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View Full Version : Where does Wades season rank now?



Chronz
05-03-2009, 05:29 PM
Any less historic?

VCaintdead17
05-03-2009, 05:33 PM
nahh.


IMO, most people expected him to get eliminated first round. The Heat put up a good fight, but just did not have enough fire power. He has stayed the same.

Draco
05-03-2009, 05:33 PM
How was Wade's season historic before the Heat's playoff run ended? With modren day guards history started in 2004/5 with the rule changes.

Chicagofaithful
05-03-2009, 05:40 PM
i dont get the point of this thread? He averaged 30 pts per game during the regular season... nothing more... nothing less.... even if he had beaten the Hawks.. he would have been crushed by the cavs... so how are we let down?

Hawkeye15
05-03-2009, 06:03 PM
his regular season was unreal. Miami was better than I thought they would be. I didn't think they would make the playoffs before the season started. The fact that he went out in the first round can not be surprising. Miami still has a lot to work on. Beasley and Chalmers are rookies. You can't expect them to be that great in the playoffs. They still have depth question marks. Give them 2 years, they should be fine.
And to answer the question, Wade's season was spectacular. He was the MVP of the league, but we all know it goes to a top 3 team, and LeBron had this thing won before the first tip off of the season, much like Kobe did last year.

Hawkeye15
05-03-2009, 06:04 PM
How was Wade's season historic before the Heat's playoff run ended? With modren day guards history started in 2004/5 with the rule changes.

excellent point. Guards numbers today will never translate with the past guards. You can't even breath on them anymore. A guy like MJ would have averaged 40 ppg now

superkegger
05-03-2009, 06:11 PM
it was a good season on a bad team. Nothing really all that historic other than the blocks.

DenButsu
05-03-2009, 06:27 PM
When people look back at how he carried his team, and remember the MVP race, and look at his numbers, it will be recognized as a fantastic season. But the problem is, without postseason success to ice it off, people won't do that as much as they would have otherwise, so it will probably end up as one of those overlooked accomplishments.

EastCoastBaller
05-03-2009, 06:39 PM
yawn.......

i.got.the.nutz
05-03-2009, 06:41 PM
^^ what he said. playoff success is what defines a players regular season when talking about all time rankings. too bad hes playing with a bunch of scrubs. i hope miami doesn't waste his prime with more supporting casts like he had this season.

dee279
05-03-2009, 07:12 PM
wade my ***** but he had alot of bad games and good games and i will say Lebron and Wade both are deserving of the MVP

ARMIN12NBA
05-03-2009, 07:30 PM
his regular season was unreal. Miami was better than I thought they would be. I didn't think they would make the playoffs before the season started. The fact that he went out in the first round can not be surprising. Miami still has a lot to work on. Beasley and Chalmers are rookies. You can't expect them to be that great in the playoffs. They still have depth question marks. Give them 2 years, they should be fine.
And to answer the question, Wade's season was spectacular. He was the MVP of the league, but we all know it goes to a top 3 team, and LeBron had this thing won before the first tip off of the season, much like Kobe did last year.

:eyebrow: If I'm not mistaken (and I'm not), the Lakers were expected to flounder last year. Everybody considered them barely a playoff squad and Kobe was possibly heading to Chicago. In fact, Kobe was #4 (behind Garnett, James, and Nash) in MVP predictions before the season. So yah...Kobe definitely did not have the MVP won before the season.

ProdigyI
05-03-2009, 08:22 PM
Just curious as to how Wade's season was historic :shrug:

Hawkeye15
05-03-2009, 08:28 PM
:eyebrow: If I'm not mistaken (and I'm not), the Lakers were expected to flounder last year. Everybody considered them barely a playoff squad and Kobe was possibly heading to Chicago. In fact, Kobe was #4 (behind Garnett, James, and Nash) in MVP predictions before the season. So yah...Kobe definitely did not have the MVP won before the season.

Flounder? haha. And whom rated Kobe this before the season, 4th? Who cares. He was a media darling to begin the year. The sentiment was, he was the best player in the world from 06-08', and he deserved an MVP. End of story. LeBron got similar treatment this year from the press

KB24PG16
05-03-2009, 08:32 PM
how was it historic in the first place this is just another reason why he shouldnt even be in mvp talks

durtee
05-03-2009, 08:36 PM
I definitely think that he deserves to be in the MVP talks and he had a great season, but I don't see anything "historic".

Lakersfan2483
05-03-2009, 08:39 PM
Any less historic?

Great individual year for Wade, his team definitely over-achieved during the regualr season. In terms of the postseason, I felt like Wade had a good series against Atlanta, but not a "memorable" series like he had against Dallas a few yrs back. Obviously, he doesn't have the same talent around him he had in yrs past, but I picked him to lead his team out of the first round.

*Wade's year would have been more historic if he somehow was able to get his team out of round 1 and put up a great showing against Cleveland.

Hawkalicious
05-03-2009, 09:04 PM
call me crazy, but after watching him for seven games in a row now, I'm more impressed with what he does defensively. Obviously that would be one historic feat he had this year, with something like being the first player at 6'4" or under with 100 blocks and steals in a season.

Offensively, he HAS to score, so I don't put so much merit into his point totals, but what he does on the defensive side is very impressive, especially with the minutes he logs.

superkegger
05-03-2009, 09:33 PM
there are other fans on this board including laker fans that appreciate what wade has accomplished this year....he had 2 rookies an took atlanta to 7 games.... even me who is a big fan of Wade acknowleges Kobe and never puts him down like that....Wade has every RIGHT to be in the MVP talk...he didnt have the help and firepower from his team but still doesnt discredit anything hes done this year after everyone said before the year started he would never come back and be the same

so that makes it historic....?

majestic
05-03-2009, 09:35 PM
hahahahahahahah @ dwade losing to the hawks.. i thought he was the next jordan?? i love how the only ship he wins is fixed and it was so obvious. if he was that goood. he wins this series in 4

GAME OVER.
nba is fixed.

Kakaroach
05-03-2009, 09:36 PM
Kinda like Kobe's season of a few years ago. Spectacular player on a horrible team. But his blocks were a stat that stands out to me a ton.

Bring The Heat
05-03-2009, 09:42 PM
so that makes it historic....?

umm dude do you honestly really love kobe that much? you talk **** about Wade not "getting it done" but your beloved Kobe Bryant got his *** handed to him in the finals last year and blew a 24 point lead in one of the games...so go ahead and talk crap about wade....he was in the same position KOBE was when he had a horrible team... Kobe was a great player but didnt have the right personnel...

and to the guy talking about Jordan....Jordan had a great team around him thats why he won championships and a great defensive one too...doesnt matter how good you are u cant beat a team by urself my friend and especially with 2 ROOKIES who have no playoff experience

superkegger
05-03-2009, 09:48 PM
umm dude do you honestly really love kobe that much? you talk **** about Wade not "getting it done" but your beloved Kobe Bryant got his *** handed to him in the finals last year and blew a 24 point lead in one of the games...so go ahead and talk crap about wade....he was in the same position KOBE was when he had a horrible team... Kobe was a great player but didnt have the right personnel...

and to the guy talking about Jordan....Jordan had a great team around him thats why he won championships and a great defensive one too...doesnt matter how good you are u cant beat a team by urself my friend and especially with 2 ROOKIES who have no playoff experience

:confused:

I'm not really sure what Kobe has to do with this. I never mentioned Kobe, at all.

I didn't say Wade didn't have a great season. He obviously did, and he's a fantastic player. I've said so many a time. Wade had a great individual season. But it's not a historic season. Other than his blocks, nothing about his season is historic. Which is what the question is about, and which you've still failed to answer why it was historic, just attacked Kobe for some reason. I guess when you don't have an argument, that's the best route to take, attack someone else and their team to change the subject. :shrug:

Bring The Heat
05-03-2009, 09:58 PM
:confused:

I'm not really sure what Kobe has to do with this. I never mentioned Kobe, at all.

I didn't say Wade didn't have a great season. He obviously did, and he's a fantastic player. I've said so many a time. Wade had a great individual season. But it's not a historic season. Other than his blocks, nothing about his season is historic. Which is what the question is about, and which you've still failed to answer why it was historic, just attacked Kobe for some reason. I guess when you don't have an argument, that's the best route to take, attack someone else and their team to change the subject. :shrug:

Historic in the sense that he led his team to the playoffs with a rookie point guard and a team that only won 15 games last season and was the leading scorer in the league and also ranked high in other statistics...historic in the sense that everybody thought he was done and injury prone and came back and proved hes still one of the best in the league....those are called "accomplishments" my friend...he proved something this year...maybe not a title but basically hey i'm still REALLY good...and when his team fully gels and we get better pieces u will probaly see another ring on his finger or another finals appearance...

I attacked Kobe because obviously your down talking the man because of the lost game today and saying hes not so good because of today which is completely unfair....u obviously wouldn't say those things about your favorite player kobe if he didnt win the title this year or didnt make it to the finals would you? of course not

marlinsfan24
05-03-2009, 10:00 PM
Historic in my mind cuz of the following stats. He led a 15 win team to the 5th seed. He led the league in scoring, with 30+. He was 2nd in steals, top in assists and blocks. He had some amazing game winners. He had a great all around season, and he proved to many that he didn't fade and die out. Also, his stats in the 2nd half of the season were sensational. He averaged somewhere around 35PPG and 10APG along with 3SPG and 1-2BPG.

Bring The Heat
05-03-2009, 10:10 PM
Historic in my mind cuz of the following stats. He led a 15 win team to the 5th seed. He led the league in scoring, with 30+. He was 2nd in steals, top in assists and blocks. He had some amazing game winners. He had a great all around season, and he proved to many that he didn't fade and die out. Also, his stats in the 2nd half of the season were sensational. He averaged somewhere around 35PPG and 10APG along with 3SPG and 1-2BPG.

Exactly

superkegger
05-03-2009, 10:12 PM
Historic in the sense that he led his team to the playoffs with a rookie point guard and a team that only won 15 games last season and was the leading scorer in the league and also ranked high in other statistics...historic in the sense that everybody thought he was done and injury prone and came back and proved hes still one of the best in the league....those are called "accomplishments" my friend...he proved something this year...maybe not a title but basically hey i'm still REALLY good...and when his team fully gels and we get better pieces u will probaly see another ring on his finger or another finals appearance...

I attacked Kobe because obviously your down talking the man because of the lost game today and saying hes not so good because of today which is completely unfair....u obviously wouldn't say those things about your favorite player kobe if he didnt win the title this year or didnt make it to the finals would you? of course not

Well then you need to reread what I said, because I never said anything bad about wade. He had a great individual season. I acknowledged that. But in terms of doing something historic, this season doesn't fit into a category of great historical accomplishments outside of Miami Heat history of his ridiculous block production. I mean in a sense everything is historic, but knowing Chronz, I assumed he was talking about was, now that we have the whole picture of Wade's season, what kind of historical context does it take on. In my mind, it's not all that historical. A great season, but many a players have had great seasons on mediocre teams. As you say, it's a team game, and what Wade did accomplish doesn't measure up to a lot of other great historical performances. Not even close.

pd7631
05-03-2009, 10:15 PM
Wade had a great season and all, but like every other non Heat fan(who still won't explain what was historic about his season) I'm confused about what he did that was so amazing.

Bring The Heat
05-03-2009, 10:17 PM
Well then you need to reread what I said, because I never said anything bad about wade. He had a great individual season. I acknowledged that. But in terms of doing something historic, this season doesn't fit into a category of great historical accomplishments outside of Miami Heat history of his ridiculous block production. I mean in a sense everything is historic, but knowing Chronz, I assumed he was talking about was, now that we have the whole picture of Wade's season, what kind of historical context does it take on. In my mind, it's not all that historical. A great season, but many a players have had great seasons on mediocre teams. As you say, it's a team game, and what Wade did accomplish doesn't measure up to a lot of other great historical performances. Not even close.

he's accomplished and proved a lot this me and the rest of the league this season and in my mind its historic....maybe not to you since your a laker fan its cool.

Kakaroach
05-03-2009, 10:19 PM
Wade had a great season and all, but like every other non Heat fan(who still won't explain what was historic about his season) I'm confused about what he did that was so amazing. Did you miss the part about all of the blocks? :rolleyes:

marlinsfan24
05-03-2009, 10:19 PM
It may or may not have been a historic season, I can't judge that. But it is one of the better seasons by an individual we'll see in our lifetimes.

superkegger
05-03-2009, 10:21 PM
he's accomplished and proved a lot this me and the rest of the league this season and in my mind its historic....maybe not to you since your a laker fan its cool.

Me being a Laker fan has absolutely nothing to do with it. Absolutely nothing.

still1ballin
05-03-2009, 10:22 PM
Wade proved me wrong. He exceeded my expectations.

GregOden#1
05-03-2009, 10:24 PM
He's had the best season by a perimeter player since Jordan in 1991, even better than Tmac in 02-03, losing in the first round doesn't change that. Winning is overrated when you compare individuals.

bogmon
05-03-2009, 10:42 PM
Just another great season in the long line of great seasons....

Wade solidified his place in history with the championship years ago....the rest is all just gravy....

The guy is great...no doubt....but in the end, the only thing people remember is who wins the ring....

Just ask Dirk

Bulls4Lyfe
05-03-2009, 10:45 PM
Me being a Laker fan has absolutely nothing to do with it. Absolutely nothing.

Right. How can anyone take you seriously on this topic when you post stuff like this:

Originally Posted by superkegger
"I just want to say to all of you, you were off, way off. Your Heat suck, Beasley was pathetic, and your confidence in Wade to carry a team no matter what is unfounded."

superkegger
05-03-2009, 10:53 PM
Right. How can anyone take you seriously on this topic when you post stuff like this:

Originally Posted by superkegger
"I just want to say to all of you, you were off, way off. Your Heat suck, Beasley was pathetic, and your confidence in Wade to carry a team no matter what is unfounded."

What exactly was off about what I said? Maybe the Heat don't suck, but they're not very good. But Beasley was not very good in the series, and when people were saying Wade could carry that team to victory in the playoffs, they were clearly wrong.

Hawkalicious
05-03-2009, 10:55 PM
please see: Hawks v Heat series thread

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 02:52 AM
Flounder? haha.

Yup. Every media member out there was calling for the end of Kobe's Lakers and a time to rebuild the franchise.


And whom rated Kobe this before the season, 4th? Who cares.

Media members who vote. Your theory about Lebron holds up because he was the pre-season #1 for everyone. Kobe was around #3-#5 in the pre-season rankings.


He was a media darling to begin the year.

Ummm...no. He was nowhere near a "darling." I'm not going to say most ripped him, but many did. Others felt sympathy, but he was not a darling by any means.


The sentiment was, he was the best player in the world from 06-08', and he deserved an MVP. End of story. LeBron got similar treatment this year from the press

Kobe was, by no means, handed the award before the season. People did not even know which team he would play for or even if his team would make the playoffs. Trust me. I was checking the updates daily (LOL...I remember being excited when I thought we could net Ben Gordan, Luol Deng, Noah, etc.).

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 02:54 AM
He's had the best season by a perimeter player since Jordan in 1991, even better than Tmac in 02-03, losing in the first round doesn't change that. Winning is overrated when you compare individuals.

Do you not consider Kobe Bryant or Lebron James perimeter players? :eyebrow:

GregOden#1
05-04-2009, 05:05 AM
Do you not consider Kobe Bryant or Lebron James perimeter players? :eyebrow:

I consider Lebron James a cross between a post/perimeter player, the same way you'd consider Charles Barkley one.

Yes, Kobe Bryant is a perimeter player and no he's never had a season as good as Wade's had this year.

Hawkeye15
05-04-2009, 08:10 AM
Yup. Every media member out there was calling for the end of Kobe's Lakers and a time to rebuild the franchise.



Media members who vote. Your theory about Lebron holds up because he was the pre-season #1 for everyone. Kobe was around #3-#5 in the pre-season rankings.



Ummm...no. He was nowhere near a "darling." I'm not going to say most ripped him, but many did. Others felt sympathy, but he was not a darling by any means.



Kobe was, by no means, handed the award before the season. People did not even know which team he would play for or even if his team would make the playoffs. Trust me. I was checking the updates daily (LOL...I remember being excited when I thought we could net Ben Gordan, Luol Deng, Noah, etc.).


well, local reporters, ie, media from around the nation, which you find on hoopshype, or espn pass, may have been critical. I am referring to the major sites. They never wavered on Kobe. NOt that I can remember. And while darling is a strong word, there was sentiment that Kobe deserved it over Nash, and was due. He was the favorite among most large media outlets, as well as GM's (which doesn't really matter), to win MVP. And the Lakers were not picked to miss the playoffs by anyone that I can remember. But you would know more on that subject than me, you follow the Lakers minute by minute, just like I follow the WOlves. THe only difference is, my season ends in mid March.

Hawkeye15
05-04-2009, 08:13 AM
Do you not consider Kobe Bryant or Lebron James perimeter players? :eyebrow:

on some statical levles, Wade may have had a better season. But team numbers do need to be factored, % of plays run thru, touches per posession, different rates, etc. It will typically show that a player with minimal help has monster numbers because they are being forced to due so.
ANd yes, LJ and Kobe are perimeter players. Anyone who shoots 4 bombs a game is a perimeter player, unless you are Okur, who may qualify as a perimeter player anyways

dandman1021
05-04-2009, 08:40 AM
To me Wade had a great season. But It wasn't historic. Some of the plays and games he did were historic, such as the 3 OT against the bulls and the comeback against the knicks. To Me Wade deserves to win MVP but i don't see it happening this year. Cav's are having just too good of a season. I hope he does win MVP but i really don't know. I hope possibly a co-MVP award between Wade and James. But back to the topic; was Wade's season historic?....no it wasn't. It was the best on a young team that will improve next season. Wade has definitely shut the critics up and has let everyone know that that he's back and better than ever.

Testaverde16
05-04-2009, 09:43 AM
still a great season... not a great team....

not really getting historic here at all...

albertc86
05-04-2009, 12:36 PM
Wade is still a beast. It's not his fault his team sucks.

king4day
05-04-2009, 12:42 PM
:eyebrow: If I'm not mistaken (and I'm not), the Lakers were expected to flounder last year. Everybody considered them barely a playoff squad and Kobe was possibly heading to Chicago. In fact, Kobe was #4 (behind Garnett, James, and Nash) in MVP predictions before the season. So yah...Kobe definitely did not have the MVP won before the season.

With respect, had they not acquired Pau, then Kobe probably doesn't win MVP. He made them so much better by adding another dimension that not even Bynum could add (primarily shooting, IQ, and experience)

J-Relo
05-04-2009, 12:43 PM
And to answer the question, Wade's season was spectacular. He was the MVP of the league, but we all know it goes to a top 3 team, and LeBron had this thing won before the first tip off of the season, much like Kobe did last year.

Wade's season was great for sure, but he was not the MVP... he was near it, but getting your team into top position is a part of being MVP.... he did a great job, just his team isn't that good + he has still a lot to improve (Kobe's example)

king4day
05-04-2009, 12:48 PM
Wade's season was great for sure, but he was not the MVP... he was near it, but getting your team into top position is a part of being MVP.... he did a great job, just his team isn't that good + he has still a lot to improve (Kobe's example)

I had Wade as 5th. Billups did more for his team in a tough conference. He turned a team in turmoil to solid defensive team.
Wade just stayed healthy and had an outstanding year. Some games like he had will get you wins when they should have been losses.

That said, I think it's only a matter of time before Wade gets his though.

jskeet23
05-04-2009, 12:56 PM
:confused:

I'm not really sure what Kobe has to do with this. I never mentioned Kobe, at all.

I didn't say Wade didn't have a great season. He obviously did, and he's a fantastic player. I've said so many a time. Wade had a great individual season. But it's not a historic season. Other than his blocks, nothing about his season is historic. Which is what the question is about, and which you've still failed to answer why it was historic, just attacked Kobe for some reason. I guess when you don't have an argument, that's the best route to take, attack someone else and their team to change the subject. :shrug:

hes 6,4 do you know how hard it is to do all that by yourself at 6,4

SlaterRaps
05-04-2009, 01:39 PM
LeBron had this thing won before the first tip off of the season, much like Kobe did last year.
i dont think either of them had it won before tip off. I did not see Kobe winning last season and i didnt know who would win this season although it seemed with the addition of Mo Williams he would be better

last stand
05-04-2009, 02:05 PM
I consider Lebron James a cross between a post/perimeter player, the same way you'd consider Charles Barkley one.

Yes, Kobe Bryant is a perimeter player and no he's never had a season as good as Wade's had this year.

yeah 35.4 ppg is nothing or 4 straight 50 point games something MJ never did

Wade fans love to put there guy on par with kobe and lebron

let me put it this way wade had a better team than kobe ever had post shaq pre-gasol and in the east still managed what 43 wins

kobe with

kwame
lamar
luke walton
kobe
smush parker (who couldn't even get minutes on the heat i might add)

won 46 games in the western conference and the was because kobe put up 35.4 ppg and carried that team

and then the next year he won 42 games with lamar odom missing 26 games, kwame missing a bunch and smush parker pouting and playing awful

don't even put wade in the same sentence as kobe or lebron he struggled to go .500 with

JO
moon
beasley
chalmers
haslem
cook

who by themselves are better than anything kobe had with him post shaq pre-gasol era

putting up big numbers while your team can't win means nothing at least kobes team was winning 46 games and then the next before lamar and kwame both got injured along with luke walton the lakers were 26-13 so they were way on track to hit 50 wins. kobe had to score 50 points to even keep the LA defenders i mean the LA lakers competitve.

and don't get me started on lebron with his lackluster teammates winning 60 games and a finals appearance 2 years ago

yeah wade had a great finals series 3 years ago that should never have happened with the ghost calls he got in game 3 which if the refs would have been competent the series would have been 3-0 and over

stats mean little to me if your team with talent struggles to win or else john salmons would be a superstar

69centers
05-04-2009, 02:18 PM
With respect, had they not acquired Pau, then Kobe probably doesn't win MVP. He made them so much better by adding another dimension that not even Bynum could add (primarily shooting, IQ, and experience)

I feel the same way, and the same about LeBron getting Mo Williams this year. Wade has produced all year without anybody behind him. No one in the NBA has been able to get so far with so little.

Chauncey has a real strong team, so I wouldn't even put his name in the mix. He was just as good in Detroit all those years, he hasn't done anything dramatically different other than straighten out and run a disarrayed team.

last stand
05-04-2009, 02:22 PM
I feel the same way, and the same about LeBron getting Mo Williams this year. Wade has produced all year without anybody behind him. No one in the NBA has been able to get so far with so little.

Chauncey has a real strong team, so I wouldn't even put his name in the mix. He was just as good in Detroit all those years, he hasn't done anything dramatically different other than straighten out and run a disarrayed team.

that is absolutely ridiculous

well then lets strip MJ of all his MVPs and larry bird you know what lets take Magics as well and kareems lets take Shaqs MVP as well

now we are penalizing people for having sidekicks

championships
05-04-2009, 02:37 PM
Every great player has to have a sidekick. Even the great MJ had Pippen. Lebron gets Mo and look what happens.

championships
05-04-2009, 02:41 PM
They should just rename the award to the BPOTBT award (Best Player on the Best Team) Thats what it is every year.

last stand
05-04-2009, 02:47 PM
thats what it should be lebron led his team to the best record in the NBA with the 2nd best stats therefore hes the MVP

this is a mirror image to last year kobe had the 2nd best record (boston first) with the 2nd best stats (lebron first)

this year lebrons team has the best record with the 2nd best stats only behind wade

kobe saw a slight drop-off and didn't have the best record

but wade shouldn't even be in the discussion

Hawkeye15
05-04-2009, 02:51 PM
thats what it should be lebron led his team to the best record in the NBA with the 2nd best stats therefore hes the MVP

this is a mirror image to last year kobe had the 2nd best record (boston first) with the 2nd best stats (lebron first)

this year lebrons team has the best record with the 2nd best stats only behind wade

kobe saw a slight drop-off and didn't have the best record

but wade shouldn't even be in the discussion

agreed, and what adds to the fact, is that if you don't play for a top 3 team, you really have no chance at it. So Wade fans will have to move on regarding this topic

marlinsfan24
05-04-2009, 02:57 PM
yeah 35.4 ppg is nothing or 4 straight 50 point games something MJ never did

Wade fans love to put there guy on par with kobe and lebron

let me put it this way wade had a better team than kobe ever had post shaq pre-gasol and in the east still managed what 43 wins

kobe with

kwame
lamar
luke walton
kobe
smush parker (who couldn't even get minutes on the heat i might add)

won 46 games in the western conference and the was because kobe put up 35.4 ppg and carried that team

and then the next year he won 42 games with lamar odom missing 26 games, kwame missing a bunch and smush parker pouting and playing awful

don't even put wade in the same sentence as kobe or lebron he struggled to go .500 with

JO
moon
beasley
chalmers
haslem
cook

who by themselves are better than anything kobe had with him post shaq pre-gasol era

putting up big numbers while your team can't win means nothing at least kobes team was winning 46 games and then the next before lamar and kwame both got injured along with luke walton the lakers were 26-13 so they were way on track to hit 50 wins. kobe had to score 50 points to even keep the LA defenders i mean the LA lakers competitve.

and don't get me started on lebron with his lackluster teammates winning 60 games and a finals appearance 2 years ago

yeah wade had a great finals series 3 years ago that should never have happened with the ghost calls he got in game 3 which if the refs would have been competent the series would have been 3-0 and over

stats mean little to me if your team with talent struggles to win or else john salmons would be a superstar


He didnt even have that team for half a season, your post is ignorant and stupid!

sixer04fan
05-04-2009, 03:09 PM
he led his team to a 5 seed in the east and lost in the first round to atlanta where they got embarrassed in game 7... if that's not historic i don't know what is!!!

last stand
05-04-2009, 03:18 PM
He didnt even have that team for half a season, your post is ignorant and stupid!

boohoo :cry:

chalmers 82 games
marion 42 games with miami(traded for JO and moon)
JO 27 games with miami (played in most of his games with the heat)
beasley 81 games
haslem 75 games
cook 75 games
moon 27 games (played in all games with the heat)

seems like he had those guys for more than half a season hmmm

Jonathan2323
05-04-2009, 03:19 PM
boohoo :cry:

chalmers 82 games
marion 42 games with miami
JO 27 games with miami (played in most of his games with the heat)
beasley 81 games
haslem 75 games
cook 75 games
moon 27 games

seems like he had those guys for more than half a season hmmm

Odom would have been the second best player on this team.

sep11ie
05-04-2009, 03:31 PM
Kinda, cause as of now, his season is HISTORY!

last stand
05-04-2009, 03:35 PM
Odom would have been the second best player on this team.

thats fine but if you want comparison

i'm sure you would agree chalmers is far and away anything smush parrker ever was

michael beasley is better than devean george, luke walton, and devin green put together

joel anthony is better than kwame and chris mihm

JO isn't far from odom because of his defense, offensively odom is far superior but defensively JO is a legit defensive anchor

this years heat team is much better than anything the lakers had in that point in time

yet kobe managed 46 wins yet finished 4th in MVP voting which is exactly where wade should finish

Hawkeye15
05-04-2009, 03:38 PM
boohoo :cry:

chalmers 82 games
marion 42 games with miami(traded for JO and moon)
JO 27 games with miami (played in most of his games with the heat)
beasley 81 games
haslem 75 games
cook 75 games
moon 27 games (played in all games with the heat)

seems like he had those guys for more than half a season hmmm

Odom is better than all the Heat's second options. Beasley and Chalmers were rookies, cant' expect consistency out of them. The Lakers had a slightly better cast around Kobe at that time, but the real difference is, this was the 2005-06' western conference. The Lakers may have had the same record, but they were far stronger than this year's Heat team. Put the Heat in that conference 3 years ago, and they are a 35 win team. Lakers from that year are a 50 win team out east this season.

charlsdq7
05-04-2009, 03:39 PM
he still at da top...got far with him bein da only good player

last stand
05-04-2009, 03:43 PM
Odom is better than all the Heat's second options. Beasley and Chalmers were rookies, cant' expect consistency out of them. The Lakers had a slightly better cast around Kobe at that time, but the real difference is, this was the 2005-06' western conference. The Lakers may have had the same record, but they were far stronger than this year's Heat team. Put the Heat in that conference 3 years ago, and they are a 35 win team. Lakers from that year are a 50 win team out east this season.

maybe we have a difference in opinion but c'mon

NO. PLAYER POS HT WT YRS DOB more...
18 Sasha Vujacic PG 6-7 193 1 3/8/84 buy jersey
8 Kobe Bryant SG 6-6 220 9 8/23/78 buy jersey
23 Von Wafer PG 6-5 210 R 7/21/85 buy jersey
1 William "Smush" Parker G 6-4 180 2 6/1/81 buy jersey
11 Devin Green G 6-7 210 R 10/25/82 buy jersey
2 Aaron McKie PG/SG 6-5 210 11 10/2/72 buy jersey
24 Jim Jackson G/F 6-6 220 14 10/14/70 buy jersey
9 Laron Profit G/SF 6-5 204 3 8/5/77 buy jersey
4 Luke Walton SF 6-8 235 2 3/28/80 buy jersey
3 Devean George SF 6-8 240 6 8/29/77 buy jersey
7 Lamar Odom SF 6-10 232 6 11/6/79 buy jersey
43 Brian Cook PF 6-9 234 2 12/4/80 buy jersey
14 Stanislav Medvedenko PF/C 6-10 255 5 4/4/79 buy jersey
54 Kwame Brown PF/C 7-0 243 4 3/10/82 buy jersey
21 Ronny Turiaf * PF 6-10 249 R 1/13/83
31 Chris Mihm C 7-0 265 5 7/16/69 buy jersey
54 Andrew Bynum C 6-11 285 R 10/27/87

are you really going to tell me the heat roster is worse than this. lamar may be better but you have to consider the other 10 people on the active roster.

smush started for the lakers and he couldn't even get minutes for a 16 win heat team last season

Hawkeye15
05-04-2009, 04:02 PM
maybe we have a difference in opinion but c'mon

NO. PLAYER POS HT WT YRS DOB more...
18 Sasha Vujacic PG 6-7 193 1 3/8/84 buy jersey
8 Kobe Bryant SG 6-6 220 9 8/23/78 buy jersey
23 Von Wafer PG 6-5 210 R 7/21/85 buy jersey
1 William "Smush" Parker G 6-4 180 2 6/1/81 buy jersey
11 Devin Green G 6-7 210 R 10/25/82 buy jersey
2 Aaron McKie PG/SG 6-5 210 11 10/2/72 buy jersey
24 Jim Jackson G/F 6-6 220 14 10/14/70 buy jersey
9 Laron Profit G/SF 6-5 204 3 8/5/77 buy jersey
4 Luke Walton SF 6-8 235 2 3/28/80 buy jersey
3 Devean George SF 6-8 240 6 8/29/77 buy jersey
7 Lamar Odom SF 6-10 232 6 11/6/79 buy jersey
43 Brian Cook PF 6-9 234 2 12/4/80 buy jersey
14 Stanislav Medvedenko PF/C 6-10 255 5 4/4/79 buy jersey
54 Kwame Brown PF/C 7-0 243 4 3/10/82 buy jersey
21 Ronny Turiaf * PF 6-10 249 R 1/13/83
31 Chris Mihm C 7-0 265 5 7/16/69 buy jersey
54 Andrew Bynum C 6-11 285 R 10/27/87

are you really going to tell me the heat roster is worse than this. lamar may be better but you have to consider the other 10 people on the active roster.

smush started for the lakers and he couldn't even get minutes for a 16 win heat team last season

agree to disagree. Beasley and Chalmers are rookies. Wash out. The Heats players were terrible. Marion and O'Neal are so over the hill, it isn't even funny. Haslem is essentially their second best player, so yes, I am saying the Lakers had a slightly better cast, cause Odom at least proved he was a very good player. The rest sucked. Just like the Heat player suck outside Wade. Now, in 2 years, Beasley should be very good, maybe Chalmers, who knows. But they both completely carried their teams.

PHX-SOXFAN
05-04-2009, 04:32 PM
I'd rank it ahead of kobe's 35 ppg season purely for the reason that wade did not quit on his team in the second half of game 7 and refuse to shoot, like kobe did.

durtee
05-04-2009, 04:34 PM
maybe we have a difference in opinion but c'mon

NO. PLAYER POS HT WT YRS DOB more...
18 Sasha Vujacic PG 6-7 193 1 3/8/84 buy jersey
8 Kobe Bryant SG 6-6 220 9 8/23/78 buy jersey
23 Von Wafer PG 6-5 210 R 7/21/85 buy jersey
1 William "Smush" Parker G 6-4 180 2 6/1/81 buy jersey
11 Devin Green G 6-7 210 R 10/25/82 buy jersey
2 Aaron McKie PG/SG 6-5 210 11 10/2/72 buy jersey
24 Jim Jackson G/F 6-6 220 14 10/14/70 buy jersey
9 Laron Profit G/SF 6-5 204 3 8/5/77 buy jersey
4 Luke Walton SF 6-8 235 2 3/28/80 buy jersey
3 Devean George SF 6-8 240 6 8/29/77 buy jersey
7 Lamar Odom SF 6-10 232 6 11/6/79 buy jersey
43 Brian Cook PF 6-9 234 2 12/4/80 buy jersey
14 Stanislav Medvedenko PF/C 6-10 255 5 4/4/79 buy jersey
54 Kwame Brown PF/C 7-0 243 4 3/10/82 buy jersey
21 Ronny Turiaf * PF 6-10 249 R 1/13/83
31 Chris Mihm C 7-0 265 5 7/16/69 buy jersey
54 Andrew Bynum C 6-11 285 R 10/27/87

are you really going to tell me the heat roster is worse than this. lamar may be better but you have to consider the other 10 people on the active roster.

smush started for the lakers and he couldn't even get minutes for a 16 win heat team last season

Not that you need me too, but I will back you up on this. This team is absolutely rotten. The Heat are bad as well, but it's a better team than this Laker team.

I do realize that Beasley and Chalmers are rookies, but Beasley was the #2 pick in the draft. We aren't talking about a late 1st round project player. A top 5 pick is supposed to make an immediate impact, otherwise he wouldn't be taken in the top 5. Rose made the Bulls better, so why wouldn't Beasley make the Heat better?

Havoc Wreaker
05-04-2009, 04:36 PM
I think it ranks in the: OVER category :p

durtee
05-04-2009, 04:38 PM
I'd rank it ahead of kobe's 35 ppg season purely for the reason that wade did not quit on his team in the second half of game 7 and refuse to shoot, like kobe did.

Well Skip Bayless would disagree. He went on and on this morning about how Wade quit on his team. Not saying that I agree with him, but he did make some pretty strong points.

_Supreme_
05-04-2009, 04:56 PM
Well Skip Bayless would disagree. He went on and on this morning about how Wade quit on his team. Not saying that I agree with him, but he did make some pretty strong points.

But who cares about Skip Bayless and his opinion anyway?

durtee
05-04-2009, 05:00 PM
But who cares about Skip Bayless and his opinion anyway?

I think it's pretty obvious that someone cares, since he is still on the air. :shrug:

_Supreme_
05-04-2009, 05:05 PM
Another thing:

Why do people keep asking HEAT fans, throughout this thread, to explain why Wade's season was historic when it wasn't a HEAT fan who brought up "historic" in the first place?

:eyebrow:

69centers
05-04-2009, 05:36 PM
that is absolutely ridiculous

well then lets strip MJ of all his MVPs and larry bird you know what lets take Magics as well and kareems lets take Shaqs MVP as well

now we are penalizing people for having sidekicks

So, it's ridiculous to compare a player who has no one playing beside him to those who have all-stars playing beside them, and compare how far they take their teams? I didn't say one can't win the MVP with an all-star playing alongside them, I was making the point that Wade has NO ONE, and Kobe and LeBron have all-stars with them.

Please read, think, and analyze before you post. :pity:

Spurred1
05-04-2009, 05:43 PM
Why do so many threads turn into Wade/Kobe comparisons? Wade had a terrific season, the Heat got into the playoffs, were the underdogs, and lost to the Hawks. Not sure what specifically is historic about it. He did more than his part, but he can only do so much as one guy. The team can only improve as the rookies gain experience. I imagine Riley will also make some adjustments to the roster.

LayZbone
05-04-2009, 05:48 PM
Wade had a fantastic year. His teammates were too young, too old, or just plain bad for this team to have any more success than it did this season.....yet the season was still a ridiculous improvement over last year's, and most of the credit goes to Wade for playing out of this world. I hate comparing this season to Kobe's 35ppg season because both were so amazing, but i understand both sides of the argument for which is better.

I wish posters would stop focusing on the fact that the OP said "historic", and focus on the point of whether Wade's 1st round exit changes your view of his season as a whole......or do you put a clear distinction between the regular season and the playoffs, accepting that Wade did something great with very little.

marlinsfan24
05-04-2009, 06:05 PM
"Historic" is a horrible word for describing a players season. None of us has watched every historic seasons in the past to be able to make that comparison. However, you guys have to admit, Wade's season was one of the most impressive, excluding Kobe's season a few years back, in a while.

AntwanN21
05-04-2009, 07:12 PM
He had an amazing season considering everything he's done. I think he just set the stage for what should be another MVP type season for D-Wade next year

AllTheWay
05-04-2009, 08:15 PM
his regular season was unreal. Miami was better than I thought they would be. I didn't think they would make the playoffs before the season started. The fact that he went out in the first round can not be surprising. Miami still has a lot to work on. Beasley and Chalmers are rookies. You can't expect them to be that great in the playoffs. They still have depth question marks. Give them 2 years, they should be fine.
And to answer the question, Wade's season was spectacular. He was the MVP of the league, but we all know it goes to a top 3 team, and LeBron had this thing won before the first tip off of the season, much like Kobe did last year.

I don't wanna nitpick, but many didn't even believe Kobe would finish the season as a Laker at the beginning of last season. If not for Bynum's early season emergence and the Gasol trade, Kobe would probably be in the East right about now.

S-Jax39
05-04-2009, 08:26 PM
Wade had an amazing season... okay, but why is this such a shock? we all know who he is, and what he is capable of... it was the injuries that have slowed him down in past years, nothing else.
I honestly expected this from Wade... also, a lot of people have mentioned how he's has led his team to the 5th seed bla bla bla.. what about Jermaine O'Neal, Mario Chalmers and Michael Beasley? sure Wade is #1 guy on this team, but you can't give him ALL the credit, and in no way has any of this been 'historic'.

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 08:27 PM
I consider Lebron James a cross between a post/perimeter player, the same way you'd consider Charles Barkley one.

Yes, Kobe Bryant is a perimeter player and no he's never had a season as good as Wade's had this year.

Lebron rarely plays in the post. In fact, Kobe plays in the post much more often than Lebron (due to the fact that he plays in the Tri Post Offensive System). How can you consider Lebron to not be a perimeter player?

So Kobe's 2003 and 2006 season ranks behind this season of Wades to you?

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 08:28 PM
With respect, had they not acquired Pau, then Kobe probably doesn't win MVP. He made them so much better by adding another dimension that not even Bynum could add (primarily shooting, IQ, and experience)

Probably not, but had Bynum stayed healthy then I think Kobe definitely wins MVP and even more convincingly. Remember, the Lakers had the #1 seed the day of Bynum's injury.

Lebron23
05-04-2009, 08:29 PM
Shooting Guards

1987, 1988 and 1989 Michael Jordan

2005 and 2006 Kobe Bryant

2009 Dwayne Wade

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 08:32 PM
Odom would have been the second best player on this team.

True. But Lamar is your second best player talent wise. As every Laker fan knew in 2006, Lamar only showed up every 5 or 6 games. The second option then was...Smush Parker. The same guy who got bounced from the 15 win Heat squad. Exactly...

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 08:34 PM
I'd rank it ahead of kobe's 35 ppg season purely for the reason that wade did not quit on his team in the second half of game 7 and refuse to shoot, like kobe did.


Wade Game 7: 42 min., 31 PTS (10/25, 40.0%), 3 RBD, 5 AST, 4 TO
5th Seed Miami Heat (43-39) v. 4th Seed Atlanta Hawks (47-25)

Kobe Game 7: 43 min., 24 PTS (8/16, 50.0%), 4 RBD, 4 AST, 3 TO
7th Seed Los Angeles Lakers (45-27) v. 2nd Seed Phoenix Suns (54-28)

A complete double standard. Taking that Phoenix team to 7 games was a much greater accomplishment. Both basically got blown out in game 7 on the road (Heat were down by 30 at one point in the 4th).


Lakers were down 15 at half time. In the 3rd quarter, Kobe played all 12 minutes, had 1 pt (0-2), 0 AST, 0 RBD, 0 TO. Lakers ended up down 25 at the end of the 3rd.

Heat were down 13 at half time. In the 3rd quarter, Wade played all 12 minutes, had 11 pts (5-8), 1 AST, 0 RBD, 1 TO. Heat ended up down 16 at the end of the 3rd.

I can see why people may have thought Kobe didn't try. However, 1) Phoenix was a much more difficult opponent than Atlanta and 2) Kobe had less talent around him so it was easier for Phoenix to key in on him.

I think its completely different circumstances. IMO, neither Wade nor Kobe deserved any criticism. They weren't the problems.

Info provided by LakerSanity.

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 08:36 PM
Shooting Guards

1987, 1988 and 1989 Michael Jordan

2005 and 2006 Kobe Bryant

2009 Dwayne Wade

2003 Kobe.

last stand
05-04-2009, 08:42 PM
Shooting Guards

1987, 1988 and 1989 Michael Jordan

2005 and 2006 Kobe Bryant

2009 Dwayne Wade

are you talking historic seasons because there is a lot of missing in between years

Lebron23
05-04-2009, 08:45 PM
are you talking historic seasons because there is a lot of missing in between years

Best Individual Seasons. ( Statistically)

last stand
05-04-2009, 08:50 PM
Best Individual Seasons. ( Statistically)

you gotta put kobe 2003 in there

30ppg 7rpg 6apg at 24 years old

sound familiar

Lakersfan2483
05-04-2009, 08:51 PM
He's had the best season by a perimeter player since Jordan in 1991, even better than Tmac in 02-03, losing in the first round doesn't change that. Winning is overrated when you compare individuals.

No, he did not. Reference Bryant's seasons in 2003 and 2006. Your biased toward anything relating to the Lakers is always clear in your posts. In 2006, Bryant led his team to 45 wins out west with very little help. No one outside of MJ and Kobe have averaged 35 or more points in an entire season in the last 30 plus years. Bryant's season that year was above and beyond what anyone expected, he had about 30, 40 point ball games, not too mention the leadership and other intangibles he provided leading that below average group to the postseason. Kobe had to take on the scoring load during the entire game and take on the opposing team's best perimeter player and did so at a extremely high level....

ARMIN12NBA
05-04-2009, 09:01 PM
Best Individual Seasons. ( Statistically)

Kobe's 2003 season was his second best statistically and probably his best considering his dominant defense that season as well as his 40 point streak.

Lebron23
05-04-2009, 09:12 PM
you gotta put kobe 2003 in there

30ppg 7rpg 6apg at 24 years old

sound familiar


Kobe's 2003 season was his second best statistically and probably his best considering his dominant defense that season as well as his 40 point streak.


Very Impressive.


:clap::clap::clap:

Kabowdos
05-04-2009, 09:40 PM
Dwayne Wade season = Kobe's three seasons after Shaq

Kobe had the stats and was by far the best player.

MVP goes to the best player on the best team for the most part. That is pretty much the truth or you have to be at least top 5 team in the NBA. They aren't giving it to the Wade, their record was like 13th in the NBA.

Close thread.

mrs rose
05-05-2009, 03:18 AM
i think his season was great.
to come back from not one but 2 major surgeries!!! and have the season he had, with 2 rookies, and a bunch of unproven players, a shawn marion with no jump shot, a j oneal with bad knees. to even have miami make the playoffs was amazing. to take a hawks team who was suppose to sweep miami to 7 games was awesome as well. i know the media, and the homer fans of kobe and lbj may not respect or view what wade has done in this season. but the true unbias (me iam bias i cant lie) fans will respect what wade has done with his game, after so much drama and injuries in his life.
thank you d wade, for giving us a chance in miami. too bad the award that should have been yours.. was given to the new golden boy of the nba. it should be the mvp award. it should the mop on mot. the most outstanding player, on the most outstanding team. since the mvp is given to the best player on the best team. change the name. because the value part wasnt expressed. both of those players have help. wade has rookies, and medicore core players on his team. while the other two have all stars and decent role players.
close thread.
we love u wade in miami dade county.

PHX-SOXFAN
05-05-2009, 01:05 PM
Lebron rarely plays in the post. In fact, Kobe plays in the post much more often than Lebron (due to the fact that he plays in the Tri Post Offensive System). How can you consider Lebron to not be a perimeter player?

So Kobe's 2003 and 2006 season ranks behind this season of Wades to you?

kobe's 05-06 season definitely ranks behind wade's season. wade didn't quit on his team in the playoffs, he didn't diminish his season like kobe did while pouting for a half.

durtee
05-05-2009, 03:06 PM
kobe's 05-06 season definitely ranks behind wade's season. wade didn't quit on his team in the playoffs, he didn't diminish his season like kobe did while pouting for a half.

:horse: