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CAIN=FUTURE
06-15-2009, 07:26 PM
What would your current NL power rankings be as of today?

Mine:
1. Dodgers - They just don't lose.
2. Phillies - Can they repeat?
3. Brewers - They can hit, but pitching can become a problem.
4. Giants - NO OFFENSE, but it is starting to look like their pitching might be enough.
5. Cardinals - Strong start, but fading fast.
6. Mets - A tough loss, and a whooping on their ace really hurt them.
7. Cubs - Will probably rebound soon, but they have to get the sticks going.
8. Rockies - Look out, they are on fire.
9. Reds- They have what it takes to stick around.
10. Braves - Ehh they have young talent to look forward to.
11. Marlins - Hanley, and a good young staff doesn't seem to be enough.
12. Pirates - Look, they're not god awful this year.
13. Astros - Fire sale is imminent.
14. D-Backs - Disappointment of the NL.
15. Padres - Adrian Gonzalez is the only thing they have right now.
16. Nationals - Joke franchise, contemplated not including them on this list.

Epic89
06-15-2009, 07:48 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Brewers
4. Cardinals
5. Mets
6. Giants
7. Cubs
8. Reds
9. Braves
10. Marlins
11. Rockies
12. Astros
13. Padres
14. Pirates
15. Diamondbacks
16. Nationals

UNETOWNBAYAREA
06-15-2009, 07:53 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Brewers
4. Giants
5. Cardinals
6. Mets
7. Cubs
8. Braves
9. Reds
10. Rockies
11. marlins
12. Astros
13. Pirates
14. Padres
15. Diamondbacks
16. Nationals

Cheezombie
06-15-2009, 07:55 PM
I love how all the Giants fans pick themselves 4th

hgtiger32
06-15-2009, 08:07 PM
all i know is that as a brewers fan im worried cuz the central is damn good this year

Brew Crew
06-15-2009, 08:11 PM
all i know is that as a brewers fan im worried cuz the central is damn good this year

I'm worried because we have one good starter.

SFGiants4life
06-15-2009, 08:19 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Cardinals
4. Brewers
5. Giants
6. Cubs
7. Mets
8. Reds
9. Rockies
10. Marlins
11. Braves
12. Astros
13. Padres
14. Pirates
15. Diamondbacks
16. Nationals

theproof
06-15-2009, 08:19 PM
I love how you say "all" when only two Giants fans posted...

Thank you for your brilliant input.

lol, that sweep is really getting to him.

jrivera
06-15-2009, 08:37 PM
I love how all the Giants fans pick themselves 4th

Your just jealous...

Cheezombie
06-15-2009, 08:46 PM
Your just jealous...

No, i just think they are a very average team. When was the last time a team with such a horrid offense made the playoffs?

theproof
06-15-2009, 08:54 PM
What would your current NL power rankings be as of today?

Mine:
1. Dodgers - They just don't lose.
2. Phillies - Can they repeat?
3. Brewers - They can hit, but pitching can become a problem.
4. Giants - NO OFFENSE, but it is starting to look like their pitching might be enough.
5. Cardinals - Strong start, but fading fast.
6. Mets - A tough loss, and a whooping on their ace really hurt them.
7. Cubs - Will probably rebound soon, but they have to get the sticks going.
8. Rockies - Look out, they are on fire.
9. Reds- They have what it takes to stick around.
10. Braves - Ehh they have young talent to look forward to.
11. Marlins - Hanley, and a good young staff doesn't seem to be enough.
12. Pirates - Look, they're not god awful this year.
13. Astros - Fire sale is imminent.
14. D-Backs - Disappointment of the NL.
15. Padres - Adrian Gonzalez is the only thing they have right now.
16. Nationals - Joke franchise, contemplated not including them on this list.

lol, man that's harsh. It's weird, I went to a Giants/A's game and there where a decent amount of people with Nationals gear scattered around the park.

SFGiants4life
06-15-2009, 08:56 PM
lol, man that's harsh. It's weird, I went to a Giants/A's game and there where a decent amount of people with Nationals gear scattered around the park.


yeah, but those are the kind of people who arnt fans but just wear what looks good to them. I asked someone wearing a Nationals hat if they liked the Nationals, they didn't know who they were.......

theproof
06-15-2009, 09:01 PM
yeah, but those are the kind of people who arnt fans but just wear what looks good to them. I asked someone wearing a Nationals hat if they liked the Nationals, they didn't know who they were.......

lol, but I'm talking about shirts and Jackets not the trendy hats.

SFGiants4life
06-15-2009, 09:27 PM
lol, but I'm talking about shirts and Jackets not the trendy hats.

i know, but a lot of people wear the clothes too that way

Twinke Masta
06-15-2009, 09:48 PM
1. Montreal Expos

ciaban
06-15-2009, 10:11 PM
No, i just think they are a very average team. When was the last time a team with such a horrid offense made the playoffs?

The Cards 06, won a title, dodgers in 88 won a world series, they beat the heavily favored A's if I recall

degnor
06-15-2009, 11:01 PM
Personally, I put the Cardinals and Giants ahead of the Brewers. I just don't think they can stay. I know the record would put them above, but its beyond record IMO

L.A's Finest
06-15-2009, 11:11 PM
WTF giant fans ranking Dodgers#1......just wow....really.......ok.......

mnrlgry
06-15-2009, 11:37 PM
The Cards 06, won a title, dodgers in 88 won a world series, they beat the heavily favored A's if I recall

How was the Cardinals offense bad that year?? Are you kidding? Eckstein Pujols Edmonds Rolen Sanders. The only reason we didn't win 100+ for the third year in a row was because Rolen and Edmonds missed extended time during the season (and yet they still scored a ton of runs)

GHGHCP
06-15-2009, 11:45 PM
yeah, but those are the kind of people who arnt fans but just wear what looks good to them. I asked someone wearing a Nationals hat if they liked the Nationals, they didn't know who they were.......

Maybe they just worked at Walgreens. :D

http://misspinkslip.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/walgreens_logo.jpg

GHGHCP
06-15-2009, 11:56 PM
The Cards 06, won a title, dodgers in 88 won a world series, they beat the heavily favored A's if I recall

Those two offenses were still not nearly as bad as this years Giants.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:26 AM
lol, man that's harsh. It's weird, I went to a Giants/A's game and there where a decent amount of people with Nationals gear scattered around the park.

It is what it is. They are something like 9.5 games worse than the next worst team, and minus Strasburg they have the worst farm system on planet Earth.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:27 AM
Those two offenses were still not nearly as bad as this years Giants.

Who's talking title? Its not ridiculous for them to just make the playoffs.

Faithdies
06-16-2009, 03:33 AM
Arizona Diamondbacks. That offense was pretty terrible. The recent incarnation, not the world series champs.

degnor
06-16-2009, 03:38 AM
Just because its rare for a team with a bad offense to make the playoffs doesn't mean it can't happen. You know what else is rare? To have your two top pitchers go 15-2. But the Giants have the pitching to last. It keeps them in every game.

Faithdies
06-16-2009, 03:40 AM
The Giants could take the Wild Card. Also, being that they are leading the wild card, unless something has changed in the last day or so, I don't see any issue with people ranking them as 4th in NL power rankings. I mean, positionally that's what they are. Wild Card = 4th pretty much.

degnor
06-16-2009, 03:47 AM
^Doesn't mean they should be 4th at all. Personally, I would rank them somewhere between 4th and 6th. I hardly think the Brewers belong in the top 3, yet I'm sure many people have them there.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:57 AM
^Doesn't mean they should be 4th at all. Personally, I would rank them somewhere between 4th and 6th. I hardly think the Brewers belong in the top 3, yet I'm sure many people have them there.

If you don't have the Brewers at 3 then its either the Giants, or Cardinals, but the Cardinals are fading really quick, and the Giants aren't aren't a complete enough team to really be a top 3 team in the NL. That spot in the beginning of the year was reserved for the Cubs, but they are hitting worse than my Giants. I feel like the Mets have shown their true colors in the last week (Mets = my 2nd favorite team btw), and the Reds don't have the record to be number 3, so I think the Brewers are a perfect fir at 3. That being said, the Bums and Phills are much better teams than the rest of the pack, but that doesn't mean they don't have to look out for the Brewers, Giants in October.

turnaround3
06-16-2009, 04:07 AM
If the Giants snuck into the playoffs that would absolutely frighten the **** out of me to have to face Lincecum and Cain three times in a 5 gamer or four times in a 7 gamer.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 04:16 AM
If the Giants snuck into the playoffs that would absolutely frighten the **** out of me to have to face Lincecum and Cain three times in a 5 gamer or four times in a 7 gamer.

Thats what I was thinking. And if we could steal a game or two on the road given how well we play at home who knows how far we could get.

Pinstripe pride
06-16-2009, 08:48 AM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Brewers
4. Cardinals
5. Giants
6. Mets
7. Braves
8. Cubs
9. Reds
10. Marlins
11. Rockies
12. Astros
13. Padres
14. Diamondbacks
15. Pirates
37056. Nationals

todu82
06-16-2009, 09:23 AM
1) Dodgers
2) Phillies
3) Brewers
4) Giants
5) Cardinals
6) Mets
7) Rockies
8) Reds
9) Cubs
10) Marlins
11) Braves
12) Pirates
13) Astros
14) Padres
15) Diamondbacks
16) Nationals

AWC713
06-16-2009, 01:50 PM
Those two offenses were still not nearly as bad as this years Giants.

i know they didnt win it all, but the 05 astros had a pretty horrid lineup.

those were the years when the stros had the best rotation in the league..when pitching carried the team and they desperately looked for offense...funny how things change in a matter of four years and a BS GM (Tim Purpura)

t327
06-16-2009, 01:58 PM
RIGHT NOW, Rockies should be at least top 7.

degnor
06-16-2009, 02:09 PM
If you don't have the Brewers at 3 then its either the Giants, or Cardinals, but the Cardinals are fading really quick, and the Giants aren't aren't a complete enough team to really be a top 3 team in the NL. That spot in the beginning of the year was reserved for the Cubs, but they are hitting worse than my Giants. I feel like the Mets have shown their true colors in the last week (Mets = my 2nd favorite team btw), and the Reds don't have the record to be number 3, so I think the Brewers are a perfect fir at 3. That being said, the Bums and Phills are much better teams than the rest of the pack, but that doesn't mean they don't have to look out for the Brewers, Giants in October.

I had Cards at 3, btw.

Lincecum4CY
06-16-2009, 02:09 PM
No, i just think they are a very average team. When was the last time a team with such a horrid offense made the playoffs?

A horrid offense that outscored your sorry as$ team what 15-3?

Don't the AAAA's consist of Holliday,Giambi,Cust, and some other overrated players? That was one of the easiest sweeps i've seen all year. Really..A's fans have no right to talk or diss ANY other teams fan base...not even Washington. The A's are by far...one of the worst teams in MLB even if there record doesn't show it.
The NL as a whole has played pretty poorly...no one is dominating except for the dodgers. Funny, the hottest teams are in the NL West...beating teams OUTSIDE THE NL WEST. So much for the intelligent experts and "intelligent knowledgeable fans"

My rankings..
1.) Dodgers- even from a giants fan perspective- can't be stopped
2.) Reds- have them making a late season run and taking the central
3.) Phillies- will take the East again with FLA behind their backs
4.) Brewers- poor pitching...nasty offense
5.) Marlins- If they don't go on a fire sale at midseason
6.) Giants- honestly...they are playing better than most of the NL teams..people that disagree really have not even watched them play and base their knowledge on "stats"
7.) Cubs
8.) Mets- would have been higher but injuries have really haunted them
9.) Rockies- Add a legit ace and they are legit.
10.) Braves- hitters need to be much much more consistent
11.) Cardinals- Pujols needs his legit protection
12.) Astros
13.) Diamondbacks
14.) Pirates
15.) Nationals- get this team some bullpen help!
16.) Padres- zzzzz

Cheezombie
06-16-2009, 03:14 PM
A horrid offense that outscored your sorry as$ team what 15-3?

Don't the AAAA's consist of Holliday,Giambi,Cust, and some other overrated players? That was one of the easiest sweeps i've seen all year. Really..A's fans have no right to talk or diss ANY other teams fan base...not even Washington. The A's are by far...one of the worst teams in MLB even if there record doesn't show it.
The NL as a whole has played pretty poorly...no one is dominating except for the dodgers. Funny, the hottest teams are in the NL West...beating teams OUTSIDE THE NL WEST. So much for the intelligent experts and "intelligent knowledgeable fans"

My rankings..
1.) Dodgers- even from a giants fan perspective- can't be stopped
2.) Reds- have them making a late season run and taking the central
3.) Phillies- will take the East again with FLA behind their backs
4.) Brewers- poor pitching...nasty offense
5.) Marlins- If they don't go on a fire sale at midseason
6.) Giants- honestly...they are playing better than most of the NL teams..people that disagree really have not even watched them play and base their knowledge on "stats"
7.) Cubs
8.) Mets- would have been higher but injuries have really haunted them
9.) Rockies- Add a legit ace and they are legit.
10.) Braves- hitters need to be much much more consistent
11.) Cardinals- Pujols needs his legit protection
12.) Astros
13.) Diamondbacks
14.) Pirates
15.) Nationals- get this team some bullpen help!
16.) Padres- zzzzz

Just because the giants beat my favorite team means i can't express how good i think the giants are? Give me a break dude. I never said the A's were amazing. By that logic a Pirates fan can never call another team bad because he is a Pirates fan. Congrats the Giants had a good series, but I still don't consider them a playoff team.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:31 PM
A horrid offense that outscored your sorry as$ team what 15-3?

Don't the AAAA's consist of Holliday,Giambi,Cust, and some other overrated players? That was one of the easiest sweeps i've seen all year. Really..A's fans have no right to talk or diss ANY other teams fan base...not even Washington. The A's are by far...one of the worst teams in MLB even if there record doesn't show it.
The NL as a whole has played pretty poorly...no one is dominating except for the dodgers. Funny, the hottest teams are in the NL West...beating teams OUTSIDE THE NL WEST. So much for the intelligent experts and "intelligent knowledgeable fans"

My rankings..
1.) Dodgers- even from a giants fan perspective- can't be stopped
2.) Reds- have them making a late season run and taking the central
3.) Phillies- will take the East again with FLA behind their backs
4.) Brewers- poor pitching...nasty offense
5.) Marlins- If they don't go on a fire sale at midseason
6.) Giants- honestly...they are playing better than most of the NL teams..people that disagree really have not even watched them play and base their knowledge on "stats"
7.) Cubs
8.) Mets- would have been higher but injuries have really haunted them
9.) Rockies- Add a legit ace and they are legit.
10.) Braves- hitters need to be much much more consistent
11.) Cardinals- Pujols needs his legit protection
12.) Astros
13.) Diamondbacks
14.) Pirates
15.) Nationals- get this team some bullpen help!
16.) Padres- zzzzz

I'm sorry, but these rankings are really bad. There is no way the Reds are above the Phillies, let alone the Brewers and Giants. You also have the Marlins to high, and the Cardinals way to low. Also, whats up with the Nationals not in last? They are 9.5 games worse than the second worse team...

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:33 PM
Just because the giants beat my favorite team means i can't express how good i think the giants are? Give me a break dude. I never said the A's were amazing. By that logic a Pirates fan can never call another team bad because he is a Pirates fan. Congrats the Giants had a good series, but I still don't consider them a playoff team.

And I'm sure you didn't consider them a team that would be 6 games over .500 1/3 of the way through the season 2 and half months ago. Oh,and "good series" is an understatement.

Cheezombie
06-16-2009, 03:39 PM
And I'm sure you didn't consider them a team that would be 6 games over .500 1/3 of the way through the season 2 and half months ago. Oh,and "good series" is an understatement.

Giants have barely scored more runs than they've allowed. I find it unlikely they overachieve the rest of the season.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 03:43 PM
Giants have barely scored more runs than they've allowed. I find it unlikely they overachieve the rest of the season.

How are they over achieving? First check my sig, then tell me how they're over achieving. They're pitching like they're supose to and they're hitting, or not hitting like they're supose to.

Cheezombie
06-16-2009, 03:45 PM
i don't have time to read it right now, but we will talk about this later. Cheerio

metfan4life775
06-16-2009, 03:45 PM
My rankings..
1.) Dodgers- even from a giants fan perspective- can't be stopped
2.) Reds- have them making a late season run and taking the central
3.) Phillies- will take the East again with FLA behind their backs
4.) Brewers- poor pitching...nasty offense
5.) Marlins- If they don't go on a fire sale at midseason
6.) Giants- honestly...they are playing better than most of the NL teams..people that disagree really have not even watched them play and base their knowledge on "stats"
7.) Cubs
8.) Mets- would have been higher but injuries have really haunted them
9.) Rockies- Add a legit ace and they are legit.
10.) Braves- hitters need to be much much more consistent
11.) Cardinals- Pujols needs his legit protection
12.) Astros
13.) Diamondbacks
14.) Pirates
15.) Nationals- get this team some bullpen help!
16.) Padres- zzzzz


LMAO really the Reds that high? i don't no whats worse the reds 2nd or the marlins 5th lmao.

or better yet the nats get them some bullpen help there SP needs to learn to pitch first what the point in a bullpen so they can save a lose?? Really?? these are wroung but hey everyone has their own views

Gigantes4Life
06-16-2009, 03:46 PM
How are they over achieving? First check my sig, then tell me how they're over achieving. They're pitching like they're supose to and they're hitting, or not hitting like they're supose to.


The simple answer is a yes given the context of the division.

That article is assuming that the Dodgers win about 85 games. That's not going to happen.

We've overachieved so far by 5 games. We're on pace for around 77 wins (this assumes Burriss and Velez keep up their playing time through 162 games), so I would say we're looking at about 82 wins. It's definitely possible that we win the wild card, assuming we overachieve by about 5 wins (which is definitely possible), but in no way are we the favorites.

metfan4life775
06-16-2009, 03:50 PM
i say the giants have a shot at both divison and wild card its VERY EARLY still and you have alot of teams going for wild cards in mets/phillies, braves, cards, cubs/brewers, Giants etc plus u have rockies and astros who always have a GREAT 2nd half of season PLUS any team can get back into things with one or two trades. . . . .well almost ne team nats :pity:

MooseWithFleas
06-16-2009, 04:30 PM
I'm gonna rank it with a combination of talent and where I think they will end up, rather than just power ranking or how they are currently doing.

1.) Dodgers - (Hottest team and they are doing it without Manny. Great balance of hitting-pitching)
2.) Phillies - (Finding ways to win with their leadoff man in a season long slump and the pitching being scrapped together)
3.) Cubs - (Underpeforming now, but Lee and Soto are coming around and Aramis will be returning around the ASG)
4.) Brewers - (Offense is among the best, but can't see the pitching holding up all year)
5.) Reds - (Hanging around .500 with their best player missing significant time and their next two best struggling for most of year)
6.) Mets - (Laundry list of injuries, but if they can somehow get healthy, they will contend)
7.) Giants - (Fantastic pitching, weak offense. I think the mediocre bullpen will be their downfall)
8.) Cardinals - (Not enough fire power, and not sure if the pitching will hold up all year)
9.) Marlins - (Young team that just doesn't have enough to get to the next level at this time).
10.) Braves - (Definition of mediocre right now)
11.) Diamondbacks - (I think they have the talent to make a run at NL West but if they continue to play like this, a firesale is imminent)
12.) Rockies - (Same as above, except without the talent to make a run)
13.) Pirates - (Nice story that they are hanging in there, but lets be honest, their pitching will NOT hold up)
14.) Padres - (Poor Adrian Gonzalez)
15.) Astros - (Ed Wade is the worst GM in sports)
16.) Nats - (Add together all the negative comments I made from the first 15 teams, and you get the Nats)

REGular
06-16-2009, 04:52 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Cardinals
4. Brewers
5. Mets
6. Cubs
7. Marlins
8. Giants
9. Rockies
10. Braves
11. Astros
12. Reds
13. Diamondbacks
14. Padres
15. Pirates
16. Nationals

IBleedPurple
06-16-2009, 05:12 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Cardinals
4. Brewers
5. Mets
6. Cubs
7. Marlins
8. Giants
9. Rockies
10. Braves
11. Astros
12. Reds
13. Diamondbacks
14. Padres
15. Pirates
16. Nationals

I pretty much agree with this list. Especially because the Rockies aren't in the bottom 3 like some other lists, when they're a couple games out of the wildcard.

theproof
06-16-2009, 05:20 PM
I'm gonna rank it with a combination of talent and where I think they will end up, rather than just power ranking or how they are currently doing.

1.) Dodgers - (Hottest team and they are doing it without Manny. Great balance of hitting-pitching)
2.) Phillies - (Finding ways to win with their leadoff man in a season long slump and the pitching being scrapped together)
3.) Cubs - (Underpeforming now, but Lee and Soto are coming around and Aramis will be returning around the ASG)
4.) Brewers - (Offense is among the best, but can't see the pitching holding up all year)
5.) Reds - (Hanging around .500 with their best player missing significant time and their next two best struggling for most of year)
6.) Mets - (Laundry list of injuries, but if they can somehow get healthy, they will contend)
7.) Giants - (Fantastic pitching, weak offense. I think the mediocre bullpen will be their downfall)
8.) Cardinals - (Not enough fire power, and not sure if the pitching will hold up all year)
9.) Marlins - (Young team that just doesn't have enough to get to the next level at this time).
10.) Braves - (Definition of mediocre right now)
11.) Diamondbacks - (I think they have the talent to make a run at NL West but if they continue to play like this, a firesale is imminent)
12.) Rockies - (Same as above, except without the talent to make a run)
13.) Pirates - (Nice story that they are hanging in there, but lets be honest, their pitching will NOT hold up)
14.) Padres - (Poor Adrian Gonzalez)
15.) Astros - (Ed Wade is the worst GM in sports)
16.) Nats - (Add together all the negative comments I made from the first 15 teams, and you get the Nats)

Mediocre bullpen? what are you talking about? Our bullpen is great.

Cheezombie
06-16-2009, 05:33 PM
That article is assuming that the Dodgers win about 85 games. That's not going to happen.

We've overachieved so far by 5 games. We're on pace for around 77 wins (this assumes Burriss and Velez keep up their playing time through 162 games), so I would say we're looking at about 82 wins. It's definitely possible that we win the wild card, assuming we overachieve by about 5 wins (which is definitely possible), but in no way are we the favorites.

Pretty much what you said.

MooseWithFleas
06-16-2009, 05:36 PM
They have gotten off to a good start but don't kid yourself. Brian Wilson is an average to slightly above average closer. Affeldt is a career long journeyman who can't be counted on for a sub 3 era, much less a sub 2 era. I highly doubt that Medders keeps up his respectable ERA with his penchant for walking batters. And Bob Howry, do I even need to start?

CAIN=FUTURE
06-16-2009, 06:05 PM
They have gotten off to a good start but don't kid yourself. Brian Wilson is an average to slightly above average closer. Affeldt is a career long journeyman who can't be counted on for a sub 3 era, much less a sub 2 era. I highly doubt that Medders keeps up his respectable ERA with his penchant for walking batters. And Bob Howry, do I even need to start?

Between Adfeldt and Sergio Romo we have two of the best setup men in the entire league.

MooseWithFleas
06-16-2009, 06:21 PM
Yep. Jereymy "Adfeldt" and his career 1.472 WHIP and Sergio Romo who has been in the league for all of 2 minutes. I can see reason isn't going to prevail in this thread, see ya!

Gigantes4Life
06-16-2009, 06:36 PM
Yep. Jereymy "Adfeldt" and his career 1.472 WHIP and Sergio Romo who has been in the league for all of 2 minutes. I can see reason isn't going to prevail in this thread, see ya!

What do career stats have to do with now?

Brew Crew
06-16-2009, 06:54 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Brewers
4. Cardinals
5. Cubs
6. Mets
7. Rockies
8. Giants
9. Marlins
10. Reds
11. Braves
12. Diamondbacks
13. Pirates
14. Astros
15. Nationals
16. Padres

Zmaster52
06-16-2009, 07:54 PM
Cubs
Phillies
Mets
Brewers
Cardinals
Dodgers
Giants
Braves
Marlins
Reds
Astros
Pirates
Diamondbacks
National

Kyle916
06-16-2009, 09:02 PM
Between Adfeldt and Sergio Romo we have two of the best setup men in the entire league.

They're very good, but that's a bit of an overstatement.

Gigantes4Life
06-16-2009, 09:07 PM
Cubs
Phillies
Mets
Brewers
Cardinals
Dodgers
Giants
Braves
Marlins
Reds
Astros
Pirates
Diamondbacks
National

Ha.

MooseWithFleas
06-16-2009, 10:04 PM
What do career stats have to do with now?

Because I said that I don't think that their relief pitching will hold up in the long run.

Gigantes4Life
06-16-2009, 10:10 PM
Because I said that I don't think that their relief pitching will hold up in the long run.

K. What do career pitching stats have to do with relief pitchers?

MooseWithFleas
06-17-2009, 01:36 AM
K. What do career pitching stats have to do with relief pitchers?

They give a better bearing of a players worth, then a 60 game stretch of a season???

CAIN=FUTURE
06-17-2009, 02:57 AM
Cubs
Phillies
Mets
Brewers
Cardinals
Dodgers
Giants
Braves
Marlins
Reds
Astros
Pirates
Diamondbacks
National

Yeah lay off the crack. Cubs in first? Are you high? Dodgers at 6? Giants at 7?

The_Mac22
06-17-2009, 03:18 AM
haha lol

Wrigheyes4MVP
06-17-2009, 03:20 AM
Yeah lay off the crack. Cubs in first? Are you high? Dodgers at 6? Giants at 7?

Dude...Giants arent that good...they are an average team.

Wrigheyes4MVP
06-17-2009, 03:23 AM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Cardinals
4. Brewers
5. Mets
6. Cubs
7. Marlins
8. Giants
9. Rockies
10. Braves
11. Astros
12. Reds
13. Diamondbacks
14. Padres
15. Pirates
16. Nationals

I guess I pretty much agree with this list...but the Dodgers are the only dominant team in the NL. No other team is a gauranteed playoff team IMO.

CAIN=FUTURE
06-17-2009, 03:28 AM
Dude...Giants arent that good...they are an average team.

And the Mets are just amzing, right?

Kyle916
06-17-2009, 03:41 AM
Dude...Giants arent that good...they are an average team.

I agree that they're being ranked a bit too high by most Giants fans...

Gigantes4Life
06-17-2009, 03:56 AM
They give a better bearing of a players worth, then a 60 game stretch of a season???

No, but you should know that the production of relief pitchers fluctuates a lot due to the small amount of innings pitched each year, so you must look at two or three seasons top.

Pinstripe pride
06-17-2009, 09:17 AM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Brewers
4. Cardinals
5. Cubs
6. Mets
7. Rockies
8. Giants
9. Marlins
10. Reds
11. Braves
12. Diamondbacks
13. Pirates
14. Astros
15. Nationals
16. Padres

really? nationals not in last place?

ATL2010
06-17-2009, 09:51 AM
1.Dodgers-Best team in NL this year and they're only gonna get better when Manny comes back
2.Phillies-The offense has carried them all year, they get a big name SP and repeat
3.Brewers-They have the offense but i dont know about the pitching
4.Cardinals-Another supprise team playing good but have been slumping of late
5.Giants-Absoloutly no offense, but pitching will carry them to the playoffs and win the Wildcard and with that pitching the Giants could go all the way
6.Reds-A supprise team playing good baseball who have a chance in the Centeral
7.Mets-Missing some key players because of injuries, need another SP
8.Braves-My team, they have the pitching but need a big outfield bat
9.Cubs-Having an ok year but not a great year
10.Marlins-Great young talent
11.Rockies-Been playing great baseball since they parted ways with Clint Hurdle
12.Astros-Another disappointment IMO
13.Pirates-the Pirates are getting better
14.Diamondbacks-big disappointment, Webb being hurt hurts
15.Nationals-not very good now but with Stratusburg, Zimmerman, and probably Bruce Harper the Nats future looks promising

CAIN=FUTURE
06-17-2009, 12:30 PM
1.Dodgers-Best team in NL this year and they're only gonna get better when Manny comes back
2.Phillies-The offense has carried them all year, they get a big name SP and repeat
3.Brewers-They have the offense but i dont know about the pitching
4.Cardinals-Another supprise team playing good but have been slumping of late
5.Giants-Absoloutly no offense, but pitching will carry them to the playoffs and win the Wildcard and with that pitching the Giants could go all the way6.Reds-A supprise team playing good baseball who have a chance in the Centeral
7.Mets-Missing some key players because of injuries, need another SP
8.Braves-My team, they have the pitching but need a big outfield bat
9.Cubs-Having an ok year but not a great year
10.Marlins-Great young talent
11.Rockies-Been playing great baseball since they parted ways with Clint Hurdle
12.Astros-Another disappointment IMO
13.Pirates-the Pirates are getting better
14.Diamondbacks-big disappointment, Webb being hurt hurts
15.Nationals-not very good now but with Stratusburg, Zimmerman, and probably Bruce Harper the Nats future looks promising

Your not a Giants fan? :D.

And Bryce Harper is only 16, so hes a ways off.

REGular
06-17-2009, 12:40 PM
4.Cardinals-Another supprise team playing good but have been slumping of late
5.Giants-Absoloutly no offense, but pitching will carry them to the playoffs and win the Wildcard and with that pitching the Giants could go all the way

If you have the Giants winning the wild card then shouldn't you have them ranked over the Cardinals?

kmo429
06-17-2009, 12:49 PM
If you have the Giants winning the wild card then shouldn't you have them ranked over the Cardinals?

Haha so he's saying there going to win the Nl central and the wild cvard? thats dicey. lol

kmo429
06-17-2009, 12:55 PM
Giants arent going to the playoffs , i pretty much agree with the original list except for a few teams, giants and rockies should be lower

MooseWithFleas
06-17-2009, 12:55 PM
No, but you should know that the production of relief pitchers fluctuates a lot due to the small amount of innings pitched each year, so you must look at two or three seasons top.

In which case, Jeremy Affeldt is still not good, let alone "one of the best setup men in the league" you didn't say that, but one of the giants fans did, which is what I was trying to disprove.

chicagofan71
06-17-2009, 01:13 PM
1. Dodgers
2. Phillies
3. Cardinals
4. Brewers
5. Mets
6. Cubs
7. Marlins
8. Giants
9. Rockies
10. Braves
11. Astros
12. Reds
13. Diamondbacks
14. Padres
15. Pirates
16. Nationals

Solid list; I'm still not entirely sold on the Rockies, but they could sway me pretty soon



Your not a Giants fan? .

And Bryce Harper is only 16, so hes a ways off

The Giants' anemic offense isn't taking them anywhere anytime soon. Also, Harper will probably be in next year's draft

Lincecum4CY
06-17-2009, 01:46 PM
Mediocre bullpen? what are you talking about? Our bullpen is great.

Our closer is one of the most overrated players on the team.

Affeldt is good but not one of the best

Medders is not a late inning guy

Romo is good but we don't have a dominant 8-9 inning bullpen duo

I agree..a lot of the giants fans are overrating our team... i wouldn't say we were a top 5...we are a top 7-10

And BTW: Our starting pitching is a little overrated. I can't watch giants games when zito,sanchez and sometimes even johnson start.

Lincecum4CY
06-17-2009, 01:49 PM
They have gotten off to a good start but don't kid yourself. Brian Wilson is an average to slightly above average closer. Affeldt is a career long journeyman who can't be counted on for a sub 3 era, much less a sub 2 era. I highly doubt that Medders keeps up his respectable ERA with his penchant for walking batters. And Bob Howry, do I even need to start?

True...but i really hope you don't think the phillies have a better bullpen than the Giants? IMO the phillies have one of the worst bullpens in the game.

Lincecum4CY
06-17-2009, 01:55 PM
Just because the giants beat my favorite team means i can't express how good i think the giants are? Give me a break dude. I never said the A's were amazing. By that logic a Pirates fan can never call another team bad because he is a Pirates fan. Congrats the Giants had a good series, but I still don't consider them a playoff team.

I was responding to your posts...i was expressing how ****** the a's are just how you you were attempting to respond how ****** the giants were. I just pointed out that your team got outscored by what you called a "horrid" offense 15-3.

I agree the giants dont have a good offense, but neither do the a's. We threw 2 CG's against you guys in 1 series? ouch.

Kyle916
06-17-2009, 02:04 PM
In which case, Jeremy Affeldt is still not good, let alone "one of the best setup men in the league" you didn't say that, but one of the giants fans did, which is what I was trying to disprove.

Why are you trying to disprove something that everybody already knows?

Everybody already knows that Affeldt isn't one of the best set-up men in the game...

Dark Donnie
06-17-2009, 02:06 PM
True...but i really hope you don't think the phillies have a better bullpen than the Giants? IMO the phillies have one of the worst bullpens in the game.

haha

sungold200033
06-17-2009, 02:12 PM
1. Dodgers, no one can beat them.
2. Philadelphia, for now.
3. St. Louis, Carpenter?
4. Milwaukee, if they keep hitting.
5. New York, they should get a guys back from dl and be fine.
6. San Francisco, pitching coming but can that stick with NO OFFENSE.
7. Chicago, they just need to put it together.
8. Cincinnati, there pitching is all over the place
9. Colorado, RED HOT
10.Florida, they will fade right out
11.Pittsburgh, wow
12. Atlanta, couple of years away
13. Houston, don't count them out
14. San Diego, one bright spot at First base
15. Arizona, New manager
16. Washington, just not all ther

Lincecum4CY
06-17-2009, 02:14 PM
haha

I guess i shouldn't have saidd that before checking the stats carefully :rolleyes:

Fcuked up on that one....sorry.

By far not one of the worst.

Dark Donnie
06-17-2009, 02:16 PM
I guess i shouldn't have saidd that before checking the stats carefully :rolleyes:

Fcuked up on that one....sorry.

By far not one of the worst.

Based off of Bullpen ERA I believe The Phillies are 9th (another bad outing last night had to due with the drop). Giants are 7th btw.

Lincecum4CY
06-17-2009, 02:18 PM
Based off of Bullpen ERA I believe The Phillies are 9th (another bad outing last night had to due with the drop). Giants are 7th btw.

Really? 7th? Even with Howry? I'll take it..thanks for the info.

I based it off because don't the Phills have all the giants scrubs? Tashner,Walker,Eyre? Or has philly realized they all blow and got rid of them?

Dark Donnie
06-17-2009, 02:36 PM
According to MLB.com....that's just bullpen ERA though.

Tashner stinks.....Eyre has been pretty good for us but is now hurt. Walker was just called up two days ago, and only saw an inning of action. Erye was a good pickup for us though.

NYman15
06-17-2009, 02:50 PM
it really depends on what your asking if you think how every team is set up I would say dogers and cubs maybe phillies cardinals but to me the wild card team in all of this is the mets they are still within 3 games of phils above 500 and have had players on dl during the year such as starting catcher schneider reyer delgado beltran church wagner putz maine pelfrey perez and santana might be hurt along with call ups being hurt if they come back healthy they will be dominant.

mser58
06-17-2009, 02:56 PM
16. the Phillies infield
17. Natinals

long ball
06-17-2009, 02:57 PM
What ever the rankings are now will probably be pretty different by September. Almost all NL contenders have dealt with a bunch of injuries and inconsistencies.

MooseWithFleas
06-17-2009, 02:58 PM
True...but i really hope you don't think the phillies have a better bullpen than the Giants? IMO the phillies have one of the worst bullpens in the game.

I think they have comparable bullpen's. Last year we had the best bullpen in the league, but thats because EVERYONE was performing to the best of their abilities.

The difference is that if the Giants bp blows a lead, they don't have the offensive firepower to comeback, where the Phillies have one of the best offenses in the league.

The Schmooze
06-17-2009, 03:13 PM
The best team in the NL, to me, has gotta be the Ph........the Ph.....

Excuse me. The best team in the NL is the, um, Phuhhhh....
Sorry my Mets fanhood will not allow me to name the team I'm thinking of.

I think they slightly edge the Dodgers b/c of their resilience late in games. I think it will be alot closer once Manny comes back, but this team I'm referring to is the best in the NL right now. If they get another starter, fuggetiboutit.

Gigantes4Life
06-17-2009, 03:33 PM
Bullpen rankings so far:

http://www.fangraphs.com/teams.aspx?pos=all&stats=rel&lg=nl&type=1&season=2009&month=0

MooseWithFleas
06-17-2009, 03:37 PM
^^ My point was that the Giants bullpen would not continue the stats they have so far. So I expect those numbers to go down by the end of the year.

Gigantes4Life
06-17-2009, 03:48 PM
Well that's your opinion and you have nothing factual to support your claim. The only thing you can say is that their ERA will increase, but their FIP is still much better than most teams.

Cheezombie
06-17-2009, 04:08 PM
I was responding to your posts...i was expressing how ****** the a's are just how you you were attempting to respond how ****** the giants were. I just pointed out that your team got outscored by what you called a "horrid" offense 15-3.

I agree the giants dont have a good offense, but neither do the a's. We threw 2 CG's against you guys in 1 series? ouch.

I never said the A's offense was great either. And i would never pick the A's to be anywhere near 4th with their offense. I couldn't care less if they outscored the A's 15-3. They did it against inconsistent rookies, and even after that they were 29th out of 30 in runs scored.

MooseWithFleas
06-17-2009, 05:23 PM
Well that's your opinion and you have nothing factual to support your claim. The only thing you can say is that their ERA will increase, but their FIP is still much better than most teams.

The factual evidence I have is that everyone in the bullpen is over performing, including older guys like Bob Howry and Jeremy Affeldt. I think many of them are going to resort to their average stats over the last 2-3 years, which will lead to just a mediocre to below average bullpen. Just my opinion though.

Gigantes4Life
06-17-2009, 05:31 PM
The factual evidence I have is that everyone in the bullpen is over performing, including older guys like Bob Howry and Jeremy Affeldt. I think many of them are going to resort to their average stats over the last 2-3 years, which will lead to just a mediocre to below average bullpen. Just my opinion though.

Well Howry isn't exactly over-performing at all. He's had a FIP in the mid-threes the last few years with the exception of last year, which likely was just an off-year. So really, he's performing at his norm.

Romo was one of our better prospects (for RP) and is young, and has great stuff, so the verdict is still out on him. Valdez has usually been a great talent but has always been hurt.

Wilson, no need to explain, overrated but still a decent closer.

And Affeldt is the only one who's overperforming really.

Basically they're all performing like they have the past few years.

REGular
06-17-2009, 05:55 PM
All I know is my fantasy team could've used a little help from the Giants bullpen today . . . what was up with that???


Also, why did the NL rankings thread devolve into a discussion and the merits of the Giants bull pen . . .

metfan4life775
06-17-2009, 06:05 PM
cause for some reason alot of people think the giants suck

Gigantes4Life
06-17-2009, 06:23 PM
All I know is my fantasy team could've used a little help from the Giants bullpen today . . . what was up with that???


Also, why did the NL rankings thread devolve into a discussion and the merits of the Giants bull pen . . .

What do you mean? They barely pitched...or was that the problem?

REGular
06-17-2009, 06:48 PM
cause for some reason alot of people think the giants suck

That's simply not true . . .

Of the 4 Giants fans that ranked, the Giants were placed between 4-6

Of the 8 non-Giants fans that ranked, they were placed between 4-8.

Every single poster so far has ranked the Giants in the better half of the NL.

So remind me . . . why are Giants fans being so insecure when they will admit the only thing they have going for them is Lincecum & Cain . . .

REGular
06-17-2009, 06:50 PM
What do you mean? They barely pitched...or was that the problem?

Yeah the problem was Lincecum pitched a great 7 innings to take a 3-1 lead into the 8th, and then he fell apart, and they kept sticking with him (I assume the bullpen had been overworked or they didn't trust them) and he ended up giving 3 more runs in the 8th and Giants lost . . .

Just checked: Lince gave up 4 consecutive hits to start the inning and they left him in there to lose it . . .

Gigantes4Life
06-18-2009, 12:53 AM
Yeah the problem was Lincecum pitched a great 7 innings to take a 3-1 lead into the 8th, and then he fell apart, and they kept sticking with him (I assume the bullpen had been overworked or they didn't trust them) and he ended up giving 3 more runs in the 8th and Giants lost . . .

Just checked: Lince gave up 4 consecutive hits to start the inning and they left him in there to lose it . . .

I see, and he didn't fall apart, groundballs just found holes. It sucked :(