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Raps18-19 Champ
08-14-2009, 10:56 PM
Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo?

I think the Jazz wins this with Millsap and Boozer with Pau and Odom for the Lakers a close 2nd.

what54!?
08-14-2009, 11:07 PM
The lakers since utah is trying to trade boozer

COBY KARL
08-14-2009, 11:09 PM
im sorry but did u watch the first round of the Playoffs?
Odom himself raped boozer and millsap

Raps18-19 Champ
08-14-2009, 11:18 PM
im sorry but did u watch the first round of the Playoffs?
Odom himself raped boozer and millsap

To be honest, I don't think Odom is anything that special now.

Boozer is still that 20 and 10 guy while Millsap is a quickly developing PF.

dre1990
08-14-2009, 11:27 PM
Utah

Toenail Clipper
08-14-2009, 11:31 PM
Lakers, depending on the rotation.
Pau + Odom = :clap:

cuttygiantsfan
08-14-2009, 11:32 PM
spurs:

duncan than blair

KnicksR4Real
08-14-2009, 11:35 PM
idk probablt the lakers

Catfish1314
08-14-2009, 11:37 PM
To be honest, I don't think Odom is anything that special now.

Boozer is still that 20 and 10 guy while Millsap is a quickly developing PF.

He also doesn't even put up an effort at the defensive end of the floor. Odom is just as good a rebounder, a far better defender, and a more versatile player. Consistency is still an issue with him, but he was more consistent this season than in years past with the Lakers. Now I would still rather have a healthy Boozer than Odom, but if one of them is less special than the other, it's Boozer because he only plays at one end.

Gasol is better than Boozer and Odom is better than Millsap. Those are the two best PF combos in the league to me, so the Lakers get the nod.

Raidaz4Life
08-14-2009, 11:39 PM
Lakers or Jazz

D-Will4Prez
08-14-2009, 11:43 PM
Boozer is a douche but I'd still have to say Boozer/Millsap combo was the best and seeing how a trade involving Boozer is now unlikely, will probably continue to be the best PF combo next year. Here is a comparison of Boozer and Millsap against Gasol and Odom using their stats in the 2009 playoffs:

Boozer 20.6PPG 13.2RPG
Millsap 11.8PPG 8.0RPG
A total of 32.4PPG 21.2RPG

Gasol 18.3PPG 10.8RPG
Odom 12.3PPG 9.1RPG
A total of 30PPG 19.9RPG

As you can see, the Jazz have the better PF combo.

Kakaroach
08-14-2009, 11:47 PM
Carlos Boozer and Paul Millsap.

Lakerfan8032
08-14-2009, 11:48 PM
Lakers. Pau is one of the better big men in the game and Odom is quite versatile and would be a starter on almost any other team. I like Milsap but don't see him as a 20 and 10 guy if he played starter minutes. Boozer is obviously good but he's always hurt it seems plus he went to Duke, which puts him down a few notches for me on that fact alone.:D

Raps18-19 Champ
08-14-2009, 11:50 PM
He also doesn't even put up an effort at the defensive end of the floor. Odom is just as good a rebounder, a far better defender, and a more versatile player. Consistency is still an issue with him, but he was more consistent this season than in years past with the Lakers. Now I would still rather have a healthy Boozer than Odom, but if one of them is less special than the other, it's Boozer because he only plays at one end.

Gasol is better than Boozer and Odom is better than Millsap. Those are the two best PF combos in the league to me, so the Lakers get the nod.

Millsap was almost a 20 and 10 guy as a starter.

AntiG
08-14-2009, 11:51 PM
Celtics. KG and Sheed/Baby.

Catfish1314
08-14-2009, 11:58 PM
Millsap was almost a 20 and 10 guy as a starter.

16 and 10. And I'm a big fan. He's gritty, physical, and willingly plays defense. But offensively, he's not as refined as Odom and can't do most of what Odom does at the offensive end of the floor.

Millsap averaged 16, 10 and a block in 34 minutes a game as a starter this year. Odom, also in 34 minutes a game, averaged 14, 11, and 1.5 blocks as a starter. Odom is just more versatile and I value his versatility very highly. I guess it just depends on what type of player you're more fond of.

Long-term, I would obviously rather have Millsap because he's so much younger.

Lakers4ItAll
08-15-2009, 12:02 AM
Gasol/Odom > Boozer/Millsap

because they are proven winners

Lakerfan8032
08-15-2009, 12:04 AM
Boozer is a douche but I'd still have to say Boozer/Millsap combo was the best and seeing how a trade involving Boozer is now unlikely, will probably continue to be the best PF combo next year. Here is a comparison of Boozer and Millsap against Gasol and Odom using their stats in the 2009 playoffs:

Boozer 20.6PPG 13.2RPG
Millsap 11.8PPG 8.0RPG
A total of 32.4PPG 21.2RPG

Gasol 18.3PPG 10.8RPG
Odom 12.3PPG 9.1RPG
A total of 30PPG 19.9RPG

As you can see, the Jazz have the better PF combo.

Well, I guess that five game series clears the debate up.:rolleyes: So based on your stats, a difference of 1.8 ppg (you added the ppg of Gasol and Odom wrong) and 1.3 rpg proves that the Jazz pf combo is superior? That difference is minimal and you don't provide a more collective set of statistics to back up your claim. The game is more than just points and rebounds. You could have used the +/- differential, in which Lamar was second best in the NBA this past season, only behind LeBron.

I don't think anyone is saying that the Laker combo is vastly superior to the Jazz combo but they are a bit better. I think they provide a more diverse set of skills to compliment the team and most people would think Gasol is the better player of the four.

The only thing I'll give you is that the Jazz pg is vastly superior to the Laker pg. I would love to see D-Will in a Laker uniform someday.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-15-2009, 12:06 AM
Rasheed Wallace is going to be the C.

Lakerfan8032
08-15-2009, 12:14 AM
Celtics. KG and Sheed/Baby.

KG, as much as I hate the guy, is a beast, especially on D, where he has Gasol, Odom, Boozer and Millsap thoroughly beat. Rasheed however is losing it quickly and can also do that for his team just as quickly. His meltdowns are pathetic and he can only be effective for small stretches of time now. Maybe he will feel revitalized this season but as of now I think his negatives outweigh his positives. I was surprised with how well Davis stepped up in KG's absence but he has to show he can be effective over a period of time before he can be considered one of the best back-ups.

StevenU2009
08-15-2009, 12:31 AM
I can't believe it took so may votes prior to the one before mine to say Celtics. Boozer is (just a numbers guy-not in a class with the celts or lakers pfs)

Ebbs
08-15-2009, 12:45 AM
kg and sheed

Bausman
08-15-2009, 01:06 AM
Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo?

I think the Jazz wins this with Millsap and Boozer with Pau and Odom for the Lakers a close 2nd.

Why? Gasol is a better player than Boozer and Odem is better than millsap. Im a big Milsap fan but Odem is a valuble player. He doesnt have jaw dropping stats bit he does a little bit of everything, and is possibly the most versitile player in the NBA(sf,pf, and point forward).
I love 20/10 guys but Zack Randolph is a 20/10 guy and I would never want him on my team. I think Boozer is a better player than Randolph but his value is overrated and has no loyalty(Cavs & now Utah) and just plays for the money. Hes a business man not a ball player.
On the otherhand Gasol has been one of the most underrated players in the game. He is not a guy that is going to lead his team to a ring but has quite obviously shown he can help get you there. Just like Odem, he doesnt put up the most impressive stats(coincidence?), but his versitility(pf,c), great hands/touch/length, and most importantly his unselfishness and strong team play. Thats a valuable quality when you have a guy like Kobe on your team.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 01:09 AM
If you consider Gasol a true PF (and not a PF/C) and you do the same for KG AND Sheed, then i think it goes like this:

1. Lakers (Gasol + Odom)
2. Jazz (Boozer +Millsap)
3. Rockets (Scola + Landry)
4. Celtics (KG + Sheed)
5. Magic (Lewis + Bass)

zachattach
08-15-2009, 02:01 AM
I have to say Gasol/ LO, the thing that sticks out the most to me is that they both give you such different looks and both are great passers, and team players.

Boozer/ Millsap pretty much give you the same look minus one is better at defense and the other is better at offense. Neither guy is known for play making.

KG/Sheed both are great players but we haven't seen what they are like together in a rotation. Sheed is most effective in his man to man defense and spreading the floor, isn't a great rebounder and has really lost his edge on the box. He's become to slow to gaurd most pf's.

zachattach
08-15-2009, 02:02 AM
I have to say Gasol/ LO, the thing that sticks out the most to me is that they both give you such different looks and both are great passers, and team players.

Boozer/ Millsap pretty much give you the same look minus one is better at defense and the other is better at offense. Neither guy is known for play making.

KG/Sheed both are great players but we haven't seen what they are like together in a rotation. Sheed is most effective in his man to man defense and spreading the floor, isn't a great rebounder and has really lost his edge on the box. He's become to slow to gaurd most pf's.

smith&wesson
08-15-2009, 02:23 AM
boston.

garnet and sheed are both natural 4's

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 02:35 AM
Boozer is a douche but I'd still have to say Boozer/Millsap combo was the best and seeing how a trade involving Boozer is now unlikely, will probably continue to be the best PF combo next year. Here is a comparison of Boozer and Millsap against Gasol and Odom using their stats in the 2009 playoffs:

Boozer 20.6PPG 13.2RPG
Millsap 11.8PPG 8.0RPG
A total of 32.4PPG 21.2RPG

Gasol 18.3PPG 10.8RPG
Odom 12.3PPG 9.1RPG
A total of 30PPG 19.9RPG

As you can see, the Jazz have the better PF combo.

gasol and odom are no doubt better players.
lets be serious now.
do you really believe boozer is better than gasol?(arguably a top 10-15 player)

those stats just prove he had more shots per game.
gasol had a much higher shooting %, is much more versatile, and actually played most of the season.

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 02:37 AM
boston.

garnet and sheed are both natural 4's

is sheed or garnett going to be backing up?
if so then you might have a case.
im guessing you dont;)

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:38 AM
Odom is a SF not a PF and will back up Ron Ron

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:39 AM
If you consider Gasol a true PF (and not a PF/C) and you do the same for KG AND Sheed, then i think it goes like this:

1. Lakers (Gasol + Odom)
2. Jazz (Boozer +Millsap)
3. Rockets (Scola + Landry)
4. Celtics (KG + Sheed)
5. Magic (Lewis + Bass)
Odom and Lewis are SF's.

Fireworld
08-15-2009, 02:42 AM
Lakers and Celtics.

LA:Gasol and Odom.
BOS:KG and Sheed.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:43 AM
Lakers and Celtics.

LA:Gasol and Odom.
BOS:KG and Sheed.
Odom plays SF

kurivaimu
08-15-2009, 02:52 AM
celtics: KG - Sheed - Big Baby

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 03:00 AM
Odom is a SF not a PF and will back up Ron Ron

he is either really, mostly PF these days.
i guarantee you he will fill in at PF when gasol or bynum go to the bench, just like he did when bynum was injured.

zachattach
08-15-2009, 03:01 AM
Odom plays SF
No he does not. When Odom comes in (off the bench) he comes in for Bynum which causes Pau to slide over to center while Odom plays PF.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:05 AM
Mavrix, do some research, please.

Lewis and Odom are PF's and both played at the 4 spot for the vast majority of thier minutes.

samus
08-15-2009, 03:32 AM
haslem and JO

cough cough

salimstoudamire
08-15-2009, 03:38 AM
Gasol and Odom are better than Boozer and Millsap. But, the Celtics have a disgusting PF combo of Garnett and Sheed. But since it is between Lakers and Utah, I gotta take Lakers.

nba08
08-15-2009, 03:41 AM
odom is a hybrid 4 and last time i check milsap and boozer cant move there feet fast enough to keep with odom or gasol there stats are more because thats what there team demands from them. in a 2 vs 2 game, odom and gasol would just walk around boozer whos plays no defense and look right over milsap who has heart but sadly not the height. i truly believe that healthy kg and sheed are better than milsap and boozer

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 03:41 AM
Mavrix, do some research, please.

Lewis and Odom are PF's and both played at the 4 spot for the vast majority of thier minutes.

They are not natural 4's and play out of position. No research needed.

Rex-Raptorz
08-15-2009, 03:42 AM
6. griffin and kaman

Draco
08-15-2009, 03:43 AM
If the Celtics use Rasheed off the bench to spell Garnett then I'll make my guess and say the Celtics.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 03:45 AM
They are not natural 4's and play out of position. No research needed.

http://www.nba.com/fantasy/draft_kit/smallforwards1_15.html

Have a nice day

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 03:48 AM
http://www.nba.com/fantasy/draft_kit/smallforwards1_15.html

Have a nice day

you are going to take a fantasy draft from years ago and claim that makes odom a SF no matter what?
he very often plays PF, infact he plays PF most of the time these days.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:49 AM
haha well i'm glad you know so much more about where these guys should naturally play than their multi-millionaire coaches do.

Too bad their teams didn't hire you do play them at their nutural positions or just think how successful they could be then...

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 03:50 AM
you are going to take a fantasy draft from years ago and claim that makes odom a SF no matter what?
he very often plays PF, infact he plays PF most of the time these days.They are NATURAL 4's. They play OUT OF position.

Here's one from last year.

http://probasketball.about.com/od/fantasybasketball/a/sfrankings.htm

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 03:51 AM
here is a link for you:


Odom came off the bench to play power forward and the Lakers were often a better team.
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-lakers-lamar-odom15-2009jul15,0,5773043.story

dont believe that? watch some games.

you do not decide what their position is based on what their "natural position" is.
if i go out and play center being 5'11'', i would be considered a center not a PG.
players are the position they play at.
when lamar goes out and plays PF the majority of the time, he is a power forward..
i dont think its too hard of a concept to understand.

zachattach
08-15-2009, 03:54 AM
They are not natural 4's and play out of position. No research needed.

Doesn't matter if they are natural or not, if they play there minutes on the floor as power forwards then that what they are.. Dirk isn't much different from them to either.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:57 AM
I guess maybe Dirk has played out of position his whole career, possibly explaining why he seems to choke whenever the pressure is on.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 03:58 AM
Discuss this here

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=234520

No need to argue in this thread.

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 04:01 AM
Discuss this here

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=234520

No need to argue in this thread.

that is a very different subject.
it is irrelevant to this thread whether he is better at SF or PF.
the fact is he plays PF often, and is considered a backup to gasol at the PF spot.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 04:03 AM
Aaaaaaand the vote seems to be in favor of PF.
the people have spoken.

"Have a nice day"

KobeBeatJeeesus
08-15-2009, 05:06 AM
Whether or not Odom is naturally a SF doesn't mean anything when you consider the fact that HE ACTUALLY PLAYS PF. He may be a 3 man on your team, but hes a 4 on mine.

DitchDat
08-15-2009, 06:51 AM
Boston if everything goes well

KG - Rasheed

fredv
08-15-2009, 07:31 AM
Luis Scola and Carl Landry - the 2 headed monster.

Rockets don't have the best PF's, however, they have the best PER at that position in the league.

rabzouz 96
08-15-2009, 08:14 AM
minnesota could also be mentioned.love is not as good as odom/millsap but al jefferson is better than boozer/gasol

StevenU2009
08-15-2009, 11:59 AM
It is pretty silly to argue whether Gasol is a 4 or a 5, whether Odom is a 3 or a 4, whether KG is a 4 or a 5, whether 'Sheed is a 4 or 5-you get the idea. Part of the reason these players are winners and such good players is their versatility; they play basketball and have combinations of skills associated with different positions and that's a big part of why the Lakers and the Celtics (and the magic) are so good. I still say Boozer/Millsap is WAY below the big two-and the guy that puts Scola and Landry is there was joking-right?-Also, putting Love/Jefferson in the conversation is a very good point-I'd put them at #3 behind Lakers/Celts.

Toenail Clipper
08-15-2009, 12:08 PM
Odom is a SF not a PF and will back up Ron Ron

NO
He is a legit power forward.
He can play Center, Small Forward, or Point Guard, but not shooting guard.
Never say he ain't a power forward.
That's just wrong
It's like saying Dirk Nowitzki is a shooting guard

MegaFauna
08-15-2009, 12:36 PM
certainly not my bulls who have zero legitimate pf's, but yea i'd probably go with the lakers

bigsams50
08-15-2009, 12:37 PM
lake show, i think sheeds gonna play center

J_M_B
08-15-2009, 12:38 PM
Which team has the best PF duo?

I'm going to have say the L.A

Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom

close 2nd Utah Jazz - Carlos Boozer and Pau Milsap

AIMelo=KillaDUO
08-15-2009, 12:57 PM
Boozer and Milsap couldn't hold Odom's or Pau's jockstrap!

Chacarron
08-15-2009, 01:02 PM
Lakers.

DCSportsIsPain
08-15-2009, 01:06 PM
Boozer and Milsap couldn't hold Odom's or Pau's jockstrap!

OK. Why would they want to? :eyebrow:

DrDEADalready
08-15-2009, 01:16 PM
Jazz easily.

THiiRTYONE
08-15-2009, 01:17 PM
Celtics! KG and wallace/baby

Mr.Nate30
08-15-2009, 01:18 PM
rank top 5
1. uta boozer/milsap
2. lal gasol/odom
3.spurs duncan/blair
4.lac camby/griffin
5.mavs dirk/marion

Storch
08-15-2009, 01:50 PM
You guys are all nuts!

Boston Celtics: Garnett and Wallace

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:42 PM
that is a very different subject.
it is irrelevant to this thread whether he is better at SF or PF.
the fact is he plays PF often, and is considered a backup to gasol at the PF spot.

Obviously it is irrelevant to this thread which is why I said to argue it in the other thread.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:46 PM
NO
He is a legit power forward.
He can play Center, Small Forward, or Point Guard, but not shooting guard.
Never say he ain't a power forward.
That's just wrong
It's like saying Dirk Nowitzki is a shooting guard
Saying Odom is a small forward is like saying Nowitzki is a shooting guard?


That has to be the funniest post I've read on this forum thus far.

Odom actually plays at the 3 and has been considered a 3 almost all his career. Nowitzki hasn't even played at the 3, how the hell could he play the 2?

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 02:47 PM
In that case Dallas has the best PF combo in Nowitzki and Marion, since Marion obviously plays the 4 position and will slide over to the 4 when Dirk needs a rest.

ChaseMe
08-15-2009, 02:56 PM
Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom hands down, any as a starter would have 20/10 stats with ease. Boozer and Millsap are in 2nd because Millsap's skills aren't as honed in as Odoms, Odom can do anything Millsap can with ease.

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 03:06 PM
minnesota could also be mentioned.love is not as good as odom/millsap but al jefferson is better than boozer/gasol
gasol is better than jefferson.
much more versatile. much better shooting, passing, etc.
jefferson shot a much worse %, and has much less range.


In that case Dallas has the best PF combo in Nowitzki and Marion, since Marion obviously plays the 4 position and will slide over to the 4 when Dirk needs a rest.

is marion going to be playing off the bench, and playing most of his time at PF?
no..
stop being a hater/homer.

DetroitRipCity
08-15-2009, 03:06 PM
If you consider Gasol a true PF (and not a PF/C) and you do the same for KG AND Sheed, then i think it goes like this:

1. Lakers (Gasol + Odom)
2. Jazz (Boozer +Millsap)
3. Rockets (Scola + Landry)
4. Celtics (KG + Sheed)
5. Magic (Lewis + Bass)

Scola and Landry ahead of KG, Sheed and Lewis, Bass.... yea you can stop talking now

RaptorsFanatic
08-15-2009, 03:14 PM
() |) () |\/| and G /\ S () |_

|_ () |_

ChaseMe
08-15-2009, 03:17 PM
If you're going to put 2 potential PF starters together, then I might as well say Chris Bosh and Andrea Bargnani.

disk 8
08-15-2009, 03:20 PM
kg & sheed

RaptorsFanatic
08-15-2009, 03:21 PM
if you're going to put 2 potential pf starters together, then i might as well say chris bosh and andrea bargnani.

^ |_ () |_

s () /\/\ e () |\| e ' s s /\/\ () k | |\| s () /\/\ e \/\/ e e |)...

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:22 PM
Haha guess you don't watch much basketball. KG and Sheed are how old?
yeah that's what i thought.

If you had seen the Lakers - Rockets playoff series maybe you would have seen Scola and Landry put a number on the duo most people are putting as No. 1 (Gasol and Odom). Scola even played at center when Yao went down and still had success. Sheed has very little left and KG is nearing the end of his career as well. If we were talking about those to in thier prime? Forget about it they would be ahead of all the other guys including Gasol and Odom. But sadly those guys will be out of the league soon and are having a tough time even staying on the court (how many games did KG play last season? thanks for proving my point.)

The guy who put Duncan and Blair at 3 is the one who needs to rethink his post. Blair hesn't even played an NBA game yet. Duncan is probably the best PF in the game WHEN HEALTHY but really, this post is about the best DUO in the game, and Duncan has no legit backup at the 4 spot at the moment.
nice try though.

AND, i'm glad to see what this whole rant from mavrix was about this whole time, and that is that he's just upset no one put his mavricks PF's in the conversation, explaining why he wants everyone to somehow believe Odom is a 3 guy that way the Lakers can't be considered to have the best PF duo in the league. He should have just come out and said that in the first place.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:24 PM
and by the way, detriotripcity, you have a bit of a bias toward Sheed don't you think? being a pisstons fan and all.
yeah thanks

YOU can stop talking now.

scully8743
08-15-2009, 03:25 PM
Garnett and Rasheed

mikantsass
08-15-2009, 03:27 PM
Well since all the Laker fans are being homers, so am I.

KG and Sheed

scully8743
08-15-2009, 03:30 PM
and by the way, detriotripcity, you have a bit of a bias toward Sheed don't you think? being a pisstons fan and all.
yeah thanks

YOU can stop talking now.

Don't you think you may have some anger issues you need to work out. Garnett's physical stature is incredible and he could probably play another 5 seasons. Rasheed could still start on most teams and if you haven't noticed by watching guys like Dikembe your defense doesn't really disappear as you get older so he can still contribute in a big way especially coming off the bench.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 03:42 PM
haha anger issues? The dude called me out; i'm perfectly fine but if he's going to be an a**hole then i'll stand my ground.
And i agree with you completely. They are both great players and certainly in their prime they would have been quite a force for any team to try to compete against. BUT, KG is beginning to have issues staying healthy, and your talent doesn't mean anything if you are on the bench hurt. Sheed is a great asset to any team because of his size and shooting ability but he has lost a lot of his inside game, which he used to have, and is not nearly as quick as he once was.

So like i already said, in thier prime, Sheed and KG at the 4 spot would be a nightmare, but these days, the younger, quicker, guys with more energy and better moves are going to win out in my opinion. And you're acting like i said KG and Sheed are no good. That's the opposite of what i said. I have them in the top 5 duo's even in thier older years in the league.

Lions #81
08-15-2009, 03:55 PM
top 3

Celtics= KG/Sheed very impressive
Lakers=get the edge because they won a championship with Gasol/Odom
Jazz=Boozer/Millsap havent proven anything yet so yeah

jus imagine if the blazers got millsap LMA/Millsap =best duo but it didnt happen

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 04:02 PM
if Millsap and Boozer don't get the nod then how would Milsap and Lamarcus Aldridge?
Are you saying you think Aldridge is better than Boozer?
please.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 04:13 PM
gasol is better than jefferson.
much more versatile. much better shooting, passing, etc.
jefferson shot a much worse %, and has much less range.



is marion going to be playing off the bench, and playing most of his time at PF?
no..
stop being a hater/homer.Please show me where in this thread it says anything about a player coming off the bench to back up the starting PF?

Marion will be backing Nowitzki up a lot, especially when he slides to the 5. Dallas will be playing a lot of small ball this season.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 04:17 PM
Well, let's check the title of this thread:
" Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo? "

See the word "backup"? I'm pretty sure that implies coming off the bench.

Well, that clears that up.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 04:30 PM
Well, let's check the title of this thread:
" Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo? "

See the word "backup"? I'm pretty sure that implies coming off the bench.

Well, that clears that up.
Actually, it doesn't. You can back up a player even if you start.

For example, Josh Howard will be the starting 2 for Dallas, but Jason Terry will get most of his minutes there which will allow Howard to move to the 3 where he get's most of his minutes and move Marion to the 4 and Nowitzki to the 5.

You don't have to come off the bench to back up a specific position.

Well, that clears that up.

DeadMemories
08-15-2009, 04:31 PM
Odom is clearly a PF, he hardly spends any minutes at all the past 2 seasons at SF. Dont know how someone who doesnt even watch every laker game to say Odom is a clear SF nowadays. Just ridiculous.

Sheed is an old player now.

Pau/Odom are in their primes.

Id put them over Boozer and Millsap based on them being proven winners and defense.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 04:38 PM
If that was the issue being argued in THIS thread then that would defeat the purpose of it. Then we would simply call this thread "Which team has the best 3/4/5 spot rotation"

and last time i looked it specified starting and backup PF duo, which means a player who starts at PF, and a second PF off the bench to back him up.

you can stop trying now, mavrix.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 04:52 PM
If that was the issue being argued in THIS thread then that would defeat the purpose of it. Then we would simply call this thread "Which team has the best 3/4/5 spot rotation"

and last time i looked it specified starting and backup PF duo, which means a player who starts at PF, and a second PF off the bench to back him up.

you can stop trying now, mavrix.Stop trying? What are you talking about? Stop going off topic with your whole rotation argument.

This thread clearly asked, "Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF"

Nowitzki starts and Marion will back him up at the 4 where he will play the majority of his minutes. No where in this thread does it say anything about the back up coming off the bench.

Everyone jumped at me when I said Odom is a natural 3 playing out of position at the 4. Same can be said about Marion.

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 05:07 PM
The difference is that Odom does not start, he comes off the bench and plays for Gasol at the 4 spot, making him a backup PF. If you want to talk about rotating people around then go ahead but just FYI, that is not the topic being discussed here.

Mavrix
08-15-2009, 05:39 PM
The difference is that Odom does not start, he comes off the bench and plays for Gasol at the 4 spot, making him a backup PF. If you want to talk about rotating people around then go ahead but just FYI, that is not the topic being discussed here.


No where in this thread does it say anything about the back up coming off the bench.

.

mrblisterdundee
08-15-2009, 05:50 PM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

GSPftw
08-15-2009, 06:14 PM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.


Really? you know this for a fact?
For now, he is in Utah, so for now, we'll use them as an option.
thanks for playing

DetroitRipCity
08-15-2009, 06:37 PM
and by the way, detriotripcity, you have a bit of a bias toward Sheed don't you think? being a pisstons fan and all.
yeah thanks

YOU can stop talking now.

uhhh i HATE sheed he can go **** himself but hes still a better player then Scola or Landry

DetroitRipCity
08-15-2009, 06:38 PM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

Warrick doesnt play for the Grizz anymore hes with the Bucks

scully8743
08-15-2009, 06:40 PM
haha anger issues? The dude called me out; i'm perfectly fine but if he's going to be an a**hole then i'll stand my ground.
And i agree with you completely. They are both great players and certainly in their prime they would have been quite a force for any team to try to compete against. BUT, KG is beginning to have issues staying healthy, and your talent doesn't mean anything if you are on the bench hurt. Sheed is a great asset to any team because of his size and shooting ability but he has lost a lot of his inside game, which he used to have, and is not nearly as quick as he once was.

So like i already said, in thier prime, Sheed and KG at the 4 spot would be a nightmare, but these days, the younger, quicker, guys with more energy and better moves are going to win out in my opinion. And you're acting like i said KG and Sheed are no good. That's the opposite of what i said. I have them in the top 5 duo's even in thier older years in the league.

Fair Enough

WSU Tony
08-15-2009, 07:23 PM
Some of you don't even have Minnesota (Jefferson and Love) in your top 7, that's hillarious. Jefferson doesn't even have another player to work with so don't give me that "Gasol is better than Jefferson" nonsense. Take away Kobe and others and lets see how Gasol does as a #1 and only option with the ball.....

I put the Wolves in the top 3, for sure.

Boston-Born
08-15-2009, 07:32 PM
is sheed or garnett going to be backing up?
if so then you might have a case.
im guessing you dont;)

Well since Sheed is coming off the bench, I guess he does have a point:clap:

MackSnackWrap
08-15-2009, 07:42 PM
Jazz for sure if they keep Bozzer, lakers not far behind

jdricks
08-15-2009, 07:46 PM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

:speechless: Bass isn't even a starting caliber PF and Battie is a 3rd or 4th string center on most teams....


Some of you don't even have Minnesota (Jefferson and Love) in your top 7, that's hillarious. Jefferson doesn't even have another player to work with so don't give me that "Gasol is better than Jefferson" nonsense. Take away Kobe and others and lets see how Gasol does as a #1 and only option with the ball.....

I put the Wolves in the top 3, for sure.

It's supposed to be starter/backup lol, not your starting center and a guy that started some at PF...

1- Pau/Odom
2- KG/Sheed
3- Boozer/Millsap
4- Duncan/McDyess-Blair
5- Scola/Landry
6- Beasley/Haslem

Can't think of any other "duos" where there are two solid PFs. I probably missed some. Obviously if it's best production from the position Bosh and his mediocre backup and Amare with his mediocre backup would be on there at 5 on but I'm listing those who have a good player and a good player spelling that good player.

jim51990
08-15-2009, 07:54 PM
this no contest celtics kg with sheed and bigb baby backing him up

cambovenzi
08-15-2009, 08:06 PM
i didnt realize how weak sheed's shooting is.
41.9% last year? from a PF? eww.
he also didnt get many rebounds, even from a fulltime starting spot last year.

DetroitRipCity
08-15-2009, 08:42 PM
i didnt realize how weak sheed's shooting is.
41.9% last year? from a PF? eww.
he also didnt get many rebounds, even from a fulltime starting spot last year.

yea cause all he did was camp out at the 3pt line

Super.
08-15-2009, 10:59 PM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

Im loling so hard at your last three, and you dont even have the KG/Sheed Combo up there

KG > A'mare Sheed > Frye
KG >>>> Zach Randolph Sheed >>> Warrick
KG >>>>>>>> Bass Sheed over...Battie? Battie was traded for VC..

blastmasta26
08-16-2009, 12:54 AM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie
Boozer hasn't been moved yet, that's still an option.

And way to make an outdated list. Warrick is on the Bucks now and Battie is on the Nets. Also, McDyess might start at PF with Duncan starting at C. And Amare and Frye is not that good.

However, Gasol/Odom is very good, slightly better than KG/Sheed.

JMKnick33
08-16-2009, 01:07 AM
I know Rasheed will be playing some center. But if my assumption is that he'll be 6th man behind Perkins and Garnett.. he might play some PF as well. So, I'd have to say Celtics with KG and Rasheed Wallace.

JMKnick33
08-16-2009, 01:09 AM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

:confused:

Daze9900
08-16-2009, 01:44 AM
To be honest, I don't think Odom is anything that special now.

Boozer is still that 20 and 10 guy while Millsap is a quickly developing PF.

You just answered the question. Millsap is quickly developing. Let me know when he's better than odom because his offensive game is nowhere on Odom's level. Jazz are dying to rid themselves of boozer.

Pau Gasol = 18.8ppg, 3.2apg, 8.7rpg 1.7bpg
L. Odom = 15.1ppg, 4.2apg, 8.8rpg,1.0bpg

Boozer = 16.0ppg, 2.4apg, 10rpg, 0.4bpg,
Millsap = 9.4ppg, 1.2apg, 6.4rpg, 0.9bpg in 22 minutes per

There you have it folks the numbers don't lie, You get less defense, less playmaking, less scoring, less championships, less scoring with the Utah tandem. Even if you try to estimate would Millsap would do as a starter i dont think he would top Odom's worst year. He just does not have the skillset to outsmart the defenses once they would key in on him. Odom has an offensive arsenal that puts him over the top of Millsap. Millsap is not the next karl malone. Sorry Utah.

ARMIN12NBA
08-16-2009, 01:46 AM
Odom plays SF

No.

ARMIN12NBA
08-16-2009, 01:50 AM
Saying Odom is a small forward is like saying Nowitzki is a shooting guard?


That has to be the funniest post I've read on this forum thus far.

Odom actually plays at the 3 and has been considered a 3 almost all his career. Nowitzki hasn't even played at the 3, how the hell could he play the 2?

Not for the past 3 years (he has played power forward during this time) and only sparingly in the past 6 years.

AntiG
08-16-2009, 02:21 AM
is sheed or garnett going to be backing up?
if so then you might have a case.
im guessing you dont;)

Sheed is a backup at both 4 and 5.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
08-16-2009, 04:30 AM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

:smoking:

rabzouz 96
08-16-2009, 06:58 PM
gasol is better than jefferson.
much more versatile. much better shooting, passing, etc.
jefferson shot a much worse %, and has much less range.


no he isnt and what i want from my pf is rebounding and jefferson is much better there, i dont need no range on my pf, hes supposed to score inside. jefferson is the better scorer and rebounder.

daleja424
08-16-2009, 07:00 PM
Haslem and Beasley... Thats two starting quality bigs

daleja424
08-16-2009, 07:01 PM
should be up in the top 5-10 duos

Super.
08-17-2009, 12:21 AM
should be up in the top 5-10 duos

no not really, beasley hasnt really done anything... and haslem? :puke:

Illuminati999
08-17-2009, 01:00 AM
Well, let's check the title of this thread:
" Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo? "

See the word "backup"? I'm pretty sure that implies coming off the bench.

Well, that clears that up.

Backing up implies coming off the bench seeing as that is where most of the "backing up" comes from.


Actually, it doesn't. You can back up a player even if you start.

For example, Josh Howard will be the starting 2 for Dallas, but Jason Terry will get most of his minutes there which will allow Howard to move to the 3 where he get's most of his minutes and move Marion to the 4 and Nowitzki to the 5.

You don't have to come off the bench to back up a specific position.

Well, that clears that up.

Technically speaking, he is correct. Kidd could even be considered a backup 2 considering when Barea and Terry are on the floor, he DEFENDS the 2 because of his size. Having said that, and on a technicality, how can anyone argue that DIRK NOWITZKI and SHAWN MARION are not the best PF duo? The only argument I can make is that they haven't played together. But that hasn't stopped KG and RW fans from claiming they are the best. In fact, you could even argue Marion is better than Odom. Marion did thrive with Kidd when he was drafted and when he played with Nash. So in comparison with the Lakers Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom duo, Nowitzki is hands down better than Gasol, and Marion is at least greater than or equal to Odom.

My vote, Nowitzki and Marion. Now if it was specifically not just a backup but a "bench player," Lakers win this one.

Just trying to be unbiased =).

Illuminati999
08-17-2009, 01:03 AM
If you're going to put 2 potential PF starters together, then I might as well say Chris Bosh and Andrea Bargnani.

Nowitzki and Marion still better...

Illuminati999
08-17-2009, 01:12 AM
The difference is that Odom does not start, he comes off the bench and plays for Gasol at the 4 spot, making him a backup PF. If you want to talk about rotating people around then go ahead but just FYI, that is not the topic being discussed here.

I feel bad for Mavrix, but the kid has a point. Marion will not be STARTING at PF, he will be Dirk's "backup." Point is, backup implies bench, but is not limited to it.


back⋅up
  /ˈbękˌʌp/ [bak-uhp]
a person or thing that supports or reinforces another

source: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/backup

In Mavrix case, Marion will be reinforcing the position given [PF] because he does not START as a PF.

theuuord
08-17-2009, 02:38 AM
Boozer is not going to be in Utah next season, so don't use them as an option.

1. Lakers - Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom
2. San Antonio - Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess
3. Phoenix - Amare Stoudemire and Channing Frye
4. Grizzlies - Zach Randolph and Hakim Warrick
5. Magic - Brandon Bass and Tony Battie

Hakim Warrick is on the Bucks and Tony Battie is on the Nets.

Mavrix
08-17-2009, 03:50 AM
I feel bad for Mavrix, but the kid has a point. Marion will not be STARTING at PF, he will be Dirk's "backup." Point is, backup implies bench, but is not limited to it.


back⋅up
  /ˈbękˌʌp/ [bak-uhp]
a person or thing that supports or reinforces another

source: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/backup

In Mavrix case, Marion will be reinforcing the position given [PF] because he does not START as a PF.
Thank you.

heatbb
08-17-2009, 04:03 AM
Weren't the Mavs going with J-How @ 2 and Marion @ 3?

xBLAMEITON24x
08-17-2009, 04:36 AM
Gasol Odom has my vote this duo/rotation is the number one reason why lakers are definding champs

dodie53
08-17-2009, 05:00 AM
Amare and Sweet Lou.
hehe

Illuminati999
08-17-2009, 07:54 AM
Gasol Odom has my vote this duo/rotation is the number one reason why lakers are definding champs

That's funny, I thought the number one reason the Lakers are "definding" champs is because of the dude on your picture, Kobe Bryant. Guess not .... should he even be credited as a reason to you?

D. Fisher and J. Farmar (along with S. Brown) are the lakers PGs, does that mean their duo (or trio) is better than any other PG duo (or trio) in the NBA simply because they are part of the championship team? I don't think so. Having said that, I still have yet to hear a better PF duo than Dirk Nowitzki and Shawn Marion. Nowitzki is better than Gasol and to avoid debate, Marion and Odom are about equal, although Marion has the edge if you look at career stats as the tie breaker.

So, is anyone going to at least explain why Nowitzki and Marion AREN'T the best PF duo?

Spencesc11
08-17-2009, 08:20 AM
1) Garnett/Sheed
2) Gasol/Odom
3) Boozer/Milsap

Check the rings for further proof plus both Boozer and Milsap are undersized

sleeper for this category would be Horford/J. Smith - two young guys who play together a lot but both are natural power forwards but still need to develop more to climb this list.

LakerMikeNJ
08-17-2009, 12:37 PM
Boozer is a douche but I'd still have to say Boozer/Millsap combo was the best and seeing how a trade involving Boozer is now unlikely, will probably continue to be the best PF combo next year. Here is a comparison of Boozer and Millsap against Gasol and Odom using their stats in the 2009 playoffs:

Boozer 20.6PPG 13.2RPG
Millsap 11.8PPG 8.0RPG
A total of 32.4PPG 21.2RPG

Gasol 18.3PPG 10.8RPG
Odom 12.3PPG 9.1RPG
A total of 30PPG 19.9RPG

As you can see, the Jazz have the better PF combo.

Please tell me that you are kidding by using this logic. I am not saying it is a clear choice either way but going off pts and rebounds alone and limiting to playoffs is overlooking many factors.

2_Trill
08-17-2009, 01:36 PM
dont sleep on the Pistons.. CV31 starting at PF.. and Max coming off the bench.. we bout 2 do sum damage dis season.. BELIEVE DAT !!!

MagicDojo
08-17-2009, 02:22 PM
They are not natural 4's and play out of position. No research needed.

that is a rediculous statement. It does not matter what you think their natural position is. It matters what position they actually play. Lewis has played PF the entire time in Orlando. He averaged 19/6.4 in the playoffs playing PF.

Mavrix
08-17-2009, 03:19 PM
that is a rediculous statement. It does not matter what you think their natural position is. It matters what position they actually play. Lewis has played PF the entire time in Orlando. He averaged 19/6.4 in the playoffs playing PF.

I'm pretty damn sure he won't be playing PF with Brandon Bass on the roster.

rabzouz 96
08-18-2009, 01:10 PM
that is a rediculous statement. It does not matter what you think their natural position is. It matters what position they actually play. Lewis has played PF the entire time in Orlando. He averaged 19/6.4 in the playoffs playing PF.

6.4 rebounds for a starting pf are pretty pathetic,he shouldnt be on that list, and although he starts at pf, the other guy is right hes a natural sf, like marion too, theyre just playing out of positions because on these teams the other pf spots are pretty much unmanned.

jimbobjarree
08-18-2009, 01:21 PM
right now Utah, why is this even being discussed?

Lamar plays some SF, Sheed plays C and Marion is more of a SF

dhalvarez
08-18-2009, 01:25 PM
Which team has the best starting PF and backup PF duo?

I think the Jazz wins this with Millsap and Boozer with Pau and Odom for the Lakers a close 2nd.

Pau and Odom for sure. Two players that could be starters on many teams.

Boozer is hurt to often for me to say he and Milsap are better.

..surprised nobody said Garnett and Sheed. if Sheed was more in his prime than for sure.

Gibby23
08-18-2009, 01:30 PM
right now Utah, why is this even being discussed?

Lamar plays some SF, Sheed plays C and Marion is more of a SF

He hasn't played SF now for about 2 years. Ever since Gasol came to the Lakers Odom has been at the PF spot.

Jay22Redd
08-18-2009, 01:37 PM
Celtics. KG and Sheed/Baby.

When Sheed plays like himself, I definitely agree. KG is great already, then having Sheed back him up is awesome.

MJ-BULLS
08-18-2009, 01:43 PM
boozer and millsap

Kobe4Life
08-18-2009, 02:18 PM
Boozer and Millsap over Pau and Odom, Are you people on drugs? Pau makes Boozer look like crap, and Millsap over Odom realy? Do I have to explain. People start way to many threads here with the funniest crap.

PrettyBoyJ
08-18-2009, 02:33 PM
Pau & Lamar

Where's KG?
08-18-2009, 02:40 PM
Even thought the team is not good as a whole....Al Jefferson, Kevin Love isnt too shabby

MTar786
08-18-2009, 09:01 PM
wowowow i cant believe people actually think its boozer and milsap. c'mon

i'd say its pau and odom.. maybe kg and sheed depending on how sheed plays next year.

boozer and milsap are 3rd or 4th.

MTar786
08-18-2009, 09:15 PM
That's funny, I thought the number one reason the Lakers are "definding" champs is because of the dude on your picture, Kobe Bryant. Guess not .... should he even be credited as a reason to you?

D. Fisher and J. Farmar (along with S. Brown) are the lakers PGs, does that mean their duo (or trio) is better than any other PG duo (or trio) in the NBA simply because they are part of the championship team? I don't think so. Having said that, I still have yet to hear a better PF duo than Dirk Nowitzki and Shawn Marion. Nowitzki is better than Gasol and to avoid debate, Marion and Odom are about equal, although Marion has the edge if you look at career stats as the tie breaker.

So, is anyone going to at least explain why Nowitzki and Marion AREN'T the best PF duo?


firstly, marion is no PF. he is a sf and he will be playing the sf position next season.. this is a pf and pf thread. learn basketball.

secondly, id take odom over marion anyday

Trouble87
08-18-2009, 09:20 PM
Celtics if Sheed comes off the bench for KG

Byronicle
08-18-2009, 09:33 PM
from a Raptors Fan...the Lakers hands down i mean boozer and millsap are undersize bigs, Odom got speed, range and handles..Pau has a great inside game..both players can reboud well and play good defence

iluvsports2much
08-18-2009, 09:51 PM
i say its close between pau/odom and garnett/sheed/big baby..

utah shouldnt even be in the discussion,boozer is not gonna be a jazz next year...but if he was,then id put them 3rd behind the lake show and celts PF combos

blastmasta26
08-18-2009, 11:19 PM
firstly, marion is no PF. he is a sf and he will be playing the sf position next season.. this is a pf and pf thread. learn basketball.

secondly, id take odom over marion anyday
Marion can and does play PF. He is a 3 that can play the 4, but I don't know what his role in Dallas will be.

NYYankeesWin#27
08-18-2009, 11:33 PM
utah

MTar786
08-18-2009, 11:37 PM
Marion can and does play PF. He is a 3 that can play the 4, but I don't know what his role in Dallas will be.

well, if thats the case then artest and odom make the best sf sf combo in the league. to go with pau and odom as best pf pf combo

jakesmail123
08-19-2009, 01:06 AM
utah. strart making polls for these threads

Mavrix
08-19-2009, 01:19 AM
well, if thats the case then artest and odom make the best sf sf combo in the league. to go with pau and odom as best pf pf combo

No Dirk is way better than Gasol and Marion is better or equal to Odom.

WITZ
08-19-2009, 03:24 AM
The Jazz(Boozer-Millsap)