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Mile High Champ
07-30-2009, 04:51 PM
Hey guys, Some of you may remember but I conducted a poll at the start of the season that had PSD users vote for the top 10 players at each position. I would like to start this up once more considering the NBA season is now over and we can get to this discussion since lots has changed since the start of last season. Please TRY AND VOTE FOR THE BEST PLAYER AND DON'T BE A HOMER. I will leave the poll open for one day and than we can carry on to the next best player at that position. I will add more players after each round...Enjoy.

REMEMBER this is based on who is the best player, not the player who has the potential to be the best.

C Rankings DONT FORGET TO VOTE!!

1) Dwight Howard
2) Yao Ming
3) Al Jefferson
4) Shaquille O'Neal
5) Andrea Bargnani
6) Andris Biedrins
7) Emeka Okafor
8)
9)
10)

Last Years C Rankings:

1) Dwight Howard
2) Yao Ming
3) Al Jefferson
4) Andrew Bynum
5) Chris Kaman
6) Tyson Chandler
7) Shaquille O'Neal
8) Marcus Camby
9) Jermaine O'neal
10) Andrew Bogut

arkanian215
07-30-2009, 04:53 PM
what? lopez isnt up there yet? oh man.

ARMIN12NBA
07-30-2009, 04:54 PM
Andrew Bynum

#5 in PER for Centers
Top 3 defensive Center
14 PPG, 8 RPG, 2 BPG
Among the best Per-36

Mile High Champ
07-30-2009, 04:54 PM
Poll is now up...

Give me Nene here, I thought he should be a little higher then this..

Mile High Champ
07-30-2009, 04:55 PM
what? lopez isnt up there yet? oh man.

he is coming off his rookie season, relax, he will be there maybe after this year..

AntiG
07-30-2009, 04:58 PM
Nene clearly. He should have been #5.

RocketsRule
07-30-2009, 04:59 PM
Nene, had a great season last year.

droalex
07-30-2009, 05:26 PM
Nene =)

cmellofan15
07-30-2009, 05:27 PM
wow I thought Nene would've been higher than this.

Jays Claw
07-30-2009, 05:29 PM
I am still going with Al Horford.

lamar2006
07-30-2009, 05:30 PM
freakin haters. hating on Bynum. He is better than Nene his potential is limitless. yes he sucked after his injury but when healthy he is top 5 center clearly. so keep voting for scrubs like Jermain O'Neal who Bynum killed by going for 20+ points and 10+ rebounds and making him look like a punk. now that we won a title everyone one hates every laker. keep the hate coming. we love it and now with Odom back repeat here we come.

theuuord
07-30-2009, 05:30 PM
Bynum, Nene, Lopez...

B.JenningsMVP
07-30-2009, 05:44 PM
Byn-uhmmmmm

arkanian215
07-30-2009, 07:17 PM
lopez w/ 13ish 8 2 bpg...and a good mid range game and ft%. imo that takes him over bynum.

arkanian215
07-30-2009, 07:18 PM
i believe this says best c in the game, not what's his potential. it should be based on how good they are now.

dee279
07-30-2009, 07:44 PM
freakin haters. hating on Bynum. He is better than Nene his potential is limitless. yes he sucked after his injury but when healthy he is top 5 center clearly. so keep voting for scrubs like Jermain O'Neal who Bynum killed by going for 20+ points and 10+ rebounds and making him look like a punk. now that we won a title everyone one hates every laker. keep the hate coming. we love it and now with Odom back repeat here we come.

OK why dont you put up when he killed someone other then Jermaine since he only has one vote and that i voted for because and only becuz hes on my team. Bynum right now is not a top 5 center. IM really just wondering who is gonna get hurt more in their career b4 they retire. Bynum or Yao.

op12
07-30-2009, 08:08 PM
nene, kaman, then lopez or horford

zambo4president
07-30-2009, 08:28 PM
Lopez easily. But the homers wont have it :pity:

clutchski
07-30-2009, 08:33 PM
freakin haters. hating on Bynum. He is better than Nene his potential is limitless. yes he sucked after his injury but when healthy he is top 5 center clearly. so keep voting for scrubs like Jermain O'Neal who Bynum killed by going for 20+ points and 10+ rebounds and making him look like a punk. now that we won a title everyone one hates every laker. keep the hate coming. we love it and now with Odom back repeat here we come.

Don't hate Lamar some people just don't think Bynum is that good in comparison to some other C's...me for example. You like to think everyone hates every laker but that's not the case

ManRam
07-30-2009, 08:47 PM
Nene. Then Bynum. Both should be ahead of Biedrins IMO.

ARMIN12NBA
07-30-2009, 09:09 PM
nene, kaman, then lopez or horford

How is Kaman, Lopez, and a power forward ahead of Bynum in your list of the Top 10 NBA Centers?

Nevermind--You're a Celtics fan.

ARMIN12NBA
07-30-2009, 09:10 PM
Don't hate Lamar some people just don't think Bynum is that good in comparison to some other C's...me for example. You like to think everyone hates every laker but that's not the case

Andrew Bynum:

#5 in PER for Centers
Top 3 defensive Center
14 PPG, 8 RPG, 2 BPG
Among the best Per-36

How is that not Top 8 material?

WoodbridgeSkins
07-30-2009, 09:15 PM
I think it's easily Lopez, but I don't see him getting the respect he deserves.

JJ81
07-30-2009, 09:17 PM
This is a joke

theuuord
07-30-2009, 09:50 PM
lol, armin is gonna have a seizure.

still1ballin
07-30-2009, 10:39 PM
Its a good thing that none of us our GMs

Chronz
07-30-2009, 10:55 PM
Its a good thing that none of us our GMs

Speak for yourself Id gladly take Armin or Uuord as my GM, but Im a Clippers fan so its not saying much.

still1ballin
07-30-2009, 10:59 PM
Speak for yourself Id gladly take Armin or Uuord as my GM, but Im a Clippers fan so its not saying much.

No no, I didn't mean it that way, you both would be good ones, but the majority would suck. It just amazes me that how Nene is leading the poll votes for the 8th best center in the league which is obsurd, so that is why I made the comment.

Mile High Champ
07-30-2009, 11:35 PM
Please keep the votes coming..

ink
07-30-2009, 11:47 PM
Speak for yourself Id gladly take Armin or Uuord as my GM, but Im a Clippers fan so its not saying much.

You'd take anyone on PSD as a GM?? I don't think there's a single poster on the site who actually knows what they're talking about. lol. This is just goofing around and a good place to yakk about basketball. It's all people who love basketball, but shouldn't take their "posts" so seriously. If anyone actually is serious, please send your resume in to a professional team and get sobered up. :laugh:

Sly Guy
07-30-2009, 11:49 PM
I voted for Camby, love the rebounds and blocks. But I didn't see Nene still up there so that's where my vote should have gone. What's Nene doing so far down the chart anyway?

ARMIN12NBA
07-30-2009, 11:57 PM
You'd take anyone on PSD as a GM?? I don't think there's a single poster on the site who actually knows what they're talking about. lol. This is just goofing around and a good place to yakk about basketball. It's all people who love basketball, but shouldn't take their "posts" so seriously. If anyone actually is serious, please send your resume in to a professional team and get sobered up. :laugh:

I would gladly take Chronz as a GM. Chronz is better at evaluating talent and judging the game than half the hacks in the FO anyways...

BTW--Don't doubt some people's skills for making good moves. I do know there is one Lakers poster that not only wanted a Josh Powell signing, but also wanted a trade for an athletic guard like Shannon Brown. I know those aren't big moves, but they were pretty solid moves that Mitch made during this past year...

ink
07-31-2009, 12:10 AM
I would gladly take Chronz as a GM. Chronz is better at evaluating talent and judging the game than half the hacks in the FO anyways...

BTW--Don't doubt some people's skills for making good moves. I do know there is one Lakers poster that not only wanted a Josh Powell signing, but also wanted a trade for an athletic guard like Shannon Brown. I know those aren't big moves, but they were pretty solid moves that Mitch made during this past year...

This is fairy land man. No one here really knows anything. It's just a forum. That includes all of us. If you believe otherwise you are really buying into fantasy basketball. ;) That's why it's so hard to keep a straight face when people argue on the forums. It's just a place to shoot the ****.

Like I said, if anyone takes themselves seriously, submit your resume to an NBA team or publication and find out. ;) Then, IF you get a job, let us know. I'd love to hear about it.

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 12:16 AM
This is fairy land man. No one here really knows anything. It's just a forum. That includes all of us. If you believe otherwise you are really buying into fantasy basketball. ;) That's why it's so hard to keep a straight face when people argue on the forums. It's just a place to shoot the ****.

Like I said, if anyone takes themselves seriously, submit your resume and find out. ;)

:eyebrow: It's like you think basketball is something of rocket science...

BTW--Sure, there are posters who subscribe to "fantasy basketball." Lets get an all-star for every position! ...There are some posters on here, IMO, who really understand the game and how to build a team based on true offensive and defensive schemes. Like I said, it really isn't rocket science.

Also, I have even heard the likes of Jerry West say people shouldn't idolize him because his job as a GM wasn't some sort of incredibly hard job. He said the players make you look good.

theuuord
07-31-2009, 12:49 AM
This is fairy land man. No one here really knows anything. It's just a forum. That includes all of us. If you believe otherwise you are really buying into fantasy basketball. ;) That's why it's so hard to keep a straight face when people argue on the forums. It's just a place to shoot the ****.

Like I said, if anyone takes themselves seriously, submit your resume to an NBA team or publication and find out. ;) Then, IF you get a job, let us know. I'd love to hear about it.

unless anyone here has a job in the basketball business.

which is entirely possible.

:whistle:

theuuord
07-31-2009, 12:51 AM
:eyebrow: It's like you think basketball is something of rocket science...

BTW--Sure, there are posters who subscribe to "fantasy basketball." Lets get an all-star for every position! ...There are some posters on here, IMO, who really understand the game and how to build a team based on true offensive and defensive schemes. Like I said, it really isn't rocket science.

Also, I have even heard the likes of Jerry West say people shouldn't idolize him because his job as a GM wasn't some sort of incredibly hard job. He said the players make you look good.

the player evaluation is actually the easy part of being a general manager. it's dealing with the owners, and the investors, etc. that makes the job difficult.

for GM's basketball is a business first. It has to be.

ink
07-31-2009, 01:02 AM
:eyebrow: It's like you think basketball is something of rocket science...

BTW--Sure, there are posters who subscribe to "fantasy basketball." Lets get an all-star for every position! ...There are some posters on here, IMO, who really understand the game and how to build a team based on true offensive and defensive schemes. Like I said, it really isn't rocket science.

Also, I have even heard the likes of Jerry West say people shouldn't idolize him because his job as a GM wasn't some sort of incredibly hard job. He said the players make you look good.

Is that Jerry West the HOFer or some dude who decides to call himself Jerry West on the internet. lol. Basically, the difference in credibility between ALL OF US and the real Jerry West (for example) is extreme.

ink
07-31-2009, 01:14 AM
the player evaluation is actually the easy part of being a general manager. it's dealing with the owners, and the investors, etc. that makes the job difficult.

for GM's basketball is a business first. It has to be.

I agree. Being a GM is like being a talent scout, business man, capologist, fortune teller and politician all at once. And then there are the egos and personalities to deal with. Not an easy job.

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 01:22 AM
Is that Jerry West the HOFer or some dude who decides to call himself Jerry West on the internet. lol. Basically, the difference in credibility between ALL OF US and the real Jerry West (for example) is extreme.

Some dude who calls himself Jerry West on the internet. :p No, it was the actual Jerry West on television. :laugh2: Truthfully though, I think if your JOB was to evaluate talent (unlike us, we have other jobs and this is our hobby) and you can spend all day working and studying, then I think quite a few PSDers can be decent GMs. Not to mention that watching the intricacies of basketball isn't so tough a task especially if you read, study, and want to learn a lot about the game and did so accordingly.

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 01:24 AM
I agree. Being a GM is like being a talent scout, business man, capologist, fortune teller and politician all at once. And then there are the egos and personalities to deal with. Not an easy job.

Here are the qualifications needed to apply for a job as a GM:


* Candidate will have 5 or more years of business experience and a Bachelors degree from a four-year college or university.
* The candidate must be committed to building a world-class operation in both business and team performance.
* Experience in managing in the television and entertainment industry, in the travel and convention industry, or in a sports-oriented organization is required.
* Must have proven experience in working cooperatively with management, success at managing staff, and be an effective communicator preferably having experience in public speaking and interaction with the media.
* Strong leadership skills a must

D-Will4Prez
07-31-2009, 01:28 AM
Check the stats. Okur had 17 PPG last season...

still1ballin
07-31-2009, 01:28 AM
LOL look what I started

ink
07-31-2009, 01:32 AM
Here are the qualifications needed to apply for a job as a GM:

Add to that:

Are you a Top 50 in NBA history?

If not, why not?

lol.

FOBolous
07-31-2009, 01:35 AM
wow the voting for top 10 center has really gone downhill since the 4th spot...

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 01:37 AM
Add to that:

Are you a Top 50 in NBA history?

If not, why not?

lol.

I'm serious though. If you want to apply for a GM job, then you should probably have an MBA and have worked in business for 5 years. Plus, you should probably get an internship beforehand to just get to know the people in the FO and build relationships. Eventually, you will be running an NBA franchise. :D

ink
07-31-2009, 01:38 AM
btw, I want to point out that those are the qualifications to APPLY. Otherwise, these are the stages:

1. apply
2. get past the resume screeners
3. get an interview
4. get a job (maybe in concession stand sales)
5. get a job as an assistant
6. get a job as a scout
7. get a job as director of scouting
8. get a job as director of player personnel
9. get a job as assitant GM
10. get a job as GM
11. deal with all the internet "experts" whose egos are big enough to release their "yearly projections" :laugh2:
12. get fired as GM
13. lucky 13 - try to get a job as a commentator

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 01:41 AM
btw, I want to point out that those are the qualifications to APPLY. Otherwise, these are the stages:

1. apply
2. get past the resume screeners
3. get an interview
4. get a job (maybe in concession stand sales)
5. get a job as an assistant
6. get a job as a scout
7. get a job as director of scouting
8. get a job as director of player personnel
9. get a job as assitant GM
10. get a job as GM
11. deal with all the internet "experts" whose egos are big enough to release their "yearly projections" :laugh2:
12. get fired as GM
13. lucky 13 - try to get a job as a commentator

Actually, if you get hired initially, we are talking a job as a GM. It's not likely though that you get hired. As I said, you must have business and management experience. If they see you are qualified and you have caught their attention before (internships), then you can get an assistant GM job at least.

ink
07-31-2009, 02:18 AM
Actually, if you get hired initially, we are talking a job as a GM. It's not likely though that you get hired. As I said, you must have business and management experience. If they see you are qualified and you have caught their attention before (internships), then you can get an assistant GM job at least.

w/e :laugh:

Out of the 50,000 members here, 0/0 would even get past the resume screeners. That's step 2. I wonder how many people here have ever had a JOB. :)

CaleX(RR)MIA™
07-31-2009, 02:41 AM
went Brook Lopez :shrug:

lakerfan 4 life
07-31-2009, 02:50 AM
this thread is bs. Bynum should be in the top 5. **** you haters i hope you enjoy getting dominated in the paint by Bynum next season. REPEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

theuuord
07-31-2009, 02:54 AM
w/e :laugh:

Out of the 50,000 members here, 0/0 would even get past the resume screeners.

I wouldn't be so sure. Maybe 5-10 people here could. 15 at most.

azkarraga
07-31-2009, 03:03 AM
does the first one on the list always win?

arkanian215
07-31-2009, 09:17 AM
i guess this poll doesnt take into account whether the player is fragile or not. otherwise guys like yao and bynum wouldnt have gotten so many votes.

AntiG
07-31-2009, 09:29 AM
this thread is bs. Bynum should be in the top 5. **** you haters i hope you enjoy getting dominated in the paint by Bynum next season. REPEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

you'd think of all fans, Lakers fans would KNOW what a "top 5" center plays like. Mikan, Wilt, Jabbar, Shaq. Bynum is far from a top 5 center. You are just a blind homer who doesn't watch the rest of the league.

Kakaroach
07-31-2009, 11:38 AM
Nene. He runs the floor well, has a good post-up game, very athletic, and even has a decent jumper. Now that I think about it, he's prolly better than Okafor.

ink
07-31-2009, 12:14 PM
I wouldn't be so sure. Maybe 5-10 people here could. 15 at most.

At minimum, to even get a job interview a candidate would need to fill all of the basic criteria like MBA, etc. but would also have to have had years of experience with an NBA team -- as a player, coach, scout, assistant GM. Unless some of us are scouts at the very least, and more likely Assistant GMs, no one here would even get past the resume screeners. People here are just FANS. Nothing wrong with that until the comments about being a better GM than the actual GM start up. Then you can only really laugh and shrug. Fantasy basketball has really created a lot of delusion in fans.

CELTICS4LYFE
07-31-2009, 12:35 PM
you'd think of all fans, Lakers fans would KNOW what a "top 5" center plays like. Mikan, Wilt, Jabbar, Shaq. Bynum is far from a top 5 center. You are just a blind homer who doesn't watch the rest of the league.

:clap:

ManRam
07-31-2009, 12:42 PM
this thread is bs. Bynum should be in the top 5. **** you haters i hope you enjoy getting dominated in the paint by Bynum next season. REPEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's just a poll. Simmer down. Just because people aren't impressed with Bynum's hype, sitting on the bench more then he actually plays, and his injuries, doesn't mean they're haters. I think Bynum should be 7, let alone 8...but whatever. People are entitled to their opinions.

J-Relo
07-31-2009, 12:50 PM
Bynum... then Nene, then maybe a guy like Lopez

clehmun
07-31-2009, 01:02 PM
At minimum, to even get a job interview a candidate would need to fill all of the basic criteria like MBA, etc. but would also have to have had years of experience with an NBA team -- as a player, coach, scout, assistant GM. Unless some of us are scouts at the very least, and more likely Assistant GMs, no one here would even get past the resume screeners. People here are just FANS. Nothing wrong with that until the comments about being a better GM than the actual GM start up. Then you can only really laugh and shrug. Fantasy basketball has really created a lot of delusion in fans.

ink, some fans will never understand. this is the NBA we're talking about, where a small decision would cost millions, some of the "fans" don't even have $1000 in their banks right now. 80% of the us "fans" here probably can't even run a fast food restaurant successfully. if all you need was a degree and some experience, these guys wouldn't be making millions of dollars a year, while making decisions that are hundreds of millions of dollars for franchises that costs billions. heck, 99% of "us" don't even understand all of the NBA rules on the business side.

just because some people here have won a few yahoo! fantasy basketball trophys, they think they can run a real team. basketball knowledge is just a small fraction of what a GM needs to do their job.

IBleedPurple
07-31-2009, 01:03 PM
Nene clearly. He should have been #5.

^this


freakin haters. hating on Bynum. He is better than Nene his potential is limitless. yes he sucked after his injury but when healthy he is top 5 center clearly. so keep voting for scrubs like Jermain O'Neal who Bynum killed by going for 20+ points and 10+ rebounds and making him look like a punk. now that we won a title everyone one hates every laker. keep the hate coming. we love it and now with Odom back repeat here we come.

You mean the Bynum who was getting benched in the playoffs? Or the one who has not lived up to his hype ever since Laker fans knew about him?


Nene. Then Bynum. Both should be ahead of Biedrins IMO.

Agreed. Biedrins got some major love on this one, I have no idea why he's that high.

azkarraga
07-31-2009, 01:17 PM
so, its gonna be nene

ChiBulls91
07-31-2009, 01:20 PM
freakin haters. hating on Bynum. He is better than Nene his potential is limitless. yes he sucked after his injury but when healthy he is top 5 center clearly. so keep voting for scrubs like Jermain O'Neal who Bynum killed by going for 20+ points and 10+ rebounds and making him look like a punk. now that we won a title everyone one hates every laker. keep the hate coming. we love it and now with Odom back repeat here we come.

You seem to have missed something...look at the rules for the poll. It says not to take into account potential. This is for current rankings

AIMelo=KillaDUO
07-31-2009, 01:22 PM
Dwight
Yao
Al
Shaq
Nene
Memo
Horford
Beidrins
Bynum
Camby

Lakerfan In NY
07-31-2009, 01:29 PM
Please stop this. This is pointless. This poll is nothing more an a popularity contest w/no real basis to it other than who some fans like. You got players that are center, not being vote on b/c you think they are more like PF's, even though they are listed as center.
NEWS FLASH: There are only like 3 "true" centers in the NBA. With some hopefuls that havent earned that right to be called a "true" center yet. Everyone else are just hyrid center/power forward. Let me know when this "poll" opens up to ALL NBA players listed at the center position. When you conduct a poll on top ten position players & you have guys who barely get 10pt & another who gets 5 rebounds as top ten, that's a disgrace. We just disrespected the history of NBA centers.

Westbrook36
07-31-2009, 02:20 PM
This list is pretty awful actually..

If Bargs/Biedrins are this high then guys like Spencer Hawes and Marc Gasol should be on the list.

ink
07-31-2009, 02:33 PM
Please stop this. This is pointless. This poll is nothing more an a popularity contest w/no real basis to it other than who some fans like.

That's all any fan poll is. Doesn't mean they shouldn't be run. No need for the melodramatic complaints just because the player you like isn't being voted for.

IversonIsKrazy
07-31-2009, 02:47 PM
It was between Bynum and Nene for me. Bynum has the potential but thas not wut the thread is abt. Nene is an UNDERRATED AMAZING DEFENDER!! He was in the elite 90+ and 90+ (steals and blocks), and the only other players in that category were LeBron, Wade & Dwight. And offense is abt equal. Bynum can sumtimes be great on offense, but sometimes gets like 5points and plays ****. Nene, consistintly scores around 12ppg every game, so I went with Nene.

arkanian215
07-31-2009, 03:38 PM
brooks per 36 is similar to bynums. his fg% is less but his ft% is way higher. good thing brook doesnt have bynum's injury history. knock on wood.

im not a big fan of per. look it up on wiki and read about some of the flaws associated with it. shane battier is a solid player and yet per says he's a below average player. he should be scrounging for minutes.
if you take a look at the long list on espn, it says that brandan wright is better than joe johnson according to per.

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 03:43 PM
w/e :laugh:

Out of the 50,000 members here, 0/0 would even get past the resume screeners. That's step 2. I wonder how many people here have ever had a JOB. :)

Don't you mean 0/50,000? If 0 tried, then of course 0 would not get past the resume screeners. :laugh:

ARMIN12NBA
07-31-2009, 03:49 PM
ink, some fans will never understand. this is the NBA we're talking about, where a small decision would cost millions, some of the "fans" don't even have $1000 in their banks right now. 80% of the us "fans" here probably can't even run a fast food restaurant successfully. if all you need was a degree and some experience, these guys wouldn't be making millions of dollars a year, while making decisions that are hundreds of millions of dollars for franchises that costs billions. heck, 99% of "us" don't even understand all of the NBA rules on the business side.

just because some people here have won a few yahoo! fantasy basketball trophys, they think they can run a real team. basketball knowledge is just a small fraction of what a GM needs to do their job.

Of course none of us would get a job as a GM. I was just jerking ink's chain. :laugh: Although the criteria I put forth was the actual criteria for the job (and it is very much possible to get an internship if you are a junior or senior in college).

Actually, you are wrong about the MBA and some experience part...Many of the richest people in the world are people who got an MBA and ran a successful business. Anyways, that is neither here nor there.

BTW--Judging your knowledge of basketball by Yahoo Fantasy Sports is plain dumb. Fantasy Sports is all stats and fantasy points. In no way was Chronz or uuord every suggesting that their knowledge of the game was based off of that. Also, there is more to a GM job than basketball knowledge, but basketball knowledge is most of it. They have many assistants that help them out on the other stuff (such as cap rules). I have even heard Mitch Kupchak say it is impossible to know all the rules off-hand so he often looks them up...

todu82
07-31-2009, 03:57 PM
Andrew Bynum.

GSW fan
07-31-2009, 04:02 PM
Lopez, Nene, Bynum

ink
07-31-2009, 04:55 PM
Of course none of us would get a job as a GM.

People say it in seriousness all the time. In fact a few people in the thread did. Just like fans who write their "yearly forecasts". Doesn't matter whether the pretension comes from fantasy sports or not, it's still pretension.

ink
07-31-2009, 05:01 PM
im not a big fan of per. look it up on wiki and read about some of the flaws associated with it. shane battier is a solid player and yet per says he's a below average player. he should be scrounging for minutes.

if you take a look at the long list on espn, it says that brandan wright is better than joe johnson according to per.

Exactly why it's so funny to see people trying to beat each other down using stats. They're inconclusive unless the difference between players is already obvious. Stats are good as a guide, not as a means to definitive conclusions. I'd say the only conclusive stats used in any sports would be the data collected by Formula One, Indy and NASCAR engineers. You can measure machines. Even then there are uncontrollable variables.