PDA

View Full Version : Why is LeBron a "traitor" and not Shaq?



Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:15 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

lakerboy
07-09-2010, 10:18 PM
a.) lebron was born and raised in Ohio.

b.) lebron created a whole fiasco, just to dump his team on national television.

j-bay
07-09-2010, 10:18 PM
because lebron is sort of a hometown boy

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:18 PM
Dont think Shaq had an hour long ESPN special..

What?
07-09-2010, 10:18 PM
When he left it wasn't a hour long special about Lebron promoting lebron...

JordansBulls
07-09-2010, 10:19 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

They both are, the difference with Shaq is he went to a team that did not have an established superstar.

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:20 PM
They both are, the difference with Shaq is he went to a team that did not have an established superstar.

Yea,Shaq was already a Laker when they got Kobe.

GrumpyOldMan
07-09-2010, 10:22 PM
I don't think Lebron is a traitor at all. He had every right in the world to exercise the rights given to him in the NBA Collective Bargaining agreement....just like anybody else that leaves one team for another.
What he did that is special is have a one hour humiliation of his former team on international tv. So no, Lebron isn't a traitor. He's an immature punk.

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:25 PM
Yea,Shaq was already a Laker when they got Kobe.

:facepalm:

And you call yourself a Laker fan?

Lemme educate you, young buck. The Lakers traded Vlade Divac for Kobe Bryant after he was drafted by the Charlotte Hornets in order to free up cap space so they could sign Shaq.

You just put Shaq's size 20-whatever shoe in your mouth.

IAmKira
07-09-2010, 10:27 PM
Shaq didnt put 6 teams on hold and then screw every1 over with no free agents left to get. Shaq didnt put up this whole dramatic offseason and screw his hometown n his fans. Shaq wasnt as loved in orlando as "Lebum" in cleveland. I Can keep going..

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:28 PM
a.) lebron was born and raised in Ohio.

b.) lebron created a whole fiasco, just to dump his team on national television.

a) He's from Akron, not Cleveland. 2 different cities.

b) What difference would that have made whether he announced it or someone else did? Going on TV doesn't make a person a traitor.

97NYer
07-09-2010, 10:28 PM
a.) lebron was born and raised in Ohio.

b.) lebron created a whole fiasco, just to dump his team on national television.

This.

kEviN21
07-09-2010, 10:28 PM
Cleveland is dumb and thought they OWNED Lebron. They created his ego! :)

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:29 PM
because lebron is sort of a hometown boy

You're right, sort of. He's from a different city. But hey, Shaq opted out of his deal. LeBron was a straight up FA with no contract.

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:29 PM
Dont think Shaq had an hour long ESPN special..

I think you need to look up the definition of traitor. It has nothing to do with going on television.

iggypop123
07-09-2010, 10:30 PM
shaq went to a team whose best players were eddie jones and elden campbell. lebron went to a team whose best players were wade and bosh.

hugepatsfan
07-09-2010, 10:31 PM
You're right, sort of. He's from a different city. But hey, Shaq opted out of his deal. LeBron was a straight up FA with no contract.

:facepalm:

hugepatsfan
07-09-2010, 10:32 PM
The only people saying he is a traitor are CLE fans. But he is taking the easy way out. I don't have a problem with it, but it's the truth. Others hate on it. I just think, and always have thought, that LBJ is a cocky arrogant prick. I love the fact that so many PSDers share my feelings now.

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:36 PM
:facepalm:

And you call yourself a Laker fan?

Lemme educate you, young buck. The Lakers traded Vlade Divac for Kobe Bryant after he was drafted by the Charlotte Hornets in order to free up cap space so they could sign Shaq.

You just put Shaq's size 20-whatever shoe in your mouth.

Well ill now educate you,I knew they both came to LA the same year. Shaq was already a proven player and Kobe a rookie at age 18 at the time didnt play to much. Now if you look at the thread title my previous post should make since.

gcoll
07-09-2010, 10:37 PM
Because most sports fans seem to lack the ability to think.

Any fan that talks about "loyalty" is a douche. It's a business. And fans don't think loyalty should be a two way street. As soon as they have a chance to make their team better, by trading away a couple of their guys...they salivate.

stawka
07-09-2010, 10:37 PM
Because PSD wasn't around to hate on LeBron. Nobody but the fans of Cleveland have a reason to hate him.

Your either a) jealous
or b) a typical LeBron hater

bholly
07-09-2010, 10:39 PM
Shaq was a traitor. At least to Orlando and a lot of non-laker fans. I was a kid, and I loved him when he played for Orlando. When he ditched on them and went to LA to try and get more spotlight I hated him, and if he didn't suck so much now I probably still would.

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:39 PM
Because PSD wasn't around to hate on LeBron. Nobody but the fans of Cleveland have a reason to hate him.

Your either a) jealous
or b) a typical LeBron hater

Yea thats it..

lakerboy
07-09-2010, 10:39 PM
See Heat fans, this is nothing personal. Nobody is complaining about Wade and Bosh. It's just really LeBron.

hotpotato1092
07-09-2010, 10:40 PM
You're all missing the point. Orlando, the organization and the fans, WANTED Shaq gone. Read the SI article about his free agency, they polled fans and I think over 50% didn't want to overpay him, and over 80% thought it was Penny's team. Clearly this wasn't the case with the Cavs.

stawka
07-09-2010, 10:42 PM
The thing that gets old is, it's MAINLY Laker fans. Worry about your own team, not what others are doing. Get Fisher back and you will be alright

As soon as Shaq went to Miami, PSD hated Wade. Shaq got traded to Phoenix and everyone started on LeBron. Now LeBron goes to Miami and the Heat are gonna be putting up with a lot of BS from these "fans"

JNA17
07-09-2010, 10:42 PM
1. Kobe was a rookie when Shaq joined, so lakers had no leader during the time.
2. Shaq did not request an hour about himself
3. shaq did not turn the FA into a circus

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:44 PM
shaq went to a team whose best players were eddie jones and elden campbell. lebron went to a team whose best players were wade and bosh.

Shaq went to a Lakers team that just lost in the 1st round of the playoffs.
LeBron went to a Heat team that just lost in the 1st round of the playoffs.

In all honesty, I think the 95-96 Lakers were better than the 09-10 Heat. The Heat play in the weak East and got handled in the playoffs. It wasn't even close. The Lakers, although swept by the Rockets, had EJ, Van Exel, and Campbell. They also started that year with Cedric Ceballos who averaged 21 ppg the year before and then traded him for Robert Horry, one of the best clutch shooters of all time.

LeBron didn't join a title contender. He made the Heat a title contender.

stawka
07-09-2010, 10:45 PM
I ask you this: if LeBron decided to go to the Lakers, Laker fans would LOVE him and be all like "he chose to go to the best organization" etc etc etc and somehow bring Kobe into it. The Bulls would have done the same thing - in fact, EVERY team would have, and the fans of every other team would have been doing what you guys are doing now

it's business. He put himself in a good situation and that's it. I'd prefer if he went NJ or a place with only one superstar, but it's business - whatev!

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:47 PM
You're all missing the point. Orlando, the organization and the fans, WANTED Shaq gone. Read the SI article about his free agency, they polled fans and I think over 50% didn't want to overpay him, and over 80% thought it was Penny's team. Clearly this wasn't the case with the Cavs.

That's BS. I remember some people saying that back then. But that was just a theory. Orlando tried everything they could to re-sign Shaq. Why wouldn't you want the 2nd best and obviously soon to be the best big man in the game?

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:50 PM
1. Kobe was a rookie when Shaq joined, so lakers had no leader during the time.
2. Shaq did not request an hour about himself
3. shaq did not turn the FA into a circus

Thanks for the input but none of that answers the question. That stuff has nothing to do with being a traitor.

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:50 PM
Im pretty sure Shaq didnt screw over his City His franchise and owner( who didnt even know anything at all not even a phone call) going forward its not easy winning a Chip they will see......lots of teams will be gunning for them.... I hope they wear some extra padding because its gonna get ugly:D

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:51 PM
^^^^

You guys just dont get it..

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:51 PM
Thanks for the input but none of that answers the question. That stuff has nothing to do with being a traitor.

I know you dont have any money, by the way .....other wise we can bet about your sig:rolleyes:

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:52 PM
Im pretty sure Shaq didnt screw over his City His franchise and owner( who didnt even know anything at all not even a phone call) going forward its not easy winning a Chip they will see......lots of teams will be gunning for them.... I hope they wear some extra padding because its gonna get ugly:D

Yeah, Orlando was in great shape after Shaq left :rolleyes:.

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:52 PM
^^^^

You guys just dont get it..

??

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:53 PM
:facepalm:

Why the facepalm? You don't think that's a valid point. Shaq was signed and opted out. That's not a bigger slap in the face?

Jaji
07-09-2010, 10:55 PM
I know you dont have any money, by the way .....other wise we can bet about your sig:rolleyes:

....or your girl ;).

ElMarroAfamado
07-09-2010, 10:55 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

:facepalm:

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:55 PM
Yeah, Orlando was in great shape after Shaq left :rolleyes:.

That was the biggest ******** stunt ever pulled in any sport and if you think Lebron was legit, then continue watching TNA and WWE:facepalm: David Stern is such as puss and didnt do a damn thing this was going on for a while too bad its the NBA:)

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:56 PM
??

I am talking about Jaji and other defending LeBron

ElMarroAfamado
07-09-2010, 10:56 PM
turn on the tv. you might get an answer to your question. you cant be this blind or ignorant

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:57 PM
....or your girl ;).

well its either fem guys or girls in south beach sooooo:p where are you:confused:

oak2455
07-09-2010, 10:58 PM
I am talking about Jaji and other defending LeBron

ohh ok :)

Giants27
07-09-2010, 10:58 PM
turn on the tv. you might get an answer to your question. you cant be this blind or ignorant

Thank You.

oak2455
07-09-2010, 11:01 PM
Thank You.

Back to Back right:confused: Its funny those bandwagon Heat fans I thought they won last year:eyebrow:

Giants27
07-09-2010, 11:04 PM
Back to Back right:confused: Its funny those bandwagon Heat fans I thought they won last year:eyebrow:

Not sure what your saying? lol

Jaji
07-09-2010, 11:09 PM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.

ntat
07-09-2010, 11:10 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans??? Its a totally different scenario. Shaq didnt go to the lakers and then get jordan and granthill to sign with him.

Giants27
07-09-2010, 11:12 PM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.

How about filling out your damn roster then we can chat about this.

Giants27
07-09-2010, 11:14 PM
Its a totally different scenario. Shaq didnt go to the lakers and then get jordan and granthill to sign with him.

Haha nice,Grant Hill will go down as one of the most undertaded players ever.

~Troy
07-09-2010, 11:24 PM
Im pretty sure Shaq didnt screw over his City His franchise and owner( who didnt even know anything at all not even a phone call) going forward its not easy winning a Chip they will see......lots of teams will be gunning for them.... I hope they wear some extra padding because its gonna get ugly:D

How exactly did LeBron screw over Cleveland? If anyone is taking this wrong it's Gilbert and Cavs fans. It's a business, and that team wasn't going to Win a Championship anytime soon without getting Bosh and Bosh wouldn't come there. So don't blame LeBron, blame Bosh for not accepting the Sign-an-Trade to Cleveland. It's kind of selfish for Cavs fans to think LeBron has to stay in Cleveland all because he was born in Akron, it's ludicrous thinking and I applaud LeBron for making the decision for giving himself the best chance to win. Cleveland tried to do that for him, but there was no way they could. So why force him to stay at an organization that wouldn't give him the best opportunity?

Jaji
07-09-2010, 11:26 PM
Its a totally different scenario. Shaq didnt go to the lakers and then get jordan and granthill to sign with him.

Oh I see, so you're supposed to find the crappiest team there is? No one wants to play with other good players? Now I understand why Kobe and Shaq didn't get along. Neither wanted to play with another good player. And that must be why Jordan retired, he was sick of playing with Scottie because he was so good.

And that still doesn't answer the question as to why LeBron is a traitor. Thanks for playing though.

~Troy
07-09-2010, 11:27 PM
Oh I see, so you're supposed to find the crappiest team there is? No one wants to play with other good players? Now I understand why Kobe and Shaq didn't get along. Neither wanted to play with another good player. And that must be why Jordan retired, he was sick of playing with Scottie because he was so good.

And that still doesn't answer the question as to why LeBron is a traitor. Thanks for playing though.

I agree completely. Couldn't have said it better myself.

oak2455
07-09-2010, 11:28 PM
Not sure what your saying? lol

Im saying the Lakers won back to back ships and the Heat sound like they won:confused::confused::confused:

Jaji
07-09-2010, 11:29 PM
How about filling out your damn roster then we can chat about this.

It's natural for you to try to deny it but it's quite evident that you are very insecure right now. Otherwise, why would it even matter to you?

THE_LOGO
07-09-2010, 11:29 PM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.

First of, I could care less where Lebron signed. I do not think he's a traitor, just mishandled the whole situation to say the least. He just rubs people the wrong way, perhaps unintentional but he does it nonetheless. As for Shaq, he wasn't that happy with the power struggle with him and Penny. Orlando chose wrong. If you don't remember, they were low-balling Shaq and not giving him the max while the Lakers did everything in their power to give Shaq more money. We kept trading players for the chance that Shaq "might" come. Orlando kept raising their offer only after the Lakers raised theirs. We made him feel wanted. Orlando made him work for his contract so he left.

On the other hand, lets look at Lebron. The organization did everything for him including treating his friends like royalty. They got him all the talent that he's ever asked for. Every year its some new big name player coming to him at his request. Kudos to Ferry for being able to pull off those trades. So basically, he recruited Mo Williams and Jamison over there and left them. Does that not constitute being a traitor? He supposedly liked all his teammates. The Cavs didn't try to lowball him. They did everything right by him and his payback is taking them to Jerry Springer. He's like the guy with no job that is supported by his girlfriend then goes on national tv and professes his love for another woman instead of just breaking it off with her in private. Now the Cavs are stuck with mediocre talent with a high payroll all thanks to Lebron playing GM and when he can't make it work, he leaves. That would be a traitor.

oak2455
07-09-2010, 11:30 PM
You know LBJ took the easy way out right?? Because it was too hard for him to work:(

CowboysKB24
07-09-2010, 11:31 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

Shaq didn't leave and call up Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson and say hey guys let's play together because I can't do it alone. He lead LA to a three peat as the leader of the team. He went to a team that luckily got KB24 (what I mean is no one thought Kobe would end up being the best player in the league at some point in his career) and turned into a dynasty... and don't for the Master, PJ.

And I don't think LBJ is traitor at all nor Shaq. Only CLE fans think that. You are able to sign with whatever team you want, but going to the extent of purposely setting up your contracts together and calling each other to play together is a little too far IMO especially when all 3 of you are top 5 players in the league. I am shocked that he would want to play with Wade and Bosh. I feel that the truly great players want to beat the best, not play with the best (that is what the Olympics and All-star game is for). That is all. It shocks me that Wade would want that too, but it isn't as bad as LBJ because Wade has already won a ring. He is the leader of the Heat, he is the King of the Miami. LBJ came to his city his team.

~Troy
07-09-2010, 11:31 PM
You know LBJ took the easy way out right?? Because it was too hard for him to work:(

He worked for 7 years in Cleveland already? :facepalm:

Laker Legend42
07-09-2010, 11:31 PM
I don't blame niether player for leaving. In Lebron's case yes, he earned the right to leave.However, there had to be a classier way to go about it. He didn't have to slap his home town in the face. Lebron said he did a lot for that organization but at the same time they did a lot for him. The Cavs should have been told ahead of time. I'm not saying what anyone should do with his or her money but that boys and girls club was one of the nicest I'd ever seen. I'm sure his local Boys and girls club needs more than the one in Ct. Shaq on the other hand didn't have coo plannes when he left. Shaq had issues with the team after his grandmother died and the coach was saying he needs to hurry back. He also had issues with guys that were as popular if not more popular than he was.Shaq also never gave them any false hope that he was staying. The only thing that makes Lebron's departure worse is the manner in which he did it. Lebron better be on his best behavior now because if he does anything just a lil bit to the left and the Cleveland media hears about it they will have all over the air waves.

THE_LOGO
07-09-2010, 11:32 PM
It's natural for you to try to deny it but it's quite evident that you are very insecure right now. Otherwise, why would it even matter to you?

Speaking of insecure, why was it that at your "party for winning nothing" everyone was chanting our team's name? By the way, I'm pissed that they cut into my Lakers summer pro league game to televise this nonsense which is why I'm taking it out on you.

cubsofchicago
07-09-2010, 11:44 PM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.

WTF man you really dont make any sense everyone knows lebron didnt sign with last years team. the 09-10 heat dont exist anymore before lebron sign how many players were in the roster or right 4. bosh wade and 2 other scrubs. Why on earth would you say lebron was signing with the 09-10 heat? its clear that what lebron wanted to sign up for was 2 other guys to do the hard stuff in the playoffs. its almost a fact that lebron quit in the last playoffs and that little comment about him "spoiling people with his play over th last couple of season" wtf is that soposto mean? the fact is he cant and knows he cant step up in the finals but he still wants the ring. if he though he would he would have signed with the bulls they are a better team and had the better pieces and i think also might have offered more money than the heat. but no lebron wasnt thinking about that... lebron was and is scared of the finals and the playoffs and knows down deep inside he cant handle it and cant step up so he will clinge to wade and bash to make those shot step up and take over a game when its trully important and it seems the team has already lost. at the end if the heat do win a campionship it will be becuse of wade or bash the 2 players in the heat team that have the balls and talent to be able to step up in those games. ehh proboly not bosh because let face it he himself has said he doesnt want to be the man...so its basicly up to wade.. il bet anything that when it goes down and if the heat do win a tittle the person that it will all be due to is wade. and right next to him knelling trying to and asking wade for some of that glory will be lebron (the best talent that didnt have the balls to win an nba trophy)....

Bornknick73
07-09-2010, 11:45 PM
I think this is gonna turn on him like Tiger Woods. They better win it all the first year, if not the media will pick them apart. Then they better hope there isnt a lock out, which thanks to the Prince is almost a certainty.

Laker Legend42
07-10-2010, 12:22 AM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.

Memphis wanted draft picks and expiring contracts and thats what they got. Chicago could have had Pau but Deng was too valuable. Dumb move by the Bulls

bulldog312
07-10-2010, 12:26 AM
Because Shaq didn't collude with other teams/free agents to build a super team on a roster gutted specifically for that purpose. It was simply 1 free agent signing, without all this drama and narcissistic act. I have always hated the Lakers but what Shaq did was completely different.

Mochalman
07-10-2010, 12:28 AM
anyone else laugh at espn when they said downtown cleveland will lose 20mil a season when lebron leaves? how much money did he make them in 7 years? must be the real reason they are pissed, he bankrupted an entire city! hah. poor cleveland.

Tony_Starks
07-10-2010, 12:58 AM
I don't blame niether player for leaving. In Lebron's case yes, he earned the right to leave.However, there had to be a classier way to go about it. He didn't have to slap his home town in the face. Lebron said he did a lot for that organization but at the same time they did a lot for him. The Cavs should have been told ahead of time. I'm not saying what anyone should do with his or her money but that boys and girls club was one of the nicest I'd ever seen. I'm sure his local Boys and girls club needs more than the one in Ct. Shaq on the other hand didn't have coo plannes when he left. Shaq had issues with the team after his grandmother died and the coach was saying he needs to hurry back. He also had issues with guys that were as popular if not more popular than he was.Shaq also never gave them any false hope that he was staying. The only thing that makes Lebron's departure worse is the manner in which he did it. Lebron better be on his best behavior now because if he does anything just a lil bit to the left and the Cleveland media hears about it they will have all over the air waves.



Thats pretty much how I see it. I don't think he owed it to them to stay because at the end of the day management uses most average players until they deem them no longer valuable and ship them out of town with no regards to their wishes on location in the name of "this is a business." So as far as Im concerned that door swings both ways, if its a business for them then its a business for the player too. He did what was best for him and I don't blame him one bit.

Like you the only thing I take issue with is him not sitting down with Gilbert and looking him in the eye like a man and giving him his decision. Now granted after the childish way Gilbert reacted who's to say he probably would've blabbed it to the media out of spite. But regardless I think ethically that would've been the right thing to do.

It's like leaving a company you've been with for a while to go to a better company. Technically you can just call in and say hey Im never coming back see ya but most people would do the right thing and give them proper notice and thank them for the opportunity.

_KB24_
07-10-2010, 01:01 AM
Even Shaq had the courtesy of not acting like a dick on national television and toying with the hearts of his fellow hometowners. And Shaq didn't walk into another man's team like Prince James. He wanted to be the leader, not piggy back like LePrincess.

slyone_nyc
07-10-2010, 01:03 AM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

learn your nba history before you make yourself look like a fool... SHAQ LEFT THE MAGIC BECAUSE THEY WERE MORE FOCUSED ON RETAINING COACH BRIAN HILL THEN RETAINING HIM, HE FELT DISRESPECTED AND SNUBBED SO, HE MOVED ON... ITS THAT SIMPLE, LOOK IT UP...

KINGBAIZE
07-10-2010, 01:11 AM
Shaq didn't follow 2 other superstars to a specific team... and when Shaq went to LA Kobe Bryant wasn't even "Kobe Bryant" at the time. Shaq left Orlando as "The Man" and went to LA as "the Man".

Lebron actually had a shot to leave a Jordan type legacy behind... but he can't even do it now. Scoring titles...career points...championships without SEVERE help... thats all out of the window now. He just won't get the same amount of credit as the legends... and he won't have the ball enough to eclipse those records he could have had a chance to.

Jaji
07-10-2010, 01:12 AM
First of, I could care less where Lebron signed. I do not think he's a traitor, just mishandled the whole situation to say the least. He just rubs people the wrong way, perhaps unintentional but he does it nonetheless. As for Shaq, he wasn't that happy with the power struggle with him and Penny. Orlando chose wrong. If you don't remember, they were low-balling Shaq and not giving him the max while the Lakers did everything in their power to give Shaq more money. We kept trading players for the chance that Shaq "might" come. Orlando kept raising their offer only after the Lakers raised theirs. We made him feel wanted. Orlando made him work for his contract so he left.

On the other hand, lets look at Lebron. The organization did everything for him including treating his friends like royalty. They got him all the talent that he's ever asked for. Every year its some new big name player coming to him at his request. Kudos to Ferry for being able to pull off those trades. So basically, he recruited Mo Williams and Jamison over there and left them. Does that not constitute being a traitor? He supposedly liked all his teammates. The Cavs didn't try to lowball him. They did everything right by him and his payback is taking them to Jerry Springer. He's like the guy with no job that is supported by his girlfriend then goes on national tv and professes his love for another woman instead of just breaking it off with her in private. Now the Cavs are stuck with mediocre talent with a high payroll all thanks to Lebron playing GM and when he can't make it work, he leaves. That would be a traitor.

I don't think you have all the facts about O'Neal. It was 14 years ago and there really is no way to prove it either way but I find it hard to believe Orlando didn't want Shaq. I know some reporters were saying they should let him go and let Penny be the guy but if that's the case, why would Orlando even offer anything?

And that Jerry Springer comparison was horrible. LeBron is the guy being supported by his GF? How about LeBron is the guy who payed to get his ugly GF some plastic surgery. The Cavs were a joke before he got there. He turned them into contenders. Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison are not major additions. Mo Williams is a 6'-1" SG who tries to play point. Jamison is an undersized PF who is past his prime.

kyubi256
07-10-2010, 01:14 AM
Shaq did not do it in National TV to embarrass his team. And Kobe wasn't a superstar at the time. It was still Shaq's team

slyone_nyc
07-10-2010, 01:14 AM
How exactly did LeBron screw over Cleveland? If anyone is taking this wrong it's Gilbert and Cavs fans. It's a business, and that team wasn't going to Win a Championship anytime soon without getting Bosh and Bosh wouldn't come there. So don't blame LeBron, blame Bosh for not accepting the Sign-an-Trade to Cleveland. It's kind of selfish for Cavs fans to think LeBron has to stay in Cleveland all because he was born in Akron, it's ludicrous thinking and I applaud LeBron for making the decision for giving himself the best chance to win. Cleveland tried to do that for him, but there was no way they could. So why force him to stay at an organization that wouldn't give him the best opportunity?

is it me OR DID EVERYONE IN THE MEDIA AND MANY NBA FANS HAD LA-VS-CLEVELAND IN THE FINALS BEFORE THE PLAYOFFS STARTED???? NOW EVERYONES SAYING THEY DIDNT PUT ANY PIECES AROUND HIM??? ALSO, HE MAY HAVE TRIED TO GET BOSH TO CLEVELAND IN THE OFF SEASON, BUT WHO ELSE DID HE TRY AND RECRUIT??? HE GAVE UP ON CLEVELAND WHEN HE TOOK THEIR JERSEY OFF AFTER THE LOSS TO BOSTON AND NOW THE SELF PROCLAIMED KING HAS BECOME A SIDE KICK AKA SCOTTIE PIPPEN...

Giants88
07-10-2010, 01:14 AM
a.) lebron was born and raised in Ohio.

b.) lebron created a whole fiasco, just to dump his team on national television.

Bingo

CLEfansincbirth
07-10-2010, 01:15 AM
Cleveland is dumb and thought they OWNED Lebron. They created his ego! :)

watch more than a game tool his ego was created far before he was a cav

Beltrans Mole
07-10-2010, 01:17 AM
Cleveland is dumb and thought they OWNED Lebron. They created his ego! :)

thats a really great point. they made lebron what he is today by obsessing over him and giving him the royalty treatment. just because lebron is from cleveland doesnt mean he needs to stay there his whole life...thats unfair, especially for a global icon like himself. he gave his heart and soul to cleveland and they didnt win a ring, guess what? its time to move on. seven years he tried his best, and its a business at the end of the day. the city of cleveland could see this coming a mile away, and now is being dramatic.

gangis2169
07-10-2010, 01:18 AM
It was expected with Shaq because he was and still is a Fat Lazy peice of crap. We all knew he was trying to latch on to another great for a ring. no suprise. Lebron is just a spoiled brat who needs to get his *** whopped!

kozelkid
07-10-2010, 01:18 AM
Why the facepalm? You don't think that's a valid point. Shaq was signed and opted out. That's not a bigger slap in the face?

BECAUSE THEY BOTH OPTED OUT!
Jesus Christ. You don't even know the players you root for.

And Lebron isn't a traitor. But he's a coward. A coward who has no problem dumping his team and love the attention as well.
Deep down inside he's a ***** and he solidified that fact by needing Wade and Bosh.

As for Shaq, he was expected to leave and no one wanted him back. But he never demanded the help from fellow superstars. He wasn't afraid. That's the difference. Shaq maybe an attention whore, but the most disappointing part about Lebron is that such a talented player is so afraid.

PlezPlayDKnicks
07-10-2010, 01:20 AM
Shaq left to be a man.. Lebron left to be a sidekick so he wont get blamed if they lose and share the glory of tryin to win multiple chips... And to be honest b4 this crazy display of quitting on his team during the playoffs and knowing he was leaving long b4 free agency started. The only time he has been successful in the playoffs were against injured teams (see finals run) or against teams that his team totally outmatched. Any close series he faded into obscurity. Thats why he ran to a team with 1 superstar and all star. He realized it would be 2 difficult to beat the lakers or boston without 2 other stars with him off top. Kobe and MJ or Shaq would never leave a team to be a Robin to 2 other stars... Clip up with one star in place and man up with quality role players and beat ur peers to live up to ur name..

Jaji
07-10-2010, 01:20 AM
Shaq didn't leave and call up Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson and say hey guys let's play together because I can't do it alone. He lead LA to a three peat as the leader of the team. He went to a team that luckily got KB24 (what I mean is no one thought Kobe would end up being the best player in the league at some point in his career) and turned into a dynasty... and don't for the Master, PJ.

And I don't think LBJ is traitor at all nor Shaq. Only CLE fans think that. You are able to sign with whatever team you want, but going to the extent of purposely setting up your contracts together and calling each other to play together is a little too far IMO especially when all 3 of you are top 5 players in the league. I am shocked that he would want to play with Wade and Bosh. I feel that the truly great players want to beat the best, not play with the best (that is what the Olympics and All-star game is for). That is all. It shocks me that Wade would want that too, but it isn't as bad as LBJ because Wade has already won a ring. He is the leader of the Heat, he is the King of the Miami. LBJ came to his city his team.

Posts like this make me wonder if you even know anything at all about basketball. Magic Johnson played for the Lakers the year before they signed Shaq. Why do I have to keep educating you "Laker" fans about your own team?

And, no Jordan nor Shaq could do it alone. Shaq didn't win anything until Kobe developed into a superstar. Jordan played on a team with Pippen. LeBron had Mo Williams (:speechless:).

And Bosh is not a top 5 player in the league. That's absolutely absurd. He's not even top 10. He barely makes my top 20.

There's nothing wrong with players recruiting each other and deciding to link up. Show the rule that outlaws that.

And who cares if Wade was there first. He's now the #2 guy. If they all went to Cleveland LeBron would be the guy. If they all went to the Knicks LeBron would be the guy. If they all went to the Nets LeBron would be the guy. So why would he not be the guy in Miami? They are still the same players. LeBron is the best player in the league. There is no doubt he is the best player on his own team.

You say the best want to beat the best. Okay, Kobe and the Lakers are the best. And Boston is the 2nd best. Wade and co. got dog walked in the playoffs last year. Bosh and co. didn't even make it. So how are they the best? Miami is a serious contender now, but only after signing LBJ. They still have to get past LAL, Boston, and maybe even Orlando. They are far from a complete team.

Sandman
07-10-2010, 01:21 AM
Cleveland didnt lowball Lebron. Shaq wasnt from Daytona.

Jaji
07-10-2010, 01:23 AM
BECAUSE THEY BOTH OPTED OUT!
Jesus Christ. You don't even know the players you root for.

And Lebron isn't a traitor. But he's a coward. A coward who has no problem dumping his team and love the attention as well.
Deep down inside he's a ***** and he solidified that fact by needing Wade and Bosh.

As for Shaq, he was expected to leave and no one wanted him back. But he never demanded the help from fellow superstars. He wasn't afraid. That's the difference. Shaq maybe an attention whore, but the most disappointing part about Lebron is that such a talented player is so afraid.

LeBron did not opt out, genius. His contract expired. Shaq had time left on his deal and opted out. Do you even know what "opting out" means? Obviously not. Way to stick your foot in your mouth though :clap:. The rest of your post isn't even worth reading because you proved you don't have a clue with the first sentence.

gangis2169
07-10-2010, 01:24 AM
thats a really great point. they made lebron what he is today by obsessing over him and giving him the royalty treatment. just because lebron is from cleveland doesnt mean he needs to stay there his whole life...thats unfair, especially for a global icon like himself. he gave his heart and soul to cleveland and they didnt win a ring, guess what? its time to move on. seven years he tried his best, and its a business at the end of the day. the city of cleveland could see this coming a mile away, and now is being dramatic.

Wow you are definately misinformed. Listen to Adrian Wojnarowski (Top NBA Insider) radio interview today on AM570 he tells it how it is the stuff you guys dont see. Why the Cavs are so mad and why Dan Gilbert is as much to blame for this as Lebron. He goes in depth about the staff and Danny Ferry/ Mike Brown telling Gilbert about Lebron's lack of respect for years. They tried to let Dan Gilbert know but Gilbert continued to follow the orders of Lebron. Lebron verbally told Gilbert the players to go after and Gilbert did it. Lebron demanded his whole posse to get jobs with the organization, problems with the practices and other numerous things. Look it up you'll see!

The Flash
07-10-2010, 01:26 AM
Ever wondered that maybe there were many things that we dont know about Lebron and Cleveland? Maybe he had a reason why he did it that way , maybe someday well find out maybe not. These guys are now rockstars and you have to realize times have changed ...we're just spectators afterall

kArSoN RyDaH
07-10-2010, 01:26 AM
jaji. your posts are gettin really annoying! please go delete yourself and proceed to hop in your car and drive off a very very very tall bridge.

psd thanks you =]

PlezPlayDKnicks
07-10-2010, 01:30 AM
True talk.. This thread is pointless... Dude is gonna discredit any logical post explaining why Lebron punked out. Nobody cares that he left besides cle fans. Its the option that he took and that was planned way ahead of time for him to try and win. U cant want all the glory and fame and be a billionare athlete and run and play with 2 allstars to try and win quick because u dont have faith in yourself... Lebron's road to success has been easy (as far as individual success). But when u have things easy he never developed that Killer instinct. Knowing that he joined a team which has that in Wade and a good supporting third star in Bosh. Makes his life easier in all angles.. ***** traitor move PERIOD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DfanAlways
07-10-2010, 01:30 AM
ALL THE ABOVE AND
THIS IS WHY LEBRON IS A TRAITOR


and quote
http://www.basketballnews.me/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/i-m-not-going-to-dissapoint-anybody-lebron-james-wallpaper.jpg

.... well.. wasn't that a big fat lie to his hometown, home state team... and the entire organization of Cleveland. Whoops :rolleyes:

The Flash
07-10-2010, 01:30 AM
jaji. your posts are gettin really annoying! please go delete yourself and proceed to hop in your car and drive off a very very very tall bridge.

psd thanks you =]

I must admit you made me smile

gangis2169
07-10-2010, 01:34 AM
I love the reasoning that Heat fans try to project in there posts its pretty sad. I really think the Heat are in big trouble with 327.5 Mil on the table for some rings. If they can not get it done I have a bad feeling about what can happen in the future. For Lebron... he's done.. period titles or not he just solidified himself as the player everybody knew he was. A hole lot of bark very little bite. OMG if the Lakers get to the finals again and if the Heat get there like they are supposed to do for the next 6 years all the Jordan/Lebron lovers will wanna kill themselves if the Lakers and Kobe is able to take down a team that is letterally one if not the greatest teams ever essembled. Good god what a nightmare that would be.

hugepatsfan
07-10-2010, 01:40 AM
Why the facepalm? You don't think that's a valid point. Shaq was signed and opted out. That's not a bigger slap in the face?

No it's not a valid point because Lebron opted out of his deal this summer, just like all the major FAs except Booz and JJ. They are the only ones who's deals expired outright.

cubsofchicago
07-10-2010, 01:41 AM
I love the reasoning that Heat fans try to project in there posts its pretty sad. I really think the Heat are in big trouble with 327.5 Mil on the table for some rings. If they can not get it done I have a bad feeling about what can happen in the future. For Lebron... he's done.. period titles or not he just solidified himself as the player everybody knew he was. A hole lot of bark very little bite. OMG if the Lakers get to the finals again and if the Heat get there like they are supposed to do for the next 6 years all the Jordan/Lebron lovers will wanna kill themselves if the Lakers and Kobe is able to take down a team that is letterally one if not the greatest teams ever essembled. Good god what a nightmare that would be.
i think alot of those fans would prefer kobe to win in that battle

kozelkid
07-10-2010, 01:42 AM
LeBron did not opt out, genius. His contract expired. Shaq had time left on his deal and opted out. Do you even know what "opting out" means? Obviously not. Way to stick your foot in your mouth though :clap:. The rest of your post isn't even worth reading because you proved you don't have a clue with the first sentence.


LeBron James signed a three-year contract extension worth about $60 million Tuesday, cementing a deal announced last week.

The All-Star forward signed the contract in Las Vegas, where he was preparing to train with the U.S. team for the world championships.

The deal will keep James with the Cavaliers through the 2009-10 season and includes a player option for a fourth year. The extension is for two fewer years than the deal the Cavs offered, a five-year package worth about $80 million.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2523410

You do the math Einstein.

Of course my favorite is you acting as if Shaq gave up to join Magic who was on his last legs.

Now take Wade's foot, Lebron's foot and Bosh's foot and put them all in your mouth.

cmellofan15
07-10-2010, 01:44 AM
Lebron's a traitor because every Laker fan and the guy above me caught their period at the same time

gangis2169
07-10-2010, 01:46 AM
Lebron's a traitor because every Laker fan and the guy above me caught their period at the same time

Jesus who let the Bronco fan post what a waste!

kozelkid
07-10-2010, 01:47 AM
Lebron is only a traitor the history of basketball and to himself. He cheated on himself and what he could be.
He wasn't however a traitor to Cleveland. He humiliated them and was an *******, but that doesn't make him a traitor.
And to his credit, Cleveland did a piss poor job of putting quality players around him. I hate to defend, but it's true. They also did a poor job of disciplining him. They fed that monster and made him become who he is by letting him have whatever he wanted. He's a spoiled brat and Cleveland's management is much to blame.

cmellofan15
07-10-2010, 02:01 AM
Jesus who let the Bronco fan post what a waste!

:laugh:

hope the Dolphins have fun at the bottom of the AFC East next year with Buffalo.

ntat
07-10-2010, 03:39 AM
Oh I see, so you're supposed to find the crappiest team there is? No one wants to play with other good players? Now I understand why Kobe and Shaq didn't get along. Neither wanted to play with another good player. And that must be why Jordan retired, he was sick of playing with Scottie because he was so good.

And that still doesn't answer the question as to why LeBron is a traitor. Thanks for playing though.

lol dont get pompous internet warrior. TRAITOR might be a little strong, but he held a team and city hostage(a city that held him their prince), and then took the easy way to victory. You would never see players of the last generation do this period. I have said it somewhere else, but they wanted to beat the best, not find the easiest solution. TRAITOR is a strong word, but kinda ****** punk move might be more accurate. "thanks for playing though". And since i said that last part that means u cant answer back and all ur responses are now discredited. Sorry.

ntat
07-10-2010, 03:41 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2523410

You do the math Einstein.

Of course my favorite is you acting as if Shaq gave up to join Magic who was on his last legs.

Now take Wade's foot, Lebron's foot and Bosh's foot and put them all in your mouth.

and by their foots, he means their C@$KS...

IDB Josh M
07-10-2010, 03:41 AM
Although it was a shock when Shaq left, Orlando didn't really miss his poor bench attitude, lack of defense and horrible free throw shot.

ntat
07-10-2010, 03:43 AM
Yea,Shaq was already a Laker when they got Kobe.

either way Kobe was 17. Hardly a superstar.

Dallas Tx4Life
07-10-2010, 03:45 AM
Dont think Shaq had an hour long ESPN special..

because the people around him were'nt smart enough to seize the opportunity

Dallas Tx4Life
07-10-2010, 03:46 AM
Although it was a shock when Shaq left, Orlando didn't really miss his poor bench attitude, lack of defense and horrible free throw shot.

did you really just claim that orlando didnt miss shaq?!?!? ok buddy

Raph12
07-10-2010, 03:52 AM
Who the hell said Shaq wasn't a traitor?!?!

The difference is that Shaq left our team for the spotlight LA could provide, he didn't leave because he felt like he needed 2 other superstars to win a ring. Lebron needs Wade's leadership, why? Because he's a follower, not a leader, he just plays the game, he isn't strong enough mentally to lead a team to a championship.

kingofdaburbs19
07-10-2010, 03:54 AM
Lebron shoulda went to Chicago if he was a smart basketball player, thats the team that he would win with right away, he isn't a traitor at all the man just wants to play bball with his best friends and attempt to win rings, the cavs are not a good team that could advance in the post-season now he has the 2nd best player in the league playing SG he thinks he has the best chance to win with the Heat their is nothing wrong with that.

ink
07-10-2010, 03:56 AM
Shaq has never exactly set the bar high when it comes to class. So comparing Lebron to him is like comparing bad to really bad. When it comes to integrity I'd be surprised if Shaq was anyone's hero.

In fact, given his lack of integrity, I wouldn't be surprised to see him as the Heat's C next year. He'd do anything to cash in.

Still sure you want to use Shaq as an exemplar of integrity???

SANDBURG23
07-10-2010, 04:04 AM
Shaq was also on an recent expansion team(no team history) the was suprisley old. He was only on the team for 4 years. He went to the Lakers who where on the down swing. The biggest reason it wasn't him and C.Barkley and C.Drexler all at one time in a big circus ring. People don't like instant 3 headed monster bought in one day. When Boston did they at least traded for 2 of them and drafted one. Miami is draft 1 buy 2. If they had the peices had had to trade for one I bet alot less problems. Plus alot of Basketball fans know if he stayed in Cleveland there could have been been alot of teams at same level in the East and alot of fun basketball to watch.

ink
07-10-2010, 04:08 AM
Lebron shoulda went to Chicago if he was a smart basketball player ....

I agree. Watching the 1 hour special yesterday even Lebron's fans had to ask if he wasn't a few forks short of a cutlery set. I mean, LBJ is not the brightest athlete we've ever seen. Someone really needed to tell him that what he was doing was really not advisable. Unfortunately it's hard to tell the guy that's paying you that he's really making a big mistake.

Raph12
07-10-2010, 04:27 AM
I agree. Watching the 1 hour special yesterday even Lebron's fans had to ask if he wasn't a few forks short of a cutlery set. I mean, LBJ is not the brightest athlete we've ever seen. Someone really needed to tell him that what he was doing was really not advisable. Unfortunately it's hard to tell the guy that's paying you that he's really making a big mistake.

Dude you don't get it; Lebron went to Miami so he doesn't have the added pressure if they don't perform to expectations. Wade will get most of the heat if anything goes wrong, it's a destination where he doesn't have to be the guy, he can just play. I think Lebron is too weak mentally and doesn't have the confidence or any other qualities it takes to lead a team to a title. If he went to NY, Chitown, NJ or back to Cleveland, the media would be on him 24/7, in Miami, it's Wade-County, LBJ is just his Robin.

cmellofan15
07-10-2010, 04:41 AM
Dude you don't get it; Lebron went to Miami so he doesn't have the added pressure if they don't perform to expectations. Wade will get most of the heat if anything goes wrong, it's a destination where he doesn't have to be the guy, he can just play. I think Lebron is too weak mentally and doesn't have the confidence or any other qualities it takes to lead a team to a title. If he went to NY, Chitown, NJ or back to Cleveland, the media would be on him 24/7, in Miami, it's Wade-County, LBJ is just his Robin.

:laugh:

maybe you don't get it. LeBron is the most talked about athlete in the history of sports now. if Miami comes up short it's all on LeBron. sure he doesn't have to be the number one scoring option but he still needs to produce 24/7. Wade has never taken any spotlight from LeBron since his Finals appearance and certainly won't be some sort of scapegoat for LeBron if he slips up. the media is still on him as much and probably more as you can see on PSD with all of these random articles posted about anything from his father to his jersey. sales. just face it, you hate LeBron because he's the biggest part of a new dynasty in the Eastern Conference and you feel threatened.

tribalpinoy
07-10-2010, 04:43 AM
LeBron is NOT a traitor, but he is a ****** ***** egotistical overhyped moron.

Mochalman
07-10-2010, 06:42 AM
because you cant hate on the man who played Shazaam or Kazaam w.e that awful movie was called

D Roses Bulls
07-10-2010, 06:45 AM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

you must be really too young to remember when shaq left. he couldnt even go back to orlando for a year cause they were trying to riot

kingofdaburbs19
07-10-2010, 07:59 AM
I agree. Watching the 1 hour special yesterday even Lebron's fans had to ask if he wasn't a few forks short of a cutlery set. I mean, LBJ is not the brightest athlete we've ever seen. Someone really needed to tell him that what he was doing was really not advisable. Unfortunately it's hard to tell the guy that's paying you that he's really making a big mistake.

Exactly, but he has his buddies telling him to go join a "mega team" instead of going to play with a really good basketball team this will back fire I think they all received 6 year contracts I say after 3 seasons of getting bounced in the postseason two of them get traded (not named D-Wade) and Flash at the age of 31 will get better players around him instead of two very good players.

FarOutIos
07-10-2010, 08:17 AM
Lebron is not a traitor. If he sucked as a basketball player, Cleveland would dump him, or trade him. There would be NO loyalty for the fact that he is from Akron. If the team won't be loyal to the players, why should the players be loyal to the team.

And as for his motives to play in Miami, he likes his teammates. He is friends with Wade and Bosh. Would YOU rather work with people you can be friends with?

JasonJohnHorn
07-10-2010, 08:23 AM
As everybody has mentioned, Shaq is not originally from Orlando. Its not his home town. LBJ is from Ohio, and close to Cleveland. He was a home town boy, and in Ohio, they havent had much luck when it comes to prosports. Cavs fans have been waiting years for a ring, Orlando fans at the time had only existed for a few years, and Florida has had a lot more success than Ohio in terms of pro-sports and even collegiate sports.

Ohio fans hung a lot of hope on LBJ and the Cavs and he meant more to the city than I think Shaq did to Orlando, though at the time a lot of people thought Shaq was turning his back on Orlando and he did get a negative responce from a lot of fans, its just at the time the internet was just really getting off the ground so you didnt have the entire blogosphere snow-balling and magnifying the public reaction, and LBJ was kind of a diva about the whole thing with the hour-long special.

Buckwheat
07-10-2010, 08:26 AM
Lebron is not a traitor. If he sucked as a basketball player, Cleveland would dump him, or trade him. There would be NO loyalty for the fact that he is from Akron. If the team won't be loyal to the players, why should the players be loyal to the team.

And as for his motives to play in Miami, he likes his teammates. He is friends with Wade and Bosh. Would YOU rather work with people you can be friends with?

If my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle, too.

LeBron just said today he still has friends on the Cavs.

Anyone who is defending this guy isn't seeing the whole picture or just has a boner because their team got him. He is a traitor. Shaq had no one on that team when he signed. LeBron had Wade and Bosh. He basically told his real fans (not the ones who jumped on his bandwagon 24 hours ago) that he can't win them a title without other superstars, so he didn't feel like sharing any glory or memories with them and wanted to share it with people who probably disliked him a week before he signed. It's a joke. He deserves no respect for this.

Atownballa5
07-10-2010, 08:46 AM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

your a heat fan so you clearly dont understand how he screwed everyone

icon1914
07-10-2010, 08:47 AM
If my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle, too.

LeBron just said today he still has friends on the Cavs.

Anyone who is defending this guy isn't seeing the whole picture or just has a boner because their team got him. He is a traitor. Shaq had no one on that team when he signed. LeBron had Wade and Bosh. He basically told his real fans (not the ones who jumped on his bandwagon 24 hours ago) that he can't win them a title without other superstars, so he didn't feel like sharing any glory or memories with them and wanted to share it with people who probably disliked him a week before he signed. It's a joke. He deserves no respect for this.

Ummm that Lakers team was a solid playoff team with Nick Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Elden Campbell and a promising young rookie in Kobe Bryant. While it's true that none of those players, except Kobe, were there when they started to win titles, they were far from a bunch of scrubs. Just one year earlier they had upset the Sonics in the first round of the playoffs.

I think the difference is today is that we are so connected to the media. Whether it's on our phones, computers, Tvs, etc... We are connected 24/7 so we get to experience fan reaction via Twitter, facebook, YouTube. We get to hear podcast of sports announcers giving their two cents... We have so many more news outlet channels... And to top it off James himself put himself on the stage to be ridiculed. He had to know that this was going to happen.

So in closing Shaq was hated by Orlando and a lot of people were disappointed at his choice, but with only so many outlets to display news at the time, the story did not go as far as it could have... Plus the Magic still had Penny.... They, at the time, still thought they had a chance to win without Shaq. Cleveland knows it will be quite sometime before they get back to being able to compete.

Buckwheat
07-10-2010, 09:01 AM
Ummm that Lakers team was a solid playoff team with Nick Van Exel, Eddie Jones, Elden Campbell and a promising young rookie in Kobe Bryant. While it's true that none of those players, except Kobe, were there when they started to win titles, they were far from a bunch of scrubs. Just one year earlier they had upset the Sonics in the first round of the playoffs.

I think the difference is today is that we are so connected to the media. Whether it's on our phones, computers, Tvs, etc... We are connected 24/7 so we get to experience fan reaction via Twitter, facebook, YouTube. We get to hear podcast of sports announcers giving their two cents... We have so many more news outlet channels... And to top it off James himself put himself on the stage to be ridiculed. He had to know that this was going to happen.

So in closing Shaq was hated by Orlando and a lot of people were disappointed at his choice, but with only so many outlets to display news at the time, the story did not go as far as it could have... Plus the Magic still had Penny.... They, at the time, still thought they had a chance to win without Shaq. Cleveland knows it will be quite sometime before they get back to being able to compete.

I chose poor wording. He had a few players.. But it was still a team that lost out in the playoffs in the first round. If the Heat had Bosh last year, I'd say they probably would have made it further.

marlinsfan24
07-10-2010, 09:38 AM
Cleveland is dumb and thought they OWNED Lebron. They created his ego! :)
:clap::clap:

crono6
07-10-2010, 10:15 AM
Jaji posts are welcome here.There needs to be a balance.I dont get on here that much but I notice there are far too many Lakers fans and Kobe lovers in comparison to anything else.

Super.
07-10-2010, 10:23 AM
a) He's from Akron, not Cleveland. 2 different cities.

b) What difference would that have made whether he announced it or someone else did? Going on TV doesn't make a person a traitor.

How close is Akron to Cleveland, Same state right? Kid grows up, lives the dream to play for his hometown team, and ditches them? Screams of cowardice. Honestly, I can't begin to fathom ditching a home-town team i dreamed of playing for as a kid.

No, making this a national debocal doesn't make you a traitor. It makes you a doushbag.

mamba24
07-10-2010, 10:34 AM
a) He's from Akron, not Cleveland. 2 different cities.

b) What difference would that have made whether he announced it or someone else did? Going on TV doesn't make a person a traitor.

Akron is close enough... He is a hometown boy... BUT it was said earlier that all free agents have the opportunity to do what they want. I don't think he is a traitor at all. I do think he has the biggest ego in the NBA and is very immature.

Aussy4GM
07-10-2010, 10:45 AM
Ok. There Has Been Alot of People Bashing The 1 Hour Special. It Was Something ESPN Approached LeBrons Camp about and it Was a good way to give back to several boys and girls clubs around the US including Cleveland's. With that being said lets stop all the "he requested a 1 hour special about himself" be honest. thats really what it took. He handled himself like a professional and didnt just leak his decision without giving a reason for leaving. On The other hand i think the three kings are terrible for the NBA itself. While the heat bandwagon fans will return to sell out the arena and by the merch, the competition between teams goes down. there will be a bigger gap between the good and the bad. It will be impossible for a team like the raptors or the cavs to beat this superteam. it just takes away from what the NBA is all about. anyone can win on any given night.

NOW, to the topic. Of Course Shaq Isnt a traitor! It Wasnt Shaqs Home, Orlando didnt have billions of huge posters and billboards for him, He only played in Orlando for 4 years! Lebron played in cleveland for 7, Shaq never guaranteed the Magic a title before he was done. He wasnt leaving orlando in the dust they still had Hardaway and Hill. The Cavs Have Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison. they wont even be as good as the wizards were last year. Shaq Didnt Join up With Jordan & Pippen either. He Didnt even join up with kobe! kobe was 18 and for all he knew he was the next garbage man.

CowboysKB24
07-10-2010, 11:04 AM
Posts like this make me wonder if you even know anything at all about basketball. Magic Johnson played for the Lakers the year before they signed Shaq. Why do I have to keep educating you "Laker" fans about your own team?

And, no Jordan nor Shaq could do it alone. Shaq didn't win anything until Kobe developed into a superstar. Jordan played on a team with Pippen. LeBron had Mo Williams (:speechless:).

And Bosh is not a top 5 player in the league. That's absolutely absurd. He's not even top 10. He barely makes my top 20.

There's nothing wrong with players recruiting each other and deciding to link up. Show the rule that outlaws that.

And who cares if Wade was there first. He's now the #2 guy. If they all went to Cleveland LeBron would be the guy. If they all went to the Knicks LeBron would be the guy. If they all went to the Nets LeBron would be the guy. So why would he not be the guy in Miami? They are still the same players. LeBron is the best player in the league. There is no doubt he is the best player on his own team.

You say the best want to beat the best. Okay, Kobe and the Lakers are the best. And Boston is the 2nd best. Wade and co. got dog walked in the playoffs last year. Bosh and co. didn't even make it. So how are they the best? Miami is a serious contender now, but only after signing LBJ. They still have to get past LAL, Boston, and maybe even Orlando. They are far from a complete team.

Educating Laker fans? The bottom line is Magic and Shaq didn't call each other to play together and they never did play together, so it doesn't matter.

Bosh is barely your top 20? You must not watch him enough, check him out. He can do it all. He is like KG in his prime without the defense. He can shoot the mid-range like a champ. He can create his own jump shot, drive to the hoop, or take it in the post. He is a complete player. Top 20 is absurd. Top is definite, and so is top 5.

Wade is better than LBJ, and the best player on the Heat, get real. They joined Wade. You will see all year that LBJ is the second player. The Heat organization is promoting everything that way, just watch. That is why Wade sits in the center at the press conference. He will always be in the middle and he will be noted as the captain and leader of this team. You will see that in marketing promotion, introduction of the players, on the court, off the court, anything.

Beat the best players... not play with the best players. I thought it was hilarious, when some one asked LBJ about how they were going to work out sharing the ball, and he is like well "oh on the USA team... bla bla bla" The Heat are now 3 of the starter on the All-star team. They are the mini USA team

Jaji
07-10-2010, 11:21 AM
Educating Laker fans? The bottom line is Magic and Shaq didn't call each other to play together and they never did play together, so it doesn't matter.

Bosh is barely your top 20? You must not watch him enough, check him out. He can do it all. He is like KG in his prime without the defense. He can shoot the mid-range like a champ. He can create his own jump shot, drive to the hoop, or take it in the post. He is a complete player. Top 20 is absurd. Top is definite, and so is top 5.

Wade is better than LBJ, and the best player on the Heat, get real. They joined Wade. You will see all year that LBJ is the second player. The Heat organization is promoting everything that way, just watch. That is why Wade sits in the center at the press conference. He will always be in the middle and he will be noted as the captain and leader of this team. You will see that in marketing promotion, introduction of the players, on the court, off the court, anything.

Beat the best players... not play with the best players. I thought it was hilarious, when some one asked LBJ about how they were going to work out sharing the ball, and he is like well "oh on the USA team... bla bla bla" The Heat are now 3 of the starter on the All-star team. They are the mini USA team

Hey you're the one who mentioned Magic Johnson. Magic retired that offseason but if he didn't, he would have been playing with Shaq, no?

And you hit the nail right on the head when describing Bosh, without the defense. That's half the game of basketball so that means he can only half the player Garnett is.

And saying Wade is better than LeBron is just ridiculous. Based on what? A ring? He had a much better team than LeBron in 06 that's why he has a ring. LeBron does everything better than Wade. Score, pass, rebound, defend. He's the reigning 2x MVP and the best player in the league, not just Miami. No one can fill up a stat sheet like him. Guy is a walking triple double waiting to happen. Wade is good, very good. But to say he is better than LeBron is just silly. And the thing is, I think you know that's not true.

And since when are Wade and Bosh "the best?" Wade's team got whupped in the 1st and Bosh wasn't even in the playoffs. That's the best? Kobe and Shaq, the 2 best players in the entire league, that was slaughter. The Heat aren't even a complete team they just have some good, young, building blocks. You act like he signed with the world champs or something (cough Artest, cough).

Aussy4GM
07-10-2010, 11:21 AM
Eastern Conference Staring All Star Team Next Season

PG: Derrick Rose
SG: Dwayne Wade
SF: LeBron James
PF: Chris Bosh
C: Amar'e Stoudamire

:win:

Jaji
07-10-2010, 11:35 AM
How close is Akron to Cleveland, Same state right? Kid grows up, lives the dream to play for his hometown team, and ditches them? Screams of cowardice. Honestly, I can't begin to fathom ditching a home-town team i dreamed of playing for as a kid.

No, making this a national debocal doesn't make you a traitor. It makes you a doushbag.


Akron is close enough... He is a hometown boy... BUT it was said earlier that all free agents have the opportunity to do what they want. I don't think he is a traitor at all. I do think he has the biggest ego in the NBA and is very immature.

Akron is almost an hour away. I have cousins who live in Akron, trust me I have been there many times. Spent a lot of summers there as a kid. Cleveland was an afterthought. The only time it was even mentioned was in a bad way. I remember going to a concert in "the Land" and all my cousin and his friend kept talking about was how much they hate Cleveland. DC and Baltimore are close too. 2 different cities though. If the Wizards got Melo (Baltimore native) would he owe DC some type of allegiance? I don't think so.

And who ever said LeBron grew up wanting to play for the Cavs?

OREcoast49er
07-10-2010, 11:59 AM
So is every FA that signs with a different team a traitor. Well, ya, to the fans of the team that player left. Get over it. Laker fans are just upset because they dont have the most stacked team in the NBA anymore.

Laker Legend42
07-10-2010, 12:05 PM
is it me OR DID EVERYONE IN THE MEDIA AND MANY NBA FANS HAD LA-VS-CLEVELAND IN THE FINALS BEFORE THE PLAYOFFS STARTED???? NOW EVERYONES SAYING THEY DIDNT PUT ANY PIECES AROUND HIM??? ALSO, HE MAY HAVE TRIED TO GET BOSH TO CLEVELAND IN THE OFF SEASON, BUT WHO ELSE DID HE TRY AND RECRUIT??? HE GAVE UP ON CLEVELAND WHEN HE TOOK THEIR JERSEY OFF AFTER THE LOSS TO BOSTON AND NOW THE SELF PROCLAIMED KING HAS BECOME A SIDE KICK AKA SCOTTIE PIPPEN...

Very good point. Everyone said Cleveland was the best team in the leauge and it was also said that Mo Williams wthe missing piece. Then it was Shaq then it was Jammison. Then reality set in and it turned into Lebron had no help.

Jaji
07-10-2010, 12:05 PM
So is every FA that signs with a different team a traitor. Well, ya, to the fans of the team that player left. Get over it. Laker fans are just upset because they dont have the most stacked team in the NBA anymore.

This.

Laker Legend42
07-10-2010, 12:08 PM
LeBron is NOT a traitor, but he is a ****** ***** egotistical overhyped moron.

And until he works on his game and developes some post moves lable him guardable.

-Big-Baby-
07-10-2010, 12:15 PM
You guys really think Lebron would get a 1 hour special to say he was returning to Cleveland? They should have been prepared, Cleveland gave him garbage, the man just wants to win. Cleveland just has bad ownership, Dan Gilbert is acting like a 12 year old girl. It was bound to happen, Cleveland offered him nothing.

BKNets
07-10-2010, 12:15 PM
I ask you this: if LeBron decided to go to the Lakers, Laker fans would LOVE him and be all like "he chose to go to the best organization" etc etc etc and somehow bring Kobe into it. The Bulls would have done the same thing - in fact, EVERY team would have, and the fans of every other team would have been doing what you guys are doing now

it's business. He put himself in a good situation and that's it. I'd prefer if he went NJ or a place with only one superstar, but it's business - whatev!

I have no issue with what you're saying as a whole, but "whatev"? What, are you a 15 year old girl?

-Big-Baby-
07-10-2010, 12:17 PM
Eastern Conference Staring All Star Team Next Season

PG: Derrick Rose
SG: Dwayne Wade
SF: LeBron James
PF: Chris Bosh
C: Amar'e Stoudamire

:win:

BARGNANI FOR C POSITION ! :win:

ABOMB_56
07-10-2010, 12:18 PM
In 1982, Moses Malone was considered by many to be the best player in basketball, certainly one of the best of his generation, and he was still in his prime. But just after he collected the second of his three MVP awards and only one year removed from playing in the NBA Finals with the Houston Rockets, he became a restricted free agent. With his team apparently regressing (the Rockets went from their Finals appearance in '81 to out in the first round the next season), Moses decided to leave Houston and go play for the Philadelphia 76ers, a team that already had one of the other best players in the game and of his generation. A guy named Julius Erving.

Moses Malone, one of the greatest players ever. His legacy wasn't touched by this decision, actually if you ask most posters, they would of never even known he ditched the Rockets to go play with another all-time great in DR. J.

artest_kobe
07-10-2010, 12:24 PM
they both are duh.

prodigy
07-10-2010, 12:27 PM
a.) lebron was born and raised in Ohio.

b.) lebron created a whole fiasco, just to dump his team on national television.

This plus...

c.) He has cost the cavs talent.

D.) He lied to us.

E.) He sucked really hard vs Celtics. He either Quit or Choked, your pick...

etc...

mlisica19
07-10-2010, 12:27 PM
Well 1- shaq wasn't as popular as lebron

But the big difference is that he didn't toy with the hearts and minds of americans for years.and finally to make it official he has a special announcement only to declare that he's LEAVING his hometown boys to play for a team that wants to buy a ring. Worst part for james is that he went to wade county,and came as a follower. Where's the integrity. The legends are players who are the modest guys who don't follow but lead, he demanded players and he got a team that brought him the 1st seed and record. What he do for them? Nothing. Now them together will try and win the easy way, and I hope they fall. And like shaq and kobe there's only time until they dissapear and one of them will have to leave

-Big-Baby-
07-10-2010, 12:33 PM
This plus...

c.) He has cost the cavs talent.

D.) He lied to us.

E.) He sucked really hard vs Celtics. He either Quit or Choked, your pick...

etc...


c) He got you guys there

d) Free agency means you can go where ever you please

e) If he sucked badly, Mo or Jamison should of done something about it, that was his ONLY bad game

ballerallday81
07-10-2010, 12:37 PM
yeah, but it took shaq 4 years to win a title.
And he didnt go around parading about winning one either.

tonyd3b54
07-10-2010, 12:40 PM
im not calling him a traitor im pretty sure only cleveland is doing that... IM CALLING HIM A PUSSSSYYYYY!!!!!!!

ABOMB_56
07-10-2010, 12:41 PM
This plus...

c.) He has cost the cavs talent.

D.) He lied to us.

E.) He sucked really hard vs Celtics. He either Quit or Choked, your pick...

etc...

C. He cost you guys nothing. He made a last ditch attempt to get Bosh to come to Cleveland, but Bosh didn't want to go their. The Cavs had a shot at getting Amare over Jamison and chose the older guy with a worse contract. Suppose they traded for Amare, but both Amare and LBJ left. It would of left you guys with 20+ million in cap space.

D. He lied to no one. It's not like he made a verbal commitment and backed out. He was a free agent.

E. He sucked really hard? Or his teammates did?

-Big-Baby-
07-10-2010, 01:20 PM
C. He cost you guys nothing. He made a last ditch attempt to get Bosh to come to Cleveland, but Bosh didn't want to go their. The Cavs had a shot at getting Amare over Jamison and chose the older guy with a worse contract. Suppose they traded for Amare, but both Amare and LBJ left. It would of left you guys with 20+ million in cap space.

D. He lied to no one. It's not like he made a verbal commitment and backed out. He was a free agent.

E. He sucked really hard? Or his teammates did?

exactly what i said, these lebron haters don't know what they talking about

Jaji
07-10-2010, 01:34 PM
Moses Malone, one of the greatest players ever. His legacy wasn't touched by this decision, actually if you ask most posters, they would of never even known he ditched the Rockets to go play with another all-time great in DR. J.

Excellent point. LeBron's legacy will not be touched and he will definitely be in the argument for GOAT when its all said and done. All his haters will continue to hate but that just proves how great he is. If he wasn't, no one would care. No one hates on Rip Hamilton (random player). He'll be public enemy #1 on PSD but who really cares about the opinion of the average PSDer?

CowboysKB24
07-10-2010, 01:36 PM
Hey you're the one who mentioned Magic Johnson. Magic retired that offseason but if he didn't, he would have been playing with Shaq, no?

And you hit the nail right on the head when describing Bosh, without the defense. That's half the game of basketball so that means he can only half the player Garnett is.

And saying Wade is better than LeBron is just ridiculous. Based on what? A ring? He had a much better team than LeBron in 06 that's why he has a ring. LeBron does everything better than Wade. Score, pass, rebound, defend. He's the reigning 2x MVP and the best player in the league, not just Miami. No one can fill up a stat sheet like him. Guy is a walking triple double waiting to happen. Wade is good, very good. But to say he is better than LeBron is just silly. And the thing is, I think you know that's not true.

And since when are Wade and Bosh "the best?" Wade's team got whupped in the 1st and Bosh wasn't even in the playoffs. That's the best? Kobe and Shaq, the 2 best players in the entire league, that was slaughter. The Heat aren't even a complete team they just have some good, young, building blocks. You act like he signed with the world champs or something (cough Artest, cough).

No what I mean what Bosh is about 75 percent of KG in his prime. Bosh is just as talent offensively, and about half the guy KG was on defense so that is about 75 percent of KG, not half LOL.

No, I always have thought Wade was better than LBJ because of the intangibles. LBJ has shown to us the past two years that he can't win as the top dog in the playoffs. Two back to back regular MVPs and back to back regular season champs and no finals? That is LBJ's fault not his teammates. He and his teammates didn't show up for the playoffs. He should have had his team ready. Wade is a better leader. Wade is a more complete player, better shooter, more complex offensive game. LBJ is more of a physical player and can't shoot like Wade can. He can't create his own jumpers like him. I'll take Wade over LBJ any day of the week. I know LBJ is a SF and does more than Wade on the court, but I'll take the guy who can hit the game winner than the guy who can fill the stat sheet (that means nothing).

Wade is the best player in the game. Bosh is the best PF in the game. Or to you it is LBJ 1a and Wade 1b, it really makes no difference now they are on the same team.

Jaji
07-10-2010, 02:25 PM
No what I mean what Bosh is about 75 percent of KG in his prime. Bosh is just as talent offensively, and about half the guy KG was on defense so that is about 75 percent of KG, not half LOL.

No, I always have thought Wade was better than LBJ because of the intangibles. LBJ has shown to us the past two years that he can't win as the top dog in the playoffs. Two back to back regular MVPs and back to back regular season champs and no finals? That is LBJ's fault not his teammates. He and his teammates didn't show up for the playoffs. He should have had his team ready. Wade is a better leader. Wade is a more complete player, better shooter, more complex offensive game. LBJ is more of a physical player and can't shoot like Wade can. He can't create his own jumpers like him. I'll take Wade over LBJ any day of the week. I know LBJ is a SF and does more than Wade on the court, but I'll take the guy who can hit the game winner than the guy who can fill the stat sheet (that means nothing).

Wade is the best player in the game. Bosh is the best PF in the game. Or to you it is LBJ 1a and Wade 1b, it really makes no difference now they are on the same team.

But Bosh plays NO defense lol. Garnett is a force on defense. And he makes his teammates play better defense too not just by rotating but by getting in their face when they mess up.

No one can win in the playoffs by themselves. No one. Not Jordan, not Kobe, not Wade. They all had another HOF player beside them or at least a really good supporting cast. No future HOFer (who can still play) was willing to go to Cleveland.

I wouldn't say the Cavs losing was his fault. I'd say he didn't have the necessary help. In 09 he was killing Orlando. But no one could stop Howard inside or Lewis and Hedo outside. Varejao couldn't get a hand in Lewis' face. Too slow. Not athletic enough.

This year LeBron had a BAD game 5. Who stepped up? No one. Kobe had a bad game 7 against Boston but he had a championship caliber team around him to pick up the slack.

There is really only 1 player who ever came close to winning it by himself and that was LeBron in 07. His sidekick was freaking Boobie Gibson and he still carried his team to the Finals. When Shaq left LA and it was just Kobe (plus Odom and Butler who are both decent) he couldn't get out of the first round. Surround him with some talent, back to back ships.

As far as Wade and LBJ, I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion. But the general non biased consensus is LBJ > Wade. LeBron does everything better. Score, pass, rebound and defend. Being 6'-8" 250 helps but then again, there aren't many, no there aren't any 6'-8" 250 pound guys who can do what he can physically.

But you think Wade > Kobe too? At least you're not being a homer.

Frezhnitz
07-10-2010, 02:38 PM
shaq got traded.

jjfan122
07-10-2010, 02:46 PM
But Bosh plays NO defense lol. Garnett is a force on defense. And he makes his teammates play better defense too not just by rotating but by getting in their face when they mess up.

No one can win in the playoffs by themselves. No one. Not Jordan, not Kobe, not Wade. They all had another HOF player beside them or at least a really good supporting cast. No future HOFer (who can still play) was willing to go to Cleveland.

I wouldn't say the Cavs losing was his fault. I'd say he didn't have the necessary help. In 09 he was killing Orlando. But no one could stop Howard inside or Lewis and Hedo outside. Varejao couldn't get a hand in Lewis' face. Too slow. Not athletic enough.

This year LeBron had a BAD game 5. Who stepped up? No one. Kobe had a bad game 7 against Boston but he had a championship caliber team around him to pick up the slack.

There is really only 1 player who ever came close to winning it by himself and that was LeBron in 07. His sidekick was freaking Boobie Gibson and he still carried his team to the Finals. When Shaq left LA and it was just Kobe (plus Odom and Butler who are both decent) he couldn't get out of the first round. Surround him with some talent, back to back ships.

As far as Wade and LBJ, I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion. But the general non biased consensus is LBJ > Wade. LeBron does everything better. Score, pass, rebound and defend. Being 6'-8" 250 helps but then again, there aren't many, no there aren't any 6'-8" 250 pound guys who can do what he can physically.

But you think Wade > Kobe too? At least you're not being a homer.

dude, you are a heat fan and you're saying james > wade??!! smfh

Jaji
07-10-2010, 02:53 PM
dude, you are a heat fan and you're saying james > wade??!! smfh

See this is the type of logic that makes me not want to waste my time on this site. You're actually encouraging a biased opinion? What does favorite team have to do with who is actually the better player?

And just so you know, I'm not a heat fan. I'm a LeBron fan. He just happens to play for the Heat now.

ink
07-10-2010, 02:59 PM
Dude you don't get it; Lebron went to Miami so he doesn't have the added pressure if they don't perform to expectations. Wade will get most of the heat if anything goes wrong, it's a destination where he doesn't have to be the guy, he can just play. I think Lebron is too weak mentally and doesn't have the confidence or any other qualities it takes to lead a team to a title. If he went to NY, Chitown, NJ or back to Cleveland, the media would be on him 24/7, in Miami, it's Wade-County, LBJ is just his Robin.

Not sure what I don't get when your answer has nothing to do with what I said.

The big mistake he made was the stupid 1 hour special and announcing his "decision" forgetting that all of his CLE fans were going to be incredibly disappointed. He announced it as if the only thing that mattered was how hard it was on his poor nerves to decide where he'd become a billionaire with no regard for the fans that have supported him for years. That's really ugly. Sportsmanship bottomed out badly on ESPN. A new low in a sport that gives us a steady supply of stupidity and lows. I'd include Shaq's off court **** as part of the NBA's lows.

NYMetros
07-10-2010, 03:04 PM
LeBron's not a traitor. He made the right move in going to Miami where he will win multiple Championships.

IversonIsKrazy
07-10-2010, 03:21 PM
Akron is a muninipal of Cleveland. Just like I live in Richmond, which is a munincipal of Vancouver. So he IS a home-town kid. HE was born there, grew up there, went to high school there, got DRAFTED there, AND became a superstar there. That is why it is a ***** move by him. Shaq was not born or raised in Orlando.

THE_LOGO
07-10-2010, 03:49 PM
OK.....you guys are absolutely right. Argue which is the best player, Lebron or Wade. Kobe? I guess he's the worst player in the league. There you go. Now be happy. We'll see what happens in the finals when your 1A and 1B lose. Oh how sweet it will be when Kobe, the worst player ever, beats both of them. Two birds with one stone. IF, you make it to the finals. And you should've tivo'd your party for winning nothing celebration so that you'd have something to watch while I'm getting sunburned at the Laker parade.

I still can't believe that everyone was saying the cavs have the best team, team to beat, already penciled in for the championship, blah blah blah. Bust out of the playoffs and the team blows up. Wow, Jamison was the missing piece. Trade him for Z and get Z back in a month, its all over. Over for the cavs. Now welcome to mediocrity.

Lastly, don't know about you but Bosh strutting around with those two like he's something, anything, was a disgrace. Who the hell is he? Some guy who can't take his team to the playoffs? What a superstar he is. As a matter of fact how about we make them 1A, 1B, and 1C. There, now the heat has the three best basketball players in the whole world, of all time, through eternity. Then the Lakers spank them and put the babies in their place with Kobe the worst player ever, EVEEEEEER leading them. How butt hurt would the heat be?

MVPKOBE43
07-10-2010, 04:02 PM
I don't think Lebron is a traitor at all. He had every right in the world to exercise the rights given to him in the NBA Collective Bargaining agreement....just like anybody else that leaves one team for another.
What he did that is special is have a one hour humiliation of his former team on international tv. So no, Lebron isn't a traitor. He's an immature punk.

This quote says it all. nicely put

Jaji
07-10-2010, 04:05 PM
Akron is a muninipal of Cleveland. Just like I live in Richmond, which is a munincipal of Vancouver. So he IS a home-town kid. HE was born there, grew up there, went to high school there, got DRAFTED there, AND became a superstar there. That is why it is a ***** move by him. Shaq was not born or raised in Orlando.

Most people I know from Akron don't like Cleveland. Like Springfield vs Shelbyville. Just because he was born in the shiddy region that is NE Ohio doesn't mean he should be cursed to stay there the rest of his life. He was a FA and had the right to sign with any team he wanted. I was born in NY and now live in FL. Am I a traitor too?

Chi-Town Sports
07-10-2010, 04:07 PM
Lebron is a traitor because he went through the whole "decision" process for publicity. he could have said to the Cavs he was leaving to Miami like a normal person would

Jaji
07-10-2010, 04:07 PM
OK.....you guys are absolutely right. Argue which is the best player, Lebron or Wade. Kobe? I guess he's the worst player in the league. There you go. Now be happy. We'll see what happens in the finals when your 1A and 1B lose. Oh how sweet it will be when Kobe, the worst player ever, beats both of them. Two birds with one stone. IF, you make it to the finals. And you should've tivo'd your party for winning nothing celebration so that you'd have something to watch while I'm getting sunburned at the Laker parade.

I still can't believe that everyone was saying the cavs have the best team, team to beat, already penciled in for the championship, blah blah blah. Bust out of the playoffs and the team blows up. Wow, Jamison was the missing piece. Trade him for Z and get Z back in a month, its all over. Over for the cavs. Now welcome to mediocrity.

Lastly, don't know about you but Bosh strutting around with those two like he's something, anything, was a disgrace. Who the hell is he? Some guy who can't take his team to the playoffs? What a superstar he is. As a matter of fact how about we make them 1A, 1B, and 1C. There, now the heat has the three best basketball players in the whole world, of all time, through eternity. Then the Lakers spank them and put the babies in their place with Kobe the worst player ever, EVEEEEEER leading them. How butt hurt would the heat be?

Amidst all your nonsense I found a good point! I think Bosh is overrated. He's a good player who played on a super garbage team. Of course he's gonna average 24 a game. But he is NOT a superstar.

YayArea
07-10-2010, 04:10 PM
Shaq didn't leave and call up Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson and say hey guys let's play together because I can't do it alone. He lead LA to a three peat as the leader of the team. He went to a team that luckily got KB24 (what I mean is no one thought Kobe would end up being the best player in the league at some point in his career) and turned into a dynasty... and don't for the Master, PJ.

And I don't think LBJ is traitor at all nor Shaq. Only CLE fans think that. You are able to sign with whatever team you want, but going to the extent of purposely setting up your contracts together and calling each other to play together is a little too far IMO especially when all 3 of you are top 5 players in the league. I am shocked that he would want to play with Wade and Bosh. I feel that the truly great players want to beat the best, not play with the best (that is what the Olympics and All-star game is for). That is all. It shocks me that Wade would want that too, but it isn't as bad as LBJ because Wade has already won a ring. He is the leader of the Heat, he is the King of the Miami. LBJ came to his city his team.

What he said!!!! EVERYTHING ON POINT

Cali4rnia
07-10-2010, 04:19 PM
I think its because cavs were surrounding their team with role players that feeds off labron. They tried a lot of different things to make it a championship team. got shaq & jamison. NOw labron is not in cavs those role players do not have superstar.

kambion
07-10-2010, 04:20 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

Simply because Orlando didn't depend on him as a city. Lebron James drives Cleveland's economy to a degree, he gives them someone they can be proud of. Miami and Orlando, LA, even the Knick's have icons that they are proud of, that retired with them etc... Who does Cleveland have?

Jarvo
07-10-2010, 04:23 PM
Thats no excuse sayin he's a hometown hero or had a hour special (which was dumb), He's no quitter nor traitor blame ESPN & the media for that 1hr crap bcuz lets face it he is the biggest thing since slice bread (thats how everyone hyped him up) he wasnt NEVA betta than wade or kobe 2 me cuz he's not that great imean ppl was callin him "king" even before he played an NBA half. The media & ESPN created this monster of "king" James now ppl realizing he's robin not a batman and now since he left the cavs behind after multiple MVPS, best records, gettin him all the help he can get and comes up short nd leaves where he have a chance to win and callin him out is bs

jlisec01
07-10-2010, 04:27 PM
I think its unfair to call someone a traitor just because they want to go to a team where they know they can win a championship. The Cavaliers just couldn't get it done even when they made it to the finals the one year. Its not like Lebron said I'm going to stay in Cleveland forever, but if he did then I guess I can see that as a reason.

NPH
07-10-2010, 04:29 PM
Where the **** is ARMIN???

Jaji
07-10-2010, 04:33 PM
Simply because Orlando didn't depend on him as a city. Lebron James drives Cleveland's economy to a degree, he gives them someone they can be proud of. Miami and Orlando, LA, even the Knick's have icons that they are proud of, that retired with them etc... Who does Cleveland have?

I don't think that's Lebron's fault. The city was dead. He gave them a little bit of a revival and they should be grateful for that IMO. They can still be proud of him. I'm still proud of him (Akron was like a 2nd home to me growing up). But if your entire region's economy is based off of one person, then you have major problems.

Jack Daniels
07-10-2010, 04:34 PM
Lebron is a douche...plain and simple

Jenceman
07-10-2010, 04:42 PM
a) He's from Akron, not Cleveland. 2 different cities.

b) What difference would that have made whether he announced it or someone else did? Going on TV doesn't make a person a traitor.

He went on national TV to announce his decision, was that really necessary?

I heard a great simile for this.

A guy, whose been with a girl for 7 years, goes on national tv and proposes to a different woman without even telling his girlfriend beforehand. It's a total backstab to keep everyone hanging like that. He's a douche.

Jenceman
07-10-2010, 04:44 PM
Most people I know from Akron don't like Cleveland. Like Springfield vs Shelbyville. Just because he was born in the shiddy region that is NE Ohio doesn't mean he should be cursed to stay there the rest of his life. He was a FA and had the right to sign with any team he wanted. I was born in NY and now live in FL. Am I a traitor too?

No you're just another bandwagon fan.

blacknell
07-10-2010, 04:45 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

LA when shaq went wasn't a power house squad like miami.. Shaq made them what they were

Raiderwood
07-10-2010, 04:45 PM
He's not a traitor, he was well within his rights to go to whatever team he wanted to. BUT..there are ways of doing things, and running a dog and pony show the way he did, was amateurish and just bad form. We all know that this is a business, and businessmen who make Billions and own teams generally have even larger egos that players who make millions and play on teams. Business is a two way street, and owners will not forget what was done here. When the labor agreement comes, you bet there will be talk of this, because owners never want to go through this again. And the people who will be effected by this? Future NBA free agents.

He basically took his hometown team and rubbed their noses in it in a 1 hour special for himself...people in power generally don't forget those things....it just wasn't the right way to do things.

BTW - I don't really care where he went, I'm more of a college BB fan..the guy was just classless and has his marketing done by a bunch of amateurs. The interesting thing here was when Wilbon or Jim Gray (I forget who) asked him about if this was decided a long time ago, LBJ started stammering because he was caught off guard. They moved on to the next question and let it go (of course) but he was busted. There was never a real opportunity for any other team, this was all premeditated to satisfy his ego....

Hope he enjoys it, because if he doesn't win a title in the next 12-24 months, this will be a huge joke...

_KB24_
07-10-2010, 05:02 PM
Most people I know from Akron don't like Cleveland. Like Springfield vs Shelbyville. Just because he was born in the shiddy region that is NE Ohio doesn't mean he should be cursed to stay there the rest of his life. He was a FA and had the right to sign with any team he wanted. I was born in NY and now live in FL. Am I a traitor too?

Yes. How can you be born in NY of all places and not be a Knicks fan? :eyebrow:

CowboysKB24
07-10-2010, 05:26 PM
But Bosh plays NO defense lol. Garnett is a force on defense. And he makes his teammates play better defense too not just by rotating but by getting in their face when they mess up.

No one can win in the playoffs by themselves. No one. Not Jordan, not Kobe, not Wade. They all had another HOF player beside them or at least a really good supporting cast. No future HOFer (who can still play) was willing to go to Cleveland.

I wouldn't say the Cavs losing was his fault. I'd say he didn't have the necessary help. In 09 he was killing Orlando. But no one could stop Howard inside or Lewis and Hedo outside. Varejao couldn't get a hand in Lewis' face. Too slow. Not athletic enough.

This year LeBron had a BAD game 5. Who stepped up? No one. Kobe had a bad game 7 against Boston but he had a championship caliber team around him to pick up the slack.

There is really only 1 player who ever came close to winning it by himself and that was LeBron in 07. His sidekick was freaking Boobie Gibson and he still carried his team to the Finals. When Shaq left LA and it was just Kobe (plus Odom and Butler who are both decent) he couldn't get out of the first round. Surround him with some talent, back to back ships.

As far as Wade and LBJ, I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion. But the general non biased consensus is LBJ > Wade. LeBron does everything better. Score, pass, rebound and defend. Being 6'-8" 250 helps but then again, there aren't many, no there aren't any 6'-8" 250 pound guys who can do what he can physically.

But you think Wade > Kobe too? At least you're not being a homer.

I think Wade is the best player in the game, so yes Wade is better than Kobe right now. Kobe's prime > Wade Prime though. I know I am among the few who feel that way about Wade. I love his game. I would love to see those guys compete against each other and not play with each other.

Boozerguy47
07-10-2010, 05:41 PM
Magic fans aren't as bitter.

knickfan33
07-10-2010, 06:00 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

Orlando didn't want to pay shaq, it's very different....
thats why so many people laughed at the rashard lewis deal, they wouldn't pay shaq that kinda money, and then a couple years late give it to rashard lewis.

Bornknick73
07-10-2010, 06:13 PM
Shaq went to be the centerpiece of that team. He didnt ride Hakeems jock in Houston. He didnt join the Admiral. Or Ewing. Or Jordan for that matter. Shaq saw competition. He saw he had to beat the best to be the best. Very surprised at Prince James. Looks like the Legacy belongs to King Wade now.

TuborgP
07-10-2010, 06:24 PM
because lebron is sort of a hometown boy

So he surrenders rights? Does that mean anyone who signs with their hometown team is surrendering collective agreement rights? Sure the show was dumb but didn't ESPN and the teams play along? Did Cleveland start/contribute to the entertainment hype with their songs etc?

TuborgP
07-10-2010, 06:26 PM
He went on national TV to announce his decision, was that really necessary?

I heard a great simile for this.

A guy, whose been with a girl for 7 years, goes on national tv and proposes to a different woman without even telling his girlfriend beforehand. It's a total backstab to keep everyone hanging like that. He's a douche.

The problem is that we have become captivated by reality shows as a nation. So much of entertainment is now about people being rejected or losing out on national TV. Seems this was part of the reality TV bandwagon. Not a good part but perhaps a consistent part.

ink
07-10-2010, 06:32 PM
The problem is that we have become captivated by reality shows as a nation. So much of entertainment is now about people being rejected or losing out on national TV. Seems this was part of the reality TV bandwagon. Not a good part but perhaps a consistent part.

That's a good point. Probably what also made me want to vomit. :laugh2: I'm laughing but what a sad chapter in NBA history.

The Raven
07-11-2010, 07:50 AM
Shaq went to a team to be the man and get them to a championship while Lebron was the man in Cleveland, couldnt get a ring and boned out to join forces and get a ring the easy way

Cali.Empire
07-11-2010, 10:42 AM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

Both are. The legends want and stay (excluding being traded) with their original team. See what Shaq is doing last few years, legends don't do what he's doing also. Shaq is just diminishing he's legacy. Bron will now be know as the person who left his team to join an all star and a superstar who is already the man on the team.

Everything that has been going on is great, this new generation of players just isn't as competitive or hungry to be the GOAT.

Cali.Empire
07-11-2010, 10:45 AM
:facepalm:

And you call yourself a Laker fan?

Lemme educate you, young buck. The Lakers traded Vlade Divac for Kobe Bryant after he was drafted by the Charlotte Hornets in order to free up cap space so they could sign Shaq.

You just put Shaq's size 20-whatever shoe in your mouth.

:clap:

ntat
07-12-2010, 02:20 AM
:facepalm:

And you call yourself a Laker fan?

Lemme educate you, young buck. The Lakers traded Vlade Divac for Kobe Bryant after he was drafted by the Charlotte Hornets in order to free up cap space so they could sign Shaq.

You just put Shaq's size 20-whatever shoe in your mouth.

And by Shaq's size 20 whatever shoe, he means Shaq's size 20 whatever C@#k....

mynameismo
07-12-2010, 02:49 AM
He isn't a TRAITOR, He's a DOUCHEBAG!

No problem of him leaving, It's his choice to make. Problem is HOW HE LEFT.

hugepatsfan
07-12-2010, 02:59 AM
He isn't a TRAITOR, He's a DOUCHEBAG!

No problem of him leaving, It's his choice to make. Problem is HOW HE LEFT.

this

valade16
07-12-2010, 03:20 AM
I'm trying to figure out how people aren't the Pot calling the Kettle black when they insist that LeBron will never be the best until he wins a title and then criticize him for going to a team that gives him a better chance at a title...

Does this make sense to anyone else? :shrug:

valade16
07-12-2010, 03:28 AM
Both are. The legends want and stay (excluding being traded) with their original team. See what Shaq is doing last few years, legends don't do what he's doing also. Shaq is just diminishing he's legacy. Bron will now be know as the person who left his team to join an all star and a superstar who is already the man on the team.

Everything that has been going on is great, this new generation of players just isn't as competitive or hungry to be the GOAT.

I know a few of these were trades, however, in every case they wanted out of their city so they could win/get playing time...

Clyde Drexler
Kevin Garnett
Allen Iverson
Charles Barkeley
Patrick Ewing
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Dikembe Mutombo
Steve Nash
Scottie Pippen
Dennis Rodman

What a list of scrubs :rolleyes:, not a legend there!

And to further prove that your ENTIRE argument is trash, the GREATEST Legend of ALL-TIME, Michael Mother ********ng Jordan signed as a FA with the Wizards.

So now we can say that yes, some legends DO want to play in other places than their first pro team...

Seriously, all the players in the NBA want to win the championship, why are you criticizing LeBron when he wants the same thing?

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 03:38 AM
This whole argument is nonsense. Every player is allowed to test free agency. Lebron didnt choose the cavs or cleveland, they drafted him. He served his contract with them and choose to leave for greener pastures. Get off his nuts!!!! Shaq isnt a traitor either. These teams can cut and trade people at will with no care about what it does to the player and Lebron or anyone else deserves the right to leave for a situation that he chooses. Garnett didnt stay in Minnesota and nobody's hating on how he jumped ship to win a title. Same for Ray Allen. Kobe was asking to be traded after losing in the playoffs and the Lakers got him the help he needed. You think he would have stayed if they didnt get Gasol and they continued to lose? Highly unlikely. You guys are fools if you think these players are obligated to stay with one team. Yeah, Lebron grew up in celveland but does that mean he wants to play there his whole life. I guess every superstar from now on must win a title with the team they were drafted by or they are cowards and dont deserve any credit. some people in these forums are simply kids.

JLynn943
07-12-2010, 03:44 AM
Seriously, all the players in the NBA want to win the championship, why are you criticizing LeBron when he wants the same thing?

Because it's LeBron. I would never accuse the majority of PSD of being intelligent, but if they were, every single person on this board would love to have him on their team.

Some people are just jealous and insecure about their own teams and aging superstars, so they verbally attack LeBron for doing exactly what he should have done. In some way I guess that makes them feel better. Before, everybody said he was all about the money. Now that he's proven them wrong and gone to a team where he has a much better shot at winning, they criticize him for abandoning Cleveland as if he owed them something. LeBron is going to be criticized his whole career. If/when he wins in Miami, people will say he couldn't do it on his own. How this is different from Kobe, I don't understand, but whatever.

He may be arrogant and crave attention, but honestly, none of that matters. People need to get over it and worry about their own teams.

-Big-Baby-
07-12-2010, 03:50 AM
Yea,Shaq was already a Laker when they got Kobe.

:facepalm:

and you call yourself a laker fan?

ntat
07-12-2010, 04:04 AM
I'm trying to figure out how people aren't the Pot calling the Kettle black when they insist that LeBron will never be the best until he wins a title and then criticize him for going to a team that gives him a better chance at a title...

Does this make sense to anyone else? :shrug:

I think the argument is pretty clear man.
Going to a supersquad doesnt make Lebron look like a winner. The best beat the best, they dont go for for the easy win route. Not until they havent won and r about to retire lol.

ntat
07-12-2010, 04:06 AM
I know a few of these were trades, however, in every case they wanted out of their city so they could win/get playing time...

Clyde Drexler
Kevin Garnett
Allen Iverson
Charles Barkeley
Patrick Ewing
Grant Hill
Jason Kidd
Dikembe Mutombo
Steve Nash
Scottie Pippen
Dennis Rodman

What a list of scrubs :rolleyes:, not a legend there!

And to further prove that your ENTIRE argument is trash, the GREATEST Legend of ALL-TIME, Michael Mother ********ng Jordan signed as a FA with th.
e Wizards
So now we can say that yes, some legends DO want to play in other places than their first pro team...

Seriously, all the players in the NBA want to win the championship, why are you criticizing LeBron when he wants the same thing?

Wasnt he their president first?

FXMAN
07-12-2010, 04:21 AM
Laker fans are proving to be HUGE hypocrites. LeBron signs with a team that just got manhandled. Yes they're contenders now... BECAUSE THEY JUST SIGNED LEBRON! But it's okay for Shaq to jump ship and sign with you guys. And it's okay for the Grizzlies to trade Gasol for a bag of potato chips. And it's okay for Ron Artest to sign with the defending champions. But let LeBron sign with a team that couldn't even get out of the 1st round and it's a problem. We all know the real issue: they pose a serious threat to your dynasty. You Laker fans (not all of course) are proving to be the real cowards. And as mentioned, very hypocritical along the way.


Did you seriously try to compare Ron Artest to Lebron,Wade or Bosh???

Lebron may not be a traitor, but he is a quitter and took the easy way out! Not to mention he's straight up got an ego and a half and is a serious diva thinking he's got rights that others don't have and the heat are just as guilty in this whole thing.

Brousard reported that Lebron turned down the bulls because he( Lebron) demanded that the bulls give some of his entourage jobs and let them travel with him on the bulls dime. The response given back to Lebron... "We didn't even do that for Jordan" We all know Lebron ain't Jordan.

Shaq left a team that had Penny Hardaway and Two big ego's ie.. see Kobe and Shaq, for a team that was young and he would be the center piece to build around. When he left There was still Penny to build around , but we know they didn't and Penny was injured but at that time he was a star. Shaq did not make a mockery out of free agency and leave 5 other teams hanging till the last minute, and Gilbert was right in saying lebron quit in the playoffs. John Starks on his 0-25 performance played harder than Lebron in the playoffs. That Cleveland team was a damn good team, albeit they were in the east but you don't win 66 games by luck! There was definitely something to build on and he flat out quit for the easy win. Jordan didn't win his first Championship till he was 27!

Chad Ocho said it best on his twitter, " Kings lead their army into battle, they don't go join superstars." Miami would have been great with just wade and Bosh but lebron throws it over the top. Lebron will be a shadow of what he was and will be hated in every town not named miami. He will still be good but not mentioned in the same sentence as Jordan, Kobe and eventually Durant.

Miami fans, Seriously stop defending yourselves. Nobody is pissed at you, they're pissed at Lebron. Congrats to you guys for building an allstar team. So put your defenses down and celebrate. The rest of us will continue to bash Lebron

valade16
07-12-2010, 05:07 AM
I think the argument is pretty clear man.
Going to a supersquad doesnt make Lebron look like a winner. The best beat the best, they dont go for for the easy win route. Not until they havent won and r about to retire lol.

Your right, just like Russell did it in the 60's with the Celtics, ENTIRELY by himself...
oh wait... he had Bob Cousy and Tommy Heisnohn...

But Larry Bird won single handedly in the 80s... wait... he had Robert Parish and Kevin McHale?

Well surely Magic won by himself. No? he had Kareem and James Worthy?

Well Kareem HAD to have won a title by himself, maybe the one from Milwaukie? Nope. They had Oscar Robertson.

Well, that was the old era, surely the NEW era had players win the title by themselves, I mean, it was MJ!... what?! He had Scottie and Rodman?!

What about the Rockets when MJ "retired", Olajuwan finally won one by himself! no?! He had Clyde Drexler in a midseason trade!

Duncan? No
Shaq? No
Kobe? No


Fact is, you have to have more than one great player to win a title, let alone multiple titles. I checked Philly in 83 (moses, Dr. J, Maurice Cheeks); Sonics in 79 (Sickma, Gus Williams, and Denny Johnson); Bullets in 78 (Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes); Blazers in 77 (Walton and Maurice Lucas).

Pretty much every single NBA Championship team throughout history had more than one great player so your advice to LeBron is to stay in Cleveland, where he has less chance to win a title, simply because you think the best ones do it by themselves?

How on EARTH do you not have a job in the NBA? Let me guess...

valade16
07-12-2010, 05:16 AM
Did you seriously try to compare Ron Artest to Lebron,Wade or Bosh???

Lebron may not be a traitor, but he is a quitter and took the easy way out! Not to mention he's straight up got an ego and a half and is a serious diva thinking he's got rights that others don't have and the heat are just as guilty in this whole

That Cleveland team was a damn good team, albeit they were in the east but you don't win 66 games by luck! There was definitely something to build on and he flat out quit for the easy win. Jordan didn't win his first Championship till he was 27!

Lebron will be a shadow of what he was and will be hated in every town not named miami. He will still be good but not mentioned in the same sentence as Jordan, Kobe and eventually Durant.

Firstly, your telling me if you had NBA talent you wouldn't have left Cleveland and gone ANYWHERE else? Can you honestly say that without your nose getting just a little bit longer?...:eyebrow:

And there was something to build on in Cleveland... LeBron James. that is it man. There is nothing else of value there. What do you think the team will do next year with Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison leading the pack? How did the bucks and Wizards look when they were the focal points of those teams? Not very good...

All you people that say LeBron should've stayed because good players win by themselves and with their first team make me sick. My previous post (should be shortly above this one) will tell you why the "he should win by himself" argument is a pile of wrong garbage.

but the second part is what really gets me. You realize the Only reason MJ was able to win with his first team is because they drafted Scottie Pippen. Yeah, funny how when your looking back you forget that MJ didn't win eveyr title in the leauge as soon as he entered simply because he was "MJ". He actually had to have a good team around him. Imagine that. How many times have the Cavs drafted a Pippen, a McHale, a Kobe, hell, even a Parker or Ginobili?

You can't, because the Cavs haven't. They've been pretty devoid of good young talent during LeBron's entire tenure. They've had a sub-par team that looked very good because of LeBron. that's it...

Don't criticize LeBron for the Cav's inability to draft quality players...

mynameismo
07-12-2010, 05:32 AM
This thread still?

Lebron is now with Miami. GET OVER IT!

shizzle09
07-12-2010, 01:54 PM
I think the argument is pretty clear man.
Going to a supersquad doesnt make Lebron look like a winner. The best beat the best, they dont go for for the easy win route. Not until they havent won and r about to retire lol.

So it makes a difference that the team that has won the title the last two years has the most stacked team in the league and a payroll way higher than any team Lebron will be a part of in coming years. A bunch of whining babies that complain about Lebron. lakers fans of all people need to stay out of this conversation because nobody is more guilty of playing on a super team than Kobe. Yeah he didnt leave to play on the team but he sure the hell asked for a trade after getting knocked out of the playoffs when he wasnt on a super team. The cap is 58 million and the lakers are at 81. hmmmmmm. but lebron is the guilty one. yeah good call people.

OREcoast49er
07-12-2010, 02:50 PM
All this talk of LeBron being a "traitor" makes me laugh. He was a FA, he had the right to go somewhere else. I mean, ifyou had a job and after yor contract was up, another company offered you much better working conditions would you not take it?

Now the way he did it, I definetly have a problem with. He could have had the courtesy of telling Cleveland before that ridiculous spectacle on tv. Thats like getting dumped on national tv. Had to be horrible feeling for Cavs fans, I feel for them.

Another thing is that everyone acts like Wade is also a new addition to the team. If you think about it they "just" added Bosh and James. I know I know, "just". But its not like all 3 are from different teams. And I heard they left a ton of money on the table to play together. And wouldnt it be great to play with your really good friends?

And for the people that say "the great ones do it themselves". Total BS. Name a championship team and there was more then one Superstar. Jordan wasnt alone, nor Kobe, nor Hakeem, Garnett, Duncan....the list goes on. Nobody does it without help. Laker fans are just mad because they arent the only team with a super team.

Dallas Tx4Life
07-12-2010, 02:54 PM
So it makes a difference that the team that has won the title the last two years has the most stacked team in the league and a payroll way higher than any team Lebron will be a part of in coming years. A bunch of whining babies that complain about Lebron. lakers fans of all people need to stay out of this conversation because nobody is more guilty of playing on a super team than Kobe. Yeah he didnt leave to play on the team but he sure the hell asked for a trade after getting knocked out of the playoffs when he wasnt on a super team. The cap is 58 million and the lakers are at 81. hmmmmmm. but lebron is the guilty one. yeah good call people.

EXACTLY!!! general consensus calls kobe the best player in the nba... right?


who's the best big man??? PAU GASOL... so the best skill player and the best big man.. along with artest, bynum, odom and that bench?? come on guys quit lying to yourself like its "cheating" that these guys did this with the heat

Dallas Tx4Life
07-12-2010, 02:55 PM
All this talk of LeBron being a "traitor" makes me laugh. He was a FA, he had the right to go somewhere else. I mean, ifyou had a job and after yor contract was up, another company offered you much better working conditions would you not take it?

uhhhh.... now that makes some freakin sense right there!!! oh but he wasnt supposed to because some of you guys didnt want him to?!?!?!?! ccome on, get real

strokeman
07-12-2010, 03:15 PM
lebron - born and raised in Ohio.
he was a god to many there!
lebron created a fiasco, just to **** on his team on national television.
shaq left because there were issues between him and penny (both wanted to be the Man)
Shaq went to a Laker team that made him the focal point which he was asking for! He didnít join AI in Philly or some other stars team he made his version of the late show!

SP@Z.
07-12-2010, 03:25 PM
Neither of them are traitors.. I don't remember them committing treason. lol... but the reason why Lebron is getting that label is because he was born and raised in Cleveland.

GspLAL
07-12-2010, 03:27 PM
I ask you this: if LeBron decided to go to the Lakers, Laker fans would LOVE him and be all like "he chose to go to the best organization" etc etc etc and somehow bring Kobe into it. The Bulls would have done the same thing - in fact, EVERY team would have, and the fans of every other team would have been doing what you guys are doing now

it's business. He put himself in a good situation and that's it. I'd prefer if he went NJ or a place with only one superstar, but it's business - whatev!

I honestly wouldn't want Lebron on my team, not until Kobe is around 35 years old.

strokeman
07-12-2010, 03:29 PM
EXACTLY!!! general consensus calls kobe the best player in the nba... right?


who's the best big man??? PAU GASOL... so the best skill player and the best big man.. along with artest, bynum, odom and that bench?? come on guys quit lying to yourself like its "cheating" that these guys did this with the heat

you guys are wrongggggg!
MIA got 3 top 10 players! LA got 1, people only talk about Pau because he has good skills as a big man but he is not the best PF in the NBA Timmy D, Dirk, KG, Bosh he is not the best C in the NBA we all know dwight is!
LA stack team was full of re-jacks,
Fisher - bench player in Utah
Odom - shipped to LA in a package deal
Artest - came with his issues and is past his prime
Ariza - was shipped to LA (over achieved with LA)
Bynum - didnt play the 1st time this year say limited time again

its is the system and Kobe that makes all these guy better! :eyebrow:
thats y i'm not counting out LA :clap:

Dallas Tx4Life
07-12-2010, 03:30 PM
I honestly wouldn't want Lebron on my team, not until Kobe is around 35 years old.

that is a lie

0nekhmer
07-12-2010, 03:34 PM
well shaq basically left the same way from a contending team to an even bigger contending team. You can view the two of them differently. but that is if you are not biased. I a raptor fan who does not care much for either sees Shaq going to LA without any real established superstars.

One thing that you can fault shaq with is he took the full max, and left because of greed and jealousy,

Now you look at Lebron and how he left. You can see he had a bigger impact on his departure thus having more angry people. His hour special certainly didn't help make him look good either. One thing you can admire is the fact that he took less money in order to have a more complete team.. but you can also counter that thought by saying he's playing with 2 other superstars.

so by an unbiased fan, they are both pretty much "traitors" but lebron was the bigger one

Dallas Tx4Life
07-12-2010, 03:35 PM
you guys are wrongggggg!
MIA got 3 top 10 players! LA got 1, people only talk about Pau because he has good skills as a big man but he is not the best PF in the NBA Timmy D, Dirk, KG, Bosh he is not the best C in the NBA we all know dwight is!
LA stack team was full of re-jacks,
Fisher - bench player in Utah
Odom - shipped to LA in a package deal
Artest - came with his issues and is past his prime
Ariza - was shipped to LA (over achieved with LA)
Bynum - didnt play the 1st time this year say limited time again

its is the system and Kobe that makes all these guy better! :eyebrow:
thats y i'm not counting out LA :clap:

no dude.. im not wrong... pau is the best big man down low, and the only person you can even call for discussion against him would be dwight, but these playoffs... no two playoffs in a row prove other wise so... either way...
you cant say you'd rather have dirk, kg, bosh or duncan over pau... come on man be real

Fisher- GREAT point guard in the playoffs for the lakers (thats what matters)
Odom- best 6th man in the league
artest- best defender in the nba, **** all the questionmarks, i knew it was gonna work..
bynum's length gave yall sooo much...

and yea its the system!!!! that system has gotten 37 rings!! lmao jk but really its alll that and then phil... so should kobe player/coach when phil goes? (damn.... thatd be so cool)

Dallas Tx4Life
07-12-2010, 03:38 PM
Now you look at Lebron and how he left. You can see he had a bigger impact on his departure thus having more angry people. His hour special certainly didn't help make him look good either. One thing you can admire is the fact that he took less money in order to have a more complete team.. but you can also counter that thought by saying he's playing with 2 other superstars.

so by an unbiased fan, they are both pretty much "traitors" but lebron was the bigger one

yea...... ok.... i get it. i know that he was born there and all that (which proves that nba gave cleveland lebron in that lottery :smoking:) (im kinda kidding haha)

but he couldnt just sit around and become the nba's dan marino...


because if he didnt go to miami


who and what would miami have done with all that money... gotten some reallllllly good players to fill the spots they have and have a completely awesome team.. lebron wouldnt have even reached the conf finals...

REALLYYYYY?
07-12-2010, 03:42 PM
LeQueen is silly.

Jaji
07-12-2010, 03:48 PM
LeQueen is silly.

:rolleyes: LeGimme a break! Sound LeCorny? Well so do LeYou.

8kobe24
07-12-2010, 03:51 PM
Didn't Shaq ditch Orlando for La La Land back in 96? The Magic got swept in the Finals in 95 and then swept by the Bulls in 96. Then Shaq left Disney World for Disney Land. Why isn't he a "traitor" too? Why isn't he a quitter? Laker fans???

Shaq jumped ship for money and fame and hopes to bring a title to LA.

Reasons why his situation is different from lebron:

1. He didn't lead the Magic to believe that they were the "front runners"

2. He didn't call for a world wide media whoring interview to say he was signing with the Lakers.

3. I can recall the Lakers made an initial offer of 6 years 90 million, Orlando countered with 6 years 100 million, the Lakers then came back with 6 years 120 million, and the Magic simply was not willing to go that high. The Lakers landed him and Kobe that same year and the rest was history.

There's plenty more reasons, but you get the idea that what lebron did was un-paralleled in terms of heart breaking and disloyal.

PS
I dont hate lebron, bosh, wade, or the heat. I am just simply comparing the difference between shaq and lebron leaving their respective teams (ORL and CLE).

valade16
07-12-2010, 04:10 PM
lebron - born and raised in Ohio.
he was a god to many there!
lebron created a fiasco, just to **** on his team on national television.
shaq left because there were issues between him and penny (both wanted to be the Man)
Shaq went to a Laker team that made him the focal point which he was asking for! He didnít join AI in Philly or some other stars team he made his version of the late show!

I think LBJ, Wade, and Bosh should be applauded for not being selfish players. They will to win supercedes their petty egos like Shaq and Kobe.

And don't let any superstar make you think they can do it on their own, no single player has ever won a title by himself. Period. There is always some other superstar or really good player on any championship team.

valade16
07-12-2010, 04:14 PM
There's plenty more reasons, but you get the idea that what lebron did was un-paralleled in terms of heart breaking and disloyal.

PS
I dont hate lebron, bosh, wade, or the heat. I am just simply comparing the difference between shaq and lebron leaving their respective teams (ORL and CLE).

I was unaware it was disloyal to change teams when your a free agent and thus under no obligation to play with any specific team...:rolleyes:

Have you had more than one job in your life? If so (and unless your a serious outlier, the answer is yes), why did you change jobs? More money? Better conditions? Better location?

NEWSFLASH: Those are the same reasons why LeBron did it.

And don't give me the BS about his "hometown", HOW many people on earth leave their hometowns!

Why is Dirk not criticized for ditching his hometown in Germany to play in USA, what about Yao?

See why these arguments are kind of hypocritical?

Jaji
07-12-2010, 04:20 PM
I think LBJ, Wade, and Bosh should be applauded for not being selfish players. They will to win supercedes their petty egos like Shaq and Kobe.

And don't let any superstar make you think they can do it on their own, no single player has ever won a title by himself. Period. There is always some other superstar or really good player on any championship team.

The closest 1 man army to win it all was, guess who? LeBron back in 2007. That team had no business in the Finals, yet LeBron took them anyway.


I was unaware it was disloyal to change teams when your a free agent and thus under no obligation to play with any specific team...:rolleyes:

Have you had more than one job in your life? If so (and unless your a serious outlier, the answer is yes), why did you change jobs? More money? Better conditions? Better location?

NEWSFLASH: Those are the same reasons why LeBron did it.

And don't give me the BS about his "hometown", HOW many people on earth leave their hometowns!

Why is Dirk not criticized for ditching his hometown in Germany to play in USA, what about Yao?

See why these arguments are kind of hypocritical?

Excellent point. And LeBron isn't even from Cleveland, he's from Akron. Akron is like a 2nd home to me. I have family there and spent many summers there as a kid. Trust me, most 20-something year old black males from Akron can't even stand Cleveland. I only say most because I'm sure there's an exception to the rule, but in reality, I don't know any. They all hate Cleveland. I'm sure LeBron grew up the same way. Cleveland is close to home, but not home.

8kobe24
07-12-2010, 04:32 PM
I was unaware it was disloyal to change teams when your a free agent and thus under no obligation to play with any specific team...:rolleyes:

Have you had more than one job in your life? If so (and unless your a serious outlier, the answer is yes), why did you change jobs? More money? Better conditions? Better location?

NEWSFLASH: Those are the same reasons why LeBron did it.

And don't give me the BS about his "hometown", HOW many people on earth leave their hometowns!

Why is Dirk not criticized for ditching his hometown in Germany to play in USA, what about Yao?

See why these arguments are kind of hypocritical?

You made some valid points and some, I won't even get in to. It all depends on how someone looks at it. But you forgot to address statement #2.:D

valade16
07-12-2010, 04:36 PM
You made some valid points and some, I won't even get in to. It all depends on how someone looks at it. But you forgot to address statement #2.:D

That's because I don't have a good rebuttal :D.

I'm aware that LeBron is a giant egomaniac, but when you tell a kid from 10 to 20 that he is destined to be the best BBall on the planet, they tend to get a big head. LeBron was created.

lakerspack#1
07-12-2010, 04:52 PM
this is for jaji lebrons a traitor cause he bailed on his team he left his hometown with nothing and before u say its different cities akron is not far at all from cleveland he was born in ohio played for ohio pro sport team he is a hometown kid and he jus ups and leaves them by an hour long special he couldnt even call the owner to tell him he let them watch it on tv thats the biggest slap in the face he created a circus out of this fa having 6 teams waiting and waitng jus to say no to them on national tv he then teams up with 2 other superstars in there prime shaq for one is not a hometown kid second orlando didnt want his ego he was already fighting with penny the same way he did with kobe shaq wanted to be the star he joined the lakers who had nobody the heat lost in the first round but wait they already had a superstar dwade then bosh came then lebron u have no arguments ur completely ********

Jaji
07-12-2010, 05:01 PM
You made some valid points and some, I won't even get in to. It all depends on how someone looks at it. But you forgot to address statement #2.:D

Yeah I'll agree, his one hour special was a bit much. But let's face it, this was a big deal. Over 10 million households tuned in. There was no way to downplay the biggest acquisition in league history. It was highly anticipated, might as well make some money off of it. Blame the media, they deserve more than LeBron.

lakerspack#1
07-12-2010, 05:06 PM
Yeah I'll agree, his one hour special was a bit much. But let's face it, this was a big deal. Over 10 million households tuned in. There was no way to downplay the biggest acquisition in league history. It was highly anticipated, might as well make some money off of it. Blame the media, they deserve more than LeBron.


the media has created lebron and his massive ego i blame them to especially espn and there non stop coverage about him its old and im tired of it now lets jus move on the rest of the summer football getting ready to start up

valade16
07-12-2010, 05:11 PM
Yeah I'll agree, his one hour special was a bit much. But let's face it, this was a big deal. Over 10 million households tuned in. There was no way to downplay the biggest acquisition in league history. It was highly anticipated, might as well make some money off of it. Blame the media, they deserve more than LeBron.

Yes indeed, and some of that money went to charity (boys and girls club I think), so it's not like he's some oil tycoon swimming in money.

he's capable of giving too.

loufor2
07-12-2010, 05:29 PM
1) Shaq won championships for LA

2) Shaq didn't have an ESPN special.

ntat
07-13-2010, 06:49 AM
Your right, just like Russell did it in the 60's with the Celtics, ENTIRELY by himself...
oh wait... he had Bob Cousy and Tommy Heisnohn...

But Larry Bird won single handedly in the 80s... wait... he had Robert Parish and Kevin McHale?

Well surely Magic won by himself. No? he had Kareem and James Worthy?

Well Kareem HAD to have won a title by himself, maybe the one from Milwaukie? Nope. They had Oscar Robertson.

Well, that was the old era, surely the NEW era had players win the title by themselves, I mean, it was MJ!... what?! He had Scottie and Rodman?!

What about the Rockets when MJ "retired", Olajuwan finally won one by himself! no?! He had Clyde Drexler in a midseason trade!

Duncan? No
Shaq? No
Kobe? No


Fact is, you have to have more than one great player to win a title, let alone multiple titles. I checked Philly in 83 (moses, Dr. J, Maurice Cheeks); Sonics in 79 (Sickma, Gus Williams, and Denny Johnson); Bullets in 78 (Wes Unseld and Elvin Hayes); Blazers in 77 (Walton and Maurice Lucas).

Pretty much every single NBA Championship team throughout history had more than one great player so your advice to LeBron is to stay in Cleveland, where he has less chance to win a title, simply because you think the best ones do it by themselves?

How on EARTH do you not have a job in the NBA? Let me guess...
-So those guys left and brought 2 of the other 10 best players in the league, or they were drafted bytheir teams and built true dynastys?
-Hakeem won those 2 championships only after he got Jordan and Robinson to come with him? NO
-Shaq went to a Lakers team with Grant Hill and Jordan? No Kobe was traded there as a darft pick after.
-David Robinson won only after leaving another team and getting two other top 10s to come? No.
-JORDAN left the Bulls to find an easy place to win?
Those arguments are all stupid.
If u cant see the BIG difference between this situation and literally every other situation u named, its because u dont want to, which makes debating with u useless.

Jaji
07-13-2010, 08:22 AM
1) Shaq won championships for LA

2) Shaq didn't have an ESPN special.

:facepalm: You do realize we're talking about Shaq leaving Orlando not being traded by LA?

That was lame of Yankeefan to delete my post. :pity:

cheetos185
07-13-2010, 08:28 AM
Shaq jumped ship for money and fame and hopes to bring a title to LA.

Reasons why his situation is different from lebron:

1. He didn't lead the Magic to believe that they were the "front runners"

2. He didn't call for a world wide media whoring interview to say he was signing with the Lakers.

3. I can recall the Lakers made an initial offer of 6 years 90 million, Orlando countered with 6 years 100 million, the Lakers then came back with 6 years 120 million, and the Magic simply was not willing to go that high. The Lakers landed him and Kobe that same year and the rest was history.

There's plenty more reasons, but you get the idea that what lebron did was un-paralleled in terms of heart breaking and disloyal.

PS
I dont hate lebron, bosh, wade, or the heat. I am just simply comparing the difference between shaq and lebron leaving their respective teams (ORL and CLE).

to add to that lakers didn't have 2 other all-star on team