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View Full Version : "I have no intention of firing Lou Piniella"



YankeeFan28
06-17-2010, 01:01 PM
But general manager Jim Hendry is holding out hope for a drastic turnaround and believes manager Lou Piniella is the man who can pull it off, despite growing criticism about the team's lackluster performance.

"I have no intention of firing Lou Piniella," Hendry said Wednesday. "Lou and I have a great relationship. Lou has done a lot of good things here. We're just going through a tough snag. It's the middle of June. I still feel comfortable we're capable of getting back in it.

"We've never talked about his future after this year. It never has been discussed and I don't think he or I feel like we're going to be doing that anyway. He's fine with me. The guy has done a lot of great things in this game for a long time."http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/ct-spt-0617-cubs-as-oakland-chicago--20100616,0,7828384.story

Sorry fellas

Milnertime
06-17-2010, 01:02 PM
Well that's just stupid.

IRNMN
06-17-2010, 01:12 PM
Well this is no surprise, I don't think a managerial change will occur until the GM is changed. However, statements like these are just to divert the press all GM say they won't and after a week of losing they end up seeing the door.

Diehdcubsfan2
06-17-2010, 01:25 PM
Then maybe the Cubs can fire JH so whoever steps in there has the balls to fire Lou.

I don't get the man love this guy gets in the Cubs organization or baseball for that matter. Like the Fangraphs thread illustrated, he just isn't smart. He is way to old school. We all know the catcher situation, he also sucks at making line-ups, loves hit-and-runs, bunts early, can't handle a pen at times, uses pitchers as pitch hitters, thinks Fonty died. Properly more that I'm forgetting. I hated him when the Cubs signed him, but he was forgiven cause the team was winning. That doesn't mean he was a good manager, just the players were more consistent. Now with the team struggling the past few season, his flaws are appearing again and are on showcase daily. He also seems to lost all interest this season, like he doesn't care anymore. Also learn how to talk.

DamnGoat
06-17-2010, 01:26 PM
I figured (and hoped) he'd just retire anyway, so hopefully this isn't an issue.

behindmydesk
06-17-2010, 01:30 PM
I hate Lou, didn't want him to start wtih, but come on we aren't in the NBA, that one losing season gets you fired. Lou's winning % is right up there with Dusty's, which is to say damn good especially for cubs standards.

Firing lou doesn't get us inot the playoffs, keeping lou doesn't get us into the playoffs, so you don't fire him.

windycityD
06-17-2010, 01:50 PM
Dusty was not fired in 2006. Lou wont be fired this season in season. What exactly is news here?

Milnertime
06-17-2010, 02:01 PM
I hate Lou, didn't want him to start wtih, but come on we aren't in the NBA, that one losing season gets you fired. Lou's winning % is right up there with Dusty's, which is to say damn good especially for cubs standards.

Firing lou doesn't get us inot the playoffs, keeping lou doesn't get us into the playoffs, so you don't fire him.
It might give you a chance to see what someone like Alan Trammel could do with this team, though.

Playoffs are probably out of the question, but I'd really like to see how Trammel manages. He seems like a really smart baseball guy.

ReJo
06-17-2010, 02:03 PM
I never expected Lou to get fired this year.
Ricketts gave the holdovers their chance but I fully expect him to bring in his own people next year meaning bye bye Hendry, Piniella and Kenney

Doogolas
06-17-2010, 02:13 PM
I just want to Fire Lou cause he's clearly completely batshit insane.

Tehjosha
06-17-2010, 02:42 PM
If Hendry isn't gonna fire Lou, then he damn sure needs to light a fire under his ***. I'm ****ing tired of seeing Lou sit in the dugout with his arms crossed and resting on his grandpa-like belly, shaking his head and shrugging his shoulders after every stupid mistake.

He has no interest in motivating this team, and you can see it. Most of the time the looks on the guys faces just scream "whatever". Sure, he got this team into the playoffs two years in a row, but this is a "what have you done for me lately" type of business.

His lineup and pen management have only got worse, not better. If Hendry isn't going to fire him, fine, we're probably not going anywhere in 2010 whether he's here or not. But if this team doesn't start to show even a little bit of fight, and continue to wallow at a level beneath Pittsburgh, and Hendry does nothing, then he should be held responsible as well.

1908_Cubs
06-17-2010, 02:56 PM
Really, Hendry? Why is that?

You should have every intention of dumping his ***.

Doogolas
06-17-2010, 03:02 PM
What GM says they intend to fire a manager?

Guy Montag
06-17-2010, 03:15 PM
Milnertime, Trammell is the guy I'm most intrigued by as well. I like his demeanor, and if his quotes here and there and ability as a player have any bearing at all on his knowledge of the game, he's probably pretty strong there, too.

The same could be said about Ryno of course--playing ability equaling knowledge--and though I suspect Ryno understands the game pretty well, too, I don't yet get the solid managerial vibe from him that I get from Trammell. Really, if I hadn't loved Ryno so much as a player, I'd say what was really on my mind.

Okay, I'll say it anyway. Ryno's demeanor is marked by an annoyed vapidity. He always looks like he's mad about something that happened ten minutes ago.

Mell413
06-17-2010, 03:18 PM
I wouldn't expect a GM to come out and say he intends to fire the manager. I would hope that he could see some of Lou's flaws.

Bambino
06-17-2010, 04:43 PM
Let the old dog finish out the season, but after that .. see ya later.



BAM

Cub_StuckinSTL
06-17-2010, 05:31 PM
Really, Hendry? Why is that?

You should have every intention of dumping his ***.

Because they have a good relationship duh!


I dont give a **** what your relationship is with someone. Its a god damn winning and business decision as soon as you let personal relationships in the way of the right decisions you are no longer fit to be in charge.

jiggin
06-17-2010, 05:39 PM
not going to find a better solution to take over this year so I see no point in firing him.

let the captain go down with the ship...

bulldog312
06-17-2010, 08:05 PM
not going to find a better solution to take over this year so I see no point in firing him.

let the captain go down with the ship...

I understand that thinking, but I'm not sure I agree. I get the feeling that this team just doesn't like playing for Lou, and that nearly anyone else could be our manager and the team might start playing better.

As for the comments, they really mean nothing to me. What else should he say? You have to back your manager 100% (in the media anyways) until the day you decide to fire him.

windycityD
06-17-2010, 08:18 PM
I understand that thinking, but I'm not sure I agree. I get the feeling that this team just doesn't like playing for Lou, and that nearly anyone else could be our manager and the team might start playing better.

As for the comments, they really mean nothing to me. What else should he say? You have to back your manager 100% (in the media anyways) until the day you decide to fire him.

If Ricketts has any intention of giving Trammell the gig, then it would make sense to do that this July and give him a deal through 2011 w/ a club option for 2012. That scenario wont happen, though, unless Lou agrees to walk. Lou is basically having the same lame duck, last year that Dusty had in '06, with the only real diff being the standings at this point.

BUD Bleachers
06-17-2010, 09:20 PM
I just want to Fire Lou cause he's clearly completely batshit insane.

He's not insane at all.

He's just completely stymied by the fact that his team of professionals have completely lost their collective ability to execute and play baseball.

This has now happened for the second year in a row.

Fire him and put him out of his misery. Do him the favor.

This team can't score runs.

When they hit; they can't pitch. When they pitch; they can't hit.

They make mental errors. They make physical errors. They're overpaid "stars" don't even contribute much anymore and have fettered progress.

The Cubs are just a major clusterf@ck.

Tehjosha
06-17-2010, 09:32 PM
Let the old dog finish out the season, but after that .. see ya later.



BAM

Hell yeah, see him later.


TEH

1908_Cubs
06-17-2010, 09:32 PM
Hell yeah, see him later.


TEH

Suck It


1908

chitownwindsof8
06-17-2010, 10:50 PM
Everyone is hating on lou. I will be the first to say he hasnt made the best moves so far this year. But I dont blame lou for the cubs short cummings this year. This team is showing its age and under achieving. Lee and Ramirez need to get there **** together and start carring this team, espeacially aram. After this year I doubt lou will be back espeacially if we dont make the playoffs or jim hendry. I am about sick of carlos zambrano as well and his large contract as well.

I would perfer bob brenley as the next manager of the cubs.

Cub_StuckinSTL
06-17-2010, 10:56 PM
Everyone is hating on lou. I will be the first to say he hasnt made the best moves so far this year. But I dont blame lou for the cubs short cummings this year. This team is showing its age and under achieving. Lee and Ramirez need to get there **** together and start carring this team, espeacially aram. After this year I doubt lou will be back espeacially if we dont make the playoffs or jim hendry. I am about sick of carlos zambrano as well and his large contract as well.

I would perfer bob brenley as the next manager of the cubs.

:confused: Apparently the cubs are making bad pornos :confused:

CubbieSteve
06-17-2010, 11:11 PM
Let the old dog finish out the season, but after that .. see ya later.



BAM

BAM, I'm with you on this one good buddy. He doesn't want to be fired, let him walk out with his dignity. Least we could do.



STEVE

Milnertime
06-18-2010, 05:21 AM
not going to find a better solution to take over this year so I see no point in firing him.

let the captain go down with the ship...
Anyone would be better at this point, since we pretty much know that Lou won't be back next year. If you can give someone a chance to come in and get acquainted with this team (at least a good portion of the players) then they don't have to start fresh next spring.

If it's someone like Trammel, he's already pretty acquainted with the club, but it would be interesting to see what he would do differently than Lou.

There are some real options that would be better than Lou at this point. He's just been absolute ******* at in game managing this year.

I wouldn't be opposed to sending Bob Brenly down to the dugout, either. I think he'd be different kind of manager than he was in Arizona, just based on the comments he's made in the booth and some of the things Len has said about him in interviews.

Ron!n
06-18-2010, 06:45 AM
Anyone would be better at this point, since we pretty much know that Lou won't be back next year. If you can give someone a chance to come in and get acquainted with this team (at least a good portion of the players) then they don't have to start fresh next spring.

If it's someone like Trammel, he's already pretty acquainted with the club, but it would be interesting to see what he would do differently than Lou.

There are some real options that would be better than Lou at this point. He's just been absolute ******* at in game managing this year.

I wouldn't be opposed to sending Bob Brenly down to the dugout, either. I think he'd be different kind of manager than he was in Arizona, just based on the comments he's made in the booth and some of the things Len has said about him in interviews.
How about Len Kasper? He probably wouldnt work just cause he doesnt have any experience as a manager or player. But hes extremely smart.

poodski
06-18-2010, 09:13 AM
Because they have a good relationship duh!


I dont give a **** what your relationship is with someone. Its a god damn winning and business decision as soon as you let personal relationships in the way of the right decisions you are no longer fit to be in charge.

Well no offense but why exactly are we all ready to fire a guy who is only 6 games under .500 on this season, and has finished all his other seasons above .500.

I dont like Lou at all, but since it's a winning business and Lou has been a winner for 3 years and now only a loser for 2.5 months, I dont think he really deserves to be fired, he just never should have been hired.

bulldog312
06-18-2010, 10:11 AM
Well no offense but why exactly are we all ready to fire a guy who is only 6 games under .500 on this season, and has finished all his other seasons above .500.

My answer to this is because, as I said before, the team doesn't look like they want to play for Lou. I realize that a lot happens behind the scenes that we don't see, so this might not be true at all. But if it is, he needs to go. This team is talented enough to win the division, but its not going to happen (especially now) if they don't have any respect for their manager.

1908_Cubs
06-18-2010, 10:48 AM
Well no offense but why exactly are we all ready to fire a guy who is only 6 games under .500 on this season, and has finished all his other seasons above .500.

I dont like Lou at all, but since it's a winning business and Lou has been a winner for 3 years and now only a loser for 2.5 months, I dont think he really deserves to be fired, he just never should have been hired.

Lou appears to have no want or care to win. We've beaten to death letting Koyie Hill play. We've seen some awfully terrible lineups being put out there. While I know it's not his fault Lee and Ramirez have sucked, his bullpen management is beyond bad, and he is awful at using the bench. Just the other day he let Zambrano pinch hit over everyone on the bench. In the 8th inning. And it was only a 4 run game. You got to be kidding me on that call.

Lou needs to go. Sure he won, but I've got to say this team won despite Lou, not because of. Which is easily grounds for firing when the team starts losing especially when you factor in the above. It's time.

poodski
06-18-2010, 10:49 AM
My answer to this is because, as I said before, the team doesn't look like they want to play for Lou. I realize that a lot happens behind the scenes that we don't see, so this might not be true at all. But if it is, he needs to go. This team is talented enough to win the division, but its not going to happen (especially now) if they don't have any respect for their manager.

Why would they have played for him the last three years then?

Why would Aramis and Lee just decide now to say well **** this guy. That doesn't make sense.

1B, 2B, and 3B are the only slots on this team not hitting league average. The ERA for the pitchers is 8th so just a slot above average.

I just don't buy that. Lee and Ramirez come back to who they were, and we get any production out of 2B from any of the three because all three have been awful, we are right back in at worst contention.

I don't like Lou, I think he is a terrible, terrible manager, but this teams flaw is not the manager, its the corner IF spots, and 2B.

poodski
06-18-2010, 10:56 AM
Lou appears to have no want or care to win. We've beaten to death letting Koyie Hill play. We've seen some awfully terrible lineups being put out there. While I know it's not his fault Lee and Ramirez have sucked, his bullpen management is beyond bad, and he is awful at using the bench. Just the other day he let Zambrano pinch hit over everyone on the bench. In the 8th inning. And it was only a 4 run game. You got to be kidding me on that call.

Lou needs to go. Sure he won, but I've got to say this team won despite Lou, not because of. Which is easily grounds for firing when the team starts losing especially when you factor in the above. It's time.

Meh I dont really feel that the manager costs the team all that much. Lineup construction has been shown to not really mean all that much, the difference between the best lineup and the worst is probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 runs a season, and since Lou uses a different lineup every day it seems its hard to really concern myself with that.

I dont really have a problem using Zambrano against a LHP. I think the only people on the bench were what Fukudome, Fontenot, Hill and Tracy right? Zambrano is probably a better hitter than all of those four vs LHP.

Lou makes some dumb decisions, but that was probably a smart decision that most managers wouldnt make. Z struck out, but the result doesnt make the decision a bad one.

I dont think the manager cost the team more than lets say 2 wins over a year? That might even be considered against the best in the game, but compared to the average manager, Lou doesn't really cost the team much.

1908_Cubs
06-18-2010, 11:00 AM
Meh I dont really feel that the manager costs the team all that much. Lineup construction has been shown to not really mean all that much, the difference between the best lineup and the worst is probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 runs a season, and since Lou uses a different lineup every day it seems its hard to really concern myself with that.

I dont really have a problem using Zambrano against a LHP. I think the only people on the bench were what Fukudome, Fontenot, Hill and Tracy right? Zambrano is probably a better hitter than all of those four vs LHP.

Lou makes some dumb decisions, but that was probably a smart decision that most managers wouldnt make. Z struck out, but the result doesnt make the decision a bad one.

I dont think the manager cost the team more than lets say 2 wins over a year? That might even be considered against the best in the game, but compared to the average manager, Lou doesn't really cost the team much.
Perhaps. But with his poor use of the bullpen, I think he actually could cost the team more than 2. I think upwards of 4 games could eventually, over the course of a season, be traced back to a manager's direct decisions. Maybe it's 2, but it's nearly impossible to quantify, sadly since it's based on ifs-and-buts.

That said, many teams seem to respond better with a change at the helm while under preforming. I normally don't believe in that portion of the game, but for some reason, across sports, many teams just...get better with a switch. We're watching Lee and Ramirez struggle mightily. I don't want Lou here anymore and who knows, maybe we'll end up being one of those teams who "get it together" under Trammel or someone. Lou isn't part of the solution, so get rid of him, is more of my mantra. Might as well try something new.

poodski
06-18-2010, 11:06 AM
Perhaps. But with his poor use of the bullpen, I think he actually could cost the team more than 2. I think upwards of 4 games could eventually, over the course of a season, be traced back to a manager's direct decisions. Maybe it's 2, but it's nearly impossible to quantify, sadly since it's based on ifs-and-buts.

That said, many teams seem to respond better with a change at the helm while under preforming. I normally don't believe in that portion of the game, but for some reason, across sports, many teams just...get better with a switch. We're watching Lee and Ramirez struggle mightily. I don't want Lou here anymore and who knows, maybe we'll end up being one of those teams who "get it together" under Trammel or someone. Lou isn't part of the solution, so get rid of him, is more of my mantra. Might as well try something new.

I suppose. More the issue I have, and its not so much with you, its just that the normal fan loved Lou and loved Dusty when things were going well, but when things start to go sour its blame the manager.

I agree with the try something new thing, but honestly I would have fired him after 2008 when we got swept in the playoffs for two straight years, I would have fired him in 2007 when the team started poorly, I would have not hired him in the first place.

1908_Cubs
06-18-2010, 11:09 AM
I suppose. More the issue I have, and its not so much with you, its just that the normal fan loved Lou and loved Dusty when things were going well, but when things start to go sour its blame the manager.

I agree with the try something new thing, but honestly I would have fired him after 2008 when we got swept in the playoffs for two straight years, I would have fired him in 2007 when the team started poorly, I would have not hired him in the first place.

Neither would have I. But I think it's time to just cut losses. I never liked Lou, granted, I liked him more than some of the other options at the time. But yeah, I think it's time for him to go and for us to try new things. It's the main reason I think he needs to be fired. We have just reasons, and lets try something. Whatever we have right now is not working and it's obvious.

And if we get worse? Fine. Lets get a high pick. Lets sell the farm, I'm okay with that route.

Marlin Bystro
06-18-2010, 12:29 PM
The pinch hitting Z over professional hitters is such a slap in the face and any sane person would no better than to do that. If I'm Fukedome, Fontenot or Tracy I'm livid at that guy. That is how you lose credibility in a clubhouse if there was any shred of that left anymore.

poodski
06-18-2010, 12:40 PM
The pinch hitting Z over professional hitters is such a slap in the face and any sane person would no better than to do that. If I'm Fukedome, Fontenot or Tracy I'm livid at that guy. That is how you lose credibility in a clubhouse if there was any shred of that left anymore.

Why though?

Zambrano vs a LHP has a career 733 OPS

Fontenot is a 639
Fukudome is a 674
Tracy a 612
Hill is a 634

I mean it was the right choice. I would have fully supported Lou hitting Z for Fukudome yesterday in the 9th.

Doogolas
06-18-2010, 01:30 PM
Why though?

Zambrano vs a LHP has a career 733 OPS

Fontenot is a 639
Fukudome is a 674
Tracy a 612
Hill is a 634

I mean it was the right choice. I would have fully supported Lou hitting Z for Fukudome yesterday in the 9th.

This.

Cub_StuckinSTL
06-18-2010, 02:14 PM
Why though?

Zambrano vs a LHP has a career 733 OPS

Fontenot is a 639
Fukudome is a 674
Tracy a 612
Hill is a 634

I mean it was the right choice. I would have fully supported Lou hitting Z for Fukudome yesterday in the 9th.

First off Im gonna call sample size on you.

But I was hoping for Fook to come in in a double switch and put colvin in left and fook in right for a defensive replacement

poodski
06-18-2010, 02:22 PM
First off Im gonna call sample size on you.

But I was hoping for Fook to come in in a double switch and put colvin in left and fook in right for a defensive replacement

Once Zambrano is done playing baseball there won't be a big enough sample size to get a "true" show on his talent as a hitter, especially vs LHP.

As much as I dont think Z is a good hitter I would rather he hit than either of the four headed left handed monster on the bench there.

bulldog312
06-19-2010, 01:34 AM
Why would they have played for him the last three years then?

Why would Aramis and Lee just decide now to say well **** this guy. That doesn't make sense.

1B, 2B, and 3B are the only slots on this team not hitting league average. The ERA for the pitchers is 8th so just a slot above average.

I just don't buy that. Lee and Ramirez come back to who they were, and we get any production out of 2B from any of the three because all three have been awful, we are right back in at worst contention.

I don't like Lou, I think he is a terrible, terrible manager, but this teams flaw is not the manager, its the corner IF spots, and 2B.

I'm not saying it is 100% Lou's fault, but I just don't see the same heart in this team that I did in 07 and 08. It wasn't there a lot last year, but it seems to be there even less this year. If a team isn't going out and putting forth their best effort every single day, I put that on the manager. And again, maybe this isn't the case, but that is just what it looks like from my vantage point.

Mell413
06-19-2010, 09:21 PM
I think it's time to fire Lou. I'm not saying it's all his fault. I won't blame him for Lee and Ramirez sucking. However his lineup construction and bullpen management leave a lot to be desired. Plus I'm getting the vibe that he doesn't want to be here. So I think it would be best to put him out of his misery.

Plus we are probably looking toward 2011 at this point. Most likely Lou won't be back so I don't see the point in keeping him throughout the rest of this season. I'd like to give Trammell a shot for the rest of the season to manage the team. That way we have a decent idea of what kind of manager he will be.

Rosh
06-20-2010, 06:35 AM
Hmm. So when are we getting Pujols and A-Rod?

Mister Marcus
06-20-2010, 11:54 AM
Lou needs to go. I haver seen a manager acomplish less with this much talent.

He was swept out of the playoffs twice. This team coud have won a World Series with better management.

windycityD
06-20-2010, 12:05 PM
Lou needs to go. I haver seen a manager acomplish less with this much talent.

He was swept out of the playoffs twice. This team coud have won a World Series with better management.

2004 anyone? Sorry, but Dusty & that team laid a much bigger egg than this one will by the time it's all said and done. He/ they were expected to win the wild card, if not compete for the division that season. This team came into 2010 with lots of holes and question marks, particularly the pen and the offense.

2008 was our only legitimate playoff bust out under Lou imo. The 2007 team was simply not that good and made hay in the second half in a joke of a division that season. In 2008, the friggin' Brewers got in and the Cards still won 86 games.

Mister Marcus
06-20-2010, 12:09 PM
2004 anyone? Sorry, but Dusty & that team laid a much bigger egg than this one will by the time it's all said and done. He/ they were expected to win the wild card, if not compete for the division that season. This team came into 2010 with lots of holes and question marks, particularly the pen and the offense.

2008 was our only legitimate playoff bust out under Lou imo. The 2007 team was simply not that good and made hay in the second half in a joke of a division that season. In 2008, the friggin' Brewers got in and the Cards still won 86 games.

I don't agree with that at all. The Dodgers squeeked in in 2008 after spending most of the season at or below .500. They then proceeded to sweep the best team in the NL that year. 2007 we didn't even win a playoff game, yet the 2008 Dodgers who got in like we did in 07 swept us? I saw Lou win 116 games in Seattle and choke out of the ALDS.

Thee man is thew most overrated manager in baseball. He won ONE ring with a very good Reds team that had a bullpen which was Lou-proof, they were that good, and they won that inspite of him not because of him.

Yeah Dusty sucked to. Bottom line is we like to hire over rated big names.

chitownwindsof8
06-22-2010, 06:50 PM
Lou needs to go. I haver seen a manager acomplish less with this much talent.

He was swept out of the playoffs twice. This team coud have won a World Series with better management.

um, nobody was complaining when we won the division back to back. our teams sucked in the playoffs pure and simple. lou cant pitch and hit for these guys. I dont care who you have for a manager if you dont pitch, hit and play defence your not going to win. And the cubs did none of that there last 6 playoff games.

Captain Obvious
06-22-2010, 11:10 PM
um, nobody was complaining when we won the division back to back. our teams sucked in the playoffs pure and simple. lou cant pitch and hit for these guys. I dont care who you have for a manager if you dont pitch, hit and play defence your not going to win. And the cubs did none of that there last 6 playoff games.

That's just it though, it's 6 games.