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redsox12
12-02-2009, 03:11 AM
According to Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports.com, the Braves have inked reliever Billy Wagner to a one-year, $7 million contract.
The deal also includes a vesting option for 2011. Atlanta is faced with losing both Mike Gonzalez and Rafael Soriano to free agency this winter, but the signing of Wagner should ease some of the pain. The 38-year-old southpaw managed an impressive 1.98 ERA, 1.02 WHIP, 26/8 K/BB ratio this past season and limited opponents to a .174 batting average in 15 appearances. As of now, it appears he'll serve as the Braves' closer in 2010. Dec. 2 - 1:31 am et

rotoworld

GA16Angels
12-02-2009, 03:32 AM
I don't like the deal for the Braves.

natepro
12-02-2009, 04:56 AM
Thank God. It's not like the Angels needed any bullpen help!

More-Than-Most
12-02-2009, 05:11 AM
To much money for a guy that has not closed in forever and is coming off of a huge injury plagued season. There were much better arms out there that the braves could have went after but they choose an aged injured guy who has been a problem in the clubhouse. They also have to give up drafts picks right?

zambo4president
12-02-2009, 05:26 AM
Oh god $7 Mill for Billy Wagner. What are you doin ATL?

ciaban
12-02-2009, 05:40 AM
Thank God. It's not like the Angels needed any bullpen help!

if the angels pen can get healthy then they wont need wagner, and anyway, wagner is 15 saves shy of 400 i never saw him being down with 2nd banana status unless he was desperate, that being said 7 mill is way to much, the braves over paid on this one

bmanjones
12-02-2009, 05:45 AM
i can't wait to watch that snake flop once again

billybuck
12-02-2009, 05:52 AM
The save is a vastly overrated stat. If he's gonna make $7 million a year, good for him. I don't think that he's worth it, though.

hawksd911
12-02-2009, 07:48 AM
Damn... little high but ill wait too see what hes got until i complain...

gfixer33
12-02-2009, 08:15 AM
is this true i haven't seen anything?

Tragedy
12-02-2009, 08:48 AM
Nice. Gave up nothing to get him and get the picks at the end. :clap:

Towelie
12-02-2009, 08:51 AM
Nice. Gave up nothing to get him and get the picks at the end. :clap:

Now, if only we get Matt Holliday over Bay then were looking at a nice first round this year.

Havoc Wreaker
12-02-2009, 08:51 AM
7 Million? Jesus

Towelie
12-02-2009, 08:56 AM
Also includes a $6.5MM option for 2011 that vests if Wagner finishes 50 games.

LudaChris520
12-02-2009, 09:01 AM
To much money for a guy that has not closed in forever and is coming off of a huge injury plagued season. There were much better arms out there that the braves could have went after but they choose an aged injured guy who has been a problem in the clubhouse. They also have to give up drafts picks right?

"Injury-plagued season" is not a fair term when you're talking about recovery from Tommy John. The dude took just as long as everyone else does to recover from the surgery, then dominated in every appearance without ever getting hurt again.

That said, $7 M is a little on the high side with someone of his age coming off injury. It's clear the Braves aren't comfortable signing Soriano or Gonzalez to a multi-year deal at their price tag, so this may be a good fit if maybe the Braves have their eyes on an internal option for closer a year or two from now.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 09:39 AM
"Injury-plagued season" is not a fair term when you're talking about recovery from Tommy John. The dude took just as long as everyone else does to recover from the surgery, then dominated in every appearance without ever getting hurt again.

That said, $7 M is a little on the high side with someone of his age coming off injury. It's clear the Braves aren't comfortable signing Soriano or Gonzalez to a multi-year deal at their price tag, so this may be a good fit if maybe the Braves have their eyes on an internal option for closer a year or two from now.

Thank you. "injury plagued" ? Nonsense.

I think the money is spot on. Both of the kids that left them will get more money and more years elsewhere. The Braves as usual have Plan B and Plan C coming through the system ready to go in '11 or '12. So in 4 years they will have saved a lot of money, and may have as good or better in the pen that are much younger and under control.

VRP723
12-02-2009, 10:05 AM
I wouldn't say anything about the money if he wasn't offered arbitration. The Braves pick at 19, which means they lose their first round pick along with paying him 7 million dollars.

DieHardColtsfan
12-02-2009, 10:13 AM
Safe to say they prob wont bring back Soriano or Gonzalez.

Young2Kinsler
12-02-2009, 10:57 AM
Oh god $7 Mill for Billy Wagner. What are you doin ATL?

It's called ruining the FA market.

thewupk
12-02-2009, 10:58 AM
I wouldn't say anything about the money if he wasn't offered arbitration. The Braves pick at 19, which means they lose their first round pick along with paying him 7 million dollars.

The pick doesn't mean much when the Braves are set to gain 4 picks in total with Soriano and Gonzo going elsewhere and possible 2 first rounders depending on who signs them.

Young2Kinsler
12-02-2009, 10:58 AM
Mike Gonzalez to Texas :)

Forty6and2
12-02-2009, 10:58 AM
Awesome move. According to Elias rankings there are only a handful of type a free agents ahead of Wagner. So outside of Holliday, Figgins, Lackey whom I dont see Atl signing I say this was a great signing.

Thanks for the 20th pick in the first round Atl.

thewupk
12-02-2009, 10:59 AM
It's called ruining the FA market.

Hoffman signed for 8 million. How is it ruining the market? Wagner is an elite closer. Tommy John doesn't change that.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 11:08 AM
It's a good move by the Braves, very good. It's good for the Sox to bag the Pick as well.

scottythegreat1
12-02-2009, 11:13 AM
7 million for Wagner is a lot. Now it means that closers are going to make a lot of money this offseason (agents will point to Wagner's deal).

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 11:15 AM
Wagner's arb number w/ the Sox was liable to be in $8-9M range. It's not a lot. The market was going to be strong anyway because you had less closers (and even elite set-up guys) then teams looking, don't blame that on the Braves.

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 11:54 AM
Had Boston offered him arbitration?

VRP723
12-02-2009, 11:56 AM
Had Boston offered him arbitration?

Yes

ccugrad1
12-02-2009, 11:57 AM
The reason I am not a big fan of this is that I believe if you look at the total deal if the 2nd year vests, 2 years, 13.5 million, the Braves could have signed Mike Gonzalez for that type of deal if for nothing else.

swagga81
12-02-2009, 11:58 AM
thats 2 draft picks for the sox right there

swagga81
12-02-2009, 11:59 AM
Safe to say they prob wont bring back Soriano or Gonzalez.
yeah prob one gose to boston the other gose to NY

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 12:00 PM
fanofclendennon: Had Boston offered him arbitration?

Yes

Proving once again that my Mets screwed up again.

swagga81
12-02-2009, 12:02 PM
Proving once again that my Mets screwed up again. hey you guys wannted to trade him

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 12:04 PM
Atlanta is taking a one year flyer out on a closer who still has a live arm. Cost them $7 mill and what, two draft picks?

Red Sox rented Wagner for two non-descript minor leaguers who will now be replaced by two decent draft picks.

The Mets are the only loser here.

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 12:06 PM
hey you guys wannted to trade him

The Mets had to either trade him for decent prospects or hold on to him, offer him arb and then collect the draft picks.

Instead they traded off the remainder of his contract in exchange for dead-weight prospects from the Red Sox, letting them get the decent draft picks the Mets could have had.

That's no way to run a baseball organization.

ESPNisBiased
12-02-2009, 12:06 PM
"Injury-plagued season" is not a fair term when you're talking about recovery from Tommy John. The dude took just as long as everyone else does to recover from the surgery, then dominated in every appearance without ever getting hurt again.

That said, $7 M is a little on the high side with someone of his age coming off injury. It's clear the Braves aren't comfortable signing Soriano or Gonzalez to a multi-year deal at their price tag, so this may be a good fit if maybe the Braves have their eyes on an internal option for closer a year or two from now.

I agree it may seem steep but with what Atl has coming up in their farm system and giving up 1 number 1 draft pick to get 2 number one picks is smart.

swagga81
12-02-2009, 12:06 PM
Atlanta is taking a one year flyer out on a closer who still has a live arm. Cost them $7 mill and what, two draft picks?

Red Sox rented Wagner for two non-descript minor leaguers who will now be replaced by two decent draft picks.

The Mets are the only loser here. i feel bad for ya guys Omar is the worst GM i ever seen and yet the wilpons dont fire him its sad

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 12:09 PM
i feel bad for ya guys Omar is the worst GM i ever seen and yet the wilpons dont fire him its sad

We can't be sure if moves like this are Omar's doing or the Wilpons. Probably the latter. The Wagner trade was all about saving dollars and nothing about improving the baseball team.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 12:27 PM
Atlanta is taking a one year flyer out on a closer who still has a live arm. Cost them $7 mill and what, two draft picks?

Red Sox rented Wagner for two non-descript minor leaguers who will now be replaced by two decent draft picks.

The Mets are the only loser here.

It doesn't cost them two draft picks, it costs them one. If they get an A type FA that is rated higher (a good bet if they do) then it'll be a 2nd rounder. The other one is a sandwich pick supplied by MLB, not Atlanta.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 12:29 PM
yeah prob one gose to boston the other gose to NY

I don't see the Sox getting involved. They need Holliday and Halladay, or Halladay, and some medium priced guys, but what do they need with a closer, unless Paps gets dealt between now and the summer deadline?

Beimel is a much better choice (cost/performance wise) if Paps and Bard stay put.

SB75
12-02-2009, 12:29 PM
Confused by this signing. Best I can figure this means the Braves think they'll get better picks from Gonzo/Sori than they will have to give up for Wagner.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 12:30 PM
The Braves usually have the goods in the system. Why pay a pile of years and cash, when you have 1-2 kids 1-2 years away?

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 12:32 PM
It doesn't cost them two draft picks, it costs them one. If they get an A type FA that is rated higher (a good bet if they do) then it'll be a 2nd rounder. The other one is a sandwich pick supplied by MLB, not Atlanta.

Thank-you.

jcjmwalt
12-02-2009, 01:14 PM
He still has alot to show and prove. His history isn't that great, but still ok

Super.
12-02-2009, 01:17 PM
Oh, why thank for the 1st rounder. Cha-Ching!

Tragedy
12-02-2009, 01:19 PM
He still has alot to show and prove. His history isn't that great, but still ok
What does that mean? He's one of the best closers of all time.

bringinwood
12-02-2009, 01:39 PM
Wags is one of the biggest characters of all time for sure...

People confuse his results with his attitude...

He isn't the same pitcher he was back in Houston when he was completely untouchable... But, he hasn't been that guy for a while... However, he is still one of the best closers of all time and is still amazingly efficient and productive...

I often believe he goes to places just to get revenge on the Phillies...

His career path is, either a coincidence, or ironic...

Even his stop in Boston last year was the most opportunistic place to beat the Phillies in the world series... Maybe i'm just reading too much into it...

maddiesbraves
12-02-2009, 01:39 PM
Thank you. "injury plagued" ? Nonsense.

I think the money is spot on. Both of the kids that left them will get more money and more years elsewhere. The Braves as usual have Plan B and Plan C coming through the system ready to go in '11 or '12. So in 4 years they will have saved a lot of money, and may have as good or better in the pen that are much younger and under control.

Thank you! We now have a true closer to go with one or the best starting rotations. Yes we gave up are first round pick at 20 but when Gonzo and Soriano sign else where we get are first round picks back!

fanofclendennon
12-02-2009, 02:04 PM
Wags is one of the biggest characters of all time for sure...

People confuse his results with his attitude...

He isn't the same pitcher he was back in Houston when he was completely untouchable... But, he hasn't been that guy for a while... However, he is still one of the best closers of all time and is still amazingly efficient and productive...

I often believe he goes to places just to get revenge on the Phillies...

His career path is, either a coincidence, or ironic...

Even his stop in Boston last year was the most opportunistic place to beat the Phillies in the world series... Maybe i'm just reading too much into it...

You're reading too much into it. The Mets were the only team willing to give him a 4 year deal since they were desperate for a top-notch closer in 2006 and he had no say in the matter when they traded him to the Red Sox in late August.

bagwell368
12-02-2009, 02:10 PM
What does that mean? He's one of the best closers of all time.

Yes sir, I have him in my top 5 RP's of all time, and the only lefty. He's great, and he's driven. Driven people often act like jerks in the moment, but not as a long term characteristic.

Pinstripe pride
12-02-2009, 02:17 PM
does this means he signs wth the marlins or nationals next year, and the other the year after that to complete his trip of the NL East?

Tragedy
12-02-2009, 02:25 PM
does this means he signs wth the marlins or nationals next year, and the other the year after that to complete his trip of the NL East?
He's like the Eric Hinske or Kevin Millar of the NL East.

dinopap
12-02-2009, 04:04 PM
thank you Billy, the A.T.L., and more thanks to Theo....

great p/u last year and now the sox will get the #20 pick and a supplemental pick--- cant believe the shrewd braves paid 7mil (plus an option) PLUS draft picks for him

this also gives the sox more assurance should they go after Type A FAs (hopefull not named scutawho!)

ty, billy

thewupk
12-02-2009, 04:20 PM
thank you Billy, the A.T.L., and more thanks to Theo....

great p/u last year and now the sox will get the #20 pick and a supplemental pick--- cant believe the shrewd braves paid 7mil (plus an option) PLUS draft picks for him

this also gives the sox more assurance should they go after Type A FAs (hopefull not named scutawho!)

ty, billy

Don't worry. We're getting 4 in return when Gonzalez and Soriano go elsewhere.

dinopap
12-02-2009, 04:34 PM
^^^ and then the braves will be left with just relying on wagner (for 7 frign' mil!) to close for a full season

very risky, but good luck--- love to see he and the braves win the east again (but its not going to happen)

did the braves outbid themselves?? they moved so fast on this...weird on many levels for the bravos

Zaunnie
12-02-2009, 04:38 PM
He's like the Eric Hinske or Kevin Millar of the NL East.

Hinske only has Baltimore left on his check list :)

thewupk
12-02-2009, 04:43 PM
^^^ and then the braves will be left with just relying on wagner (for 7 frign' mil!) to close for a full season

very risky, but good luck--- love to see he and the braves win the east again (but its not going to happen)

did the braves outbid themselves?? they moved so fast on this...weird on many levels for the bravos

7 million is less than what Hoffman got. And it's not like Wagner is Mike Hampton or anything. He had Tommy John which is nothing nowadays. The odds of him not pitching a full season is what would be strange.

dinopap
12-02-2009, 04:49 PM
^^who else was going after him? what were they offering? why did he sign so quickly? a bit strange is all im saying

again, ty and good luck

bringinwood
12-02-2009, 05:01 PM
The market was already set for relievers this season with Hoffman...

The Braves are a pretty solidly managed franchise from top to bottom....

He probably fell 3rd among free agent relievers this season behind Rafael Soriano and Jose Valverde....

Both of those guys are set to get multiyear deals...

With Hoffman getting a one year 8MM deal for next year it sort of put him and Wagner in a separate market for older closers... I think Soriano and Valverde will get more lucarative contracts than both even though they sort of jumped the gun...

thewupk
12-02-2009, 05:02 PM
^^who else was going after him? what were they offering? why did he sign so quickly? a bit strange is all im saying

again, ty and good luck

I don't have names but apparently 8 teams were after him, 7 since he got offered arbitration. And they had been in discussions for about two weeks or so it would seem. They just waited to see if he was offered arbitration or not. Seems like a deal had been in place for awhile.

VRP723
12-02-2009, 05:06 PM
It'll be interesting to see what the other closers on the market get, that was we can really judge if the Braves gave up too much

Towelie
12-02-2009, 05:15 PM
Don't worry. We're getting 4 in return when Gonzalez and Soriano go elsewhere.

I would be disappointed if someone's draft spot was higher then 20.

Dr.Philly
12-02-2009, 08:48 PM
Wags is one of the biggest characters of all time for sure...

People confuse his results with his attitude...

He isn't the same pitcher he was back in Houston when he was completely untouchable... But, he hasn't been that guy for a while... However, he is still one of the best closers of all time and is still amazingly efficient and productive...

I often believe he goes to places just to get revenge on the Phillies...

His career path is, either a coincidence, or ironic...

Even his stop in Boston last year was the most opportunistic place to beat the Phillies in the world series... Maybe i'm just reading too much into it...

He did say he wanted to close for the Nationals.......

Vinny642
12-02-2009, 08:49 PM
7 Million is a little expensive, but I dont not hate this deal

Sportfan
12-02-2009, 08:55 PM
Isnt it the 19th pick not the 20th?

BRAVE KID
12-02-2009, 09:28 PM
I like the move. It wasn't a given that we would keep gonzo or sori..or both. And for the draft pick being given up..the way I look at it you still got to wait 3+ years in order for that pick to amount to anything, and we are going to get picks if sori and gonzo do depart anyways. So seems like a win to me.

Greenmonster24
12-02-2009, 09:39 PM
Ya plus he did real well with the Redsox after the injury and when he came back he looked real good. I think he can still be a real good closer.

VRP723
12-03-2009, 12:26 AM
No one is doubting his abilities, we're saying he's being overpaid along with the draft pick, right?

bravesfan22193
12-03-2009, 02:29 AM
I think people forget just how good Wagner is. We're talking about the second best relief pitcher of this decade behind Rivera, the guy is flat out dominant. He showed he was healthy in his return to Boston and his quotes about his health lead one to believe he's feeling great. A healthy Billy Wagner was easily the best available option for RP's and 7M is not an exceedingly high price to pay given the current closer market. If you think it's too much then you like me have a problem with how closers are viewed but don't isolate this as a bad contract because when you look at other teams closer situations, it really isn't.

VRP723
12-03-2009, 02:36 AM
2nd best? Better than Hoffman, really?

thewupk
12-03-2009, 02:46 AM
I would be disappointed if someone's draft spot was higher then 20.

I wouldn't. Assuming one is still in the first round 21-30 then the odds the Braves get their guy is very high.

thewupk
12-03-2009, 02:48 AM
No one is doubting his abilities, we're saying he's being overpaid along with the draft pick, right?

Is 7 million overpaid for what he would bring? The market isn't that bad for relievers. And as mentioned before the Braves will get 4 picks in return for losing their 2 top relievers. Would it have made more sense to sign one of them for more years and more money and getting 3 total picks instead of 4?

thewupk
12-03-2009, 02:52 AM
2nd best? Better than Hoffman, really?

Wagner 182 OPS+ 1.009 WHIP
Hoffman 147 ops+ 1.041 WHIP

Hoffman has pitched more innings thus more saves. But Wagner has had a higher quality of work.

VRP723
12-03-2009, 02:54 AM
Is 7 million overpaid for what he would bring? The market isn't that bad for relievers. And as mentioned before the Braves will get 4 picks in return for losing their 2 top relievers. Would it have made more sense to sign one of them for more years and more money and getting 3 total picks instead of 4?

It might be, for a guy whose pitched 62 innings in the last two years combined, let's not act as though he was lights out when he was pitching too, he blew 7 saves in 2008, 5 in 2007 and 5 in 2006

Ty Fast
12-03-2009, 03:41 AM
Go braves. Win one last one for bobby. Oh ya. I'm going out with my boots on(tought i would just add that in there)

DodgersFanFor23
12-03-2009, 04:50 AM
Atlanta is taking a one year flyer out on a closer who still has a live arm. Cost them $7 mill and what, two draft picks?

Red Sox rented Wagner for two non-descript minor leaguers who will now be replaced by two decent draft picks.

The Mets are the only loser here.

That's right, Zen Master.

donnie23
12-03-2009, 11:40 AM
Amazing that the Braves would give up a first rounder (20th) for Wagner, they must be planning on signing another type A. Red-Sox pulled a fast one here, good for them.

Hustla23
12-03-2009, 12:30 PM
****ing Mets are the worst run team in sports :facepalm:

The Wilpons don't know how to run a ****ing ball club.

thewupk
12-03-2009, 03:34 PM
Amazing that the Braves would give up a first rounder (20th) for Wagner, they must be planning on signing another type A. Red-Sox pulled a fast one here, good for them.

Doubtful they sign another Type A guy. As I mentioned earlier. They could have signed Gonzo or Soriano for more money and ended up with 3 picks instead of 4.

thewupk
12-03-2009, 03:39 PM
It might be, for a guy whose pitched 62 innings in the last two years combined, let's not act as though he was lights out when he was pitching too, he blew 7 saves in 2008, 5 in 2007 and 5 in 2006

That's an 86% save percentage. Pablebon is at 90% for his career as a closer.