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View Full Version : Which Player Needs A Ring the Most?



Swashcuff
04-22-2010, 05:21 PM
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/playo...3fid%3d5125480


QUESTION: Which player needs a championship ring most?

CHRIS BROUSSARD: While everyone's talking about how much LeBron James needs to win a title this year, there are several players who need a ring more than he does. He's young; he'll have plenty more opportunities. But Dirk Nowitzki, Steve Nash, Jason Kidd -- just to name a few -- don't have much time left. Of everyone in these playoffs, though, no one needs to win the championship this season more than Vince Carter does.

RIC BUCHER: Of all the older players out there, I'd agree that Vince needs a ring the most, with Ron Artest right behind him, since they are on teams that reached the Finals without them and then proclaimed themselves better after acquiring them. But don't kid yourself: LeBron needs this ring more than any of the guys you listed. Sure, this probably isn't his last shot at one, but the table couldn't be better set than right now.

CB: I definitely see where you're coming from with LeBron. If he doesn't win it all this year, some will no doubt begin to wonder if he has what it takes to get it done. The number of Skip Baylesses out there will multiply. But the fact is he has several more years left to win a ring. He could fail this year and still win four or five rings, and then no one would harp on 2010.

RB: You toss off the prospect of four or five titles pretty casually. Granted, we've never seen someone as gifted as LeBron, and Michael Jordan didn't win his first ring until he was 27. But if LeBron is like every other prep-to-pro, the clock is based on NBA minutes not calendar age. By that standard, he has six to eight years of prime time left. Five titles in eight years? Four in six? He's the healthiest superstar in this race, by far. He's had a supporting cast good enough to post the best regular-season record two years running. If not now, what makes you think a deluge is coming?

CB: I don't want to downplay the importance of LeBron taking the throne this year, but time is clearly on his side. Vince is probably in his last year of high-level play (and he's slipped quite a bit already). Vince, arguably the greatest dunker of all-time, is an icon. Yet he's widely viewed, pardon my frankness, as a loser, as a guy who's all flash and no substance. Though he's one of the most talented players we've seen, right now he's not even in the Hall of Fame conversation. If he can help Orlando win a ring, and by help I mean be their first- or second-leading scorer (16, 17 ppg at least), he can change all that.

RB: What has to be considered isn't just what would be gained by winning a ring but what would be lost if the player didn't. For Vince, Artest, Kidd or Dirk, we're not going to look at them differently if they don't win. For Vince, in particular, it will simply be confirmation of what we've come to believe. That's where this is different for LeBron. If he doesn't win a ring this year, with the larcenous addition of Antawn Jamison to a motivated-by-wounded-pride Shaq and a battle-tested nucleus, there's no getting around it: The perception of LeBron is going to change. I dare say there may even be a backlash from those who made him a two-time MVP and feel they've been let down. And how exactly do the Cavs get better than they are right now?

CB: You're talking like LeBron's got Magic's Showtime cast around him. On paper, the Los Angeles Lakers still appear to be the superior team. Certainly, L.A. has the top starting five -- and a heck of a sixth man in Lamar Odom -- in the league. So if LeBron gets to the Finals and loses to the Lakers in a tough six or seven games, I don't know how much of a hit he takes. (He'll take some hit but maybe a small one.) Now if the Cavs lose to Orlando in the conference finals, it will indeed be damaging to his rep. But if the Lakers right themselves, there will be no shame in losing to them. Having the best regular-season record doesn't mean you're the best team.

RB: Enough with the excuses. No one said anything about the Showtime Lakers or any other all-time great team. It's just time to stop talking about the Cavs and LeBron as if he's trying to carry St. Vincent-St. Mary to a championship. Overall, I'd say the Lakers are a more talented team, too. But it's about perception: the Lakers and Kobe Bryant are banged up and worn down trying to make a third trip to the Finals. The Cavs are healthy with a full head of steam. The fact is, Nash won back-to-back MVP awards while failing to get a ring and he's still wearing that scarlet letter. I'm not saying it's right or fair, it's just the way it is. Create an expectation and then fail to fill it and there is hell to pay -- as LeBron will find out if he isn't hugging the Larry O'Brien trophy in June.

CB: There are two key facts that favor my argument: 1) the Lakers are the most talented team in the league (as you admitted); and 2) LeBron has plenty of time left to win titles.

Vince, on the other hand, has this year and that's it. And he has something to lose too: If he doesn't get the Orlando Magic to the Finals, they will have taken a step back, and he will be blamed, since he's the main new piece. He's currently perceived as a massive underachiever who doesn't have the inner strength it takes to win. Failure this year will confirm that in the eyes of many and turn his great career into a mere blip in time. He won't be remembered for anything but dunking.

RB: One fact that completely undercuts your argument: Vince is not the best player on the team with the best record in the league, nor has he ever been. Nor has he ever been the best player in the league, sniffed an MVP award or made winning a championship his sole mission. He's a fantastic, entertaining talent, but his career has already been defined. Winning a ring now isn't going to make him Kevin Garnett; at best, he'll join the ranks of Antoine Walker, Gary Payton, Odom and Pau Gasol. No one is asking pointed questions if Vince doesn't win a ring; we already know why. But LeBron? Everyone already has him surpassing Kobe and approaching Michael -- how does that continue to be justified if he still doesn't have a ring? Your answer seems to be, repeatedly: He has time. My answer: It's time.

CB: Are you serious?! Vince will get far more props for winning a ring this year than Walker or Payton did with the Heat. They were bit players through and through with Miami (and Payton's huge series-turning shot in 2006's Game 3 doesn't change that). Vince, on the other hand, was brought in to put the Magic over the top, to replace one of their most valuable players (Hedo Turkoglu), to be their closer. If he plays the role he's supposed to and they win a ring, the perception of him changes dramatically. People will look back at his past teams and see that he never played on anything close to a title contender. They'll have to say that the one time he played on a team with title talent, he delivered the goods. Paul Pierce was viewed in much the same way that Vince is now before he won a ring. Now, Pierce is a probable Hall of Famer. Vince's legacy will grow greatly if he wins it all this year.

Chris Broussard and Ric Bucher are senior writers for ESPN The Magazine.

What do you guys think?

Swashcuff
04-22-2010, 05:23 PM
I'll personally put my man A.I. at the TOP of this list!

JNA17
04-22-2010, 05:23 PM
jason kidd deserves one, he's just picking the wrong teams :(

Toenail Clipper
04-22-2010, 05:24 PM
Tracy McGrady, Vince Carter, Jason Kidd, Allen Iverson.
No, LeBron doesn't need a ring.

Fire&Ice2&33
04-22-2010, 05:24 PM
My boy T-Mac

sep11ie
04-22-2010, 05:39 PM
**** T-Mac, why does he deserve a ring?

Ray_R
04-22-2010, 05:41 PM
There are more than i thought LBJ justneeds a ring to shut up the haters im just scared he going to become a total douche adter he gets it. I think Nashdeserves a ring as much as J Kidd does.

Iodine
04-22-2010, 05:46 PM
Grant hill>thread
if only he wasn't on the suns

ldc62
04-22-2010, 05:54 PM
People chose Tmac??? This is "which player needs a ring" not "which player needs to make it to the 2nd round". Tmac hasn't done **** in the playoffs. Also I agree that Vince doesn't need a ring that much because everyone knows him for his dunks and the most talent ever wasted on a human being. I have to choose Nash or Lebron.

Slimsim
04-22-2010, 05:55 PM
Patrick Ewing

heathonater
04-22-2010, 05:58 PM
i agree that lebron needs a ring, but his time for winning a title is still open. players like dirk and vc need to win the ring now though because they dont have many years left to do it. therefore, dirk and vc need the ring more this year than a player like lebron entering into his prime.

mikantsass
04-22-2010, 05:59 PM
People who need a ring IN THIS YEAR"S PLAYOFFS:

Vince, JKidd, Nash, Hill, Bibby, Stackhouse, Artest, Camby

mikantsass
04-22-2010, 05:59 PM
Forgot Dirk

Bruno
04-22-2010, 06:02 PM
Why would Carter need a ring any more than Jason Kidd or Steve Nash or Dirk? He was never in MVP talks like how they were but he is still one of the remaining 90's players who still has game. IMO they all need a ring equally.

But LeBron needs it the most, but for a different reason. He needs a ring because everyone thinks hes the best now. The 90's guys need rings because theyre running out of time.

Oaktown R8ers
04-22-2010, 06:03 PM
People who need a ring IN THIS YEAR"S PLAYOFFS:

Vince, JKidd, Nash, Hill, Bibby, Stackhouse, Artest, Camby

Oh hes getting it :)

Geargo Wallace
04-22-2010, 06:08 PM
Vince and TMac don't deserve ****. They entertained us for a few years...

jackdawson
04-22-2010, 06:16 PM
Allen Iverson tops the list easily. Then Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Vince Carter, Grant Hill etc etc.

xbrackattackx
04-22-2010, 08:20 PM
Allen Iverson tops the list easily. Then Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Vince Carter, Grant Hill etc etc.

x2

Swashcuff
04-22-2010, 08:34 PM
x2

x3

ManRam
04-22-2010, 08:40 PM
Vince has the most on the line this year. The Magic got to the Finals without him last year, and with a worse supporting cast by far. If he doesn't lead the Magic to a better result, his neck is on the line.

ryder78c
04-22-2010, 08:46 PM
A.I.,Marcus Camby,Grant hill,Jason Kidd,i dont like dirk so no dirk doesnt hahaaaa

LBJ Needs one to shut peoples mouths

Swashcuff
04-22-2010, 08:48 PM
Vince has the most on the line this year. The Magic got to the Finals without him last year, and with a worse supporting cast by far. If he doesn't lead the Magic to a better result, his neck is on the line.

Same can be said about Artest, I mean he was suppose to make the Lakers a better play off team.

thescore53
04-22-2010, 09:02 PM
chris bosh

thescore53
04-22-2010, 09:03 PM
jarret jack atleast deserves playoffs

cubyfan07
04-22-2010, 09:25 PM
Kobe. He only has four and needs one more for each finger on his hand.

thescore53
04-22-2010, 09:31 PM
Kobe. He only has four and needs one more for each finger on his hand.

no he need 6 more, he has 10 fingers

xbrackattackx
04-22-2010, 09:33 PM
Kobe is the only answer.

IRUAM #21
04-22-2010, 09:33 PM
Dirk, Kidd, and Hill are all good choices.

ManRam
04-22-2010, 09:33 PM
Same can be said about Artest, I mean he was suppose to make the Lakers a better play off team.

True. But Vince's legacy has more at stake. Artest isn't a HOF player, and probably won't be with a ring this year. Vince is borderline. A ring and he'll probably get it.

xbrackattackx
04-22-2010, 09:36 PM
True. But Vince's legacy has more at stake. Artest isn't a HOF player, and probably won't be with a ring this year. Vince is borderline. A ring and he'll probably get it.

I agree about Vince, He maybe has next season, to be his last chance as a big contributor after that he will be a good Grant Hill type player.

cubyfan07
04-22-2010, 09:37 PM
no he need 6 more, he has 10 fingers

...on his hand. <-- That is singular.

xbrackattackx
04-22-2010, 09:39 PM
...on his hand. <-- That is singular.

Your boy Noah was butter tonight. Had a great of bunch little plays that mattered.

Swashcuff
04-22-2010, 09:41 PM
True. But Vince's legacy has more at stake. Artest isn't a HOF player, and probably won't be with a ring this year. Vince is borderline. A ring and he'll probably get it.

True dat.

ManRam
04-22-2010, 09:49 PM
I agree about Vince, He maybe has next season, to be his last chance as a big contributor after that he will be a good Grant Hill type player.

I think if we don't win it this year, and Vince isn't amazing the first half of next season, we'll trade him for something. He'll have value as a big expiring.

xbrackattackx
04-22-2010, 09:52 PM
I think if we don't win it this year, and Vince isn't amazing the first half of next season, we'll trade him for something. He'll have value as a big expiring.

Oh Snap, I forgot I was thinking he signed 3 year, nicee!

thescore53
04-22-2010, 09:56 PM
...on his hand. <-- That is singular.

than dont watch

iFYouSeekAmy
04-22-2010, 11:52 PM
than dont watch

..Yeah.

OC Knights #11
04-23-2010, 12:33 AM
Kurt Thomas and Jerry Stackhouse

THE MTL
04-23-2010, 12:47 AM
Lebron James really does need a ring. Looking at his past, his current team, and his free agency situation, and the state of the Cavs. HE NEEDS IT ALOT!

However, I do believe that Allen Iverson needs a ring the MOST! Allen Iverson needs a ring to save his legacy. Right now, AI's legacy is shot. Severely damaged! Ppl look at AL an laugh when this man was the best player in the NBA a few years ago. As well as being perhaps the best little man to ever play the game.

OC Knights #11
04-23-2010, 12:47 AM
George Karl

OC Knights #11
04-23-2010, 12:49 AM
Lebron James really does need a ring. Looking at his past, his current team, and his free agency situation, and the state of the Cavs. HE NEEDS IT ALOT!

However, I do believe that Allen Iverson needs a ring the MOST! Allen Iverson needs a ring to save his legacy. Right now, AI's legacy is shot. Severely damaged! Ppl look at AL an laugh when this man was the best player in the NBA a few years ago. As well as being perhaps the best little man to ever play the game.

No, i would say Cleveland needs it more than Lebron James.

ryder78c
04-23-2010, 12:52 AM
Toronto isn't a good city period. I mean it's cool and
all, but they have so many damn canadians, I think the most out of any city in the US.

^ thats the funniest thing i ever read....is that a Quote from Joakim Noah?

OC Knights i Agree George Karl Needs a Ring the Most.....He Was My Favorite Coach When He Was The Sonics Coach

braveniler58
04-23-2010, 12:58 AM
Nash and Hill. Nash is, I think, the only MVP to never make the Finals (or one of two). He needs that ring.

Chronz
04-23-2010, 01:45 AM
Vinces career does a Pierce 180 with a chip, hes already helped make the Magic better but it wont be appreciated without a chip.

still1ballin
04-23-2010, 02:04 AM
Kosta Kofas

alencp3
04-23-2010, 09:26 AM
Lebron needs the most. With rings there is nothing that can stop him from being the GOAT.

arkanian215
04-23-2010, 10:12 AM
Kidd has a solid team this year. Nice energy guys in Najera and Beaubois. Some shooters out there like always this time including himself. He has bigs that now can match up with lots of teams. The straw chewer puts them over the top and Jet will do his thing.

GrumpyOldMan
04-23-2010, 10:23 AM
I'll pick an owner...Mark Cuban. It's time to put up or shut up.

Mikeleafs
04-23-2010, 10:31 AM
JKidd by far! He paid his dues!!

Vince and Tmac dont deserve a ring!!

Brooklyn Mets
04-23-2010, 10:35 AM
Grant Hill

Mr.Chi-Town
04-23-2010, 10:47 AM
nash,kidd,hill and AI

Raph12
04-23-2010, 01:33 PM
People who need a ring IN THIS YEAR"S PLAYOFFS:

Vince, JKidd, Nash, Hill, Bibby, Stackhouse, Artest, Camby

Yeah but only Vince and Artest have a legit shot at it IMO.