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Mile High Champ
07-24-2009, 01:09 PM
Hey guys, Some of you may remember but I conducted a poll at the start of the season that had PSD users vote for the top 10 players at each position. I would like to start this up once more considering the NBA season is now over and we can get to this discussion since lots has changed since the start of last season. Please TRY AND VOTE FOR THE BEST PLAYER AND DON'T BE A HOMER. I will leave the poll open for one day and than we can carry on to the next best player at that position. I will add more players after each round...Enjoy.

REMEMBER this is based on who is the best player, not the player who has the potential to be the best.

I will be Away this weekend, I will make this poll last till Sunday mid day and move on the 5th best center sunday night.

C Rankings DONT FORGET TO VOTE!!

1) Dwight Howard
2) Yao Ming
3) Al Jefferson
4)
5)
6)
7)
8)
9)
10)

Last Years C Rankings:

1) Dwight Howard
2) Yao Ming
3) Al Jefferson
4) Andrew Bynum
5) Chris Kaman
6) Tyson Chandler
7) Shaquille O'Neal
8) Marcus Camby
9) Jermaine O'neal
10) Andrew Bogut

Mile High Champ
07-24-2009, 01:14 PM
Poll is now up.. I will be away this weekend so this poll will last for two days..


Cheers


I went with Shaq here, the best still on the board..

Kakaroach
07-24-2009, 01:15 PM
Shaq for #4.

JordansBulls
07-24-2009, 01:15 PM
Shaq

jimbobjarree
07-24-2009, 01:16 PM
Shaqmannn

Unruly Fan
07-24-2009, 01:19 PM
Chaquill!

Raps18-19 Champ
07-24-2009, 01:25 PM
Just start #5th best because Shaq is going to win.

Might as well use the whole weekend on Bargnani vs Bynum debate.

uncblue2332
07-24-2009, 01:39 PM
im going okur shaq cant play night after night and okur can rebound and spread the floor he is vastly underrated

Raph12
07-24-2009, 01:43 PM
Shaq and I'll take Bargnani over Bynum, Bynum is too injury prone and inconsistent. Bargnani is a sure thing so I'm goin Andrea

AntiG
07-24-2009, 01:50 PM
Shaq by a gigantic margin.

AntiG
07-24-2009, 01:51 PM
Shaq and I'll take Bargnani over Bynum, Bynum is too injury prone and inconsistent. Bargnani is a sure thing so I'm goin Andrea

Bynum shouldn't even be in the top 10, since its based on how they play now and not on future potential. I really don't know how people can watch him play and honestly say to themselves that he is any more than mediocre.

ManRam
07-24-2009, 01:51 PM
Shaq is the clear #4 center in the league...yet some people really think it isn't a good addition to Cleveland. Crazy...

He's gonna help a lot, especially on Dwight...who's only really good series was vs. Cleveland, and their soft front court.

GSW fan
07-24-2009, 01:51 PM
Shaq

Then i think Bargs

Then Beidrins

Then Lopez

THEN BYNUM

All my opinion

cowboyz180
07-24-2009, 01:51 PM
shaq

Raps18-19 Champ
07-24-2009, 01:59 PM
Start # 5 because everyone is going to vote Shaq and it isn't even close.

The next one is going to be closer because it is pretty much Lakers fans vs Raptors fans.

slaker619
07-24-2009, 02:01 PM
Lopez

Gibby23
07-24-2009, 02:01 PM
Shaq

zambo4president
07-24-2009, 02:01 PM
Shaq easily. Took me about 2 seconds to decide this one.

TheKing23
07-24-2009, 02:02 PM
Shaq
CAAAAANNNNN YOOOOOOUUUUUUU DIIIIGGGGGGG IIIIITTTT!!!!

blujaysrock
07-24-2009, 02:05 PM
Bargnani

Mikeleafs
07-24-2009, 02:11 PM
Shaq at #4; Bargnani at #5

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNaXpBsKdZ8

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 02:12 PM
I'm gonna have to go with Bargnani here, just for the fact that he play's Center and no other center is able to gaurd him.

Gibby23
07-24-2009, 02:20 PM
I'm gonna have to go with Bargnani here, just for the fact that he play's Center and no other center is able to gaurd him.

Then why doesn't he even score 20ppg? Why doesn't he shoot over 50%, like most good centers do, why doesn't he grab 8 to 10 rebounds, why doe he average more turnovers than assists?

5.3rpg for a center is garbage.

DMOB23
07-24-2009, 02:20 PM
Al jefferson is a PF Not A center

Nighthawk
07-24-2009, 02:23 PM
Bargs 5??? LMAO

Rapsjaysleafs
07-24-2009, 02:28 PM
I can see why people pick Bynum over Bargs. I mean the playoffs he had average an amazing 6.3 points and an mind blowing 3.7 rebounds!
Sarcasm anyone?
Everyone says he is a better true C in the league. Well i would take Bargs who played in 95% of games the past 2 seasons as opposed to Bynum who played in 52% of the Laker games.


As a starting C
Bargs averaged 18.9 PPG 6 rebounds and 1.4 blocks
Bynum 14.3 PPG 8 rebounds and 1.8 blocks

Did I mention Bynum played in 52% of the games!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4129/splits

Bargnani is going to have a break out season, be talked about in all-star debate (wont make it in front of Dwight and Shaq) and will be in the discussion for Most Improved Player. I am biased towards Bargs, having seen him improve, being called BUSTnani and playing with no confidence to starting the C very nicely. Look at his last few month stats. Watch out this season!

What do NON Laker and Rapor fans think. Its hard because all the over exposure that Bynum gets being in LA

SANTHI
07-24-2009, 02:34 PM
where's NOAH?! :cry:

masalex1205
07-24-2009, 02:37 PM
Shaq. Bargnani doesn't play D, don't no what all the fuss is about

yungballah15
07-24-2009, 02:39 PM
t-dot and bargnani fan all day, but 4 is shaq,5 is bargnani, but al jefferson ain even a 4. bu w.e bargs betta get #5

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 02:39 PM
Then why doesn't he even score 20ppg? Why doesn't he shoot over 50%, like most good centers do, why doesn't he grab 8 to 10 rebounds, why doe he average more turnovers than assists?

5.3rpg for a center is garbage.

When Bargnani got consistent starter minutes he flourished. Don't worry you will be forced to RESPECT HIM, when he averages 20-8 this year when he gets those minutes. He doesn't get those averages is because he is not your average Center that has "no-range", dude has more offensive tools at his arsenal, that is why he was selected number 1 overall. If you look at the video at 2:03, get use to seeing that a lot on highlights in 2009. His defence is just as good as all these players picked above him IMO. Atleast Bargnani will cause mismatches instead of being a boring traditional center.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 02:41 PM
I can see why people pick Bynum over Bargs. I mean the playoffs he had average an amazing 6.3 points and an mind blowing 3.7 rebounds!
Sarcasm anyone?
Everyone says he is a better true C in the league. Well i would take Bargs who played in 95% of games the past 2 seasons as opposed to Bynum who played in 52% of the Laker games.


As a starting C
Bargs averaged 18.9 PPG 6 rebounds and 1.4 blocks
Bynum 14.3 PPG 8 rebounds and 1.8 blocks

Did I mention Bynum played in 52% of the games!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4129/splits

Bargnani is going to have a break out season, be talked about in all-star debate (wont make it in front of Dwight and Shaq) and will be in the discussion for Most Improved Player. I am biased towards Bargs, having seen him improve, being called BUSTnani and playing with no confidence to starting the C very nicely. Look at his last few month stats. Watch out this season!

What do NON Laker and Rapor fans think. Its hard because all the over exposure that Bynum gets being in LA

If Bargs were playing with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom, and Pau Gasol, just to name a few, he would even break 10 PPG.

You put Bynum on the Thunder and he can easily put 25ppg 13rpg when healthy

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 02:43 PM
Shaq. Bargnani doesn't play D, don't no what all the fuss is about

LMAO, you think that slow dinosaur can play D? The only reason Bargnani got torched by him that one game was because the refs didn't feel like callin the 3 second violation on him. Even Bosh complained about the no-calls that they gave to Shaq.

EDIT: Bargnani would just Destroy Shaq in 1on1 situations.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 02:46 PM
LMAO, you think that slow dinosaur can play D? The only reason Bargnani got torched by him that one game was because the refs didn't feel like callin the 3 second violation on him. Even Bosh complained about the no-calls that they gave to Shaq.

EDIT: Bargnani would just Destroy Shaq in 1on1 situations.

You should just leave PSD right now

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 02:49 PM
If Bynum struggles to crack L.A roster, that right there is saying something. LOL, if he was so dominate wouldn't he be getting those minutes and touches? He isn't getting them because Phil knows that Bynum isn't worth it obviously. LOL those averages are just ridiculous and you think you can base your "projected stats on another team" on those?!!? LOL! too much L.A media for you SON. How about get in the real world.

EastCoastBaller
07-24-2009, 02:50 PM
Poll is now up.. I will be away this weekend so this poll will last for two days..


Cheers


I went with Shaq here, the best still on the board..


You should start a poll for the top 10 Qb's in the NFL.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 02:54 PM
If Bynum struggles to crack L.A roster, that right there is saying something. LOL, if he was so dominate wouldn't he be getting those minutes and touches? He isn't getting them because Phil knows that Bynum isn't worth it obviously. LOL those averages are just ridiculous and you think you can base your "projected stats on another team" on those?!!? LOL! too much L.A media for you SON. How about get in the real world.

How is he stuggling to crack the Lakers roster when he has been our starting Center for the past 2 yrs. Jeez watch some basketball because its obvious you don't know your ****.

He wasn't getting the minutes and touches in the playoffs because it was obvious he wasn't 100% and he wasn't himself.

Tmac,lt,berkman
07-24-2009, 02:56 PM
Bynum shouldn't even be in the top 10, since its based on how they play now and not on future potential. I really don't know how people can watch him play and honestly say to themselves that he is any more than mediocre.

i agree and andrea should be like seventh..

Rapsjaysleafs
07-24-2009, 02:56 PM
If Bargs were playing with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom, and Pau Gasol, just to name a few, he would even break 10 PPG.

You put Bynum on the Thunder and he can easily put 25ppg 13rpg when healthy



When healthy.....enough said!!
He will never be fully healthy, he is like jermaine O'neil now!!

I know he is better but think about it!

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 03:00 PM
When healthy.....enough said!!
He will never be fully healthy, he is like jermaine O'neil now!!

I know he is better but think about it!

Bynum has had 2 major injurys since he started in the NBA, both being freak accidents, both having a player fall on his knee. What do you expect when a player is at full blown speed, trips up and falls on your knee with all that weight. Jermaine is a different story, he gets injured without nothing happening, he is prone to it. Its not like Bynum one day feels his ankle is hurting, or his shoulder is tweeked or nothing. They were both freak accidents so don't compare the two.

pebloemer
07-24-2009, 03:05 PM
If Bargs were playing with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom, and Pau Gasol, just to name a few, he would even break 10 PPG.

You put Bynum on the Thunder and he can easily put 25ppg 13rpg when healthy

Wow, what an unbelievable random statement to make about Bynum. I respect your anti Bargnani arguments as I don't know why my fellow Raptors fans believe he is the 5th best C in the league, but this statement is pretty outrageous to me. Neither Bargnani nor Bynum has put together a full season of consistent play. If 5 and 6 is a Bargs or Bynum debate I am gonna get a huge ****ing headache. They both have potential, but neither has shown it consistently enough for me. Perhaps the fact that it is a debate is says more about the lack of good Centers in this league. I sure hope other names are added to the debate.

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 03:05 PM
Saying that bynum would easily average 25 and 13 on the Thunder, has to be one of the most bias statements I have ever heard on PSD. Just face the facts, Bynums career was over before it began. He was washed up like JO before he had the chance to prove anything. So why try say he is even top ten center in the league when he has proved nothing.

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:06 PM
The question is whos the better player right, not whos better at staying healthy. Besides Bynums freak accidents are flukes. If Bargs were to bang like a bigman hed be more prone to njury, but he opts to play the inefficient game and not be a dominant force in the paint.

Bynum is a MUCH better player than Bargs, it will truly be a shame if Bynum is picked behind him. I hope you guys arent that bias

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:07 PM
Wow, what an unbelievable random statement to make about Bynum. I respect your anti Bargnani arguments as I don't know why my fellow Raptors fans believe he is the 5th best C in the league, but this statement is pretty outrageous to me. Neither Bargnani nor Bynum has put together a full season of consistent play. If 5 and 6 is a Bargs or Bynum debate I am gonna get a huge ****ing headache. They both have potential, but neither has shown it consistently enough for me. Perhaps the fact that it is a debate is says more about the lack of good Centers in this league. I sure hope other names are added to the debate.
Heres the difference, Bargs plays every game and still doesnt prove it, Bynum when healthy does.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 03:08 PM
Saying that bynum would easily average 25 and 13 on the Thunder, has to be one of the most bias statements I have ever heard on PSD. Just face the facts, Bynums career was over before it began. He was washed up like JO before he had the chance to prove anything. So why try say he is even top ten center in the league when he has proved nothing.

The last 2 weeks before he got injured, he was tearing up the league. He was averaging 25ppg and 13 rpg on the LAKERS. He droped 42pts on the Clippers, Yeah its the clippers but so what, he is the only Laker, other than Kobe to drop 40+ pts in a game when Shaq left....

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:08 PM
Saying that bynum would easily average 25 and 13 on the Thunder, has to be one of the most bias statements I have ever heard on PSD. Just face the facts, Bynums career was over before it began. He was washed up like JO before he had the chance to prove anything. So why try say he is even top ten center in the league when he has proved nothing.

You call him bias and then proceed to claims his career is over before it started as FACT?

Oh the irony

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 03:12 PM
Wow, what an unbelievable random statement to make about Bynum. I respect your anti Bargnani arguments as I don't know why my fellow Raptors fans believe he is the 5th best C in the league, but this statement is pretty outrageous to me. Neither Bargnani nor Bynum has put together a full season of consistent play. If 5 and 6 is a Bargs or Bynum debate I am gonna get a huge ****ing headache. They both have potential, but neither has shown it consistently enough for me. Perhaps the fact that it is a debate is says more about the lack of good Centers in this league. I sure hope other names are added to the debate.

Bynum and Bargs are two different players. Bynum is a traditional Center, while Bargs is not. Bynum bangs down low, fights for position for rebounds and guards the paint, while Bargs likes to stay around the three point like and shoot threes. Compare both players. Bargs is a career 42% FG while Bynum is a 56%FG in his career. That is pretty low for a center to be avergaing 42%FG in his career.

pebloemer
07-24-2009, 03:16 PM
Heres the difference, Bargs plays every game and still doesnt prove it, Bynum when healthy does.

I'm not convinced about Bynum showing that he could put up 25 and 13 on the Thunder when healthy. I'm not even sure how a human could defend a statement like that. Bargnani showed from December through to the endof the season that he could put up the numbers consistently, but obviously at lower percentages because he is a different breed of Center than Bynum. Percentages tend to go down as players move further form the basket. Percentages go down, but it spaces the floor and creates mismatches. The argument between Bargnani and Bynum will surely be a headache for me. That is all I am saying.

May beef is not Bargnani not getting 5, because I don't feel he deserves it at this point, it is why the argument is between those two names and doesn't include Biedrins, Okafor, Okur or more specifically Nene. But I fully predict they will be lost in the Bargs vs Bynum debate.

Legitimate
07-24-2009, 03:17 PM
All good. At least Bargnani will get the chance to prove why he was selected number 1 overall. Instead of being considered washed up(read Bynum). Bargnani will get the minutes to prove what he is made of, Bynum will rot on the lakers bench with a suit. I gotta go to the beach cya!

Hawkeye15
07-24-2009, 03:17 PM
I am voting for who I think is going to be the best C this upcoming season, so I voted for Lopez.

Macedonian
07-24-2009, 03:17 PM
Shaq

S-Dot
07-24-2009, 03:20 PM
There are 11 Bargnani votes...really?

IversonIsKrazy
07-24-2009, 03:21 PM
Shaq for #4. There is no way Bynum deserves #5. I have Bargs, Nene, & Okafor over him.

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:23 PM
Bynum and Bargs are two different players. Bynum is a traditional Center, while Bargs is not. Bynum bangs down low, fights for position for rebounds and guards the paint, while Bargs likes to stay around the three point like and shoot threes. Compare both players. Bargs is a career 42% FG while Bynum is a 56%FG in his career. That is pretty low for a center to be avergaing 42%FG in his career.
They are just going to tell you that he shoots 3's and thats why its lower. What you shouldve posted is their eFG% since it takes into account the added value of a 3pter.
Bynum .560
Bargs ..516

The gap is much closer when you factor in his 3pt shooting ability.


Then their ability to get to the line and the gap closes in even more.
Bargs TS%: 560
Bynum:TS% .600

Shooting % arent as far apart as you think, but the key and most important difference between the 2 comes from their shot location. Because Bynum plays in the paint and is such a talented player hes a force on the offensive glass, Bargs corrals 3.4% of missed shots, Bynum corrals 20%, thats ****in ridiculous, basically every 5 missed shots for the Lakers he gets 1 and it usually leads to a dunk for him.

Its this fact that gives him a 118 Offensive rating, that completely demolishes Bargs 105 rating. Even when you account for the fact that Bargs carries a bigger load offensively, Bynum is still far and away the better offensive player. Its why you can make claims about him being a bigtime scorer if he were a #1 option, while Bargs is pretty much what he is.

dre1990
07-24-2009, 03:26 PM
Andris Biedrins

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:29 PM
I'm not convinced about Bynum showing that he could put up 25 and 13 on the Thunder when healthy. I'm not even sure how a human could defend a statement like that.
He grossly exaggerates that claim, but he does have somewhat of a point. If you were to start a franchise, your offense would have more success if it were headlined by Bynum rather than Bargs, and they would be better defensively as well. It really is a no brainer here. There is a reason why Bynum, even in limited minutes saw huge money, while Bargs in more minutes couldnt get Bynum type money. The fact that Bynum is younger only elevates the room for improvement.



Bargnani showed from December through to the endof the season that he could put up the numbers consistently, but obviously at lower percentages because he is a different breed of Center than Bynum. Percentages tend to go down as players move further form the basket. Percentages go down, but it spaces the floor and creates mismatches. The argument between Bargnani and Bynum will surely be a headache for me. That is all I am saying.

Bynum causes just as many mismatches in the paint, and opens the floor for his teammates as well, add to the fact that hes a good passer and better defender and I dont see how the intangibles are in Bargs favor.


May beef is not Bargnani not getting 5, because I don't feel he deserves it at this point, it is why the argument is between those two names and doesn't include Biedrins, Okafor, Okur or more specifically Nene. But I fully predict they will be lost in the Bargs vs Bynum debate.

Yea I wasnt expecting to get into this debate for awhile, I voted Shaq though personally I think Bynum isnt too far off from Shaq right now, even Shaq recognized this fact when he talks about the games best centers.

Biedrens has a case, Okafor probably, but I dont see why Okur is up there. Hes easily the worst defender of the bunch.

op12
07-24-2009, 03:31 PM
I can see why people pick Bynum over Bargs. I mean the playoffs he had average an amazing 6.3 points and an mind blowing 3.7 rebounds!
Sarcasm anyone?
Everyone says he is a better true C in the league. Well i would take Bargs who played in 95% of games the past 2 seasons as opposed to Bynum who played in 52% of the Laker games.


As a starting C
Bargs averaged 18.9 PPG 6 rebounds and 1.4 blocks
Bynum 14.3 PPG 8 rebounds and 1.8 blocks

Did I mention Bynum played in 52% of the games!!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4129/splits

Bargnani is going to have a break out season, be talked about in all-star debate (wont make it in front of Dwight and Shaq) and will be in the discussion for Most Improved Player. I am biased towards Bargs, having seen him improve, being called BUSTnani and playing with no confidence to starting the C very nicely. Look at his last few month stats. Watch out this season!

What do NON Laker and Rapor fans think. Its hard because all the over exposure that Bynum gets being in LA

i would take biedrins, kaman, and lopez over both. that may change after this year but as of right now, today those 3 are better. but thats just me.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 03:35 PM
All good. At least Bargnani will get the chance to prove why he was selected number 1 overall. Instead of being considered washed up(read Bynum). Bargnani will get the minutes to prove what he is made of, Bynum will rot on the lakers bench with a suit. I gotta go to the beach cya!

Sorry buddy, but if you are selected #1 overall, you need to prove that in your rookie season, not wait 2/3 yrs to prove you are #1 in the draft

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:35 PM
i would take biedrins, kaman, and lopez over both. that may change after this year but as of right now, today those 3 are better. but thats just me.
As a devoted Clipper fan I can tell you, Kaman at his best, isnt better than Bynum at his best. Lopez intrigues me, Id take him over Kaman and Biedrins, no quarrels with his selection.

Chronz
07-24-2009, 03:38 PM
All good. At least Bargnani will get the chance to prove why he was selected number 1 overall. Instead of being considered washed up(read Bynum). Bargnani will get the minutes to prove what he is made of, Bynum will rot on the lakers bench with a suit. I gotta go to the beach cya!
Ahh the minutes excuse, what a pitty. Not getting quality minutes never prevented Bynum from producing at a higher rate.

Also the fact that your clinging on to an unjustified draft selection year ago is very sad. Bynum has been in the league longer, and is still younger. Based on what theyve proven thus far and both were in the draft today, I guarantee the Pritchards and Moreys of the world would select Bynum.

kobe24>lebron23
07-24-2009, 03:57 PM
bynum but seriously shaq

azkarraga
07-24-2009, 03:58 PM
it's shaq, but i went for bargs, heating up the bargs-bynum debate

kobe24>lebron23
07-24-2009, 04:15 PM
here we go check these clips out...

bynum
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9efsJwJxYEk&feature=related

bargnani
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2Ml14AgY4I

u decide but i think bynum wins

Chronz
07-24-2009, 04:31 PM
I usually dont like the idea of assessing a players worthy by a highlight mix but goddamn those were some sick moves, Bynum is going to flat out be a dominant force in this league, look at the footwork, length, and intelligence he displays at such a young age. Thats the best mix Ive seen in awhile, it got me pumped. Im taking a break, gotta go bang my head against the wall for awhile.

The Bargs mix was good too, its just a little discouraging that everytime I see the score the raps are usually down alot, or losing to a bad team. Where are the highlights against dominant opposition, Bynum absolutely crushed Shaq and Duncan. I like the block he had on Dirk. If he ever gets the consistency aspect of his game down, improves his efficiency, and atleast rebound well defensively, he could be the next Dirk. And that would definitey put him above Bynum. Lets consider this upcoming season the test to prove it once and for all, both players should be done developing and entering their pre-prime form. From here on out, we will know whoes the best.

still1ballin
07-24-2009, 04:43 PM
I usually dont like the idea of assessing a players worthy by a highlight mix but goddamn those were some sick moves, Bynum is going to flat out be a dominant force in this league, look at the footwork, length, and intelligence he displays at such a young age. Thats the best mix Ive seen in awhile, it got me pumped. Im taking a break, gotta go bang my head against the wall for awhile.

The Bargs mix was good too, its just a little discouraging that everytime I see the score the raps are usually down alot, or losing to a bad team. Where are the highlights against dominant opposition, Bynum absolutely crushed Shaq and Duncan. I like the block he had on Dirk. If he ever gets the consistency aspect of his game down, improves his efficiency, and atleast rebound well defensively, he could be the next Dirk. And that would definitey put him above Bynum. Lets consider this upcoming season the test to prove it once and for all, both players should be done developing and entering their pre-prime form. From here on out, we will know whoes the best.

HAHA I like the comment you left on youtube on the bynum mix

yanksknicksgmen
07-24-2009, 04:44 PM
the big shaqtus

WoodbridgeSkins
07-24-2009, 06:18 PM
Brandon Haywood hands down!

mrblisterdundee
07-24-2009, 06:54 PM
As long as he doesn't play extended minutes, Shaq is still one of the better centers in the league. If he's fresh, I'd say he can go toe-to-toe with Yao.

Raps18-19 Champ
07-24-2009, 07:01 PM
The Bynum-Bargnani debate will be decided by which team has more fans.

LA_Raiders
07-24-2009, 07:16 PM
Shaq but he is damn old you never know whats going to happen next year...

LeonFSU
07-24-2009, 07:22 PM
here we go check these clips out...

bynum
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9efsJwJxYEk&feature=related

bargnani
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2Ml14AgY4I

u decide but i think bynum wins


Such a terrible song...

arkanian215
07-24-2009, 07:28 PM
im excited to see where lopez lands on this list. i voted for shaq for fourth cuz he can still dominate even if he plays limited minutes.

J_M_B
07-24-2009, 07:31 PM
Shaq by a large margin

BlondeBomber41
07-24-2009, 07:46 PM
Again thats your opinion, it does not make it right bomber. I could care less if he averages 6 boards a game. I dont think he will ever be a great rebounder, personally I see somewhere between 8-9 for him when its all said and done. About your list, its all about opinion. Personally I like that Bargnani can do more on the offensive end then any of the centers you named. Maybe not as dominant of course, Howard, Ming, Jefferson and Even Shaq still take that list. He is creative, can hit any shot from anywhere on the floor, plays good defense, takes it to the basket, blocks shots. If the team is winning with him at center, I say he is getting the job done.. Personally I would rather have Bargnani at then most of the guys on that list other than Shaq, Jefferson, Ming, Howard... I would much rather have him that Bynum, Kaman, Nene, Okafor. Camby, Bogut etc. Its all about prefrence, the fact that he is a matchup nightmare for teams speaks volumes for his talent, Personally I think thisis more rooted about hate for Canadians and of course international players by the PSD community.

You think I have hate for him because he is a Raptor or international?

Im a Mavs fan, OUR BEST PLAYER AND MY USERNAME IS AFTER DIRK NOWITZKI!

As far as it being because he is on a Canadian team, give me a break. I couldnt care less what team he was on, I dont have any hate for Canada. I love Chris Bosh, and he plays for the Raptors. I love Jose Calderon, and he plays for the Raptors. Im a fan of Hedo Turkoglu, and he plays for the Raptors. Dont even act like I have some sort of national hatred of Canadians because I dislike Andrea Bargnani.

For the record he doesnt average 6 boards, more like 5 in THIRTY MINUTES A GAME. My list was to show you how sad it is that a 7 footer grabs less rebounds than 6-3 guys or guys that play half the amount of minutes he does.

I mean the guy cant even accidently have a great rebounding game. His season high was only 11, and except for a couple 10 rebound games he consistently was a bad rebounder.

You say rebounding isnt a deciding factor into what makes a good center, but the fact is anyone with NBA knowledge or basketball knowledge will tell you rebounding and defense are the two most important things in winning NBA Championships. There were only 9 teams in the NBA last year that were worst rebounding teams than the Magic, and usually running and gunning equals a ton of rebounds! The fact that the Raptors are so up and down and still manage to get so few rebounds speaks volumes on why they were one of the worst teams in the NBA last year.

and Yeah he has range, but I would rather a center shoot a good % over having a good shot. You tried to compare him to Mehmet Okur, but here is the difference... Okur shot 49% last year. Which means that his shot selection is fine because he makes half of them. Bargnani shoots 45%, which is decent for a PG or SG but quite bad for a 7 footer.

Im not saying he wont be a quality rebounder one day, and Im not saying his % wont improve but this thread is asking who is a top 10 center in the NBA now, not in a couple years. There is no way Bargnani has proven himself enough to be considered top 10. Part of being a good player is being consistent. If you score 30 one night and 10 the next and average 20 PPG because of it, you arent nearly as valuable as someone who actually scores around 20 a night.

You can say its my opinion if you would like, but opinion rules when every non Raptor fan thinks it. Im sure there are plenty of Raptor fans who would agree with me also.

I have no hate for you, the country of Canada, or players from outside the US but the facts hit you square in the face and cant be ignored.

dtmagnet
07-24-2009, 09:26 PM
Shaquille. Pretty easy choice here.

vash9
07-24-2009, 10:18 PM
Shaq

Then i think Bargs

Then Beidrins

Then Lopez

THEN BYNUM

All my opinion

Bynum doesn't even deserve top 10 spot. But other than that, i agree with your list.

Beno7500
07-25-2009, 02:22 AM
thanks for adding hawes