtedly add a few more ships to his resume as LeBron's sidekick but to say he's "too good to be a sidekick" is disrespectful to Pippen who accomplished way more.

Wade is the better player. Stop kidding yourself.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 09:13 PM
Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now. He got a Finals MVP but if Shaq got it no one would be shocked. Shaq was still averaging 20 a game that year and there is NO WAY Miami wins that title without him. And what happened when Shaq left? Miami's "undisputed #1" couldn't get out of the 1st round in a weak Eastern conference. They were lucky not to be swept this past season.

LeBron is saving Wade's legacy. He will forever be known as LeBron's sidekick when its all said and done, there's no doubt about that. LeBron could have teamed up with a lot of guys and still been successful. LeBron carried his team to the Finals ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has proved he can't even get out of the first round by himself. And its not like Wade is a young buck like Durant. He's 3 and a half years older than LeBron. 2 years from now, he'll be in decline. Meanwhile LeBron is just entering his prime. Don't be shocked if LeBron wins some more titles after Wade is gone.

Basically what I'm saying is Pippen is over Wade. At least right now. Wade will undoubtedly add a few more ships to his resume as LeBron's sidekick but to say he's "too good to be a sidekick" is disrespectful to Pippen who accomplished way more.

There's no sense in having this argument if you can't accept that Wade was numero uno for the Heat in their only championship year. Because that's what it is all based on.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 09:16 PM
There's no sense in having this argument if you can't accept that Wade was numero uno for the Heat in their only championship year. Because that's what it is all based on.

I can't believe you kept going with a nonsense.

SwaggaIke
07-12-2010, 09:20 PM
It could be argued that Wade could do it w/ Bosh and a strong supporting cast (similar to LA's). Wade has done this thing before, I think his rep as a winner and one of the games fiercest competitors will be solidified w/ a couple more rings.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 09:21 PM
There's no sense in having this argument if you can't accept that Wade was numero uno for the Heat in their only championship year. Because that's what it is all based on.

He can be #1 but they still don't win it without Shaq. That's why I brought up Chauncey. He has a Finals MVP too. We've seen Wade "carry" a team by himself (meaning without Shaq) and its not that far. Pippen was much better at carrying the Bulls. And LeBron has shown what he can do with no help also. Wade is the only one out of the 3 (Pippen, James and Wade) that proved he can't carry a team by himself. He needed Shaq, the 2nd best center in the game at the time, to help him. Wade can be #1 all you want, but without #32, they would not have won the title.

All I'm saying is Pippen is better than Wade. It has nothing to do with who was #1 on that Heat squad. If you say Wade, fine, it's Wade. Still doesn't disprove my point. If Wade is too good to be a sidekick then MJ isn't even top 5 because Pippen was better than Wade.

KnicksorBust
07-12-2010, 09:22 PM
Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now. He got a Finals MVP but if Shaq got it no one would be shocked.

Wow. Wade has accomplished more already and he's 5 years younger. No one would be shocked that Shaq got the Finals MVP? Did you watch that series? :laugh: Wade had the 3rd highest scoring average in Finals History and I believe had the highest PER rating ever.


Abut the same, he should have said something... Wade & Bosh + a core team thats an awesome team, to let LeBroom in, he looks like a coward too (ala Lebroom).

3 top 10 players in the same team is BS...

I wouldnt allow that even while playing for fun, I love the challenge to play the best, not play with the best...

What if your closest friends are the best and instead of deciding if you should go 1 on 4 or pass to Anthony Parker and JJ Hickson, you can win titles with them for 5 years?

The only thing that bothers me is now his legacy will be so tainted playing on this dream team that LeBron can't ever crack the top 6 of all-time. He'll be lucky to crack the top 10 with the hit his accolodades are going to receive playing with Wade. Neither one can play at their highest level now. You think LeBron could possibly have had that 48 point game vs. Detroit if he had Wade there with him? Impossible.

Something that was supposed to be special for us as basketball fans has been taken away from us and it's frustrating for me. At least we still have Kobe. :speechless: WHAT DID I JUST SAY?

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 09:22 PM
to say wade hasn't been mentioned in the same breath as kobe lebron and MJ is ridiculous. You obviously don't watch the sport if you think this. lets remember the 2006 NBA finals performance wade put on which many say was better than Jordan did over a NBA finals series ala http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2008/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FinalsPerformances-1

think about what your saying here.

and to the OP Wade will damn well be remembered for his NBA Finals performance not just what happens with the "three kings"

Im sorry bro but D Wade is not on Kobe or Lebrons level

and you saying wade is in the same breath as MJ :facepalm:

Id take Durant over wade anyday

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:23 PM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: If Kobe didn;t have shaq or Gasol. he would have 0 rings. You lakers fans make it sound like Kobe won all 5 rings by himself:facepalm:

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:24 PM
Actually, LeBron is chasing Warren Buffet more than MJ.

But anyways, your complete dissing of Scottie Pippen tells me you either a) are 15 or b) have a basketball IQ comparable to Kobe Bryant's shooting percentage in game 7.

Scottie Pippen was a 3x All-NBA 1st teamer and a member of the 50th anniversary team. He's also a HOFer, something Amare and Bosh will never be.

Dwyane Wade is NOT on LeBron's level. Period.

:facepalm:

Byronicle
07-12-2010, 09:25 PM
that makes DWade a seducing Mistress

i guess DWade needs not 1 but 2!! count them, 2 superstars to win a championship lol Kobe just needed the supporting cast from Highschool Musical...3

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:26 PM
Im sorry bro but D Wade is not on Kobe or Lebrons level

and you saying wade is in the same breath as MJ :facepalm:

Id take Durant over wade anyday

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
I'd give you 1,000 more facepalms but your not worth the time. Wade isnt on MJ's level or Kobes for that matter (yet) but Lebron and Durant????? come on now. What has LBJ done besides win MVP's? Wade Avg nearly 30ppg winning a scoring title along with finals MVP where he had one of the best finals performances ever avg nearly 37 ppg in the 4 wins. Durant does 2 things score and score

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 09:26 PM
Im sorry bro but D Wade is not on Kobe or Lebrons level

and you saying wade is in the same breath as MJ :facepalm:

Id take Durant over wade anyday

Wait...Dirk on your avatar...2006...Choking....:cry::cry:

Oh, well I am surprised by your comment :rolleyes:

SwaggaIke
07-12-2010, 09:26 PM
Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now. He got a Finals MVP but if Shaq got it no one would be shocked. Shaq was still averaging 20 a game that year and there is NO WAY Miami wins that title without him. And what happened when Shaq left? Miami's "undisputed #1" couldn't get out of the 1st round in a weak Eastern conference. They were lucky not to be swept this past season.

LeBron is saving Wade's legacy. He will forever be known as LeBron's sidekick when its all said and done, there's no doubt about that. LeBron could have teamed up with a lot of guys and still been successful. LeBron carried his team to the Finals ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has proved he can't even get out of the first round by himself. And its not like Wade is a young buck like Durant. He's 3 and a half years older than LeBron. 2 years from now, he'll be in decline. Meanwhile LeBron is just entering his prime. Don't be shocked if LeBron wins some more titles after Wade is gone.

Basically what I'm saying is Pippen is over Wade. At least right now. Wade will undoubtedly add a few more ships to his resume as LeBron's sidekick but to say he's "too good to be a sidekick" is disrespectful to Pippen who accomplished way more.

One thing LeBron has had (at least in the regular season) is dead eye shooters surrounding him at all times. Wade hasn't really had that post Shaq. LeBron has had Parker, Gibson, Mo Williams, West and a few more marksmen during his tenure. Q Rich is probably the best shooter we've had post Shaq that could actually compete defensively. LeBron drives and the defense collapses he can depend on his shooters. Wade makes the same basketball play and rarely gets Cle's results. You haven't had to respect many on our supporting cast since '07. I'm not saying LeBron has had stellar supporting casts, but they have been reliable in regular season play.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:27 PM
Wades only finals appearance: 34 ppg 7 rpg 3 ast pg 46 fg pct
Lebrons only finals appearance: 22 ppg 7 rpg 6 ast pg 35 fg pct

Now who is pippen?

Ray_R
07-12-2010, 09:28 PM
not really, if the head woulda signed say rudy gay and stoudemire or just stoudemire...hell even if they woulda signed boozer and a good supporting cast wade woulda stayed why cuz wade is a TRUE COMPETITOR he actually cares about winnig and thanks to lebron wades legacy will always be better than LBJ...

Championships=Greatness

Shaq and Kobe+great supporting cast=3
shaq and wade+descent supporting cast=1
shaq and lebron+good supporting cast=0

so when it comes to legacies
MJ>>KOBE>>>WADE>>>>LEBRON

Age has alot to do with this.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:30 PM
Wades only finals appearance: 34 ppg 7 rpg 3 ast pg 46 fg pct
Lebrons only finals appearance: 22 ppg 7 rpg 6 ast pg 35 fg pct

Now who is pippen?

:clap::clap:

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 09:30 PM
He can be #1 but they still don't win it without Shaq. That's why I brought up Chauncey. He has a Finals MVP too. We've seen Wade "carry" a team by himself (meaning without Shaq) and its not that far. Pippen was much better at carrying the Bulls. And LeBron has shown what he can do with no help also. Wade is the only one out of the 3 (Pippen, James and Wade) that proved he can't carry a team by himself. He needed Shaq, the 2nd best center in the game at the time, to help him. Wade can be #1 all you want, but without #32, they would not have won the title.

All I'm saying is Pippen is better than Wade. It has nothing to do with who was #1 on that Heat squad. If you say Wade, fine, it's Wade. Still doesn't disprove my point. If Wade is too good to be a sidekick then MJ isn't even top 5 because Pippen was better than Wade.

You're mssing my point. Pippen vs. Wade as players is irrelevant. I'm talking about their standing as sidekicks. Pippen was drafted (actually his draft rights were traded for) by CHI. He was MJ's sidekick virtually his whole career. Wade has a legacy as leading a team to a title on his own. LBJ doesn't. Wade's accomplishments in postseason play (he has always been a beast, even in losses) far exceed Lebron's as a whole (although that DET game was incredible, the whole is not that great). Lebron is joining another player that has proven to be a #1 on a title team. Worthy joined Magic's Lakers like Pippen did the Bulls. Kareem was past his prime, the same way Shaq was in MIA's title. Parrish and McHale joined Bird's Celtics.

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 09:31 PM
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
I'd give you 1,000 more facepalms but your not worth the time. Wade isnt on MJ's level or Kobes for that matter (yet) but Lebron and Durant????? come on now. What has LBJ done besides win MVP's? Wade Avg nearly 30ppg winning a scoring title along with finals MVP where he had one of the best finals performances ever avg nearly 37 ppg in the 4 wins. Durant does 2 things score and score

:facepalm: Besides win MVPs, wow

I guess its easy to get MVP according to you

LavelC
07-12-2010, 09:31 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

Kobe also had Shaq, whos was the biggest reason the lakers won their Championships as evident by his 3 finals MVP awards. A team with gasol is Odom on it is a team of scrubs who were turned into winners. Nobody from Jordan to Lebron can win alone.

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:33 PM
Wades only finals appearance: 34 ppg 7 rpg 3 ast pg 46 fg pct
Lebrons only finals appearance: 22 ppg 7 rpg 6 ast pg 35 fg pct

Now who is pippen?

No one is Pippen, just like neither of them are MJ. These are 2 guys creating there own legacies. Also, you point is ******** because Wade had a lot better help around him in the playoffs. Lebron was triple covered and none of his teammtes could make a shot.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:33 PM
Im sorry bro but D Wade is not on Kobe or Lebrons level

and you saying wade is in the same breath as MJ :facepalm:

Id take Durant over wade anyday

Top 10 Finals PERs since merger
Name Team Year PPG RPG APG FG% PER

Dwyane Wade Mia 2006 34.7 7.8 3.8 46.8 33.8

Tim Duncan SA 2003 24.2 17.0 5.3 49.5 32.0

Michael Jordan Chi 1991 31.2 6.6 11.4 55.8 31.5

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2002 36.3 12.3 3.8 59.5 31.4

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2000 38.0 16.7 2.3 61.1 31.1

Michael Jordan Chi 1998 33.5 4.0 2.3 42.7 30.8

Tim Duncan SA 1999 27.4 14.0 2.4 53.7 30.7

Michael Jordan Chi 1997 32.3 7.0 6.0 45.6 29.5

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2001 33.0 15.8 4.8 57.3 29.4

Michael Jordan Chi 1992 35.8 4.8 6.5 52.6 29.2

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:34 PM
:facepalm: Besides win MVPs, wow

I guess its easy to get MVP according to you

You hate for Miami is really ridiculous.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:35 PM
No one is Pippen, just like neither of them are MJ. These are 2 guys creating there own legacies. Also, you point is ******** because Wade had a lot better help around him in the playoffs. Lebron was triple covered and none of his teammtes could make a shot.

I dunno, Payton, Walker, J Will werent exactly in their primes. Shaq was non existent in the finals in 2006 at least it seemed that way.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 09:36 PM
Wow. Wade has accomplished more already and he's 5 years younger. No one would be shocked that Shaq got the Finals MVP? Did you watch that series? :laugh: Wade had the 3rd highest scoring average in Finals History and I believe had the highest PER rating ever.

:facepalm: I'm talking about before the series if someone said "Shaq will be MVP" that wouldn't be crazy to say. Besides, who was guarding him again? And how much did the Heat pay the refs that series. Where has Wade been since then? Nowhere near the 2nd round.

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 09:36 PM
Top 10 Finals PERs since merger
Name Team Year PPG RPG APG FG% PER

Dwyane Wade Mia 2006 34.7 7.8 3.8 46.8 33.8

Tim Duncan SA 2003 24.2 17.0 5.3 49.5 32.0

Michael Jordan Chi 1991 31.2 6.6 11.4 55.8 31.5

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2002 36.3 12.3 3.8 59.5 31.4

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2000 38.0 16.7 2.3 61.1 31.1

Michael Jordan Chi 1998 33.5 4.0 2.3 42.7 30.8

Tim Duncan SA 1999 27.4 14.0 2.4 53.7 30.7

Michael Jordan Chi 1997 32.3 7.0 6.0 45.6 29.5

Shaquille O'Neal LAL 2001 33.0 15.8 4.8 57.3 29.4

Michael Jordan Chi 1992 35.8 4.8 6.5 52.6 29.2


Whoop dee doo hahaha one lil finals mvp is not better than 2 MVPs

period lol you really think d wade is better than Lebron haha thats sad

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:37 PM
No one is Pippen, just like neither of them are MJ. These are 2 guys creating there own legacies. Also, you point is ******** because Wade had a lot better help around him in the playoffs. Lebron was triple covered and none of his teammtes could make a shot.

That was directed toward raji who said pippen is better than wade. And its wades team. Sorry bron get an L for this one.

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 09:38 PM
You hate for Miami is really ridiculous.

I just said LEBRON IS BETTER THAN WADE!!!!!!

Lebron is on your team hahahaha How is that hating bro?? Go read the post b4 you talk

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:40 PM
I dunno, Payton, Walker, J Will werent exactly in their primes. Shaq was non existent in the finals in 2006 at least it seemed that way.

Dude, wade had much better help in the finals than Lebron. Our 2nd best player still commanded double teams, and played well. LBJ had gibson as his 2nd best player. :laugh: Wade's performance was better for sure, but LBJ was playing with a bunch of scrubs, just trash he had for teammates.

And we had haslem who totally shut down dirk...:laugh: Dirk is and always will be haslem's *****,

Regardless, we have rings to win now:cheers:

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:41 PM
:facepalm: Besides win MVPs, wow

I guess its easy to get MVP according to you

oh, you're one of those that thinks MVP's tells the whole story. Did Wade not have an equal to or better statistical season than Lebron when he won the MVP for the first time? I guess Wade isnt on Nash's or Chris Pauls level either since he doesnt have mvp's? Wade has avg'd better numbers than Kobe of late so for you to say he's no on their levels is quite comical. Wade hasnt reached Kobe's or MJ's career levels but he certainly can be mentioned with those players. LBJ has done nothing but put up statistics. he hasnt won anything. Wade has and puts up similar numbers.

TheKing6
07-12-2010, 09:42 PM
why are we arguing about what their legacies will be LeBron isnt even half done with his career lets watch this play out then argue using facts instead of speculation. We dont even know what roles Wade and LeBron will be taking on this dream team.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 09:43 PM
LOL at Heat fans arguing w/ each other over Wade vs. LBJ

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:44 PM
I just said LEBRON IS BETTER THAN WADE!!!!!!

Lebron is on your team hahahaha How is that hating bro?? Go read the post b4 you talk

and we disagree with your assessment. I like to look at it as they are now equals.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:44 PM
MJ>KOBE>WADE>BRON Legacies And got a feeling it will be that way forever. Lebron shot himself in the foot signing with miami.

D-Will4Prez
07-12-2010, 09:45 PM
Kobe never played with one of the league's best players? What was Shaq then?

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:45 PM
But who knows kobe will win more 6 or more.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:45 PM
LOL at Heat fans arguing w/ each other over Wade vs. LBJ

i personally think they are pretty dam close as players.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:46 PM
MJ>KOBE>WADE>BRON Legacies And got a feeling it will be that way forever. Lebron shot himself in the foot signing with miami.

Thats about right. that order is legit.

ldawg
07-12-2010, 09:47 PM
And this is Why kobe was a goat until he won without Shaq. So now if they win Lebron is a goat. Buy the way Lebron is the most talented but that does not mean he is the best player. Wade knows how to finish he has more heart than Lebron.

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 09:47 PM
i personally think they are pretty dam close as players.

Agree, wade and lebron will be raping the rest of the league for the next few years.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:47 PM
Kobe never played with one of the league's best players? What was Shaq then?

Never said he didnt. But he was dynamite in the 01 and 02 finals.But Shaq was the man. But kobe is on his run now as the man.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 09:47 PM
You're mssing my point. Pippen vs. Wade as players is irrelevant. I'm talking about their standing as sidekicks. Pippen was drafted (actually his draft rights were traded for) by CHI. He was MJ's sidekick virtually his whole career. Wade has a legacy as leading a team to a title on his own. LBJ doesn't. Wade's accomplishments in postseason play (he has always been a beast, even in losses) far exceed Lebron's as a whole (although that DET game was incredible, the whole is not that great). Lebron is joining another player that has proven to be a #1 on a title team. Worthy joined Magic's Lakers like Pippen did the Bulls. Kareem was past his prime, the same way Shaq was in MIA's title. Parrish and McHale joined Bird's Celtics.

Like I said, Wade's post season legacy is equal to that of Billups. 1 Finals MVP does not make you a legend. Wade's team was lucky not to get swept this year. He hasn't been to the 2nd round since 06. It doesn't matter if he's been a sidekick his whole career, he's a sidekick now. That's not a bad thing either because being LeBron's sidekick will probably be pretty sweet seeing how LeBron plays so unselfishly. I wouldn't be surprised to see LBJ average 10 assists this year.

Wade's post season play exceeds Pippens? 1 good series tops 6 rings??? You can't be serious. And when they were both on their own as the undisputed #1, Pippen at least got his team out of the first round. Wade has failed to do that in multiple tries.

And Shaq "past his prime" was still the 2nd best C in the game, averaging 20 points a game. You act like Wade carried the Heat by himself. Even if he was #1, the cliche still holds true: "No one can win a title alone." Wade all alone has done nothing. Pippen all alone did. Therefore Pippen > Wade. Which means Jordan had a better sidekick than LeBron.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:48 PM
And this is Why kobe was a goat until he won without Shaq. So now if they win Lebron is a goat. Buy the way Lebron is the most talented but that does not mean he is the best player. Wade knows how to finish he has more heart than Lebron.

Winner :clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::c lap:

End thread.

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 09:49 PM
LOL at Heat fans arguing w/ each other over Wade vs. LBJ


Thank you haha

I never heard one time in the last 5 years of d wade being the best player in the league or even the second player!!!

its always kobe or lebron!! Why are they even arguing about me saying lebron is better? haha they have lebron!!! i dont get it, just be happy

And the reason i brought up lebron is better than wade is bc that dude said wade should be in the same breath as kobe lebron and MJ

that does deserve a :facepalm:

You give a heat fan a compliment and they still argue with you

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 09:50 PM
Like I said, Wade's post season legacy is equal to that of Billups. 1 Finals MVP does not make you a legend. Wade's team was lucky not to get swept this year. He hasn't been to the 2nd round since 06. It doesn't matter if he's been a sidekick his whole career, he's a sidekick now. That's not a bad thing either because being LeBron's sidekick will probably be pretty sweet seeing how LeBron plays so unselfishly. I wouldn't be surprised to see LBJ average 10 assists this year.

Wade's post season play exceeds Pippens? 1 good series tops 6 rings??? You can't be serious. And when they were both on their own as the undisputed #1, Pippen at least got his team out of the first round. Wade has failed to do that in multiple tries.

And Shaq "past his prime" was still the 2nd best C in the game, averaging 20 points a game. You act like Wade carried the Heat by himself. Even if he was #1, the cliche still holds true: "No one can win a title alone." Wade all alone has done nothing. Pippen all alone has. Therefore Pippen > Wade. Which means Jordan had a better sidekick than LeBron.

I said it exceeds Lebron's. I have not compared Wade and Pippen as players. I only compared their accomplishments before they became sidekicks to MJ and LBJ.

TheKing6
07-12-2010, 09:50 PM
Kobe has played with top players. Shaq was arguably the best in the league in their title run. This year pau was a top 3 big man. Artest one of the best lock down defenders taking pressure off of kobe on the defensive end. why is the help kobe gets so discounted remember they may not make it out of round one if the thunder box out on kobes airball

KnicksorBust
07-12-2010, 09:51 PM
:facepalm: I'm talking about before the series if someone said "Shaq will be MVP" that wouldn't be crazy to say. Besides, who was guarding him again? And how much did the Heat pay the refs that series. Where has Wade been since then? Nowhere near the 2nd round.

It wouldn't be crazy to say that the second best player on the team will get the MVP. What's your point? The second that series was over there was no doubt we had just witnessed one of the greatest Finals performances ever.

All you're doing is a bait and switch really because you are trying to skirt your comment about Wade being on par with Billups even though Wade has accomplished more and is 5 years younger. It's not a bad attempt to deflect your statement.

Oh and I love how when a player wins it's because they had help but when they have no help they get torn to shreds for not getting anywhere. Wade in 2009 and Kobe in 2005 are two of the best seasons I've seen by individual players in my life and they both couldn't make it to the second round. The pile of dog **** that they even carried into the playoffs was enough of an accomplishment to me.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:51 PM
:facepalm: I'm talking about before the series if someone said "Shaq will be MVP" that wouldn't be crazy to say. Besides, who was guarding him again? And how much did the Heat pay the refs that series. Where has Wade been since then? Nowhere near the 2nd round.

alot of things happened after the the title. Shaq quit on the team and was traded, Wade seriously hurt his shoulder and missed quite a bit of time. 2008'09 was Wade's best season ever and could have won mvp if not for the media's love for Lebron. Along the way Riley started filling the roster with expiring contracts planning for 2010 free agency. Wade hasnt exactly had a good team since the finals.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 09:52 PM
Like I said, Wade's post season legacy is equal to that of Billups. 1 Finals MVP does not make you a legend. Wade's team was lucky not to get swept this year. He hasn't been to the 2nd round since 06. It doesn't matter if he's been a sidekick his whole career, he's a sidekick now. That's not a bad thing either because being LeBron's sidekick will probably be pretty sweet seeing how LeBron plays so unselfishly. I wouldn't be surprised to see LBJ average 10 assists this year.

Wade's post season play exceeds Pippens? 1 good series tops 6 rings??? You can't be serious. And when they were both on their own as the undisputed #1, Pippen at least got his team out of the first round. Wade has failed to do that in multiple tries.

And Shaq "past his prime" was still the 2nd best C in the game, averaging 20 points a game. You act like Wade carried the Heat by himself. Even if he was #1, the cliche still holds true: "No one can win a title alone." Wade all alone has done nothing. Pippen all alone did. Therefore Pippen > Wade. Which means Jordan had a better sidekick than LeBron.

Your crazy. Just my opinion. But your crazy.

KnicksorBust
07-12-2010, 09:52 PM
Like I said, Wade's post season legacy is equal to that of Billups. 1 Finals MVP does not make you a legend. Wade's team was lucky not to get swept this year. He hasn't been to the 2nd round since 06. It doesn't matter if he's been a sidekick his whole career, he's a sidekick now. That's not a bad thing either because being LeBron's sidekick will probably be pretty sweet seeing how LeBron plays so unselfishly. I wouldn't be surprised to see LBJ average 10 assists this year.

Wade's post season play exceeds Pippens? 1 good series tops 6 rings??? You can't be serious. And when they were both on their own as the undisputed #1, Pippen at least got his team out of the first round. Wade has failed to do that in multiple tries.

And Shaq "past his prime" was still the 2nd best C in the game, averaging 20 points a game. You act like Wade carried the Heat by himself. Even if he was #1, the cliche still holds true: "No one can win a title alone." Wade all alone has done nothing. Pippen all alone did. Therefore Pippen > Wade. Which means Jordan had a better sidekick than LeBron.

Smart edit.

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 09:52 PM
It wouldn't be crazy to say that the second best player on the team will get the MVP. What's your point? The second that series was over there was no doubt we had just witnessed one of the greatest Finals performances ever.

All you're doing is a bait and switch really because you are trying to skirt your comment about Wade being on par with Billups even though Wade has accomplished more and is 5 years younger. It's not a bad attempt to deflect your statement.

Oh and I love how when a player wins it's because they had help but when they have no help they get torn to shreds for not getting anywhere. Wade in 2009 and Kobe in 2005 are two of the best seasons I've seen by individual players in my life and they both couldn't make it to the second round. The pile of dog **** that they even carried into the playoffs was enough of an accomplishment to me.

:clap::clap:

perfectly said

ldawg
07-12-2010, 09:53 PM
No one is Pippen, just like neither of them are MJ. These are 2 guys creating there own legacies. Also, you point is ******** because Wade had a lot better help around him in the playoffs. Lebron was triple covered and none of his teammtes could make a shot. He had the same washed up Shaq and teamates you can't even find in the NBA. Lebron didn't help yawdyyawdy They had a great defensive team lead the nba for two seasons. Someone should have told Lebron to stop passing to mo Williams then running from the ball then they would have stand a chance to beat Boston.

GspLAL
07-12-2010, 09:57 PM
Wade has led a team to a championship first of all. Second, he didn't go on an hour long show to glorify himself and try to make himself bigger than what he really is.

ldawg
07-12-2010, 09:59 PM
Lebron lives in Wade County and has a poster of wade on his wall.

soonabooma
07-12-2010, 09:59 PM
Lebron left the city that he started in, the team that he had been building up and trying to win a ring with, like a coward. Wade didn't do that. Fair or not, he stayed right where he started in Miami and convinced captain douchebag to come join HIS team. That's why Lebron is a quitter and Wade isn't. All we've been hearing out of Lebron is "we're gonna keep fighting until we bring a title to Cleveland". But his talk was totally cheap. He never had the guts to do it, he never had the leadership necessary to achieve greatness, he never had the heart of a champion, and as a result....he's the worst kind of loser now becuz he has all the talent in the world, but he's been reduced to running to his little buddies to try to help him get a ring. So YES....he's a queefbag with cheese, and any current player not on his team or past player will tell you the same thing. How can you respect what he's become? And let's tell the truth, the kid never had any class, he was never humble, he was never respectful. He just faked his way through for the first half of his career. That's all that happened. He fooled people into thinking he was the heir-apparent. But he's not even close and he never will be. He's gonna get exactly what he deserves, and I'm not talking about rings. We all know he doesn't deserve that. He's gonna get what the little boy shot at.

:D

Viper2000
07-12-2010, 09:59 PM
Thats about right. that order is legit.

I like this order; MJ/Kobe, that's about right. How many rings or MVP's does Kobe need to surpass MJ? Lakers are going to need some help & a lot of Health to make it through the West & the Heat....

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 10:00 PM
Talking about legacies is redundant NOW when they are all still playing and LeBron is 25, Wade is 28, and Kobe is 32. Talk about it when they are all done, then it will make a lot of sense. No one can win by himself, NO ONE. As individual players LeBron and Wade are better than Kobe right now.

Draco
07-12-2010, 10:04 PM
If Lebron's a "quitter" or whatever, then what's D-Wade?

Here's a better thread question.. if/when Lebron and company win some rings, do you really consider them winners in competition or did are you more comfortable saying that they won. If Helu, Buffet and Gates know what it takes to make money and they're rich because of it.. are they comparable to 3 dudes who won the power lotto?

ldawg
07-12-2010, 10:05 PM
I like this order; MJ/Kobe, that's about right. How many rings or MVP's does Kobe need to surpass MJ? Lakers are going to need some help & a lot of Health to make it through the West & the Heat....Dont think for a minute injuries cant happen Bosh wears one of those JO Bynum braces.

ldawg
07-12-2010, 10:07 PM
LeBron and Wade are better than Kobe right now. The Last time i Look Kobe was still King. but yes Lebron and Wade can run faster and jump higher than an older Bryant. To bad its more to bb than Flash(Wade) and bolt(out of town lebron)

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:09 PM
Talking about legacies is redundant NOW when they are all still playing and LeBron is 25, Wade is 28, and Kobe is 32. Talk about it when they are all done, then it will make a lot of sense. No one can win by himself, NO ONE. As individual players LeBron and Wade are better than Kobe right now.

Keep telling yourself that.

KnicksorBust
07-12-2010, 10:12 PM
"Back to Back 2008-2010 NBA Champions" lmao

KTheo77
07-12-2010, 10:13 PM
this crap gets old. None of them are quitters. People who are quitters are people like Shaq who quit on the Heat mid season and end up being traded to a contender. I've been a heat fan since day one and my favorite players went Glen Rice to Alonzo Mourning to Dwyane Wade. If Wade would have left the Heat to Chicago it would have sucked but no way would i sit around and call him a quitter because he changed teams for better chances at winning a title. Anyone who sits around and criticizes these players for putting themselves in the best position to win and be happy is simply bitter. the end

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Well Said!!!

LTBaByyy
07-12-2010, 10:15 PM
LeBron and Wade are better than Kobe right now.

:facepalm:

ldawg
07-12-2010, 10:17 PM
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Well Said!!!He Quit he did not finish what he started to grow. He saw greener grass on the other side so he cross to plant his seed in someone else back yard.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:17 PM
"Back to Back 2008-2010 NBA Champions" lmao

Won the title in 08-09 and 09-10 :eyebrow:

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:19 PM
"Back to Back 2008-2010 NBA Champions" lmao

Amare will fit in well, he doesnt defend. At all.

roshan3ai
07-12-2010, 10:22 PM
Amare will fit in well, he doesnt defend. At all.

:laugh2: What the **** does this have to do with the topic? The Knicks weren't mentioned once. And you're sig isn't correct. It makes it look like the Lakers won three in a row and that wouldn't be "Back-to-back"

DKGiants
07-12-2010, 10:23 PM
Originally Posted by mdm692:
Championships=Greatness

Shaq and Kobe+great supporting cast=3
shaq and wade+descent supporting cast=1
shaq and lebron+good supporting cast=0

so when it comes to legacies
MJ>>KOBE>>>WADE>>>>LEBRON


Age has alot to do with this.

this is actually very true.. I think With Shaq in his prime he could've easily won all three players at least 3 Championships, easily.. And this is why Shaq and Tim Duncan should have split Player of the Decade and Kobe shouldn't have gotten it(Kobe=54% of the vote.. :facepalm:). And this is also why Kobe can never be compared to Jordan because he made Pippen great and didnt have a bigman to help him out. Pippen w/out Jordan isnt as good as he came out to be.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:25 PM
:laugh2: What the **** does this have to do with the topic? The Knicks weren't mentioned once. And you're sig isn't correct. It makes it look like the Lakers won three in a row and that wouldn't be "Back-to-back"

And my sig has everything to do with the topic. :facepalm:

Jaji
07-12-2010, 10:25 PM
It wouldn't be crazy to say that the second best player on the team will get the MVP. What's your point? The second that series was over there was no doubt we had just witnessed one of the greatest Finals performances ever.

All you're doing is a bait and switch really because you are trying to skirt your comment about Wade being on par with Billups even though Wade has accomplished more and is 5 years younger. It's not a bad attempt to deflect your statement.

Oh and I love how when a player wins it's because they had help but when they have no help they get torn to shreds for not getting anywhere. Wade in 2009 and Kobe in 2005 are two of the best seasons I've seen by individual players in my life and they both couldn't make it to the second round. The pile of dog **** that they even carried into the playoffs was enough of an accomplishment to me.

When did I say Wade was on par with Billups? I said in terms of post season legacies. 1 Finals MVP compared to 1 Finals MVP. Obviously Wade is better.

And it's not just that Wade didn't win a title by himself, he didn't win anything by himself. Pippen by himself, with no sidekick got out of the 1st round. LeBron, by himself, with no sidekick routinely got out of the 1st round and even took his team as far as the Finals... ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has gone absolutely nowhere in the playoffs without another All Star on the team to help shoulder the load. He either needs a sidekick or needs to be a sidekick to have any type of post season success. This has been proven. Without Shaq or LeBron, Wade is T Mac. And that's not a dis, I'm old school and remember when T Mac was a BEAST. Still couldn't get outta the 1st though, just like Wade.

KW93KB24
07-12-2010, 10:26 PM
6/24 shooting and still win....Oh, well where is T-mac, Vinsanity, AI.....nvm ;)

6/24 with 5 finals titles and 2 mvp titles............. oh, well wheres t mac? still trying to get out the first round of the playoffs, AI oh yeah lost to kobes lakers in the finals, im not going to even talk about vince carter.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:27 PM
Dont worry after next year it will be three.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 10:28 PM
And my sig has everything to do with the topic. :facepalm:

He's saying that the Lakers weren't 2008 champs. You sig is misleading.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 10:30 PM
Im sorry bro but D Wade is not on Kobe or Lebrons level

and you saying wade is in the same breath as MJ :facepalm:

Id take Durant over wade anyday

I agree with this 100%. Best in the league goes:

1. Kobe/LeBron
3. Durant
4. Wade

Viper2000
07-12-2010, 10:32 PM
Dont think for a minute injuries cant happen Bosh wears one of those JO Bynum braces.

absolutely; Wade has taken quite a beating over the years as well. still cannot believe that they're 25,26,28 respectively & the Heat have them locked for 6 years. like it or not, if you're the Heat, that is a good move

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:35 PM
He's saying that the Lakers weren't 2008 champs. You sig is misleading.

08 meaning the 08 09 season. Who gives a **** anyway? Not my fault he's misled.

NYMetros
07-12-2010, 10:36 PM
Wade was never perceived to be such a douche. More people like him, so that obviously helps. But there's more than just that. Lebron made us think he wanted to chase MJ, then quit that pursuit. It died July 8th. If he just wants to win, that's fine with me. But if you make the decision to chase MJ and then go to MIA (killing his chances), you quit that chase. He quit his chase of MJ, not the Cavs. Wade never marketed himself as someone who was interested in the chase.

And to the people to think that MJ played w/ talent so this doesn't kill Lenron;s chances: Wade is too good to be a sidekick to the greatest. He is a superstar. If Lebron had signed w/ the Knicks and joined Amare or lured Bosh to CLE, he would still be in the chase. Because those are sidekicks. Wade is a top 3 NBA player - Pippen never was. Playing w/ talent is a necesity. But a sidekick of Wade's caliber is too much.

What are you talking about? What does LeBron having a good supporting cast now have to do with ANYTHING? Does that diminish LeBron's skill sets or something? Um, no. It doesn't make LeBron any less of a basketball player.

Rings have nothing to do with a basketball player's talent. If LeBron was on the Lakers the past 3 years then he'd already have 3 rings right now. If he was on the Celtics the past 3 years he'd have at least 2, maybe 3, rings. Get it? It's all relative.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 10:39 PM
What are you talking about? What does LeBron having a good supporting cast now have to do with ANYTHING? Does that diminish LeBron's skill sets or something? Um, no. It doesn't make LeBron any less of a basketball player.

Rings have nothing to do with a basketball player's talent. If LeBron was on the Lakers the past 3 years then he'd already have 3 rings right now. Get it?

Correct. But how many you have and who you won them with have EVERYTHING to do with a player's legacy.

Valkyrie
07-12-2010, 10:39 PM
But guys, Wade has won a ring on his own.... regardless of how many he wins with this trio, he has arguably the best finals performance ever

KnicksorBust
07-12-2010, 10:41 PM
Amare will fit in well, he doesnt defend. At all.

Oh that's fine I'm used to it. Neither did Lee. :D Nice attempt at baiting though! ANYWAY...


:laugh2: What the **** does this have to do with the topic? The Knicks weren't mentioned once. And you're sig isn't correct. It makes it look like the Lakers won three in a row and that wouldn't be "Back-to-back"

Everyone gets so sensitive about the smallest things. It's like a reflex "Knicks fan made fun of me?? QUICK! THINK! ISIAH!! NO! MARBURY! NO! UHH D'ANTONI! YES! AMAR'E! NO DEFENSE!!! Haha I win! "


When did I say Wade was on par with Billups?


Wade's legacy is too great? Are you kidding? His legacy is on par with Chauncey Billups' legacy right now.

The first time you clearly meant his whole career legacy because never clarified that you meant *SPECIFICALLY* post season legacies... which are never compared in such a weird vacuum like that where you exclude regular season. Then you changed it in your next post which was smart.


I said in terms of post season legacies. 1 Finals MVP compared to 1 Finals MVP. Obviously Wade is better.

And it's not just that Wade didn't win a title by himself, he didn't win anything by himself. Pippen by himself, with no sidekick got out of the 1st round. LeBron, by himself, with no sidekick routinely got out of the 1st round and even took his team as far as the Finals... ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has gone absolutely nowhere in the playoffs without another All Star on the team to help shoulder the load. He either needs a sidekick or needs to be a sidekick to have any type of post season success. This has been proven. Without Shaq or LeBron, Wade is T Mac. And that's not a dis, I'm old school and remember when T Mac was a BEAST. Still couldn't get outta the 1st though, just like Wade.

Yoooo you remember T-Mac the beast back in the DAY? YOU ARE OLD SCHOOL! :laugh: Okay I'm bein a prick. I'll stop. If you really think Wade's Miami Heat teams of the past few years compare with LeBron's Cavaliers teams then I'll just have to agree to disagree because I don't even think it's close. That's where the argument stops for me.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:43 PM
But guys, Wade has won a ring on his own.... regardless of how many he wins with this trio, he has arguably the best finals performance ever

Ehh give me 93 jordan and 00 shaq.

KW93KB24
07-12-2010, 10:46 PM
why are heat fans arguing about lebron and wade being the second best player in the nba? just be happy u guys landed both of them

roshan3ai
07-12-2010, 10:53 PM
Everyone gets so sensitive about the smallest things. It's like a reflex "Knicks fan made fun of me?? QUICK! THINK! ISIAH!! NO! MARBURY! NO! UHH D'ANTONI! YES! AMAR'E! NO DEFENSE!!! Haha I win! "

:laugh: Very true

MikeDanks
07-12-2010, 10:56 PM
Actually, LeBron is chasing Warren Buffet more than MJ.

But anyways, your complete dissing of Scottie Pippen tells me you either a) are 15 or b) have a basketball IQ comparable to Kobe Bryant's shooting percentage in game 7.

Scottie Pippen was a 3x All-NBA 1st teamer and a member of the 50th anniversary team. He's also a HOFer, something Amare and Bosh will never be.

Dwyane Wade is NOT on LeBron's level. Period.


I have to disagree completely with you--i honestly believe Scottie Pippen is one of the most overrated players ever---having the luxury of playing with Mike allowed Scottie to receive tons of accolades he never deserved. I remember when Jordan took his chances in baseball down in Birmingham farm system, that WAS Scottie's team than. They wouldn't have even been playoff bound those 2 years had Chicago not brought over Toni Kukoc who played sidekick to Scottie..I think Pippen's best year was around 21 ppg 7 rpg and about 4-5 assists..granted those are wonderful numbers and he was a very good on ball defender, but not enough for the HOF and especially not for the 50 greatest players in the NBA (documented list back in 1996.)

One of the largest travesties, i believe, is how the human highlight film Dominique Wilkins, who constantly was 2nd in scoring behind Jordan almost every year (averaging 28-29 ppg for at least a stretch of 6-7 yrs,) was left off the 50 greatest players ever and they put an above average player like Pippen in this hallowed group.

My reason for speaking about Pippen so much? Because all of these people insist that Michael couldn't win alone...are you kidding me?? The guy was an absolute monster---6 titles in 6 attempts.. He didn't need a bunch of all stars traded onto his team, rather he took mediocre/above average players and got the very best out of them...oh and p.s. I'm a die hard knicks fan who loathes MJ, but can accept how great he truly was.

showtym24
07-12-2010, 10:56 PM
why are heat fans arguing about lebron and wade being the second best player in the nba? just be happy u guys landed both of them

Because most of them are still in transition. :D

HiphopRelated
07-12-2010, 11:06 PM
When did I say Wade was on par with Billups? I said in terms of post season legacies. 1 Finals MVP compared to 1 Finals MVP. Obviously Wade is better.

And it's not just that Wade didn't win a title by himself, he didn't win anything by himself. Pippen by himself, with no sidekick got out of the 1st round. LeBron, by himself, with no sidekick routinely got out of the 1st round and even took his team as far as the Finals... ALL BY HIMSELF. Wade has gone absolutely nowhere in the playoffs without another All Star on the team to help shoulder the load. He either needs a sidekick or needs to be a sidekick to have any type of post season success. This has been proven. Without Shaq or LeBron, Wade is T Mac. And that's not a dis, I'm old school and remember when T Mac was a BEAST. Still couldn't get outta the 1st though, just like Wade.
lol, replace Wade with Kobe and it's the same sh1t

All Wade needs is a talented big

Bosh made the Heat a contender. Add Lebron and they can make a dynasty. Which was Riley's goal as the architect

rickshaw
07-12-2010, 11:31 PM
not really, if the head woulda signed say rudy gay and stoudemire or just stoudemire...hell even if they woulda signed boozer and a good supporting cast wade woulda stayed why cuz wade is a TRUE COMPETITOR he actually cares about winnig and thanks to lebron wades legacy will always be better than LBJ...

Championships=Greatness

Shaq and Kobe+great supporting cast=3
shaq and wade+descent supporting cast=1
shaq and lebron+good supporting cast=0

so when it comes to legacies
MJ>>KOBE>>>WADE>>>>LEBRON


Kobe was part of shaqs supporting cast. when shaqs skills declined he went to miami then cleveland and became part of the supporting cast.

justinnum1
07-12-2010, 11:33 PM
lol, replace Wade with Kobe and it's the same sh1t

All Wade needs is a talented big

Bosh made the Heat a contender. Add Lebron and they can make a dynasty. Which was Riley's goal as the architect

This. Kobe will go down in history one ring short of Michael.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 11:34 PM
why are heat fans arguing about lebron and wade being the second best player in the nba? just be happy u guys landed both of them

You mean the Best and the 2nd best player in the nba?

Aussy4GM
07-12-2010, 11:35 PM
Heat Fans Need To Stop Worrying About How Their Team Is Perceived & Be Happy You Lucked Out & Got These Guys. Im So Sick Of Heat Fans Trying To Defend LeBron When the fact is you dont know LeBron you dont know what made him decide to go to Miami. if i were a heat fan i could care less who hated LeBron. i would keep my mouth shut and pray to god these three win a title or next year on the forums all of you will be taking some serious ****.

As for everyone else.you can stop hating lebron because that is just as annoying as people defending him. whats done is done. no matter how hard you bash lebron he is not going to change his decision. yes, he took the easy way out. but you can fault him for wanting to win. just bite your tounge when heat fans talk about how heroic these guys are for taking a couple less million. Save your breath and pray to go the heat dont win a championship so you can **** on the heat fans next year.

natelpete
07-12-2010, 11:35 PM
I have to disagree completely with you--i honestly believe Scottie Pippen is one of the most overrated players ever---having the luxury of playing with Mike allowed Scottie to receive tons of accolades he never deserved. I remember when Jordan took his chances in baseball down in Birmingham farm system, that WAS Scottie's team than. They wouldn't have even been playoff bound those 2 years had Chicago not brought over Toni Kukoc who played sidekick to Scottie..I think Pippen's best year was around 21 ppg 7 rpg and about 4-5 assists..granted those are wonderful numbers and he was a very good on ball defender, but not enough for the HOF and especially not for the 50 greatest players in the NBA (documented list back in 1996.)

One of the largest travesties, i believe, is how the human highlight film Dominique Wilkins, who constantly was 2nd in scoring behind Jordan almost every year (averaging 28-29 ppg for at least a stretch of 6-7 yrs,) was left off the 50 greatest players ever and they put an above average player like Pippen in this hallowed group.

My reason for speaking about Pippen so much? Because all of these people insist that Michael couldn't win alone...are you kidding me?? The guy was an absolute monster---6 titles in 6 attempts.. He didn't need a bunch of all stars traded onto his team, rather he took mediocre/above average players and got the very best out of them...oh and p.s. I'm a die hard knicks fan who loathes MJ, but can accept how great he truly was.

He only tried to be a champion 6 times?

Obviously MJ was the All-Star of the team, but there is no denying he had a great supporting cast.......

Kind of like Lebron will have in Miami

Aussy4GM
07-12-2010, 11:37 PM
This. Kobe will go down in history one ring short of Michael.

Didnt Bill Russell Win 11? So That Would Make Michael 5 Short Of Him. Who Cares.

Heater4life
07-12-2010, 11:56 PM
here's a link in case you need reminding of how Kobe has to be called a quitter also if they call Wade, Lebron or Bosh quitters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyIGaKTvBVY&feature=related

Said he wants to be traded for two reason. to be on a team that is a contender and because of the whole why was shaq traded fiasco.

How people forget! ****ing hypocrites! :facepalm:

If Kobe was a free agent at that very moment he would have bolted. The only reason he didnt go to Chicago is because L.A wanted to bring back Deng and other young talent, so he rescinded the deal because he wanted to be surrounded by the most TALENT possible. (being as he had a no trade clause)

But hes on another level because he didnt "chase" the ring; he would have left too! stfu all these guys want to win.

jackdawson
07-12-2010, 11:58 PM
How people forget! ****ing hypocrites! :facepalm:

If Kobe was a free agent at that very moment he would have bolted. The only reason he didnt go to Chicago is because L.A wanted to bring back Deng and other young talent, so he rescinded the deal because he wanted to be surrounded by the most TALENT possible. (being as he had a no trade clause)

But hes on another level because he did "chase" the ring he would have left too!

Yellows are hypocrites!

JasonJohnHorn
07-13-2010, 12:00 AM
If LeBron is a Quitter, then Wade is one lucky Alpha Dog. He talked James in to joining a team with literally only two players on the roster, where as James and the Cavs would have been immediate title contenders with the addition of Wade via a sign and trade. If James was the alpha dog, Wade would be in Cleveland, but as it turns out... Wade is the alpha dog, and a lucky one at that. He gets to stay loyal, keep the same jersey, and be on a wining team... well, a winning team that is if they can fill out the rest of the roster. Thought the starting line up looks tight:

C: Haslem
PF: Bosh
SF: LBJ
SG: Mike Miller
PG: Wade

I know a couple guys are out of position, but if they put together a starting line up with what they have now... this would have to be it.

xxplayerxx23
07-13-2010, 12:01 AM
this is sooooo comical. Did he not ask to be traded after losing in the playoffs after shaq left?????? Funny how you guys put Kobe on this pedestal of almighty loyalty when its far from the case. No Gasol no contract extension from Kobe believe that. Kobe is a legend on the court but as for this so called loyalty thing, stop.

Yah i agree i dont like kobe he did try to be traded. All i know is lebron will never be micheal jordan. Mj was a free agent and everyone wanted him to go to ny But mj said **** that there my rivals why would i go to that .Same with larry bird had the chance to leave. Those guys are the true stars. **** lebron And im not to thirlled with wade even though i like the way wade plays he is JUst as good as lebron if not better and can carry his team in the playoffs unlike lebron!

Raps08-09 Champ
07-13-2010, 12:01 AM
That tells me that Wade is totally not a Jordan,Kobe and Bird like minded. And to be honest that is a good thing.;)

Wanting someone good on your team means you shouldn't be great when it's all said and done?

I'm sure Kobe wanted Gasol, and Artest.

Heater4life
07-13-2010, 12:05 AM
If LeBron is a Quitter, then Wade is one lucky Alpha Dog. He talked James in to joining a team with literally only two players on the roster, where as James and the Cavs would have been immediate title contenders with the addition of Wade via a sign and trade. If James was the alpha dog, Wade would be in Cleveland, but as it turns out... Wade is the alpha dog, and a lucky one at that. He gets to stay loyal, keep the same jersey, and be on a wining team... well, a winning team that is if they can fill out the rest of the roster. Thought the starting line up looks tight:

C: Haslem
PF: Bosh
SF: LBJ
SG: Mike Miller
PG: Wade

I know a couple guys are out of position, but if they put together a starting line up with what they have now... this would have to be it.

Mario Chalmers and Joel Anthony are starters, Haslem and Mike Miller are more than likely coming off the bench.

when you have two elite players and an all-star in your starting line up you can afford to start Chalmers (decent three, ok defender) and Anthony ( shot blocker, energy, hustle, rebounding; cheap mans ben wallace).

Miller and Haslem are off the bench. which is awesome imo.

Chalmers
Wade
Bron
Bosh
Anthony
Miller
Haslem

Raps08-09 Champ
07-13-2010, 12:06 AM
:laugh: You people are so waste.

The thing you say like "He held a TV show to embarrass Cleveland" is so crap.

You are acting like he had already planned to join the Heat when he was still undecided when he booked that show. He even said after that he only made his decision AFTER he had already booked the show. But since it's Lebron and all you people are haters, you won't believe ****. But yet if Lebron says something you want to hear, you'll bag him for it.

Heater4life
07-13-2010, 12:14 AM
Wanting someone good on your team means you shouldn't be great when it's all said and done?

I'm sure Kobe wanted Gasol, and Artest.

The issue lies with the fact that this is unprecedented. The chances of this happening were astronomical. The guys had to sign identical deals when they extended, had to have a team completely unload there roster to have space (extreamly difficult), had to have the players willing to leave their respective team, and had to be willing to take a pay cut.

The chances of something like this ever happening again are EXTREMLY unlikely. I think I'll pass as an old man before seeing something similar to this happening again. (im 21)

But if other great players had the oppurtunity these players had, and had all these many factors fall into order as these guys had dont be too quick to assume that "they would never have done something like that". Just because they didnt have the oppurtunity to do so, does not mean they wouldnt have.

Kyben36
07-13-2010, 12:17 AM
not really, if the head woulda signed say rudy gay and stoudemire or just stoudemire...hell even if they woulda signed boozer and a good supporting cast wade woulda stayed why cuz wade is a TRUE COMPETITOR he actually cares about winnig and thanks to lebron wades legacy will always be better than LBJ...

Championships=Greatness

Shaq and Kobe+great supporting cast=3
shaq and wade+descent supporting cast=1
shaq and lebron+good supporting cast=0

so when it comes to legacies
MJ>>KOBE>>>WADE>>>>LEBRON

Amare Stat and gay where gone, and I dont think Booze was enough to keep him there. let me repeat what I said, WITHOUT Wade getting help, he would have left,

Heater4life
07-13-2010, 12:30 AM
Amare Stat and gay where gone, and I dont think Booze was enough to keep him there. let me repeat what I said, WITHOUT Wade getting help, he would have left,

Agree 100%. Wade would have left.

The fact is their job is to win championships. If I were in their shoes i wish i could be as noble and say i would leave money on the table. Fact is people remember winners whether they stayed with original team or left.

Oscar Robertson, Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Moses Malone, Bob Macadoo. All greats! because they won, and did so emphatically regarless of where they played.

Lebrons' no different.

mynameismo
07-13-2010, 12:42 AM
D-Wade is the Man. As much as I hate Lebron and his one hour spectacle, I have much respect for D-Wade. He was surrounded by scrubs then but we all know he was staying in Miami from the start. He never gave up on them. He deserves this team that he has now.

He finally have his Pippen. :clap:

Jaji
07-13-2010, 08:38 AM
D-Wade is the Man. As much as I hate Lebron and his one hour spectacle, I have much respect for D-Wade. He was surrounded by scrubs then but we all know he was staying in Miami from the start. He never gave up on them. He deserves this team that he has now.

He finally have his Pippen. :clap:

It's more like Wade is Pippen and LeBron is Jordan coming out of retirement, I mean Cleveland.

JonnyBrav000
07-13-2010, 09:02 AM
Actually, LeBron is chasing Warren Buffet more than MJ.

But anyways, your complete dissing of Scottie Pippen tells me you either a) are 15 or b) have a basketball IQ comparable to Kobe Bryant's shooting percentage in game 7.

Scottie Pippen was a 3x All-NBA 1st teamer and a member of the 50th anniversary team. He's also a HOFer, something Amare and Bosh will never be.

Dwyane Wade is NOT on LeBron's level. Period.


Sorry but you aren't very smart yourself. How can you possibly say Wade is not on Lebron's level???

Wade has a championship and a finals MVP, what does Lebron have???

Are you one of those guys who just looks at stats? If you are then remember that since 2007 Lebron has been surrounded by much better talent than Wade and also, when the stars get together to play in the olympics, Wade is usually outperforming Lebron. Wade has more of a killer instinct and is more clutch than Lebron as well. Plus Lebron quit on his team in the playoffs, he is easily frustrated. Right now Wade is the captain and Lebron will have to defer. It's Wade's team.

By the way, you have no idea if Amare or Bosh will ever make the hall of fame. both guys are still young and in the prime of their careers.

Also, Lebron will never have Warren Buffet money, so I don't get how you can say Lebron is chasing Warren Buffet when Buffet and Lebron do their business in different industries.

ansky50
07-13-2010, 09:11 AM
The difference is that Wade already won a title as the MVP and #1 on his own team. Also, he didn't "go" anywhere. He stayed home on his team as talent was brought to him. Not implying he is on their level but, that was just like what Kobe did and just like what Jordan did.

JonnyBrav000
07-13-2010, 09:11 AM
Agree 100%. Wade would have left.

The fact is their job is to win championships. If I were in their shoes i wish i could be as noble and say i would leave money on the table. Fact is people remember winners whether they stayed with original team or left.

Oscar Robertson, Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Moses Malone, Bob Macadoo. All greats! because they won, and did so emphatically regarless of where they played.

Lebrons' no different.


Only Wade left money on the table guy... Lebron and Bosh would have been paying income taxes to the government playing on other teams. Basically Lebron and Bosh are going to make more basketball money in Miami than they would have anywhere else because of this, despite the appearance of them leaving money on the table, which they really didn't.

Jaji
07-13-2010, 09:26 AM
Sorry but you aren't very smart yourself. How can you possibly say Wade is not on Lebron's level???

Wade has a championship and a finals MVP, what does Lebron have???

Are you one of those guys who just looks at stats? If you are then remember that since 2007 Lebron has been surrounded by much better talent than Wade and also, when the stars get together to play in the olympics, Wade is usually outperforming Lebron. Wade has more of a killer instinct and is more clutch than Lebron as well. Plus Lebron quit on his team in the playoffs, he is easily frustrated. Right now Wade is the captain and Lebron will have to defer. It's Wade's team.

By the way, you have no idea if Amare or Bosh will ever make the hall of fame. both guys are still young and in the prime of their careers.

Also, Lebron will never have Warren Buffet money, so I don't get how you can say Lebron is chasing Warren Buffet when Buffet and Lebron do their business in different industries.

So does Chauncey Billups :shrug:. What has Wade done since then without Shaq? Last time I saw him he was just barely avoiding another 1st round sweep. Meanwhile LeBron is the reigning 2x MVP. Or did you miss the last 4 years of basketball?

They've both had shiddy teams. Difference is LeBron was able to carry a shiddy team to the Finals in 07 all by himself, with no help. Meanwhile, Wade has just 1 playoff win his last 2 trips to the post season. Wade has 1 playoff win in his career without another All Star. James has how many? Killer instinct :laugh2:? How about at least making a series interesting Wade.

heattiltheend94
07-13-2010, 09:28 AM
This is obvious, Wade already got a championship, pretty much singlehandedly.

Thisisouryear!!
07-13-2010, 09:30 AM
they both dont have the mindset or heart of a kobe or MJ bottom line...

Thisisouryear!!
07-13-2010, 09:31 AM
This is obvious, Wade already got a championship, pretty much singlehandedly.

Shaq :confused:

Thisisouryear!!
07-13-2010, 09:32 AM
Wanting someone good on your team means you shouldn't be great when it's all said and done?

I'm sure Kobe wanted Gasol, and Artest.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Wow did u just compare gasol and artest to lebron?!?!?!?! gasol a second option and artest a third option at BEST at this point of his career, more of a forth option...

HiphopRelated
07-13-2010, 09:43 AM
Yah i agree i dont like kobe he did try to be traded. All i know is lebron will never be micheal jordan. Mj was a free agent and everyone wanted him to go to ny But mj said **** that there my rivals why would i go to that .Same with larry bird had the chance to leave. Those guys are the true stars. **** lebron And im not to thirlled with wade even though i like the way wade plays he is JUst as good as lebron if not better and can carry his team in the playoffs unlike lebron!
MJ was only 4 years in when he signed that 8 year *** rape deal.

All these guys signed their 1st extensions

Meaze_Gibson
07-13-2010, 10:30 AM
People are really goin in on Wade like he didn't lead the Heat as a rookie to 2nd round..
..Like he didn't hit the gamewinner in playoffs over b davis.
..Like he didnt torch ron artest and dunk over. jermaine oneal HIS ROOKIE YEAR..
..Like he isn't the best shot-blocking guard (even better than bron bron)
..Like he didnt lead a sub par team to playoffs (Kobe was 1st rnd exit pre gasol)

Wade's career is legit and solidified as one of the most hard-working superstars in the League..Chanucey and to some degree Pip is a slap in the face

PHX2daDEATH
07-13-2010, 10:45 AM
Wade = Loyal Genius with a Ring
Lebron= Disloyal follower without a ring

NY Till I Die
07-13-2010, 10:51 AM
D-WADE is a pimp, nuff said. He got arguably the best player in the league to take way less money to come and help him win his second ring. And threw in another big man to try and seal the deal. All for less money.

In the words of Jay-Z " Look in the mirror you always be #2", Lebron. If it were really about winning and not about money he should have taken the mid level exception and played with the Lakers.

JonnyBrav000
07-13-2010, 11:08 AM
So does Chauncey Billups :shrug:. What has Wade done since then without Shaq? Last time I saw him he was just barely avoiding another 1st round sweep. Meanwhile LeBron is the reigning 2x MVP. Or did you miss the last 4 years of basketball?

They've both had shiddy teams. Difference is LeBron was able to carry a shiddy team to the Finals in 07 all by himself, with no help. Meanwhile, Wade has just 1 playoff win his last 2 trips to the post season. Wade has 1 playoff win in his career without another All Star. James has how many? Killer instinct :laugh2:? How about at least making a series interesting Wade.

Well Chauncey Billips is no-one to laugh at. He's a champion, finals MVP and he beat the Kobe and Shaq Lakers. Also, he doesn't quit on his team and performs to the best of his potential late in close ball games.

Anyway, over the last 4 years Lebron has had a way better supporting cast than Wade, no question. If Lebron and Wade could have traded places, the heat would have been just as bad in the playoffs, maybe they would have done a little better in the regular season, but the Cavs would have probably performed better with Wade in the playoffs because the guy just always gives it his all, meanwhile Lebron is super talented and the game comes easy to him, but when things get difficult he gets frustrated and he sometimes takes his talent for granted. If Wade would have been on the team, I would bet the Cavs would not have been swept by the Spurs. They still would have lost of course, but Wade is going to show everyone this season how everyone sweating Lebron is a joke when there are other players including himself that deserve a little more attention.

Either way it doesn't matter because the Lakers are still the team to beat and are a better team then the Heat are right now.

ChicagoRox
07-13-2010, 11:23 AM
People are really goin in on Wade like he didn't lead the Heat as a rookie to 2nd round..
..Like he didn't hit the gamewinner in playoffs over b davis.
..Like he didnt torch ron artest and dunk over. jermaine oneal HIS ROOKIE YEAR..
..Like he isn't the best shot-blocking guard (even better than bron bron)
..Like he didnt lead a sub par team to playoffs (Kobe was 1st rnd exit pre gasol)

Wade's career is legit and solidified as one of the most hard-working superstars in the League.Chanucey and to some degree Pip is a slap in the face

While you have some valid points your kinda of wrong to insult Chauncey and Pippen. Chauncey led a team with no "superstars: to a title. And Pippen took a Jordan-less Bulls deep into the playoffs(probably to the finals if there was no phantom call). So don't be slappin Chanucey and Pip in the face. But I am pretty sure after Wade's Career is over he will be comparable.

And Lebron is a forward so what validation does the best shot-blocking guard have to do with it?

As far Wade is concerned, He really didn't do nothing wrong but campaign for his current team. Only thing I didn't like was him bringing up his Kids and saying crap like he would come to Chicago because of his kids. Sound like he is being a dbag as a dad. Leave your family comments to urself Wade and congrats on forming a killer trio.

Meaze_Gibson
07-13-2010, 11:56 AM
Chauncey Does Not Compare With Wade..While he did lead, Chauncey also had a legit AND CONSISTENT 20 pt scorer in Richard Hamilton and Defensive Player of the Year in Ben Wallace. Wade was the only person on Heat squad to average 20 a game in the Playoffs that Finals year. Shaq was not a 20 point playoff scorer when Heat won it all Since then Chauncey has continually played with consistent 20 pt scorers and Wade hasn't. Don't let Chauncey's better teams suggest he was a better or comparable player to Dwyane Wade.

Pip Had 1 year being the Man and lead to the 2nd Round--same spot Wade took the Heat his rookie year. You cannot compare a player who had 1 year to one who has been the Man basically since he entered. Pip failed to lead Portland, He failed in Houston, both without Jordan yet, with other stars. What makes you think he would succeed as the man? Hall of Fame player no doubt. beast defensively but the heart of a tin can..Don't compare quitting players with no heart to Wade either.

LTS
07-13-2010, 12:23 PM
this crap gets old. None of them are quitters. People who are quitters are people like Shaq who quit on the Heat mid season and end up being traded to a contender. I've been a heat fan since day one and my favorite players went Glen Rice to Alonzo Mourning to Dwyane Wade. If Wade would have left the Heat to Chicago it would have sucked but no way would i sit around and call him a quitter because he changed teams for better chances at winning a title. Anyone who sits around and criticizes these players for putting themselves in the best position to win and be happy is simply bitter. the end


this is sooooo comical. Did he not ask to be traded after losing in the playoffs after shaq left?????? Funny how you guys put Kobe on this pedestal of almighty loyalty when its far from the case. No Gasol no contract extension from Kobe believe that. Kobe is a legend on the court but as for this so called loyalty thing, stop.

I think he covered it

as for Wade he is still one of the greatest players in the league and of the three he should be the last to be getting tarnished by some stupid fans for this move remeber this Heat wanted Wade signed before going after Lebron

CowboysKB24
07-13-2010, 12:28 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.

Dude, just get over it. LBJ ruined his career by doing this. Everyone has lost all respect for this guy.

uws
07-13-2010, 12:29 PM
lebron=follower
bosh=follower

wade=great player so scared that he cant do it alone that he needs to bring in not one but two top 7 players in the league

8kobe24
07-13-2010, 12:31 PM
wade = recruiter = leader
lebron,bosh = recruits = followers/disciples/sidekicks/b,c

CowboysKB24
07-13-2010, 12:41 PM
No one has respect for any three of these guys. We assume great players want to play against the best players, not with them. That is why there is the loss of respect. The breed is dying of Kobe, Magic, MJ, etc. These guys wanted to be the man and undoubtedly the best player in the league. They wanted to play against each other and beat each other. The breed is dying. LBJ, Wade, Bosh took the easy way by creating the USA team in the NBA. It is upsetting, we expect more from the "best player in the league". If he is so good why does he need the second best player in the league and the best big man to win?

CowboysKB24
07-13-2010, 12:43 PM
So does Chauncey Billups :shrug:. What has Wade done since then without Shaq? Last time I saw him he was just barely avoiding another 1st round sweep. Meanwhile LeBron is the reigning 2x MVP. Or did you miss the last 4 years of basketball?

They've both had shiddy teams. Difference is LeBron was able to carry a shiddy team to the Finals in 07 all by himself, with no help. Meanwhile, Wade has just 1 playoff win his last 2 trips to the post season. Wade has 1 playoff win in his career without another All Star. James has how many? Killer instinct :laugh2:? How about at least making a series interesting Wade.

Yeah LBJ's team was so shiddy that he won back to back MVPs and had the best record for two years (ALL BY HIMSELF). Shaq, Z, Jamison, Mo Williams, Anderson Varejo, Delonte West, JJ Hickson, Leon Powe, are soo bad. Please. What are you talking about? Do you watch basketball? Last year the Cavs dominated every playoff team during the regular season... why did they get crushed by them in the playoffs? Because LBJ did NOT BRING IT. He left it at home, which is why he got sent home every year.

LBJ is so good he needs Wade and Bosh to even compete for a title. That is the truth. Stop trying to protect LBJ, he gave up on doing it alone and could not handle the pressure of it. We all saw what he was capable of with out the two other best players in the league, and that was underachieve.

justinnum1
07-13-2010, 12:59 PM
So does Chauncey Billups :shrug:. What has Wade done since then without Shaq? Last time I saw him he was just barely avoiding another 1st round sweep. Meanwhile LeBron is the reigning 2x MVP. Or did you miss the last 4 years of basketball?

They've both had shiddy teams. Difference is LeBron was able to carry a shiddy team to the Finals in 07 all by himself, with no help. Meanwhile, Wade has just 1 playoff win his last 2 trips to the post season. Wade has 1 playoff win in his career without another All Star. James has how many? Killer instinct :laugh2:? How about at least making a series interesting Wade.

:facepalm: You are the biggest lebron homer

8kobe24
07-13-2010, 01:10 PM
:facepalm: You are the biggest lebron homer

bang!!!

Jaji
07-13-2010, 01:13 PM
The first time you clearly meant his whole career legacy because never clarified that you meant *SPECIFICALLY* post season legacies... which are never compared in such a weird vacuum like that where you exclude regular season. Then you changed it in your next post which was smart.

Well if I didn't *SPECIFICALLY* mention post season it's because I thought people would be bright enough to figure that out since that's what we're clearly talking about and I clearly mentioned Finals MVP and clearly no one cares about regular season legacies if there even is such a thing. My fault for giving you the benefit of the doubt, I guess. Do you need help tying your shoes also?


Yoooo you remember T-Mac the beast back in the DAY? YOU ARE OLD SCHOOL! :laugh: Okay I'm bein a prick. I'll stop. If you really think Wade's Miami Heat teams of the past few years compare with LeBron's Cavaliers teams then I'll just have to agree to disagree because I don't even think it's close. That's where the argument stops for me.

On PSD that is old school because most people on this site think T Mac is a straight scrub. They forget he was once mentioned with the likes of Kobe as best swingman in the game. But when I started watching basketball the Pistons were the champs, and I'm talking about Isaiah and Dumars, for those (you) who might need clarification.

Tony_Starks
07-13-2010, 01:21 PM
If hatin is an occupation, then Lebron currently employs half the nation.

Giantwarrior
07-13-2010, 01:22 PM
D-wade is a loser.

Sportfan
07-13-2010, 01:23 PM
All the Lebron bashers keep saying how he quit, how he'll never be compared to MJ or Kobe because he couldn't lead his team, etc etc. Those arn't my beliefs at all, but that's a different story. What I'm asking is, if everyone who does take that viewpoint agrees that Lebron is a coward/quitter/etc, then what is D-Wade?

"Kobe or MJ would never go team up with with one of the best".
This seems to be a huge point in debating that Lebron won't come close to their level now. They say Lebron will always be remembered for having to team up with someone to win. So where's the hate for D-Wade? Are you saying there's no hate for him because he's already PROVEN that he could win (by winning a finals and getting a finals MVP)? That argument isn't the greatest. First off, Wade had Shaq... he did not take a team of scrubs and turn them into winners, but I will give DWade props on what he worked with to win that finals.

I think it's all stupid. Lebron & D-Wade are going to be remembered for this trio that they are in, not for what they did previously in their careers (my beliefs). When all is said and done, I believe 15 years from now, when you think of Lebron, you'll think of the trio of players that accomplished whatever they are going to (or not). Same with Wade. Same with Bosh. No one is going to say "Oh yeah, those three guys teaming up. Wade was a winner, but Lebron was just a little girl who couldn't do it until he went to a winner's team.

Wade WANTED Lebron on his team. What does that say about Wade? Wade has the most to gain in this situation and the least to lose, and Lebron has EVERYTHING to lose in this trio if they do not win a championship.


That was with a Shaq who was 34 during the finals, and couldn't play more than 30 min a game.


The bolded part is what puts the hate on Lebron not wade. Wade didn't go to Lebron's team. Lebron went to Wade's team, making Wade look superior and being the one that could attract the big name(s)

ILMindState
07-13-2010, 01:26 PM
People are quick to dismiss Pippen. Pippen was a top player, especially when Jordan retired. Pete freakn Meyers replaced Jordan and Pip still lead them to the Eastern Conference Finals in 93-94 and could have made the finals w/o a phantom foul call from Hue Hollins. The next season he lead the Bulls in every major statistical category

Jaji
07-13-2010, 01:36 PM
I have to disagree completely with you--i honestly believe Scottie Pippen is one of the most overrated players ever---having the luxury of playing with Mike allowed Scottie to receive tons of accolades he never deserved. I remember when Jordan took his chances in baseball down in Birmingham farm system, that WAS Scottie's team than. They wouldn't have even been playoff bound those 2 years had Chicago not brought over Toni Kukoc who played sidekick to Scottie..I think Pippen's best year was around 21 ppg 7 rpg and about 4-5 assists..granted those are wonderful numbers and he was a very good on ball defender, but not enough for the HOF and especially not for the 50 greatest players in the NBA (documented list back in 1996.)

One of the largest travesties, i believe, is how the human highlight film Dominique Wilkins, who constantly was 2nd in scoring behind Jordan almost every year (averaging 28-29 ppg for at least a stretch of 6-7 yrs,) was left off the 50 greatest players ever and they put an above average player like Pippen in this hallowed group.

My reason for speaking about Pippen so much? Because all of these people insist that Michael couldn't win alone...are you kidding me?? The guy was an absolute monster---6 titles in 6 attempts.. He didn't need a bunch of all stars traded onto his team, rather he took mediocre/above average players and got the very best out of them...oh and p.s. I'm a die hard knicks fan who loathes MJ, but can accept how great he truly was.

You're insane if you think Pippen wasn't a big part of Chicago's success. You can't fake your way into the HOF. And in 93-94 Pippen averaged 22 points, 9 boards and 6 assists. Not to mention 3 steals per game (Scottie was also 8x 1st team All Defense). Really there's no excuse for you understating of all his stats and your misinformation on an internet forum. Ever hear of Google? You'll get burned every time doing that.

When Scottie was the man he had no legit sidekick. Toni Kukoc? Are you kidding? He didn't even start! He averaged 9.3 ppg in the 93-94 season. Major fail with that one.

But you're right, Scottie Pippen wasn't important at all to Chicago's success :rolleyes:.

You basically just gave Dominique's argument when the 50th anniversary team came out. The first thing he did was hate on Scottie. Scottie did 2 things Dominique never did: win and play defense. Wait, 3 things. Scottie also passed the ball.

Jaji
07-13-2010, 01:41 PM
:facepalm: You are the biggest lebron homer

I'd rather be a LeBron homer than a Wade d!ck rider. 1) because LeBron is better and 2) d!ck riding is pretty gay.

I do have to give Wade props though. I wouldn't think it possible to make a jumper with a grown man clinging to his nuts. Props for that D Wade :clap:.

Jaji
07-13-2010, 01:45 PM
That was with a Shaq who was 34 during the finals, and couldn't play more than 30 min a game.


The bolded part is what puts the hate on Lebron not wade. Wade didn't go to Lebron's team. Lebron went to Wade's team, making Wade look superior and being the one that could attract the big name(s)

Shaq averaged 20 a game that year and 18 in the playoffs.

And LeBron didn't go to Wade's team. They teamed up. Miami just happened to be the location because it's well, Miami. Who in their right mind would move to Cleveland for any reason? They could have just as easily teamed up in NY or Chicago though.

Meaze_Gibson
07-13-2010, 02:05 PM
Where is this OD pip love coming from?..He made it to 2nd Round without Jordan..Not Eastern Finals but 2nd round. He's hit probably 1 game-winner in his entire career. He is great defensive player. Good Playmaker. Above average scorer at best. He is and always will be a number two..you dont become a number 1 by barely crackin 20 a game..Now, he's Probably the best sidekick ever but its wild to compare him to dudes who had to hold teams down solo FOR YEARS.

At 33 pip averaged 14 pts a game in 40 minutes..Barkley gave almost 20 and 13 at age 33..GP gave you 20 and 8 at 33 yrs..Mitch Ritchmond even gave you 16 a game at 35..Pip didn't even do anything, not even statwise, without jordan minus that 1 year he mad it to 2nd round..He's not a number 1 fellas..Not in his dna..Its cheating to compare him with players like Wade and Bron who were the man for their squads.

PLAYERS FAN
07-13-2010, 02:33 PM
People are really goin in on Wade like he didn't lead the Heat as a rookie to 2nd round..
..Like he didn't hit the gamewinner in playoffs over b davis.
..Like he didnt torch ron artest and dunk over. jermaine oneal HIS ROOKIE YEAR..
..Like he isn't the best shot-blocking guard (even better than bron bron)
..Like he didnt lead a sub par team to playoffs (Kobe was 1st rnd exit pre gasol)

Wade's career is legit and solidified as one of the most hard-working superstars in the League..Chanucey and to some degree Pip is a slap in the face

Why many heat fans always say this. I always thought it was Eddie Jones the 3 time all-star who lead that team to the playoffs. He was the leading scorer at 17.3 and Odom was second at 17.1 a game. Wade was the thrid Averaging 16.2 a game.

I always though Wade was the third option on that team.

Meaze_Gibson
07-13-2010, 02:41 PM
Why many heat fans always say this. I always thought it was Eddie Jones the 3 time all-star who lead that team to the playoffs. He was the leading scorer at 17.3 and Odom was second at 17.1 a game. Wade was the thrid Averaging 16.2 a game.

I always though Wade was the third option on that team.

Check their playoff stats tho..Wade led em in points and assists both series..Also check fg%.. Thats a leading quality to me.

CowboysKB24
07-13-2010, 03:41 PM
Shaq averaged 20 a game that year and 18 in the playoffs.

And LeBron didn't go to Wade's team. They teamed up. Miami just happened to be the location because it's well, Miami. Who in their right mind would move to Cleveland for any reason? They could have just as easily teamed up in NY or Chicago though.

And they went to Miami because they would get paid there, unlike anywhere else. It was the only place it was possible for them to get together. The organization did a great job of clearing the cap space, but I think the props people are giving to Riley is a overrated. Wade is the primary reason they went there and because it was possible. Riley did have a part in making it possible, but it is not like he did something crazy to get LBJ there. Still though, LBJ came to Wade's team and his city. That'll never change.