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View Full Version : How is it that in his entire career Tmac has never been higher than a #4 seed?



JordansBulls
06-09-2010, 09:11 PM
How is it that in his entire career Tmac has never been higher than a #4 seed in the playoffs?


When you compare him to his peers, each of these guys at one time or another have had teams that were a #1 seed.

Jason Kidd
Kobe Bryant
Allen Iverson (2001)
Paul Pierce (2008)

To name a few.

poleandreel
06-09-2010, 09:29 PM
never had a good team around him until the later years in houston. by then the spurs had a dynasty and now the lakers are dominating.

GoatMilk
06-09-2010, 09:42 PM
^yup

and then the regular season juggernauts in Dallas and Phoenix

top 3 seeds always locked up

DerekRE_3
06-09-2010, 09:44 PM
Well, his team didn't win enough games to get a #4 seed. That's a good start.

thescore53
06-09-2010, 09:45 PM
cause he left Vince carter in Toronto. so he could play at ''home'' and be the star of his own ''team''

td0tsfinest
06-09-2010, 09:54 PM
cause he left Vince carter in Toronto. so he could play at ''home'' and be the star of his own ''team''

Ye if he put his ego aside, T-Mac and Vince could have created the most potent offensive duo in the league.

n83417
06-09-2010, 09:58 PM
Because TMac was ridiculously overrated.

bahama0811
06-09-2010, 10:00 PM
Because it takes more than one player to get a higher seed.

PrettyBoyJ
06-09-2010, 10:11 PM
Cuz one man can only win you a few games.. A team (which he never really had) can win you several games

_KB24_
06-09-2010, 10:23 PM
Because he is a PREtender, not a contender. I can't believe I once thought he was going to be as good as Kobe in his Orlando days. Shame on me :facepalm:

znick21
06-09-2010, 10:57 PM
he was the man back in the day, a ridiculous scorer. but that doesn't automatically translate to wins.

Bishnoff
06-09-2010, 11:04 PM
I'm pretty sure that injuries to Grant Hill (Orlando) and T-Mac and Yao (Houston) played a big part.

superkegger
06-09-2010, 11:08 PM
How is it that you continue to create Tmac threads when it's clear no one cares about Tmac anymore?

Reyes6
06-09-2010, 11:14 PM
It's simple, PP wasn't a high seed until 2008... VC wasn't a high seed until this past year (I believe), had T-Mac played these past 3 years his team would've been a top 3 seed... but alas, they were #4 seeds with/without him.

But T-Mac is now going to sign for a minimum or low contract, so why are we talking about him? I dunno.

dnl123
06-09-2010, 11:47 PM
Okay here's the thing about Tracy McGrady, and this is coming from a big fan of his, in his best years he was a GREAT scorer, but he's not a very good passer and after he started scoring more he started getting more lazy on defense. He was never a great leader either and it didn't help that his teams were always mediocre and injury prone. I think T-Mac would have benefited from playing with a quality big man. So when he was traded to Houston at first I was excited, but that obviously didn't work out. My dream would have been that he and KG could have paired up in Minnesota because KG was never a big time scorer and the teams he was on always needed another star. Sadly Tracy was never paired up with a great sidekick much like KG until Boston. And yes I'm saying Grant Hill and Yao aren't great players. (They're good, not great)

kblo247
06-09-2010, 11:49 PM
cause he left Vince carter in Toronto. so he could play at ''home'' and be the star of his own ''team''

Yeah and he had a better career and more success ever since (well all a first round virgin could have)

kblo247
06-09-2010, 11:51 PM
Okay here's the thing about Tracy McGrady, and this is coming from a big fan of his, in his best years he was a GREAT scorer, but he's not a very good passer and after he started scoring more he started getting more lazy on defense. He was never a great leader either and it didn't help that his teams were always mediocre and injury prone. I think T-Mac would have benefited from playing with a quality big man. So when he was traded to Houston at first I was excited, but that obviously didn't work out. My dream would have been that he and KG could have paired up in Minnesota because KG was never a big time scorer and the teams he was on always needed another star. Sadly Tracy was never paired up with a great sidekick much like KG until Boston. And yes I'm saying Grant Hill and Yao aren't great players. (They're good, not great)

That loses all credibility as T-Mac isn't great but he is a very good playmaker for others and that was put on full display by Van Gundy

NBA-GMaster
06-10-2010, 12:22 AM
Tmac will get his chance, as a 3rd scorer.. I think he will sign with LeBron's Team (Cleveland, Chicago, Miami or New Jersey) or Dwyane's Team..

IversonIsKrazy
06-10-2010, 12:23 AM
How has Chronz not responded to this forum yet??

IversonIsKrazy
06-10-2010, 12:25 AM
Lol, but T-mac is overrated. But at the same time, Spurs were always amazing, and teams like Mavs and Suns were always almost 60win teams (amazing during season) so it was tough for Houston top be top 3. O yea, and a team called the Lakers.

If only he stayed in T-dot, with Vince as a 1-2 punch...

OT Thriller
06-10-2010, 12:43 AM
TMac was an exciting player to watch and I wish him the best wherever he lands. It will be interesting to see where he goes. He should go to a winning team and try and win a championship. Unfortunately, I see him going to a not so great team and try and be the star. Hopefully that isnt the case, I really want TMac to succeed.

LA_Raiders
06-10-2010, 12:49 AM
he doesnt play D....

JordansBulls
06-10-2010, 08:08 AM
TMac was an exciting player to watch and I wish him the best wherever he lands. It will be interesting to see where he goes. He should go to a winning team and try and win a championship. Unfortunately, I see him going to a not so great team and try and be the star. Hopefully that isnt the case, I really want TMac to succeed.

I don't believe he should go to a team that is a championship team without him, but rather a team that becomes one with him.

HouRealCoach
06-10-2010, 08:47 AM
Orlando was no where near a solid team and YAo was ALWAYS injured

younggunn113
06-10-2010, 08:48 AM
I don't believe he should go to a team that is a championship team without him, but rather a team that becomes one with him.

He can't go to a team like that because they don't exist. TMac is not a player who will make any team a championship contender. He is simply a role player at best, and if he's any higher than the 4th or 5th option on a team they will not be competing for a championship. You can't count on the guy, I honestly can't think of one situation where TMac can go to a team and make the a finals contender...

MaHaRaJaH
06-10-2010, 09:03 AM
Same reason Lebron hasn't won the championship, he just didn't

awmathewsjr
06-10-2010, 09:18 AM
Well, his team didn't win enough games to get a #4 seed. That's a good start.

what in the hell are you talking about. he was a 4th seed a few times, the thread asked why has he never been higher.

awmathewsjr
06-10-2010, 09:20 AM
The reason is his health, T-Mac has bad ankles, knees and a bad back.
The real question should be why has he never won a playoff series

ballpd05
06-10-2010, 09:34 AM
He was an amazing talent and one of the most unstoppable forces in the league in Orlando days.

He never did because Orlando didn't have the talent, and there were just better teams out west than Houston, especially with Yao always hurt (like San Antonio, the Lakers thru the Shaq and Gasol eras, Dallas, and Phoenix).

IAmKira
06-10-2010, 09:48 AM
How is it that you continue to create Tmac threads when it's clear no one cares about Tmac anymore?

Cuz he wants to get the forum thinking with his way too obvious questions. :facepalm:

JNA17
06-10-2010, 10:10 AM
because the teams he was on were not good enough. But more importantly, who cares?

sep11ie
06-10-2010, 10:21 AM
How is it that you continue to create Tmac threads when it's clear no one cares about Tmac anymore?

This!

marlinsfan24
06-10-2010, 10:31 AM
He never had great teams around him and the other teams in the west were at another level.

And why the hell respond to a thread if you have no interest? If you don't care, STAY THE **** OUT! It's obvious that some people do care, as they are responding to the thread.

Hawkeye15
06-10-2010, 10:55 AM
never had the personel in Orlando, and in Houston, his team was rarely healthy enough to compete against the stacked west from 2000-2009. The top 4 seeds almost always had mid 50's in victories.

Da Knicks
06-10-2010, 12:10 PM
I kinda feel bad for t-mac wait a minute wasnt this guy the highest paid player last season? I don't feel too bad for him but t-mac had potential to be the best player in the league. As it is I think t-mac needed a better team maybe now he can latch on with a good team.

CowboysKB24
06-10-2010, 12:19 PM
TMAC was just not that good IMO. He could never get it done. He either didn't play well or didn't have enough around him. Whatever the case maybe, he just didn't get it done.

JasonJohnHorn
06-10-2010, 12:48 PM
Um... because he jumped ship in TO before they got good because he lacked patience, then he pushed a trade in Orlando because he lacked patience and didnt want to 'wait around for a highschool kid (aka Dwigth Howard) to get good' because its not like he came out of highschool and expected a team to wait for him to get good, and then leave the team that had put that investment in him. and then when he got to Houston they actually took a step back when he got to the team and he's forever failed to be the facilitator that LBJ, Duncan, Nash and even Shaq has.

So as talented as he was, and as talented as his teams have been, he has lacked the proper team mindset, patience, maturity, and foresight, and has also battled through injuries the last couple seasons.

Chronz
06-10-2010, 01:07 PM
Um... because he jumped ship in TO before they got good because he lacked patience, then he pushed a trade in Orlando because he lacked patience and didnt want to 'wait around for a highschool kid (aka Dwigth Howard) to get good' because its not like he came out of highschool and expected a team to wait for him to get good, and then leave the team that had put that investment in him. and then when he got to Houston they actually took a step back when he got to the team and he's forever failed to be the facilitator that LBJ, Duncan, Nash and even Shaq has.

So as talented as he was, and as talented as his teams have been, he has lacked the proper team mindset, patience, maturity, and foresight, and has also battled through injuries the last couple seasons.
He left Toronto to go HOME to play ALONGSIDE another superstar. Of course he didnt have patience for a HS unknown, he had just spent 4 incredible years of his prime for a team that was floundering and a management that had proven its inability to assess players, why the hell would you stay when A) You know your career span is shorter than most players, B) management is inexperienced and is insulting you, C) the team had just wasted your best years? When he got to Houston they improved dramatically which is very telling of his ability considering how much they gave up to get him.

You got your facts twisted no surprise considering its Tmac. LOL lacked the facilitating mindset? He was known as one of the most unselfish superstars in the game, and definitely one of its best facilitators, so much so that other stars coaches told their players to study his passing game.

Seriously admit it, youve never seen Tmac play huh

Chronz
06-10-2010, 01:13 PM
cause he left Vince carter in Toronto. so he could play at ''home'' and be the star of his own ''team''

LOL do you not remember the night Toronto played Detroit and Tmac+Grant were talking about playing together? Doesnt sound like a kid looking to be on his own to me, then again I use facts to fortify my rationale, but its always fun to speculate recklessly so I wont stop you.

Raidaz4Life
06-10-2010, 01:15 PM
Because TMac was ridiculously overrated.

This

xbrackattackx
06-10-2010, 01:16 PM
Um... because he jumped ship in TO before they got good because he lacked patience, then he pushed a trade in Orlando because he lacked patience and didnt want to 'wait around for a highschool kid (aka Dwigth Howard) to get good' because its not like he came out of highschool and expected a team to wait for him to get good, and then leave the team that had put that investment in him. and then when he got to Houston they actually took a step back when he got to the team and he's forever failed to be the facilitator that LBJ, Duncan, Nash and even Shaq has.

So as talented as he was, and as talented as his teams have been, he has lacked the proper team mindset, patience, maturity, and foresight, and has also battled through injuries the last couple seasons.

Wow, So many wrong assumptions in this piece here.

Chronz
06-10-2010, 01:17 PM
TMAC was just not that good IMO. He could never get it done. He either didn't play well or didn't have enough around him. Whatever the case maybe, he just didn't get it done.

Its simple, by the time he had the talent around him he lacked the talent inside of him.

sep11ie
06-10-2010, 01:22 PM
Chronz, thats prob the best thing you've ever said my friend.

xbrackattackx
06-10-2010, 01:26 PM
Its simple, by the time he had the talent around him he lacked the talent inside of him.

x 2

And you have Dexter as your avatar so you obviously know what's up.

JordansBulls
06-10-2010, 02:54 PM
He left Toronto to go HOME to play ALONGSIDE another superstar. Of course he didnt have patience for a HS unknown, he had just spent 4 incredible years of his prime for a team that was floundering and a management that had proven its inability to assess players, why the hell would you stay when A) You know your career span is shorter than most players, B) management is inexperienced and is insulting you, C) the team had just wasted your best years? When he got to Houston they improved dramatically which is very telling of his ability considering how much they gave up to get him.

You got your facts twisted no surprise considering its Tmac. LOL lacked the facilitating mindset? He was known as one of the most unselfish superstars in the game, and definitely one of its best facilitators, so much so that other stars coaches told their players to study his passing game.

Seriously admit it, youve never seen Tmac play huh

:clap::clap:

sventhedog
06-10-2010, 03:05 PM
he can't even play 4 games straight without getting an injury. i'm surprised he is still alive.

leftymo
06-10-2010, 03:20 PM
at one point, guys like tmac and vince carter were compared to kobe bryant...

man it looks just comical these days...

Bruno
06-10-2010, 04:02 PM
His plateau as a dominant player was very short. When he was dominant, his team was horrible. By the time he got with Yao, he really wasn't the same guy who had a PER of 30 over the corse of a season. Injuries are huge as well.

Bruno
06-10-2010, 04:10 PM
at one point, guys like tmac and vince carter were compared to kobe bryant...

man it looks just comical these days...

T-Macs best year is arguably better than Bryants best year. What separates Kobe is his longevity, he's been dominating the league for a decade.

(95-98 Draftees) Duncan, KG, Pierce, Carter, AI, J. Oneal, Ray Allen have all lost some explosiveness, and no long dominate how they did three or four years ago. Kobe's the only guy whos still on top.

He was in discussion for best player during the peak of the 90's draftees (along with Duncan, KG, Dirk, AI, ect), and he's still in the discussion for best player amongst the new era (LeBron, DWade, Dwight, CP3, Melo, KD, ect).

ToldYa
06-10-2010, 04:10 PM
He left Toronto to go HOME to play ALONGSIDE another superstar. Of course he didnt have patience for a HS unknown, he had just spent 4 incredible years of his prime for a team that was floundering and a management that had proven its inability to assess players, why the hell would you stay when A) You know your career span is shorter than most players, B) management is inexperienced and is insulting you, C) the team had just wasted your best years? When he got to Houston they improved dramatically which is very telling of his ability considering how much they gave up to get him.

You got your facts twisted no surprise considering its Tmac. LOL lacked the facilitating mindset? He was known as one of the most unselfish superstars in the game, and definitely one of its best facilitators, so much so that other stars coaches told their players to study his passing game.

Seriously admit it, youve never seen Tmac play huh
so why is it that he never made it out the first round?

shep33
06-10-2010, 04:25 PM
I like Tmac, it sucks that he gets those injuries, very unfortunate. He had some very good teams in houston, but his health just wasn't there plain and simple.

If I were him I'd try and go to the Suns, (and I'm not a Suns fan), but their training staff could maybe get him going again like G. Hill.

I really hope he comes back cause i still think he can score 15-20 when healthy.

Mplsman
06-10-2010, 04:27 PM
Used to Love seein Tmac play, but its gotta be the lazy eye...

Chronz
06-10-2010, 04:29 PM
so why is it that he never made it out the first round?
What year would you like to know more about?

thescore53
06-10-2010, 04:39 PM
recently vince and tmac vented about what they could have been in toronto

Mplsman
06-10-2010, 04:41 PM
Tmac used to be a tight scorer... between him and yao getting injured really screwed over the rockets franchise.

USMCLaker
06-10-2010, 04:46 PM
Two words: Team sport

avrpatsfan
06-10-2010, 04:57 PM
Because it takes more than one player to get a higher seed.
This.

JordansBulls
06-10-2010, 05:36 PM
What year would you like to know more about?

Just break it down for him any years.

NYtilIdie
06-10-2010, 05:36 PM
T-Mac was argueably the best player in the league in his Orlando days and way better then Kobe was at the time.


After T-Mac went to Houston then Kobe surpassed him since Kobe hit his prime around that time, but Kobe wasn't near T-Mac in his prime.

You guys gotta understand he wasn't in a any better situation then Vince was in the end of his Toronto days. He could never get a good team around him and his best player who was suppose to be his Pippen was hurt majority of the time in Orlando.

This guy has one of the highest playoff PPG in league history at 29 PPG and people have the nerve to call him a choke and pretender. Did you guys not see when he single handly carried the Rockets to 20+ wins in a row without Yao and an old Mutumbo as the Center in 07-08 season?

Then when they played the Jazz, Yao was hurt and Rafer who was having a great year didn't come back from an ankle injury until the last game where they lost the series.

Point blank is T-Mac never had a great team around him and even when he teamed with Yao, they rarely ever played together since both are injury plagued. He was playing Lebron James his whole career, but the difference is he never got a championship caliber team around him.

JordansBulls
06-10-2010, 10:14 PM
T-Mac was argueably the best player in the league in his Orlando days and way better then Kobe was at the time.




He was never the best player in the league.

ToldYa
06-10-2010, 10:27 PM
What year would you like to know more about?

i mean..his whole damn career he couldnt make it out the first round, pathetic

JordansBulls
06-11-2010, 08:37 AM
Well he only had HCA twice.

Chronz
06-11-2010, 12:07 PM
i mean..his whole damn career he couldnt make it out the first round, pathetic
Pathetic? You must not know much about the game if you find one man unable to beat a team pathetic.

Chronz
06-11-2010, 12:08 PM
Well he only had HCA twice.
Who cares, he never had the better TEAM is what matters.

ToldYa
06-11-2010, 12:21 PM
Pathetic? You must not know much about the game if you find one man unable to beat a team pathetic.

iverson carried bums to the finals and has been out the first round plenty ..and tmac had a good lead on the pistons that one year and thought he'd get out the first round lmao

RipVW
06-11-2010, 12:27 PM
Im surprised this thread hasnt been closed. But then, again, not really.

JordansBulls
06-11-2010, 01:23 PM
Who cares, he never had the better TEAM is what matters.

2007 and 2008. Rockets were up 2-0 with HCA in 2007.

In 2008 they won like 22 in a row and 13 in a row without Yao.

Chronz
06-11-2010, 02:30 PM
iverson carried bums to the finals and has been out the first round plenty ..and tmac had a good lead on the pistons that one year and thought he'd get out the first round lmao
AI missed the playoffs, how can he go from carrying bums to the finals (with a sub 40% shooting fyi) to missing the playoffs entirely? Unless *gasp* theres more to the game than the performance of a teams best player. The truth is, AI didnt carry bums, he had the best support of any star player.

A 3-1 lead is already more than what should have been expected from a series with those squads involved.

Chronz
06-11-2010, 02:31 PM
2007 and 2008. Rockets were up 2-0 with HCA in 2007.

In 2008 they won like 22 in a row and 13 in a row without Yao.
Ummm ok? :clap:

ToldYa
06-11-2010, 03:04 PM
AI missed the playoffs, how can he go from carrying bums to the finals (with a sub 40% shooting fyi) to missing the playoffs entirely? Unless *gasp* theres more to the game than the performance of a teams best player. The truth is, AI didnt carry bums, he had the best support of any star player.

A 3-1 lead is already more than what should have been expected from a series with those squads involved.

ai made it to the finals (while having to take almost every shot because he didnt have offensive help) tmac hasnt even won a playoff series in his life ..ever

twoearl
06-11-2010, 03:26 PM
Because he is a PREtender, not a contender. I can't believe I once thought he was going to be as good as Kobe in his Orlando days. Shame on me :facepalm:

I agree EXACTLY. The amount of TMAC threads on PSD baffles me. Never has one man done so little but gotten so much love. It's at a point where I had to think about it for a brief second who tracey mcgrady actually was.

NBAfan4life
06-11-2010, 03:37 PM
T-Mac was argueably the best player in the league in his Orlando days and way better then Kobe was at the time.


After T-Mac went to Houston then Kobe surpassed him since Kobe hit his prime around that time, but Kobe wasn't near T-Mac in his prime.

You guys gotta understand he wasn't in a any better situation then Vince was in the end of his Toronto days. He could never get a good team around him and his best player who was suppose to be his Pippen was hurt majority of the time in Orlando.

This guy has one of the highest playoff PPG in league history at 29 PPG and people have the nerve to call him a choke and pretender. Did you guys not see when he single handly carried the Rockets to 20+ wins in a row without Yao and an old Mutumbo as the Center in 07-08 season?

Then when they played the Jazz, Yao was hurt and Rafer who was having a great year didn't come back from an ankle injury until the last game where they lost the series.

Point blank is T-Mac never had a great team around him and even when he teamed with Yao, they rarely ever played together since both are injury plagued. He was playing Lebron James his whole career, but the difference is he never got a championship caliber team around him.

While I respect your opinion about maybe having a better season than Bryant once twice max, at no point in Tracy's life has he been way better than Bryant.

SACNYY
06-11-2010, 04:12 PM
I really wish when he was a Rocket they would have beaten the Mavs. I can't remember what season that was, but i'm sure u all know what i'm talking about. It was when t-mac dunked on bradley

JordansBulls
06-11-2010, 05:02 PM
Ummm ok? :clap:

Glad to see we see face to face on this one now.:)

ccugrad1
06-11-2010, 05:04 PM
Because TMac was ridiculously overrated.

And Vince Carter is right behind him. Never seen so much gaga over two guys that have done squat!

Chronz
06-11-2010, 06:26 PM
ai made it to the finals (while having to take almost every shot because he didnt have offensive help) tmac hasnt even won a playoff series in his life ..ever
1 you didnt answer the question
2 your excuse doesnt change anything I said

JordansBulls
06-11-2010, 08:27 PM
i really wish when he was a rocket they would have beaten the mavs. I can't remember what season that was, but i'm sure u all know what i'm talking about. It was when t-mac dunked on bradley

2005

ToldYa
06-12-2010, 04:39 PM
1 you didnt answer the question
2 your excuse doesnt change anything I said

your excuse for why tmac never made it past the first round is ridiculous ..and you even think the east was weak back then so why couldnt he make it past with bums while the other peer stars made it farther with less ..tmac was up 3-2 against the jazz WITH homecourt advantage in 2007 and choked it away..dude is not a winner