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View Full Version : ESPN Host says, "Wade doesn't make others better."



JordansBulls
06-07-2010, 06:36 PM
Link - Colin Cowherd on Wade (http://miamiherald.typepad.com/sedano-says/2010/06/espn-host-says-wade-doesnt-make-others-better.html)




we seem to suffer from short term memory. Four years ago Dwyane Wade led his team to a championship. He had a 34 year old Shaq as his second best player.



He compares Wade to Amare.
:speechless:

GoatMilk
06-07-2010, 06:41 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball

JNA17
06-07-2010, 06:47 PM
this pretty much describes what wade went through this year.

http://slamdumb.com/c41.php

Bruno
06-07-2010, 06:49 PM
bla bla bla, they said the same BS about Kobe. When Wade gets a team he'll prove this nonsense wrong.

magichatnumber9
06-07-2010, 06:50 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball This is your hobby, that is his career.

n83417
06-07-2010, 06:50 PM
He hasn't made Beasley any better.

JNA17
06-07-2010, 06:50 PM
bla bla bla, they said the same BS about Kobe. When Wade gets a team he'll prove this nonsense wrong.

i dare espn to say this crap about lebron. That would really strike a riot.

skinsfan4life80
06-07-2010, 06:54 PM
I agree with him. He didnt say he isnt a great player or that he didnt lead his team to a title with very litte help..he just said he doesnt make his teammates better. I watched about half the games the heat had this year and Wade has the ball in his hands almost 80 percent of the time and has no problem taking 5 shots in a row. Beasly who is a very talented offensive player is a none factor when on the floor with Wade. When Mike is on the floor without DWade he is a much better player. He is a great player but every great player doesnt make others better. Maryberry, Francis, D.Wilkens and many other have been good..just dont help there teammates game grow at all

fairandbalanced
06-07-2010, 06:59 PM
He hasn't made Beasley any better.

Only God has the ability to make Beasley better.........he's never been double teamed his whole career yet he can't manage to score a point on Glenn Davis....btw, Big baby dropped more than 20 on him.

IrespectNumber3
06-07-2010, 07:01 PM
Yea and Kobe made Shaq better...

Shaq quit on the Heat, he had marital problems and Wade got injured.

Your crazy if you don't think Lebron and Wade won't both make each other better.

fairandbalanced
06-07-2010, 07:01 PM
I agree with him. He didnt say he isnt a great player or that he didnt lead his team to a title with very litte help..he just said he doesnt make his teammates better. I watched about half the games the heat had this year and Wade has the ball in his hands almost 80 percent of the time and has no problem taking 5 shots in a row. Beasly who is a very talented offensive player is a none factor when on the floor with Wade. When Mike is on the floor without DWade he is a much better player. He is a great player but every great player doesnt make others better. Maryberry, Francis, D.Wilkens and many other have been good..just dont help there teammates game grow at all

From someone that watched all 82 of Miami's game, i've never seen Wade take 5 shots in a row w/o passing.

DerekRE_3
06-07-2010, 07:03 PM
That's even more impressive then. Despite not making his really bad teammates this year better, he still lead his team to a 5 seed.

IrespectNumber3
06-07-2010, 07:03 PM
O yea...Im sure you've seen the Olympic games...and Im sure you've watched this pass Allstar game...That is by far a Joke

TheKing23
06-07-2010, 07:24 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball

Best. Sig. Ever.

kntresistheheat
06-07-2010, 08:30 PM
This guy is obviously on that *****!!

fishfan79
06-07-2010, 08:33 PM
espn host = proof someone can talk out of his backside

dwade's ring disagrees with this guy

td0tsfinest
06-07-2010, 08:44 PM
this pretty much describes what wade went through this year.

http://slamdumb.com/c41.php

Its off topic but this has always been my favourite:
http://slamdumb.com/c43.php

n83417
06-07-2010, 08:49 PM
espn host = proof someone can talk out of his backside

dwade's ring disagrees with this guy

You mean the ring that Shaq won with Wade with a slew of excellent role players? Gary Payron, Toine, Posey... That ring?

kntresistheheat
06-07-2010, 08:56 PM
You mean the ring that Shaq won with Wade with a slew of excellent role players? Gary Payron, Toine, Posey... That ring?


You cant be serious:facepalm:

boriquaabe
06-07-2010, 08:57 PM
Espn personalities have gotten so bad in the last 5 years. This guy takes the cake. I absolutely despise this guy. He absolutely only appeals to mid-western college football loving ____ guys. Listening to the clowns who call his radio show is like spending the day at the rodeo. The only sport that guy has any real knowledge of is College football. That's it period. Nothing against college football but until they get a playoff system in place it's not going to be taken seriously by the larger eastern markets like Chicago, NYC, Boston or philadelphia. Same with that geek Van pelt and Ricilo(sp?) not a show goes by where those two don't talk about college football. Unfortunately some of us were not fortunate enough or did not have the desire to go to college.

james21
06-07-2010, 09:02 PM
i dare espn to say this crap about lebron. That would really strike a riot.

Yeah i didn't want to be the first one that said, mo williams, and jaminson played better without james, here goes everybody calling me crazy now! lol!

fadedmario
06-07-2010, 09:05 PM
Colin is right. Wade is a one-person show

Derick713
06-07-2010, 09:10 PM
Dwayne Wade sure made Team USA look good. He carried the Heat. He is a player that brings all the intangibles to the table. He is unselfish.

Kobe Bryant doesn't make other better. Talent allows Bryant to get away with taking bad shots. Bryant won with O'Neal because Bryant didn't have to be the leader. Bryant is now the leader and it seems like Gasol and Bynum aren't the forces they should be. Wade would give up his points to makesure elite talent got shots.

tr4shb0t
06-07-2010, 09:12 PM
ban

Raoul Duke
06-07-2010, 09:30 PM
His team has been complete garbage for two straight years, and they've been a five seed in the playoffs both years. They had one of the best defenses in the league the last two years.

Who else on that team is making that happen? It's like watching Wade play 1 on 5. He's one of the best players I've ever seen in my entire life and I've seen some really, really great players. It's a shame that his play these last couple seasons has been wasted on so many people.

The Jokemaker
06-07-2010, 09:35 PM
I have to agree. He has some talented players on his team who have looked promising at one point in Beasley and Chalmers. Beasley had enormous talent in college and you'd think playing with a superstar in Wade would help him. No one else on the team has improved either since he's been there. The team is exactly the same this year as it was last year. And if they weren't in the east, they sure wouldnt be in the playoffs. He certainly doesnt have the effect Jason Kidd had with the Nets back in 02,03 or Nash has now.

n83417
06-07-2010, 09:40 PM
You cant be serious:facepalm:

I am entirely serious. Wade was phenomenal in the Finals.

Name one player Wade has "made better"

One player who has benefited from playing along side Dwyane Wade...

SugeKnight
06-07-2010, 09:53 PM
thats ignorant

KeepMonta#8
06-07-2010, 09:56 PM
I am entirely serious. Wade was phenomenal in the Finals.

Name one player Wade has "made better"

One player who has benefited from playing along side Dwyane Wade...

Udonis Haslem

valade16
06-07-2010, 09:59 PM
bla bla bla, they said the same BS about Kobe. When Wade gets a team he'll prove this nonsense wrong.

If Wade gets a good team then it wouldn't be Wade making his teammates better, it'd be his teammates BEING better. :facepalm:

That being said, Wade absolutely makes his team better. That heat team is filled with filler crap, and Wade takes them to the playoffs every year. Not to mention the dude absolutely dominated when the Heat won the title.

Derick713
06-07-2010, 10:06 PM
At one point Dwayne Wade had a starting line-up on the below mentioned. Pat didn't eve surround D-Wade with an y decent shooters till he traded for Q-Rich.

Dwayne Wade once played with this STARTING LINE-UP FOR A FEW GAMES
Chris Quinn-Undrafted
Dwayne Wade
Yakhouba Diawara-Undrafted
Udonis Haslem-Undrafted
Joel Anthony-Undrafted

Derick713
06-07-2010, 10:07 PM
Michael Beasley is a bust. He isn't a Pat Riley type player. He doesn't have the size or body to be an elite PF.

IndiansFan337
06-07-2010, 10:10 PM
Your crazy if you don't think Lebron and Wade won't both make each other better.

They aren't going to be on the same squad next year.

Hoopsadvocate
06-07-2010, 10:12 PM
I am entirely serious. Wade was phenomenal in the Finals.

Name one player Wade has "made better"

One player who has benefited from playing along side Dwyane Wade...

1. Udonis Haslem (self explanatory)

2. Jason Kapono (sucked on the next two teams he played for after the HEAT coincidence?)

3 James posey ( blew once he got to NO where he had CP3)

Bruno
06-07-2010, 10:41 PM
If Wade gets a good team then it wouldn't be Wade making his teammates better, it'd be his teammates BEING better. :facepalm:.

So youre saying that if Wade was surrounded by good players opposed to mediocre ones, he wouldn't be able to make those good players even better greater players, because they were already good? People never mentioned Pau Gasol in the top 3 PF discussion before he was traded to the Lakers. Today most posters say Pau is the best offensive big in the game. There are endless examples of superstars making already good players, great players.

HuRRiCaNeS324
06-07-2010, 10:53 PM
So youre saying that if Wade was surrounded by good players opposed to mediocre ones, he wouldn't be able to make those good players even better greater players, because they were already good? People never mentioned Pau Gasol in the top 3 PF discussion before he was traded to the Lakers. Today most posters say Pau is the best offensive big in the game. There are endless examples of superstars making already good players, great players.

Not really thats just Pau Gasol moving from Memphis to Hollywood were the media blows everyone

HiphopRelated
06-07-2010, 10:55 PM
I have to agree. He has some talented players on his team who have looked promising at one point in Beasley and Chalmers. Beasley had enormous talent in college and you'd think playing with a superstar in Wade would help him. No one else on the team has improved either since he's been there. The team is exactly the same this year as it was last year. And if they weren't in the east, they sure wouldnt be in the playoffs. He certainly doesnt have the effect Jason Kidd had with the Nets back in 02,03 or Nash has now.
yet they won 4 more games than last year

It's Wade's fault Chalmers isn't a pg?

JO, best fg% of his career

Haslem, only offense is from Wade getting him wide open

QRich, best 3 pt% of career. Made Kapono look good enough to earn 5 mil per from the Raptors that ended up looking garbage.

Beasley got a lot of sh1t on his plate unrelated to Wade

gimme a break. Just like when I didn't blame Kobe for not carrying Smush and Kwame anywhere, the Heat hit it's ceiling, and that was losing in the 1st round to the eventual EC champs.

This Heat team would be in the ECFs in the early 2000s, you don't seem to remember that the Finals was the beat down invitational for the East.

Bruno
06-07-2010, 11:11 PM
Not really thats just Pau Gasol moving from Memphis to Hollywood were the media blows everyone

Before Pau came to LA the consensus was that he was behind Duncan, KG, Bosh, Dirk, Amare, Boozer. Where does he rank amongst them today?

Truheatfan
06-07-2010, 11:54 PM
I agree with him. He didnt say he isnt a great player or that he didnt lead his team to a title with very litte help..he just said he doesnt make his teammates better. I watched about half the games the heat had this year and Wade has the ball in his hands almost 80 percent of the time and has no problem taking 5 shots in a row. Beasly who is a very talented offensive player is a none factor when on the floor with Wade. When Mike is on the floor without DWade he is a much better player. He is a great player but every great player doesnt make others better. Maryberry, Francis, D.Wilkens and many other have been good..just dont help there teammates game grow at all

yes because wade is the only player capable of making plays off the dribble have you ever watched when wade is out the game there is little to no ball movement the whole offense is run thru him... and did you seriously compare him 2 marberry and francis :facepalm:

CowboysKB24
06-07-2010, 11:59 PM
This really is meaningless.

mshan5
06-08-2010, 12:08 AM
Not even God could make Michael Beasley any better.

Giaps
06-08-2010, 12:23 AM
Cowherd knows absolutely squat about basketball. It's annoying as hell because he speaks as if he thinks he does.

robdizzle3
06-08-2010, 12:40 AM
I agree with him. He didnt say he isnt a great player or that he didnt lead his team to a title with very litte help..he just said he doesnt make his teammates better. I watched about half the games the heat had this year and Wade has the ball in his hands almost 80 percent of the time and has no problem taking 5 shots in a row. Beasly who is a very talented offensive player is a none factor when on the floor with Wade. When Mike is on the floor without DWade he is a much better player. He is a great player but every great player doesnt make others better. Maryberry, Francis, D.Wilkens and many other have been good..just dont help there teammates game grow at all

Well, though im a Lakers fan, I stay in Florida, so I see a bunch of Magic and Heat games and Cowherd is wrong here. Wade gets them involved early an often, but its up to the players to do their job after Wade sets them up. He didnt have the cast. Sure, Mike was better one the floor without Wade, because he needs the ball to be dominant. He just sits there while Wade does his thing, other than go to the ball or move without it.

kntresistheheat
06-08-2010, 01:00 AM
yes because wade is the only player capable of making plays off the dribble have you ever watched when wade is out the game there is little to no ball movement the whole offense is run thru him... and did you seriously compare him 2 marberry and francis :facepalm:


No, He said Maryberry:facepalm:

TopsyTurvy
06-08-2010, 01:04 AM
Cowherd will do or say anything for attention.

jackdawson
06-08-2010, 01:16 AM
Hahahaha! What a joke! I can gurantee he leads a miserable life as a person. Now people will talk about it and his name will be mentioned just like here. What a whore!

PrettyBoyJ
06-08-2010, 01:27 AM
Yeah i didn't want to be the first one that said, mo williams, and jaminson played better without james, here goes everybody calling me crazy now! lol!

Maybe jamison cuz he's new to the system.. But Mo Williams?? LeBron Made him.. Like Mo should call Lebron daddy.. Mo Williams was trash before he teamed up with Lebron.. How you think he made the allstar team.. Cuz Lebron lobbied for him..

MaHaRaJaH
06-08-2010, 03:04 AM
espn host = proof someone can talk out of his backside

dwade's ring disagrees with this guy
Exactly so they can get off his nutz

JordansBulls
06-08-2010, 08:26 AM
espn host = proof someone can talk out of his backside

dwade's ring disagrees with this guy

:nod:

Russollini
06-08-2010, 08:54 AM
The issue with Wade and the Heat is that Wade does not trust the other guys and he has gotten use to doing it by himself. It is not that he does not make them better, as he very well can, but that he chooses not to due to trust issues. The reason UD is still there, and gets minutes and points is that DWade trusts him. In stint where he went down the other guys got better for a few nights and died off, why inconsistent play. Wade can only get the ball to them or get them open looks, he can not knock it down for them. Is he a teacher, no, can he inspire yes. He has however lost that fire we saw from him last year. Maybe it will be back this year when he gets some running mates. He needs to stop shooting 3s for the hell of it.

marlinsfan24
06-08-2010, 09:05 AM
I am entirely serious. Wade was phenomenal in the Finals.

Name one player Wade has "made better"

One player who has benefited from playing along side Dwyane Wade...

Udonis Haslem
Dorrell Wright
Shaq
Jason Williams
Antoine Walker
Carlos Arroyo
Jermaine O'Neal
Stan Van Gundy

Corey
06-08-2010, 09:06 AM
Maybe jamison cuz he's new to the system.. But Mo Williams?? LeBron Made him.. Like Mo should call Lebron daddy.. Mo Williams was trash before he teamed up with Lebron.. How you think he made the allstar team.. Cuz Lebron lobbied for him..

What?

Mo Williams was a pretty solid player on Milwaukee.

RaiderLakersA's
06-08-2010, 12:00 PM
Kobe Bryant doesn't make other better. Talent allows Bryant to get away with taking bad shots. Bryant won with O'Neal because Bryant didn't have to be the leader. Bryant is now the leader and it seems like Gasol and Bynum aren't the forces they should be. Wade would give up his points to makesure elite talent got shots.

Bull. Besides, this thread is about Wade. Keep Kobe's name out of it.

awmathewsjr
06-08-2010, 12:14 PM
I agree with him. He didnt say he isnt a great player or that he didnt lead his team to a title with very litte help..he just said he doesnt make his teammates better. I watched about half the games the heat had this year and Wade has the ball in his hands almost 80 percent of the time and has no problem taking 5 shots in a row. Beasly who is a very talented offensive player is a none factor when on the floor with Wade. When Mike is on the floor without DWade he is a much better player. He is a great player but every great player doesnt make others better. Maryberry, Francis, D.Wilkens and many other have been good..just dont help there teammates game grow at all

The best reply to this thread. I couldn't agree more

Southsideheat
06-08-2010, 12:17 PM
Not making others better isn't the worst thing in the world. You guys make it seem like he said he was bad or something. It's just one trait of many for a basketball player.

Heater4life
06-08-2010, 12:55 PM
Hes made ton of players better! What are you guys talking about.

Jason Kapono- was an IR player on the Bobcats prior to joining the Heat. And im sorry, he became a DISGUSTINGLY good off ball/spot up three point shooter for the Heat, led the league in three point percentage (108 3's at 50% shooting). Enough so that we couldnt retain him because he took the full mid-level. (i miss that bastard heat need him back)

Damon Jones- Im surprised no one here has mentioned this guy. Again was a back up on a Milwaukee team, virtually unknown becomes a premier 3-point guy [playing for the Heat, led the league in three pointers made. Hit highest # of three's in his career, 225 at 43%! After he left heat, disappeared.

Rasual Butler- Shot highest three-point percentage of career at 46% from downtown. Playing next to D. Wade.

Q Rich- this year highest career percentage again.

He makes players better hands down. theres a difference between making good players better and trying to make a goumet meal out of garbage.

Da Knicks
06-08-2010, 01:20 PM
This is everyone fault that this happened so late, did Wade pay this guy so he could say this and now we can talk about him? I like d.wade eventhough he plays for the heat I have being kind of shocked that no one is talking enough about him. He needs to create some hate kinda like lebron is doing to get himself some recognition. Wade should of teased with more teams like lebron and he could of created more buzz for himself. To me there are like 5 players who are pretty even and wade is one of them. He is a star but for some reason he doesnt always get the credit he deserves I thought his finals play was great but he doesnt play for L.A. or Boston so it kinda went unnoticed. To me him and Lebron leading the cavs and heat to the finals was so much better than any other player lately just because they lacked so many players and still got there. Granted Wade did have a better team but nothing like the lakers or boston teams that are stacked at every position. If i had to rank b-ball skills and b-ball iq my top three are
1. Gasol-i just always think a skilled big man can get you the easy points and if he can pass is a nightmare to the defense.

2. James-Clearly the best point guard I have ever seen, if put on a running team this guy is unstoppable and is clearly the best player. for right now he is number 2

3. Wade-Injuries are what have stopped Wade along with having a weak supporting cast but he is imo the best sg.

BkOriginalOne
06-08-2010, 01:58 PM
Wade did everything to try to make Beasley better.
What other young "prodigies" did Wade have to work with - Chalmers? Dorell Wright?

Raidaz4Life
06-08-2010, 01:59 PM
I actually agree with that

cmellofan15
06-08-2010, 02:03 PM
Maybe jamison cuz he's new to the system.. But Mo Williams?? LeBron Made him.. Like Mo should call Lebron daddy.. Mo Williams was trash before he teamed up with Lebron.. How you think he made the allstar team.. Cuz Lebron lobbied for him..

Mo averaged more points and assists in Milwaukee and also shot a better FG%. If you think LeBron made him improve his FT% and 3pt% (the things Mo improved on) you're dead wrong. LeBron just made him well known around the league.

tbone2171
06-08-2010, 02:08 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball

Love the sig!

PHX2daDEATH
06-08-2010, 02:35 PM
ummm he's right.. Wade basically beat Dallas all by himself that year.

ballpd05
06-08-2010, 02:38 PM
Before Pau came to LA the consensus was that he was behind Duncan, KG, Bosh, Dirk, Amare, Boozer. Where does he rank amongst them today?

It was just because he played on a terrible memphis team that got no tv time.

He was always better than Boozer and Bosh to me. Duncan and KG have both fallen off with age, but Pau proved to me he was better in a head to head than Amare and thats the tiebreaker. Not that Kobe doesn't help because it seems like Kobe has come a long way from his gunner ballhog days to actually be a complete player, that is why him and Lebron to me are head and shoulders above the rest of the league (maybe except Chris Paul n D Will if you go inch by inch).

And Wade does not make people a whole lot better. He dribbles way too much for a wing player for my liking and has way too many possessions where he is the only one who touches the rock, that and he will get in the media and basically call his team trash.

That team he won a title with was littered with talent. He had an aging Shaq who was still the best C in the league probably outside of Yao at the time, Alonzo Mourning who was probably also a top 5 center in the league as his backup, James Posey who did basically the same things he did in Memphis and Boston, and Jason Williams and an aging Gary Payton.

JordansBulls
06-08-2010, 03:41 PM
ummm he's right.. Wade basically beat Dallas all by himself that year.

Pretty much.

HiphopRelated
06-08-2010, 04:37 PM
It was just because he played on a terrible memphis team that got no tv time.

He was always better than Boozer and Bosh to me. Duncan and KG have both fallen off with age, but Pau proved to me he was better in a head to head than Amare and thats the tiebreaker. Not that Kobe doesn't help because it seems like Kobe has come a long way from his gunner ballhog days to actually be a complete player, that is why him and Lebron to me are head and shoulders above the rest of the league (maybe except Chris Paul n D Will if you go inch by inch).

And Wade does not make people a whole lot better. He dribbles way too much for a wing player for my liking and has way too many possessions where he is the only one who touches the rock, that and he will get in the media and basically call his team trash.

That team he won a title with was littered with talent. He had an aging Shaq who was still the best C in the league probably outside of Yao at the time, Alonzo Mourning who was probably also a top 5 center in the league as his backup, James Posey who did basically the same things he did in Memphis and Boston, and Jason Williams and an aging Gary Payton.
so basically after Shaq and Zo, he had guys who were considered either underachievers or cancers?

apart from 37 yo GP?

yeah, littered with talent. Wade hasn't played with a borderline allstar player since '06

Funny to me that the media was picking the Heat to be borderline or out of the playoffs altogether the last 2 years and yet they got the 5th seed. Won 47 games without making anybody better

JordansBulls
06-08-2010, 05:43 PM
so basically after Shaq and Zo, he had guys who were considered either underachievers or cancers?

apart from 37 yo GP?

yeah, littered with talent. Wade hasn't played with a borderline allstar player since '06

Funny to me that the media was picking the Heat to be borderline or out of the playoffs altogether the last 2 years and yet they got the 5th seed. Won 47 games without making anybody better

Jermaine O'neal finished 5th in MVP voting at one time.

unleashthebeast
06-08-2010, 05:55 PM
Jermaine O'neal finished 5th in MVP voting at one time.

that was when he could still move. now his knees r ****

HiphopRelated
06-08-2010, 06:05 PM
Jermaine O'neal finished 5th in MVP voting at one time.
Go sign Bill Russell

Bruno
06-08-2010, 06:23 PM
Jermaine O'neal finished 5th in MVP voting at one time.

"There was a time I shot 40% from the three-point line." - Artest

haha.

JordansBulls
06-08-2010, 11:31 PM
that was when he could still move. now his knees r ****

When did his knees go out?

OT Thriller
06-08-2010, 11:54 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball

LMAO that is a hysterical sig. Havent laughed out loud by myself in a while and no im not a goth.

JordansBulls
06-09-2010, 12:56 AM
"There was a time I shot 40% from the three-point line." - Artest

haha.

:)

Bruno
06-09-2010, 04:45 PM
:)

Sorry, reading that Jermaine Oneal was once 5th in MVP voting really spurred me to say favorite recent Artestism. Too funny.

JordansBulls
06-09-2010, 11:23 PM
Sorry, reading that Jermaine Oneal was once 5th in MVP voting really spurred me to say favorite recent Artestism. Too funny.

No problem man.

PLAYERS FAN
06-09-2010, 11:49 PM
Hes made ton of players better! What are you guys talking about.

Jason Kapono- was an IR player on the Bobcats prior to joining the Heat. And im sorry, he became a DISGUSTINGLY good off ball/spot up three point shooter for the Heat, led the league in three point percentage (108 3's at 50% shooting). Enough so that we couldnt retain him because he took the full mid-level. (i miss that bastard heat need him back)

Damon Jones- Im surprised no one here has mentioned this guy. Again was a back up on a Milwaukee team, virtually unknown becomes a premier 3-point guy [playing for the Heat, led the league in three pointers made. Hit highest # of three's in his career, 225 at 43%! After he left heat, disappeared.

Rasual Butler- Shot highest three-point percentage of career at 46% from downtown. Playing next to D. Wade.

Q Rich- this year highest career percentage again.

He makes players better hands down. theres a difference between making good players better and trying to make a goumet meal out of garbage.

I give Shaq the credit for that.

HoopsMachine
06-10-2010, 12:43 AM
All that "making teammates better" is non-sense and is just a talking point for sports pundits and fans alike to debate. The truth is simply either teammates step their game up or the GM surrounds the franchise player with a better team, it's as simple as that.

You have grown men getting paid millions of dollars, they shouldn't need their best player telling them what to do to get better.

HiphopRelated
06-10-2010, 09:16 AM
I give Shaq the credit for that.
Shaq was injured while Kapono was beasting and Butler had a worse year with Shaq

people just say sh1t just to say it. You probably couldn't pick these dudes out a lineup in a Heat jersey but have an opinion.

JordansBulls
06-10-2010, 04:08 PM
I give Shaq the credit for that.

:(

slamfan4life
06-12-2010, 08:12 PM
idk about this, wade always gives it his all, and the heat would be way more ****** than they are now so


i disagree :D

DeyAce
06-12-2010, 08:43 PM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

Master Mind
06-13-2010, 12:37 AM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

Bulls fan huh? :eyebrow:

questkat
06-13-2010, 01:32 AM
We wouldnt be hearing this if he was winning. I disagree with cowherd, he's a fool, although he gets somethings right i think he's wrong here

sventhedog
06-13-2010, 05:03 AM
you have to be smarter. these are the same people who said lebron makes the team better. where is cleveland now?

lebron refused to shake anyone's hand when he got eliminated by the magic because he can't accept losing. believe that if you want. lol.

LeBroom
06-13-2010, 07:39 AM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

Wade hit a nerve eh? :clap:

Reversed86Curse
06-13-2010, 09:34 AM
Miami= NJ w/o Wade

Of course he makes his teammates better, if he doesn't, hell, that just means he led his team to a 5 by himself

jackdawson
06-13-2010, 09:42 AM
miami= nj w/o wade

of course he makes his teammates better, if he doesn't, hell, that just means he led his team to a 5 by himself

this.

BALLER71
06-13-2010, 09:43 AM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

Because he's not going to the Bulls? Why should have any loyalty towards the Chicago Bulls? He's never played for them.

ATX
06-13-2010, 09:48 AM
Miami= NJ w/o Wade

Of course he makes his teammates better, if he doesn't, hell, that just means he led his team to a 5 by himself

So true. His supporting cast is fairly awful, and they still won 47 games. Where would they be without Wade...Bottom feeding like NJ. Get this man some help!!

ATX
06-13-2010, 09:50 AM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

I can't believe that all Bulls are butt hurt about Wade staying loyal to his organization, and are calling him a "Back stabbing piece of garbage!" No wonder Wade doesn't want to go to Chicago. What exactly makes him a piece of garbage, or a backstabber? Just because he doesn't want to play for your team, you Bulls fans all hate him now? That's just awful of you, and I feel ashamed for you. :facepalm:

jackdawson
06-13-2010, 09:52 AM
^^Let them do whatever they want. More miseries are coming toward the cows starting from July 8. I am gonna posterize couple of them with my saved quotes; most likely we wont't see them again on PSD...lol.

97NYer
06-13-2010, 09:58 AM
If he doesn't make his teammates better how did the Heat get anywhere? His supporting cast was truly awful.

JordansBulls
06-13-2010, 12:32 PM
wade's a backstabbing peice of garbage

:mad:

jackdawson
06-13-2010, 12:41 PM
:mad::love:

JordansBulls
06-13-2010, 11:59 PM
:love:

:confused:

still1ballin
06-14-2010, 12:21 AM
Wow

J$mo0th_3o5
06-14-2010, 12:23 AM
Wtf?!

chitownbulls
06-14-2010, 12:59 AM
I can't believe that all Bulls are butt hurt about Wade staying loyal to his organization, and are calling him a "Back stabbing piece of garbage!" No wonder Wade doesn't want to go to Chicago. What exactly makes him a piece of garbage, or a backstabber? Just because he doesn't want to play for your team, you Bulls fans all hate him now? That's just awful of you, and I feel ashamed for you. :facepalm:

We dont give a damn if he comes here. What matters is, he took a low blow at us trying to get a FA to go to Miami. Ive never heard a player disgrace an organization by saying they have no loyalty, even though we have actually stuck with most of our older players than Miami has. He is also insulting his childhood team, who he looked up to when he was a kid. Which is why he is a backstabber. He had the gift of watching the great Bulls of the 90's and now he insults them....

OnslaughtXX6
06-14-2010, 01:01 AM
Colin Cowherd obviously knows nothing about basketball. I guarantee you he didn't watch one heat game this year. Your average PSD NBA poster even knows Wade supporting cast was very limited in skill and talent. Only a couple of players besides Wade had the ability to create their own shot on the Heat's roster. If Cowherd had any basketball knowledge he should be praising him on how he took that team full of scrubs to 47 wins. And comparing Wade to Amare (in my opinion) is truely insulting.

still1ballin
06-14-2010, 01:14 AM
Colin Cowherd obviously knows nothing about basketball. I guarantee you he didn't watch one heat game this year. Your average PSD NBA poster even knows Wade supporting cast was very limited in skill and talent. Only a couple of players besides Wade had the ability to create their own shot on the Heat's roster. If Cowherd had any basketball knowledge he should be praising him on how he took that team full of scrubs to 47 wins. And comparing Wade to Amare (in my opinion) is truely insulting.

yi

saintdrew
06-14-2010, 01:18 AM
Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

curtie74
06-14-2010, 01:40 AM
WADE DOESNT MAKE HIS TEAMMATES BETTER:speechless: WADE HAS A RING AND HE WON IT WITH A TERRIBLE SHAQ DID LEBRON DO THAT??????? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO STOP HATING MY TEAM SWEPT THE CAVS N DA FINALS

Master Mind
06-14-2010, 02:10 AM
Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

Really? How many rings does Bron have without a supporting cast? :eyebrow:

bbblack40
06-14-2010, 02:36 AM
Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

with the exception of lebron? are u serious? What has Lebron won without a supporting cast? as a matter of fact what has he won with a supporting cast? answer ur looking for is nothing. I swear people say tha craziest stuff.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:07 AM
nvm...

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:08 AM
:confused:

That you are mad at a bulls fan;)

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:12 AM
Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now.

NYKalltheway
06-14-2010, 03:14 AM
You can't deny that LeBron is overall a better player than Wade. But too say that Wade doesn't make his teammates look better, well that's definitely far from truth. He doesn't do it in the same way LeBron does it, but he's close. Kobe has a much better 'supporting cast' than both of them. I don't think the Lakers would have been far different with Wade instead of Kobe.

JordansBulls
06-14-2010, 01:47 PM
You can't deny that LeBron is overall a better player than Wade. But too say that Wade doesn't make his teammates look better, well that's definitely far from truth. He doesn't do it in the same way LeBron does it, but he's close. Kobe has a much better 'supporting cast' than both of them. I don't think the Lakers would have been far different with Wade instead of Kobe.

Do you realize how Wade played against the Celtics despite being the focal point of the offense with absolutely no help?

Dude averaged 33/6/6/ on 56%FG.

JordansBulls
06-14-2010, 01:48 PM
Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now.

:clap:

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:00 PM
Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now.

???? cmon man. absolutely not.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 02:16 PM
???? cmon man. absolutely not.

Really???? Well, you could have said something like "you never know," but I would love to know how that would be absolutely not possible. Please elaborate (If you really think Beasley could play more than 8-10 mins on the cavs-celtics series, then I don't need your elaboration and Beasley supposedly was the Heat's 2nd best player).

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:24 PM
look, the Heat had minimal talent compared to any other team in the playoffs, and there is no doubt Wade had a better series individually than LeBron did against the Celtics. But the Celtics have played stronger throughout the playoffs, Miami caught them first, and with the Cav's supporting cast, taking LeBron off, and putting Wade on isn't going to just win the series. Is it possible? Sure. So maybe I used strong words. But the Cavs's role players are dirt as well. Are they better then the Heat's? Yes. But I personally don't see Wade dominating like that without his teammates suffering around him in that series.
And I still think LeBron's elbow was giving him more issues then he let on, but that is just a guess.
My point is, if LeBron can't win with that crappy cast, I am not believing anyone else can.

ballpd05
06-14-2010, 02:27 PM
Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now.

u can't be serious.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 02:33 PM
look, the Heat had minimal talent compared to any other team in the playoffs, and there is no doubt Wade had a better series individually than LeBron did against the Celtics. But the Celtics have played stronger throughout the playoffs, Miami caught them first, and with the Cav's supporting cast, taking LeBron off, and putting Wade on isn't going to just win the series. Is it possible? Sure. So maybe I used strong words. But the Cavs's role players are dirt as well. Are they better then the Heat's? Yes. But I personally don't see Wade dominating like that without his teammates suffering around him in that series.
And I still think LeBron's elbow was giving him more issues then he let on, but that is just a guess.
My point is, if LeBron can't win with that crappy cast, I am not believing anyone else can.


Ok. Let me see:

Mo-Will>Arroyo
Delonte> Cook
Gibson???Chalmers
Jamison> Beasley
Varejao>Haslem
Shaq>JO
Ilguskas>Joel

bla bla bla...

Yeah, you are right :rolleyes:

Edit: You must be kidding with that bold part. It would have been absolutely opposite because celtics had to put lot more defensive focus on other players, instead, they solely focused their defense on Wade.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 02:38 PM
btw my post was on the following in case if you guys missed it:


Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

Now how absurd is this? When did LeBron win a ring without a supporting cast??

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:40 PM
Ok. Let me see:

Mo-Will>Arroyo
Delonte> Cook
Gibson???Chalmers
Jamison> Beasley
Varejao>Haslem
Shaq>JO
Ilguskas>Joel

bla bla bla...

Yeah, you are right :rolleyes:

the better than arrows are fine, but the difference is not that much. And like I said, Boston has literally gotten better every game. Cleveland would have been fine had they played Boston round 1 before LeBron's elbow injury, and before the Celtics started gearing up.
the funniest part is, if anyone else went for 27/9/7 on 45% shooting, it would be considered dominant. Its not like LeBron played poorly outside game 5.

Rivera
06-14-2010, 02:43 PM
Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now.

I agree with this statement 75% of the way


the only reason i say this is i believe that they would of had a better shot at beating the celtics with wade instead of lebron BUT

at the end of the day would they still have beaten the celtics?? im not sooo sure on that



i was just looking up the miami heat roster of 05-06 their championship year and man WADE was/is a beast

@ the time

PG 32year old often injured jason williams/ 36 yr old backup Gary Payton

SG Dwyane Wade/ Derek Anderson (member him#1 from the spurs)/Shannon Anderson(lmao didnt he used to be an OK knick? lmao)

SF 31/32 yr old Antoine Walker/ James Posey/Jason Kapono

PF Udonis Haslem (hes a championship type player was actually their 5th leading scorer durin the season/Wayne Simien/Earl Barron

C Shaq that depreciated during the season/ And Alonozo Mourning last hurrah (especially on the Defensive end of the floor)

thats not a GREAT squad and DWADE still led them to the chip

ballpd05
06-14-2010, 02:43 PM
Really???? Well, you could have said something like "you never know," but I would love to know how that would be absolutely not possible. Please elaborate (If you really think Beasley could play more than 8-10 mins on the cavs-celtics series, then I don't need your elaboration and Beasley supposedly was the Heat's 2nd best player).

I'll argue that Lebron, who almost looked like he didn't care at the end of that Boston series, is just better. He can score just as well as D Wade and is a much better team player than Wade, and is starting to be a real presence on the defensive end of the floor.

Wade looks like the type of player where if you miss a shot or two you won't see the ball for another 2 1/2 quarters. He just has the aura of a bad teammate who loses confidence in his team quickly.

That and Lebron took a team to the finals where his second best player was Daniel "Boobie" Gibson. And beat a really good Detroit team to do it.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 02:45 PM
the better than arrows are fine, but the difference is not that much. And like I said, Boston has literally gotten better every game. Cleveland would have been fine had they played Boston round 1 before LeBron's elbow injury, and before the Celtics started gearing up.
the funniest part is, if anyone else went for 27/9/7 on 45% shooting, it would be considered dominant. Its not like LeBron played poorly outside game 5.

If you go by positions they is no Heat player better the any of the cavs, well except the shooting guard, which is Wade himself:rolleyes: And still the overall difference is no much? hahahaha!! C'on man! You are better than that.

The Prodigy
06-14-2010, 02:47 PM
look, the Heat had minimal talent compared to any other team in the playoffs, and there is no doubt Wade had a better series individually than LeBron did against the Celtics. But the Celtics have played stronger throughout the playoffs, Miami caught them first, and with the Cav's supporting cast, taking LeBron off, and putting Wade on isn't going to just win the series. Is it possible? Sure. So maybe I used strong words. But the Cavs's role players are dirt as well. Are they better then the Heat's? Yes. But I personally don't see Wade dominating like that without his teammates suffering around him in that series.
And I still think LeBron's elbow was giving him more issues then he let on, but that is just a guess.
My point is, if LeBron can't win with that crappy cast, I am not believing anyone else can.

I hate when people do this. They praise Lebron's team all year saying there great and that its there year to win it all and all the BS. And as soon as they fall short of expectation they make excuses saying his team is crappy. I've been hearing this for the last three years. C'mon people get over it. Lebron is good but he isn't on a planet of his own, He has Wade and Kobe to accompany him. Stats don't tell it all. And stop living by ESPN there job is not to inform you on sports, its to sell sports.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 02:48 PM
I'll argue that Lebron, who almost looked like he didn't care at the end of that Boston series, is just better. He can score just as well as D Wade and is a much better team player than Wade, and is starting to be a real presence on the defensive end of the floor.

Wade looks like the type of player where if you miss a shot or two you won't see the ball for another 2 1/2 quarters. He just has the aura of a bad teammate who loses confidence in his team quickly.

That and Lebron took a team to the finals where his second best player was Daniel "Boobie" Gibson. And beat a really good Detroit team to do it.

I am NOT arguing who is the better individual player. Wade has shown what he is capable of doing in the playoffs with a somewhat supporting cast till 2006.

DR. Pepper
06-14-2010, 02:50 PM
He hasn't made Beasley any better.

yeah well beasley isnt doin himself any favors either

JordansBulls
06-14-2010, 02:51 PM
???? cmon man. absolutely not.

Wade vs C's

33.2 ppg 5.6 rpg 6.8 apg 1.6 spg 1.6 bpg on 56% FG

Lebron vs C's

26.8 ppg 9.3 rpg 7.2 apg 2.2 spg 1.3 bpg on 45% FG

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:54 PM
I hate when people do this. They praise Lebron's team all year saying there great and that its there year to win it all and all the BS. And as soon as they fall short of expectation they make excuses saying his team is crappy. I've been hearing this for the last three years. C'mon people get over it. Lebron is good but he isn't on a planet of his own, He has Wade and Kobe to accompany him. Stats don't tell it all. And stop watching ESPN there job is not to inform you on sports, its to sell sports.

I can not be convinced that the Cavs players are nothing more than cast offs from other squads, with their two centers being 100 years old.
Honestly, remove LeBron from the Cavs, and they are a 20-25 win team. They are a phantom contender that wins games in the regular season, then gets exposed big time when defenses are able to key in on LeBron and make the other players deal with stressful situations.
And the point is, LeBron, Wade, Kobe, it doesn't matter who you put on either Miami or Cleveland. None of them would go that far.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:56 PM
Wade vs C's

33.2 ppg 5.6 rpg 6.8 apg 1.6 spg 1.6 bpg on 56% FG

Lebron vs C's

26.8 ppg 9.3 rpg 7.2 apg 2.2 spg 1.3 bpg on 45% FG

so? That is barely a difference, and Wade's efficiency was better in those 5 games from being abnormally hot for stretches of time, much higher than any other series outside the 2006 finals, while LeBron actually has a down series with still dominant numbers.
Simply put, there is no way I can be convinced simply replacing LeBron with Wade is enough for Cleveland to put away the Celtics, who are now putting away the Lakers. Sorry

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 02:59 PM
whats funny is, last season, LeBron took a dump on Wade's numbers from this year, and the Cavs still went home. At some point, people need to realize Mike Brown was not a good coach, and Cleveland's players are castaways from other teams who look better than they are due to having LeBron on their team. But you don't get to play the Wolves and Kings for 7 games in the playoffs, so those role players drop back to earth when they face actual competition

godolphins
06-14-2010, 03:01 PM
ignore Cowherd when it comes to basketball
not his forte'

he's pretty much a football guy. NFL and NCAA. Im not the biggets football guy, but it seems to me like he's got some nice knowledge there

when it comes to baseball, he's ok.

but basketball, yikes. he just shouldnt talk about bball

Your sig: :laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh::laugh::laugh::laug h::laugh::laugh:

The Prodigy
06-14-2010, 03:01 PM
I can not be convinced that the Cavs players are nothing more than cast offs from other squads, with their two centers being 100 years old.
Honestly, remove LeBron from the Cavs, and they are a 20-25 win team. They are a phantom contender that wins games in the regular season, then gets exposed big time when defenses are able to key in on LeBron and make the other players deal with stressful situations.
And the point is, LeBron, Wade, Kobe, it doesn't matter who you put on either Miami or Cleveland. None of them would go that far.

Far from it and we all witnessed when Wade leaves the team. A 15 win team with Wade actually winning them a couple games that season. I might not be able to convince you that Wade would get to the Finals with the Cavs current roster but Wade plays better on the bigger stages then Lebron does on many mutiple occasions.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:03 PM
does anyone really think this team could win more than 25 games?
Mo
West
Moon
Anderson V
Shaq

cmon

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:04 PM
and Miami pulled a monster tank job to keep at that 15 games peeps, you all know this, please don't even bother denying it. They could have won over 20 games but they started a D League team the last 15 games of the season

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:05 PM
whats funny is, last season, LeBron took a dump on Wade's numbers from this year, and the Cavs still went home. At some point, people need to realize Mike Brown was not a good coach, and Cleveland's players are castaways from other teams who look better than they are due to having LeBron on their team. But you don't get to play the Wolves and Kings for 7 games in the playoffs, so those role players drop back to earth when they face actual competition

:confused: Role players beat the lakers twice in reg season? Everyone said cavs had one of the deepest team in the league and I can still argue with it. May be Magic had a deeper team, but I don't think anyone else. And now you are saying that was a crappy cast. Take a look at this carefully and compare with other teams player by player.
http://espn.go.com/nba/teams/roster?team=cle&sort=null

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:05 PM
Look, I love Wade, so I am bowing out here. But when I flip to a thread for the first time, and see cussing and the statement that the Cavs would be in the finals if Wade were there, and not LeBron, and then a respected mod is applauding it, I am saying something.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:08 PM
does anyone really think this team could win more than 25 games?
Mo
West
Moon
Anderson V
Shaq

cmon

You do know Antawn Jamison is a nba player and he plays for the cavs right? Plus go with the whole list from the link that I provided you above and show me how many teams had deeper casts than the cavs. I am eagerly waiting.

The Prodigy
06-14-2010, 03:08 PM
does anyone really think this team could win more than 25 games?
Mo
West
Moon
Anderson V
Shaq

cmon

First you forgot that Antwan Jamison starts and that there bench is decent.
If teams like Indiana, Detroit, NO(without Paul)GS and SacTown can win close to 30 games this team is pushing like 32 games.

krest213
06-14-2010, 03:10 PM
thats the truth. im a heat Fan also but Wade doesn't.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:11 PM
Look, I love Wade, so I am bowing out here. But when I flip to a thread for the first time, and see cussing and the statement that the Cavs would be in the finals if Wade were there, and not LeBron, and then a respected mod is applauding it, I am saying something.

That the cavs had a crappy cast? You are funny dude.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:11 PM
That the cavs had a crappy cast? You are funny dude.

its crappy enough is the point. There isn't a player in the game that could bring that team to the finals in this season. No way.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:14 PM
its crappy enough is the point. There isn't a player in the game that could bring that team to the finals in this season. No way.

Yet they had the best records two years just for lebron? Then why didn't they have best records other years since 2003? I am off dude. I gave you the link and you are not going with that because you know you can't find more than 1/2 (IF THERE IS ANY) teams with a better cast.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:20 PM
The Wolves won more than 50 games for years, and had the best record in the west in 2004. Did anyone seriously consider them contenders? The Mavs have won how many games in the last 7 seasons? Does anyone consider them a threat?
Both are a big no
Point is, regular season is pretty and all, but nobody out there can really consider Cleveland a legit threat to the title until they get help for LeBron. And both of the last years, the Cavs again trick people into believing they are legit, only to watch their role players completely crumble in the playoffs like they are made of glass.

Bring The Heat
06-14-2010, 03:22 PM
Still don't understand why people say the Cavs supporting cast sucks...You don't win 60+ games and have a crappy team... Having the best record in the league and throughout the regular season having people call you the best team and the favorite to get to the finals... Then all of a sudden you lose in the second round people change their minds and say its crappy

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:24 PM
The cast is fine in the regular season, when they aren't being pressured. When they get to the playoffs, they are terrible. Seriously, find me a Cav's player outside LeBron that consistently played well throughout any of the last couple of playoffs.
Good luck

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:25 PM
The Wolves won more than 50 games for years, and had the best record in the west in 2004. Did anyone seriously consider them contenders? The Mavs have won how many games in the last 7 seasons? Does anyone consider them a threat?
Both are a big no
Point is, regular season is pretty and all, but nobody out there can really consider Cleveland a legit threat to the title until they get help for LeBron. And both of the last years, the Cavs again trick people into believing they are legit, only to watch their role players completely crumble in the playoffs like they are made of glass.

LMAO!!!!

You are probably the only one who has said Cavs were not a contender this season or last season. How can you trick people for 82 games and how can you NOT trick for 21 games??

Major Fail.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:25 PM
and the 60 wins is a reflection of how good LeBron is. Any team he goes to will win more than 50 games. Especially in the east

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:28 PM
LMAO!!!!

You are probably the only one who has said Cavs were not a contender this season or last season. How can you trick people for 82 games and how can you NOT trick for 21 games??

Major Fail.

nope, they even dupe me. In the regular season. And then in the playoffs they disappear the second they run into an actual defense. Not sure how you don't see this man.
And what is with the attack? You are claming I am a fail? I think you have seen me long enough on this site to know I am not blowing smoke up your ***, so I would appreciate a little respect, though it doesn't matter really

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:33 PM
nope, they even dupe me. In the regular season. And then in the playoffs they disappear the second they run into an actual defense. Not sure how you don't see this man.
And what is with the attack? You are claming I am a fail? I think you have seen me long enough on this site to know I am not blowing smoke up your ***, so I would appreciate a little respect, though it doesn't matter really

Attack? You say they tricked all of us for 82 games and they can't trick for 7 games?????? Get real man. Go make a poll and see how many people think cavs weren't a contender last two years. Then come back to this argument. And here is something for you (Since you are acting weird and someone like who has just opened a PSD account).
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=OffseasonPredictions09-NBAChamps

EDIT: You were escaping that "Show me how many teams had deeper cast than the cavs?" I even provided a link for your ease. Another reason of saying fail.

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 03:38 PM
I came in here, not to talk about the Cavs supporting cast, which I don't believe in, or even to compare LeBron and Wade. I was responding to the statement you made saying Wade would bring that cast to the finals. Its not happening. Period. A healthy Boston, and Orlando are way more stacked up and down their rosters. Replacing the best player in the world with the second best player in the world aint gonna get it done brother.
And the entire year this year, I always said that I thought LeBron finally got some help, but was very reserved about whether that help was close to enough. Well, it wasn't. I looked at is as, they need to prove they are a good cast when it matters, not just win a bunch of regular season games then get bounced.
And as for the thread, I haven't even read through it. I simply saw your comment, of which I responded to.
Peace, this is nonproductive, cause they are both watching the finals right now.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 03:42 PM
I came in here, not to talk about the Cavs supporting cast, which I don't believe in, or even to compare LeBron and Wade. I was responding to the statement you made saying Wade would bring that cast to the finals. Its not happening. Period. A healthy Boston, and Orlando are way more stacked up and down their rosters. Replacing the best player in the world with the second best player in the world aint gonna get it done brother.
And the entire year this year, I always said that I thought LeBron finally got some help, but was very reserved about whether that help was close to enough. Well, it wasn't. I looked at is as, they need to prove they are a good cast when it matters, not just win a bunch of regular season games then get bounced.
And as for the thread, I haven't even read through it. I simply saw your comment, of which I responded to.
Peace, this is nonproductive, cause they are both watching the finals right now.

LOL..anyways, it was fun though. Hopefully, we will get better discussions next season when Wade will probably have a better cast. Peace man.

ballpd05
06-14-2010, 03:52 PM
The Cavs have solid role players and had a great defensive scheme. But to win a title in a seven game series they do not have the weapons to go out and beat the high quality teams.

When comparing Wade's title team to Lebron's last three teams. The main difference is that while Wade had an aging team they were still all pretty good, and Shaq was still a 20-10 center unlike the 12-6 center he is now. Jason Williams and Mo are a toss up to me, James Posey then was better than Anthony Parker now, Shaq and Alonzo then are head and shoulders better than Big Z and Shaq now, and Antoine Walker and Jamison seem to look like the same player. I think that the Celtics, Lakers, and even the Mavericks of this year are all better than the Pistons and Mavs the Heat beat in '06 to win.

Not taking away from Wade's performance because he hit a historic hot streak, but don't act like he was the only capable player on that Miami Heat squad or that that Heat squad wasn't more talented than this Cavs team.

In the past three years I think Lebron has gotten so good that you can put almost anyone around him and have a contender, but of course when it comes down to beating another elite team 4 of 7 you need someone else to take away the playmaking load.

thescore53
06-14-2010, 03:55 PM
LOL..anyways, it was fun though. Hopefully, we will get better discussions next season when Wade will probably have a better cast. Peace man.

at least you acknowledge it might not happen........

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 04:01 PM
at least you acknowledge it might not happen........

Yes, I also acknowledge there is a 0.001% chance that Bosh stays in freeze for 6 more years.

thescore53
06-14-2010, 04:05 PM
Yes, I also acknowledge there is a 0.001% chance that Bosh stays in freeze for 6 more years.

so i guess there's also 0.001 chance he goes to Chicago or nyk cause he'll freeze there to..... man you heat fans dont want to discuss even the slightest chance that the big FA might not go there

mikantsass
06-14-2010, 04:06 PM
I dont think Jesus Christ himself could make JO, Richardson, Arroyo, and Beasley better.

Did Wade make his teammates better when they won the Finals in 06?

JordansBulls
06-14-2010, 05:20 PM
I dont think Jesus Christ himself could make JO, Richardson, Arroyo, and Beasley better.

Did Wade make his teammates better when they won the Finals in 06?

JO was a 7x allstar my friend.

HiphopRelated
06-14-2010, 05:25 PM
JO was a 7x allstar my friend.
That WAS a long time ago

azkarraga
06-14-2010, 05:57 PM
So youre saying that if Wade was surrounded by good players opposed to mediocre ones, he wouldn't be able to make those good players even better greater players, because they were already good? People never mentioned Pau Gasol in the top 3 PF discussion before he was traded to the Lakers. Today most posters say Pau is the best offensive big in the game. There are endless examples of superstars making already good players, great players.

You mean, thanks to Kobe? Lol Gasol doesnt get touches in LA and he's become a great offensive player thanks to Kobe?

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 06:49 PM
so i guess there's also 0.001 chance he goes to Chicago or nyk cause he'll freeze there to..... man you heat fans dont want to discuss even the slightest chance that the big FA might not go there

Of-course we could end up with nothing but chances of Bosh bolting is millions times higher than that. If one FA bolts this summer that's Bosh for me. I can bet my house on that.

mikantsass
06-14-2010, 07:08 PM
JO was a 7x allstar my friend.

This aint the 90s

unleashthebeast
06-14-2010, 08:01 PM
JO was a 7x allstar my friend.

thats when he could still jump and for that matter run

Hawkeye15
06-14-2010, 08:07 PM
JO was a 7x allstar my friend.

he WAS. Key word. He was so bad in this years playoffs, they should come up with a term for it

smith&wesson
06-14-2010, 08:12 PM
mario chalmers seems to play well with d wade and has developed nicely. :shrug:

td0tsfinest
06-14-2010, 08:16 PM
This aint the 90s

He didn't play with the Pacers until 2000.

thescore53
06-14-2010, 08:17 PM
Of-course we could end up with nothing but chances of Bosh bolting is millions times higher than that. If one FA bolts this summer that's Bosh for me. I can bet my house on that.

why you keep bringing up bosh, im fully aware the chances of him leaving are extremely high :facepalm:

shizzle09
06-14-2010, 08:17 PM
mario chalmers seems to play well with d wade and has developed nicely. :shrug:

And Lebron sure made Gibson better and so did Kobe with Farmar. Nice example!:facepalm:

thescore53
06-14-2010, 08:18 PM
mario chalmers seems to play well with d wade and has developed nicely. :shrug:

no. hes horrible, thats why arroyo took his starting job. did you see him in the playoffs

dwadefan03
06-14-2010, 08:20 PM
is this even a discussion? wade doesnt make his team better? is this guy watching the same games we are?

smith&wesson
06-14-2010, 08:30 PM
no. hes horrible, thats why arroyo took his starting job. did you see him in the playoffs

I dont judge a player only on one seasons play off performance. chalmers has been solid for the heat He isnt horrible at all. i feel what your saying about him playing poorly in the playoffs this year but i guess thats what seperates him from a good rotation player and an elite player. but chalmers is a good example of a yonge player who grew better by playing with wade in practice. I think alot of the heat wade is getting based on this topic is because of beasley not living up to his potential yet.

smith&wesson
06-14-2010, 08:33 PM
And Lebron sure made Gibson better and so did Kobe with Farmar. Nice example!:facepalm:

I take chalmers over gibson anyday. and i dont know about you but i dont even like farmar. I think chalmers is better then both players.

not every thing is a facepalm just express your opinion.. whats sooo wrong with what im saying here homie. chalmers is an example of a yonge player who plays along side wade and has developed well. he isnt a star but thats not the point of the topic.

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 08:38 PM
I take chalmers over gibson anyday. and i dont know about you but i dont even like farmar. I think chalmers is better then both players.

not every thing is a facepalm just express your opinion.. whats sooo wrong with what im saying here homie. chalmers is an example of a yonge player who plays along side wade and has developed well. he isnt a star but thats not the point of the topic.

I agree with you.

thescore53
06-14-2010, 08:39 PM
jordan farmar is wayy better than chalmers.. but no ever expected much from chalmers unlike beasley

jackdawson
06-14-2010, 08:46 PM
jordan farmar is wayy better than chalmers.. but no ever expected much from chalmers unlike beasley
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
Farmar: http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jordan_farmar/

Chalmers: http://www.nba.com/playerfile/mario_chalmers/


How so??? Your bitter feeling of Bosh's bolting is taking over your brain cells:facepalm:

thescore53
06-14-2010, 08:48 PM
i dont need stats i have eyes

madiaz3
06-14-2010, 09:11 PM
Dwayne Wade sure made Team USA look good. He carried the Heat. He is a player that brings all the intangibles to the table. He is unselfish.

Kobe Bryant doesn't make other better. Talent allows Bryant to get away with taking bad shots. Bryant won with O'Neal because Bryant didn't have to be the leader. Bryant is now the leader and it seems like Gasol and Bynum aren't the forces they should be. Wade would give up his points to makesure elite talent got shots.

What? Where do you get this from?

madiaz3
06-14-2010, 09:12 PM
1. Udonis Haslem (self explanatory)

2. Jason Kapono (sucked on the next two teams he played for after the HEAT coincidence?)

3 James posey ( blew once he got to NO where he had CP3)

Forget about his impact on the Celtics...?

Hoopsadvocate
06-14-2010, 09:15 PM
Forget about his impact on the Celtics...?

right it was so short i actually forgot lol but he had 3 players to take pressure off him too (so im saying they made him better also just like wade).

mia305king
06-14-2010, 09:54 PM
jordan farmar is wayy better than chalmers.. but no ever expected much from chalmers unlike beasley

They both suck. Two career backups with no potential.

mia305king
06-14-2010, 09:55 PM
JO was a 7x allstar my friend.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: :facepalm:

smith&wesson
06-14-2010, 10:05 PM
i dont need stats i have eyes

score what up with you man, your supose to be my patna.


anyways you said farmar wayyyyy over chalmers. ok thats opinionated. i really dont think soo homie. dam were co-gms too lol . we wouldnt sign either anyways

smith&wesson
06-14-2010, 10:10 PM
If he doesn't make his teammates better how did the Heat get anywhere? His supporting cast was truly awful.


x2

bbblack40
06-14-2010, 10:37 PM
look, the Heat had minimal talent compared to any other team in the playoffs, and there is no doubt Wade had a better series individually than LeBron did against the Celtics. But the Celtics have played stronger throughout the playoffs, Miami caught them first, and with the Cav's supporting cast, taking LeBron off, and putting Wade on isn't going to just win the series. Is it possible? Sure. So maybe I used strong words. But the Cavs's role players are dirt as well. Are they better then the Heat's? Yes. But I personally don't see Wade dominating like that without his teammates suffering around him in that series.
And I still think LeBron's elbow was giving him more issues then he let on, but that is just a guess.
My point is, if LeBron can't win with that crappy cast, I am not believing anyone else can.

please get off that sportscenter juice, they keep pumping ur head full of lebron that u can't see with your own eyes. fact is cavs and heat both played the same team lebron struggled wade didnt. in 2006 that team was worse than this years and last yrs cavs team. difference Wade lead them to a ring, Lebron lead them to an early exit 2 yrs in a row. for somethings you cant just look at stats its also about intangibles, Wade's will to win is far superior to lebron, his heart, clutchness, etc... sometimes u have to watch tha game instead of catchin sportscenter highlights.

JordansBulls
06-15-2010, 08:42 AM
x2

+3

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 08:49 AM
please get off that sportscenter juice, they keep pumping ur head full of lebron that u can't see with your own eyes. fact is cavs and heat both played the same team lebron struggled wade didnt. in 2006 that team was worse than this years and last yrs cavs team. difference Wade lead them to a ring, Lebron lead them to an early exit 2 yrs in a row. for somethings you cant just look at stats its also about intangibles, Wade's will to win is far superior to lebron, his heart, clutchness, etc... sometimes u have to watch tha game instead of catchin sportscenter highlights.

I dont watch sportscenter

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 08:55 AM
while I think its ridiculous to say Wade doesn't help his teammates, everyone needs to remember a player of Wade or LeBron's caliber can get in the playoffs in the east with 14 girls as teammates

thekmp211
06-15-2010, 09:00 AM
it makes me sad that people get paid to say these things.

someone before said "this is your hobby, its his profession."

only makes it more depressing.

thekmp211
06-15-2010, 09:03 AM
please get off that sportscenter juice, they keep pumping ur head full of lebron that u can't see with your own eyes. fact is cavs and heat both played the same team lebron struggled wade didnt. in 2006 that team was worse than this years and last yrs cavs team. difference Wade lead them to a ring, Lebron lead them to an early exit 2 yrs in a row. for somethings you cant just look at stats its also about intangibles, Wade's will to win is far superior to lebron, his heart, clutchness, etc... sometimes u have to watch tha game instead of catchin sportscenter highlights.

youre right i always miss the "will to win meter" during the highlights.

lebron has never had a supporting cast as good as the heat in 2006 and that was not a great team for wade to carry beyond shaq.

lebron has never had a teammate close to as good as shaq was in 2006. NOT EVEN CLOSE!

Not even close!

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 09:17 AM
youre right i always miss the "will to win meter" during the highlights.

lebron has never had a supporting cast as good as the heat in 2006 and that was not a great team for wade to carry beyond shaq.

lebron has never had a teammate close to as good as shaq was in 2006. NOT EVEN CLOSE!

Not even close!

not even remotely close to what Shaq/Zo were up front.

chonbon
06-15-2010, 09:19 AM
youre right i always miss the "will to win meter" during the highlights.

lebron has never had a supporting cast as good as the heat in 2006 and that was not a great team for wade to carry beyond shaq.

lebron has never had a teammate close to as good as shaq was in 2006. NOT EVEN CLOSE!

Not even close!

i apologize, but you need to look at the roster he had this year... the cavs ****ing chocked and thats it... true shaq wasnt the shaq of old... but jamison, mo williams, big z, varejao? plz stop making excuses for lebron

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 09:26 AM
i apologize, but you need to look at the roster he had this year... the cavs ****ing chocked and thats it... true shaq wasnt the shaq of old... but jamison, mo williams, big z, varejao? plz stop making excuses for lebron

but how is his roster choking on him? That is what I don't get.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 09:27 AM
and Shaq sucked this year, as did Mike Brown. Why on earth would you play Shaq and Big Z, and take away your sole advantage up front, which is athletic ability?????? Brown deserved not only to be fired, but ***** slapped in public

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 09:31 AM
i apologize, but you need to look at the roster he had this year... the cavs ****ing chocked and thats it... true shaq wasnt the shaq of old... but jamison, mo williams, big z, varejao? plz stop making excuses for lebron

True. They choked with arguably the deepest line-up in the league. Not to mention Jamison was a free gift. Everything has been done to get them a ring but they failed miserably. Bottom line--LeBron is an amazing individual player but he certainly hasn't shown the ability to win it all in the bigger stages. He is a certified choker as of now. Wade is not. He led his team to championship with arguably the greatest performance in final's history. He showed what he can do with a somewhat good supporting cast from 2003 to 2006. He shines in bigger stages when he has somewhat support. An ultimate team-first guy who cares less about stats.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 09:40 AM
obviously Wade has proven his worth on the biggest stage, and LeBron has done nothing close to that. But that really isn't the argument here. This thread turned into Lebron hate well before I got here, and I stupidly became part of the discussion. Fact is, Wade wouldn't have done much to help the Cavs this playoffs, because all the players not named LeBron sucked, regardless of where you rate them over the past 2 years as a supporting cast.
And Shaq of 2006 was indeed far better than anything LeBron had this year. At that point, Shaq was still plan A for all defenses.

Raoul Duke
06-15-2010, 10:46 AM
Dude, seriously. He had Carlos Arroyo as his starting PG. Arroyo's "go-to move" is to run the ball up the floor as fast as he can in transition, make a b-line for the basket no matter how many defenders are in front of it, and then throw the ball out of bounds on a no-look pass. Brilliant!

kozelkid
06-15-2010, 10:48 AM
Dude, seriously. He had Carlos Arroyo as his starting PG. Arroyo's "go-to move" is to run the ball up the floor as fast as he can in transition, make a b-line for the basket no matter how many defenders are in front of it, and then throw the ball out of bounds on a no-look pass. Brilliant!

Who, Wade?
In 06 he had Jason Williams and Gary Payton...
I'm amazed that people actually think Lebron is a choker.
A player who had one of the best series ever statistically against Orlando last season doesn't look like a choker to me. Looks like his teammates failed him.
And this year Jamison failed as well.

td0tsfinest
06-15-2010, 10:50 AM
Who, Wade?
In 06 he had Jason Williams and Gary Payton...
I'm amazed that people actually think Lebron is a choker.
A player who had one of the best series ever statistically against Orlando last season doesn't look like a choker to me. Looks like his teammates failed him.
And this year Jamison failed as well.

I think he's just commenting on the article itself.

marlinsfan24
06-15-2010, 10:56 AM
Who, Wade?
In 06 he had Jason Williams and Gary Payton...
I'm amazed that people actually think Lebron is a choker.
A player who had one of the best series ever statistically against Orlando last season doesn't look like a choker to me. Looks like his teammates failed him.
And this year Jamison failed as well.

Stats don't equal wins. Lebron seems to be more interested in that than winning, which does hurt the Cavs.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 11:00 AM
Stats don't equal wins. Lebron seems to be more interested in that than winning, which does hurt the Cavs.

how does LeBron seem more interested in stats? What has he ever said or done to make people think this? He needs to get 30/8/7, or his team loses. That is the bottom line. So does Wade for that matter

JordansBulls
06-15-2010, 12:40 PM
Stats don't equal wins. Lebron seems to be more interested in that than winning, which does hurt the Cavs.

This. Remember last summer he walked around with a T-shirt saying "Check my Stats"

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 01:38 PM
Again, LeBron is probably the best all round player on the planet right now but this argument WILL NOT go anywhere untill LeBron wins a title. Wade has already set himself up there for the debate; Sadly, LeBron has yet to do that. Till then it's all worthless.

Chronz
06-15-2010, 01:45 PM
This. Remember last summer he walked around with a T-shirt saying "Check my Stats"

Case shut and closed


Stats don't equal wins. Lebron seems to be more interested in that than winning, which does hurt the Cavs.
Stas do equal wins, the winning team has the best stats remember.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 01:46 PM
agreed, which is why its a stupid argument. But you had to figure a response was coming when you said Wade could carry that cast to the finals. This isn't the 2006 east.

kozelkid
06-15-2010, 01:52 PM
Stats don't equal wins. Lebron seems to be more interested in that than winning, which does hurt the Cavs.

True, to a degree. Like if you are Wilt Chamberlain who was more interested in that and therefore constantly got his butt kicked by Russell.
However, only watching Lebron you realize that he was all about winning. And STATs, mind you, showed that his teammates laid an egg in the playoffs.

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 01:57 PM
agreed, which is why its a stupid argument. But you had to figure a response was coming when you said Wade could carry that cast to the finals. This isn't the 2006 east.

Ofcourse someone can't say for sure that Wade couldn't. This is simply a stupid idea that "Wade couldn't; Why? Because LeBron couldn't." Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 01:59 PM
Ofcourse someone can't say for sure that Wade couldn't. This is simply a stupid idea that "Wade couldn't; Why? Because LeBron couldn't." Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

I don't think anyone could have led the Cavs, minus, LeBron, to the finals. Not with a healthy Celtics and the Magic in the way.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 02:00 PM
but of course absolutes are uncalled for. Apologize if I used any.

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 02:06 PM
I don't think anyone could have led the Cavs, minus, LeBron, to the finals. Not with a healthy Celtics and the Magic in the way.

That's your opinion only. You can't say "for the fact wade couldn't" like you said couple of posts back.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 02:19 PM
That's your opinion only. You can't say "for the fact wade couldn't" like you said couple of posts back.

that is fine. But you also are using the fact that Wade and the Heat (with a 20/9 Shaq who was still option A for defenses, and a cast that showed up actually), as him carrying a weak team to the finals, against the 2006 eastern conference. The east is better up top now, and I have already explained that LeBron's supporting cast laid an egg in the playoffs, and that is not debatable. So Wade, even with his stats he threw up against Boston, or if he outplayed that even, wasn't going to make that big of a difference when Mike Brown was outcoached badly.
"Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now"

there is your statement. Its an absolute statement, which is what made me respond.

Wade_County
06-15-2010, 02:22 PM
This. Remember last summer he walked around with a T-shirt saying "Check my Stats"

Well hes done the same thing the past 2 Junes........watch the finals at home :laugh:

JordansBulls
06-15-2010, 02:55 PM
Well hes done the same thing the past 2 Junes........watch the finals at home :laugh:

He'll get there next year though.

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 03:30 PM
that is fine. But you also are using the fact that Wade and the Heat (with a 20/9 Shaq who was still option A for defenses, and a cast that showed up actually), as him carrying a weak team to the finals, against the 2006 eastern conference. The east is better up top now, and I have already explained that LeBron's supporting cast laid an egg in the playoffs, and that is not debatable. So Wade, even with his stats he threw up against Boston, or if he outplayed that even, wasn't going to make that big of a difference when Mike Brown was outcoached badly.
"Are you ****ing kidding me?????? Replace LeBron with Wade on the cavs and you would have been watching the cavs against the lakers now"

there is your statement. Its an absolute statement, which is what made me respond.


Did you realize my comment was a response to the following?????


Wade is just like any other current NBA player (with the exception of LeBron) in that he needs a supporting cast. Just like Kobe, Dirk-A-Lirk, Durant, Nash...

Pair up Wade with Stoudemire or Bosh and you got a conference finals team.

Now explain that bold part since you quoted me. How the hell LeBron can be an exception here??????? How many rings did he win without a supporting cast?????

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 03:36 PM
BTW,

Shaq: 2006 finals

13.67ppg, 10 rpg. NOT 20/9.

Wade_County
06-15-2010, 03:39 PM
He'll get there next year though.

we'll see

Chronz
06-15-2010, 03:49 PM
BTW,

Shaq: 2006 finals

13.67ppg, 10 rpg. NOT 20/9.

Constant hard doubles, although they didnt end up with quality shots that series, it did show they werent focused with getting the ball out of Wades hands. They made damn sure Shaq didnt do what he did to Detroit the round earlier. They played both straight up and got torched by both. Dallas had problems defending wings all year so they opted with just targeting a quickly deteriorate Shaq.

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 04:47 PM
Constant hard doubles, although they didnt end up with quality shots that series, it did show they werent focused with getting the ball out of Wades hands. They made damn sure Shaq didnt do what he did to Detroit the round earlier. They played both straight up and got torched by both. Dallas had problems defending wings all year so they opted with just targeting a quickly deteriorate Shaq.

True but that doesn't diminish the fact that Wade produced arguably the greatest show in final's history.

Edit: my argument was it wasn't 20/9 as Hawkeye said. Sure there were little helps but it was Wade who single-handedly destroyed the mavs.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 05:51 PM
Did you realize my comment was a response to the following?????



Now explain that bold part since you quoted me. How the hell LeBron can be an exception here??????? How many rings did he win without a supporting cast?????

oh, he isn't dude. I wasn't defending that dude in the least haha.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 05:53 PM
BTW,

Shaq: 2006 finals

13.67ppg, 10 rpg. NOT 20/9.

remember when I said Shaq was option A for the defense?? He was doubled the second the ball was in the air coming at him. They were going to let Wade beat them over Shaq. Cmom man, you know this

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 05:55 PM
True but that doesn't diminish the fact that Wade produced arguably the greatest show in final's history.

Edit: my argument was it wasn't 20/9 as Hawkeye said. Sure there were little helps but it was Wade who single-handedly destroyed the mavs.

Wade was incredible in that series. And no, Wade did not single handedly do it. The stats may show that, but the effect Shaq had on defenses can not be measured. It opens up the entire floor for everyone else. Kobe, and then Wade, capitalized on this.
The Shaq point was made, because LeBron has nothing even close to 2006 for help.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 05:56 PM
and again, the east at that point wasn't as strong as it is now. half the teams in there were .500 teams. Detroit won 64 games, but Shaq destroyed them yet again.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 05:58 PM
I love how this has turned into a history lesson. Whatever. its all "what if's" anyways, so who cares.

jackdawson
06-15-2010, 06:10 PM
2009-10 Cavs team was waaaaaay more balanced and deeper than 2006 Heat team. If you still want argue on that matter, please make thread with a poll first and then we will see what majority think.

Sure Shaq was a factor but you are acting like he was Lakers shaq (even you mentioned kobe).

NYKstateOFmind
06-15-2010, 06:21 PM
Wow. How is Wade in charge if his teammates are better? They have to step it up and practice on there own time. Wade is a superstar and a champion and has a Gold metal so he wont be the problem if the team plays bad.

Hawkeye15
06-15-2010, 09:28 PM
2009-10 Cavs team was waaaaaay more balanced and deeper than 2006 Heat team. If you still want argue on that matter, please make thread with a poll first and then we will see what majority think.

Sure Shaq was a factor but you are acting like he was Lakers shaq (even you mentioned kobe).

they are deeper, but having more average players doesn't make you a stronger cast. And again, the regular season doesn't matter. If LeBron's cast was good in the regular season, that is nice. But they sucked monster **** in the playoffs. And that is all that matters. For 2 seasons. His cast has proven they can play when it doesn't matter. Bout it.
anyways, nope, still don't think a cavs team with wade gets past Boston.
Im out, this is repetitive and going nowhere

thescore53
06-15-2010, 09:36 PM
True but that doesn't diminish the fact that Wade produced arguably the greatest show in final's history.

Edit: my argument was it wasn't 20/9 as Hawkeye said. Sure there were little helps but it was Wade who single-handedly destroyed the mavs.

no the refs destroyed the mavs and you know it

thescore53
06-15-2010, 10:40 PM
Dallas was up 2-0 in the series and led Miami in the Third Quarter of Game Three. Then Miami makes a miracle comeback to win the game. Dwayne Wade goes to the line 18 times.

Game Four: Miami wins handily to tie the series up at 2-2. However, Jerry Stackhouse caught Shaquille O'Neal with a flagrant foul that resulted in him being suspended for Game 5. Mavericks officials called the suspension of Stackhouse, who was a key player, unfair. Shaq later publicly said that the Stackhouse foul was less vicious than a love tap from his daughters.

Game Five: Miami wins in OT. Dwyane Wade
shot as many free throws as all the Mavericks combined! He set an NBA Finals record for most made free-throws in a game with 21. After a controversial play in which many fans thought Wade committed a backcourt violation, Wade hit the game-winning free throws with 1.9 seconds left.

Game Six: Miami wins the game and the series. Wade once again goes to the line an unusually large number of times (21). Four Mavs players are called for five fouls each.

FUN SERIES FACT: Dwyane Wade shattered the free throw record in a 6 game NBA Finals with 97 attempts and 75 makes. He averaged over 16 free throw attempts a game.

thescore53
06-15-2010, 10:43 PM
and then to top it off two former heat players publicly say they dont know how they won that title... stating they partied a lot

kswissdaf
06-15-2010, 10:47 PM
I hate when people bring up that he shot a lot of free throws,he got fouled a lot deal with it unless you can show me a **** load of bad calls you shouldnt be talking

dwadefan03
06-15-2010, 10:47 PM
^ duh it's common sense that if a guy goes to the line alot the refs are obviuosly conspiring to help them win :rolleyes:

OnslaughtXX6
06-15-2010, 10:49 PM
Yeah, I'm a Heat fan and I don't even know how we won in 2006. When Antoine Walker is your starting SF you have no business winning a title.

OnslaughtXX6
06-15-2010, 10:51 PM
Dwyane Wade was great though.

JordansBulls
06-16-2010, 01:03 AM
^ duh it's common sense that if a guy goes to the line alot the refs are obviuosly conspiring to help them win :rolleyes:

:laugh2: