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View Full Version : Is Kendrick Perkins an elite defender?



m26555
06-01-2009, 03:33 PM
He really did an outstanding job against Dwight Howard in a series in which everyone expected Howard to demolish Boston and has developed into one of the best shot blockers and most consistent post defenders in the league.

My question is has Perkins now solidified himself as an elite defensive player in the NBA? Does anyone see him challenging for a DPOY award in the future, or at least making an All-Defensive team?

IKAZ
06-01-2009, 03:37 PM
He really did an outstanding job against Dwight Howard in a series in which everyone expected Howard to demolish Boston and has developed into one of the best shot blockers and most consistent post defenders in the league.

My question is has Perkins now solidified himself as an elite defensive player in the NBA? Does anyone see him challenging for a DPOY award in the future, or at least making an All-Defensive team?

hahah r u kidding me?

IKAZ
06-01-2009, 03:37 PM
heyall noooooooo

Chronz
06-01-2009, 03:37 PM
Shouldve made an All-Defensive team last year, and who expected Dwight to dominate? Perkins has all the talent to be a great defender, heck he should be a much better offensive player but it seems the gods only blessed him with defensive IQ.

The best defenders in the league are usually one dimensional, especially bigs, they are either good shot blockers but horrible post defenders or vice versa, this guy does it all, and for someone his size I didnt see him struggle too much in rotation situations.

m26555
06-01-2009, 03:39 PM
Shouldve made an All-Defensive team last year, and who expected Dwight to dominate? Perkins has all the talent to be a great defender, heck he should be a much better offensive player but it seems the gods only blessed him with defensive IQ.

The best defenders in the league are usually one dimensional, especially bigs, they are either good shot blockers but horrible post defenders or vice versa, this guy does it all, and for someone his size I didnt see him struggle too much in rotation situations.
Maybe it was just Magic fans, but on other message boards, everyone said Boston didn't have a chance against Orlando because they had no one to cover Howard.

m26555
06-01-2009, 03:39 PM
hahah r u kidding me?
I guess you don't watch basketball.

Nice, educated post, by the way.

Unruly Fan
06-01-2009, 03:50 PM
I would consider him a good post defender but not an quite an "elite" (yet).

Fayzon10
06-01-2009, 03:53 PM
I think he may be, you can throw him on pretty much any center in the league other than Yao and he will hold his own on the defensive end..

mjt20mik
06-01-2009, 04:00 PM
He's a great team defender. A good post defender, but not an elite.

DJ CHACH
06-01-2009, 04:04 PM
he's elite at getting away w everything and then when they call something, looking so stunned like hes gonna punch the ref...he looks like a red devil and i cant stand him...he's a cheap player

albertc86
06-01-2009, 04:04 PM
The term 'elite' gets thrown around too loosely around here. He's not an elite defender. He's above average, not great, and certainly not elite. His services would be welcomed on any team but don't get ahead of yourself.

_Sn1P3r_
06-01-2009, 04:13 PM
He's really good, but to say 'elite' is a reach.

Chronz
06-01-2009, 04:14 PM
Name to me 5 better defensive Centers

Unruly Fan
06-01-2009, 04:27 PM
Name to me 5 better defensive Centers

1. Tim Duncan
2. Ben Wallace (Det)
3. DHow
4. David Robinson
5. Marcus Camby
6. Dikembe Mutombo
7. Hakeem Olajuwon
...

DJ CHACH
06-01-2009, 04:28 PM
Name to me 5 better defensive Centers

yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

superkegger
06-01-2009, 04:34 PM
yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

:laugh:

IRUAM #21
06-01-2009, 04:36 PM
Brad Miller lol.

superkegger
06-01-2009, 04:37 PM
Brad Miller lol.

Don't forget Pau and Amare, both awesome defenders. :laugh2:

Chronz
06-01-2009, 04:51 PM
yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....
Yao is easily exploited in certain matchups, matchups that have become more frequent in recent years. Shaq, Magloire, Dampier are too old now. Nene fouls too much, cant rebound or block shots like Perk, Pau's help defense is spotty especially when he has to guard a legit threat. Ben Wallace was amazing this year all things (age, Playing Time) considered but he doesnt have the same defensive responsibility that Perk has. Dont know about Etan but Haywood I could understand. Ive seen him and person and hes probably the biggest/scariest no namer in the league but hes been injured for awhile now, does he still have it? Pryzbilla, Im not too fond of defensive anchors who play on bad defensive teams unless they are extremely valuable to that team. I dont think Pryzbilla is but then again I dont watch too many Blazer games. Brad Miller is tougher than people give him credit for, but his best defensive weapon is the ability to annoy, Perk has much more going for him.

Camby is notorious for being an overrated defender, but without him the Clippers probably dont reach double figure in wins, we were absolutely pathetic when he wasnt on the floor, though when your backups are Z-Bo and a rookie your not going to be good defensively. Bogut is in a similar scenario, hes not a GREAT defender, but he means so much to Milwaukee that he deserves some recognition, I have no idea how he became shotblocker, its not really a skill you can develop but hes really put in the work. But youve got to be joking with Amare, he took a step back this year in every facet of the game. He was becoming an average defender up until this season.



1. Tim Duncan
2. Ben Wallace (Det)
3. DHow
4. David Robinson
5. Marcus Camby
6. Dikembe Mutombo
7. Hakeem Olajuwon
...
Is he asking from an All-Time perspective or in the now? Take Camby off that list in either event.

Chicagofaithful
06-01-2009, 04:54 PM
if a 100 is an elite defender (KG ect, Ben Wallace in his prime, D howard)... Kendick is around a 27

KmB728
06-01-2009, 05:02 PM
:laugh:



:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: i thought i would be the only one to find that post funny


anyway Perk is a great defender... but he isnt elite (yet) :pray:

AntiG
06-01-2009, 05:05 PM
Perkins is one of the best defensive big men in the game today.


yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....
Perkins is a better defensive player than everyone you listed except Howard, Wallace and Camby. Are you kidding me? Terrible job with your list, unless you were aiming for comedy.

Gasol hahahahahahhahahhaha good one

Raidaz4Life
06-01-2009, 05:10 PM
ummmm no not even close to "Elite"

Joshtd1
06-01-2009, 05:13 PM
I dont think he's elite, but he is very solid.

Reason Dwight didnt dominate him is because Dwight couldnt bully him, like he was able to bully Ilsoftkus, and Veraejo.

I dont think Dwight will have as good of a series against the Lakers either, since I dont see him being able to bully Bynum around.

AntiG
06-01-2009, 05:15 PM
I dont think he's elite, but he is very solid.

Reason Dwight didnt dominate him is because Dwight couldnt bully him, like he was able to bully Ilsoftkus, and Veraejo.

I dont think Dwight will have as good of a series against the Lakers either, since I dont see him being able to bully Bynum around.

Dwight had trouble with him because Perkins plays very fundamental defense... he doesn't fly around, he holds his position and shuffles his feet to mirror his opponent. KG & Thibideaux taught the guy REALLY well.

Considering that there isn't too much out there in terms of "elite" defenders, he's pretty much an elite by current standards.

Joshtd1
06-01-2009, 05:20 PM
Dwight had trouble with him because Perkins plays very fundamental defense... he doesn't fly around, he holds his position and shuffles his feet to mirror his opponent. KG & Thibideaux taught the guy REALLY well.

Considering that there isn't too much out there in terms of "elite" defenders, he's pretty much an elite by current standards.

I agree with you, but another reason Dwight didnt do that good is because he relies alot on bullying people around, since he doesnt really have a whole lot of offensive moves..and he really couldnt do that to Perk since Perkins is a big strong guy.

SeoulBeatz
06-01-2009, 05:27 PM
he is a good defender, but he fouls WAYYYY too much.

Chronz
06-01-2009, 05:47 PM
I dont think he's elite, but he is very solid.

Reason Dwight didnt dominate him is because Dwight couldnt bully him, like he was able to bully Ilsoftkus, and Veraejo.

I dont think Dwight will have as good of a series against the Lakers either, since I dont see him being able to bully Bynum around.
The fact that you cant dominate him physically is why hes a great defender. Ive never heard of a dominant defender who could be dominated.

Missing56&33
06-01-2009, 06:20 PM
KP is a basketball player. All basketball players find a way to be good defensive. KP wants to win.

PhillyMac
06-01-2009, 06:33 PM
i think one of the problems is when you say elite, people think elite player, not defender. he is an elite defender, which is the answer to the question. but nowhere near is he an elite player, let alone a good player, because his offensive game is so terrible. having said that, he is however an excellent defender

DJ CHACH
06-01-2009, 06:38 PM
Perkins is one of the best defensive big men in the game today.


Perkins is a better defensive player than everyone you listed except Howard, Wallace and Camby. Are you kidding me? Terrible job with your list, unless you were aiming for comedy.

Gasol hahahahahahhahahhaha good one


dude, ur from NY, get on top of ur game..if u dont think haywood, pau,shaq,nene,tyson chandler, pryzbilla, magloire, dampier and etan thomas are better than u better catch up w ur overall knowledge of the game. there are other players outside of the playoffs that are good..DIDu just turn the tv on? pryzbilla is tough to deal with bc he is veteran, long and athletic..perkins is lucky to have thibedoua tell them how to hold without having the refs see what u are doing.....
ill go one by one for u since im not a comedian

1)Haywood- very undderated, lebron couldnt do anything against him when they playd them, and if u ask any real basketball fan, nobody would argue haywood

2)shaq= shaqtus..nuff said

3)pau isnt just a block of meat, he's long and his help defense and recovery is INSANE, especially those games in denver--im not talkin rebounding, im talking one on one, and help defense, he kept blocking everyone, smith, nene, jones, melo SO STOP hatin unless u didnt watch the series)

4)wait, so ur telling me TYSON chandler doesnt play d? he's just like gasol, great recovery and help side defense...i wanna c perkins come from the weak side and block ppl, he cant he just stays there...If u wanna be good at defense, u hafta be able to recover and gamble..when does perkins ever gamble on a potential block he MIGHT get to... u listed howard, ben wallace, and camby as the ones u thought were fine...DO U REALIZE THAT ALL THOSE GUYS have EXCELLENT HELP SIDE DEFENSE and RECOVERY..well, now u do..

moving on..

5)Dalembert-also the same, excelent at challenging, recovering and keepin his man always close even when he gambles..NOT EVEN DWIGHT HAD AN EASY TIME in that series

6) ETAN THOMAS is probably at the same level as perkins..u havent seen him play in a while, but ur basketball knowledge shud be telling you that he is a very good defensive player, doesnt gamble alot (just like perkins) but likes to push and shove

7)Dampier, same as ETAN and PERKINS

8)MAGLOIRE...maybe u dont know this, but teams pick him up for his DEFENSE, his toughness, and his veteran saviness

9) i could see BOGUT u may have me there, but when i watched him the seasons before he got hurt, he was young, athletic, Tall, and Versatile, and he never let he ALWAYS kept his man in check(only that one time eddy curry owned him., but u see how far back im goin, u might not even have known that nba was broadcasted back when eddy curry was dishin out 20+

10)YAo- whats funny is that ppl like perkins and other centers who push and shove and grab and hold dont get whistled for it..IM 1,000% happy that they dont call that ******** fouls, but then when ppl play against YAO MIng, he doesnt even wanna do anything besides block a shot, but the refs dont let it get that far...i feel bad for yao, when any shot goes up, he is right there contesting adn altering shots, but he'll probably have 3 fouls just trying to move outta the way and let them shoot so he could block it..ANOTHER POINT I COME TO, IS THAT GREAT DEFENSIVE CENTERS ALSO HAVE THE ABILITY TO ALTER SHOTS...i think yao is up there, and i dont think im wrong..

11)brad miller= very underrated..he talks a lotta smack, and usually forces ppl to lower their shoulder so he can fall down...BEING SMART=BEING A GOOD DEFENSIVE CENTER..ANOTHER MAJOR POINT..I HATE FLOPPING JUST AS MUCH AS ANYONE ELSE, NOTHING BOTHERS ME MORE (well maybe lebron getting away w traveling but nvr mind) BUT IF U ARE A GOOD DEFESNIVE CENTER, U KNOW HOW TO BAIT THE OFFENSE TO TRY AND LOWER THEIR SHOUDLER OR USE THIER ELBOW TO CLEAR SPACE..BRAD MILLER IS AN EXCELLLENT CROWDER AND ANY CONTACT IS PRETTY MUCH GONNA SEND HIM FLYING BC HE IS SO CLOSE...NOWADAYS, U CANT BE A GOOD DEFENDER IF U PLAY "FOUL OUT" TYPE OF DEFENSE(WHICH PERKINS ALWAYS DOES) BECAUSE WHEN IT COUNTS IN THE CLUTCH, HE CANT BE THERE TO EARN HIS "ELITENESS"...perkins always is in foul trouble, and i dont mind it, but he doesnt gamble, he doesnt alter shots from other players, he isnt quick enuf to rotate, he isnt fast enuf at recovering(forcing him to foul to prevent a layup) and he simply doesnt know how to bait/frustrate players into charging into him.. nowadays u and i both know that defense is not allowed, so u can tell me perkins is a good defender but a great defender doesnt just use his body to push out a mano-e-mano situation..a great defender can do everythhing i listed up there

SO, WHAT DID WE LEARN TODAY?

Great defenders.....
1) have the veteran savvy
2)long, ahtletic
3)great instincts of not putting yourself in a bad position, ex- fouling out
4)reading the way the play unfolds and challenge other ppl than the one ur guarding
5)alter shots
6)bait the offense
7)Gamble when ur athleticism can assure ur help side defense that u can block a shot
8)recover if u gamble
9)being smart (and smart doesnt mean fouling urself out, and maybe trying to force contact that could lead to an offensive foul and u escape with one less foul)
10)great recovery
11)help side defense
12)understanding the time to foul and the tiime to let it go(perkins is always out in the first quarter w 2 fouls)
13)challenging anyone who comes thru the lane WIHTOUT PICKING UP A FOUL (or in perkins case, a FLAGRANT)
14)playing the game doesnt mean playing basketball, it means playing the refs version of basketball so stop complaining after every call otherwise they will ALWAYS be against u..

i miss the days of defense and i dont mind one bit that perkins is physical...just somebody tell him its not allowed anymore..he's just putting himself in his own hole and he keeps digging it deeper every year. if he could just force contact from other players than him always being the one to cause it, THe refs might just cut him some slack..

dude, no heart feelings, but think before u post..i dont have that many posts but when i do, its because i know what im saying...

im a knicks faithful, born n raised in the upper west side of manhattan, and i know how far the rules have changed since my 90's knicks days...just stating the obvious

look at the list again and tell me what u think...yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

mitch91
06-01-2009, 06:43 PM
when you say elite, elite means comparing players to current and past players, so in comparing kp to some of the past greats, no he is not elite. but compared to some of the centers today, he is very good. he has the frame and ability to become a very good if possible great center but he will have to work his butt of.

as somebody said earlier "hes pretty much elite by current standards"

Missing56&33
06-01-2009, 06:50 PM
i think one of the problems is when you say elite, people think elite player, not defender. he is an elite defender, which is the answer to the question. but nowhere near is he an elite player, let alone a good player, because his offensive game is so terrible. having said that, he is however an excellent defender

KP is a basketball player. All good basketball players find a way to score the basketball. David Lee is not a good offensive or defense player but he avg a double double. Your right KP is not an elite defender technically but can be at times.

Unruly Fan
06-01-2009, 06:51 PM
Name to me 5 better defensive Centers



Is he asking from an All-Time perspective or in the now? Take Camby off that list in either event.

You've just asked me to name 5 centers who are better defensively. Point is if you compare Perkins with TRUE elites he is overshadowed.

PS. I added Camby because at one point believe it or not he made 1st Defensive Team.

m26555
06-01-2009, 06:53 PM
yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....
You ARE kidding, right?

Angel
06-01-2009, 06:54 PM
He does great against guys like Dwight Howard and Yao Ming but the more quick centers like Joakim Noah and Al Horford give him problems. Weird huh? He's is as strong as anyone in the league so he does great against the big strong centers but the smaller faster ones give him a little trouble. George Karl said that Perkins is in the top 3 of best defensive centers in basketball. He is a big strong hard nose defender though.

DJ CHACH
06-01-2009, 06:56 PM
You ARE kidding, right?

read my post above on this page..yup, the long one

Chronz
06-01-2009, 07:07 PM
You've just asked me to name 5 centers who are better defensively. Point is if you compare Perkins with TRUE elites he is overshadowed.

I thought it would go without saying that he doesnt stack up to Bill Russel, Dream, even a motivated Shaq, Deke, Ewing, these are just names that come to everyones mind. Did you really believe I would ask for that, when your simple minded 4th grader could do the same? I was hoping it would go without saying that Im speaking about the now. CHACH seemed to get me just fine, specifically naming quite a few decent players. It doesnt take a genius to know there are a handful better defenders than Perkins in the history of the league.

Which takes me back to.....
Point is if you compare Perkins with TRUE elites he is overshadowed.
For the sake of argument, if your naming Camby as a TRUE elite then apparently not. Hes easily now a better defender than Camby has every at one point been. The proof is in the pudding, Celtics have stayed a top shelf defensive team, it wasnt all KG's doing that turned the C's around, dirty work tends to go unappreciated. One of Ainges best moves was signing him on the cheap and keeping him undervalued.

PS. I added Camby because at one point believe it or not he made 1st Defensive Team.


Do you have any idea how hard it is to get recognition for your defense when your not boasting REB+BLK/STL averages? Do you know how long Battier went before finally feeling like he got the respect he deserved? Even then it was only a 2nd team, when your adopted kids look up Battier in the history books they are going to see 2 lousy 2nd-team All-Defensive selections after what in reality is damn near a decade of defensive dominance.

I dont know which is more infuriating, him or Duncan never winning a DPOY.

alverwi
06-01-2009, 07:14 PM
hell no. no part of KP's game is "elite." He has improved his game but is lightyears from "elite"

mikantsass
06-01-2009, 07:16 PM
Let's not let people's homer-ness get in the way of this debate on either end. Perkins is a great post defender. He plays physical and he is relatively quick for a big man. He did a great job playing Howard in that series as Howard struggled in most of those games. However, a great shot blocker? No. I am a Celtics fan and have been watching him ever since they drafted him. He gets his occasional blocked shots against little guys but he doesnt have much of a vertical leap. You won't see him blocking too many other centers or PFs either.

x_notorious
06-01-2009, 07:35 PM
Elite? No. But he's a pretty good defender.

magichatnumber9
06-01-2009, 07:35 PM
The guy gets the job done. He's not Elite and doesn't consider himself Elite. So your not hurting his ego

Vincent
06-01-2009, 07:38 PM
I thought it would go without saying that he doesnt stack up to Bill Russel, Dream, even a motivated Shaq, Deke, Ewing, these are just names that come to everyones mind. Did you really believe I would ask for that, when your simple minded 4th grader could do the same? I was hoping it would go without saying that Im speaking about the now. CHACH seemed to get me just fine, specifically naming quite a few decent players. It doesnt take a genius to know there are a handful better defenders than Perkins in the history of the league.

Which takes me back to.....
Point is if you compare Perkins with TRUE elites he is overshadowed.
For the sake of argument, if your naming Camby as a TRUE elite then apparently not. Hes easily now a better defender than Camby has every at one point been. The proof is in the pudding, Celtics have stayed a top shelf defensive team, it wasnt all KG's doing that turned the C's around, dirty work tends to go unappreciated. One of Ainges best moves was signing him on the cheap and keeping him undervalued.

PS. I added Camby because at one point believe it or not he made 1st Defensive Team.


Do you have any idea how hard it is to get recognition for your defense when your not boasting REB+BLK/STL averages? Do you know how long Battier went before finally feeling like he got the respect he deserved? Even then it was only a 2nd team, when your adopted kids look up Battier in the history books they are going to see 2 lousy 2nd-team All-Defensive selections after what in reality is damn near a decade of defensive dominance.

I dont know which is more infuriating, him or Duncan never winning a DPOY.

If you didn't notice, the Celtics were a much worse defensive team after Kevin Garnett went down. And were pretty much middle of the road in that category.

Kendrick Perkins relies on his size and length to play defense. He is slow on the weak side help and does not have the foot speed to get back fast enough during fast break opportunities. He is an average defensive rebounder at 5.5 drpg, but had a decent amount of bpg at 2.0. Yet, he doesn't necessarily intimidate players from driving inside the lane due to his weak help side defense. In the post, due to his size and length, he gives opposing post players great trouble. In that sense, I do think Kendrick Perkins is one of the best on-ball post defenders in the league.

IndyRealist
06-01-2009, 07:40 PM
Dwight, Yao, Shaq, Dalembert, Camby, Chandler, Okafor, Horford, Kaman, Jermaine O'Neal. All better defensively than Perkins. Bynum, Dampier, Beidrins, Nene, and big Ben are roughly even with KP, he may be slightly better. If you include PF's, then you can throw in Duncan, Aldridge, Garnett, Gerald Wallace, Kevin Love, Rasheed Wallace, and Luis Scola who are on his level or better.

Perkins is big and strong but he's one dimensional. Against Al Jefferson, Pau, Josh Smith, Gerald Wallace, Dirk, and other face up, jump shooting bigs, Perkins is clearly exposed.

lakersrock
06-01-2009, 07:42 PM
Shoving, hitting and just general dirty play doesn't equal elite defense.

Unruly Fan
06-01-2009, 08:11 PM
I thought it would go without saying that he doesnt stack up to Bill Russel, Dream, even a motivated Shaq, Deke, Ewing, these are just names that come to everyones mind. Did you really believe I would ask for that, when your simple minded 4th grader could do the same? I was hoping it would go without saying that Im speaking about the now. CHACH seemed to get me just fine, specifically naming quite a few decent players. It doesnt take a genius to know there are a handful better defenders than Perkins in the history of the league.

An unspecified answer will usually receive a generalized answer. And anyhow I was simply using them to contrast the differences between an elite defender and a good defender so imo it made perfectly good sense to give them a mention.


Which takes me back to.....
Point is if you compare Perkins with TRUE elites he is overshadowed.
For the sake of argument, if your naming Camby as a TRUE elite then apparently not. Hes easily now a better defender than Camby has every at one point been. The proof is in the pudding, Celtics have stayed a top shelf defensive team, it wasnt all KG's doing that turned the C's around, dirty work tends to go unappreciated. One of Ainges best moves was signing him on the cheap and keeping him undervalued.

Regardless, the point I'm still trying to make is that if you compare Perkins to other greats (past or present) he is still far from elite for now.


Do you have any idea how hard it is to get recognition for your defense when your not boasting REB+BLK/STL averages? Do you know how long Battier went before finally feeling like he got the respect he deserved? Even then it was only a 2nd team, when your adopted kids look up Battier in the history books they are going to see 2 lousy 2nd-team All-Defensive selections after what in reality is damn near a decade of defensive dominance.

I dont know which is more infuriating, him or Duncan never winning a DPOY.

Exactly. Camby stood out in those categories. Mind you I haven't been watching him play but from what I can see on paper; His 07/08 season trumps anything Perkins has ever done in his entire career.

Chronz
06-01-2009, 08:40 PM
If you didn't notice, the Celtics were a much worse defensive team after Kevin Garnett went down. And were pretty much middle of the road in that category.
They werent middle of the pack, far from it actually. They only lost a few points off of their defensive efficiency, which is what you would expect when youve lost not only KG but Rondo for a few games and integrated a few new players.


Kendrick Perkins relies on his size and length to play defense. He is slow on the weak side help and does not have the foot speed to get back fast enough during fast break opportunities.
Which is why the Celtics are not only a disciplined offensive team that plays at a slow pace, they limit transition opportunities. Perkins has his weaknesses, you mentioned his weakside rotations take too long but you can name a flaw in every elite defenders game, in KG's its his post defense and overall toughness inside. The Celtics didnt become a historically great defensive team with just KG, its the combination of these 2 frontcourt players that accounts for each others respective weaknesses and magnifies their strengths.


He is an average defensive rebounder at 5.5 drpg,
Yea but hes still in the top 19 in defensive rebounding% and hes on arguably the 2nd best rebounding team in the league. Thats still real good, not average.


but had a decent amount of bpg at 2.0. Yet, he doesn't necessarily intimidate players from driving inside the lane due to his weak help side defense.In the post, due to his size and length, he gives opposing post players great trouble. In that sense, I do think Kendrick Perkins is one of the best on-ball post defenders in the league.

I dont know what your seeing, I always see players rush their shots or passes when trying to attack the lane when hes there. The point of his weak side help is that he has a propensity for giving up midrange jumpers, he rarely leaves the lane so vulnerable to allow uncontested layups. Its his main strength along with his post defense that makes him a great defender.

Can you name to me another shotblocker with a higher rebounding rate and can still check the best big?

clehmun
06-01-2009, 08:41 PM
perkins is a very good defender. but he'll probably never make the all nba defensive team because he's not good enough offensively. no i'm not out of my mind, but that's how the league works.
if you don't have a big name, you won't get an award. if you're a superstar, you get the benefit of the doubt. and to be a superstar, the market and fans has to love you and promote you, and fans always like big time scorers or highlight reel players. that is why some people think josh smith is a great defender with his crazy blocks, or once thought that iverson was also a great defender because he leds the league in steals.

i'm a kobe fan, and i like lebron and CP3. but how are they better defenders than battier, artest, and billups? battier and artest are known for their defense, and they play their best defense on every play. kobe and lebron are good defenders, but inorder for them to perform on offense, they play defense half the time.
CP3 leads the league in steals, but if you know basketball, that's not a good way to tell if you're a good defender or not. CP3 is undersized, and often gambles for steals. billups can guard both guard spots, stay in front of defenders, as well as defending the post.

kobe, lebron, and CP3 are all in the first team this year with 20-30 votes each. but ak47, billups, and posey has 9 votes combined.
something tells me, when people were voting, they were looking other parts of the players game instead of just focusing on defense.

i mean, really? if a PG was going off against your team, on fire, scoring and penetrating at will, dishing to all open shooters.... the FIRST guard you would think of using to stop him would be CP3? really?!

Chronz
06-01-2009, 08:43 PM
Dwight, Yao, Shaq, Dalembert, Camby, Chandler, Okafor, Horford, Kaman, Jermaine O'Neal. All better defensively than Perkins. Bynum, Dampier, Beidrins, Nene, and big Ben are roughly even with KP, he may be slightly better. If you include PF's, then you can throw in Duncan, Aldridge, Garnett, Gerald Wallace, Kevin Love, Rasheed Wallace, and Luis Scola who are on his level or better.

Perkins is big and strong but he's one dimensional. Against Al Jefferson, Pau, Josh Smith, Gerald Wallace, Dirk, and other face up, jump shooting bigs, Perkins is clearly exposed.
Dont people always say he punked Pau? And those guys you listed arent even centers. Some of them arent even bigmen just 3's playing the 4. Thats hardly a fair matchup, ask any true center to guard a swingman.

29$JerZ
06-01-2009, 08:45 PM
Not even close to elite.
He is a solid C who does what you expect from him, rebounding,blocking,switching on plays,etc. Elite I don't see it.

VCaintdead17
06-01-2009, 08:54 PM
yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

Gotta love Brad Millers lockdown D. :rolleyes:

op12
06-01-2009, 09:04 PM
perk is a great defensive center. elite is hard to say, i consider dwight elite on d and not many other centers. elite on d to me is shaq or big ben in their prime. perk is excellent but not elite. but he could become even better with continued work.

to the guy who posted the long list, i would love to see some stats on perk vs great centers and the rest of your list. that list was laughable and your extremely long post trying to give an explanation was just as bad. everyone who says he is not a great defender is simply a hater.

_KB24_
06-01-2009, 09:07 PM
Definitely not elite. Hes just a big fat piece of weight that helps clog the paint. He needs to be a little quicker with his hands.

Chronz
06-01-2009, 09:09 PM
Exactly. Camby stood out in those categories. Mind you I haven't been watching him play but from what I can see on paper; His 07/08 season trumps anything Perkins has ever done in his entire career.
Heres my point, if your saying Camby is true ELITE, then Perkins is most definitely comparable.

You cannot quantify defense with Rebounds, STL/BLK tallies, its a tired catchphrase but I guess you havent heard it much considering you thought I was talking All-Time rankings earlier. Im not saying Camby is garbage, but hes not as good as his stats suggest, atleast those stats and compared to the truly elites. Neither Camby or Perkins are in that discussion honestly.

IndyRealist
06-01-2009, 09:25 PM
Dont people always say he punked Pau? And those guys you listed arent even centers. Some of them arent even bigmen just 3's playing the 4. Thats hardly a fair matchup, ask any true center to guard a swingman.

-SOME- of them aren't centers, I clearly said that. If they're listed at PF, and they get put in the game instead of a PF, then they're PF's. I'm sorry, is it unfair for teams to exploit mismatches on the Celtics? I'm sure the league will write a memo.

dos132
06-01-2009, 09:38 PM
that a big No No... he has to prove more of him self... he has to play more consistent to be called an elite defender....

LA @ 6

koreancabbage
06-01-2009, 09:49 PM
you're kidding right?


the only reason you think he's "elite" is becuase he plays for a defensive minded team in Boston- take him away, pretty sure he's not as elite as you think he is.


he didn't even make any 2nd All defensive team yet. let alone first.

people ahead him of him right now:

Howard
Duncan
Przybilla
Ming
Okafor
Camby (if he wasn't always so injured)
then comes
Perkins.

he's not there yet, but if he continues his work ethic, maybe oneday he'll make it to a 2nd All-Defensive team.

codes238
06-01-2009, 10:11 PM
he's the best defensive center in the league besides dwight...

codes238
06-01-2009, 10:16 PM
Wait.. I take it back.

Kobe is insane. Talk about the best player I've ever seen.

Black Mamba for FINALS MVP!

Dwight who?!

BTownTeamsRKing
06-01-2009, 10:32 PM
he's the best defensive center in the league besides dwight...

The Winner.

As a Celtics fan, I never go into a game concerned who is at center for the other team. Generally centers suck anyways, but Perk does a great job of not allowing the other center to score and does a pretty good job of shot blocking guards and forwards who beat their man.

He did a tremendous job on Howard and people forget he did it while playing with a dislocated shoulder for half the series.

jmastert
06-01-2009, 10:41 PM
no.... not even close

Kdirt
06-01-2009, 10:42 PM
hes an elite bum

BTownTeamsRKing
06-01-2009, 10:49 PM
no.... not even close

yea eddy curry is worlds better :rolleyes:

AntiG
06-01-2009, 10:55 PM
dude, ur from NY, get on top of ur game..if u dont think haywood, pau,shaq,nene,tyson chandler, pryzbilla, magloire, dampier and etan thomas are better than u better catch up w ur overall knowledge of the game. there are other players outside of the playoffs that are good..DIDu just turn the tv on? pryzbilla is tough to deal with bc he is veteran, long and athletic..perkins is lucky to have thibedoua tell them how to hold without having the refs see what u are doing.....
ill go one by one for u since im not a comedian.... yada yada yada

look at the list again and tell me what u think...yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: thanks for the laughs!

jrivera
06-01-2009, 10:59 PM
NOUN:
pl. elite or e·lites

1.A group or class of persons or a member of such a group or class, enjoying superior intellectual, social, or economic status: "In addition to notions of social equality there was much emphasis on the role of elites and of heroes within them" (Times Literary Supplement).
The best or most skilled members of a group: the football team's elite.
2.A size of type on a typewriter, equal to 12 characters per linear inch.

IF KP is a typewriter thats the only way KP is Elite..

dee279
06-01-2009, 11:02 PM
He is not elite by any means but a good defender.

lakersrock
06-01-2009, 11:57 PM
Somebody asked for five better post defenders.

Dwight
Shaq
Yao
KG
Duncan
Kurt Thomas
Rasheed Wallace
Bynum (Argue all you want, but look at the kind of impact he made in Game 6. He's not as good at man defense, but in terms of making the team defense better, I'd rather have Bynum. He's more of a defender like Dwight while Perkins is more like Ben Wallace used to be.)

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 09:20 AM
Somebody asked for five better post defenders.

Dwight
Shaq
Yao
KG
Duncan
Kurt Thomas
Rasheed Wallace
Bynum (Argue all you want, but look at the kind of impact he made in Game 6. He's not as good at man defense, but in terms of making the team defense better, I'd rather have Bynum. He's more of a defender like Dwight while Perkins is more like Ben Wallace used to be.)

Dwight - Yes.
Shaq - not any more
Yao - not nearly as physical as Perkins. and been dunked over by people Perkins wouldnt allow to score.
KG - NOT A CENTER
Duncan - NOT A CENTER
Kurt Thomas - is this a joke?
Sheed - NOT A CENTER
BYNUM - are u shittin me? u know what? u believe that and when Dwight is ripping by him to the basket, ill show u dwight's stats vs Boston.

NO ONE is saying Perkins is an elite PLAYER, ONLY DEFENSIVE CENTER.

BeantownBill
06-02-2009, 10:14 AM
if a 100 is an elite defender (KG ect, Ben Wallace in his prime, D howard)... Kendick is around a 27

The Bulls and Celts played a great series, and the Bulls came up short. Let it go, bro. Saying Perkins is in the bottom 3rd in the league as a defender is borderline ********. I don't consider him elite, but he is good and getting better. How much better he can be remains to be seen, I'd like to see him commit fewer fouls and stay out of foul trouble.

lakersrock
06-02-2009, 10:49 AM
Dwight - Yes.
Shaq - not any more
Yao - not nearly as physical as Perkins. and been dunked over by people Perkins wouldnt allow to score.
KG - NOT A CENTER
Duncan - NOT A CENTER
Kurt Thomas - is this a joke?
Sheed - NOT A CENTER
BYNUM - are u shittin me? u know what? u believe that and when Dwight is ripping by him to the basket, ill show u dwight's stats vs Boston.

NO ONE is saying Perkins is an elite PLAYER, ONLY DEFENSIVE CENTER.

Howard - Yep.
Shaq - When he bodies up someone, they don't go anywhere.
Yao - He still is a better defender. He does better against DH than Perkins.
KG - Plays C and has played C during every year he's played.
Duncan - Plays C and has played C during almost every year he's played.
Sheed - Played C almost all year in 08-09. Plays C all the time in other years.
Bynum - If you didn't hear me, I said Perkins is better in man, but Bynum makes the entire team defense better. Perkins is just a bully that pushes guys around, but he's really not that good rotating and patrolling the lane. Bynum isn't as good as pushing guys around, but he does do a good job of rotating and patrolling the lane. To me, I'd rather have the guy in the middle ready to block shots. There are a bunch of tough guys you can get to body up guys. Heck, Chuck Hayes did it brilliantly at times against Pau. Make sure you read this if you reply to it. It's the second time I've had to say the same thing.

op12
06-02-2009, 11:20 AM
for their careers bynum avg 1.4 blocks and perk 1.3 blocks. hardly a good point to say you would rather have someone patrolling the lane to block shots. obviously they both do it. and you already said perk is better at man, so i think this stat doesnt help your arguement that bynum is better at zone. he is not.

IndyRealist
06-02-2009, 11:39 AM
Dwight - Yes.
Shaq - not any more
Yao - not nearly as physical as Perkins. and been dunked over by people Perkins wouldnt allow to score.
KG - NOT A CENTER
Duncan - NOT A CENTER
Kurt Thomas - is this a joke?
Sheed - NOT A CENTER
BYNUM - are u shittin me? u know what? u believe that and when Dwight is ripping by him to the basket, ill show u dwight's stats vs Boston.

NO ONE is saying Perkins is an elite PLAYER, ONLY DEFENSIVE CENTER.

So what you're saying is, there aren't many true centers in the NBA, so Perkins qualifies as an elite defensive center because there's only like 5 centers in the league? Again, like the wing player argument, if you're inserted at center you're a center. Rasheed Wallace is a center, he played center all year. KG's played center, and so has Duncan.

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 11:52 AM
Howard - Yep.
Shaq - When he bodies up someone, they don't go anywhere.
Yao - He still is a better defender. He does better against DH than Perkins.
KG - Plays C and has played C during every year he's played.
Duncan - Plays C and has played C during almost every year he's played.
Sheed - Played C almost all year in 08-09. Plays C all the time in other years.
Bynum - If you didn't hear me, I said Perkins is better in man, but Bynum makes the entire team defense better. Perkins is just a bully that pushes guys around, but he's really not that good rotating and patrolling the lane. Bynum isn't as good as pushing guys around, but he does do a good job of rotating and patrolling the lane. To me, I'd rather have the guy in the middle ready to block shots. There are a bunch of tough guys you can get to body up guys. Heck, Chuck Hayes did it brilliantly at times against Pau. Make sure you read this if you reply to it. It's the second time I've had to say the same thing.

ok so first off, forget yao and shaq bc we clearly disagree there.

so your telling me that in BOSTON, KG AND PERK both play center. well thats great. except we sorta need a PF.

and so Duncan and David Robinson were both Centers at the same time too.

and so Rasheed plays Center with Brown/Maxiel/McDyess playing center as well. not to mention BIG BEN was his Center.

man teams play 1 CENTER at a time.

and now that brings me to Bynum is the greatest thing ever. The way Lakers fans overrate EVERYTHING Bynum does is unbelievable. U make it sound like Bynum is a defensive captain or something.

So Perkins doesnt block shots? Perkins averaged 2.64 blocks per game in the playoffs, which puts him 2nd behind ty thomas. and 1.97 blocks per game in the regular season.

Bynum is averaing 1 block per game in the playoffs. A stellar 19th in the playoffs. http://www.nba.com/statistics/player/Blocks.jsp?league=00&season=42008&conf=OVERALL&position=0&splitType=9&splitScope=GAME&qualified=N&yearsExp=-1&splitDD=

Bynum averaged 1.8 blocks per game in the regular season. which is close to Perk, but NOT BETTER.

Super.
06-02-2009, 11:54 AM
anyone who thinks Pau is better defensively than Perk, needs to lay off the pipe. big time.

KP elite? naww i dont think so, but getting there? yea i would say that

dude fouls too much though

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 11:58 AM
So what you're saying is, there aren't many true centers in the NBA, so Perkins qualifies as an elite defensive center because there's only like 5 centers in the league? Again, like the wing player argument, if you're inserted at center you're a center. Rasheed Wallace is a center, he played center all year. KG's played center, and so has Duncan.

I didnt say he was elite. He is a lot better than people give him credit for is all Im saying.

Elite means Big Ben in his prime. Perk isnt there. But he is by default the 2nd best Center at DEFENSE right now. thats all.

there just isnt many true centers.

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 12:00 PM
I dont know whats hard to understand about KG is NOT BOSTON"S CENTER.

lakersrock
06-02-2009, 12:08 PM
I didnt say he was elite. He is a lot better than people give him credit for is all Im saying.

Elite means Big Ben in his prime. Perk isnt there. But he is by default the 2nd best Center at DEFENSE right now. thats all.

there just isnt many true centers.

Bynum is a true C and is better. If you think great defense = blocks, you would think AI is a great defender because he gets a ton of steals. What Bynum does doesn't equal a ton of blocks. He is in the lane and when the guys know it'll get blocked, they just pass the ball. That's why he is better. People will run right at Perkins without great position. They don't with Bynum because he's so big and has really long arms. If a wing guy gets past their guy running at Bynum with him ready to block, the defender that messed up can just cover the guys outside. Now his options are try going over Bynum or kick it out. Either way, we're in position to defend. We did it all game long in Game 6. If he keeps it up in the Finals, the outside shooting of Orlando will be taken away.....just like with Denver. That's why Bynum is better. He makes the entire team defense better.

EX-TREME
06-02-2009, 12:19 PM
not there yet but close

kbrill21
06-02-2009, 12:28 PM
Elite, no, but very very good.

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 12:32 PM
Bynum is a true C and is better. If you think great defense = blocks, you would think AI is a great defender because he gets a ton of steals. What Bynum does doesn't equal a ton of blocks. He is in the lane and when the guys know it'll get blocked, they just pass the ball. That's why he is better. People will run right at Perkins without great position. They don't with Bynum because he's so big and has really long arms. If a wing guy gets past their guy running at Bynum with him ready to block, the defender that messed up can just cover the guys outside. Now his options are try going over Bynum or kick it out. Either way, we're in position to defend. We did it all game long in Game 6. If he keeps it up in the Finals, the outside shooting of Orlando will be taken away.....just like with Denver. That's why Bynum is better. He makes the entire team defense better.

haha I didnt say that. u implied it by bringing up "id rather have a shotblocker..."

So Perkins is better at bodying up and Shotblocking, but Bynum is a better defender? just stop it

Il agree that Bynum allows his team to play their normal positions, but thats every starting center's job.

J-Relo
06-02-2009, 12:33 PM
not a elite defender, but not bad, he ash improved

IndyRealist
06-02-2009, 12:38 PM
I didnt say he was elite. He is a lot better than people give him credit for is all Im saying.

Elite means Big Ben in his prime. Perk isnt there. But he is by default the 2nd best Center at DEFENSE right now. thats all.

there just isnt many true centers.

Ok, that's what I thought you were saying. If you're talking about true centers and not PF/C then yeah, Perkins is probably the #2 or #3 defensive center in the league right now (we'll end up debating about Shaq all day).

But players like Duncan are PF/C's, they play C for their team at some point in time during the game. That qualifies them as C's, and if they do, then Perkins is much further down on the totem pole.

ManRam
06-02-2009, 12:39 PM
If he didn't guard Dwight as well as he did, the Celtics would have been swept. He never needed help guarding Dwight. They rarely had to double team him. He frustrated Dwight so much that he forced him to call out his coach for no reason whatsoever. The Magic never gave the ball to Dwight in the 4th because he wasn't really able to score on Perk.

In that series, he looked upper echelon. He's not elite, but he is top 10, probably top 5.

lakersrock
06-02-2009, 01:26 PM
KG and Duncan and Rasheed, etc. are C. Rasheed played C all the time this year, Duncan played C a TON last year and KG plays C when Perkins isn't on the floor and the guy coming in isn't good enough on defense. Plus, KG played C in Minny too. Just because he isn't there all the time doesn't mean he's not.

Chronz
06-02-2009, 01:40 PM
Duncan was in fact a Center this year, and this was the year he took the most jumpshots.

bostncelts34
06-02-2009, 02:06 PM
yao, shaq, dwight, nene, pau, camby, haywood, amare, brad miller, ben wallace, tyson chandler, dalembert, pryzbilla, magloire, bogut(when he wants to), dampier, ETAN THOMAS....

Wow..thats a horrible post. Brad Miller? Magloire? Camby,Shaq,wallace, are all well past there defensive PRIME. I would take Perkins defensively over any of these guys other then Dwight.

As for the question, i wouldn't quite consider him elite yet. But he is a great, great individual and team defender. He should have made the ALL defensive team by now IMO. I don't see him getting DPOY any time soon, hes just a very, very solid defender. ALot of you are also forgetting, that he is only 23 or 24 years old. He is extremely young and has alot of time to learn and get even better.

BTownTeamsRKing
06-02-2009, 05:29 PM
If he didn't guard Dwight as well as he did, the Celtics would have been swept. He never needed help guarding Dwight. They rarely had to double team him. He frustrated Dwight so much that he forced him to call out his coach for no reason whatsoever. The Magic never gave the ball to Dwight in the 4th because he wasn't really able to score on Perk.

In that series, he looked upper echelon. He's not elite, but he is top 10, probably top 5.

bingo.

dee279
06-02-2009, 05:50 PM
Shaq is really not all that defensive at the center position. Guards take it at him alot.

dee279
06-02-2009, 05:54 PM
Dwight does not do very well against the houston rockets. Does that mean Yao is a great defender? NO! The houston rockets have great team defense. Yaos height really does him good the the D end though.

Chronz
06-02-2009, 06:20 PM
Whats wrong with Yao's defense? It amazes me how opinions vary so widely on Yao's games.

GspLAL
06-02-2009, 08:10 PM
No he's not elite, but I believe he can be if he wants to, he's strong and a presence and his defense right now is good.

ewing
06-02-2009, 08:57 PM
He really did an outstanding job against Dwight Howard in a series in which everyone expected Howard to demolish Boston and has developed into one of the best shot blockers and most consistent post defenders in the league.

My question is has Perkins now solidified himself as an elite defensive player in the NBA? Does anyone see him challenging for a DPOY award in the future, or at least making an All-Defensive team?

yeah i think he has. I also think if you have the muscle to push howard out from below he becomes a much much easier cover. Still there aren't many guys that can do that plus Perk in an real good shot blocker, post defender, and demands alot of space in that paint. I don't think he is a DPOY guy or a first teamer but he's real good

ewing
06-02-2009, 09:17 PM
Somebody asked for five better post defenders.

Dwight
Shaq
Yao
KG
Duncan
Kurt Thomas
Rasheed Wallace
Bynum (Argue all you want, but look at the kind of impact he made in Game 6. He's not as good at man defense, but in terms of making the team defense better, I'd rather have Bynum. He's more of a defender like Dwight while Perkins is more like Ben Wallace used to be.)



Even if those guys are better post defenders not all of them are better defenders from the 5 spot. This guy was wrong in saying that Perk was the second best defensive center b/c weather people like it or not guys play multiple spot in game and cross match often. Thats said I'll agree with you on these guys being better over all at defending from the 5:

Dwight- he's a force

KG- he doesn't take up space like Perk but is a heck of post defender who can switch out to anyone from the 5 spot.

Duncan- he denfends the post as good as anyone, is always smart in the pick and roll, and is a presence in the paint

Wallace- other then KG the verstile of defenders on this list, maybe the best post defender, and he protects the hole (when he feels like it)


I'm 50/50 with Yao b/c while he is such a presence in the paint and he plays well in the post he is also asking for you to force him into help sitautions on the perimter where he has to run and try to recover.

I completely disagree with

KT- I love KT but its not 1998

Shaq- he might be the worst pick and roll defender in the league and cant get back to defend on the break

Bynum- I understand your reason but think your being a bit of a Homer. You cant call a guy an elite defender when he has only been a consistent contributer for a couple months in his NBA career and those couple of months happened over a year ago

lakersrock
06-02-2009, 09:32 PM
Bynum- I understand your reason but think your being a bit of a Homer. You cant call a guy an elite defender when he has only been a consistent contributer for a couple months in his NBA career and those couple of months happened over a year ago

I didn't call him elite. I said he was better than Perkins at patrolling the lane. I also said Perkins was better in man. Overall, I'd rather have someone patrolling the lane.

slipcid
06-02-2009, 09:38 PM
elite? N-O!

ManRam
06-02-2009, 09:39 PM
I didn't call him elite. I said he was better than Perkins at patrolling the lane. I also said Perkins was better in man. Overall, I'd rather have someone patrolling the lane.

Verse Howard, in this series, you'll want a great man-man defender, not someone patrolling. If you can single team Howard, your chances of winning are a lot higher. Once you have to double him, you're in trouble. Perk did a great job, and kept Boston in a lot of games Orlando could have run away with. The fact that they never had to double Dwight was the sole reason that series went 7.

The Panch
06-02-2009, 09:46 PM
He's a good defender, but not great, or even close to elite, there are at least 5 to 10 C or PF I would say are better than him.

ElGuapoIsKing
06-02-2009, 10:03 PM
I wouldnt go as far as saying he's an elite defender but i was really surprised how he stepped it up against Howard and i think he D is really under-rated. Next year i think hes gonna bring it all season and step up his offensive game.

ElGuapoIsKing
06-02-2009, 10:04 PM
I wouldnt go as far as saying he's an elite defender but i was really surprised how he stepped it up against Howard and i think he D is really under-rated. Next year i think he's gonna bring it all season and step up his offensive game.

Chronz
06-02-2009, 10:05 PM
Perkins didnt step it up against Howard, thats how he plays every Center.

dawkinit
06-02-2009, 10:08 PM
i consider an elite defensive player to be in the top 5 or 10 in the league. i think KP is in the top 10 for his position. so no not even close to elite.

UK Ivy
06-02-2009, 10:11 PM
no

xmoney328
06-02-2009, 10:12 PM
i think he's a better post defender than he is a shot blocker at this point!...the lack of a elite centers make him look much better!....not yet elite!

lakersrock
06-02-2009, 10:38 PM
Verse Howard, in this series, you'll want a great man-man defender, not someone patrolling. If you can single team Howard, your chances of winning are a lot higher. Once you have to double him, you're in trouble. Perk did a great job, and kept Boston in a lot of games Orlando could have run away with. The fact that they never had to double Dwight was the sole reason that series went 7.

Against Dwight? Yes.

Against the entire NBA? Nope.

I'm just saying overall, a guy patrolling the lane is more my thing. Also, I think Odom and Gasol will be in a lot during the Finals and it will result in Howard getting a lot of fouls.

MSG34
06-02-2009, 10:46 PM
I don't think you can measure his post defense by how he matched up against Dwight Howard. Howard has even admitted he needs a ton of work in the post. I'd say Perkin's is a solid defender but I wouldn't put him up with the NBA's best quite yet.

Angel
06-02-2009, 11:08 PM
Bynum is a true C and is better. If you think great defense = blocks, you would think AI is a great defender because he gets a ton of steals. What Bynum does doesn't equal a ton of blocks. He is in the lane and when the guys know it'll get blocked, they just pass the ball. That's why he is better. People will run right at Perkins without great position. They don't with Bynum because he's so big and has really long arms. If a wing guy gets past their guy running at Bynum with him ready to block, the defender that messed up can just cover the guys outside. Now his options are try going over Bynum or kick it out. Either way, we're in position to defend. We did it all game long in Game 6. If he keeps it up in the Finals, the outside shooting of Orlando will be taken away.....just like with Denver. That's why Bynum is better. He makes the entire team defense better.


Bynum is not even close to being a better defender than Perkins. Watch what Dwight Howard does to Bynum in the finals. Perkins handles Howard better than any center in basketball. George Karl said Kendrick Perkins should be 1st defensive team every year. I don't agree with that but he is definitely a way better defender than Bynum man to man or at team defense. Bynum can't even get on the court. Perkins is the better player. Bynum has been non existent in the playoffs. He's been non existent his entire career except for that decent half a season last year. Not a great half a season. Decent.

Angel
06-02-2009, 11:11 PM
Against Dwight? Yes.

Against the entire NBA? Nope.
I'm just saying overall, a guy patrolling the lane is more my thing. Also, I think Odom and Gasol will be in a lot during the Finals and it will result in Howard getting a lot of fouls.

He plays the same way against every center. He locked Yao Ming and Tim Duncan down a few times too. You don't have a clue what your talking about.

CELTICS4LYFE
06-03-2009, 12:20 PM
i dunno if i would say elite yet but he is on his way, i remember when he couldnt stay on the floor more than a min w/o getn a foul called

kbrill21
06-03-2009, 01:08 PM
NO center in the NBA can be considered an Elite defender. When you talk elite, you mean a guy like Hakeen Olajuwon. He was elite.

Kyle916
06-03-2009, 04:08 PM
He's not "elite".

He has good size and length (he won't be bullied in post defense). He clogs the lane. Solid defender, but nowhere near elite.