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JordansBulls
05-14-2009, 03:01 PM
Charles Barkley on TNT yesterday said that Home Court Advantage in the playoffs is overrated. Do you Agree/Disagree with that statement?


I totally disagree. How the hell could HCA be overrated? HCA gives you a much greater chance to win a series than not having it.

Chronz
05-14-2009, 03:08 PM
Because it doesnt give you a much greater chance of anything, HC doesnt matter once your at this stage, if you cant win on the road your not winning a damn thing.

Sure youd rather be at home, but I think they were talking about in terms of how it alters a series among 2 great teams, it doesnt. The better team will win regardless of HC or with it, but never because of it.

Trouble87
05-14-2009, 03:14 PM
If the level of talent is high enough the HCA isn't that important...

I agree with Charles

Joshtd1
05-14-2009, 03:16 PM
Have to agree. Its nice to have because of all the support with the fans and everything, but if you are the better team, it shouldnt really matter a whole lot.

Ethix11
05-14-2009, 03:22 PM
No it shouldnt matter. If you cant win on the road, you dont deserve the championship. Remember how good the road warriors were...theres no excuse.

Squad13
05-14-2009, 03:24 PM
It doesn't mean that much, its rare games go 7. That being said Barkely is there for comic relief, the guy can barely put entire sentences together.

ManRam
05-14-2009, 03:35 PM
Overrated...maybe. Insignificant? No.

In the playoffs it shouldn't matter...but it still does. It's a fact, every team plays better at home. No team in the regular season has a better record on the road than at home.

The 6 remaining teams

Houston's record in the playoffs: 4-1 at home, 2-4 on the road
Lakers' record in the playoffs: 5-1 at home, 2-2 on the road
Boston's record in the playoffs: 5-2 at home, 2-3 on the road
Denver's record in the playoffs: 6-0 at home, 2-2 on the road
Cleveland record in the playoffs: 4-0 at home, 4-0 on the road
Orlando's record in the playoffs: 3-2 at home, 3-3 on the road

Combined: 27-6 at home, 15-14 on the road

It's obvious that it matters.

JordansBulls
05-14-2009, 03:58 PM
Because it doesnt give you a much greater chance of anything, HC doesnt matter once your at this stage, if you cant win on the road your not winning a damn thing.

Sure youd rather be at home, but I think they were talking about in terms of how it alters a series among 2 great teams, it doesnt. The better team will win regardless of HC or with it, but never because of it.

Since 1980 how many champions ended up winning a title the first time without HCA? Only teams I can think of were the 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat and neither of them ended up winning again. Teams recognize the importance of getting the HCA.

When you are champion the HCA might not be as important to you, but if you have never won a title before with a select group of players, the HCA is vital.


Check a star players success in series where they have HCA vs in series when they don't and you will see a huge difference.

Chronz
05-14-2009, 04:02 PM
Good point to man4, it does play a role

Chronz
05-14-2009, 04:04 PM
Since 1980 how many champions ended up winning a title the first time without HCA? Only teams I can think of were the 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat and neither of them ended up winning again. Teams recognize the importance of getting the HCA.
Correlation doesnt equal causation. The best teams tend to have HCA in the first place


When you are champion the HCA might not be as important to you, but if you have never won a title before with a select group of players, the HCA is vital.

Seems logical, still not that alarming


Check a star players success in series where they have HCA vs in series when they don't and you will see a huge difference.

Check the supporting cast of that player, you'll find that the biggest difference and most telling aspect of winning and losing resides in his support.

Hawkize31
05-14-2009, 04:19 PM
Overrated...maybe. Insignificant? No.

In the playoffs it shouldn't matter...but it still does. It's a fact, every team plays better at home. No team in the regular season has a better record on the road than at home.

The 6 remaining teams

Houston's record in the playoffs: 4-1 at home, 2-4 on the road
Lakers' record in the playoffs: 5-1 at home, 2-2 on the road
Boston's record in the playoffs: 5-2 at home, 2-3 on the road
Denver's record in the playoffs: 6-0 at home, 2-2 on the road
Cleveland record in the playoffs: 4-0 at home, 4-0 on the road
Orlando's record in the playoffs: 3-2 at home, 3-3 on the road

Combined: 27-6 at home, 15-14 on the road

It's obvious that it matters.

Excellent post. /thread imo

And to add to that, of those 6 teams, 1 has a winning record on the road. All 6 have a winning record at home. Its pretty clear that having an extra game at home for a team with HCA is very helpful.

LAKERMANIA
05-14-2009, 04:21 PM
I dont agree in the regular playoffs.

I agree when it comes to the NBA finals. If you are not the team who has HCA you can find yourselves up 3-2 if you just win your 3 consecutive home games

Kevj77
05-14-2009, 04:23 PM
Check the supporting cast of that player, you'll find that the biggest difference and most telling aspect of winning and losing resides in his support.This sounds right. Phil Jackson said something after one of the losses in Houston about how its usually the supporting players that struggle on the road.

The best teams should win on the road, but then they usually have HCA to begin with. It really isn't that important IMO unless it comes down to a game 7.

pd7631
05-14-2009, 04:23 PM
I think it definitely matters. Just look at last year, the Celtics went 7 games with the Hawks and didn't win once on the road. I think they still would've won the series had game 7 been in Atlanta instead of Boston, but it wouldn't have been nearly as easy.

Kakaroach
05-14-2009, 04:25 PM
Its not important in any other sport, but fan involvement in basketball is huge. HCA is not over=rated, not by a long shot. Gotta disgagree with Sir Charles on this one.

championships
05-14-2009, 04:29 PM
It could be huge. Go ask the Celtics how important it was last year.

Knowledge
05-14-2009, 04:45 PM
Since 1980 how many champions ended up winning a title the first time without HCA? Only teams I can think of were the 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat and neither of them ended up winning again. Teams recognize the importance of getting the HCA.

When you are champion the HCA might not be as important to you, but if you have never won a title before with a select group of players, the HCA is vital.


Check a star players success in series where they have HCA vs in series when they don't and you will see a huge difference.

If you are the better team than it doesnt matter where you play, but I would guess usually the best/better teams always have HCA.

what54!?
05-14-2009, 04:47 PM
no most teams play better at home. That includes the playoffs.

JordansBulls
05-14-2009, 04:52 PM
Correlation doesnt equal causation. The best teams tend to have HCA in the first place


Seems logical, still not that alarming


Check the supporting cast of that player, you'll find that the biggest difference and most telling aspect of winning and losing resides in his support.

Which shows why HCA is important.

It means you should be the better team.

TragicallyHip
05-14-2009, 05:11 PM
Barkley also said that the Celtics didn't stand a chance against the Magic.

Chronz
05-14-2009, 05:25 PM
Which shows why HCA is important.

It means you should be the better team.

Thats not what Charles was saying, if your the better team you'll win because your the better team, whether you have HCA or not.

Chronz
05-14-2009, 05:28 PM
If you are the better team than it doesnt matter where you play, but I would guess usually the best/better teams always have HCA.

Yes indeed, Im sure if you look back on the history of the league there have been several exceptions but really lets hypothesize, say MJ had gotten injured the year they won 72 games, say they only win enough games to qualify 2nd in the League. Would you count against MJ and the exact same 72win caliber team, just because they didnt have HCA? Thats what it boils down to, the best team wins period. HCA or not

azkarraga
05-14-2009, 05:35 PM
it aint. just take a look at the stats. for sure, you gotta win on the road to do to the next round, but that doesn't mean HCA aint worthy.

SteveNash
05-14-2009, 05:35 PM
Since 1980 how many champions ended up winning a title the first time without HCA? Only teams I can think of were the 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat and neither of them ended up winning again. Teams recognize the importance of getting the HCA.

When you are champion the HCA might not be as important to you, but if you have never won a title before with a select group of players, the HCA is vital.

Check a star players success in series where they have HCA vs in series when they don't and you will see a huge difference.

Since 1980, how many champions have won a title WITHOUT winning a game on the road during the finals?

0.

Draco
05-14-2009, 05:39 PM
Yes indeed, Im sure if you look back on the history of the league there have been several exceptions but really lets hypothesize, say MJ had gotten injured the year they won 72 games, say they only win enough games to qualify 2nd in the League. Would you count against MJ and the exact same 72win caliber team, just because they didnt have HCA? Thats what it boils down to, the best team wins period. HCA or not

With regards to the Bull's I think the importance of HCA (which Phil always talked about) was to help offset the pressure of winning year after year. Not many teams are in that position.

superkegger
05-14-2009, 05:58 PM
I think it is overrated. Not unimportant, but overrated.

Missing56&33
05-14-2009, 06:14 PM
im not a CB fan but ive found myself agreeing with him lately. He talks a little bit more reasonable since hes been back. I agree with him HCA is over rated, if the visiting team wants it more they can win anywhere, look at Boston vs Orlando, Boston took HC and will wrap up the series tonight on the road.

Lakersfan2483
05-14-2009, 06:16 PM
Charles Barkley on TNT yesterday said that Home Court Advantage in the playoffs is overrated. Do you Agree/Disagree with that statement?


I totally disagree. How the hell could HCA be overrated? HCA gives you a much greater chance to win a series than not having it.

I definitely agree with you on this one, homecourt advantage is huge in the playoffs, obviously it's important to win on the road, but having homecourt in a 7 game series is an advantage. Barkely is generally wrong in everything he has to say, he's on the show strictly for entertainment purposes.

Wake's Fastball
05-14-2009, 06:42 PM
I don't think so. I don't know about other teams, but certainly the Celtics (specifically Eddie House) feed off of it. Watching game 5 made it absurdly evident. Howard's monster putback got no feedback from the crowd, and at home, I think the momentum from Pietrus' alley-oop in the fourth quarter, as well as Turkoglu's 3 point play would've been a dagger if they'd had the crowd on their side. Instead it didn't even register.

ramz.n
05-14-2009, 06:44 PM
i agre that HC is overrated..if ur a good team thats condifent..it shouldn't matter...the only thing that home court provides is the happy fans when the home team wins..thats about it.

JordansBulls
05-14-2009, 07:51 PM
Since 1980, how many champions have won a title WITHOUT winning a game on the road during the finals?

0.

Which shows how important HCA is. Meaning you will probably lose a game at home so you need to be good enough to win a road game.
However if you don't have HCA now you have to win 2 games on the road in the Finals or any series if you drop one at home.

ALLTIME HOME and ROAD RECORDS in the Playoffs (http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=339046&highlight=ROAD)

JordansBulls
05-15-2009, 12:44 AM
We will see how good HCA is on Sunday in those game 7's.

tr4shb0t
05-15-2009, 01:24 AM
yes it is overrated, because it depends on the refs. ask lebron

JordansBulls
05-15-2009, 11:30 AM
Here is a list of title teams to Win without HCA:



06 Heat*
04 Pistons*
98 Bulls
95 Rockets*
93 Bulls*
85 Lakers
82 Lakers
79 Sonics
78 Bullets* (won in game 7)
77 Trailblazers*
75 Bullets*
74 Celtics (won in game 7)
73 Knicks*(won ECF in game 7)
69 Celtics* (game 7)
58 Hawks

* Won their conference without HCA


So 15 teams out of last 50 years.

mitch91
05-15-2009, 11:38 AM
i didnt vote and iv reasons. it seems to me that this year hca has became less irelevent as we've seen many teams go win on the opposing teams court so this year it seems maybe its been abit overated as before the playoffs even begun people were saying that theres no chance the cavs get beat as they have hca, so yes theis year maybe its been overated.

however if you look at past stats hca has been sooooo important so in that case i didnt vote. over the long haul hca is important, i think it has been OVERRATED this season though it is still relevent

JordansBulls
05-15-2009, 12:19 PM
i didnt vote and iv reasons. it seems to me that this year hca has became less irelevent as we've seen many teams go win on the opposing teams court so this year it seems maybe its been abit overated as before the playoffs even begun people were saying that theres no chance the cavs get beat as they have hca, so yes theis year maybe its been overated.

however if you look at past stats hca has been sooooo important so in that case i didnt vote. over the long haul hca is important, i think it has been OVERRATED this season though it is still relevent

Well teams are going to win on the road that is a guarantee, however HCA is vital as well because if both teams take a road game than the team who originally had HCA has it still. The point is the team with HCA shouldn't lose and should be able to win on the road as well in case they drop a home game. The team with HCA is the better team, they just need to show it in the series.

SteveNash
05-15-2009, 12:38 PM
Which shows how important HCA is. Meaning you will probably lose a game at home so you need to be good enough to win a road game.
However if you don't have HCA now you have to win 2 games on the road in the Finals or any series if you drop one at home.

ALLTIME HOME and ROAD RECORDS in the Playoffs (http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=339046&highlight=ROAD)

In a 7 game series, the better team wins. Homecourt or no homecourt.

Usually the team with the better record is the better team.

BoSelecta!!!
05-15-2009, 01:32 PM
series like hou vs lal and bos vs orl, of course you want to play game 7 at your home court!

JordansBulls
05-18-2009, 12:08 PM
In a 7 game series, the better team wins. Homecourt or no homecourt.

Usually the team with the better record is the better team.

If the team with the worse record wins it is called an upset unless the team with the worse record is the defending champs, but even so, the team with HCA should win.

J-Relo
05-18-2009, 12:50 PM
if you are better - you win wherever you want

NYY 26 to 7
05-18-2009, 01:02 PM
this can be backed up with stats that homecourt advantage helps and just look at the last 2 years. It has been a huge factor. As someone else said though the best team usually wins a 7 game series and that team usually has hc - so it does make it tough to tell but I will bet if you ask many teams they will tell you it is better to play at home.

NYY 26 to 7
05-18-2009, 01:03 PM
There is a reason Vegas adjusts lines to the home team in all sports.

MelkyNYY
05-18-2009, 01:16 PM
im not a CB fan but ive found myself agreeing with him lately. He talks a little bit more reasonable since hes been back. I agree with him HCA is over rated, if the visiting team wants it more they can win anywhere, look at Boston vs Orlando, Boston took HC and will wrap up the series tonight on the road.

lol

JordansBulls
06-02-2009, 12:28 PM
Barkley says it is overrated because one of his teams lost in the finals with it. He also lost with it against the Rockets as well.


However let's consider the finals. Teams with HCA since the 2-3-2 format are 18-6. Only the 1985 Lakers, 1993 Bulls, 1995 Rockets, 1998 Bulls, 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat won series without HCA.

Edit: Forgot the 1985 Lakers won without HCA.

superkegger
06-02-2009, 02:35 PM
Barkley says it is overrated because one of his teams lost in the finals with it. He also lost with it against the Rockets as well.


However let's consider the finals. Teams with HCA since the 2-3-2 format are 18-6. Only the 1985 Lakers, 1993 Bulls, 1995 Rockets, 1998 Bulls, 2004 Pistons and 2006 Heat won series without HCA.

Edit: Forgot the 1985 Lakers won without HCA.

Thing is you're delving into a Pandora's box here though.

What I mean is, you can have HCA, but that doesn't make you the better team. I mean, even though the Suns had a great year in '93, I don't think they were the better team over that Bulls squad. Having a better regular season record does not automatically equate you to being the better team. Many times it may, but not necessarily. When it comes to the Finals, the better team will win. Some times, the better team also, unsurprisingly has HCA.

Besides the NBA is a game of matchups. If you matchup poorly vs. another team it could spell disaster. See 2007 Mavs vs Warriors.