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JordansBulls
07-24-2009, 11:47 PM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=2997




All-Decade First Team
G Kobe Bryant 88.2
G Chauncey Billups 76.1
F Dirk Nowitzki 95.4
F Tim Duncan 91.5
C Shaquille O’Neal 86.1






All-Decade Second Team
G Steve Nash 70.0
G Ray Allen 66.3
F Kevin Garnett 86.8
F LeBron James 76.9
C Ben Wallace 60.8






All-Decade Third Team
G Tracy McGrady 63.4
G Jason Kidd 59.9
F Shawn Marion 72.4
F Paul Pierce 69.1
C Amare Stoudemire 54.1

blacknell
07-24-2009, 11:56 PM
decent

TheGsw
07-25-2009, 12:02 AM
Notice Bostons big 3 are all in there!!!
Thats why Bostin will have a shot at the titles for yeaars!

MTar786
07-25-2009, 12:10 AM
lol thats ******** IMO

id say

jason kidd
kobe
KG
Duncan
Shaq

with Shaq being the Player of the decade
close runner ups would be kobe and TD

His (shaqs) dominance from 00-04 maybe even 05 Will NEVER be repeated

B.JenningsMVP
07-25-2009, 12:15 AM
Looks about right

JMKnick33
07-25-2009, 12:21 AM
I'd put either Nash or Kidd ahead of Billups.

True, Billups has the ring. But Nash has the two MVPs. Kidd has the two Finals appearances. ALSO, Nash and Kidd improved their teams by at least double amount of wins upon arrival.

And no, I'm not disrespecting Billups. I love his game. He's right behind Nash and Kidd IMO.

superkegger
07-25-2009, 12:31 AM
I'd put either Nash or Kidd ahead of Billups.

True, Billups has the ring. But Nash has the two MVPs. Kidd has the two Finals appearances. ALSO, Nash and Kidd improved their teams by at least double amount of wins upon arrival.

And no, I'm not disrespecting Billups. I love his game. He's right behind Nash and Kidd IMO.

Billups has two finals appearances as well, and won one of them.

While he didn't double the teams wins, that should be asterisked. Both Nash and Kidd went to a team that just got rid of Stephon marbury, that alone improves you by 10 games, as we saw with the Knicks this year.

Plus, the Nets had the #1 pick in Kenyon Martin the year Kidd arrived. And Phoenix also pretty much tanked that year before Nash, getting rid of marbury early in the season for Antonio McDyess, Maciej Lampe, Howard Eisley, Charlie Ward, rights to Milos Vujanic, and McDyess only played 24 games.

And all anybody could talk about earlier this year with Denver was how much Chauncey improved them. Chauncey is very deserving of that top spot.

B.JenningsMVP
07-25-2009, 12:36 AM
From looking at this it's kinda sad how the Center position has declined. I mean Ben Wallace 2nd? Yeah I know he's a great rebounder & stuff;& that this goes by what you accomplished rather than individual skills, but really 2nd?.. If this was the '90s you'd have Hakeem, Ewing, The Admiral, Shaq, & even Alonzo... Just thought I'd bring that up lol

CaesarTheParrot
07-25-2009, 12:41 AM
lol thats ******** IMO

id say

jason kidd
kobe
KG
Duncan
Shaq

with Shaq being the Player of the decade
close runner ups would be kobe and TD

His (shaqs) dominance from 00-04 maybe even 05 Will NEVER be repeated

I would agree with shaq over nowitzki but in no way should j kidd be over chauncey

CaesarTheParrot
07-25-2009, 12:44 AM
lol thats ******** IMO

id say

jason kidd
kobe
KG
Duncan
Shaq

with Shaq being the Player of the decade
close runner ups would be kobe and TD

His (shaqs) dominance from 00-04 maybe even 05 Will NEVER be repeated

I would agree with KG over nowitzki but in no way should j kidd be over chauncey

AntiG
07-25-2009, 01:06 AM
no AI is ********.

adrijanl
07-25-2009, 01:21 AM
For real? How you not going to have allen iverson on there. Thats ****ed

asandhu23
07-25-2009, 01:23 AM
where is baron davis? :speechless:

superkegger
07-25-2009, 01:25 AM
where is baron davis? :speechless:

where he should be, not on the list.

dre1990
07-25-2009, 01:26 AM
LOVE the Chauncey Love

asandhu23
07-25-2009, 01:38 AM
where he should be, not on the list.

baron should be somewhere there. what he did for us back in 2007 has to be worth something. t-mac is up there for crying out loud

97'bulls
07-25-2009, 01:40 AM
Dirk shouldn't be ahead of KG

what54!?
07-25-2009, 01:43 AM
thats list is garbage. Dirk shouldn't be ahead of KG and kidd before billups

BUCSFORLIFE123
07-25-2009, 01:45 AM
I'd put either Nash or Kidd ahead of Billups.

True, Billups has the ring. But Nash has the two MVPs. Kidd has the two Finals appearances. ALSO, Nash and Kidd improved their teams by at least double amount of wins upon arrival.

And no, I'm not disrespecting Billups. I love his game. He's right behind Nash and Kidd IMO.

billups plays D which is a huge + dats why hes over nash and kidd plain and simple

Nets fan 93
07-25-2009, 01:48 AM
nooo.... Jkidd should be on the 1st team

superkegger
07-25-2009, 01:49 AM
baron should be somewhere there. what he did for us back in 2007 has to be worth something. t-mac is up there for crying out loud

one year doesn't warrant all decade team mention.

It's not just some random placing.

From the guy who compiled the teams:


My opinion is that most people mentally rank players by counting all the players’ seasons, but weighting their best seasons more. In order to mimic that, I’ve defined each player’s approximate career “value” to be:

100% of his best season, plus 95% of his 2nd-best season, plus 90% of his 3rd-best season, plus, ….

So, for two players with the same career [value], the one with the higher peak will be rated a little higher. And junk seasons at the end of a player’s career count for almost nothing.

In order to find each player’s “value” for a particular season, I decided to add his regular season Win Shares to his post-season Win Shares. I also tweaked Doug’s weights slightly. Since we’re dealing with a period of 10 years rather than entire careers, a player’s best season gets a weight of 1, his second-best season gets a weight of 0.9, his third-best season gets a weight of 0.8, etc. This will help to prevent players who may have missed a season due to injury or were drafted later in the decade from being penalized too harshly. I also decided to mimic the All-NBA voters and not make fine distinctions at each position, so a particular team might have two power forwards rather than one small forward and one power forward.


and on Dirk:

Nowitzki earned a decade-best 137.6 Win Shares during the regular season.
Nowitzki finished fifth in the decade with 17.4 playoff Win Shares, but while Nowitzki played in only 97 playoff games, no one above him played him in fewer than 133 games.
Nowitzki is an almost perfect blend of productivity and efficiency. Among players with at least 400 games played during the decade, he had the 15th-highest usage percentage, the 8th-lowest turnover percentage, and the 6th-highest offensive rating.
The Mavericks have won 50 or more games nine consecutive seasons, including seasons of 60 and 67 wins after losing two-time MVP Steve Nash. The one constant during this streak? Nowitzki.

Pretty reasonable.

asandhu23
07-25-2009, 02:03 AM
one year doesn't warrant all decade team mention.

It's not just some random placing.

From the guy who compiled the teams:




dude he brought a franchise back from the grave, that is pretty huge. why is t-mac there? he didn't do squat.

Hawkeye15
07-25-2009, 02:04 AM
Kidd
Bryant
KG
Duncan
Shaq

superkegger
07-25-2009, 02:07 AM
dude he brought a franchise back from the grave, that is pretty huge. why is t-mac there? he didn't do squat.

squat?

Joke about his injuries and how he's a vagina all you want, but clearly you didn't follow the NBA the earlier part of this decade, when Tmac was a ****ing stud. He was utterly dominant from 2000-2004 and still very damn good from 05-07. Yes, he never got out of the first round, but look beyond that, and look at how damn good he was before injuries took hold. He was un****ingreal.

NYtilIdie
07-25-2009, 02:09 AM
baron should be somewhere there. what he did for us back in 2007 has to be worth something. t-mac is up there for crying out loud

T-Mac was arguably the best player in the league in his day and has one of the highest PPG in the playoffs also he carried the Rocket's to a 22 game win streak without Yao in 2007. Now while Baron was great he was never known as one of the elite in the league not even in his best days.

Baron's accomplishments: 2 time all-star, Playstation Skills Challenge champion, Third NBA team

T-Mac accomplishments:7 time all-star, 7 time all NBA team, 2 scoring titles, Most Improved player

Plus T-Mac has always been dominate except for last seasonwith the knee problems.

j-mart
07-25-2009, 02:09 AM
How did Ray Allen make this list?

ko8e24
07-25-2009, 02:29 AM
I would agree with shaq over nowitzki but in no way should j kidd be over chauncey

:confused: shaq's a center and dirk's a power forward

ko8e24
07-25-2009, 02:29 AM
baron should be somewhere there. what he did for us back in 2007 has to be worth something. t-mac is up there for crying out loud

1 outta 10 yrs bro. means he was really only relevant compared to those guys listed only 10% of the time

ko8e24
07-25-2009, 02:30 AM
Kidd
Bryant
KG
Duncan
Shaq

x2

ko8e24
07-25-2009, 02:32 AM
billups plays D which is a huge + dats why hes over nash and kidd plain and simple

uuhhh no, its not that plain and simple. Chauncey was irrelavant the first four years of his decade (2000, 2001, 2002, 2003ish). sure, he had seven straight trips to the conference finals (beyond awesomeness)

(ECF with Detroit Pistons in 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008) and (WCF with Denver Nuggets in 2009). But you gotta be relevant every year

Beno7500
07-25-2009, 03:40 AM
marion... really?

DQL
07-25-2009, 03:49 AM
Omg how do Ray Allen, Marion or even Lebron make the teams and Wade cant? He nearly singlehandedly won the championship. That guy is a big time Wade hater.

BoltLakerPadre
07-25-2009, 04:36 AM
Notice Bostons big 3 are all in there!!!
Thats why Bostin will have a shot at the titles for yeaars!

Boston will have a shot at the title for years because their big 3 were great earlier in this decade?

This decade is almost over, and so are they.

Kings Faithful
07-25-2009, 04:37 AM
No C-Webb? Seriously? I guess 27 ppg/ 11 rpg / 5 apg / 1.7 bpg / 1.3 spg isn't good enough... ridiculous.

SeoulBeatz
07-25-2009, 04:38 AM
maybe im a homer but not having A.I on at least the all decade 3rd team is a disgrace

SeoulBeatz
07-25-2009, 04:39 AM
baron should be somewhere there. what he did for us back in 2007 has to be worth something. t-mac is up there for crying out loud

lol dude cmon now

Kings Faithful
07-25-2009, 04:41 AM
I think it's impossible to make an all decade team with a 15 player limit... there are too many good players that are and were amazing.

SeoulBeatz
07-25-2009, 04:42 AM
dude he brought a franchise back from the grave, that is pretty huge. why is t-mac there? he didn't do squat.

after reading this u must be either a huge homer or only 10 years old and did not see how great T-Mac was the first half of the decade!

he was as good if not better than Kobe (at the time)

Kobe, A.I, V.C and T-Mac.

those were the big 4 Sg's and they were the top 4 players in the league for a good 5 years....

do some research youngin!

asandhu23
07-25-2009, 05:44 AM
after reading this u must be either a huge homer or only 10 years old and did not see how great T-Mac was the first half of the decade!

he was as good if not better than Kobe (at the time)

Kobe, A.I, V.C and T-Mac.

those were the big 4 Sg's and they were the top 4 players in the league for a good 5 years....

do some research youngin!

you are wrong on both age ( i am much older than that ) and homer part. i am not looking for people who can get stats etc. i am looking at people who have made the most impact on their respective team. I know T-Mac was good but he certainly doesn't belong up in those lists.

J_M_B
07-25-2009, 03:41 PM
you are wrong on both age ( i am much older than that ) and homer part. i am not looking for people who can get stats etc. i am looking at people who have made the most impact on their respective team. I know T-Mac was good but he certainly doesn't belong up in those lists.

Come on man stop being a homer! T-Mac was arguably the best player in the NBA in his prime! Baron Davis is a good player and I respect his game, but they are a handful of players that aren't on this list that are ahead of Davis(Allen Iverson, Dwyane Wade, Vince Carter, etc...)

knickerbockerny
07-25-2009, 04:08 PM
If Allen Iverson is not on even the third team that list has no merit and quite frankly biased. You are trying to tell me that from the year 2000 until now, including last years debacle, he is not one of the top six guards? Chauncey Billups, Tracey McGrady, and Ray Allen are in front of him, that's ridiculous. Man add Steve Nash and Jason Kidd to the list; Kobe Bryant is the only justified choice to be ahead of AI

2001 league MVP
He lead the league in scoring 01, 02, and 05.
NBA First team in 01 and 05
NBA Second team in 02 and 03
All star game MVP in 01 and 05
was an allstar in every year of the decade.
lead his team to the finals in 01

Need I say more. The guy is tough as nails. The list is basically punishing AI heavy for his down year this year. And that's not fair, how many games did T-Mac even play this season or over the last 3 seasons.

lorenz00
07-25-2009, 10:05 PM
where tony parker? XD

Chronz
07-25-2009, 10:29 PM
dude he brought a franchise back from the grave, that is pretty huge. why is t-mac there? he didn't do squat.
Tmac did more in 1 season with the magic than Baron has done his entire career.

Chronz
07-25-2009, 10:31 PM
No C-Webb? Seriously? I guess 27 ppg/ 11 rpg / 5 apg / 1.7 bpg / 1.3 spg isn't good enough... ridiculous.
Yea I wouldve had him over Marion, but Im guessing Marion getting more prime years in the 00's put him over the top.

Chronz
07-25-2009, 10:33 PM
you are wrong on both age ( i am much older than that ) and homer part. i am not looking for people who can get stats etc. i am looking at people who have made the most impact on their respective team. I know T-Mac was good but he certainly doesn't belong up in those lists.
In other words you have no argument, Tmac had the bigger impact and the stats are RELEVANT

OC Knights #11
07-25-2009, 10:33 PM
Ben Fricken Wallace. Come on, that's bull ****. I'd rather see Michael Jordan on that list even though he only played two seasons in this decade.

Hawkeye15
07-25-2009, 10:35 PM
Yea I wouldve had him over Marion, but Im guessing Marion getting more prime years in the 00's put him over the top.

agreed, big time. It still boggles my mind how Dirk beat out KG though. The only thing I can think of, is number wise, KG has gone way down the last 2 years. But I can guarantee you, 4/5 fans would take KG in the 2000's over Dirk

DenButsu
07-25-2009, 10:37 PM
Both Nash and Kidd went to a team that just got rid of Stephon marbury, that alone improves you by 10 games

:laugh2: Classic post.

People who are having a hard time figuring out why basketball-reference put Billups ahead of Nash and Kidd should read the full article. They explain themselves pretty thoroughly.

Chronz
07-25-2009, 10:46 PM
agreed, big time. It still boggles my mind how Dirk beat out KG though. The only thing I can think of, is number wise, KG has gone way down the last 2 years. But I can guarantee you, 4/5 fans would take KG in the 2000's over Dirk
Lack of playoff success really hurts him, and its where I disagree with this list the most. It overrated Ben Wallace, and underrates Yao.

I wouldve put more emphasis on regular season play and subjectively included defense into the equation.

MajorFloridaFan
07-25-2009, 10:48 PM
i agree seems spot on

cubsbullsbears
07-25-2009, 10:56 PM
if winning mvp and 3 scoring titles (AI) doesnt get you on this list, idk wat does

MajorFloridaFan
07-25-2009, 11:01 PM
if winning mvp and 3 scoring titles (AI) doesnt get you on this list, idk wat does

No doubt he needs to be on this list he was a great player by any persons measure plays with soo much heart and hustle

Killadelphian13
07-25-2009, 11:01 PM
I hate Allen Iverson. I despise him as a person and hate the way he plays the game. That being said, he really does deserve to make the list in some capacity.

Chronz
07-25-2009, 11:03 PM
if winning mvp and 3 scoring titles (AI) doesnt get you on this list, idk wat does
Scoring titles are meaningless (Who cares who wins an arbitrary tally, that doesnt take into consideration efficiency and role), MVP's are subjective the best players in the league dont win MVP's, **** even Peja was in the running once, Tmac has been overrated by MVP standings the past few years). This list is an effort at an objective stance. If you have a problem with the rankings, break the logic/formula down. There are bound to be holes that they arent seeing, there always are when it comes to stats, thats part of the game.


No doubt he needs to be on this list he was a great player by any persons measure plays with soo much heart and hustle
Great player yes, but among the greatest he is severely overrated. Put it this way, he was better in his days in Denver, but all people ever brag about when it comes to AI is his lone trip to the Finals.

MajorFloridaFan
07-25-2009, 11:13 PM
Scoring titles are meaningless (Who cares who wins an arbitrary tally, that doesnt take into consideration efficiency and role), MVP's are subjective the best players in the league dont win MVP's, **** even Peja was in the running once, Tmac has been overrated by MVP standings the past few years). This list is an effort at an objective stance. If you have a problem with the rankings, break the logic/formula down. There are bound to be holes that they arent seeing, there always are when it comes to stats, thats part of the game.


Great player yes, but among the greatest he is severely overrated. Put it this way, he was better in his days in Denver, but all people ever brag about when it comes to AI is his lone trip to the Finals.

My man he played with sooooo much heart.....he is the best pound for pound player ever in the NBA he is barely six foot.....Tiny....before him there was the tag that no under six ft gaurd could ever star in this league and he did it with soo much proficiency...there has been arguements about this in the Sports world
Maybe a never top 3 PG or SG but def needs some kind of recognition for what he has done he has done waaaaay more than tracy mcgrady if your arguments hold true all he has done is been bounced out of the first round always

Chronz
07-25-2009, 11:19 PM
My man he played with sooooo much heart.....he is the best pound for pound player ever in the NBA he is barely six foot.....Tiny....before him there was the tag that no under six ft gaurd could ever star in this league and he did it with soo much proficiency...there has been arguements about this in the Sports world
See heres your main problem, impact and greatness doesnt care about your height, it doesnt matter whether your 7"1 or 6"10 all that matters is the end result. Would you rather have a 6"0 player that plays hard or the talented 7ft who makes the game look easy? Im not gonna give AI credit for being a liability. Being a 6"0 SG really made it hard for his teams to build around him.


Maybe a never top 3 PG or SG but def needs some kind of recognition for what he has done he has done waaaaay more than tracy mcgrady if your arguments hold true all he has done is been bounced out of the first round always

Its more than what AI accomplished after his top ranked defense left his side. Tmac on that Sixers team wouldve gotten more out of the group, he was a better offensive and defensive player in his peak form, usually when you upgrade both ends of your team you get better as a result. And AI was given a substantial advantage by these weights for his playoff games, and it still wasnt enough to outrank Tmac, thats just how good he was in the regular season man. And despite what you may think, that means alot. Displaying a level of play that few have ever reached is more impressive than anything AI has ever done.

Again AI was a better player in Denver than he ever was in Philly, once you come to the realization that these instances happen despite the glory of making the finals not withstanding, its still very possible. So if its possible, it should make you think of other instances where this may hold true, despite the lack of team success.

JordansBulls
07-26-2009, 04:55 PM
Just don't agree with Marion on the team.

JustBlaze31
07-26-2009, 05:37 PM
I agree wit everythin except for no AI and shawn marion bein there