PDA

View Full Version : Put Players Into Context



mrblisterdundee
03-07-2009, 04:38 PM
Many people will talk about how good a player is without putting them into the context of their team. A person's individual performance is heavily tied to their place on a team.
Take Dwayne Wade for example. There's no doubt that he's a top three MVP candidate. He is also the only prolific scorer on his team. Also, he is the only decent distributor on his team. He is also the only decent defensive player on his team. Those three reasons combine to give an explanation for why he is getting such monstrous numbers. It's because of his talent and context on his team.
Take Kobe Bryant for example. Some would argue that he's fallen off from a couple years ago, but they're not looking at the context he's in. When he led the Lakers by himself, he was in the same position as Wade. He had to score a lot, and was the main distributor and defensive presence. He still is the main defensive presence, but he has to do a lot less now that the context of his team has changed.
Take Dwight Howard for example. He averages monstrous numbers of rebounds and blocks, but look at his context. He's the only legitimately dominant post presence on his team. Orlando even has a small forward playing power forward. The reason he doesn't score more is because there's other main options on his team.
Take LeBron James for example. He averages monstrous numbers all around, but put him into the context of a team that is mediocre without him. He is the main scorer and main distributor. He's also the equally leading rebounding option next to Ilgauskas. His assists might fall off now that the context of his team has changed with the addition of Mo Williams.

Chronz
03-07-2009, 04:51 PM
I never baught into this line of thinking, more help makes it easier for you to score efficiently, less help means you have to carry a bigger load thus take on harder shots. Look at LeBron, hes on a first place team and is on pace to having the greatest individual season in NBA history, I credit alot of this to the fact that he has shooters galore. If he was on his own hed be just as good, if theres any difference its very subtle. And if Dwight is playing with such a small team, how are they so great defensively? Facts are Dwight is the best rebounder on a team with the 3rd highest Defensive rebound rate in the league, you have to credit him for that. Usually bloated rebounders come from teams that are so poor that someone has to rebound and thats usually causes a slight increase. Where the Magic's lack of interior players hurts them is on the offensive glass. Look at Rashard, by your theory you would think this is would be his best rebounding season considering hes playing the 4, but in fact playing next to Dwight has actually lowered his rebounding numbers and he had higher numbers playing on a Sonics team that ranked 26th.

Kobe is having a better year now, he was finally at MJ's level in terms of raw efficiency but but hes trailed off after a few of those 30+ attempt games.

If Wade didnt have to create everything himself then he himself could be more efficient, dont let per game averages dictate what you think makes up good stats.

mrblisterdundee
03-07-2009, 04:56 PM
I never baught into this line of thinking, more help makes it easier for you to score efficiently, less help means you have to carry a bigger load thus take on harder shots. Look at LeBron, hes on a first place team and is on pace to having the greatest individual season in NBA history, I credit alot of this to the fact that he has shooters galore. If he was on his own hed be just as good, if theres any difference its very subtle. And if Dwight is playing with such a small team, how are they so great defensively? Facts are Dwight is the best rebounder on a team with the 3rd highest Defensive rebound rate in the league, you have to credit him for that. Usually bloated rebounders come from teams that are so poor that someone has to rebound and thats usually causes a slight increase. Where the Magic's lack of interior players hurts them is on the offensive glass. Look at Rashard, by your theory you would think this is would be his best rebounding season considering hes playing the 4, but in fact playing next to Dwight has actually lowered his rebounding numbers and he had higher numbers playing on a Sonics team that ranked 26th.

Kobe is having a better year now, he was finally at MJ's level in terms of raw efficiency but but hes trailed off after a few of those 30+ attempt games.

If Wade didnt have to create everything himself then he himself could be more efficient, dont let per game averages dictate what you think makes up good stats.

How do you explain Dwayne Wade? If he had another good scoring options, his points per game wouldn't be as high. If he had a good point guard, his assists per game wouldn't be as high.

bostncelts34
03-07-2009, 05:01 PM
And this is why i hate when people say rondo is only good because of the big 3. I beleive the big 3 hurts him just as much as helps him.

Hurts him with PPG because he is the 4th option, obviously helps him in assist. Rebounds and stuff he still does his own thing

Chronz
03-07-2009, 05:26 PM
How do you explain Dwayne Wade? If he had another good scoring options, his points per game wouldn't be as high. If he had a good point guard, his assists per game wouldn't be as high.
That would just mean his turnovers would lower and his floor% would go up. There are advantages in either scenario.