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View Full Version : Mock Offseason FINALS - Boston Celtics vs Phoenix Suns



BlondeBomber41
09-01-2009, 07:09 PM
Every offseason some of us on PSD do a mock offseason where we simulate an offseason by doing mock free agency and trades. Below are the rosters of two teams after the game, please look at both rosters and give your honest opinion on who you believe would win.

Remember, these votes have nothing to do with your real team so there is no reason to be a homer.


Boston Celtics Lineup:

C-Rasheed Wallace/Jeff Foster/Mark Blount
PF-Kevin Garnett/Kenyon Martin/Brian Skinner
SF-LeBron James/Shawne Williams
SG-Dahntay Jones/Keith Bogans
PG-Devin Harris/Luke Ridnour


Phoenix Suns Lineup:

C - Yao / Rasho Nesterovic / Stephen Hunter
PF - Rashard Lewis / Lamar Odom
SF - Stephen Jackson / Grant Hill / Stephen Graham
SG - Vince Carter / Joey Graham / Adam Morrison
PG - Steve Nash / Earl Watson / Speedy Claxton



Boston Celtics Series Writeup:

Before I say anything else, I want to congratulate Mile High Champ on advancing to the Mock Finals. He has put together an excellent Suns team and I wish him the best of luck.

Frontcourt:

Overall this is primarily Kevin Garnett, Rasheed Wallace, and Kenyon Martin vs. Yao Ming, Rashard Lewis, and Lamar Odom. The Suns frontcourt has presented match-up problems to virtually every other team they faced out West but that won't work here.

Garnett and Martin are long and athletic enough to defend Rashard Lewis or Lamar Odom, both streaky shooters, on the perimeter if they need to. Garnett and Foster are established interior defenders with the toughness, length, and athleticism to contain the wobbly Yao inside.

Offensively, this Suns frontcourt is as potent and dangerous as the mock has to offer but Wallace, Garnett, and Martin will be playing the beneficiary of each other, LeBron, and Harris. Not to mention all 3 have their fair share of offensive talent. Odom and Lewis are underrated defenders but even underrated, they are still merely average. The penetration of LeBron and Harris with Wallace outside and KG underneath the basket will cause their frontline all kinds of problems. That and I seriously doubt Yao will take pleasure in trying to defend Wallace from the perimeter or KG from midrange.

Edge: Celtics

Small Forward:

As I've said before, it takes an excellent defensive unit to have any success defending LeBron James. The Suns have some good defensive players, but not near the personnel it will take to cut him off in this series. Stephen Jackson is a solid, versatile defender but he has a tendency to do himself in offensively and defensively, he doesn't have the speed to handle LeBron.

The teams that have managed to contain LeBron to some extent have managed to limit his penetration and make him more of a jump shooter. But with options like Devin Harris and Kevin Garnett, by the far the best complements he's played with in his life, that won't work against these Celtics.

Edge: Celtics

Backcourt:

Dahntay Jones doesn't have a chance to match Vince Carter's production. There's no denying that. But he has the defens size, strength, and explosiveness as well as the defensive ability to cut him off on a few possessions and that's all I expect him to do.

Devin Harris vs. Steve Nash is a pivotal match-up in my eyes. Nash is the better playmaker and the better shooter, but the size and quickness advantage Harris has will limit him at the offensive end. That and he is also an excellent defender on the ball and if he can manage to slow down Tony Parker on occassion, Steve Nash won't be nearly as formidable for him. Offensively, point guards have a history of going off on Nash and Harris will be no exception. He'll pick him apart with insanely superior quickness and explosiveness.

Harris will get the better end of his match-up with Nash, but I'll give Vince Carter his due. His presence puts this end of the match-up in the Suns favor.

Edge: Suns

We match up very well with this team. LeBron James has carried worse, over better, with less. He and Kevin Garnett compose the most deadly duo the NBA has seen since Shaq and Kobe in the early decade. They are game changers at both ends of the floor and when you add stars like Devin Harris and Rasheed Wallace, great defense, great depth, and an incredible amount of experience to that, the result is the Larry O'Brien Trophy. This team can play big, small, fast, and slow.

In terms of team defense, starpower, and versatility this team is second to none and that is why the Mock Boston Celtics should be NBA Champions. Good luck once again to Mile High Champ.



Phoenix Suns Writeup:

Well I am very happy to have made it to the finals. I faced some great teams on my way to this point in the Rockets, Warriors and Spurs. Perhaps now I face my toughest challenge yet in Lebron and the Celtics. This series should be a great one and I am excited to see how it turns out. I wish nothing but the best of luck to Catfish in the final.

Steve Nash - Devin Harris: Two great pg's, though very different in many ways. Devin Harris is a very skilled offensive, shoot first pg who knows how to put up points on the board. That being said, his playmaking and ability to create shots for others with his passing is questionable at times. That cannot be said for Steve Nash. The two time MVP is the best playmaking pg in the NBA arguably. He makes everyone around him so much better and simply knows the easiest ways to create great scoring opportunities for his teammates. With so many weapons at Nash's disposal, he should really continue to show his importance to this suns team as the series goes on. Nash's experience and sound decision making is what gives him the edge in this series over Devin Harris.

Vince Carter -Dahntay Jones: This is really a no contest. While Jones can be a good defender, he does not have the necessary talent or ability to stop VC or Jackson, whoever he may cover in this series. J Jones last year only averaged 5 and 2 as a starter, offensive numbers for a starting SG that are below average. VC remains one of the best SG's in today's game, he is an outstanding shooter and knows how to get to the line. Not to mention, like Lebron, he can take over the game at any time and be the that gets the ball every play. VC this past year also show an improved commitment to defence which should help the suns case even more. Huge Advantage for the Suns.

Stephen Jackson - Lebron James: Wow could not of asked for a tougher match up. Lebron as many of you would agree, is probably the best player in the league. It will be up to Jackson to try and at least contain him the best he can. Jackson however is no slouch, this match-up is nowhere near as one sided as the VC-Jones match-up. Jackson can hold his own on defence and remains a very solid perimeter defender. He knows how to get in players faces and play a physical game. I expect Jackson to play Lebron very tough and also make Lebron work on the defensive end as Jackson himself is a 20 ppg scorer. He also averaged an under the radar 5 rebounds and 6 assists per game last year.

Rashard Lewis - Kevin Garnett: Another great match up, while KG is the better player, we could not be happier that we are going up against a hybrid 4 like Garnett instead of a more traditional bruising PF. Lewis this past year really had his game reach new levels. Many saw him only as a SF playing out of position but last year really changed all that. Lewis became a solid and reliable PF who could defend the hybrid 4's of the NBA quite well. He stays in front of his man at all times and always contests shots. I feel like his quickness and speed will be an asset against KG who relies on those qualities on the offensive end of the floor to score and be efficient. Lewis also brings KG away from the basket because of his ability to hit shots from anywhere on the floor, which allows some of our wing players like Jackson, Carter and Hill to get to the rim easier. I expect Lewis to play KG tough but we also have Lamar Odom to help out as well.

Yao Ming - Rasheed Wallace: A few years ago this would of been a closer matchup, sadly Wallace since then has really had his game slip. Once one of the best post defenders in the league is no showing his inability to play at the same level. Yao is sure to have a big series against the older Wallace. Yao remains significantly stronger and bigger then Wallace at every aspect of the game. He is a polished scorer from the block and knows how to step out and hit a shot. He also has very good lateral quickness for such a big guy and that will be needed against a center like Wallace. Yao also is a force in the middle on defence who can contest and block shots at will, he should certainly make Lebron life much harder. People have to remember that this is not the same Rasheed Wallace, he is very much a shadow of what he once was. Huge Advantage Suns.

Suns Bench - Celtics Bench: Once again my depth and talent off the bench will be counted on to help shoulder the load in the series. Lamar Odom remains the best player by a large margin coming off the bench in this series. He can defend and score from a variety of positions on the floor. He has matched up against KG before and has done well and we feel he is a great compliment to Lewis off the bench. He experience as an NBA champion is another added bonus as he can be an effective player on both offense and defence. The Celtics counter in Kenyon Martin who is also a talented player but his defensive abilities since his time in NJ are not the same as what they once were. Both back up pg's in Ridinour and Watson have experience as starters and can run an offense. That matchup is very much a wash. Both Back up centers are also role players, Rasho and Foster know what works for their games and they stick to it. Foster while a great rebounder is an average defender at best. He also has no offensive game to speak of. Rasho has experience playing on championship teams like the spurs and can be effective hitting shots from mid range and also posting up. Another wash match-up . Finally the Suns have something the Celtics do not, a talent wing player off the bench. Grant Hill just last year was starting and remains one of the smartest players in the league today. He is a team orientated player and knows how to be effective on offense and defence. He should have a nice series for us with the talent he has to work with around him. With Odom and Hill leading the way, the Suns bench is very much deeper and more talented than the Celtics.

Conclusion: I feel that our starting line-up is better rounded then the Celtics. We have 5 unselfish starters who can score 20 ppg any give night. Add that with Odom and Hill coming off the bench and you have the recipe of a championship. With Lewis on KG and Jackson on Lebron, we feel we match up well with Celtics star players but feel the Celtics needed more help at SG and Center to win the series. Suns in 6 games hopefully.

BlondeBomber41
09-01-2009, 07:10 PM
Just like the sudden death, each GM just vote for your own team. Each team only has 1 GM, so it shouldnt make anything uneven. I just didnt wanna see anymore mistake votes on the "GM's Click Here" option.

I like you
09-01-2009, 07:21 PM
Celtics

Catfish1314
09-01-2009, 07:50 PM
Good luck again to MHC :)

Mile High Champ
09-01-2009, 08:00 PM
Hopefully this becomes a little closer, the difference between our two teams aint that much..

Mile High Champ
09-01-2009, 08:06 PM
Good luck again to MHC :)

Same to you..:D

SeoulBeatz
09-01-2009, 08:18 PM
Lebron KG... AND Devin Harris...

sorry i have to give it to the celtics.

Nets fan 93
09-01-2009, 08:47 PM
Lebron KG... AND Devin Harris...

sorry i have to give it to the celtics.
Same...

As much as I like the Suns with VC and Nash...
LeBron Harris and KG is too much

bostncelts34
09-01-2009, 08:53 PM
Gotta go with the celtics here

Lebron, KG and Harris. Not to mention Sheed.


I beleive Harris would be the diffrence maker, blowing by Nash consistently.

Shady66
09-01-2009, 08:54 PM
cmon let the suns win ONE :p

Nets fan 93
09-01-2009, 08:54 PM
Gotta go with the celtics here

Lebron, KG and Harris. Not to mention Sheed.


I beleive Harris would be the diffrence maker, blowing by Nash consistently.

yeah his career high 47 points were against the Suns...(Nash)

Strumpy
09-01-2009, 09:03 PM
Ultimately I picked the Celts, but damn do the Suns look good...

Catfish1314
09-01-2009, 09:44 PM
Bump.

Durant is hype
09-01-2009, 09:46 PM
Boston.

roshan3ai
09-01-2009, 09:55 PM
Boston w. LeBron and Kg w/ Harris as a third option- unstoppable

bigsams50
09-01-2009, 10:00 PM
boston

Mile High Champ
09-01-2009, 10:05 PM
I hope I can close the gap here in voting. I thought it would be closer.

carter15
09-01-2009, 10:07 PM
ill go the other way on this.
Yao - Sheed
and
Lebron - Sjax * are a wash to me. Lebron and Yao will both dominate that matchup and the other guys in the matchup are very similar talent wise.
VC -Jones
and
KG - Shard * is again a wash. VC is way better then Jones, but Jones is a solid defender. KG is a lot better then Shard but Shard is very good offensively.
Nash - Harris * this is an interesting matchup, although Harris is much younger and faster, Nash has a huge edge in experience and will get the ball to his teamates much better then Harris. Due to the fact that both team have so many scorers already, I'll take the pure passer who can still jack up the 3 as good as anyone else. Advantage Nash.
Lastly theirs the benches. 3 impact players total between the 2 team. Odom, Martin and Hill. 2 are on Pheonix so they have the advantage on the bench. Odom might even start to help defend KG and bring Shard off the bench, they can both work and that gives Phoenix another nice advantage.

So overall, Pheonix in 7 is what id predict.

lakers4sho
09-01-2009, 10:15 PM
I like the Suns in this one, that team actually has a chance to work in real life, unlike the Celtics which is only great on paper

plus they've got depth with L.O. off the bench

Catfish1314
09-01-2009, 10:19 PM
I like the Suns in this one, that team actually has a chance to work in real life, unlike the Celtics which is only great on paper

Way to support that claim with absolutely nothing. There's no reason this team wouldn't work in real life.

LeBron has a huge ego but he's unselfish on the court, as are Garnett and Harris. Harris and Garnett can play off the ball or excel with it. So they would have no problem co-existing with James. Plus the whole team is great defensively.

Catfish1314
09-01-2009, 10:22 PM
plus they've got depth with L.O. off the bench

And one player makes a whole bench? I concede the Suns have superior depth but it's not a deciding factor in this series because with K-Mart, Foster, Ridnour my bench isn't too shabby either. Defense is the deciding factor. Mine is great, theirs is average.

jimbobjarree
09-01-2009, 10:22 PM
beantown all the way

theimortalone
09-01-2009, 10:23 PM
I voted for Phoenix.

BRICKCITYPIMP12
09-01-2009, 10:46 PM
i agree with most of you.. kg and james and then harris on top of that.. thats just crazy.
good job by both gms tho.

ots_drummer
09-01-2009, 11:12 PM
This seems like a no brainer to me....it has to be the celtics.

Not to mention I think the Yao sheed matchup favors Sheed. I'm not saying he's the better player but both KG and Sheed can spread the floor and shoot, I can't see Yao being able to have his usual success chasing them around the floor.

My prediction would be C's in 6

Mile High Champ
09-01-2009, 11:56 PM
bump....

I really hope this becomes closer, I know the series is not this one sided..

Mile High Champ
09-01-2009, 11:58 PM
And one player makes a whole bench? I concede the Suns have superior depth but it's not a deciding factor in this series because with K-Mart, Foster, Ridnour my bench isn't too shabby either. Defense is the deciding factor. Mine is great, theirs is average.

Rasheed Wallace is very much a shadow of what he once was on defense. He is old and much slower. This past year really saw his production and efficency drop. I just don't see him as a starting center in this league. The only good defender in my opinion on the celtics are Garnett and Jones. Lebron is an average defender at best, as is harris.

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 12:08 AM
Rasheed Wallace is very much a shadow of what he once was on defense. He is old and much slower. This past year really saw his production and efficency drop. I just don't see him as a starting center in this league. The only good defender in my opinion on the celtics are Garnett and Jones. Lebron is an average defender at best, as is harris.

I agree LeBron's defense is overrated but coaches vote for the All-Defensive teams and he was elected to the All-Defensive 1st team. That preaches volumes for what he is capable of defensively. Harris's defense wasn't as great this season as it has been in years past because he was in a much more significant offensive role than what he is used to. But laterally, he is one of the quickest point guards in the league and was the Mavs defensive weapon against Tony Parker, Steve Nash, etc. in Dallas for years. Both of them are definitely above average at least.

As for Rasheed Wallace, he is horribly inconsistent offensively. But I can't say I know where you're coming from on his defensive decline. He has surprisingly lost little mobility and he's still one of the most aggressive interior defenders the league has to offer.

Then there are Foster, Martin, and Bogans off the bench. All three specialize at the defensive end of the floor.

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 12:17 AM
I agree LeBron's defense is overrated but coaches vote for the All-Defensive teams and he was elected to the All-Defensive 1st team. That preaches volumes for what he is capable of defensively. Harris's defense wasn't as great this season as it has been in years past because he was in a much more significant offensive role than what he is used to. But laterally, he is one of the quickest point guards in the league and was the Mavs defensive weapon against Tony Parker, Steve Nash, etc. in Dallas for years. Both of them are definitely above average at least.

As for Rasheed Wallace, he is horribly inconsistent offensively. But I can't say I know where you're coming from on his defensive decline. He has surprisingly lost little mobility and he's still one of the most aggressive interior defenders the league has to offer.

Then there are Foster, Martin, and Bogans off the bench. All three specialize at the defensive end of the floor.


I saw Wallace this year often and really saw his game decline, especially on defence. He is a valuable addition and piece off the bench for a great team but there is a reason why he is no longer a starter. As far as Bogans and Foster go, you could not be anymore wrong. As a Pacers fan, I have seen Foster play a great deal and all he does well is rebound, he really is an ok defender. IF he was a better defender, he would see a lot more PT but it remains a fact that he is not a good defender, he does however know how to box out well and crash the boards. As far as bogans goes, he is simply a chucker. Dont get me wrong I really think your team is good but I don't see your team being as great on defence as you claim..

Cheers

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 12:28 AM
I saw Wallace this year often and really saw his game decline, especially on defence. He is a valuable addition and piece off the bench for a great team but there is a reason why he is no longer a starter. As far as Bogans and Foster go, you could not be anymore wrong. As a Pacers fan, I have seen Foster play a great deal and all he does well is rebound, he really is an ok defender. IF he was a better defender, he would see a lot more PT but it remains a fact that he is not a good defender, he does however know how to box out well and crash the boards. As far as bogans goes, he is simply a chucker. Dont get me wrong I really think your team is good but I don't see your team being as great on defence as you claim..

Cheers

What does being a chucker have to do with defense? Bogans has been known for defense, toughness, and outside shooting since he came into the league. He just isn't as high profile as a Raja Bell. Watch him. Read a scouting report.

I saw Wallace decline too, but primarily as an offensive player. He spends too much time outside and not enough time down on the baseline, but I saw virtually no decline in his defensive game. When he was interested and commited (like he would be in the playoffs), he was as great defensively as he's always been, other than being the expected step slower against the more agile young bigs. But he's guarding Yao in this series. I don't expect he would have to worry about agility.

The same goes for Stephen Jackson. An average defender in the regular season, great defender in the postseason.

As for Foster defense, that depends on who he's guarding. He's not a particularly mobile or athletic player, but just like Wallace, he doesn't have to be to defend Yao.

theimortalone
09-02-2009, 12:45 AM
It looks like Boston is dominating!

carter15
09-02-2009, 12:49 AM
more people shud read and listen to my post on the previous page :P

johnnychan
09-02-2009, 12:59 AM
Boston in 4 or 5

BlondeBomber41
09-02-2009, 01:02 AM
Basically over, congrats Catfish. I mean, you started with the Celtics... not that hard to win. :p

Raps08-09 Champ
09-02-2009, 01:02 AM
Celtics PF and C rotation is pretty rough and aggressive. I don't think Lewis, Yao and Odom handle that because they are finesse oriented.

I would say Celtics.

RocketsRule
09-02-2009, 01:04 AM
more people shud read and listen to my post on the previous page :P

Coming from a Rockets fan, to say that Yao Ming and Steven Jackson are greater than Lebron James and Rasheed Wallace is complete blasphemy. I'd take Lebron James over them any day of the week, it's not even close.

jeff86
09-02-2009, 01:09 AM
its not even close imo

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 03:03 AM
Coming from a Rockets fan, to say that Yao Ming and Steven Jackson are greater than Lebron James and Rasheed Wallace is complete blasphemy. I'd take Lebron James over them any day of the week, it's not even close.

Would expect nothing else from
catfish's right hand man.... Haha

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 07:44 AM
Basically over, congrats Catfish. I mean, you started with the Celtics...and ended up with a beastly all around team that even I couldn't come close to matching in talent, defense, and starpower.

Awwww shucks.

D-Will4Prez
09-02-2009, 12:22 PM
Celtics have a weak bench but with LeBron I think they would pull through to beat the Suns in 5 or 6

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 12:57 PM
wow my team is getting raped, I thought the series would be a lot closer than this..

PrettyBoyJ
09-02-2009, 01:09 PM
That Boston team is pretty much unbeatable...

Joshtd1
09-02-2009, 02:15 PM
So catty, now that me and the Suns match is over....who would you have voted for? Since your vote would have swayed the match.

Super.
09-02-2009, 02:33 PM
Celtics

KH12
09-02-2009, 02:42 PM
Congrats to Boston! If my team had to go out, at least I lost against the Champ.

I think I would have voted the Spurs to win it all if they made the finals against Boston though.

TragicallyHip
09-02-2009, 02:44 PM
C's in 4 EASY.

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 03:44 PM
C's in 4 EASY.

typical boston fan... :facepalm:

Ace33Bone
09-02-2009, 04:00 PM
Celtics but it wont be easy by any means... I say the Celtics in 7 1/2

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 04:21 PM
Celtics have a weak bench but with LeBron I think they would pull through to beat the Suns in 5 or 6

Kenyon Martin, Jeff Foster, and Luke Ridnour is a weak bench? Two of the three were starters last season and the third is a rock solid frontcourt rotation player.


So catty, now that me and the Suns match is over....who would you have voted for? Since your vote would have swayed the match.

Spurs. But it was damn close regardless.

Speaking of close, this should be a lot closer. Obviously I'm going to think my team is better than the Suns, but there's no reason this shouldn't be much closer.

Joshtd1
09-02-2009, 05:03 PM
I dont think the Suns matchup great against you.

Personally I think it would have been closer if my team face you, because I feel we matchup better.

jimbobjarree
09-02-2009, 07:34 PM
prolly would, it was closer between us and the Celts than this haha

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 07:34 PM
I dont think the Suns matchup great against you.

Personally I think it would have been closer if my team face you, because I feel we matchup better.

Yeah your team matches up almost perfectly in terms of being able to defend LeBron. I would have been more cautious facing your team than the Suns.

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 09:22 PM
Never thought my team got the respect it should have in this series but whatever the users of PSD have spoken.

Congrats Catfish on taking home the title!!

Cheers

Catfish1314
09-02-2009, 09:35 PM
Never thought my team got the respect it should have in this series but whatever the users of PSD have spoken.

Congrats Catfish on taking home the title!!

Cheers

Thanks :)

And congrats to you as well for advancing here. Fantastic job with that Suns team.

Look forward to competing against all of you again next Mock.

Joshtd1
09-02-2009, 09:54 PM
Does anyone know when the next mock is? I heard there was supposed to be one after the redraft?

theimortalone
09-02-2009, 09:55 PM
Wow, Boston Dominated! lol

Mile High Champ
09-02-2009, 10:57 PM
Does anyone know when the next mock is? I heard there was supposed to be one after the redraft?

Because the first one took so long to get started, there will not be another mock this year..

MackSnackWrap
09-02-2009, 11:15 PM
[QUOTE=roshan3ai;10721086]Boston w. LeBron and Kg w/ Harris as a third option- unstoppable[/QUOTE

pretty much sums up what i was gonna say

Toenail Clipper
09-03-2009, 12:04 AM
But the bench for Celtics suck though! -_-