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DitchDat
05-28-2010, 11:20 AM
I brought this up several times when responding to threads, and also in my "Players you know will get injured at some point during the season" thread, but I wanted to get people's opinions on the matter.

Should NBA contracts have health clauses that allow the team to void contracts when a player can't physically contribute or play 75+ games per season ? Should guys like T-Mac, Arenas and Eddy Curry be allowed to let go by their teams if they don't play a certain amount of games for a certain amount of seasons?

I know there are already some clauses in place, but it remains very difficult to void contracts in the NBA. I think teams should be given some flexibility when a player is NEVER healthy though. I firmly believe I could be onto something and that the NBA should look into this.

Thoughts?

Kakaroach
05-28-2010, 11:30 AM
No player would sign that kind of deal. Plus, that would reflect badly on the organization.

I can understand that fans get angry and upset when certain players are injured, but you never know when a player may get injured and no player would sign a kind of deal where their contract would get voided because of unknown and unpredictable injuries.

IAmKira
05-28-2010, 11:37 AM
75 game is too much. Maybe 40-50. Also a lot of the contracts are covered by insurances so they dont even pay for that sheit..

Niro
05-28-2010, 11:46 AM
if its the players fault then yes, otherwise no

but thats the way it is, isnt it?

TheKing23
05-28-2010, 11:51 AM
75 game is too much. Maybe 40-50. Also a lot of the contracts are covered by insurances so they dont even pay for that sheit..

Yeah wasn't there a clause in Erick Dampier's contract that said if he didn't play a certain amount of minutes in a season (I think it averaged out at about 25.6 MPG) then he would only get paid a tiny fraction of his contract?

To be honest, I think that kind of clause is even worse, dependent on match ups etc. there's a chance you could lose out on a ton of money even if you're fully healthy.

Hawkeye15
05-28-2010, 12:04 PM
I would freakin LOVE the contracts to be like the NFL, designed to make sure teams aren't crippled by injuries. But good luck getting that by the player's union

GSW Hoops
05-28-2010, 12:34 PM
No. Players would play injured and ruin their careers long-term.

If a guy blows out his knee while working for his employer, they shouldn't be allowed to drop him like a hot potato in the offseason. Much like disability insurance for regular Joes.

C_Mund
05-28-2010, 12:48 PM
I agree that you don't want players getting hurt worse because they wanted them dollas, but at the same time how often do you hear fans complaining about injuries ruining their team?
Like Grant Hill with the Magic, T-Mac with the Rockets, J.O. with every team he's been on, Oden, etc.
These guys can still be paid most of their salaries by insurance, but maybe there's a way it wouldn't count aganst the cap.....but then again there would be teams asking players with minor injuries to take time off so they can recover while finding replacements with no repercussions.
Frankly, the NBA machine would find a way to contort any rule change.

CowboysKB24
05-28-2010, 01:00 PM
I brought this up several times when responding to threads, and also in my "Players you know will get injured at some point during the season" thread, but I wanted to get people's opinions on the matter.

Should NBA contracts have health clauses that allow the team to void contracts when a player can't physically contribute or play 75+ games per season ? Should guys like T-Mac, Arenas and Eddy Curry be allowed to let go by their teams if they don't play a certain amount of games for a certain amount of seasons?

I know there are already some clauses in place, but it remains very difficult to void contracts in the NBA. I think teams should be given some flexibility when a player is NEVER healthy though. I firmly believe I could be onto something and that the NBA should look into this.

Thoughts?

You are not onto anything and the NBA has looked at this for decades. The teams can't control everything. It is a business, they are taking risk in these contracts and injuries are one of them.

JNA17
05-28-2010, 01:03 PM
I would freakin LOVE the contracts to be like the NFL, designed to make sure teams are crippled by injuries. But good luck getting that by the player's union

So let's say a player where to have a career ending injury with 5 years and $50 million left on his contract. He was also on the T-Wolves. Say....An Al Jefferson type of player, would you still have the same opinion? :eyebrow:

Raoul Duke
05-28-2010, 01:05 PM
Well, they have to change something to make it more fair for the teams. I don't think they should be able to void a contract completely due to injury, but they shouldn't have to pay a guy the same amount if he only plays in a handful of games or is a shadow of his former self.

One Jermaine O'neal can ruin a team's chances for years.

Kakaroach
05-28-2010, 01:14 PM
I think what the OP is trying to get at is that it shouldn't count against the salary cap? That would be pretty hard to work around though I would imagine.

Niro
05-28-2010, 02:07 PM
hold on guys there is a rule that the salary doesnt count agaisnt the cap all the way if a player is out for the season...

Disabled Player Exception: Allows a team that is over the cap to acquire a replacement for a disabled player who will be out for either the remainder of that season (for in-season injuries/deaths) or the next season (if the disability occurs during the offseason). The maximum salary of the replacement player is either 50% of the injured player's salary, or the average salary, whichever is less. This exception requires an NBA-designated doctor to verify the extent of the injury.

Note that while teams can often use one exception to sign multiple players, they cannot use a combination of exceptions to sign a single player.

Kakaroach
05-28-2010, 02:19 PM
hold on guys there is a rule that the salary doesnt count agaisnt the cap all the way if a player is out for the season...

Disabled Player Exception: Allows a team that is over the cap to acquire a replacement for a disabled player who will be out for either the remainder of that season (for in-season injuries/deaths) or the next season (if the disability occurs during the offseason). The maximum salary of the replacement player is either 50% of the injured player's salary, or the average salary, whichever is less. This exception requires an NBA-designated doctor to verify the extent of the injury.

Note that while teams can often use one exception to sign multiple players, they cannot use a combination of exceptions to sign a single player. Ahhh I see. Good find Niro, thats very interesting. Unfortunately I don't think most owners are willing to spend that much money on just a short term fix. Plus, what good player would want that back-up role. Still, thats pretty interesting.

JasonJohnHorn
05-28-2010, 02:35 PM
I dont think contract should be voided for actual injuries. You can't help that, especially it if is work related, it would actually be against the law to do that.

Now, as for things like weight, you could potentially put bonuses in contracts for that. Like I think Sean May had if I recall, but actors, actresses and models and such have contracts where they have to maintain a certain weight, so if you have a player who is constantly over wieght (Eddy Curry, Oliver Miller, and Sean May as examples), then you could void their contract or take away a bonus depending on how you work things out.

also, putting is exclusions to high risk activities (like motorcycles- Jay Williams and Monta Ellis have both ahd issues with that, Jay Williams' was more tragic of course) is fair, because you have an investment and want to reduce risks.

But voiding it because they got injured for work related incident? Not cool.

DerekRE_3
05-28-2010, 02:52 PM
I know that Gerald Wallace has incentives in his contract that have to do with a certain # of games played. Besides that I don't think any player would agree to terms like the OP brought up.

However, if the team can get doctors to say that an injury is so severe that it was career ending and forced the player to retire, then the salary I think is covered by insurance and the team can have the salary taken off the team's cap figure.

THE MTL
05-28-2010, 03:00 PM
NBA injuries are work-related. Which means these guys are injured while ON-THE-JOB; therefore there contract should cover them and not be voided.

If any of you, injured yourselves at work....yall be ready to sue in a heartbeat!

Hawkeye15
05-28-2010, 03:13 PM
So let's say a player where to have a career ending injury with 5 years and $50 million left on his contract. He was also on the T-Wolves. Say....An Al Jefferson type of player, would you still have the same opinion? :eyebrow:

well, my opinion is, a contract like in the NFL, where you paid a certain guaranteed amount up front, and then have the right to release them, is better. So yes, if Jefferson had 4 years, $40 million left, and had a career ending injury, it would be great if the Wolves could just release him and get out from under his contract.

Hawkeye15
05-28-2010, 03:14 PM
So let's say a player where to have a career ending injury with 5 years and $50 million left on his contract. He was also on the T-Wolves. Say....An Al Jefferson type of player, would you still have the same opinion? :eyebrow:

haha, I left out the "'nt". My bad. I meant "teams AREN"T crippled". my b

xwashableclothx
05-28-2010, 03:34 PM
I believe that if a player gets hurt off the court that there are things teams can do with the contract. I remember hearing something about it when Monta Ellis got hurt on a motorcycle or scooter. But its not like players go out and try to get hurt to collect money, they all want to play the game.

Most contracts are insured to a high percentage. Example; Redd missed over 40 straight games and his contract is 80% insured so the Bucks only have to pay 20% of his contract till he returns and the NBA will cover the other 80%.

The only thing that sucks is his full contract still counts on the salary cap, so maybe if a player is going to miss 40+ games in a season a team should be awarded more cap space or something. But players shouldn't lose there contracts for getting hurt while playing.

njnets
05-28-2010, 03:46 PM
as others have said, they work ON THE JOB when they get injured for the most part. so your trying to tell me that if a player gets injured on the court and its season ending, the franchise has the right to void the contract? that argument is beyond ridiculous.

if a player gets hurt off the court, however, like jay williams of the chicago bulls did by crashing his bike, its still up for argument. if a guy falls down the stairs and breaks his leg, he shouldn't be punished. its an accident that unfortunately happened and he was not doing anything dangerous. performing a dangerous activity like skiing or motorcycle riding however and getting injured should allow a franchise to void it.

to say that any injury should allow a franchise to cut a player for getting any injury is ridiculous. only injuries that happen off the court that are presumed dangerous should a franchise be able to void a contract.

C_Mund
05-28-2010, 04:26 PM
NBA injuries are work-related. Which means these guys are injured while ON-THE-JOB; therefore there contract should cover them and not be voided.

If any of you, injured yourselves at work....yall be ready to sue in a heartbeat!

Just playing devil's advocate here...
but isn't a contract a 2-way binding system? The team is contractually obligated to pay the player regardless. But under the same reasoning doesn't that mean that the player would also have to play regardless of whether they're injured or not, so long as they're getting paid? I'm not saying that it should be that way, just that the logic is flawed. There has to be SOME way that the team -and fans- don't get screwed.
Also, if I were hurt on the job, my bosses would have the tools to replace me for at least the duration of my injury. The NBA doesn't allow temporary relaxation of the cap so teams can put together a full roster in case of a high-salary player getting hurt.
..I think these are the issues that could be looked at by the league.

IAmKira
05-28-2010, 06:52 PM
well, my opinion is, a contract like in the NFL, where you paid a certain guaranteed amount up front, and then have the right to release them, is better. So yes, if Jefferson had 4 years, $40 million left, and had a career ending injury, it would be great if the Wolves could just release him and get out from under his contract.

Like i said, most contract have insurance policies. Cuttino Mobly for example has what i believe 70-80% of his contract covered by insurance. If you think about it, thats a lot and that contract can come to good use when you're trading for players.

DitchDat
05-29-2010, 06:32 AM
I think if you give a certain player a contract, but he keeps getting re-injured and the team has invested a lot of money in that player, contracts should be voidable, I'm sorry. Or maybe have the contracts partially guaranteed + pro-rated amounts per game played ?
You cannot tell me that a guy like Gilbert Arenas - who quite frankly NEVER plays - and is collecting big $$$ is helping his team in ANY way :s
This guy will probably never be fully healthy, while happily collecting his cash, crippling his team.

DitchDat
10-07-2010, 05:43 AM
... or at least make it that you lose salary for every day that you miss?

Hurt these Carlos Boozer/Eddy Curry/Kenyon Martin/Gilbert Arenas types in their pockets !

daleja424
10-07-2010, 09:02 AM
I would freakin LOVE the contracts to be like the NFL, designed to make sure teams aren't crippled by injuries. But good luck getting that by the player's union

I actually like it the way it is. It punishes teams that sign guys to terible contracts.