PDA

View Full Version : Who are the DPOY Contenders?



Chronz
11-17-2009, 09:18 PM
I think NBA.com should have a season long DPOY piece like they have for the MVP. Not that I ever read it but I would if they were if it were for defense... if they have one then they should do a better job of making sure I know about it.

Cuz to me it seems like the DPOY talk doesnt get started until some time during the 2nd half of the season. Whatever the reason, I see no reason to wait so please give your take on who you think the years best defenders have been.

Any newcomers this year? Surprises?

TheDetroitBlue
11-17-2009, 09:45 PM
Ben Wallace is lookin like his old self back in Detroit to me that's a bit of a surprise because I did not think he would play even close to former dominant player he once was

Kakaroach
11-17-2009, 10:47 PM
I think ESPN does it all season long not sure.

Yep, they do: http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/awards?page=awards-091117

ko8e24
11-17-2009, 10:53 PM
Well, Bryant is averaging a career high in steals, so he should be considered, but he won't win it if he isn't consistent on the DPOY type of level

acehole
11-17-2009, 11:18 PM
Mr. Defense himself DAVID LEE!!

GunFactor187
11-17-2009, 11:32 PM
Ba-Ba-Ba-Ba-Ba-Ba-BEN Wwwwwwwwwwwallace!!!!!!!!!

kswissdaf
11-17-2009, 11:35 PM
Michael Beasley =)

sunnydayin'zona
11-17-2009, 11:38 PM
d12?

KH12
11-17-2009, 11:38 PM
Jo.

dynasty 93-96
11-17-2009, 11:53 PM
Chuck hayes

cantstopthee
11-18-2009, 12:02 AM
man ben is look of old, kinda scary.


but i doubt it will keep up or be enough to over pass some big names

Shady66
11-18-2009, 12:08 AM
D12, D wade, Kobe, Big Ben.

Hustla23
11-18-2009, 12:09 AM
If Danilo Gallinari doesn't win, then we know for sure this stupid league is rigged.

Not even joking. For serious.

kjoke
11-18-2009, 12:12 AM
monta ellis

ManRam
11-18-2009, 12:13 AM
Mr. Defense himself DAVID LEE!!

I pray to God you're joking. I'm going to assume you are. If not...yikes.


If Danilo Gallinari doesn't win, then we know for sure this stupid league is rigged.

Not even joking. For serious.

You said you aren't joking...you should be. He's a good defender, but Christ...he's not that good.

I vote Rondo. I refuse to vote for Josh Smith...still don't think he's a good on-ball defender. Artest maybe eventually...but as of now, their team defense isn't up too par, partially because of him and Kobe having chemistry issues at the moment, not knowing or agreeing who to guard.

Tyreke Jennings
11-18-2009, 12:26 AM
josh smith

td0tsfinest
11-18-2009, 12:33 AM
well no doubt in my mind its Monta Ellis, the self-proclaimed "last defender left on his team"

But seriously, I think Josh Smith is flying under the radar with how well the Hawks are doing.
I don't think D12 will repeat with the way he's been playing right now.
KG's name is going to be up there with the Celts defense.

If I had a vote, I'd give it to Josh Smith.

Raph12
11-18-2009, 02:49 AM
Howard and Wallace should be frontrunners with several honorable mentions.

theuuord
11-18-2009, 02:53 AM
Garnett.

Gators123
11-18-2009, 02:53 AM
Big Ben getting DPOY would be great. You can tell being back home where he should be has rejuvenated him.:)

KH12
11-18-2009, 02:56 AM
Ben Wallace,a front-runner?

Wallace: 8.9 RPG, 1.6 BPG, 1.3 SPG
Noah: 12.4 RPG, 2.0 BPG, 0.4 SPG

Don't get me wrong, Wallace is a nice comeback story but he's nowhere near being a front-runner IMO.

theuuord
11-18-2009, 02:58 AM
There are some surprising teams near the top of the league's best defenses early in the season.

The top 2 (Celtics, Blazers) are no surprise, but the next 4 (Heat, Thunder, Bucks, Bobcats) I would not have predicted.

It's still early, but definitely worth noting.

Bulls_fan90
11-18-2009, 03:11 AM
Ben Wallace,a front-runner?

Wallace: 8.9 RPG, 1.6 BPG, 1.3 SPG
Noah: 12.4 RPG, 2.0 BPG, 0.4 SPG

Don't get me wrong, Wallace is a nice comeback story but he's nowhere near being a front-runner IMO.

True. But the majority that said Ben Wallace were Detroit homers.

Raph12
11-18-2009, 03:43 AM
Ben Wallace,a front-runner?

Wallace: 8.9 RPG, 1.6 BPG, 1.3 SPG
Noah: 12.4 RPG, 2.0 BPG, 0.4 SPG

Don't get me wrong, Wallace is a nice comeback story but he's nowhere near being a front-runner IMO.

Maybe, but can Noah keep it up for 82 games?... either way when it is all said and done, I see Howard putting up numbers that look like this: 12-14rpg, 2.5-4bpg, 1spg, trumping both Wallace and Noah, even if both continue to produce at this rate.

Chronz
11-18-2009, 03:45 AM
There are some surprising teams near the top of the league's best defenses early in the season.

The top 2 (Celtics, Blazers) are no surprise, but the next 4 (Heat, Thunder, Bucks, Bobcats) I would not have predicted.

It's still early, but definitely worth noting.

Im not buying Oklahomas improvement, theyve played us twice and both times I thought to myself if we were a good offensive team we woudve burned these guys. They deserve props for coming out the gates strong, but once they play teams that can shoot from the outside they will get torched, right now their opponent 3pt% is fluckishly good, not that they arent good, last year they were around average but even the very best defenses dont contain offenses to such low shooting marks. Not surprisingly both the Heat and Thunder qualify for the flukishly good opp %'s. But Im buying Miami's improvement moreso.

The main difference from last year has been Jermaine basically doubling his output on the defensive glass and being alittle more conservative with his shot blocking. I hope thats not flukish because it would be a great story.

Its entirely possible that theyve made the leap, but like you said it being ridiculously early will lead to some wierd candidates but for now who would you recognize from those teams? Miami seems pretty easy to spot down, but the Thunder? I thought Thabo did a great job on Kobe but at the end of the night he went for like 35.

Chronz
11-18-2009, 03:49 AM
Ben Wallace,a front-runner?

Wallace: 8.9 RPG, 1.6 BPG, 1.3 SPG
Noah: 12.4 RPG, 2.0 BPG, 0.4 SPG

Don't get me wrong, Wallace is a nice comeback story but he's nowhere near being a front-runner IMO.

Are you counting offensive rebounds with all this?

ko8e24
11-18-2009, 03:51 AM
Howard and Wallace should be frontrunners with several honorable mentions.

y?

cuz he won it last yr?

hez down like 1 BPG from last season, and he's average like 3 less rebounds per game (remember, rebounding is an aspect of defense), and SVG has been getting on him lately for that. So no, he is not the frontrunner for DPOY


and Big Ben might be showing "flashes" and will have a couple of good games to make fans reminisce of Big Ben of the old, but this aint circa 2004, 2005. He ain't as intimidating as he used to be.


Now Josh Smith, that guys a beast in rebounding and blocked shots. He, Rondo, Kobe and Artest are the frontrunners right now.

abe_froman
11-18-2009, 03:53 AM
Are you counting offensive rebounds with all this?

he is

jd_azsportsfan
11-18-2009, 03:54 AM
Keep an eye on jokim noah he has good stats right now but he probly get dicked over by the nba and there goive to a moron like Kobe or KG

Raph12
11-18-2009, 04:02 AM
y?

cuz he won it last yr?

hez down like 1 BPG from last season, and he's average like 3 less rebounds per game (remember, rebounding is an aspect of defense), and SVG has been getting on him lately for that. So no, he is not the frontrunner for DPOY


and Big Ben might be showing "flashes" and will have a couple of good games to make fans reminisce of Big Ben of the old, but this aint circa 2004, 2005. He ain't as intimidating as he used to be.


Now Josh Smith, that guys a beast in rebounding and blocked shots. He, Rondo, Kobe and Artest are the frontrunners right now.

Howard's also playing 30mpg and getting into foul trouble (avgs over 4fpg) almost in every game he plays. As the season progresses, he will learn to adjust his game to the calls, stay on the court and be aggressive while playing smart. Like I said, it's really early right now and you forget that Howard can get 20 rebounds or 10blks on any given night, drastically improving his pergame avg. By the end of the season, I look for his stats to look a bit more like this: 20ppg, 13-14rpg, 1-2apg, 2.5-4bpg and 1spg.

Wallace has been great while playing for the Motor City and I look for him to be able to keep it up for the full season, retiring at the end of the year.

Smith has been a stud early, but he is known to get lazy as the season goes on, Rondo would deserve an honorable mention, as would either Kobe or Artest (one or the other, not both).

stawka
11-18-2009, 04:38 AM
After seeing THIS (http://www.nba.com/video/channels/top_plays/2009/11/17/20091117_botn.nba/?ls=iref:nbahpt2), i'm going with Maxiell.

But seriously, Dwight.

JayW_1023
11-18-2009, 05:51 AM
Noah.

Mr.ATLHawks
11-18-2009, 09:04 AM
Josh Smith he leads the league in shot blocking (2.55) and 8.9 rebounds per game...

bigsams50
11-18-2009, 09:33 AM
J-Smooth

PBG
11-18-2009, 10:07 AM
After seeing THIS (http://www.nba.com/video/channels/top_plays/2009/11/17/20091117_botn.nba/?ls=iref:nbahpt2), i'm going with Maxiell.

kinda dumb that bspn top 10 had kobes little backwards lay up but that block was no where to be seen.

but yea, for dpoy ill go with the dude with the ears from la :up:

olrales
11-18-2009, 10:42 AM
I'd go with J-Smooth...others should be watched too like Noah and the other Wallace that no one talk about, Gerald.

And if everybody on PSD is taking a homer pick, then I'll go with Oden!! lol!

mikantsass
11-18-2009, 10:49 AM
my 3 would be Howard, Lebron, Battier

loki34
11-18-2009, 12:17 PM
Jared dudley

Tmac,lt,berkman
11-18-2009, 12:48 PM
chuck hayes

Tmac,lt,berkman
11-18-2009, 12:50 PM
trevor ariza will be in the discussion as will kobe, d-12, josh smith and shane battier

Stunner
11-18-2009, 12:57 PM
Noah

Cool007
11-18-2009, 01:05 PM
Joakim Noah.

Bulls also have one of the top defnses in the NBA. They are helding teams under 100 points and most of them to even below 90 points. Noah is just simply awesome and so far Bulls' MVP of the young season.

Noah deserves props.

I think Dwight will come back to his old self from last year and probably win it.

MJ-BULLS
11-18-2009, 01:12 PM
Joakim Noah

JordansBulls
11-18-2009, 01:14 PM
I think Joakim Noah is playing quite well.

Matrix3132
11-18-2009, 01:26 PM
I pray to God you're joking. I'm going to assume you are. If not...yikes.



You said you aren't joking...you should be. He's a good defender, but Christ...he's not that good.

I vote Rondo. I refuse to vote for Josh Smith...still don't think he's a good on-ball defender. Artest maybe eventually...but as of now, their team defense isn't up too par, partially because of him and Kobe having chemistry issues at the moment, not knowing or agreeing who to guard.

1.I think he was being sarcastic about Gallinari but you are a joke for saying Gal is a good defender....what are you watching?

2.Saying Josh Smith isn't a good on-ball defender is like saying Rondo is a poor defender down low. Smith plays power forward and protects the hoop, Rondo obviously guards the perimeter so you can't down grade their skills because of their positions....

Carey
11-18-2009, 02:03 PM
Thabo Sefolosha.....Held Kevin Martin to 5 for 19, Ben Gordon to 8 for 20, Brandon Roy to 5 for 17 and Kobe to 9 for 22, Kobe scored 31 but worked extremely hard for his points, Thabo also had 4 steals in that game. Held D Wade to 6 for 19 last night, averages 2 steals a game, He's clearly the best perimeter defender in the league and should be in the running for it at least.

DenButsu
11-18-2009, 02:08 PM
Melo.

And no, I'm not joking. Opposing SFs have been held to a PER of 15.1, and opposing PFs to 17.6 against him. And anyone just watching the Nuggets will be able to see that he's just playing with so much more defensive intensity and tenacity than ever before, and it's paying off dividends in steals, blocks, loose balls, etc. I honestly believe he is working his way into the conversation.

theuuord
11-18-2009, 02:12 PM
Im not buying Oklahomas improvement, theyve played us twice and both times I thought to myself if we were a good offensive team we woudve burned these guys. They deserve props for coming out the gates strong, but once they play teams that can shoot from the outside they will get torched, right now their opponent 3pt% is fluckishly good, not that they arent good, last year they were around average but even the very best defenses dont contain offenses to such low shooting marks. Not surprisingly both the Heat and Thunder qualify for the flukishly good opp %'s. But Im buying Miami's improvement moreso.

The main difference from last year has been Jermaine basically doubling his output on the defensive glass and being alittle more conservative with his shot blocking. I hope thats not flukish because it would be a great story.

Its entirely possible that theyve made the leap, but like you said it being ridiculously early will lead to some wierd candidates but for now who would you recognize from those teams? Miami seems pretty easy to spot down, but the Thunder? I thought Thabo did a great job on Kobe but at the end of the night he went for like 35.

I'm with you, I don't buy it either. I was more noting how weird it was that OKC was up there. Chances are they'll fall back but ten games of being a top 5 defense is something... Thabo is a good perimeter defender but outside of him there's no one I can think of that's really great defensively.
I don't think either Miami or OKC will end up top 5 by the end of the year defensively though.


I'd go with J-Smooth...others should be watched too like Noah and the other Wallace that no one talk about, Gerald.

And if everybody on PSD is taking a homer pick, then I'll go with Oden!! lol!

Oden is a way smarter pick than people are giving credit. He's really coming into his own as a defensive player. It's hard to notice because Przybilla is also a really awesome defensive player so their defense doesn't drop off that much with him out.

theuuord
11-18-2009, 02:13 PM
Melo.

And no, I'm not joking. Opposing SFs have been held to a PER of 15.1, and opposing PFs to 17.6 against him. And anyone just watching the Nuggets will be able to see that he's just playing with so much more defensive intensity and tenacity than ever before, and it's paying off dividends in steals, blocks, loose balls, etc. I honestly believe he is working his way into the conversation.

Look at Oden's numbers in that vein. They're freaking mind-boggling.

DenButsu
11-18-2009, 02:24 PM
Look at Oden's numbers in that vein. They're freaking mind-boggling.

8.1 is truly insane. The only asterisk I might put there, though, is that he's playing at best borderline starter's minutes, at 24 per game, and averaging over 4 fouls. The luxury of having Pryz (etc.) to back him up allows him to play more ferociously than most C's (or any other players) can afford to.

Melo, on the other hand, is averaging about 36 per game, and therefore spending a lot of quality time against the best of the opposition. I don't really want to stack these two up against each other anyways, since it's an uneven comparison, but if Oden were playing the same minutes, he'd either be fouling out every game, or giving up more offense.

theuuord
11-18-2009, 02:32 PM
8.1 is truly insane. The only asterisk I might put there, though, is that he's playing at best borderline starter's minutes, at 24 per game, and averaging over 4 fouls. The luxury of having Pryz (etc.) to back him up allows him to play more ferociously than most C's (or any other players) can afford to.

Melo, on the other hand, is averaging about 36 per game, and therefore spending a lot of quality time against the best of the opposition. I don't really want to stack these two up against each other anyways, since it's an uneven comparison, but if Oden were playing the same minutes, he'd either be fouling out every game, or giving up more offense.

I wasn't trying to compare and contrast the two, just noting how crazy Oden's numbers are. It's really unfortunate that he's still so wild in picking up fouls, because outside of that he really is an outstanding defensive player.

DerekRE_3
11-18-2009, 02:39 PM
Melo.

And no, I'm not joking. Opposing SFs have been held to a PER of 15.1, and opposing PFs to 17.6 against him. And anyone just watching the Nuggets will be able to see that he's just playing with so much more defensive intensity and tenacity than ever before, and it's paying off dividends in steals, blocks, loose balls, etc. I honestly believe he is working his way into the conversation.

Dwyane Wade is holding his opponents PER to 9.1 at SG and 9.5 at PG, plus he's playing almost 39 MPG.

Verbal Christ
11-18-2009, 02:49 PM
Since its a homer bonanza ill go with chuck hayes (seriously when has a 6'6 C held his own in this league? Never that's when) and ariza noticeable improvement over artest.

Carey
11-18-2009, 02:52 PM
Im not buying Oklahomas improvement, theyve played us twice and both times I thought to myself if we were a good offensive team we woudve burned these guys. They deserve props for coming out the gates strong, but once they play teams that can shoot from the outside they will get torched, right now their opponent 3pt% is fluckishly good, not that they arent good, last year they were around average but even the very best defenses dont contain offenses to such low shooting marks. Not surprisingly both the Heat and Thunder qualify for the flukishly good opp %'s. But Im buying Miami's improvement moreso.

The main difference from last year has been Jermaine basically doubling his output on the defensive glass and being alittle more conservative with his shot blocking. I hope thats not flukish because it would be a great story.

Its entirely possible that theyve made the leap, but like you said it being ridiculously early will lead to some wierd candidates but for now who would you recognize from those teams? Miami seems pretty easy to spot down, but the Thunder? I thought Thabo did a great job on Kobe but at the end of the night he went for like 35.

[QUOTE=theuuord;11437143]I'm with you, I don't buy it either. I was more noting how weird it was that OKC was up there. Chances are they'll fall back but ten games of being a top 5 defense is something... Thabo is a good perimeter defender but outside of him there's no one I can think of that's really great defensively.
I don't think either Miami or OKC will end up top 5 by the end of the year defensively though.


Im not saying we are the Celtics but we are pretty good defensively. Besides Thabo, we have Kevin Ollie, Collison, Etan Thomas, who guard their position very well though they lack a little quickness, very smart defenders, Westbrook defends well, Jeff can guard different spots and effectively front bigger players, KD has turn himself into a capable defender using his length. The rotations are crisp, they play with intensity, and all this without a true shot blocker in the rotation, imagine when we get that. If you dont think this is good D i dont know what you consider good defense

Bulls_fan90
11-18-2009, 07:21 PM
Thabo Sefolosha.....Held Kevin Martin to 5 for 19, Ben Gordon to 8 for 20, Brandon Roy to 5 for 17 and Kobe to 9 for 22, Kobe scored 31 but worked extremely hard for his points, Thabo also had 4 steals in that game. Held D Wade to 6 for 19 last night, averages 2 steals a game, He's clearly the best perimeter defender in the league and should be in the running for it at least.

I agree. He is one of the best defenders in the league. But he will be overlooked completely because of his low profile and his stats.

DenButsu
11-18-2009, 07:45 PM
I wasn't trying to compare and contrast the two, just noting how crazy Oden's numbers are. It's really unfortunate that he's still so wild in picking up fouls, because outside of that he really is an outstanding defensive player.

Well, I'm sure the more experience he gets, the better he'll get at reigning those worse tendencies in. As a Nuggets fan, I'm not looking forward to seeing that happen, though. :cool:


Dwyane Wade is holding his opponents PER to 9.1 at SG and 9.5 at PG, plus he's playing almost 39 MPG.

Yeah, that's pretty damn sick, there's no getting around that.

ARMIN12NBA
11-18-2009, 08:07 PM
Andrew Bynum should get some consideration. His opponents have a PER of 13.8 and he averages over 8 Defensive RPG. He also averages 1.8 BPG.

smith&wesson
11-18-2009, 08:19 PM
good point chronz, mvp gets talked about soo much and dpoy which i think is mad important hardly gets talked about as much.

im gonna have to go with my man JO.

he has really helped miami on this year, and they have been doing well on defence which is a suprize.

kingcanadian409
11-18-2009, 08:20 PM
big ben, hands downn

dwadefan03
11-18-2009, 08:34 PM
i didnt read all of the posts but im pretty sure no one has said this....thabo sefalosha. the dude is the next bruce bowen.

dwadefan03
11-18-2009, 08:36 PM
Thabo Sefolosha.....Held Kevin Martin to 5 for 19, Ben Gordon to 8 for 20, Brandon Roy to 5 for 17 and Kobe to 9 for 22, Kobe scored 31 but worked extremely hard for his points, Thabo also had 4 steals in that game. Held D Wade to 6 for 19 last night, averages 2 steals a game, He's clearly the best perimeter defender in the league and should be in the running for it at least.

nvm the comment before... agree 100 percent

kArSoN RyDaH
11-18-2009, 08:54 PM
artest is up there!!! =]

Chronz
11-18-2009, 09:22 PM
I'm with you, I don't buy it either. I was more noting how weird it was that OKC was up there. Chances are they'll fall back but ten games of being a top 5 defense is something... Thabo is a good perimeter defender but outside of him there's no one I can think of that's really great defensively.
I don't think either Miami or OKC will end up top 5 by the end of the year defensively though.
Westbrooks a beast on D, I was just thinking theres no way a team thats 2 best defenders comprise of their backcourt ends up with a top5 rating. But right now backcourt defense really been the strength of theirs and I doubt its a product of their help. They were strong last year with these 2 on the court, but its the improvements elsewhere that need to stand the test of time.



Im not saying we are the Celtics but we are pretty good defensively. Besides Thabo, we have Kevin Ollie, Collison, Etan Thomas, who guard their position very well though they lack a little quickness, very smart defenders, Westbrook defends well, Jeff can guard different spots and effectively front bigger players, KD has turn himself into a capable defender using his length. The rotations are crisp, they play with intensity, and all this without a true shot blocker in the rotation, imagine when we get that. If you dont think this is good D i dont know what you consider good defense
Judging from the stats Krystic is really the only guy killing you, Etan is dominating Oden style and Collison seems to be doing good so long as hes not playing Center.

And dont flip out on us bro, I havent seen enough of them. Ironically we dont want to believe the #'s until we see more of them, or they sustain these stats.

mjt20mik
11-18-2009, 09:25 PM
thabo sefolosha.....held kevin martin to 5 for 19, ben gordon to 8 for 20, brandon roy to 5 for 17 and kobe to 9 for 22, kobe scored 31 but worked extremely hard for his points, thabo also had 4 steals in that game. Held d wade to 6 for 19 last night, averages 2 steals a game, he's clearly the best perimeter defender in the league and should be in the running for it at least.

+1

Chronz
11-18-2009, 10:00 PM
Melo.

And no, I'm not joking. Opposing SFs have been held to a PER of 15.1, and opposing PFs to 17.6 against him. And anyone just watching the Nuggets will be able to see that he's just playing with so much more defensive intensity and tenacity than ever before, and it's paying off dividends in steals, blocks, loose balls, etc. I honestly believe he is working his way into the conversation.

It took me all year to notice Melo's counterpart #'s last year, when all year long all the talk was about Melo's improved focus on that end, I dont know why I never bothered to check them. One thing that looks out of place is Melo's on/off court differentials. Adjusted data probably sorts this out. Either way I dont think his counterpart measures scream DPOY to me (considering where they were last year), though depending on the context I could be wrong. His counterpart is basically producing at an average rate, but who has he been guarding?

The best stat available to us to attempt to account for these questions are KP's Defensive Multiplier (dMULT), and Defensive Counterpart Quality (dQUAL). One attempts to measure the expected rate of efficiency of a player, and the other the quality of the players expected production vs league average. Like if I hold Bruce Bowen scoreless and 0-4 from the field my dMULT will be impressive, but my dQUAL will say he was a **** of a challenge.

By the #'s (dQUAL not being accessible)(Im still grasping them by the way so bear with me), his counterpart has accounted for 141 possessions, near half of his own usage, his Points Saved rating is 5 (anything above 0 is good). And regardless of the strength of the opposition, who hes been guarding has played well below their standards. Its fair to say Melo's individual D has been strong thus far.

Unruly Fan
11-18-2009, 10:46 PM
I cant believe I didn't see a mention of Josh Smith on the first page.

DenButsu
11-18-2009, 10:50 PM
It took me all year to notice Melo's counterpart #'s last year, when all year long all the talk was about Melo's improved focus on that end, I dont know why I never bothered to check them. One thing that looks out of place is Melo's on/off court differentials. Adjusted data probably sorts this out. Either way I dont think his counterpart measures scream DPOY to me (considering where they were last year), though depending on the context I could be wrong. His counterpart is basically producing at an average rate, but who has he been guarding?

The best stat available to us to attempt to account for these questions are KP's Defensive Multiplier (dMULT), and Defensive Counterpart Quality (dQUAL). One attempts to measure the expected rate of efficiency of a player, and the other the quality of the players expected production vs league average. Like if I hold Bruce Bowen scoreless and 0-4 from the field my dMULT will be impressive, but my dQUAL will say he was a **** of a challenge.

By the #'s (dQUAL not being accessible)(Im still grasping them by the way so bear with me), his counterpart has accounted for 141 possessions, near half of his own usage, his Points Saved rating is 5 (anything above 0 is good). And regardless of the strength of the opposition, who hes been guarding has played well below their standards. Its fair to say Melo's individual D has been strong thus far.

Incidentally, I do not mean to make an absolute declarative like "Melo should be DPOY!" I mainly just felt that his defensive improvement was worth mentioning. Maybe better placed in a "defensive 1st/2nd/3rd teams" thread, though, rather than DPOY. I wouldn't try to argue that he's the best in the business on that end of the court, because I don't think it's true.

td0tsfinest
11-18-2009, 11:05 PM
I cant believe I didn't see a mention of Josh Smith on the first page.

there were 2 mentions of smith

including by myself

kozelkid
11-18-2009, 11:10 PM
I cant believe I didn't see a mention of Josh Smith on the first page.

I can, he's overrated. Sure, by blocks and steals he looks nice, but that's a terrible way to judge a defender. Smith is a pretty bad on ball defender, but terrific off the ball, not DPOY quality imo. Thabo was a good mention though, completely forgot about him.

_KB24_
11-18-2009, 11:17 PM
I would like Kobe to finally get the award but he doesn't have the blocks. Smith and Dwight look like legitimate to me but can't leave put Joakim.

Mr.Nate30
11-18-2009, 11:34 PM
keith bogans

Carey
11-19-2009, 10:33 AM
Westbrooks a beast on D, I was just thinking theres no way a team thats 2 best defenders comprise of their backcourt ends up with a top5 rating. But right now backcourt defense really been the strength of theirs and I doubt its a product of their help. They were strong last year with these 2 on the court, but its the improvements elsewhere that need to stand the test of time.


Judging from the stats Krystic is really the only guy killing you, Etan is dominating Oden style and Collison seems to be doing good so long as hes not playing Center.

And dont flip out on us bro, I havent seen enough of them. Ironically we dont want to believe the #'s until we see more of them, or they sustain these stats.

No disrespect meant, look we have hard enough time getting credit for anything but being young and talented so when we bring something else to the table beside that i gotta let people kno lol

Chronz
11-19-2009, 11:53 AM
Thats what your here for bro, I post the stats and ask the questions. You tell us if theyre legit or not. Still if Durant has become a great defender over night then thats got to be the biggest leap forward for any phenom to undergo. It took Bron 2 solid years just to become an average defender.

ChiSox219
11-19-2009, 12:32 PM
I can, he's overrated. Sure, by blocks and steals he looks nice, but that's a terrible way to judge a defender. Smith is a pretty bad on ball defender, but terrific off the ball, not DPOY quality imo. Thabo was a good mention though, completely forgot about him.

Not that it matters because he's banned for a month, but man this kid can't stop hating Josh Smith.


I vote Josh Smith right now because voters will look at steals, blocks, rebounds in addition to actual on court play.

Luc Richard Mbah a Moute and Thabo Sefolosha should get some serious consideration as they are two of the best perimeter defenders in the league.

Carey
11-19-2009, 02:27 PM
Thats what your here for bro, I post the stats and ask the questions. You tell us if theyre legit or not. Still if Durant has become a great defender over night then thats got to be the biggest leap forward for any phenom to undergo. It took Bron 2 solid years just to become an average defender.

Oh no KD is not a great defender by any means, his effort has been off the charts and his technique has been alot better, I'd say he's average at this point, learning how to use length and angles but he needs to get stronger and improve his lateral quickness.

Raph12
11-19-2009, 02:44 PM
Not that it matters because he's banned for a month, but man this kid can't stop hating Josh Smith.


I vote Josh Smith right now because voters will look at steals, blocks, rebounds in addition to actual on court play.

Luc Richard Mbah a Moute and Thabo Sefolosha should get some serious consideration as they are two of the best perimeter defenders in the league.

Smith is legit atm, but he tends to get lazier as the season goes on and decides to only show up on defense against the stronger teams or when trying to make the highlight reel for showtime blocks.

Verbal Christ
11-19-2009, 08:54 PM
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/john_schuhmann/11/19/numbersgame.battier/

this article is insightful and i believe goes well with this thread topic.


As the only team in the top five against all four players, the Rockets have clearly been able to defend these guys pretty well. And Battier, of course, has been the stopper there since he arrived in 2006. Back in August, I wrote how Ron Artest was more effective defensively against the Lakers last season, but he wasn't the one guarding Bryant on most of those possessions. Battier was.


Since Battier and Artest played together last season, it can cloud Artest's defensive value. To get a decent measure of Artest's "stop-ability," we can look at Anthony's, Bryant's and Wade's true shooting percentage against the Kings in the two seasons Artest was in Sacramento (James and Artest met just once in those years). Artest was able to slow down Anthony a bit (.505 TS% in five games), but not Wade (.566 in five games) and certainly not Bryant (.622 in seven games). Fortunately for Artest, he doesn't have to guard Kobe anymore.