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View Full Version : Why does everybody think the Cavaliers will be so good?



Boston Faithful
07-30-2009, 01:57 AM
This is not meant to be a flaming thread. I legitimately want to know why many people on this forum are sold on the Cavs winning the East this year. Let's look at the facts:

They mortaged their future badly this offseason. They re-signed Varejao at 8-9 million a year, signed Parker at 2.5 million for multiple years and Moon for 3 million a year. That kills ANY chance of them getting a top flight free agent next year to put next to LeBron.

They acquired Shaq, who had some sort of renaissance last year (18 and 8.5), but his numbers are still DRASTICALLY down from his prime.

They lost Wally, probably Joe Smith, Pavlovic and Ben Wallace and added Moon and Parker as far as role players go. That's certainly a wash.

But how is this team nearly as good as the Celtics or Magic? Vince Carter is a hell of alot better than Hedo Turkolugu. He's a proven commodity while I think Hedo will go down as one of the most overpaid guys in NBA history at age 35.

How the Cavs plan on beating a lineup of Howard, Lewis, Carter, Pietrus and Nelson or Wallace, Garnett, Pierce, Allen and Rondo is beyond me. The Cavs starting lineup doesn't scare me one bit. Now that Shaq is on the team, everyone will see how non-existent Mo Williams really is. There won't be much of a difference between him and Delonte West in the backcourt.

To me, the Magic's bench is so much better than the Cavs and so is the Celtics. When Bass is starting, Pietrus, a likely CJ Watson, Barnes and Gortat is just downright lethal protection. And a likely Big Baby, House, Rasheed and Marquis Daniels is equally as devastating. Nothing about Moon, Parker or Ilgauskas really scares me to be honest. Ilgauskas could never guard Howard or Garnett for **** - and Moon and Parker have just been average players on bad teams the past few years. The Cavs should have spent money on Linas Kleiza, not two over the hill role players.

The power rankings thread really put me over the top. How the Cavs will beat a loaded Magic or Celtics team is beyond me. They are at best third in the East right now and if somehow the Heat can pull off getting Boozer and Odom, I would confidantly put the Cavs at fourth.

Their future is mortgaged. Next year, if LeBron is re-signed for 18-20 million a year - they will have only three million in cap (50 million out of the 53 million salary cap - source go to HoopsHype salaries) and a shitload of role players. Shaq will be 38 and a free agent. I really can't grasp why Danny Ferry would do such idiotic moves as signing Varejao, Moon and Parker long term instead of waiting next year for someone like Bosh or Amare to come to Cleveland. None of those guys are really a help and all Varejao did last year was foul Howard and two years ago foul Garnett in the playoffs.

It's really now or never for this team and I can't see LeBron re-signing if they go empty handed this year and can't sign a big star next year.

disk 8
07-30-2009, 02:14 AM
cavs are the best in the east because LEBRON MVP JAMES. You think the cavs have a bunch of over the hill players look at Boston KG, Paul, Ray, and Sheed are old as **** there is no way they all are healthy for the playoff.

marlinsfan24
07-30-2009, 02:16 AM
1.Magic
2.Celtics
3.Cavs

itsripcity32
07-30-2009, 02:17 AM
lmfao delete! they've been good so why cant the continue to be good.

their main guys are still there. so basically if they screw up this year, they are screwed for life with verajao's contract and james leaving

Boston Faithful
07-30-2009, 02:20 AM
cavs are the best in the east because LEBRON MVP JAMES. You think the cavs have a bunch of over the hill players look at Boston KG, Paul, Ray, and Sheed are old as **** there is no way they all are healthy for the playoff.

LeBron couldn't even defeat the Magic last year and the Magic got better. The Celtics almost defeated the Magic in six so what makes you think that the Cavs would have any chance against a healthy Celtics team with a reloaded bench?

Oh yeah. Pierce is real old. It's not like he's the same age as Kobe or anything. :rolleyes:

And your speaking from a team who has a player (Shaq) who is about 4-6 years older than any of the players you just mentioned.

KB---24
07-30-2009, 02:24 AM
cavs are the best in the east because LEBRON MVP JAMES. You think the cavs have a bunch of over the hill players look at Boston KG, Paul, Ray, and Sheed are old as **** there is no way they all are healthy for the playoff.

First of all your wrong. The Cavs

Do NOT:
-Have a strong bench
-Have enough salary cap space for 2010
-Have any real chance to win the eastern conference when there is the Magic and Celtics that have Majorly upgraded there Roster compared to Clevelands "Role Players" and Shaq (37yrs old)

Catfish1314
07-30-2009, 02:27 AM
I don't think they're as good as a healthy Celtics team, but they've gotten much better this summer. Shaq is not the 28-12 Shaq he used to be, but he's still a top 5 center easily and based on what he did last year, still virtually unguardable 1 on 1 in the post. In the off chance he doesn't make them better, it would be very hard to see him making them worse.

They gained Shaq, Moon, and Parker and lost Pavlovic, Wallace, Smith, and Wally. If I were the Cavs, I would happily take that any summer. The stinging loss to the Magic will make them better too, I think. It was a wake-up call for a team that walked through the competition to the ECF and as long as Shaq is healthy, I think they'll be back there this season.

Teeboy1487
07-30-2009, 02:32 AM
The only time I will ever agree with a celtics fan. The Cavs are better offensively but shaq does not put them over the top defensively. However, I think the magic are the the team to beat in the east. Here is my top 3 in the east:1. Magic 2. Celtics 3. Cavs. The cavs are a contender but I think the magic and celtics are better on paper. It will be interesting to see. Honestly, I hope the celtics win the east and I hope the lakers make it back to the finals again, so we can settle the score. I would really like that.

Boston Faithful
07-30-2009, 02:36 AM
The only time I will ever agree with a celtics fan. The Cavs are better offensively but shaq does not put them over the top defensively. However, I think the magic are the the team to beat in the east. Here is my top 3 in the east:1. Magic 2. Celtics 3. Cavs. The cavs are a contender but I think the magic and celtics are better on paper. It will be interesting to see. Honestly, I hope the celtics win the east and I hope the lakers make it back to the finals again, so we can settle the score. I would really like that.

Exactly.

A few Lakers fans chiming in over here. I can live with people saying the Magic are better than the Celtics but I just can't see the Cavs being better in anyway than those two teams.

tr4shb0t
07-30-2009, 02:37 AM
Well, they had a great regular season last year and they aren't really losing too much, yet they are gaining shaq. I think they certainly pose some problems for a lot of teams out there.

However, they still didn't patch one of their big weaknesses: they have no good shooters. Opposing teams just need to defend the paint well because that's where Lebron and Shaq do their thing. We'll have to wait a while to see how the team chemistry is too with Shaq's love for attention. In the end, good interior defense will still win against the Cavs.

I would say Boston is definitely ahead of them, and its hard to say about the Magic. VC will have to be a strong leader on the court.

Either way, all 3 of these east teams are pretty good.

dibacco59
07-30-2009, 02:40 AM
when u take a 66 win team, add shaq, anthony parker, and jamario moon, and ur best player (lebron) is a superstar veteran entering his prime, you have a scary team

KB---24
07-30-2009, 02:46 AM
when u take a 66 win team, add shaq, anthony parker, and jamario moon, and ur best player (lebron) is a superstar veteran entering his prime, you have a scary team

yeah but you are adding player that is 37 years old that will certainly have a injury next year which will cost the Cavs some games and i dont see how jamario moon and anthony parker will make the Cavs a better team then the Magic or Celtics. Lebron is a superstar huh what about Dwight and KG

Only time that i will also agree with a Celtic Fan because i am a Laker fan

HuRRiCaNeS324
07-30-2009, 02:52 AM
I think they got worse this year, but not by a lot. They will still contend for a title because they will prolly be the hungriest team in the nba next season like the lakers where this year.

Hawkize31
07-30-2009, 02:59 AM
Because the Cavs lost to the magic because they had nobody who could defend Dwight Howard. If they doubled Howard, the Magic shot 3s. If they defended the perimeter, Dwight Howard scored easily. Now they can put Shaq on Howard and he will do an adequate job. Meanwhile, the rest of the team can shut down the three point shots way more effectively while Lebron takes over games.

The main way the Magic scored on the Cavs was wide open threes and easy mismatches of Howard vs small people inside. The Magic won't have it easy this time and they will lose to the Cavs.

Edit: The Cavs may have a worse record this year, but they will be build for playoff success in a better way IF SHAQ IS HEALTHY IN THE PLAYOFFS. Thats a huge if. For the rest though, it doesn't matter if the Cavs are the 7 or 8 seed. If they can defend Howard and Lebron goes out and plays his game, they win the Eastern Conference Finals.

Don Starks
07-30-2009, 03:12 AM
dont forget the reason that Shaq had such a breakout season last year was basically because of the suns trainers. they are the best in the league and without them i predict shaq will revert to his 37 year old self. especially now that he is in cleveland and cold weather does not help an aging body. i dont think shaq will be around for the playoffs, and if he is, he wont be 100%

sNaKeS
07-30-2009, 03:17 AM
I think they got worse this year, but not by a lot. They will still contend for a title because they will prolly be the hungriest team in the nba next season like the lakers where this year.

How the hell are they going to be hungrier than the magic? They lost the nba finals at home and dwight and jameer watched kobe and the lakers celebrate the championship on their homecourt.

For the other guy who says shaq can guard dwight, get out of here, if dwight even adds 1 post move to his repetoire then he's unstoppable. Shaq can't guard the pick and roll and the magic now have versatility with either bass or anderson at the PF and will still cause nightmares for the cavs and every other team in the nba for that matter. In my eyes, the only team that can take the magic in a series is a HEALTHY boston celtic team.

GoatMilk
07-30-2009, 03:17 AM
well im sure you answered, but because of this

best record last year
added an all-star center

thats whay everyone thinks they'll be so good
not saying i agree

Sox Appeal
07-30-2009, 03:22 AM
They mortaged their future badly this offseason. They re-signed Varejao at 8-9 million a year, signed Parker at 2.5 million for multiple years and Moon for 3 million a year. That kills ANY chance of them getting a top flight free agent next year to put next to LeBron.

What exactly does this have to do with next season? But yes, the Cavs still have enough money to offer the MAX for next season, even if LBJ does decide to stay.


They acquired Shaq, who had some sort of renaissance last year (18 and 8.5), but his numbers are still DRASTICALLY down from his prime.

Doesn't matter how good Shaq was in his prime. He's still a legit top 5 center, who will be taking the minutes of Ben Wallace and Joe Smith, who Shaq is a huge upgrade over.


They lost Wally, probably Joe Smith, Pavlovic and Ben Wallace and added Moon and Parker as far as role players go. That's certainly a wash.

Not even close. Wally, Sasha, Joe Smith where all god awful players, who had no business being in the rotation for a title contending team. Moon gives them a quality perimeter defender to pair along side LeBron, and Parker gives them length and perimeter shooting in the front-court.


But how is this team nearly as good as the Celtics or Magic? Vince Carter is a hell of alot better than Hedo Turkolugu. He's a proven commodity while I think Hedo will go down as one of the most overpaid guys in NBA history at age 35.

The Cavs are still hands down better than Boston. It's almost laughable how much they're being overrated coming into the season. Odds are KG never does comeback to what he was in '08, and Pierce is obviously on the decline, and I'm unsure how many years he has left as a superstar scorer. The Cavs have done a nice job adding pieces to help them defend Orlando. Before, they didn't have anybody -- other than Bron -- who could defend Rashard Lewis, now they have 3 guys capable of doing the job.


How the Cavs plan on beating a lineup of Howard, Lewis, Carter, Pietrus and Nelson or Wallace, Garnett, Pierce, Allen and Rondo is beyond me. The Cavs starting lineup doesn't scare me one bit. Now that Shaq is on the team, everyone will see how non-existent Mo Williams really is. There won't be much of a difference between him and Delonte West in the backcourt.

One of the main reasons the Magic where so successful last year, was because of the crazy match-ups they would throw at you. With the departure of Hedo, and with the addition of Carter, they became a much easier team to defend. My main concern for Boston is, who on their team can guard LeBron? Pierce can do it once in awhile during the season, but when the playoffs role around, Bron will simply wear him down in a playoff series. (Please don't tell me Marquis Daniels is going to be the Bron stopper, because if that's the case, you guys are in for a world of problems.) The addition of Shaq will only help Mo Williams. Shaq is still more than capable of drawing double teams, which means the shooters -- Parker, West, Mo, etc -- will all befit greatly from the addition of Shaq.


To me, the Magic's bench is so much better than the Cavs and so is the Celtics. When Bass is starting, Pietrus, a likely CJ Watson, Barnes and Gortat is just downright lethal protection. And a likely Big Baby, House, Rasheed and Marquis Daniels is equally as devastating. Nothing about Moon, Parker or Ilgauskas really scares me to be honest. Ilgauskas could never guard Howard or Garnett for **** - and Moon and Parker have just been average players on bad teams the past few years. The Cavs should have spent money on Linas Kleiza, not two over the hill role players.

You're so wrong here. One of my main concerns for the Celtics, is their lack of depth coming off the bench. Eddie House is a below average, streaky scorer, who doesn't play any defense coming off the bench. Sheed has been costing off his reputation for past few years, the majority of casual fans don't realize how god awful he was last year. The addition of Daniels was alright, but he still doesn't give them the one thing they truly need, and that's somebody who can defend LeBron. The Orlando bench has defiantly upgraded, Bass & Pietrus give them a solid 7 man rotation, outside of that I don't see much. I mean, Gortat can't really count as a rotation guy, seeing how he'll only play about 10 minutes a game.

Why are you so down on Anthony Parker? He's a quality 3-point shooter (42 percent during the past three seasons) with size who can defend 2-guards. Something the Cavs didn't have last season. Moon is a similar player. Shoots the ball well from 3, and is also a well above average perimeter defender. Couple of nice additions, if you ask me.


The power rankings thread really put me over the top. How the Cavs will beat a loaded Magic or Celtics team is beyond me. They are at best third in the East right now and if somehow the Heat can pull off getting Boozer and Odom, I would confidantly put the Cavs at fourth.

:laugh2:


Their future is mortgaged. Next year, if LeBron is re-signed for 18-20 million a year - they will have only three million in cap (50 million out of the 53 million salary cap - source go to HoopsHype salaries) and a shitload of role players. Shaq will be 38 and a free agent. I really can't grasp why Danny Ferry would do such idiotic moves as signing Varejao, Moon and Parker long term instead of waiting next year for someone like Bosh or Amare to come to Cleveland. None of those guys are really a help and all Varejao did last year was foul Howard and two years ago foul Garnett in the playoffs.

What exactly does this have to do with next season?

214boyz
07-30-2009, 04:11 AM
wow! you commented just about every ones post :clap:
clevland fan, got ya!
bron is bron nothing more need be said cause he's the KING!
bron will get his numbers but parker and moon aint gonna cut it.
yes shaq will help but cant count on him being healthy the whole season
3rd best team in the east.
but just cause the magics or the celtics have no one to guard
him doesnt mean the cavs cant be beat. they will not win it all
i love the KING but just being real.
looking forward to the KING hitting free agency

S-Dot
07-30-2009, 07:38 AM
They have LeBron...thats a pretty good reason

JordansBulls
07-30-2009, 08:32 AM
They have improved at Center and SG and got a little deeper. They got rid of their dead weight as well.

king james
07-30-2009, 08:42 AM
everybody keeps saying that FATBOY is still 1 of the top 5 centers in the game, right. Well can anybody name 5 good centers in the game? It doesn't take alot 2 b 1 of the best at a position when there isn't that many good players at that position. people act like when u say he's top 5 that it's like saying wade or kobe is the best sg in the league. When u say that then that means something cuz of all the good sg's in the league; but when u guys says he's 1 of the top 5 C's that means nothing.

Anyway Fat Boy is going 2 make a difference only 4 the simple fact that he may open the lanes up 4 lebron.But I don't think it will make that much of a difference 2 make them the best in the east. The only reason y everybody says the cavs r the best in the east is cuz of all lebron hype. Don't get me wrong the boy is a baller but tha espn's of the world want him 2 win so badly that that's all ur going 2 hear is the cavs r the best.

The Cavs proved in the playoffs that when they go up against a team that have multiple options on offense that they can't beat them. Now that Orlando has added a closer imo n Carter they become even more dangerous cuz if lebron sticks Carter whose going 2 stick Lewis and so on the magic provides 2 many matchup problems 4 the cavs. Then if u go 2 the Celtics the cavs would have all type of problems. Cuz in my opinion the Celtics has the best team chemistry in the league. They took the magic 2 7 games with out their best player; and I say that if Garnett was there last year that they would have repeated as champions, and now u add in a proven player like wallace and 1 of the steals n FA n Marquis Daniels. I just think daniels is a great addition 2 that team.I don't think the cavs additions r that much of an upgrade as what Boston and Orlando brought n.

Boston Faithful
07-30-2009, 09:40 AM
What exactly does this have to do with next season? But yes, the Cavs still have enough money to offer the MAX for next season, even if LBJ does decide to stay.

Doesn't matter how good Shaq was in his prime. He's still a legit top 5 center, who will be taking the minutes of Ben Wallace and Joe Smith, who Shaq is a huge upgrade over.

Not even close. Wally, Sasha, Joe Smith where all god awful players, who had no business being in the rotation for a title contending team. Moon gives them a quality perimeter defender to pair along side LeBron, and Parker gives them length and perimeter shooting in the front-court.

The Cavs are still hands down better than Boston. It's almost laughable how much they're being overrated coming into the season. Odds are KG never does comeback to what he was in '08, and Pierce is obviously on the decline, and I'm unsure how many years he has left as a superstar scorer. The Cavs have done a nice job adding pieces to help them defend Orlando. Before, they didn't have anybody -- other than Bron -- who could defend Rashard Lewis, now they have 3 guys capable of doing the job.

One of the main reasons the Magic were so successful last year, was because of the crazy match-ups they would throw at you. With the departure of Hedo, and with the addition of Carter, they became a much easier team to defend. My main concern for Boston is, who on their team can guard LeBron? Pierce can do it once in awhile during the season, but when the playoffs role around, Bron will simply wear him down in a playoff series. (Please don't tell me Marquis Daniels is going to be the Bron stopper, because if that's the case, you guys are in for a world of problems.) The addition of Shaq will only help Mo Williams. Shaq is still more than capable of drawing double teams, which means the shooters -- Parker, West, Mo, etc -- will all befit greatly from the addition of Shaq.

You're so wrong here. One of my main concerns for the Celtics, is their lack of depth coming off the bench. Eddie House is a below average, streaky scorer, who doesn't play any defense coming off the bench. Sheed has been costing off his reputation for past few years, the majority of casual fans don't realize how god awful he was last year. The addition of Daniels was alright, but he still doesn't give them the one thing they truly need, and that's somebody who can defend LeBron. The Orlando bench has defiantly upgraded, Bass & Pietrus give them a solid 7 man rotation, outside of that I don't see much. I mean, Gortat can't really count as a rotation guy, seeing how he'll only play about 10 minutes a game.

Why are you so down on Anthony Parker? He's a quality 3-point shooter (42 percent during the past three seasons) with size who can defend 2-guards. Something the Cavs didn't have last season. Moon is a similar player. Shoots the ball well from 3, and is also a well above average perimeter defender. Couple of nice additions, if you ask me.

What exactly does this have to do with next season?

First of all, you are a huge Cleveland mark. It's pretty obvious from your post. So your credibility goes down the toilet with this post. I made the post with a serious intention and you took just about every negative from Orlando and Boston and turned it upon them.

Let's just get this out of the way. It's a fact. As in THERE IS NO WAY THEY CAN SIGN A TOP FREE AGENT NEXT YEAR. Period. Go to HoopsHype and look at salaries and they already have 48 million committed if LeBron were to pick up his option (18 million) which he won't, and if he resigned it will be for that or more than that. The salary cap number was released at 53 million. So you're trying to feed me ******** that the Cavs will have enough cap next year to sign a top flight young free agent like Bosh, Amare or Wade? Yeah, right.

How is Parker a front court player? He's a shooting guard. He wasn't even good enough to play in the NBA from 99 to the mid 2000's and he came back to a bad team the past few years. He's a decent player with good shooting skills but is not any better than the combo of Wally and Sasha. I would take Ben Wallace anyday defending Garnett in the post than Jamario Moon. Anyday. And I highly doubt the Cavs brought Moon in for scoring.

Odds are? What were you the surgeon that operated on KG? You know how it went? As far as any real fan knows, the surgery went extremely well, perfect. And KG is on the road to 100% recovery. If anything, he'll be better than 2008. Mentally, he'll be so intense and fired up he'll probably jump out of his skin with revenge. What indications are there that Pierce is on the decline? The fact he hit clutch shot after clutch shot in the Magic and Bulls series? Or the fact that him and Ray Allen took that team to the limit last year with no depth and no KG?

I'll give you the fact that Shaq will draw solid double teams to kick out to shooters. That does scare me a bit. But it's comforting knowing how good the Celtics defense is and that Rasheed Wallace, Perkins or Garnett could at least do a half decent job on Shaq 1 on 1. And there's the fact that the Celtics have a top 3 defense in the league.

How the hell do they become more guardable without Hedo? Carter's a superstar. He may not be what he was but I will take 22/5/5 anyday. And that's been his worst season lately. All of his season with New Jersey he averaged 22-26. Nothing in your argument really proves how they will be better than Orlando now. It's obvious Carter is better than Hedo as Hedo just had a two year reckoning in Orlando as the rest of his career he's been relegated to a role player. His Sacramento and early Orlando years he wasn't all that. Nelson is coming back healthy and there is just no way the Cavs are going to be able to guard four All-Stars.

Eddie House is below average? He's a hell of alot better than Parker and is far more likely to have a 20 or 30 point game than Parker. When House gets hot, House gets hot. He had a stretch last season when he made like 20 out of 25 three pointers in 4 games. You obviously don't know that much about him to say such a foolish comment. He's one of the most solid role players in the NBA. I'm not a casual fan. Obviously Sheed has a reputation but that will be nullified by the Celtics strong locker room and his friendship with KG. Sheed doesn't need to be the All-Star he once was anymore. He just needs to come off the bench and give solid minutes, which he can do.

Unruly Fan
07-30-2009, 09:50 AM
LeBron couldn't even defeat the Magic last year and the Magic got better. The Celtics almost defeated the Magic in six so what makes you think that the Cavs would have any chance against a healthy Celtics team with a reloaded bench?

Oh yeah. Pierce is real old. It's not like he's the same age as Kobe or anything. :rolleyes:

And your speaking from a team who has a player (Shaq) who is about 4-6 years older than any of the players you just mentioned.This has already been discussed many times over. I think the Magic will be in for a surprise now that Hedo is gone.

3neSoulja
07-30-2009, 10:09 AM
"Shaq flops, Howard Dunks" ring any bells. You guys think Turks contract is overpaid look and Varajuo someone tell me how he's worth 9 mill a year. The cavs didn't do **** all but create a log jam at center and sign some roll players. Orlando picked up cry baby Carter and their bench is pretty solid. The celtics are better but they're older to so I have a good feeling one of the big three goes down again this year. Don't sleep on Toronto their gonna turn some heads cause their bench is the deepest in the east

Corey
07-30-2009, 10:15 AM
I just think Shaq will slow them down. I know he played (or tried to) run and gun in Phoenix, but I just can't see him fitting the Cavs style of play.

The best team in the east has to be the Magic since they just made it to the finals, but realistically 1-3 is a crap-shoot between the Magic, Cavs and C's. Anything can happen.

king4day
07-30-2009, 10:18 AM
I just see a lot of jealous fans out there wanting to know why the Cavs will be so good and why orlando will be so good.
This is starting to get silly.

ManRam
07-30-2009, 10:22 AM
LOL at the title...begging for this thread not to be close.

One word: LeBron James.

He carried the worst supporting cast ever to reach the NBA Finals to the NBA Finals before. He has some good players around him, not great ones, but enough to compete. As long as he's there, they'll contend. Picking up Shaq will help. He's still a top 5 center, and the main reason they lost to Orlando was because of Dwight, who averaged 10 more points a game vs. Cleveland than he did vs. Boston an LA. Shaq will help a lot.

cle12152433
07-30-2009, 10:31 AM
oh to hell with all this cold weather ****. Its the only argument unintelligent people make, because they want to fit in.

Its not like they are playing basketball OUTSIDE!!! When the hell is he gonna be outside??? HE will have to go outside to walk from his car to the arena and to pump gas at a gas station.

Stupid.

rabzouz 96
07-30-2009, 10:41 AM
weird thread, where is everybody thinking that the cavs are going to be so good?cuz here i just see lakersfans bashing lebron and saying that shaq will clog the paint.

ManRam
07-30-2009, 10:50 AM
Yeah...Shaq clogging the paint, and LeBron leaving because of the weather are quite possibly the funniest explanations ever.

Compared to Z, Shaq wont be slowing anything down, or clogging anything up. He sure clogged the lane real bad with Kobe and Wade...it totally decimated those teams. And LeBron wasn't born and raised in Akron, Ohio or anything...I'm sure the cold really bothers him, probably isn't used to it by now.

S-Dot
07-30-2009, 10:58 AM
Yeah...Shaq clogging the paint, and LeBron leaving because of the weather are quite possibly the funniest explanations ever.

Compared to Z, Shaq wont be slowing anything down, or clogging anything up. He sure clogged the lane real bad with Kobe and Wade...it totally decimated those teams. And LeBron wasn't born and raised in Akron, Ohio or anything...I'm sure the cold really bothers him, probably isn't used to it by now.

:clap:

philab
07-30-2009, 10:58 AM
This is not meant to be a flaming thread. I legitimately want to know why many people on this forum are sold on the Cavs winning the East this year. Let's look at the facts:

They mortaged their future badly this offseason. They re-signed Varejao at 8-9 million a year, signed Parker at 2.5 million for multiple years and Moon for 3 million a year. That kills ANY chance of them getting a top flight free agent next year to put next to LeBron.

They acquired Shaq, who had some sort of renaissance last year (18 and 8.5), but his numbers are still DRASTICALLY down from his prime.

They lost Wally, probably Joe Smith, Pavlovic and Ben Wallace and added Moon and Parker as far as role players go. That's certainly a wash.

But how is this team nearly as good as the Celtics or Magic? Vince Carter is a hell of alot better than Hedo Turkolugu. He's a proven commodity while I think Hedo will go down as one of the most overpaid guys in NBA history at age 35.

How the Cavs plan on beating a lineup of Howard, Lewis, Carter, Pietrus and Nelson or Wallace, Garnett, Pierce, Allen and Rondo is beyond me. The Cavs starting lineup doesn't scare me one bit. Now that Shaq is on the team, everyone will see how non-existent Mo Williams really is. There won't be much of a difference between him and Delonte West in the backcourt.

To me, the Magic's bench is so much better than the Cavs and so is the Celtics. When Bass is starting, Pietrus, a likely CJ Watson, Barnes and Gortat is just downright lethal protection. And a likely Big Baby, House, Rasheed and Marquis Daniels is equally as devastating. Nothing about Moon, Parker or Ilgauskas really scares me to be honest. Ilgauskas could never guard Howard or Garnett for **** - and Moon and Parker have just been average players on bad teams the past few years. The Cavs should have spent money on Linas Kleiza, not two over the hill role players.

The power rankings thread really put me over the top. How the Cavs will beat a loaded Magic or Celtics team is beyond me. They are at best third in the East right now and if somehow the Heat can pull off getting Boozer and Odom, I would confidantly put the Cavs at fourth.

Their future is mortgaged. Next year, if LeBron is re-signed for 18-20 million a year - they will have only three million in cap (50 million out of the 53 million salary cap - source go to HoopsHype salaries) and a shitload of role players. Shaq will be 38 and a free agent. I really can't grasp why Danny Ferry would do such idiotic moves as signing Varejao, Moon and Parker long term instead of waiting next year for someone like Bosh or Amare to come to Cleveland. None of those guys are really a help and all Varejao did last year was foul Howard and two years ago foul Garnett in the playoffs.

It's really now or never for this team and I can't see LeBron re-signing if they go empty handed this year and can't sign a big star next year.

Here's THE argument (not necessarily MY argument):

First, the future is irrelevant to this thread.

The Cavaliers lost Pavlovic, probably Smith, Wally, and Wallace's corpse and replaced them with Moon, Parker, and Shaq. What Shaq put up in his prime is irrelevant. Today, he is still a very good player. Parker is a much better defender than Wally. Moon is Pavlovic but a bit more athletic and a bit longer. All in all, it's a wash at worst.

The Cavaliers also added Danny Green. So with Moon, Parker, and Green, they have added three guys capable of defending taller perimeter players and lost only one (Pavlovic). This is much more important than anyone has noticed. The reason the Cavaliers lost to the Magic was NOT Dwight Howard really -- it was the lack of any perimeter defenders to match up with Lewis and Turkoglu.

Shaq is also much more capable of guarding Howard than Ilgauskas.

And let's not forget the Cavaliers won 66 games last year and made it to Game 6 of the ECF. That's a good team whatever way you slice it. That team has only gotten better this offseason.


So, why does "everyone" think the Cavaliers will be so good? Well, not everyone thinks they will. Hell, look at this thread. The Cavaliers are consistently ranked 3rd in the East. Just because a few pick them as the best doesn't mean you need to flip out. People are picking the Wizards to win the Finals on here.

Regardless, the Cavaliers were an elite team last year and only got better. It makes some sense to expect them to compete for a championship again. One series in which the opposing team shot over 50% from 3PT should not preclude a team from ever being mentioned as a contender again.



Second, as to the [irrelevant] "mortgaged future": You have LeBron making $18-20MM in a $53MM. THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE. In a $53MM cap, the most LeBron could make is $15.9MM. Shaq comes off the books for $20MM after this year also. And remember, if the Cavaliers signed the all-elusive "max FA" FIRST, then they could go over the cap to sign LeBron. Whether they were going over the cap or not, they would likely have to ink a player or two before re-signing LeBron anyway.

It's hard to see how any future has been mortgaged. In fact, the Cavaliers could have done much more this offseason (this is actually my opinion) if they weren't concerned with the future. Shaq is nice, but he certainly was not the best use of $20MM. The reason Ferry used that $20MM on Shaq was because he comes off the books after this year.

Also, a lot is made of the Varejao contract, but it's $42MM over six years (IIRC). That's not that bad. It can go up to $50MM, but only $42MM is guaranteed.



Finally, "waiting around this year for Bosh or Amare" next year is stupidity. LeBron becomes a FA after next year. Why would the team sit idle and not try to win? That makes no sense. And hell, the Cavaliers franchise does not cease to exist without LeBron. Dan Gilbert wants to win a championship for the Cavaliers and for Cleveland. Obviously, LeBron is a HUGE, HUGE part of that, but the championship is what owners and fans care about. And if the Cavaliers did somehow win one, it's hard to imagine how that could hurt their chances of landing LeBron.

arkanian215
07-30-2009, 11:04 AM
lol delete. bunch of homers...

ManRam
07-30-2009, 11:14 AM
Here's THE argument (not necessarily MY argument):

First, the future is irrelevant to this thread.

The Cavaliers lost Pavlovic, probably Smith, Wally, and Wallace's corpse and replaced them with Moon, Parker, and Shaq. What Shaq put up in his prime is irrelevant. Today, he is still a very good player. Parker is a much better defender than Wally. Moon is Pavlovic but a bit more athletic and a bit longer. All in all, it's a wash at worst.

The Cavaliers also added Danny Green. So with Moon, Parker, and Green, they have added three guys capable of defending taller perimeter players and lost only one (Pavlovic). This is much more important than anyone has noticed. The reason the Cavaliers lost to the Magic was NOT Dwight Howard really -- it was the lack of any perimeter defenders to match up with Lewis and Turkoglu.

Shaq is also much more capable of guarding Howard than Ilgauskas.

And let's not forget the Cavaliers won 66 games last year and made it to Game 6 of the ECF. That's a good team whatever way you slice it. That team has only gotten better this offseason.


So, why does "everyone" think the Cavaliers will be so good? Well, not everyone thinks they will. Hell, look at this thread. The Cavaliers are consistently ranked 3rd in the East. Just because a few pick them as the best doesn't mean you need to flip out. People are picking the Wizards to win the Finals on here.

Regardless, the Cavaliers were an elite team last year and only got better. It makes some sense to expect them to compete for a championship again. One series in which the opposing team shot over 50% from 3PT should not preclude a team from ever being mentioned as a contender again.



Second, as to the [irrelevant] "mortgaged future": You have LeBron making $18-20MM in a $53MM. THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE. In a $53MM cap, the most LeBron could make is $15.9MM. Shaq comes off the books for $20MM after this year also. And remember, if the Cavaliers signed the all-elusive "max FA" FIRST, then they could go over the cap to sign LeBron. Whether they were going over the cap or not, they would likely have to ink a player or two before re-signing LeBron anyway.

It's hard to see how any future has been mortgaged. In fact, the Cavaliers could have done much more this offseason (this is actually my opinion) if they weren't concerned with the future. Shaq is nice, but he certainly was not the best use of $20MM. The reason Ferry used that $20MM on Shaq was because he comes off the books after this year.

Also, a lot is made of the Varejao contract, but it's $42MM over six years (IIRC). That's not that bad. It can go up to $50MM, but only $42MM is guaranteed.



Finally, "waiting around this year for Bosh or Amare" next year is stupidity. LeBron becomes a FA after next year. Why would the team sit idle and not try to win? That makes no sense. And hell, the Cavaliers franchise does not cease to exist without LeBron. Dan Gilbert wants to win a championship for the Cavaliers and for Cleveland. Obviously, LeBron is a HUGE, HUGE part of that, but the championship is what owners and fans care about. And if the Cavaliers did somehow win one, it's hard to imagine how that could hurt their chances of landing LeBron.

Wow. Great post. Couldn't have written it any better myself. Too bad the people who disagree don't have the attention span to read this, and their minds are made up already. But whatever...you can't disagree with anything you just wrote. :clap::clap:

MPScribbles
07-30-2009, 11:18 AM
First of all, you are a huge Cleveland mark. It's pretty obvious from your post. So your credibility goes down the toilet with this post. I made the post with a serious intention and you took just about every negative from Orlando and Boston and turned it upon them.

Let's just get this out of the way. It's a fact. As in THERE IS NO WAY THEY CAN SIGN A TOP FREE AGENT NEXT YEAR. Period. Go to HoopsHype and look at salaries and they already have 48 million committed if LeBron were to pick up his option (18 million) which he won't, and if he resigned it will be for that or more than that. The salary cap number was released at 53 million. So you're trying to feed me ******** that the Cavs will have enough cap next year to sign a top flight young free agent like Bosh, Amare or Wade? Yeah, right.

How is Parker a front court player? He's a shooting guard. He wasn't even good enough to play in the NBA from 99 to the mid 2000's and he came back to a bad team the past few years. He's a decent player with good shooting skills but is not any better than the combo of Wally and Sasha. I would take Ben Wallace anyday defending Garnett in the post than Jamario Moon. Anyday. And I highly doubt the Cavs brought Moon in for scoring.

Odds are? What were you the surgeon that operated on KG? You know how it went? As far as any real fan knows, the surgery went extremely well, perfect. And KG is on the road to 100% recovery. If anything, he'll be better than 2008. Mentally, he'll be so intense and fired up he'll probably jump out of his skin with revenge. What indications are there that Pierce is on the decline? The fact he hit clutch shot after clutch shot in the Magic and Bulls series? Or the fact that him and Ray Allen took that team to the limit last year with no depth and no KG?

I'll give you the fact that Shaq will draw solid double teams to kick out to shooters. That does scare me a bit. But it's comforting knowing how good the Celtics defense is and that Rasheed Wallace, Perkins or Garnett could at least do a half decent job on Shaq 1 on 1. And there's the fact that the Celtics have a top 3 defense in the league.

How the hell do they become more guardable without Hedo? Carter's a superstar. He may not be what he was but I will take 22/5/5 anyday. And that's been his worst season lately. All of his season with New Jersey he averaged 22-26. Nothing in your argument really proves how they will be better than Orlando now. It's obvious Carter is better than Hedo as Hedo just had a two year reckoning in Orlando as the rest of his career he's been relegated to a role player. His Sacramento and early Orlando years he wasn't all that. Nelson is coming back healthy and there is just no way the Cavs are going to be able to guard four All-Stars.

Eddie House is below average? He's a hell of alot better than Parker and is far more likely to have a 20 or 30 point game than Parker. When House gets hot, House gets hot. He had a stretch last season when he made like 20 out of 25 three pointers in 4 games. You obviously don't know that much about him to say such a foolish comment. He's one of the most solid role players in the NBA. I'm not a casual fan. Obviously Sheed has a reputation but that will be nullified by the Celtics strong locker room and his friendship with KG. Sheed doesn't need to be the All-Star he once was anymore. He just needs to come off the bench and give solid minutes, which he can do.

Him being a Cleveland, defending his team, fan hurts his credibility but you being a Boston fan, touting yours, doesn't hurt your credibility? Doubles standards make your argument weaker.

As the guy said, signing free agents next summer has nothing to do with this upcoming season.

Anthony Parker, defensively, is much better than either one of those guys and shoots a pretty lights-out 3, which is all those two are good for anyways.

Comparing a former dpoy center to a small forward in regards to defending Garnett in the post is a ridiculous statement. Ridiculous statements make your argument weaker.

The reality of the situation is that Boston, as a team, is pretty old. That will happen when you mortgage your future- funny to me that you used that phrase when that is exactly what Boston did two years ago- and bring in a bunch of veterans to try to win now. If you act like older players don't face injury more often and that players coming back from injury are more likely to get injured again then you aren't dealing in reality. Dealing outside the realm of reality makes your argument weaker.

Shaq will still get double teams and open things up for others on the court. Imagine if LeBron had this last year. LeBron was the entire team last year and they were the best team in the East. Shaq may not be what he was but when you've got him on the team that allows the best one-on-one player in the league to play one-on-one. That seemed to work out really well for Kobe and Wade so no reason to think that it won't work out well for LeBron. So the ball gets dumped into Shaq, they double, ball back out to LeBron and now he gets to attack a defense that is out of position. With his superior driving skill and great passing skills there is no way that this is a worse situation than last season where every defense was geared to only stop him.

Carter does make Magic easier to guard in that with him on the floor they are a far more conventional team. Not many teams run a SF/C pick and roll as the main part of their offense so they were exceptionally hard to defend. Also, with four 3pt shooters on the floor at all times they were hard to defend. Now with Shaq, one of the few people in the league that can body up with Howard, they can play more straight man defense and with Carter instead of Hedo they won't have to defend the same style of offense as last year. Also, they didn't pay Bass all that money to not play so when he is on the floor they will have a VERY conventional lineup which continues to make them easier to defend than one beast in the middle and four 3pt shooters.

I believe that the guy's point about Eddie House is that he is streaky and you proceeded to refute that by proving his point? If house had a STREAK of 20/25 3's then that means that he had to have a pretty cold STREAK in order to bring his average back down to earth, right? Defending Eddie House by attacking Parker shows insecurity. Insecurity weakens your argument. If Eddie House were anything special he wouldn't have played for his 8th team in 9 years. Defending him just because you're a Boston fan is being a homer. Homerism weakens your argument.

I'm a Bulls fan if you would like to use that or the makeup of my team in any way to discredit all the sound points that I've made.

StevenU2009
07-30-2009, 11:20 AM
You may have overstated your case but I think all your points are correct. The X-factor, obviously, is that every once in a while a player is so much better than the rest that he is able to elevate his team-especially when the pressure is on and the pace is slower and the defense is intense-ala MJ-and the King is in that class to be certain. I love KG and Superman but neither is in LeBrons class.

Catfish1314
07-30-2009, 11:21 AM
I just think Shaq will slow them down. I know he played (or tried to) run and gun in Phoenix, but I just can't see him fitting the Cavs style of play.

Why would he slow them down? The Cavs don't play fast, they're strictly a halfcourt team.

MPScribbles
07-30-2009, 11:25 AM
Here's THE argument (not necessarily MY argument):...

Philab serving these fools once again. Nice.:clap:

pds916
07-30-2009, 11:36 AM
i honestly think that the acquisation of shaq will not help the cavs too much... shaq is just gonna take up space in the lane for lebron to drive to the basket.. btw shaq is just getting older and dwight howard is just getting better, dwight howard is the new superman

fatpat1116
07-30-2009, 11:36 AM
Wow. Great post. Couldn't have written it any better myself. Too bad the people who disagree don't have the attention span to read this, and their minds are made up already. But whatever...you can't disagree with anything you just wrote. :clap::clap:

totally agree

ttam68
07-30-2009, 11:49 AM
LeBron couldn't even defeat the Magic last year and the Magic got better. The Celtics almost defeated the Magic in six so what makes you think that the Cavs would have any chance against a healthy Celtics team with a reloaded bench?

Oh yeah. Pierce is real old. It's not like he's the same age as Kobe or anything. :rolleyes:

And your speaking from a team who has a player (Shaq) who is about 4-6 years older than any of the players you just mentioned.

Kobe's ten months younger and in the best shape of anyone in the NBA. Pierce is fat.

One goliath center thats top 10 all time being over the hill is better than your entire core of one time stars being old.

I'm not even a Cavs fan but theres ample reason to think they'll be good. Its really a toss up in the East as far as I can tell. Boston faces the greatest risk of injury and being a lower seed could be devastating this year.

Not to mention, the Cavs had the best record in the league and were tearing through the playoffs until they met the Magic's unconventional line-up and fell apart without a good leader. This year, I see Shaq stepping up and motivating that team in the playoffs and the Magic dropped Hedo (though they could try to get by with Shard and Pietrus at the 3/4 for a little advantage sometimes).

MPScribbles
07-30-2009, 12:07 PM
i honestly think that the acquisation of shaq will not help the cavs too much... shaq is just gonna take up space in the lane for lebron to drive to the basket.. btw shaq is just getting older and dwight howard is just getting better, dwight howard is the new superman

What did they accuse Shaq of? And why would that be helpful?

Sox Appeal
07-30-2009, 06:03 PM
First of all, you are a huge Cleveland mark. It's pretty obvious from your post. So your credibility goes down the toilet with this post. I made the post with a serious intention and you took just about every negative from Orlando and Boston and turned it upon them.

No, I'm actually a Bulls fan.


Let's just get this out of the way. It's a fact. As in THERE IS NO WAY THEY CAN SIGN A TOP FREE AGENT NEXT YEAR. Period. Go to HoopsHype and look at salaries and they already have 48 million committed if LeBron were to pick up his option (18 million) which he won't, and if he resigned it will be for that or more than that. The salary cap number was released at 53 million. So you're trying to feed me ******** that the Cavs will have enough cap next year to sign a top flight young free agent like Bosh, Amare or Wade? Yeah, right.

Have you ever heard of bird years? The Cavs can go over the cap to keep Bron, which means they would still have money left over to sign a MAX FA. But what exactly does this have to do with, next year?



How is Parker a front court player? He's a shooting guard. He wasn't even good enough to play in the NBA from 99 to the mid 2000's and he came back to a bad team the past few years. He's a decent player with good shooting skills but is not any better than the combo of Wally and Sasha. I would take Ben Wallace anyday defending Garnett in the post than Jamario Moon. Anyday. And I highly doubt the Cavs brought Moon in for scoring.

He gives them some versatility coming off the bench. Like I said, he's a quality 3PT shooter, he can defend 2's and 3's effectively, which is something they desperately needed last year. Parker is a legit rotation player on a championship team, Wally and Sasha have no buisness being on anybody's roster. They're god awful players, Parker isn't, so that alone makes him a MAJOR upgrade. Wallace is a terrible low-post defender, even in his prime he's had his struggles defending skilled players in the post, such as Garnett.


Odds are? What were you the surgeon that operated on KG? You know how it went? As far as any real fan knows, the surgery went extremely well, perfect. And KG is on the road to 100% recovery. If anything, he'll be better than 2008. Mentally, he'll be so intense and fired up he'll probably jump out of his skin with revenge. What indications are there that Pierce is on the decline? The fact he hit clutch shot after clutch shot in the Magic and Bulls series? Or the fact that him and Ray Allen took that team to the limit last year with no depth and no KG?

Well, are you a doctor? Everything that I've heard is, most people honestly have no idea what was wrong KG's knee. Yes, he had surgery, but the surgery that he had has only been done to .00001% of people. My guess is it was just all of the wear and tear on KG's knee taking it's toll on him, I could be wrong though. Pierce it clutch shot after clutch shot in the playoffs? Did you actually watch the games? Pierce was pathetic in the playoffs, Ray Allen and Rondo simply carried that team as far as they possibly could.


I'll give you the fact that Shaq will draw solid double teams to kick out to shooters. That does scare me a bit. But it's comforting knowing how good the Celtics defense is and that Rasheed Wallace, Perkins or Garnett could at least do a half decent job on Shaq 1 on 1. And there's the fact that the Celtics have a top 3 defense in the league.

True.


How the hell do they become more guardable without Hedo? Carter's a superstar. He may not be what he was but I will take 22/5/5 anyday. And that's been his worst season lately. All of his season with New Jersey he averaged 22-26. Nothing in your argument really proves how they will be better than Orlando now. It's obvious Carter is better than Hedo as Hedo just had a two year reckoning in Orlando as the rest of his career he's been relegated to a role player. His Sacramento and early Orlando years he wasn't all that. Nelson is coming back healthy and there is just no way the Cavs are going to be able to guard four All-Stars.

Because Orlando was the only team in the league with two players taller then 6'10, that could put the ball on the floor, and shoot it from the 3. Did you watch the conference finals? That was the one true advantage they had over the Cavs. Carter isn't a superstar anymore, he's been putting up those numbers on a bad team. His numbers are going to drop drastically in Orlando, and it'll be interesting to see how he deals with that.


Eddie House is below average? He's a hell of alot better than Parker and is far more likely to have a 20 or 30 point game than Parker. When House gets hot, House gets hot. He had a stretch last season when he made like 20 out of 25 three pointers in 4 games. You obviously don't know that much about him to say such a foolish comment. He's one of the most solid role players in the NBA. I'm not a casual fan. Obviously Sheed has a reputation but that will be nullified by the Celtics strong locker room and his friendship with KG. Sheed doesn't need to be the All-Star he once was anymore. He just needs to come off the bench and give solid minutes, which he can do.

House isn't even close to as good as Anthony Parker. It's almost laughable how much you're underrating him. Parker is a quality defender, pretty solid mid-range shooter, can make it from 3, and he's never going to take a bad shot. Eddie House decides not to play defense, he's an horrific ball handler, the only one true thing he can do is score, but whenever he gets the ball he's going to shoot, so it's not like you could say he's an effective scorer.

solelimited
07-30-2009, 06:11 PM
I dont think the Cavs could beat orlando or boston. Especially Orlando. They still have ZERO answer for Lewis.

ElMarroAfamado
07-30-2009, 06:11 PM
its probably because they got Shaq
and the east is so weak any acquisition gets overblown for the simple fact..that well its the east.....
and they have lebron james....
with that said.....
the cavs are not making the nba finals....i think its going to boil down to the magic or the celtics
last season i correctly predicted neither the cavs or celtics would make the nba finals (in the beggining of the playoffs)

so this time ill start by saying the Cavs will not......

Sox Appeal
07-30-2009, 06:18 PM
i honestly think that the acquisation of shaq will not help the cavs too much... shaq is just gonna take up space in the lane for lebron to drive to the basket.. btw shaq is just getting older and dwight howard is just getting better, dwight howard is the new superman

If Shaq does "clog the paint" won't that just leave more room for the Cavs shooters to do some damage?

cowboyz180
07-30-2009, 06:26 PM
i think the magic and celtics are better

championships
07-30-2009, 06:52 PM
haha I don't

Fireworld
07-30-2009, 07:26 PM
Marc Stein says Laker's stepped up after hearing about Portland's 5 year offer.

CowboysKB24
07-30-2009, 07:44 PM
1.Magic
2.Celtics
3.Cavs

Sounds pretty good in the East.

It is great to see that it is unnecessary to even name the Lakers because they are the best team in the NBA considering they just won the NBA championship. Also Kobe Bryant has 4 NBA championship rings!

pds916
07-30-2009, 07:45 PM
What did they accuse Shaq of? And why would that be helpful?

huh? what are u trying to say... i didnt say accusation..

tland22
07-30-2009, 08:34 PM
They have LeBron James.

They won 66 games last year, have same team with two HUGE additions: Anthony Parker and Shaq.

Their bench is EXCELLENT:
Gibson
A. Parker
Jamario. Moon
JJ. Hickson
Big Z

They play in the Central Division: Cavs, Bulls, Pistons, Bucks, Pacers. They will win tons of games.

They play very good, consistent Defense.

They have LeBron James!

any other reason you need to convince you they will be good?????????????????????????????????????????????? ?

Lakergirl24
07-30-2009, 08:37 PM
Because they had the best record in the league last year and just added more depth

dee279
07-30-2009, 08:55 PM
Well they were so good last year and Shaq only makes them that much better so maybe thats y.

Superstar21
07-30-2009, 08:57 PM
cavs are the best in the east because LEBRON MVP JAMES. You think the cavs have a bunch of over the hill players look at Boston KG, Paul, Ray, and Sheed are old as **** there is no way they all are healthy for the playoff.

how do u figure, when shaq shows more decline than KG, Paul & Ray..
plus u havn't even seen Sheed play yet? what if sheed coming to a new environment brings something else out of him! after all this could be his last chance and going for a championship being on the celtics!

CaesarTheParrot
07-30-2009, 09:14 PM
yeah but you are adding player that is 37 years old that will certainly have a injury next year which will cost the Cavs some games and i dont see how jamario moon and anthony parker will make the Cavs a better team then the Magic or Celtics. Lebron is a superstar huh what about Dwight and KG

Only time that i will also agree with a Celtic Fan because i am a Laker fan

How do you know he'll have an injury? What can you see into the future? I love these cavs hate threads.

mikantsass
07-30-2009, 09:38 PM
Dude i want to back you up cuz you're a C's fan, but the Cavs have LeBron James. Himself alone qualifies the team as a contender. He already took a team to the finals by himself.

MPScribbles
08-01-2009, 12:51 PM
huh? what are u trying to say... i didnt say accusation..

I know what you were going for but it's not what you wrote, it was funnier this way. jk. Don't worry about it.

DMOB23
08-01-2009, 01:16 PM
Top 5 nba teams, are magic,lakers,celtics,cavs and san antonio

KB---24
08-01-2009, 01:29 PM
Well they were so good last year and Shaq only makes them that much better so maybe thats y.

Dwayne Wade hasnt even got an MVP award for the regular season.
1.Kobe
2.Lebron
3.D-Wade

Hawkeye15
08-01-2009, 03:21 PM
Because they have the best player in the world, who is 24, and will only get better, won 66 games, play great defense, and added Shaq.
Are they the best team in the NBA? Probably not. Can they win a ring? Sure

jakesmail123
08-01-2009, 03:27 PM
Lebron

JJ81
08-01-2009, 06:00 PM
Because they have LeBron and Shaq.

stockchampion25
08-01-2009, 06:13 PM
LeBron couldn't even defeat the Magic last year and the Magic got better. The Celtics almost defeated the Magic in six so what makes you think that the Cavs would have any chance against a healthy Celtics team with a reloaded bench?
Oh yeah. Pierce is real old. It's not like he's the same age as Kobe or anything. :rolleyes:
And your speaking from a team who has a player (Shaq) who is about 4-6 years older than any of the players you just mentioned.
LOL @ this guy!
Listen to what you said...."Lebron couldnt even defeat the Magic...". That is exactly why this team is better than last years team. It's not just Lebron doing all the work now. Shaq @ 37 is better than 75% of the leagues centers(including soft Gasol). But just adding him isnt why we are better. With him and "Z" we have a solid starting&bench center position.

Also, now with Parker and Moon instead of Wally and Sasha, we can finally guard the perimeter with length and speed. I once saw a turtle take Wally to the hole:o.....lol. He can shoot but what else?...anyone?...Im waiting..... And Sasha(I had such high hopes of a chris mullen type of guy, remember I said type not eexact, because he is far from that) and you let me down! But in your defense you did shut down VC in the playoffs a few years back and I thank you for that and remind everyone else of that. Vince shot 35.3% from the field that series!!!!! That is the only upside that we got from Sasha...one series!:mad: Moon and Parker can both stink it up(but I doubt that) and we would be no worst off than before. Fingers crossed that one turns out to be a poor mans Ariza.

We lost Ben Wallace...AND?!?!?!?! FYI, I watched all 82 Cavs games last year(havent missed one since LBJ joined) and if you missed the action let me fill you in. He missed countless wide open dunks, was slow on rotations and well thats it.....what more does he do? Dunk and play D, right? I mean the other teams would not even look at him when he was on the court. If he cant do either then where is his value? I look at it like it was a Shaq for Wallace trade(which basically it was). Shaq can still dunk and his "D" is no worst off(actually much better) than Wallace. Ben got us 2.9 pts and 6.4 reb per game:speechless:, Shaq 17.8 and 8.4 repectively and Shaq only played 4 minutes more per. Shaq, granted it was a comeback year, still has some left in the tank and with Z he can coast through the regular season and save some for the postseason. And if Shaq only does 12 and 7 while guarding Dwight then we have improved alot more than people are letting onto.

Now with all that being said the topic was why do we think we can win the East...let me help.

Boston, do you remember 2 years ago when we almost beat you with ONLY Lebron on our team? Maybe you can ask your "new/very old" teammate about his... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1Px-jPm_TU . Point being anything can happen with a player like LBJ/Kobe/MJ on your team. Everyone has witnessed that throughout history. Boston, you are old and getting older!! There still is only one ball on the court at a time. I like Rasheed but he was a waste of money. Big Baby does most of what he can at this point in his career(except shoot the 3) and with less headaches and more upside/youth. KG still has to prove he can play post injury. Peirce has never been fast but it never helps having a 3 that cant keep up with LBJ...rotate off Shaq please...LOL!! And whoever said kobe and peirce are the same age is right but while Kobe looks to be getting better, Paul is faking injuries and really starting to show his age. Ray has been anything but consistent for you and is now officially 35. You let your youth walk and got older in return, meaning you did not get better. You actually put yourself in position to deal with many injuries throughout a long season and possibly miss the playoffs...I actually would like those odds of them not making it at all. Especially with Rondo not being happy! He was your key to winning it 2 yrs ago and is no longer "feeling" Boston. It takes more heart than talent to win a championship!

That goes for Orlando also. YES, LBJ couldnt do it this year, I have to admit very reluctantly, but we cant say he didnt try. You to might have actually gotten worst. Hedo was your "grease man". He made everything work for you guys last year. I love VC....I played againts him in HS(football not basketball at Mainland High). But is he worth a budding Courtney Lee??? My goodness that guy shined for you guys last year in the playoffs vs the Cavs and you sent him packing...wow...thank you:clap:. But his year we match up much differently than last year and that has more to do with the trades and moves that the Magic made than the ones the Cavs made. Vince doesnt shoot the 3 any better than Courtney(VC 38.5% last year...CL 40.4% last year) and is slower and a much worst defender also. You guys actually got worst if you ask me. But time will tell.

These are my views and opinions mixed with facts. I do believe the Cavs gambled greatly but I also believe it was the only right move to make. Watch what happens when LBJ plays the 4 this year!!! You want trouble you got it!! Cavs are my champs but I have been saying that my entire life as a Cleveland sports fans and we all know where thats gotten me. Good luck to all with the upcomming season!

:D

DetroitRipCity
08-01-2009, 06:33 PM
Shaq does not help the cavs just added a 325 pound ankle weight