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JordansBulls
04-02-2010, 05:20 PM
http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Cavaliers.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Celtics.png 1:00 PM EDT ABC


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Spurs.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Lakers.png 3:30 PM EDT ABC


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Rockets.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Pacers.png 6:00 PM EDT


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Grizzlies.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Magic.png 6:00 PM EDT


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Nets.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Wizards.png 6:00 PM EDT


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Warriors.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Raptors.png 6:00 PM EDT


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Timberwolves.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Thunder.png 7:00 PM EDT


http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Knicks.png @ http://i402.photobucket.com/albums/pp109/KHinrich12/Team%20Logos/Clippers.png 9:30 PM EDT




Cleveland @ Boston 1:00 PM ABC
San Antonio @ LA Lakers 3:30 PM ABC
Houston @ Indiana 6:00 PM
Memphis @ Orlando 6:00 PM
New Jersey @ Washington 6:00 PM
Golden State @ Toronto 6:00 PM
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City 7:00 PM
New York @ LA Clippers 9:30 PM

Jays Claw
04-02-2010, 05:32 PM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

Jays Claw
04-02-2010, 05:34 PM
Why did you create this thread so early?

ManRam
04-02-2010, 06:31 PM
Getting ahead of our selves?

td0tsfinest
04-02-2010, 07:11 PM
Why did you create this thread so early?

and why is it so different compared to the other ones?

jimbobjarree
04-02-2010, 08:12 PM
lets go Clipps

PC
04-02-2010, 08:47 PM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

Ryan328
04-02-2010, 11:10 PM
Cleveland @ Boston 1:00 PM
San Antonio @ LA Lakers 3:30 PM
Houston @ Indiana 6:00 PM
Memphis @ Orlando 6:00 PM
New Jersey @ Washington 6:00 PM
Golden State @ Toronto 6:00 PM
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City 7:00 PM
New York @ LA Clippers 9:30 PM

Avenged
04-02-2010, 11:36 PM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

stawka
04-02-2010, 11:47 PM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

Raph12
04-03-2010, 02:34 AM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

Sadds The Gr8
04-03-2010, 02:52 AM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

_KB24_
04-03-2010, 03:05 AM
I love ABC Sundays!

Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

J-Relo
04-03-2010, 04:41 AM
Cleveland @ Boston 1:00 PM ABC
San Antonio @ LA Lakers 3:30 PM ABC
Houston @ Indiana 6:00 PM
Memphis @ Orlando 6:00 PM
New Jersey @ Washington 6:00 PM
Golden State @ Toronto 6:00 PM
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City 7:00 PM
New York @ LA Clippers 9:30 PM

FaM0us Skins
04-03-2010, 08:01 PM
Cleveland @ Boston 1:00 PM ABC
San Antonio @ LA Lakers 3:30 PM ABC
Houston @ Indiana 6:00 PM
Memphis @ Orlando 6:00 PM
New Jersey @ Washington 6:00 PM
Golden State @ Toronto 6:00 PM
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City 7:00 PM
New York @ LA Clippers 9:30 PM

bigsams50
04-03-2010, 08:09 PM
Cleveland @ Boston
San Antonio @ LA Lakers
Houston @ Indiana
Memphis @ Orlando
New Jersey @ Washington
Golden State @ Toronto
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City
New York @ LA Clippers

thedfactor
04-04-2010, 12:51 AM
Cleveland @ Boston 1:00 PM ABC
San Antonio @ LA Lakers 3:30 PM ABC
Houston @ Indiana 6:00 PM
Memphis @ Orlando 6:00 PM
New Jersey @ Washington 6:00 PM
Golden State @ Toronto 6:00 PM
Minnesota @ Oklahoma City 7:00 PM
New York @ LA Clippers 9:30 PM

JordansBulls
04-04-2010, 11:19 AM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/odds;_ylt=AksbunYLpC4CUzIpRugjq0i8vLYF

The Cavs are a 2 point favorite in Boston today?
:speechless:

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 12:39 PM
Statement game for the Celtics today. They have to show the rest of the NBA that they are still a force to be reckoned with.

Jays Claw
04-04-2010, 12:53 PM
The Cavaliers will win in Boston without much difficulty.

*Superman*
04-04-2010, 01:09 PM
Cavs/Boston good game!...Atleast I'm hoping Bos puts up a fight.

PBG
04-04-2010, 01:13 PM
anyone know what shoes lebrons wearing? lol them ***** is nice!

roshan3ai
04-04-2010, 01:18 PM
Cleveland @ Boston

San Antonio @ LA Lakers

Houston @ Indiana

Memphis @ Orlando

New Jersey @ Washington

Golden State @ Toronto

Minnesota @ Oklahoma City

New York @ LA Clippers

*Superman*
04-04-2010, 01:22 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/odds;_ylt=AksbunYLpC4CUzIpRugjq0i8vLYF

The Cavs are a 2 point favorite in Boston today?
:speechless:

How do you read that crap?

*Superman*
04-04-2010, 01:22 PM
Lakers and SAS should be a good game too.

arkanian215
04-04-2010, 02:01 PM
Nets 4-3 in the last 7. :clap: let's make it 5-3 against the wiz at 6.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 02:11 PM
Great game by Boston so far.

Jahari Kavi
04-04-2010, 02:11 PM
cavs end the half in pathetic fashion....mike brown shows his "genius" by doing a hack-a-perkins and then decides it would be a good idea to let rondo dribble up the floor with 2 seconds without applying any pressure.......Bron has been bad today, as well.........Celtics looking like they care out there.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 02:29 PM
anyone know what shoes lebrons wearing? lol them ***** is nice!

There just lime green LeBron VII's

http://www.sneakerobsession.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/air-max-lebron-vii-dunkman.jpg

They are hella nice!

ManRam
04-04-2010, 02:33 PM
The Nets are not the worst team in the league. Injuries, youth, bad coaching and a lack of confidence crippled them earlier on. Now that they are healthy, and now that the young guys are finally getting it going, they are showing they aren't record-breaking terrible, not even close.

LeBron is having a bad game. Something that you can probably count the amount of times that has happened all year on one hand. And no coincidence, they are getting destroyed. Their coach is also a complete idiot. Mike Brown will never have another head coaching job after Cleveland. Without LeBron, he's nothing.

Jays Claw
04-04-2010, 02:35 PM
I was completely wrong. :facepalm:

LEBRON_KING_23
04-04-2010, 02:36 PM
Lol Cavs are not trying at all. They want Celtics to win this so they get 3rd seed. Thats why they are missing free throws on purpose and lebron is missing 3s on purpose

m26555
04-04-2010, 02:39 PM
Lol Cavs are not trying at all. They want Celtics to win this so they get 3rd seed. Thats why they are missing free throws on purpose and lebron is missing 3s on purpose
Oh boy...you CANNOT be serious.

Boston is sending a message to Cleveland; period.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 02:40 PM
Celts pounding the Cavs.....now if the Celtics started dancing that would be funny.



Still enough time to come back though.

m26555
04-04-2010, 02:41 PM
Anyone who doesn't think Cleveland wants this game is delusional. The Cavaliers DO NOT want to give Boston ANY momentum heading into the playoffs. They want to win this one just as much as the Celtics do; they're just getting their ***** handed to them.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 02:42 PM
Lol Cavs are not trying at all. They want Celtics to win this so they get 3rd seed. Thats why they are missing free throws on purpose and lebron is missing 3s on purpose

No. They might not be playing 100%, but they aren't throwing it. If they didn't want to win, they'd just rest their starters more than they are. They aren't missing FTs on purpose. Their bench doesn't have a ton of minutes. They clearly are trying. Again, definitely not playing like it's a playoff game, but they aren't losing on purpose.

LeBron missing threes on purpose?? Haha. I usually am pro Cleveland/LeBron, but come on.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 02:42 PM
Boston making a statement today. Great game so far by the C's. Pierce is doing a fantastic job defending Lebron.

m26555
04-04-2010, 02:43 PM
No. They might not be playing 100%, but they aren't throwing it. If they didn't want to win, they'd just rest their starters more than they are. They aren't missing FTs on purpose. Their bench doesn't have a ton of minutes. They clearly are trying. Again, definitely not playing like it's a playoff game, but they aren't losing on purpose.

LeBron missing threes on purpose?? Haha. I usually am pro Cleveland/LeBron, but come on.
They are certainly playing 100%.

avrpatsfan
04-04-2010, 02:49 PM
Lol Cavs are not trying at all. They want Celtics to win this so they get 3rd seed. Thats why they are missing free throws on purpose and lebron is missing 3s on purpose

Sure :rolleyes:

avrpatsfan
04-04-2010, 02:50 PM
They are certainly playing 100%.

Agreed. Why would the Cavs throw a game? This game was supposed to be a message to the Celtics that they aren't good enough. Not so much so far.

m26555
04-04-2010, 02:51 PM
Sure :rolleyes:
I guess the fact that Cleveland is missing free throws has nothing to do with the fact that they are the worst free throw shooting team in the league. Nope; they're just throwing the game. :laugh:

Avenged
04-04-2010, 02:52 PM
Lol Cavs are not trying at all. They want Celtics to win this so they get 3rd seed. Thats why they are missing free throws on purpose and lebron is missing 3s on purpose

The only words I agree from in your post are "Lol".

ManRam
04-04-2010, 02:57 PM
They are certainly playing 100%.

They really aren't. They aren't tanking it, but they aren't playing at a playoff caliber level. It's showing the most on defense. LeBron is having a bad game, which doesn't help, but the intensity is just not there.

I don't think they are losing and missing shots on purpose at all...but they have HCA locked up essentially, and why not conserve some energy.

Again, just look at their defensive intensity. That's where they aren't playing 100%.

Teeboy1487
04-04-2010, 02:58 PM
I seriously doubt the cavs are throwing the game. If that's the case, then it makes them look scared and weak. That's not a mentality you want to have. To be a championship winning team, you can beat anyone on any given night.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:00 PM
They really aren't. They aren't tanking it, but they aren't playing at a playoff caliber level. It's showing the most on defense. LeBron is having a bad game, which doesn't help, but the intensity is just not there.

I don't think they are losing and missing shots on purpose at all...but they have HCA locked up essentially, and why not conserve some energy.

Again, just look at their defensive intensity. That's where they aren't playing 100%.
Sorry, but I don't buy that. I refuse to believe that they aren't giving their all against a team that could easily knock them out of the playoffs. Again, why give Boston any momentum/confidence? The Celtics are just severely out-playing the Cavaliers; plain and simple.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:00 PM
The Cavs are gonna make a comeback here.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:01 PM
Its obvious the Celtics are making all the hustle plays and Cavs aren't and thats because the Cavs are playing but not at their highest level here if they were you would see both Green and Red diving for balls and all you see is Green guess why?

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:02 PM
The Cavs are gonna make a comeback here.
I doubt it. Every time they start to inch closer, the Celtics go on another run.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:02 PM
Of course the Cavs want to win this but from what it looks like they're going at about 75%.

They need one more win and their regular season is over. The Celts are battling to avoid facing us in the 2nd round. I wouldn't entirely mind losing to the Celts, they're fighting to avoid us in the 2nd round and i'd rather face the Hawks then than the Celts, so I don't think a loss is a terrible thing.

It's one of those nights where LeBron is off, and the Celts cannot miss. I'd love to see them shoot this well over a 7 game series, because it's just not gonna happen.

It's one (pretty insignificant) game for the Cavs, i'm not worried in the slightest.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:03 PM
Its obvious the Celtics are making all the hustle plays and Cavs aren't and thats because the Cavs are playing but not at their highest level here if they were you would see both Green and Red diving for balls and all you see is Green guess why?
Yeah; I guess the fact that one player on Boston made a couple of dives DEFINITELY means Cleveland isn't giving it their all. :rolleyes:

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:05 PM
Oh and btw don't listen to that LEBRON_KING_23 guy... He's clearly a troll.

I have an idea who it is as well :rolleyes:

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:05 PM
Considering how great Cleveland has been lately, this is a great win if Boston can hang on. The Celtics are a lot more active in this game and are doing a good job on the defensive end. Ray Allen is shooting lights out today. This is a bigger game for Boston because of their recent struggles and it shows that they still have a lot of fight left in them. They are going to be a difficult out come playoff time.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:05 PM
Yeah; I guess the fact that one player on Boston made a couple of dives DEFINITELY means Cleveland isn't giving it their all. :rolleyes:

No their trying their just not giving it that extra hustle that you would see in the playoffs or in an important game.....Ive seen it from the Celtics this game though. Celtics just want this game more and it shows a bit, their no urgency from the Cavs and none is needed they can afford to lose and they know that.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:09 PM
Clearly a foul. I love how LeBron complains about EVERY call...

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:10 PM
Clearly a foul. I love how LeBron complains about EVERY call...

I can understand him complaining but I dont see how Big Z could argue it.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:11 PM
I can understand him complaining but I dont see how Big Z could argue it.
I don't understand how James could argue that vehemently; he didn't even have a good angle.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:13 PM
This has been a pretty poorly officiated 4th... First Parker gets called for a blocking foul when he was clearly in front of Pierce and now there's some ridiculous call with KG.

All the fouls being called on the Celts are genuine fouls. LeBron is attacking the basket like a man possessed, so don't give me all that phantom foul BS.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:15 PM
I guess Cleveland still isn't trying? :laugh2:

Boston has to finish strong here.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:16 PM
LeBron is listed at 250 lbs. Announcers say he weighs 265. Pretty sure he weighs about 280.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:16 PM
Wow... Cavs (LeBron in particular) are really trying to make a game of it.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:16 PM
LeBron is listed at 250 lbs. Announcers say he weighs 265. Pretty sure he weighs about 280.
I don't know man...280 is pretty big.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:17 PM
This has been a pretty poorly officiated 4th... First Parker gets called for a blocking foul when he was clearly in front of Pierce and now there's some ridiculous call with KG.

All the fouls being called on the Celts are genuine fouls. LeBron is attacking the basket like a man possessed, so don't give me all that phantom foul BS.

Well Idk if your posting this as a response to the foul called on Big Z but that was clearly a foul....I will agree the officiating is a bit off but every game is like that the Cavs are just not getting the calls their way today which is expected the Celtics are at home.

Tha Truth
04-04-2010, 03:17 PM
I'm loving this Cavs-Celtics game.

It has a playoff feel to it.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:18 PM
Lebron James is just too good.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:19 PM
I don't understand why closing out games has been so difficult for Boston.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:20 PM
The Celtics are coming apart again, they just seem like they can't sustain for a full 48. I think the age of their core players plays a large part in that. They can't keep up their defensive intensity like they did a few yrs. ago.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 03:22 PM
They've picked up their defense.

chonbon
04-04-2010, 03:22 PM
I'm loving this Cavs-Celtics game.

It has a playoff feel to it.

agreed

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:23 PM
I don't know man...280 is pretty big.

He's huge, he's been steamrolling Perkins (280) all quarter

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:23 PM
Ray Allen needs to get more touches here.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:23 PM
Wow, the C's looked great for 3 quarters, but are looking terrible in the 4th.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:24 PM
I wouldn't say steamrolling. Perkins rocked him with a screen earlier.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:24 PM
Well Idk if your posting this as a response to the foul called on Big Z but that was clearly a foul....I will agree the officiating is a bit off but every game is like that the Cavs are just not getting the calls their way today which is expected the Celtics are at home.

Yeah, fair enough. I haven't agreed on a lot of those calls on both sides, so i'm not being a homer as well.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:25 PM
The playoffs are gonna be wild this year.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:26 PM
I'd say LeBron is about 260-265 max. I really don't think he's pushing 270-280, that's a lot for a center let alone the most athletic player in the league.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:27 PM
Dumb dumb move by Rondo. Just get back on defense.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:27 PM
Boston only has 5 pts. in the 4th quarter, wow.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:27 PM
Total meltdown by the Celtics..

avrpatsfan
04-04-2010, 03:27 PM
Man we're screwed. That should have been a foul. Ugh if we lose this I will be very very pissed.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:28 PM
Where is the guy that said that the Cavs didn't want this game? lol.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:28 PM
The ball needs to be in Allen's hands; I don't know why they've gone away from him.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:31 PM
Where is the guy that said that the Cavs didn't want this game? lol.
lmao

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-04-2010, 03:31 PM
james can't shoot but he sure can drive to the basket like a maniac

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:31 PM
LeBron has been clutch as hell... 16 in the 4th.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:33 PM
LeBron has been clutch as hell... 16 in the 4th.

Im surprised it's not more. All he has to do is drive to the basket and it's an automatic 2 points.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:33 PM
Allen is the man.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:33 PM
Make that 18, the guy is incredible.

But just because he hasn't been in the position to hit game winning buzzer beaters, he's isn't considered clutch... :rolleyes:

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:33 PM
Celtics are playing so stupid. GET THE BALL TO RAY!

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:34 PM
The C's should have kept running plays for Ray, he's hot today. 33 pts on only 17 shots, now that's efficiency.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:34 PM
Celtics are playing so stupid. GET THE BALL TO RAY!
Yep; been saying it all along. The guy has been money all game, but he has hardly touched the ball in the fourth.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:34 PM
HUUUUUGGGGGEEEE shot from Allen... Damn, lol.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:35 PM
And they finally did... And he hits a 3. He shouldve been getting the ball the whole 4th quarter.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:36 PM
Tony Allen you idiot...what a dumbass play.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:36 PM
Make that 18, the guy is incredible.

But just because he hasn't been in the position to hit game winning buzzer beaters, he's isn't considered clutch... :rolleyes:

So if they lose the game that means he is "Clutch" in the game?

Is it possible to be "Clutch" if you lose?

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:37 PM
LeBron has missed WAY too many free throws to consider this a "clutch" performance.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:37 PM
And missed free throws in closing seconds is one of my arguments.... :pity:

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:37 PM
Wow, they shouldn't have given Cleveland that 3.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:38 PM
So if they lose the game that means he is "Clutch" in the game?

Is it possible to be "Clutch" if you lose?

Yes, it is, since basketball isn't an individual sport. He's basically had an entire games worth of stats in the 4th, he's been clutch.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:38 PM
Wow, they shouldn't have given Cleveland that 3.

couldn't they review it?

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:38 PM
That was just a tough call for the refs. Basically, Tony should have never grabbed the ball that soon.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:39 PM
couldn't they review it?
I don't know if that's reviewable.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:39 PM
Ray Allen is money in the clutch.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:39 PM
Yes, it is, since basketball isn't an individual sport. He's basically had an entire games worth of stats in the 4th, he's been clutch.

Oh so the comeback had nothing to do with his TEAM playing great D? Ok I get he gets all the praise as being "Clutch" for the comeback but his team gets all the blame if they lose? :rolleyes:

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-04-2010, 03:39 PM
lebron clutch lol

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:40 PM
couldn't they review it?

Yeah. I thought they should have.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:40 PM
Oh so the comeback had nothing to do with his TEAM playing great D? Ok I get he gets all the praise as being "Clutch" for the comeback but his team gets all the blame if they lose?

Who said it hasn't? The entire team has been clutch this quarter, where did anyone say otherwise? But you can be clutch if you lose, because one player does not determine a win or loss.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:41 PM
Come on, let's see some overtime.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:41 PM
What's up with Pierce nowadays, he used to take games over in the 4th? Is he hurt?

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:42 PM
Oh so the comeback had nothing to do with his TEAM playing great D? Ok I get he gets all the praise as being "Clutch" for the comeback but his team gets all the blame if they lose? :rolleyes:

Come on man, Lebron is clutch.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:42 PM
Who said it hasn't? The entire team has been clutch this quarter, where did anyone say otherwise? But you can be clutch if you lose, because one player does not determine a win or loss.

IDK Buzzer beating shots do and thats 1 player taking them. :shrug:

Slimsim
04-04-2010, 03:43 PM
LBJ missed 2 FT.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:44 PM
Lebron is ****ing up at the line.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:44 PM
The only real flaw I see with Lebron is missing free throws in tight games. He has to sure that part of his game up.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:44 PM
I wanna see Lebron hit a winner

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:45 PM
Nevermind. :sigh:

Slimsim
04-04-2010, 03:45 PM
Kobe > LBJ

chonbon
04-04-2010, 03:45 PM
wtf wat a dumb shot

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:45 PM
Lebron trying to be the hero, should've just drove to the basket, would've got the 2 points.

chonbon
04-04-2010, 03:46 PM
^ yep, n most likely the foul

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:47 PM
And what in the world was LeBron doing in Boston's huddle? Grow the hell up.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:47 PM
Alright LBJ might get another chance.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:47 PM
Bron has been great in the 4th, but that was a bad shot. He also missed some critical free throws.

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 03:48 PM
Great performance by the Cavs until the last minute. They choked on the line.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:48 PM
That's how you hit free throws in the clutch.

Slimsim
04-04-2010, 03:48 PM
Garnett talking **** to LBJ

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:48 PM
LOL at KG being all proud of himself for being a minor contributor on a team that barely won despite having a 22 point lead in the 4th

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:49 PM
I friggin love KG.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:49 PM
IDK Buzzer beating shots do and thats 1 player taking them. :shrug:

Nothing influenced the result in the first 47 minutes, 59 seconds?

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:50 PM
LOL at KG being all proud of himself for being a minor contributor on a team that barely won despite having a 22 point lead in the 4th
:rolleyes:

Because 17 points, eight boards, and great defense is a "minor contribution."

At least he can hit his free throws.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:50 PM
That was a great game.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:50 PM
CLE vs BOS will be a good one if they face in the playoffs.

Slimsim
04-04-2010, 03:50 PM
If I'm a Celtics fan i would be pissed. They had this game since the beginning of the 3rd quarter

thedfactor
04-04-2010, 03:50 PM
KG is wack

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:51 PM
:rolleyes:

Because 17 points, eight boards, and great defense is a "minor contribution."

At least he can hit his free throws.

He was the 3rd best player on his team today. Allen carried them Perkins dominated defensively. Yet Garnett acts like he carries this team, and has acted like that despite being the 4th or 5th best player on the team for the past 2 years.


Cool, he hit his free throws. If he's as great as he thinks he is, he should have been the one scoring 20 in the 4th instead of LeBron, and not letting this game get close.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:51 PM
He was the 3rd best player on his team today. Allen carried them Perkins dominated defensively. Yet Garnett acts like he carries this team, and has acted like that despite being the 4th or 5th best player on the team for the past 2 years.
Again, because 19 points, eight rebounds, great defense, and clutch free throws is a "minor contribution." Fourth or fifth best player on his team? lol...I guess that's why Boston was knocked out of the second round without him last season, right? You're also forgetting that Garnett is playing on one leg.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 03:51 PM
LeBron gets calls because he can get to the paint so easily, and you can't stop him half the time unless you foul him. Most calls he gets are 100% deserving.

Great game. The Cavs were lackluster for 3 quarters, especially on defense. Moral victory. They almost came back from 20 down verse a top 4 team in the East. Not that they need reassurance of their greatness.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:52 PM
Nothing influenced the result in the first 47 minutes, 59 seconds?

Ok well then how do you consider the whole 4th quarter as "Clutch" why not just go by players season stats and consider them "Clutch" by their stats per 48.

Lakersfan2483
04-04-2010, 03:52 PM
I hope Boston and Cleveland matchup in a 7 game series as that would be a great matchup. Great matchups on both sides, trash talking, great players, just all around great entertainment.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:53 PM
I hope Boston and Cleveland matchup in a 7 game series as that would be a great matchup. Great matchups on both sides, trash talking, great players, just all around great entertainment.
Hell yes.

Like I said; the playoffs are gonna be crazy this season.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:54 PM
Again, because 17 points, eight rebounds, great defense, and clutch free throws is a "minor contribution." Fourth or fifth best player on his team? lol...I guess that's why Boston was knocked out of the second round without him last season, right?

Yes, most teams would be knocked out against a great team without their 4th or 5th best player. See the Suns with Joe Johnson, the Lakers and Karl Malone, etc. He is the 4th or 5th best player on that team. Pierce, Rondo, and Perkins are clearly better at this point, and Allen might be.

And again, if he's as good as he thinks he is, then he should have been stopping LeBron instead of getting run over play after play and letting it get close.


Ok well then how do you consider the whole 4th quarter as "Clutch" why not just go by players season stats and consider them "Clutch" by their stats per 48.

All I said is that individuals can't DECIDE a game, no matter how clutch. They can greatly influence it, as LeBron did today, but no individual decides a game entirely by himself. Even a last second shot requires a good pass, often a good screen, etc.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 03:55 PM
Nothing influenced the result in the first 47 minutes, 59 seconds?

In Laker fans' eyes, nothing is clutch but buzzer beaters...which is absolutely laughable. LeBron is the best clutch player in the league. No player can dominate the entire 4th quarter like he can. He's made so many close games not close, rendering buzzer beaters unnecessary. Amazing 4th quarter from him. Too bad he couldn't hit a three for the life of him today.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:55 PM
Yes, most teams would be knocked out against a great team without their 4th or 5th best player. See the Suns with Joe Johnson, the Lakers and Karl Malone, etc. He is the 4th or 5th best player on that team. Pierce, Rondo, and Perkins are clearly better at this point, and Allen might be.

And again, if he's as good as he thinks he is, then he should have been stopping LeBron instead of getting run over play after play and letting it get close.
You are absolutely delusional if you think he's their fourth or fifth best player. There is a reason why Boston's defense absolutely collapsed without KG in the postseason. And PERKINS is better at this point? And CLEARLY? Are you SERIOUS? Stop talking before you make yourself look like an even bigger fool.

Teeboy1487
04-04-2010, 03:55 PM
Please don't hate me for this my fellow laker fans, but I can't deny it anymore. Lebron is the best player in this league. Very objective post from me because I'm a huge Kobe fan. I still say kobe in better in the clutch and Kobe is the clutchest player in this league but Lebron is just better. I'm giving this guy the credit he deserves and I hope we see them in the finals if we make it.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 03:55 PM
LeBron gets calls because he can get to the paint so easily, and you can't stop him half the time unless you foul him. Most calls he gets are 100% deserving.

Great game. The Cavs were lackluster for 3 quarters, especially on defense. Moral victory. They almost came back from 20 down verse a top 4 team in the East. Not that they need reassurance of their greatness.

The thing is he's gotten so use to that, that when they do get a clean block on him he cries for the foul. Yes, sort of like Kobe (before anyone else tries to get me with that) :laugh2:

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:56 PM
Please don't ate me for this mmy fellow laker fans, I can't deny it anymore. Lebron is the best player in this league. Very objective post from me because I'm a huge Kobe fan. I still say kobe in better in the clutch and Kobe is the clutchest player in this league but Lebron is just better. I giving this guy the credit he deserves and I hope we see them in the finals if we make it.
Kobe can actually make his free throws. I'll take him any day of the week over LeBron.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:56 PM
In Laker fans' eyes, nothing is clutch but buzzer beaters...which is absolutely laughable. LeBron is the best clutch player in the league. No player can dominate the entire 4th quarter like he can. He's made so many close games not close, rendering buzzer beaters unnecessary. Amazing 4th quarter from him. Too bad he couldn't hit a three for the life of him today.

Or a free throw. He was incredible but he messed up at the line today.

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:57 PM
In Laker fans' eyes, nothing is clutch but buzzer beaters...which is absolutely laughable. LeBron is the best clutch player in the league. No player can dominate the entire 4th quarter like he can. He's made so many close games not close, rendering buzzer beaters unnecessary. Amazing 4th quarter from him. Too bad he couldn't hit a three for the life of him today.
:laugh:

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 03:58 PM
Ok well then how do you consider the whole 4th quarter as "Clutch" why not just go by players season stats and consider them "Clutch" by their stats per 48.

Are you being serious? :facepalm:

You're another one of those "people" (I don't wanna get another infraction) that sees clutch play as how many buzzer beaters you can hit. Not the play that leads up to that.

LeBron clearly wasn't clutch at all. Scoring 20 points in the fourth quarter whilst leading your team back from 22 points down isn't clutch at all, is it...

:rolleyes:

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 03:58 PM
In Laker fans' eyes, nothing is clutch but buzzer beaters...which is absolutely laughable. LeBron is the best clutch player in the league. No player can dominate the entire 4th quarter like he can. He's made so many close games not close, rendering buzzer beaters unnecessary. Amazing 4th quarter from him. Too bad he couldn't hit a three for the life of him today.

He dominated the whole 4th and still lost. Some player dominate the whole game. What people have done change the standards for Lebron and say this is where Clutch starts and choose to look at his 4th a a whole and refuse to see his constant missed FTs or big shots when the game is tight.....but no he had a big 4th so that makes him "CLUTCH". :rolleyes:

Baller1
04-04-2010, 03:59 PM
:laugh:

Why is that funny?

m26555
04-04-2010, 03:59 PM
Are you being serious? :facepalm:

You're another one of those "people" (I don't wanna get another infraction) that sees clutch play as how many buzzer beaters you can hit. Not the play that leads up to that.

LeBron clearly wasn't clutch at all. Scoring 20 points in the fourth quarter whilst leading your team back from 22 points down isn't clutch at all, is it...

:rolleyes:
His fourth quarter performance was great, but I'm sorry; you cannot miss THAT many free throws and take an ill-advised three like that and still call it a "clutch" performance.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 03:59 PM
You are absolutely delusional if you think he's their fourth or fifth best player. There is a reason why Boston's defense absolutely collapsed without KG in the postseason. And PERKINS is better at this point? And CLEARLY? Are you SERIOUS? Stop talking before you make yourself look like an even bigger fool.

Yes, their defense collapsed because they lost a starter. San Antonio's defense would collapse if they lost George Hill, I guess he's a top 3 player on the Spurs, right? Dallas's would collapse if they lost Haywood, Butler, or Kidd, so I guess all of those guys are better than Dirk, right? Completely illogical argument, the fact that losing a STARTER hurt their defense does not make that starter one of their 3 best players. It makes him one of their 5 best. You know, one of the STARTERS.

And Perkins is a better rebounder, better defender at his position, and equally efficient scorer. Other than that, Garnett is much better.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:00 PM
Are you being serious? :facepalm:

You're another one of those "people" (I don't wanna get another infraction) that sees clutch play as how many buzzer beaters you can hit. Not the play that leads up to that.

LeBron clearly wasn't clutch at all. Scoring 20 points in the fourth quarter whilst leading your team back from 22 points down isn't clutch at all, is it...

:rolleyes:

His TEAM played GREAT D and allowed them to come back....LEBRON MISSED HUGE FREE THROWS THAT could of won his TEAM the game, HIS TEAM DID NOT miss those FREE THROWS he did.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:00 PM
Why is that funny?
Because he isn't. I cannot believe I have to defend this point when the guy just missed EIGHT free throws today, with a number of those misses coming late. Oh, and let's not forget that idiotic three he took.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:01 PM
On another note, great win for the Celts. They outplayed us for 3 quarters, but then completely fell off in the 4th.

I would be worried if I was a Celtics fan... Not only did they nearly surrender a 22 point lead, but they lost 13 times when leading by 10 or more points in a game. To me that's a sign of their age and fatigue setting in as the games come down to the line.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:01 PM
And please lets not act like this is the First time Lebron misses HUGE FREE THROWS cause he has done it at a consistant basis.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:02 PM
Yes, their defense collapsed because they lost a starter. San Antonio's defense would collapse if they lost George Hill, I guess he's a top 3 player on the Spurs, right? Dallas's would collapse if they lost Haywood, Butler, or Kidd, so I guess all of those guys are better than Dirk, right? Completely illogical argument, the fact that losing a STARTER hurt their defense does not make that starter one of their 3 best players. It makes him one of their 5 best. You know, one of the STARTERS.
Dallas' defense would collapse if they lost Haywood or Kidd? San Antonio's defense would collapse if they lost Hill? LMAO. Did any of those three players win Defensive Player of the Year? My God; I feel like I'm talking to a 10-year old. Try telling someone who knows a thing or two about basketball that Perkins is "clearly better" than Garnett, and they'd laugh in your face, and probably spit on you to boot.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:02 PM
He dominated the whole 4th and still lost. Some player dominate the whole game. What people have done change the standards for Lebron and say this is where Clutch starts and choose to look at his 4th a a whole and refuse to see his constant missed FTs or big shots when the game is tight.....but no he had a big 4th so that makes him "CLUTCH". :rolleyes:

He led the team back from 22 points down...

Are you seriously this stupid or has someone hacked your account and they're just playing around.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:02 PM
And please lets not act like this is the First time Lebron misses HUGE FREE THROWS cause he has done it at a consistant basis.

He's a poor free throw shooter shooting free throws. If Shaq can't hit a 3 down the stretch, that doesn't mean he's not a clutch player, it means he's a crappy 3 point shooter.

Teeboy1487
04-04-2010, 04:02 PM
Kobe can actually make his free throws. I'll take him any day of the week over LeBron. Yes I would too but Lebron is just better than him at this point in their careers. Still, if I needed a closer, I would choose Kobe 10 out of 10. Kobe would have hit that open three and he would have ended Boston but Lebron just have that "it" factor. He can take over a game when he pleases. Kobe can't do that like he use too. However, Kobe is clutcher.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 04:03 PM
Because he isn't. I cannot believe I have to defend this point when the guy just missed EIGHT free throws today, with a number of those misses coming late. Oh, and let's not forget that idiotic three he took.

He had an "off night" in terms of clutch, and still scored 20. That pretty much proves my point in itself.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:03 PM
He's a poor free throw shooter shooting free throws. If Shaq can't hit a 3 down the stretch, that doesn't mean he's not a clutch player, it means he's a crappy 3 point shooter.

Shaq sucked at FTs but he HIT THEM WHEN THEY NEEDED THEM and nobody can deny that. Now thats "Clutch".

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:03 PM
Lebron's weaknesses are his FT shooting and somewhat of his outside shot. He couldn't hit FT's because that's not the strongest part of his game. How many layups did he miss in 4th? not many, if any.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:03 PM
He had an "off night" in terms of clutch, and still scored 20. That pretty much proves my point in itself.
Yeah; I mean, it's not like we've seen James miss key free throws down the stretch plenty of times before or anything.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:04 PM
Lebron's weaknesses are his FT shooting and somewhat of his outside shot. He couldn't hit FT's because that's not the strongest part of his game. How many layups did he miss in 4th? not many, if any.
He is a 77% free throw shooter. That is not a "weakness."

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:06 PM
He is a 77% free throw shooter. That is not a "weakness."

Considering the fact that he excels at mostly every thing in basketball, his FT's are his "weakness".

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:06 PM
The funny thing is if LeBron hadn't led his team back to lead by a point with a couple of minutes left after being 22 down people wouldn't be calling him out like this...

If the Celts had coasted to a 20 point win, people wouldn't be talking about missed free throws. But because he scored 20 in the 4th and pulled his team back into it, he's not clutch because he missed some free throws and pulled up for a three.

Ok...

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:07 PM
The funny thing is if LeBron hadn't led his team back to lead by a point with a couple of minutes left after being 22 down people wouldn't be calling him out like this...

If the Celts had coasted to a 20 point win, people wouldn't be talking about missed free throws. But because he scored 20 in the 4th and pulled his team back into it, he's not clutch because he missed some free throws and pulled up for a three.

Ok...

Once again give all the credit to Lebron on the comeback it had nothing to do with the GREAT TEAM D right?

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:07 PM
He's a poor free throw shooter shooting free throws. If Shaq can't hit a 3 down the stretch, that doesn't mean he's not a clutch player, it means he's a crappy 3 point shooter.

Exactly.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 04:07 PM
Yeah; I mean, it's not like we've seen James miss key free throws down the stretch plenty of times before or anything.

Oh, so therefore we're supposed to completely disregard the fact that he's completely taken over a huge amount of games in the 4th?

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:07 PM
Considering the fact that he excels at mostly every thing in basketball, his FT's are his "weakness".
Anyone who shoots 77% from the line is considered to be a solid free throw shooter. Why is LeBron the exception in this case? He has trouble hitting his free throws in big spots; plain and simple.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:07 PM
On another note KG is such a douche bag... In his mind he still probably thinks he's the best PF in the league.

Dude is washed up and still runs his mouth like a little *****.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:08 PM
Oh, so therefore we're supposed to completely disregard the fact that he's completely taken over a huge amount of games in the 4th?
Did I say he wasn't big in fourth quarters? All I'm saying is that saying he is the league's most clutch player is ridiculous.

Shady66
04-04-2010, 04:08 PM
the Lebron haters on this site are ridiculous.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:08 PM
On another note KG is such a douche bag... In his mind he still probably thinks he's the best PF in the league.

Dude is washed up and still runs his mouth like a little *****.
Hahaha.

I guess James never runs his mouth.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:08 PM
The funny thing is if LeBron hadn't led his team back to lead by a point with a couple of minutes left after being 22 down people wouldn't be calling him out like this...

If the Celts had coasted to a 20 point win, people wouldn't be talking about missed free throws. But because he scored 20 in the 4th and pulled his team back into it, he's not clutch because he missed some free throws and pulled up for a three.

Ok...

That 3 was pretty stupid to take, you have to agree.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:09 PM
He's a poor free throw shooter shooting free throws. If Shaq can't hit a 3 down the stretch, that doesn't mean he's not a clutch player, it means he's a crappy 3 point shooter.


Exactly.

So you guys are saying he's a crappy FT shooter at 77%, Or are you saying he is a crappy FT shooter only when its close and you need every FT? :shrug:

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:09 PM
the Lebron haters on this site are ridiculous.
No; the LeBron lovers are ridiculous. The LeBron "haters" are simply objective.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:10 PM
So you guys are saying he's a crappy FT shooter at 77%, Or are you saying he is a crappy FT shooter only when its close and you need every FT? :shrug:
I don't think either of them know what they're saying, to be honest.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:11 PM
Shaq sucked at FTs but he HIT THEM WHEN THEY NEEDED THEM and nobody can deny that. Now thats "Clutch".

That's not what I said, try reading my post.

Also:

Game 6 against Sac in 2001-2002: Missed 2 of 4 within 5 minutes left, out some of the game to keep him off the line
Game 7: Missed 1 of 2 down the line and a 12 foot jumper to let it into OT

2003-2004 against Detroit

Went 27-55 from the line in the finals. I think they needed those.

2004-2005 as member of Heat

50-106 at the line in the playoffs. 22-49 against Detroit. They lost to Detroit.




That statement is completely false.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-04-2010, 04:11 PM
Lebron 0-9 from downtown

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:12 PM
That's not what I said, try reading my post.

Also:

Game 6 against Sac in 2001-2002: Missed 2 of 4 within 5 minutes left, out some of the game to keep him off the line
Game 7: Missed 1 of 2 down the line and a 12 foot jumper to let it into OT

2003-2004 against Detroit

Went 27-55 from the line in the finals. I think they needed those.

2004-2005 as member of Heat

50-106 at the line in the playoffs. 22-49 against Detroit. They lost to Detroit.




That statement is completely false.
You're so good at pointing out "false" statements that others make, yet you fail to back up your own points with logical arguments (i.e. saying LeBron is a "poor" free throw shooter when he shoots 77%).

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:13 PM
That's not what I said, try reading my post.

Also:

Game 6 against Sac in 2001-2002: Missed 2 of 4 within 5 minutes left, out some of the game to keep him off the line
Game 7: Missed 1 of 2 down the line and a 12 foot jumper to let it into OT

2003-2004 against Detroit

Went 27-55 from the line in the finals. I think they needed those.

2004-2005 as member of Heat

50-106 at the line in the playoffs. 22-49 against Detroit. They lost to Detroit.




That statement is completely false.

Shaq was a career 53% FT if all you can come up with is a few games where he didn't considering ther was hack-a-shaq id say thats pretty clutch wouldn't you I mean all that says is that more often than not he would hit them.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:14 PM
So you guys are saying he's a crappy FT shooter at 77%, Or are you saying he is a crappy FT shooter only when its close and you need every FT? :shrug:

77% is poor for a star at that position. Compare him to the guys he should be compared to (Pierce, Durant, Kobe, Granger, etc.), yes, it is poor. He went 8-11 (73%, 9-11 would have been 81%) in the 4th today, and you guys are calling that a poor performance, so clearly you agree with that being poor.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:14 PM
Anyone who shoots 77% from the line is considered to be a solid free throw shooter. Why is LeBron the exception in this case? He has trouble hitting his free throws in big spots; plain and simple.

You took his post out of context... LeBron is so good, 77% free throw shooting has to be a weakness because he is so good at everything else. If he was as good at shooting free throws as he is everything else he'd be a 90% free throw shooter, but compared to the rest of his game that is considered a weakness.

He has trouble hitting his free throws in big spots? What about when the Cavs were down by 1 against the Heat with about 3 seconds left and he hit two free throws to give the Cavs a win?

Why are you trying to use one game to argue he's a poor big time free throw shooter?

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:14 PM
77% is poor for a star at that position. Compare him to the guys he should be compared to (Pierce, Durant, Kobe, Granger, etc.), yes, it is poor. He went 8-11 (73%, 9-11 would have been 81%) in the 4th today, and you guys are calling that a poor performance, so clearly you agree with that being poor.
:facepalm:

You're hopeless. No one is comparing him to other "stars" at the position; this is about LeBron James.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:15 PM
Shaq was a career 53% FT if all you can come up with is a few games where he didn't considering ther was hack-a-shaq id say thats pretty clutch wouldn't you I mean all that says is that more often than not he would hit them.

I came up with the first elimination games and close games readily available to me through ESPN's game logs.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:15 PM
:facepalm:

You're hopeless.

Interesting. Instead of contesting facts I posted, you post something that in no way disputes them. Likely because you can't. They're facts.

Baller1
04-04-2010, 04:16 PM
No; the LeBron lovers are ridiculous. The LeBron "haters" are simply objective.

The "Lebron haters" are objective?

:laugh2:

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:16 PM
You took his post out of context... LeBron is so good, 77% free throw shooting has to be a weakness because he is so good at everything else. If he was as good at shooting free throws as he is everything else he'd be a 90% free throw shooter, but compared to the rest of his game that is considered a weakness.

He has trouble hitting his free throws in big spots? What about when the Cavs were down by 1 against the Heat with about 3 seconds left and he hit two free throws to give the Cavs a win?

Why are you trying to use one game to argue he's a poor big time free throw shooter?
And why are you using one game to argue that he's a good big time free throw shooter?

It is simply homeristic to deny that LeBron has trouble hitting free throws in big spots. It has always plagued him throughout his career.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:17 PM
Interesting. Instead of contesting facts I posted, you post something that in no way disputes them. Likely because you can't. They're facts.
They're dumb "facts." Again, this has NOTHING to do with LeBron's peers but with LeBron himself. Why you brought Pierce and Durant into the argument is beyond me.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:18 PM
The "Lebron haters" are objective?

:laugh2:
I hate Kobe Bryant; HATE him with a passion, but I can be objective and say that he is probably the most clutch player in the league. LeBron? No, because he isn't.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:18 PM
77% is poor for a star at that position. Compare him to the guys he should be compared to (Pierce, Durant, Kobe, Granger, etc.), yes, it is poor. He went 8-11 (73%, 9-11 would have been 81%) in the 4th today, and you guys are calling that a poor performance, so clearly you agree with that being poor.

Kobe shoots 81% from the FT line thats not a HUGE difference. :shrug:

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:21 PM
And why are you using one game to argue that he's a good big time free throw shooter?

It is simply homeristic to deny that LeBron has trouble hitting free throws in big spots. It has always plagued him throughout his career.

It's not like Lebron has missed ALL his FT's in big moments. He isn't shooting 77% in big moments, he's shooting that percentage throughout the game. He does have trouble hitting his FT's but not all come in big moments. You're making it seem like he shoots perfect from the line except when it's in the finals minutes of a game.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:22 PM
It's not like Lebron has missed ALL his FT's in big moments. He isn't shooting 77% in big moments, he's shooting that percentage throughout the game. He does have trouble hitting his FT's but not all come in big moments. You're making it seem like he shoots perfect from the line except when it's in the finals minutes of a game.
I'm not making it seem like that at all. :shrug:

I'm just saying that he isn't a poor enough free throw shooter where you can essentially use that as an excuse for him missing big free throws down the stretch.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:22 PM
And why are you using one game to argue that he's a good big time free throw shooter?

It is simply homeristic to deny that LeBron has trouble hitting free throws in big spots. It has always plagued him throughout his career.

Go back and look at all of my posts in this thread. Please show me at any point that I argued LeBron is a good "big time" free throw shooter?

I argued he doesn't struggle at the free throw line any more so than he does during the game. He is averaged at the line for the first three quarters and he's average at the line in the 4th quarter. Simple.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:23 PM
Kobe shoots 81% from the FT line thats not a HUGE difference. :shrug:

That's a huge difference. These guys easily shoot over 100 "clutch" FT's a season, and people are calling this performance by LeBron not clutch based on missed 2 free throws out of 4. If they shoot 200 "clutch" free throws a year, Bryant should make about 9 more, which is a big difference when people are judging LeBron on missing just 2.


They're dumb "facts." Again, this has NOTHING to do with LeBron's peers but with LeBron himself. Why you brought Pierce and Durant into the argument is beyond me.

It actually makes perfect sense. The word "poor" is completely relative. If LeBron shot 77% but his peers shot 40% from the line, he'd be an elite free throw shooter. If LeBron shot 77% from the line and his peers shot 100%, he'd be terrible. So yes, his peers are completely relevant in classifying his free throw shooting.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:24 PM
It's not like Lebron has missed ALL his FT's in big moments. He isn't shooting 77% in big moments, he's shooting that percentage throughout the game. He does have trouble hitting his FT's but not all come in big moments. You're making it seem like he shoots perfect from the line except when it's in the finals minutes of a game.

No your right he doesn't just miss in big moments. But players who are "Clutch" hit their FTs in those BIG MOMENTS and ive seen Lebron miss those FTs in big moments quite a few times.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:25 PM
It actually makes perfect sense. The word "poor" is completely relative. If LeBron shot 77% but his peers shot 40% from the line, he'd be an elite free throw shooter. If LeBron shot 77% from the line and his peers shot 100%, he'd be terrible. So yes, his peers are completely relevant in classifying his free throw shooting.
Again, why are we comparing LeBron to his peers? It is completely irrelevant. It doesn't matter what the players at his position are shooting. 77% is above league average from the free throw line, therefore, he is an above average shooter. I guess I should realize that I am arguing with a guy who said that Kendrick Perkins is "clearly better" than Kevin Garnett and call it a day.

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 04:26 PM
It hasn't been updated for a while, but here is proof that LeBron doesn't struggle at the line any more so than he does the rest of the game. If anything, he's a better free throw shooter in crunch time.

http://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM

He shoots 81% from the foul line in crunch time compared to 77% usually. He missed 2 big free throws down the stretch in this game. Please tell me m26555, now that you've seen the stats, why you still think LeBron struggles at making free throws in crunch time?

I'm all ears...

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:29 PM
Again, why are we comparing LeBron to his peers? It is completely irrelevant. It doesn't matter what the players at his position are shooting. 77% is above league average from the free throw line, therefore, he is an above average shooter. I guess I should realize that I am arguing with a guy who said that Kendrick Perkins is "clearly better" than Kevin Garnett and call it a day.

It's not irrelevant. You're saying LeBron is not usually a poor free throw shooter. The word poor is completely relative, it needs to be based on something. Shooting 77% in a league of 100% shooters would definitely be poor. If you can't understand that you can't determine whether something is poor without being given context of what poor is, you're beyond explaining things too.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:29 PM
It hasn't been updated for a while, but here is proof that LeBron doesn't struggle at the line any more so than he does the rest of the game. If anything, he's a better free throw shooter in crunch time.

http://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM

He shoots 81% from the foul line in crunch time compared to 77% usually. He missed 2 big free throws down the stretch in this game. Please tell me m26555, now that you've seen the stats, why you still think LeBron struggles at making free throws in crunch time?

I'm all ears...
This site defines clutch time as: "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points."

I want to see what he shoots when there are under two minutes remaining in the fourth quarter. That's what I'm referring to. How well does he shoot free throws when the game is on the line in the final minute or final seconds? There is a HUGE difference between having five minutes remaining and what I just mentioned.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:29 PM
It's not irrelevant. You're saying LeBron is not usually a poor free throw shooter. The word poor is completely relative, it needs to be based on something. Shooting 77% in a league of 100% shooters would definitely be poor.
Is the rest of the league full of 100% free throw shooters? Your argument is going nowhere. Just stop. I'm basing it on the fact that 77% is certainly above league average. Therefore, whatever you are attempting to argue holds absolutely no weight here.

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 04:30 PM
Walton back and looks a little rusty. Vujacic getting booed by the crowd after the wide open airball. Kobe simply "punishing Hill and Bogens down in the post".

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:30 PM
This site defines clutch time as: "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points."

I want to see what he shoots when there are under two minutes remaining in the fourth quarter. That's what I'm referring to. How well does he shoot free throws when the game is on the line in the final minute or final seconds? There is a HUGE difference between having five minutes remaining and what I just mentioned.

Yeah King, don't you know that his completely arbitrary definition of clutch is a lot more important than theirs is?

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:32 PM
Yeah King, don't you know that his completely arbitrary definition of clutch is a lot more important than theirs is?
:rolleyes:

Just like your arbitrary definition of "poor" free throw shooting?

Again, I cannot take someone who says that Kendrick Perkins is "clearly better" than Kevin Garnett seriously.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:33 PM
Yeah King, don't you know that his completely arbitrary definition of clutch is a lot more important than theirs is?

Well your definition of "Clutch" differs from theirs as well so why poke fun? You use the ENTIRE 4th. :rolleyes:

ManRam
04-04-2010, 04:34 PM
Does Kobe smile anymore? I miss the mini fro, happy kid version of Kobe. His intensity is admirable though.

m26555
04-04-2010, 04:34 PM
Well your definition of "Clutch" differs from theirs as well so why poke fun? You use the ENTIRE 4th.
The guy is the epitome of hypocrisy.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:35 PM
Well your definition of "Clutch" differs from theirs as well so why poke fun? You use the ENTIRE 4th. :rolleyes:

I don't use the entire 4th quarter. It varies from game to game, it's ridiculous to try to give clutch a set definition of parameters.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 04:36 PM
Well your definition of "Clutch" differs from theirs as well so why poke fun? You use the ENTIRE 4th. :rolleyes:

Would you rather have a guy that dominate the entire 4th, putting games out of hand or at least catching up, than a guy who plays well in the 4th, then tries to take over in the last minute or two?

I'd rather have the former. And anything in the 4th, in a close game, is clutch. The amount of games that LeBron has put out of reach before the last seconds this year is remarkable. That's what I'd rather have.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:36 PM
:rolleyes:

Just like your arbitrary definition of "poor" free throw shooting?

Again, I cannot take someone who says that Kendrick Perkins is "clearly better" than Kevin Garnett seriously.

OK, don't. But it's actually not like that at all, since he DID compare LeBron's free throw shooting then compared to otherwise.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 04:36 PM
LOL @ Ron Ron.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:36 PM
Ginobili getting called for a tech there is ****ing pathetic

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 04:37 PM
It's raining technicals in Staples.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:38 PM
I don't use the entire 4th quarter. It varies from game to game, it's ridiculous to try to give clutch a set definition of parameters.

Wow thats even worse if it varies. What you mean by "varies from game to game"? Cause I watch many games so "game to game" might have a different definition than yours. Like you hold different players to different standards?

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:39 PM
Would you rather have a guy that dominate the entire 4th, putting games out of hand or at least catching up, than a guy who plays well in the 4th, then tries to take over in the last minute or two?

I'd rather have the former. And anything in the 4th, in a close game, is clutch. The amount of games that LeBron has put out of reach before the last seconds this year is remarkable. That's what I'd rather have.

Being dominant and clutch are 2 different though people seem to relate the 2 but their 2 different things.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 04:42 PM
San Antonio is such an enigma. Losing to ****** team, beating good ones.

They still scare me come playoff time. Manu's showing he's still got it.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:42 PM
Would you rather have a guy that dominate the entire 4th, putting games out of hand or at least catching up, than a guy who plays well in the 4th, then tries to take over in the last minute or two?

I'd rather have the former. And anything in the 4th, in a close game, is clutch. The amount of games that LeBron has put out of reach before the last seconds this year is remarkable. That's what I'd rather have.

That's not really the argument. The argument is, Lebron isn't considered clutch by 2 posters because he can't make FT's.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:43 PM
That's not really the argument. The argument is, Lebron isn't considered clutch by 2 posters because he can't make FT's.

And the counter argument is "He dominated the 4th thus making him Clutch" so he's right on with the argument people are using.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-04-2010, 04:45 PM
OK we have 15 pages of lebron clutch arguments

can we agree that he isn't as clutch as kobe in the final minutes but he is a hell of a 4th quarter player

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 04:45 PM
Wow thats even worse if it varies. What you mean by "varies from game to game"? Cause I watch many games so "game to game" might have a different definition than yours. Like you hold different players to different standards?

If it's a tie point game with 3 minutes left, and a guy goes Tracy McGrady on the other team and scores 15 points in a minute, ending the game there, is that not clutch because it didn't happen in the last 2 minutes? Clutch isn't something that can be given defined parameters, it's something that you see in games.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:46 PM
OK we have 15 pages of lebron clutch arguments

can we agree that he isn't as clutch as kobe in the final minutes but he is a hell of a 4th quarter player

We could, but the argument doesn't include Kobe. lol :p

Jahari Kavi
04-04-2010, 04:47 PM
go to get something to eat and comeback to the Celtics almost gagged.....they will be done in the 2nd round...............Cavs appeared to be toying with them today...the trash talk at the end was hilarious

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:48 PM
And the counter argument is "He dominated the 4th thus making him Clutch" so he's right on with the argument people are using.

That's a legitimate argument. You're arguing buzzer beaters and what not. But Clutch as a whole is something different.

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:49 PM
If it's a tie point game with 3 minutes left, and a guy goes Tracy McGrady on the other team and scores 15 points in a minute, ending the game there, is that not clutch because it didn't happen in the last 2 minutes? Clutch isn't something that can be given defined parameters, it's something that you see in games.

Ok so missing FT in a situation where the game is close or a tied("a tie point game") doesn't matter because you dominated the 4th thus making you "Cltuch"?

Jahari Kavi
04-04-2010, 04:50 PM
CLE vs BOS will be a good one if they face in the playoffs.

no it wouldn't....magic and cavs is the matchup....Cs would be done in 5 games or less if they faced the Cavs

DCB/LAL
04-04-2010, 04:50 PM
That's a legitimate argument. You're arguing buzzer beaters and what not. But Clutch as a whole is something different.

Like I said Dominant and Clutch have 2 different meaning their 2 different words and people always try to relate the 2 as having the same meaning but they dont.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 04:51 PM
no it wouldn't....magic and cavs is the matchup....Cs would be done in 5 games or less if they faced the Cavs

Haha well if the games are anything close to today's, i'll say it would be a good series.

td0tsfinest
04-04-2010, 04:54 PM
did Kobe just compliment another man on the size of his booty?

Iodine
04-04-2010, 04:56 PM
My God Timmy and Manu are so sexy

Jahari Kavi
04-04-2010, 04:57 PM
Haha well if the games are anything close to today's, i'll say it would be a good series.

but they won't be, especially with Shaq and Varejo back...Cs have had trouble playing 4 quarters all season long...this is partly due to their age and their lack of depth.........I can't see them winning in Cleveland in the post season, so I could see them losing 2 in Cleveland and splitting in Boston and then losing in Cleveland in 5............but that won't matter, because the Magic will dispose of them in 5 or 6...........Magic and Cavs will be the series to watch :clap:

Joshtd1
04-04-2010, 05:11 PM
Im loving how Kobe keeps on shooting while Gasol has just been rolling offensively. I know Kobe can get it going any time and is the man, but damn. The way hes playing, I feel like they have a better chance of scoring with Gasol in the post, then Kobe and his contested jumpers/

Avenged
04-04-2010, 05:13 PM
Im loving how Kobe keeps on shooting while Gasol has just been rolling offensively. I know Kobe can get it going any time and is the man, but damn. The way hes playing, I feel like they have a better chance of scoring with Gasol in the post, then Kobe and his contested jumpers/

I agree. But what can you do? It's Kobe.

ManRam
04-04-2010, 05:20 PM
I agree. But what can you do? It's Kobe.

Ask him politely to pass it.

Avenged
04-04-2010, 05:25 PM
Ask him politely to pass it.

That wouldn't end well. ;)

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 05:34 PM
Can Gasol guard anyone?

ManRam
04-04-2010, 05:35 PM
That wouldn't end well. ;)

I know. Oh Kobe...

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 05:54 PM
You have to be kidding me Gasol........

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 05:55 PM
Damn, Ginobili is playing like a top 10 player in the league right now.

Since the all star break he has been UN-BE-LIEVABLE!

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 05:56 PM
Tim Duncan is really exposing Gasol's defensive frailties.

jetsfan28
04-04-2010, 05:58 PM
Ok so missing FT in a situation where the game is close or a tied("a tie point game") doesn't matter because you dominated the 4th thus making you "Cltuch"?

Show me where I said it doesn't matter. Sure it matters, but one shot doesn't supersede every other big shot hit in the game.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-04-2010, 05:58 PM
Tim Duncan is really exposing Gasol's defensive frailties.

And so as duncan, cause pau has 32 points

Iodine
04-04-2010, 06:02 PM
Since the all star break he has been UN-BE-LIEVABLE!

Kindof like you in bed

On a serious note Im thinking TP should come off the bench when he comes back, just because the chemistry is so good

_KB24_
04-04-2010, 06:04 PM
JVG: The Spurs have now beaten the Cavs, Magic, Boston, and the Lakers.....The only elite team they lost to is the Nets..... LOL!

iggypop123
04-04-2010, 06:06 PM
lakers shot 23% from 3. wow there is your reason for a loss

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 06:07 PM
Kindof like you in bed

On a serious note Im thinking TP should come off the bench when he comes back, just because the chemistry is so good

Oh stop it you, you're making me blush :o

TheKing23
04-04-2010, 06:08 PM
NEWSFLASH FOR KOBE: Gasol has scored 32 points and shot 13-20... Why have you taken 24 shots when you're having a bad shooting night?

Iodine
04-04-2010, 06:08 PM
Your making me ejaculate (hopes manrammer doesnt see me cheat on him)

Avenged
04-04-2010, 06:12 PM
lakers shot 23% from 3. wow there is your reason for a loss

The reason was that Kobe kept shooting the ball knowing he has having a bad shooting night and Gasol was playing great. Add the bench also.. Our bench sucks!