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torontosports10
08-04-2009, 07:47 PM
Name a player that you think gets no love and explain yourself. Dont just put a name. I will start off.


Why no love for Spencer Hawes. In every young big man discussion we hear names like Bynum,Bargs,Oden,Lopez,Jefferson but never Hawes. It seems like Catfish is the only one big supporter of him. Here is some stats from his 2nd season and Bosh 1st season in which they averaged almost the same minutes at the same age.

Spencer Hawes--29min
11.5ppg/7.1rpg/2apg/1.2bpg/46%FG/66%FT

Chris Bosh--33mins
11.5ppg/7.5rpg/1apg/1.5bpg/45%FG/70%FT

I dont think people talk about him enough and I feel he is going to be the main option for the Kings this year with Kev Martin and he will really surprise with what he can do this year.

And who do you think gets no love (with reasoning)

Bucsfan
08-04-2009, 07:59 PM
not to soudn racist, but alot of white players never get love...they just dont do the flashy stuff, they are usually the grinders down in the paint, or are just simple basketball players that dont have alot of flash...thats just now a days for the main part, back in the 70's, 80's and 90's there were larry birds and john stocktons and pete maravich's but now there is just kobe bryants, lebron james etc....spencer hawes is not in the same category as them but he is in that boat of unloved players

lots of players that play on small market teams are this way, lots of jazz players never get recognition, pacers, kings, bucks, etc etc

Chronz
08-04-2009, 08:06 PM
Can I just play the role of detractor?

Maybe Im wrong but wasnt Bosh 19 that season? Still for the sake of comparison the reason hes not viewed in the same light as Bosh is because he cant get to the line, I dont know what his turnovers consist of but for the amount of possessions he uses its unimpressive, overall he had a pretty rough season. And I do believe your stats are wrong.

Catfish1314
08-04-2009, 08:07 PM
Mehmet Okur.

He's not flashy or super athletic, but he averaged 17 and 8 last year and he's a better defender than people give him credit for. When Paul Millsap isn't on the floor, it's Okur guarding the other team's best big man because Boozer couldn't defend a steaming pile of dog doo if you threw it on the court. He has 3 point range, good 3 point range, and he's unselfish from what I've seen of him too. I can understand how some people don't give Spencer Hawes any credit because he plays for the Kings and the Kings play in Sacramento, and they've been on the outside looking in on the playoffs for the last 3 years. But Utah is a good team and they've been in the playoffs the last 3 years so I don't know why this guy doesn't get more credit.

arkanian215
08-04-2009, 08:07 PM
yup i agree. jeff foster! he does the dirty work and doesn't get any love.

arkanian215
08-04-2009, 08:08 PM
bobby simmons .447 3pt%. 1/3 shots is a 3 pt attempt.

Chronz
08-04-2009, 08:08 PM
Ive always wondered why Kevin Love gets no love, he didnt make the Rookie Sophmore game and Clipper fans hated him being mentioned in Erics league

rever
08-04-2009, 08:10 PM
what about K. Perkins
about 9 points 9 boards 2 blk in 30 min a game
he never gets his # called and gaurds any big without help most of the time
his FG% is .577
thats pretty good
and he never whines about touches

arkanian215
08-04-2009, 08:11 PM
cuz he's been hyped coming out of college? dunno. i dont want to hear about his connection with the beach boys anymore. god.

Catfish1314
08-04-2009, 08:12 PM
Can I just play the role of detractor?

Maybe Im wrong but wasnt Bosh 19 that season? Still for the sake of comparison the reason hes not viewed in the same light as Bosh is because he cant get to the line. And I do believe your stats are wrong.

Once he puts more weight on his frame, he'll get to the line a lot more. He has a really refined post game and excellent footwork, but the majority of other NBA post players are too strong for him to put those skills to good work as often as he could with more strength.

That, and there's only so much stock you can put into the Kings players individual stats the last 58 games of the season. Guys like Hawes and Jason Thompson were lucky to have put up the kind of numbers they did. After Theus was fired, there was not nearly as much offensive fluidity.

DerekRE_3
08-04-2009, 08:12 PM
Boris Diaw: Averaged 15 points, 6 boards, and 5 assists with the Bobcats last season. He shot 50% from the field and 42% from the 3 point line. He's one of the most offensively gifted and versatile PF's in the league in my personal opinion. His range now extends to the 3 point line, he can handle the ball and drive to the basket, he can pass the ball, and he can score in the low post. He doesn't rebound that well for a PF, but he lined up next to Emeka Okafor, a very good rebounder, and Gerald Wallace, who lead all SF's in rebounding last year so he doesn't need to get as many rebounds as your average PF. The one downside to Diaw is sometimes he's too unselfish. He's always looking to make his teammates better that he sometimes forgets that he is a threat to score as well. When he's aggressive though, he can be tough to stop. I just think he's such a clever player and really fun to watch.

Nobody on the Bobcats gets any love though....

arkanian215
08-04-2009, 08:12 PM
ak47. great all around game. very versatile.

DerekRE_3
08-04-2009, 08:16 PM
Can I just play the role of detractor?

Maybe Im wrong but wasnt Bosh 19 that season? Still for the sake of comparison the reason hes not viewed in the same light as Bosh is because he cant get to the line, I dont know what his turnovers consist of but for the amount of possessions he uses its unimpressive, overall he had a pretty rough season. And I do believe your stats are wrong.

His stats on Hawes aren't wrong.

Also to end the season, Hawes finished great. The last month he averaged 16 points and 9 boards a game. After Theus was fired, he went into a slump and it took him awhile to get out of it. I think Hawes could become one of the better Centers in the league. He is just so damn talented. His range extends to the 3 point line. He's a legit 7'1 in shoes, he can pass the ball, and has pretty good footwork in the post already at the age of 21. All he really needs to do is bulk up and get more experience.

DerekRE_3
08-04-2009, 08:17 PM
ak47. great all around game. very versatile.

Unfortunately his huge contract overshadows his game.

zambo4president
08-04-2009, 08:18 PM
Kirk Hinrich, lock down defender, shoots well

arkanian215
08-04-2009, 08:19 PM
so does having boozer and millsap there. he could do a lot more than what's being asked of him.

Chronz
08-04-2009, 08:20 PM
Once he puts more weight on his frame, he'll get to the line a lot more. He has a really refined post game and excellent footwork, but the majority of other NBA post players are too strong for him to put those skills to good work as often as he could with more strength.

That, and there's only so much stock you can put into the Kings players individual stats the last 58 games of the season. Guys like Hawes and Jason Thompson were lucky to have put up the kind of numbers they did. After Theus was fired, there was not nearly as much offensive fluidity.

Yea, I will say he has alot of historical factors going in his favor, turnover prone newbies are usually the ones who end up improving the coming years as they gain more experience. The t.o.'s decrease in a bigmans prime and come back to haunt them when they are out of their prime. And because bigmen peak later, particularly natural centers like Hawes appears to be, he will have more room to improve than a more faceup shooting/slashing oriented game like Bosh has. Still Bosh has come a long way as a scorer.

bigsams50
08-04-2009, 08:22 PM
Boris Diaw: Averaged 15 points, 6 boards, and 5 assists with the Bobcats last season. He shot 50% from the field and 42% from the 3 point line. He's one of the most offensively gifted and versatile PF's in the league in my personal opinion. His range now extends to the 3 point line, he can handle the ball and drive to the basket, he can pass the ball, and he can score in the low post. He doesn't rebound that well for a PF, but he lined up next to Emeka Okafor, a very good rebounder, and Gerald Wallace, who lead all SF's in rebounding last year so he doesn't need to get as many rebounds as your average PF. The one downside to Diaw is sometimes he's too unselfish. He's always looking to make his teammates better that he sometimes forgets that he is a threat to score as well. When he's aggressive though, he can be tough to stop. I just think he's such a clever player and really fun to watch.

Nobody on the Bobcats gets any love though....

agreed, wallace is extremely underrated, he never gets any love

Chronz
08-04-2009, 08:32 PM
His stats on Hawes aren't wrong.

Spencer Hawes--29min
11.5ppg/7.1rpg/2apg/2bpg/46%FG/66%FT

I have him clocked in at 1.2Blk/gm. Not only is that rounded the wrong way, but in this statistical category a .8 difference is very significant. The only reason I looked it up was because I couldnt recall anyone saying he was that good of a shot blocker. 2 in 29 minutes would be pretty dramatic like +5% shot block rate I think.



Also to end the season, Hawes finished great. The last month he averaged 16 points and 9 boards a game. After Theus was fired, he went into a slump and it took him awhile to get out of it. I think Hawes could become one of the better Centers in the league. He is just so damn talented. His range extends to the 3 point line. He's a legit 7'1 in shoes, he can pass the ball, and has pretty good footwork in the post already at the age of 21. All he really needs to do is bulk up and get more experience.
I suppose thats encouraging, but would it really surprise you if this was just another case of a player building up expectations for next year with a flukish 2nd half sample. I remember Bulls fans raving over Eddy Curry the same way after a similar stretch only to drop back down the following year. But there is no doubt he will improve, just like Curry did after a few years but hes gonna have to take alot more lumps I think.

torontosports10
08-04-2009, 08:35 PM
Spencer Hawes--29min
11.5ppg/7.1rpg/2apg/2bpg/46%FG/66%FT

I have him clocked in at 1.2Blk/gm. Not only is that rounded the wrong way, but in this statistical category a .8 difference is very significant. The only reason I looked it up was because I couldnt recall anyone saying he was that good of a shot blocker. 2 in 29 minutes would be pretty dramatic like +5% shot block rate I think.



I suppose thats encouraging, but would it really surprise you if this was just another case of a player building up expectations for next year with a flukish 2nd half sample. I remember Bulls fans raving over Eddy Curry the same way after a similar stretch only to drop back down the following year. But there is no doubt he will improve, just like Curry did after a few years but hes gonna have to take alot more lumps I think.

I must of looked at his apg twice. they were right beside one another.

KnicksR4Real
08-04-2009, 08:36 PM
Wilson Chandler

DerekRE_3
08-04-2009, 08:36 PM
Spencer Hawes--29min
11.5ppg/7.1rpg/2apg/2bpg/46%FG/66%FT

I have him clocked in at 1.2Blk/gm. Not only is that rounded the wrong way, but in this statistical category a .8 difference is very significant. The only reason I looked it up was because I couldnt recall anyone saying he was that good of a shot blocker. 2 in 29 minutes would be pretty dramatic like +5% shot block rate I think.



I suppose thats encouraging, but would it really surprise you if this was just another case of a player building up expectations for next year with a flukish 2nd half sample. I remember Bulls fans raving over Eddy Curry the same way after a similar stretch only to drop back down the following year. But there is no doubt he will improve, just like Curry did after a few years but hes gonna have to take alot more lumps I think.

Ah I didn't see the part about the blocks. He was getting over 2 blocks a game to begin the season, but he didn't keep it up. Also, Eddy Curry and Hawes are vastly different in personalities. Hawes is hardest on himself, and won't hesitate to criticize his own play. He's a hard worker, and he just has that attitude of wanting to be great.

Catfish1314
08-04-2009, 08:39 PM
I suppose thats encouraging, but would it really surprise you if this was just another case of a player building up expectations for next year with a flukish 2nd half sample. I remember Bulls fans raving over Eddy Curry the same way after a similar stretch only to drop back down the following year. But there is no doubt he will improve, just like Curry did after a few years but hes gonna have to take alot more lumps I think.

Curry's drop-off was a result of his character, not his skills.

DerekRE_3
08-04-2009, 08:44 PM
Curry's drop-off was a result of his character, not his skills.

Exactly. From everything I've seen Hawes is pretty much completely opposite of Curry character wise.

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 09:53 PM
Josh Howard

He's one of the most versatile players in the game. Very offensively talented and an underrated defender.

He would be a second option on almost any team

Raps18-19 Champ
08-04-2009, 10:06 PM
Joe Johnson.

He is top 10 in the league and no attention.

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 10:07 PM
Joe Johnson.

He is top 10 in the league and no attention.

Which is why he's one of the most highly coveted free agents next year :rolleyes:

He's only the face of ATL's franchise..

GeorgeMcCloud21
08-04-2009, 10:09 PM
Brandon Roy

RLundi
08-04-2009, 10:11 PM
Not a player but Stan Van Gundy. I hate the crap he gets for his voice and his yelling and people disrespecting him as a good coach by saying his job is on the line, master of panic blah blah. This man is one of the league's best coaches. He showed it with the Heat and he's showing it with the Magic.

They can piss and moan about his motivational tactics but his .638 winning percentage speaks for itself.

b_rad23
08-04-2009, 10:14 PM
Joe Johnson.

He is top 10 in the league and no attention.

Not top 10 at all....

Easily worse than:
Wade
Lebron
Kobe
CP3
TD
Dwight
Dirk
Roy
Melo
Granger
Durant
Pierce

Mikeleafs
08-04-2009, 10:15 PM
Shane Battier

Solid defender, great leader and teammate, clutch shooter

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 10:15 PM
PS Joe Johnson is not top 10 probably not even top 20..I can name 15 better off the top of my head

1. Kobe
2. Lebron
3. Wade
4. Paul
5. Howard
6. Duncan
7. Dirk
8. Yao
9. Amare
10. Melo
11. Billups
12. Roy
13. Pierce
14. Bosh
15. Durant

Want me to keep going?

Raps18-19 Champ
08-04-2009, 10:16 PM
Not top 10 at all....

Easily worse than:
Wade
Lebron
Kobe
CP3
TD
Dwight
Dirk
Roy
Melo
Granger
Durant
Pierce

That is why Joe Johnson was an MVP candidtate while Durant and Granger were nowhere to be seen.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-04-2009, 10:17 PM
How can Joe Johnson not be top 15 or top 10 when he is the 3rd SG in the league and that is behind Wade and Kobe so that makes it even harder.

RLundi
08-04-2009, 10:18 PM
When on Earth was Joe Johnson even remotely mentioned in any MVP discussion????????

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 10:18 PM
That is why Joe Johnson was an MVP candidtate while Durant and Granger were nowhere to be seen.

Go look at my list. Take out Durant if you want, add Tony Parker. Granger wasn't on mine.

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 10:22 PM
How can Joe Johnson not be top 15 or top 10 when he is the 3rd SG in the league and that is behind Wade and Kobe so that makes it even harder.


1. Kobe
2. Wade
3. Roy

mambastatus
08-04-2009, 10:22 PM
Add deron williams on that list

mambastatus
08-04-2009, 10:26 PM
And Gasol. Just because he puts up stats on a garbage team doesnt make johnson top anything. Hes good but not top 10 or 15

Mavrix
08-04-2009, 10:26 PM
Add deron williams on that list

Forgot about him. He makes it over J Johnson

dre1990
08-04-2009, 10:42 PM
Charlie V

magichatnumber9
08-04-2009, 10:44 PM
Perk is crazy man

D-Will4Prez
08-04-2009, 10:54 PM
Mehmet Okur.

He's not flashy or super athletic, but he averaged 17 and 8 last year and he's a better defender than people give him credit for. When Paul Millsap isn't on the floor, it's Okur guarding the other team's best big man because Boozer couldn't defend a steaming pile of dog doo if you threw it on the court. He has 3 point range, good 3 point range, and he's unselfish from what I've seen of him too. I can understand how some people don't give Spencer Hawes any credit because he plays for the Kings and the Kings play in Sacramento, and they've been on the outside looking in on the playoffs for the last 3 years. But Utah is a good team and they've been in the playoffs the last 3 years so I don't know why this guy doesn't get more credit.

^This. Okur had the #1 3P% for Centers last year (I don't count Troy Murphy cuz he's PF half the time). 17 and 8 last season and he didn't even get a top 10 spot in our Top 10 Centers poll here in the forums yet his numbers are better than Bargnani who was picked at the #5 spot. True his D could use some improvement but he's really not a bad defender by any means.

tland22
08-05-2009, 12:30 AM
Joe Johnson.

He is top 10 in the league and no attention.

WRONG. He is not top 10. You are severely exaggerating.

My pick is OKUR...he gets zero love and is a top 10 Center...always baffles me. I know people dont like a 7 footer who stands around the perimeter but he does everything pretty well...shooting and rebound wise atleast. Id ont know ennough on his defensive abilities though.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-05-2009, 12:42 AM
Joe Johnson is one of the best SG's in the league.

People voted AI over him in the ASG. That is how much people don't know about him.

Joe Johnson can make the 10 top players. You people just don't give him a chance because you are always caught in the hype of the young and flashy guys. A lot of experts say he is one of the most under rated players in the game.

HuRRiCaNeS324
08-05-2009, 12:50 AM
Joe Johnson.

He is an amazing player in a lot of ways. To begin, he is a top 5 shooter in the nba. He can knock it down from long, medium, and short range with efficiency. Secondly, he uses his 6'7 240 pound frame to post other guards down and dominate them (i am a heat fan and i have seen Wade get taken by Joe Johnson down there on a couple occasions). Thirdly, he also uses his size and strength on D making it hard for guards to get by him. Lastly, he is extremely athletic for his size, he can handle the ball like a point guard and dunk in your face. One thing he needs to improve is his rebounding, he should get more than 4 if hes that big, but guards don't normally get more than that but still.

dsickich123
08-05-2009, 12:56 AM
JEFF GREEN

2nd year in NBA he averaged 16.5ppg, 6.7rpg, 2ast
He is only going to get better...but still recieves no talk...
could end up being the 2nd best player out of the 2007 draft...
show him love

anyone agree?

HuRRiCaNeS324
08-05-2009, 12:58 AM
JEFF GREEN

2nd year in NBA he averaged 16.5ppg, 6.7rpg, 2ast
He is only going to get better...but still recieves no talk...
could end up being the 2nd best player out of the 2007 draft...
show him love

anyone agree?

:nod: yup

He would be my second choice

Raps18-19 Champ
08-05-2009, 01:04 AM
Joe Johnson.

He is an amazing player in a lot of ways. To begin, he is a top 5 shooter in the nba. He can knock it down from long, medium, and short range with efficiency. Secondly, he uses his 6'7 240 pound frame to post other guards down and dominate them (i am a heat fan and i have seen Wade get taken by Joe Johnson down there on a couple occasions). Thirdly, he also uses his size and strength on D making it hard for guards to get by him. Lastly, he is extremely athletic for his size, he can handle the ball like a point guard and dunk in your face. One thing he needs to improve is his rebounding, he should get more than 4 if hes that big, but guards don't normally get more than that but still.

Finally someone agrees with me.

b_rad23
08-05-2009, 01:08 AM
How can Joe Johnson not be top 15 or top 10 when he is the 3rd SG in the league and that is behind Wade and Kobe so that makes it even harder.

He's the 4th SG on almost every list.


Multiplied out by 5 positions that's top 20. I'd say that's exactly where I'd rank him, maybe top 15.

And to Hurricane's: he's not very efficient at all...

Raps18-19 Champ
08-05-2009, 01:21 AM
He's the 4th SG on almost every list.


Multiplied out by 5 positions that's top 20. I'd say that's exactly where I'd rank him, maybe top 15.

And to Hurricane's: he's not very efficient at all...

You can't really multipy. He might be better than the 2nd best C or 3 best SF so it doesn't work like that

I rank it like this in no order.

Lebron
Kobe
Wade
Paul
Howard
Duncan
Garnett
Nowitzki
Melo
Johnson

but whatever you say.

b_rad23
08-05-2009, 01:32 AM
You can't really multipy. He might be better than the 2nd best C or 3 best SF so it doesn't work like that

I rank it like this in no order.

Lebron
Kobe
Wade
Paul
Howard
Duncan
Garnett
Nowitzki
Melo
Johnson

but whatever you say.

You don't think Roy, Durant, Bosh, Granger are better? They are statistically. It isn't like Johnson is a lock down guy defensively either, so that can't be why you take him over them. Really, I don't get it. He's less efficient then them, equal defensively and worse statistically.

To each his own I guess...

asandhu23
08-05-2009, 01:33 AM
anybody that is not Kobe, Dwight, Nate Robinson, Wade, LeBron or KG and Yao

Kjthunder
08-05-2009, 02:20 AM
i like how he mentioned Joe Johnson being mentioned in MVP talks unlike Granger and Durant, i guess thats a compliment to Durant considering he was in his second season and Joe is in his what? im not saying Joe isn't a great player, but i'd take Durant over him any day of the week

vash9
08-05-2009, 02:24 AM
anybody that is not Kobe, Dwight, Nate Robinson, Wade, LeBron or KG and Yao

This can summarize up this WHOLE thread.

shep33
08-05-2009, 02:32 AM
Troy Murphy- guy has quiet 20 rebound games
Kevin Martin- can drop 30 on you, but his team can't win
Al Thornton-same as above
Thad Young-great shooter, and athlete
Travis Outlaw-Guy seems like he can be a legit 20 point guy... has the potential for sure

Run&Gun
08-05-2009, 02:53 AM
Rashard Lewis never gets love,
Although he does have a crazy contract, he spreads the floor for Orlando, super versatile, makes almost 3 threes a game, but then again he's just another one of those players that never gets love because his stats don't give him 20 points a game. Shane Battier also gets no love even though he locks down everyone and anyone, even though he has no offensive capabilities besides a three point shot,

MagicDojo
08-05-2009, 03:11 AM
what about K. Perkins
about 9 points 9 boards 2 blk in 30 min a game
he never gets his # called and gaurds any big without help most of the time
his FG% is .577
thats pretty good
and he never whines about touches

I have watched 1000 magic games. (It seems like it) Perkins is a great defender. Only two players stymy D12.... Perkins and Wallace(Rasheed).

nba08
08-05-2009, 03:21 AM
ILL BE HONEST JOE JOHNSON IS REALLY GOOD PLAY i dont know here he ranks in many are top players but just remember he was the turning point for atlanta being a good team again and we al remember how bad the used to be.

MSU Spartans313
08-05-2009, 03:22 AM
Gerald Wallace gets no love whatsoever. He is one of the best all-around players the NBA has. He can do it all, he will have his time soon though.

toovey107
08-05-2009, 03:24 AM
ILL BE HONEST JOE JOHNSON IS REALLY GOOD PLAY i dont know here he ranks in many are top players but just remember he was the turning point for atlanta being a good team again and we al remember how bad the used to be.
translation anyone ??

J-Relo
08-05-2009, 04:01 AM
Lebron James gets no love... Also that guy named Kobe...

Mavrix
08-05-2009, 04:01 AM
You can't really multipy. He might be better than the 2nd best C or 3 best SF so it doesn't work like that

I rank it like this in no order.

Lebron
Kobe
Wade
Paul
Howard
Duncan
Garnett
Nowitzki
Melo
Johnson

but whatever you say.You really think Johnson is better than Chauncey Billups? Better than Tony Parker? Better than B.Roy? And dare I say Yao Ming? Wow.

Illuminati999
08-05-2009, 04:10 AM
not to soudn racist, but alot of white players never get love...they just dont do the flashy stuff, they are usually the grinders down in the paint, or are just simple basketball players that dont have alot of flash...thats just now a days for the main part, back in the 70's, 80's and 90's there were larry birds and john stocktons and pete maravich's but now there is just kobe bryants, lebron james etc....spencer hawes is not in the same category as them but he is in that boat of unloved players

lots of players that play on small market teams are this way, lots of jazz players never get recognition, pacers, kings, bucks, etc etc

I 100% agree. Troy Murphy is a stud. Sure he is 29, but I rarely hear anything about him. I'm not even a Pacers fan and I admire his talent. Look at his stud stats last season.

Games : 73
FGM-A FG% : 364-767 .475
3PM-A 3P% : 161-358 .450 (a lot of 3s....)
FTM-A FT% : 152-184 .826
Rebounds : 11.8
Steals : .79
Blocks : .47
Assists : 2.4
PPG : 14.3

A very unique PF, but I see no love =(.

Illuminati999
08-05-2009, 04:26 AM
Wilson Chandler

I love his game, he is definitely not given any love for it.

Pornstar86
08-05-2009, 06:40 AM
Michael Beasley

-Better rookie season statistically than Bosh, Amare, Boozer
-Average 14ppg, 5rpg in 25 min/g...translates to 20.7 ppg and 8 rpg if he had 37 min/g like Derrick Rose, and 21.3 ppg and 8.2 rpg if he had 38 min/g like Mayo
-Can finish with both hands, and is has a beautiful touch around the basket
-Amazing mid-range shot, improving 3pt shot
-Very inconsistent PT from game to game
-His defense is horrible, but it did improve over the course of last season, and will continue to improve under the teaching of Spo, Wade, and Zo

Pornstar86
08-05-2009, 06:48 AM
When on Earth was Joe Johnson even remotely mentioned in any MVP discussion????????

last season he was mentioned as being an MVP candidate until the end of the season....this is because his Hawks were winning and were the 4 seed, Granger and Durant's team both sucked so they get no love

azkarraga
08-05-2009, 07:18 AM
Boris Diaw: Averaged 15 points, 6 boards, and 5 assists with the Bobcats last season. He shot 50% from the field and 42% from the 3 point line. He's one of the most offensively gifted and versatile PF's in the league in my personal opinion. His range now extends to the 3 point line, he can handle the ball and drive to the basket, he can pass the ball, and he can score in the low post. He doesn't rebound that well for a PF, but he lined up next to Emeka Okafor, a very good rebounder, and Gerald Wallace, who lead all SF's in rebounding last year so he doesn't need to get as many rebounds as your average PF. The one downside to Diaw is sometimes he's too unselfish. He's always looking to make his teammates better that he sometimes forgets that he is a threat to score as well. When he's aggressive though, he can be tough to stop. I just think he's such a clever player and really fun to watch.

Nobody on the Bobcats gets any love though....

I fully agree, diaw deserves more love, much more... may be it's because he's french, but he's clearly undrerated

azkarraga
08-05-2009, 07:21 AM
anybody that is not Kobe, Dwight, Nate Robinson, Wade, LeBron or KG and Yao

well, not everybody who's not on that list deserves love. i can think a couple of names...

kurivaimu
08-05-2009, 07:21 AM
I cant understand why Nate doesnt get any love this offseason from teams. I mean, the guy puts up 17-4-4 and still no contract. I know its a economic crisis...but..still..id love to have a guy like that on my team. great scorer of the bench, instant offense..
so he goes nuts once in a while...still..a great addition for any team

cmacmath
08-05-2009, 10:29 AM
I chose to make a list of guys who were never All-Stars and probably never will be All-Stars but who if you ask their teammates or assistant coaches or fan bases would probably tell you how valuable they are or how much they appreciate their effort:

Chris "Birdman" Anderson - gets attention, but I think more for his goofy style not the fact that he is actually a legitimate NBA Center who defends and intimidates

Kyle Lowry - one of my favorite players to watch on League Pass when he was with Memphis because he can do a little bit of everything. Can give you 8-8-8 off the bench...got a little more credit once Houston stole him away. Never starts, but always seems to be on the court during a comeback or crunch time

Luis Scola/Carl Landry/Chuck Hayes - speaking of players Daryl Morey steals. I mean honestly, is there a better GM in the business. There is a reason why when McGrady and Yao go down wit injuries these teams go on 20+ game winning streaks and get to the 2nd round.

Andre Miller - should be on the top of everyone's list. Is there a guy who helps a team win more that goes more underappreciated? Since back in the days with Cleveland and those ugly uniforms when he was leading the league in assists to this offseason where he couldn't even get a contract for 2 months, this guy gets no love because he's efficient over flashy

Chris Duhon - Getting booted to the bench after one season when he actually did pretty good until he got burnt out at the end because D'Antoni had him top 3 in the NBA in minutes played for the first half of the season. Plays defense at the point of attack at the PG position which is incredibly valuable in the NBA (see Chauncey Billups)

Jarret Jack - I think often gets a bad rap as a shoot first guard because of similarities to (and his fondness for) Stephon Marbury. But if you ever actually watch him he is nothing like Marbury and actually an incredibly willing passer

Thaddeus Young/Al Thornton - Type of glue guys who will be starting in the NBA for 12 years probably on a championship team or 2

Kirk Heinrich - Gets booted to the bench and always the topic of trade discussions yet whenever the playoffs role around he is always the toughest competitor and best player on the Bulls and acts as their muscle (Wade, Rondo, etc.)

Marquise Daniels - showed flashes on Dallas then went to Indy where no one is even aware they have a bball team. Solid guy who fills up the stat box and can play 3 different positions. Boston fans are going to LOVE him especially at the rate they paid for him...

Delonte West - always seems to be a starter. Was great in college but no one thought it would translate to the NBA. Good size and can defend his position. Underrated at blocking shots and has a sweet shot. That will keep you in the L for awhile/

Al Horford - Don't know if we thought this guy could be a Double Double player in the NBA, but apparently he can

Josh Smith - I'm willing to look past this last season. Has the ability to be top 5 in the NBA in steals, blocks, and FG%. Just has to apply himself again.

Julian Wright - another one of my favorite players to watch on League Pass yet Byron Scott seems to hate him for some reason. I love this guy. He is the new era Gerald Wallace and Josh Howard (both of whom I would have put on this list 3-5 years ago)

Mikel Pietrus (or however you spell it) - Golden State fans were probably sad to see him go. I think it is safe to say he single handedly won at least 2-3 playoff games himself this year.

Nick Young - This guy is instant offense. He can absolutely light it up. If he gets a chance to see the court this season, watch out. Ben Gordon type ability!

Raja Bell - Very underrated. People forget he was on that Iverson Philly team that went to the finals and was an important player then all those years in Phoenix making 3's and checking Kobe

Clearly you can all see I don't do anything at my job and have time to write these posts.......feel free to comment away......

tland22
08-05-2009, 10:53 AM
love the list

Heinrich STINKS though

#1Mavericksfan
08-05-2009, 11:39 AM
Dirk Nowitzki get's no love.....if you put Dirk on a team like the Magic or Cavs they would become favorites to win it all.

blastmasta26
08-05-2009, 12:48 PM
I cant understand why Nate doesnt get any love this offseason from teams. I mean, the guy puts up 17-4-4 and still no contract. I know its a economic crisis...but..still..id love to have a guy like that on my team. great scorer of the bench, instant offense..
so he goes nuts once in a while...still..a great addition for any team
Economic crisis, hated by other players, bad team player, undersized SG, can't play the point, Knicks will probably match a reasonable offer. A lot of factors as to why he doesn't have an offer yet.

NJrockPD
08-05-2009, 01:09 PM
what about K. Perkins
about 9 points 9 boards 2 blk in 30 min a game
he never gets his # called and gaurds any big without help most of the time
his FG% is .577
thats pretty good
and he never whines about touches

Because he's aware that he is just a product of good players around him. Why would he whine?

tbo41fan
08-05-2009, 01:32 PM
love the list

Heinrich STINKS though

2 things...

1. You totally butchered his name...

2. How can you even seriously say Hinrich sucks? He is a great lockdown defender, will be in the discussion for 6th man of the year, and is a career 13pts/ 6 ast guy...

Hinrich does NOT stink

DaBUU
08-05-2009, 03:52 PM
Im going with Capt. Kirk Hinrich. Hes a combo guard that offensively play both 1 & 2, although better running the point. And on defense hes able to lockdown on 1-3, as evidenced in the playoffs when he shut down Paul Pierce for stretches at a time.

mdabstar
08-05-2009, 04:15 PM
not to soudn racist, but alot of white players never get love...they just dont do the flashy stuff, they are usually the grinders down in the paint, or are just simple basketball players that dont have alot of flash...thats just now a days for the main part, back in the 70's, 80's and 90's there were larry birds and john stocktons and pete maravich's but now there is just kobe bryants, lebron james etc....spencer hawes is not in the same category as them but he is in that boat of unloved players

lots of players that play on small market teams are this way, lots of jazz players never get recognition, pacers, kings, bucks, etc etc

i would like to also say that im NOT a racist but i agree!! nowadays there hardly isnt any white dudes that you can consider superstars.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-05-2009, 04:23 PM
You really think Johnson is better than Chauncey Billups? Better than Tony Parker? Better than B.Roy? And dare I say Yao Ming? Wow.

They look better because they have better help. When you have better help, you look way better. Like how a lot of people think Gasol is a top 15 player when he was no different than when he was on the Grizzlies.

Raps18-19 Champ
08-05-2009, 04:27 PM
You don't think Roy, Durant, Bosh, Granger are better? They are statistically. It isn't like Johnson is a lock down guy defensively either, so that can't be why you take him over them. Really, I don't get it. He's less efficient then them, equal defensively and worse statistically.

To each his own I guess...

People give Granger, Roy and Durant love because they are flashy and young.

Bosh isn't top 10. I don't think Durant and Granger can get those stats on legit teams.

Roy is the only arguement but he looks better than Johnson because he has better help. It is kind of like how people think Gasol is top 15 now even though he is pretty much the same player as he was in the last years in his Memphis days.

nbaguy123
08-05-2009, 04:31 PM
jose calderon doesnt get much love

tland22
08-05-2009, 05:00 PM
2 things...

1. You totally butchered his name...

2. How can you even seriously say Hinrich sucks? He is a great lockdown defender, will be in the discussion for 6th man of the year, and is a career 13pts/ 6 ast guy...

Hinrich does NOT stink

Oh, I "butchered his name because I put an "E" before the "I" when there wasnt suppose to be one? WOW....WOW. OMG, I know that you are being serious, and I just cant believe it.

Hinrich was overrated when he started for the bulls. And NO, he wont be in any 6th man of the year convo. Just keep telling yourself that.

tbo41fan
08-05-2009, 05:17 PM
Oh, I "butchered his name because I put an "E" before the "I" when there wasnt suppose to be one? WOW....WOW. OMG, I know that you are being serious, and I just cant believe it.

Hinrich was overrated when he started for the bulls. And NO, he wont be in any 6th man of the year convo. Just keep telling yourself that.

People dont take you serious if you can't even spell the name of the person you're talking about.. well I don't anyway...im just saying

And yes he will be mentioned in 6th man talks because he will have to help in the scoring with Ben Gordon leaving...