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View Full Version : why do the t-wolves trade their draft picks?



Rique
02-25-2009, 09:40 AM
I don't get it they trade higher picks for lower 1s all the time and get nothing else

Breatnach
02-25-2009, 09:51 AM
Well they got Foye +Cash 2 years ago

and this year they got Love +Miller and expiring contracts.

So yeah, I guess you're right - they got nothing xD

HOZ THE KNICK
02-25-2009, 09:58 AM
they have too much young talent and not enough veteran leaders.

Tblaze
02-25-2009, 09:58 AM
they value quantity over quality, which is the wrong way around.

WSU Tony
02-25-2009, 10:00 AM
If you look into the deals, you'll see they actually got something in return.

This year:

Gave up: Mayo - Jaric (bad contract) and Walker (bad contract)

Got: Love and Miller.

Sure, Mayo is the better talent between himself and love but in all honesty getting rid of bad contracts was a huge move for the Wolves. That, and we got Miller who could be used in a trade this offseason to move UP in the draft.

If you follow the trades more closely you won't have to make threads like these. :)

WSU Tony
02-25-2009, 10:01 AM
they value quantity over quality, which is the wrong way around.

Blazers would have done the same thing if they were in cap trouble, trust me. What's the point of getting a talent like Mayo if you are UNABLE to resign him in 3-4 years from now. :laugh:

hotdogbun
02-25-2009, 10:27 AM
Blazers would have done the same thing if they were in cap trouble, trust me. What's the point of getting a talent like Mayo if you are UNABLE to resign him in 3-4 years from now. :laugh:

wolves would have signed mayo even if they are over the cap because of bird rights

BoognishMN
02-25-2009, 10:55 AM
Mayo did not want to play in MN. Plus McFail had a man crush on Kevin Love because he was a white guy with hustle.

Big Quett
02-25-2009, 11:20 AM
If you look into the deals, you'll see they actually got something in return.

This year:

Gave up: Mayo - Jaric (bad contract) and Walker (bad contract)

Got: Love and Miller.

Sure, Mayo is the better talent between himself and love but in all honesty getting rid of bad contracts was a huge move for the Wolves. That, and we got Miller who could be used in a trade this offseason to move UP in the draft.

If you follow the trades more closely you won't have to make threads like these. :)

Yeah i see you conveniently forgot to mention Brian Cardinal
With 2 years and about 13 mil left on his contract
1 bad contract for another
So the contracts are a wash
And plus we got the better player
And plus Walker was an expiring this year

Tblaze
02-25-2009, 11:20 AM
Blazers would have done the same thing if they were in cap trouble, trust me. What's the point of getting a talent like Mayo if you are UNABLE to resign him in 3-4 years from now. :laugh:

True that. But sometimes you have to take a chance. You need stars to contend, players like Love or very useful.. but they will only get you so far...

WSU Tony
02-25-2009, 12:26 PM
wolves would have signed mayo even if they are over the cap because of bird rights

I'm talking retaining, your talking leasing.


Yeah i see you conveniently forgot to mention Brian Cardinal
With 2 years and about 13 mil left on his contract
1 bad contract for another
So the contracts are a wash
And plus we got the better player
And plus Walker was an expiring this year


The contracts were not a wash.

27M over 3 years <<< 12M over 2 years. Come on now, you can't honestly say the contracts were a wash. Which would you rather pay? I left Miller out of this discussion because he's not a 'contract' trade, he's a legit player and any playoff team would love to have him.

Honestly, though, enjoy Mayo walking after 3 years to a bigger market. We'll have Love (who wants to play in Mini) putting up 16/13 every night for a reasonable price.

You realize how PER works, right? 15 is league average.

Mayo's PER: 15.3
Love's PER: 17.8

So let me get this right. The Wolves got a player with a better first year PER, wants to play and stay in the same city, isn't 'sexy' so he won't take tons of money to re-sign, received Miller in return, AND got rid of Jarics horrible contract along with others.

Seriously, dude, the only good part about this trade is the national recognition that Mayo can jack up 20+ shots a night at a decent shooting rate. Other than that, Minnesota won.

DreamShaker
02-25-2009, 01:39 PM
Because McHale and Bird are sabotaging the Pacers and Wolves so that Boston can get back it's glory days....duh!

Fireworld
02-25-2009, 02:10 PM
MN sucks! Bad team, boring cold state. nothing good there!

Big Quett
02-25-2009, 02:30 PM
The contracts were not a wash.

27M over 3 years <<< 12M over 2 years. Come on now, you can't honestly say the contracts were a wash. Which would you rather pay? I left Miller out of this discussion because he's not a 'contract' trade, he's a legit player and any playoff team would love to have him.

Ok atleast Jaric is a playable player. And again you fail to mention Cardinal. I would rather have a player who can actually play. Cardinal is nothing more dead cap space


Honestly, though, enjoy Mayo walking after 3 years to a bigger market. We'll have Love (who wants to play in Mini) putting up 16/13 every night for a reasonable price.

And who says he is leaving to play in bigger market. He grew up in West Virginia. And plus in case you haven't been reading and keeping up with NBA economics. The salary cap is going down. So teams who already can offer the most money will have even more leverage and more of an advantage. Mayo is not going to leave money on the table. Just like LeBron, Wade, and Bosh are not going to.


You realize how PER works, right? 15 is league average.

Mayo's PER: 15.3
Love's PER: 17.8

And do you even know what PER means? So your telling me PER is how you rate how good a player is?
Proof that the whole is stat is flawed is that Marreese Speights leads all rookies in PER. And Derrick Rose the most likely candidate for rookie of the year is the 7th best rookie according to PER. But this is the stat you live by? So you mean to tell me that Marreese Speights and JaVale McGee among others are better than Rose and Mayo?


So let me get this right. The Wolves got a player with a better first year PER, wants to play and stay in the same city, isn't 'sexy' so he won't take tons of money to re-sign, received Miller in return, AND got rid of Jarics horrible contract along with others.

But you took on a worse one is Cardinal because he cant play at all. Like I said atleast Jaric is a playable player.


Seriously, dude, the only good part about this trade is the national recognition that Mayo can jack up 20+ shots a night at a decent shooting rate. Other than that, Minnesota won.

He doesnt take 20 shots. And what else does Love do? He rebounds that's it. He dosnt play defense and barely shoots a better percentage than Mayo.

Listen i like Love. I just dont think he was worth a top 5 pick. Now you mean to tell me that you would rather have have Love, Big Al, and Foye. Rather than Big Al and a back court of Mayo and Foye?

STL/Mizzou/DZ
02-25-2009, 03:00 PM
foye and mayo play same pos so i would rather have love

Hawkeye15
02-25-2009, 03:48 PM
Ok atleast Jaric is a playable player. And again you fail to mention Cardinal. I would rather have a player who can actually play. Cardinal is nothing more dead cap space



And who says he is leaving to play in bigger market. He grew up in West Virginia. And plus in case you haven't been reading and keeping up with NBA economics. The salary cap is going down. So teams who already can offer the most money will have even more leverage and more of an advantage. Mayo is not going to leave money on the table. Just like LeBron, Wade, and Bosh are not going to.



And do you even know what PER means? So your telling me PER is how you rate how good a player is?
Proof that the whole is stat is flawed is that Marreese Speights leads all rookies in PER. And Derrick Rose the most likely candidate for rookie of the year is the 7th best rookie according to PER. But this is the stat you live by? So you mean to tell me that Marreese Speights and JaVale McGee among others are better than Rose and Mayo?


But you took on a worse one is Cardinal because he cant play at all. Like I said atleast Jaric is a playable player.



He doesnt take 20 shots. And what else does Love do? He rebounds that's it. He dosnt play defense and barely shoots a better percentage than Mayo.

Listen i like Love. I just dont think he was worth a top 5 pick. Now you mean to tell me that you would rather have have Love, Big Al, and Foye. Rather than Big Al and a back court of Mayo and Foye?

Neither Foye or Mayo is a PG, they wouldn't co exist together dude. And Mayo may turn out to be the better player of the two, but you will need to resign him to a $10+ million deal, because he is OJ MAYO the great, and we will keep Foye and Love for under $14. So you can have him. And when did Mayo start playing defense? He will be a great shooter in the league. I keep coming around to Ben Gordon, and I just don't think there is a better comparison.

Unown99
02-25-2009, 04:12 PM
there dumb

T.O.Fan:)
02-25-2009, 04:20 PM
there dumb

huh .... Lol

boeknows
02-26-2009, 03:28 AM
But you took on a worse one is Cardinal because he cant play at all. Like I said atleast Jaric is a playable player.



You do realize that Cardinal has played more minutes and more games this year than Jaric has?

Big Quett
02-28-2009, 07:31 AM
You do realize that Cardinal has played more minutes and more games this year than Jaric has?

So that makes him good? Jaric didnt play because they were better players ahead of him. Cardinal playing more mins and games than Marko isnt a good thing. It just means your bigman rotation is terrible if he is even getting off the bench. Cardinal wouldnt be able to get off the bench on any team other than the Wolves.

He only plays because of his contract. When his current contract is up so will his NBA career. He is done.He is a 11th or 12th man at best.

Jaric will still be a serviceable back-up.

WSU Tony
02-28-2009, 01:42 PM
Ok atleast Jaric is a playable player. And again you fail to mention Cardinal. I would rather have a player who can actually play. Cardinal is nothing more dead cap space

That's exactly it, he's actually coming OFF the cap in two years. That's more than I can say for Marco.

And who says he is leaving to play in bigger market. He grew up in West Virginia. And plus in case you haven't been reading and keeping up with NBA economics. The salary cap is going down. So teams who already can offer the most money will have even more leverage and more of an advantage. Mayo is not going to leave money on the table. Just like LeBron, Wade, and Bosh are not going to.

Mayo has been hyped since he was in 3rd grade. He'll dash as soon as possible because, like you said, he won't leave money on the table. He's got the NY or Cali attitude, not Memphis.

And do you even know what PER means? So your telling me PER is how you rate how good a player is?
Proof that the whole is stat is flawed is that Marreese Speights leads all rookies in PER. And Derrick Rose the most likely candidate for rookie of the year is the 7th best rookie according to PER. But this is the stat you live by? So you mean to tell me that Marreese Speights and JaVale McGee among others are better than Rose and Mayo?

PER is a very good indicator of how good a player is whether you recognize it as a legitimate stat or not. I understand it is complicated how they come to the final number but most will agree it's about the best stat there is. It's not a tell-all, but it does a fairly good job. I'm sorry PER doesn't work out of your man, Mayo, so you feel the need to not recognize it as a stat.

But you took on a worse one is Cardinal because he cant play at all. Like I said atleast Jaric is a playable player.

We don't want Jaric OR Cardinal on our team, the point is that at least Cardinal will come off the books soon, not like Jaric. (Thats the point)



He doesnt take 20 shots. And what else does Love do? He rebounds that's it. He dosnt play defense and barely shoots a better percentage than Mayo.

That's ironic your using the "he can only do one thing" argument against Love and FOR Mayo. :p

Listen i like Love. I just dont think he was worth a top 5 pick. Now you mean to tell me that you would rather have have Love, Big Al, and Foye. Rather than Big Al and a back court of Mayo and Foye?

Quality bigs > Quality smalls. This is especially true when you have the 2nd best rebounding big in the league and the BEST offensive rebounder (by far) in the league.


So that makes him good? Jaric didnt play because they were better players ahead of him. Cardinal playing more mins and games than Marko isnt a good thing. It just means your bigman rotation is terrible if he is even getting off the bench. Cardinal wouldnt be able to get off the bench on any team other than the Wolves.

He only plays because of his contract. When his current contract is up so will his NBA career. He is done.He is a 11th or 12th man at best.

Jaric will still be a serviceable back-up.

Please inform me of both of our teams big men and then tell me who's bigs are terrible. :laugh: Look at this next draft, if the Wolves grab Thabeet, look at those three promissing big men on the wolves, that could end up being the best big three in the league down the road.

Again, we DON'T WANT EITHER of those guys, we're happy Cardinal is coming off the bench.


Bottom line, if you love hyped players and guys which ESPN will recognize because they are 'sexy' guys, then take Mayo. If you like guys who quietly do their jobs (kind of like the Duncan mentality) then take Love.

Hustla23
02-28-2009, 02:23 PM
I'm talking retaining, your talking leasing.




The contracts were not a wash.

27M over 3 years <<< 12M over 2 years. Come on now, you can't honestly say the contracts were a wash. Which would you rather pay? I left Miller out of this discussion because he's not a 'contract' trade, he's a legit player and any playoff team would love to have him.

Honestly, though, enjoy Mayo walking after 3 years to a bigger market. We'll have Love (who wants to play in Mini) putting up 16/13 every night for a reasonable price.

You realize how PER works, right? 15 is league average.

Mayo's PER: 15.3
Love's PER: 17.8

So let me get this right. The Wolves got a player with a better first year PER, wants to play and stay in the same city, isn't 'sexy' so he won't take tons of money to re-sign, received Miller in return, AND got rid of Jarics horrible contract along with others.

Seriously, dude, the only good part about this trade is the national recognition that Mayo can jack up 20+ shots a night at a decent shooting rate. Other than that, Minnesota won.

lol Are you serious. You're actually happy with the trade? And not just frustrated that Kevin McHale is an idiot GM?

Dude your team traded away a future superstar for a guy who has a pretty low ceiling.

I like Kevin Love but Mayo is leaps and bounds more valuable than he is.

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 02:52 PM
lol Are you serious. You're actually happy with the trade? And not just frustrated that Kevin McHale is an idiot GM?

Dude your team traded away a future superstar for a guy who has a pretty low ceiling.

I like Kevin Love but Mayo is leaps and bounds more valuable than he is.

really? WHo has a higher PER? What is Mayo's ceiling in your opinion? He is a 6'4" guard with above average quicks, and a great shot who has never had better than a 1:1 assist/turnover ratio. As a guard. Mayo has a star name, and will command big money for basically being Ben Gordon. I will take Love, and his reasonable contract, and his 18-12 down the line, for 60% of what Mayo makes. THanks

Missing56&33
02-28-2009, 02:54 PM
One reason...................kevin mchale is a bad gm....was a bad gm

brandonwarne52
02-28-2009, 03:08 PM
I'm talking retaining, your talking leasing.




The contracts were not a wash.

27M over 3 years <<< 12M over 2 years. Come on now, you can't honestly say the contracts were a wash. Which would you rather pay? I left Miller out of this discussion because he's not a 'contract' trade, he's a legit player and any playoff team would love to have him.

Honestly, though, enjoy Mayo walking after 3 years to a bigger market. We'll have Love (who wants to play in Mini) putting up 16/13 every night for a reasonable price.

You realize how PER works, right? 15 is league average.

Mayo's PER: 15.3
Love's PER: 17.8

So let me get this right. The Wolves got a player with a better first year PER, wants to play and stay in the same city, isn't 'sexy' so he won't take tons of money to re-sign, received Miller in return, AND got rid of Jarics horrible contract along with others.

Seriously, dude, the only good part about this trade is the national recognition that Mayo can jack up 20+ shots a night at a decent shooting rate. Other than that, Minnesota won.

You're starting to sound like me.

eric1501
02-28-2009, 03:24 PM
You're starting to sound like me.

Because he adores you bwarne ;)

eric1501
02-28-2009, 03:25 PM
This is the dumbest title and object to bring up I have ever seen on PSD.

Kakaroach
02-28-2009, 03:43 PM
McHale should stick to coaching instead of being a GM. Plus, Mayo is a superstar (potentially) and love is an excellent rebounder and role player. Right now, Memphis got the better deal only because Miller is having a horrid season.

Hustla23
02-28-2009, 04:08 PM
really? WHo has a higher PER? What is Mayo's ceiling in your opinion? He is a 6'4" guard with above average quicks, and a great shot who has never had better than a 1:1 assist/turnover ratio. As a guard. Mayo has a star name, and will command big money for basically being Ben Gordon. I will take Love, and his reasonable contract, and his 18-12 down the line, for 60% of what Mayo makes. THanks

Mayo has a flawless jumpshot, creative ability, and awesome defense.

Kevin Love can score in the paint and rebound. He's a bad defensive player, slow, and can't block shots and not a good compliment to Al Jefferson.

Kevin Love would be really good on a team where there was a real defensive big next to him.

If you think Love is anywhere comparable to Mayo, then you have your head in the clouds.

Love's going to average 18 and 12? :speechless: That's a pretty bold prediction my friend. I like Love's game alot but those are all star numbers and probably out of reach.

Whereas Mayo already averages 20 points, 4 rebounds, and 3 assists.

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 04:37 PM
Mayo has a flawless jumpshot, creative ability, and awesome defense.

Kevin Love can score in the paint and rebound. He's a bad defensive player, slow, and can't block shots and not a good compliment to Al Jefferson.

Kevin Love would be really good on a team where there was a real defensive big next to him.

If you think Love is anywhere comparable to Mayo, then you have your head in the clouds.

Love's going to average 18 and 12? :speechless: That's a pretty bold prediction my friend. I like Love's game alot but those are all star numbers and probably out of reach.

Whereas Mayo already averages 20 points, 4 rebounds, and 3 assists.


you appear to have a mancrush on Mayo, you describe him like the ultimate shooting guard. He is Ben Gordon dude. nice inflation on his numbers and skills as well. I will take Foye's 17/5/4 for 60% of what Mayo will require to be paid. ANd this trade had more to do with that swap. The WOlves got rid of **** contracts, got 2 players in return, for 1, which they already have a player at that position. And if 18/12 are all star numbers, why is Al Jefferson sitting at home during the all star break? Mayo an awesome defender? mkay. ANd you forgot to add the turnovers, they zero out the assists. If Love had 38 mpg, plus play after play run for him, which he doesn't because Al Jefferson already plays there, you are looking at 15/12. This year. So, this will be my last response on this issue, I expect nothing less than Mayo will surpass MJ to come back from you at this point

thesparky33
02-28-2009, 04:48 PM
Hawkeye's kicking some ***!

Hustla23
02-28-2009, 04:55 PM
you appear to have a mancrush on Mayo, you describe him like the ultimate shooting guard. He is Ben Gordon dude. nice inflation on his numbers and skills as well. I will take Foye's 17/5/4 for 60% of what Mayo will require to be paid. ANd this trade had more to do with that swap. The WOlves got rid of **** contracts, got 2 players in return, for 1, which they already have a player at that position. And if 18/12 are all star numbers, why is Al Jefferson sitting at home during the all star break? Mayo an awesome defender? mkay. ANd you forgot to add the turnovers, they zero out the assists. If Love had 38 mpg, plus play after play run for him, which he doesn't because Al Jefferson already plays there, you are looking at 15/12. This year. So, this will be my last response on this issue, I expect nothing less than Mayo will surpass MJ to come back from you at this point

lol inflated numbers? Care to check the stats? And they are all star numbers. Al Jefferson should of been in the all star game. Why do you think everyone was calling him a "snub"? And you'd take Foye over Mayo for 60% ?

Did you know that players that are better usually get paid more? LOL I mean seriously, that's like saying instead of having Tim Duncan for 20 million, you'd rather have Josh Smith for 14 million.

And I really do hope that was your last response.

superkegger
02-28-2009, 05:00 PM
Minnesota is more than likely to have 4 first round picks this year...

Their own (which at some point will go the clippers, but is top 10 protected until 2011)

Minnesota receives Miami's 2009 first round pick (top 10 in 2009, top 6 in 2010, beyond: unprotected.)(Ricky Davis trade).


Minnesota receives Boston's 2009 first round pick (top 3 protected) (Kevin Garnett trade).

Minnesota receives a first rounder (Rodney Carney trade 070908) via Philadelphia receives a Utah 2009 first round pick (protected) (Kyle Korver trade 122907).(The Wolves will get it if the Jazz pick lower than 22nd in 2009, 17th in 2010, 15th in 2011, 16th in 2012 or 16th in 2013.) And right now the Jazz are slated to pick 20th, should the standings hold.

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 05:08 PM
Hawkeye's kicking some ***!

no just dealing with typical fans that fall in love with names, and stats. I doubt most have even watched Love play more than a couple times, so they have no idea what they are talking about. Mayo wasn't going to stay in Minnesota. Plus, he isn't going to be much of an upgrade over Randy. Championships are won with rebounding and defense. Where does Mayo fit in there? He is an undersized SG, with above average athletic ability. I don't see the same ceiling some do, which is mostly guys who haven't played basketball at any level outside some junior high and rec league, who love youtube videos of Mayo, Gordon, and Derozan playing agasint women. Mayo will be a fine player, but he is limited. 22-4-4, with iffy decision making, and average defense is what I see in his future. Except, you will need to pay him $16 million a year for that.

eric1501
02-28-2009, 05:09 PM
[QUOTE=superkegger;8557720]Minnesota is more than likely to have 4 first round picks this year...

So basically he is saying we have a bright future. :D


I can't wait for K-Love to start getting at least 35 MPG. Then people will finally realize outside the state of Minnesota how we robbed Memphis in June '08.

brandonwarne52
02-28-2009, 05:10 PM
How ****ed would we be without Love right now?

Our 2 best players right now have to be Foye and Telfair, or at least two of our best. Where does Mayo fit into that picture?

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 05:11 PM
[QUOTE=superkegger;8557720]Minnesota is more than likely to have 4 first round picks this year...

So basically he is saying we have a bright future. :D


I can't wait for K-Love to start getting at least 35 MPG. Then people will finally realize outside the state of Minnesota how we robbed Memphis in June '08.

it will never happen. Love could go for 22-15, but because he is white, and kind of slow, and doesnt make ESPN, most fans won't care. And guess what, we will get to keep him at a good value dollar wise because of that. I called Love a better player in high school than Mayo. And Love won freshman of the year, and PAC 10 player of the year last season over, guess who, Mayo, Westbrook, Lopez, blah, blah blah. He gets questioned at every level, and still succeeds

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 05:12 PM
[QUOTE=superkegger;8557720]Minnesota is more than likely to have 4 first round picks this year...

So basically he is saying we have a bright future. :D


I can't wait for K-Love to start getting at least 35 MPG. Then people will finally realize outside the state of Minnesota how we robbed Memphis in June '08.

it will never happen. Love could go for 22-15, but because he is white, and kind of slow, and doesnt make ESPN, most fans won't care. And guess what, we will get to keep him at a good value dollar wise because of that. I called Love a better player in high school than Mayo. And Love won freshman of the year, and PAC 10 player of the year last season over, guess who, Mayo, Westbrook, Lopez, blah, blah blah. He gets questioned at every level, and still succeeds. Why would anything change now?

superkegger
02-28-2009, 05:16 PM
The only reason I wish the Wolves hadn't traded for Love is so that there would be the gay-love connection.

Something like "Gay between the legs to love for the reverse lay in" would probably make me chuckle to no end if I heard an announcer say that.

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 05:21 PM
Randy Foye, since moving to SG after game #24, is averaging 20 ppg, 4.4 apg, 3.8 rpg, 1.3 spg, and shooting 41% from the 3 pt line. ANd he will require far less to resign than Mayo. He is nicknamed 4th quarter Foye for a reason, and leads the NBA in free throw accuracy with one posession games with under 4 minutes to go.

Lakers09
02-28-2009, 05:22 PM
you guys are arguing over a team that will never be a contender

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 05:26 PM
you guys are arguing over a team that will never be a contender

go back to the Lakers forums and stroke Kobe bro. Sorry, we don't have lifeless celebs to show up to our games and pretend to give a **** about basketball

superkegger
02-28-2009, 05:27 PM
you guys are arguing over a team that will never be a contender

Well that's not really true at all. It will take some time, but we've seen how fast fortunes can change in the NBA via what Portland has done the past 3 years.

radcli17
02-28-2009, 05:45 PM
mayos sick, loves a douche

thesparky33
02-28-2009, 06:09 PM
mayos sick, loves a douche
???

Everyone who has met Love, loves him (no pun intended). And he's one of the nicest guys, and humble at that. Everyone here in Minnesota loves the guy... how are you coming up with your assumptions?

WSU Tony
02-28-2009, 06:38 PM
Did you know that players that are better usually get paid more? LOL I mean seriously, that's like saying instead of having Tim Duncan for 20 million, you'd rather have Josh Smith for 14 million.



And for the players who are over paid because they have 'star' names and under produce? What do you call them? I'll take a quiet big man who produces better numbers than the money he gets over a "I deserve millions and won't sign for any less" guard. Enjoy over paying him to retain him.

Hustla23
02-28-2009, 06:48 PM
And for the players who are over paid because they have 'star' names and under produce? What do you call them? I'll take a quiet big man who produces better numbers than the money he gets over a "I deserve millions and won't sign for any less" guard. Enjoy over paying him to retain him.

Well first of all I'm a Knicks fan so I couldn't really care less. I'm putting an objective opinion out there.

How do you know Mayo's like that? He gives every indication that he's a loyal and hard working young player. Why, just because Love is a big friendly white guy that looks huggable you assume one guy's gonna want less money and the other one's gonna want a fortune?

Give me a break man.

I'll gladly pay the more talented player his money to play for my team.

eric1501
02-28-2009, 06:52 PM
Well first of all I'm a Knicks fan so I couldn't really care less. I'm putting an objective opinion out there.

How do you know Mayo's like that? He gives every indication that he's a loyal and hard working young player. Why, just because Love is a big friendly white guy that looks huggable you assume one guy's gonna want less money and the other one's gonna want a fortune?

Give me a break man.

I'll gladly pay the more talented player his money to play for my team.

Maybe because Mayo already made it clear before the draft he wanted to go to a big market team. If Memphis continues to suck for the next 3 to 4 years which they will. He will jet.

Hawkeye15
02-28-2009, 07:58 PM
Well first of all I'm a Knicks fan so I couldn't really care less. I'm putting an objective opinion out there.

How do you know Mayo's like that? He gives every indication that he's a loyal and hard working young player. Why, just because Love is a big friendly white guy that looks huggable you assume one guy's gonna want less money and the other one's gonna want a fortune?

Give me a break man.

I'll gladly pay the more talented player his money to play for my team.

which is what the Knicks attempted to do for the last 10 years. How is that working out?

WSU Tony
02-28-2009, 09:34 PM
Well first of all I'm a Knicks fan so I couldn't really care less. I'm putting an objective opinion out there.

How do you know Mayo's like that? He gives every indication that he's a loyal and hard working young player. Why, just because Love is a big friendly white guy that looks huggable you assume one guy's gonna want less money and the other one's gonna want a fortune?

Give me a break man.

I'll gladly pay the more talented player his money to play for my team.

Mayo has already commented (pre draft) about wanting a big market team....

Did you really need to make this a race issue? Does that card really need to be pulled?

Being a Knicks fan I bet you won't only pay them, you'll OVER pay them! ;)

Hustla23
02-28-2009, 09:53 PM
which is what the Knicks attempted to do for the last 10 years. How is that working out?

LOL. We overpayed for CRAP, not talent. Big difference. Fortunately, Walsh is doing a great job in getting rid of this crap so we have money to spend on talent. Get it ? :)




Mayo has already commented (pre draft) about wanting a big market team....

Did you really need to make this a race issue? Does that card really need to be pulled?

Being a Knicks fan I bet you won't only pay them, you'll OVER pay them! ;)

See comment above.

And he also made a comment claiming his commitment with Memphis after he was drafted by them so....

Just because he said he wanted to play for a big market before he was drafted, that means he's going to be disloyal to his team and run away? People have their preferences man. Yao Ming wanted to play for a big market team and hated being drafted by Houston, he's still around isn't he?

LeonFSU
02-28-2009, 11:11 PM
I thinks its pretty obvious Minnesota fans in this thread are trying to talk themselves into the Mayo-Love trade being definitively good for the T-Wolves. I personally think Mayo will end up being a very good all around player; Much better than Ben Gordon; I think thats a horrible comparison.

I do agree that Mayo wouldn't necessarily have improved Minnesota this year, and that Mayo and Foye would not be an effective backcourt, but that still doesn't necessarily lead me to believe that Minnesota got a good deal. IMO, Minnesota's best opportunity to actually improve the talent on their roster from that trade lies in what they do with Mike Miller. Once Minnesota figures out what to do with Miller, then the impact of the trade will be clearer.

As for Love, I don't think he is a bad player at all. There have certainly been worse players selected in the top five, and that he at least seems assured to have an effective career, barring injury, keeps Minnesota from immediately being declared unanimous losers of this trade.

But Love is not an all-star, and I don't see any all-star berths in his future. He is a hustle rebounder, and not a whole lot else. Somewhat in the mold of Louis Amundson, Udonis Haslem, or David Lee. None of those were top 5 picks and rightly so. Basically I don't think his skill set warrants him being a top 5 pick, and the 3 guys I mentioned are just a few guys I am citing as examples for similar players that can be acquired without using a top 5 pick.

Minnesota obviously could have done a lot worse, especially if they picked a player that turned out to be a complete bust. But the main reason I think Love isn't good for the Wolves is Al Jefferson. Kevin Love is not a good fit alongside Jefferson. Period. They provide absolutely no front-line defense whatsoever. Thats why I think Minnesota made a mistake with this pick. Of course good front court players are more valuable than good backcourt players because its so hard to find them, but not all good frontcourt players can play together, and Love and Jefferson are very poor complements, IMO. Just watch Toronto play with Bosh and Bargs and get lit up for 45 by a soon to be 37 year old Diesel, and you'll have a good idea of how soft and porous the defense of a frontcourt composed of two defensive liabilities at the 4 and 5 will look.

Someone on here, a Wolves fan mind you, was actually suggesting that the Wolves draft Thabeet. I'm not saying thats a bad idea, but if you think about that, and think about how they just drafted a big man in the top 5, locked up their star player in Jefferson, and STILL need to draft a big man, it should give you an idea of where Minnesota is right now. Minnesota needs a PG and another shooter or two, and still has to worry about drafting a big man because Love is not a good fit alongside Jefferson for an entire game.

Kakaroach
02-28-2009, 11:24 PM
^^I agree. The Wolves should trade Mike Miller for a good young talent this off-season. Maybe draft Thabeet as well, but they should take Rubio if he is there.

thesparky33
03-01-2009, 02:59 AM
Why does everyone suggest that we trade Mike Miller? He's actually starting to play really well, and starting to gel on this team. I know the Wolves are never on national tv, so go look at his game logs over the last few game, or at least since Jefferson has been out... he's back to his old self.

superkegger
03-01-2009, 03:02 AM
Why does everyone suggest that we trade Mike Miller? He's actually starting to play really well, and starting to gel on this team. I know the Wolves are never on national tv, so go look at his game logs over the last few game, or at least since Jefferson has been out... he's back to his old self.

Do you really not understand why people think he should be traded, or are you just saying that he's playing well and is a good contributor for the Wolves.

Because I think the general feeling is that by the time the Wolves are in a position to be a good team again, Miller will no longer be the productive player he is, and right now because his value is high, the pieces that could be obtained for him would be more likely to be able to contribute when the Wolves are in a position to be a good team.

But I know you understand that, so....

Big Quett
03-01-2009, 11:20 AM
Well first of all I'm a Knicks fan so I couldn't really care less. I'm putting an objective opinion out there.

How do you know Mayo's like that? He gives every indication that he's a loyal and hard working young player. Why, just because Love is a big friendly white guy that looks huggable you assume one guy's gonna want less money and the other one's gonna want a fortune?

Give me a break man.

I'll gladly pay the more talented player his money to play for my team.

Exactly!!!!

How do you know he will take less money then he THINKS he is worth?
And how do you know OJ will demand a fortune?

People are quick to say Oj is Hollywood. He went to High School in West Virginia.When he could have easily transferred and moved to big cities. Do you really think Kevin wouldnt love playing on the big stage in somewhere like New York or LA? Of course he would. That doesnt mean he or OJ would like to play for the Knicks. Or that either one of them would bolt just to play there.

People say they know Love just because you have seen him in interviews and might have actually met him. Unless we hang out or see these people on a regular basis in day to day life we dont know any of them. We know only what they want us to see.

And i dont hate love i just dont see as much as other people see in him. I would be okay if he was drafted in the early teens. But not as a top 5 five pick. I think there were bigmen drafted later on that were better. Like Speights, Lopez or even Hickson.

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 12:31 PM
I thinks its pretty obvious Minnesota fans in this thread are trying to talk themselves into the Mayo-Love trade being definitively good for the T-Wolves. I personally think Mayo will end up being a very good all around player; Much better than Ben Gordon; I think thats a horrible comparison.

I do agree that Mayo wouldn't necessarily have improved Minnesota this year, and that Mayo and Foye would not be an effective backcourt, but that still doesn't necessarily lead me to believe that Minnesota got a good deal. IMO, Minnesota's best opportunity to actually improve the talent on their roster from that trade lies in what they do with Mike Miller. Once Minnesota figures out what to do with Miller, then the impact of the trade will be clearer.

As for Love, I don't think he is a bad player at all. There have certainly been worse players selected in the top five, and that he at least seems assured to have an effective career, barring injury, keeps Minnesota from immediately being declared unanimous losers of this trade.

But Love is not an all-star, and I don't see any all-star berths in his future. He is a hustle rebounder, and not a whole lot else. Somewhat in the mold of Louis Amundson, Udonis Haslem, or David Lee. None of those were top 5 picks and rightly so. Basically I don't think his skill set warrants him being a top 5 pick, and the 3 guys I mentioned are just a few guys I am citing as examples for similar players that can be acquired without using a top 5 pick.

Minnesota obviously could have done a lot worse, especially if they picked a player that turned out to be a complete bust. But the main reason I think Love isn't good for the Wolves is Al Jefferson. Kevin Love is not a good fit alongside Jefferson. Period. They provide absolutely no front-line defense whatsoever. Thats why I think Minnesota made a mistake with this pick. Of course good front court players are more valuable than good backcourt players because its so hard to find them, but not all good frontcourt players can play together, and Love and Jefferson are very poor complements, IMO. Just watch Toronto play with Bosh and Bargs and get lit up for 45 by a soon to be 37 year old Diesel, and you'll have a good idea of how soft and porous the defense of a frontcourt composed of two defensive liabilities at the 4 and 5 will look.

Someone on here, a Wolves fan mind you, was actually suggesting that the Wolves draft Thabeet. I'm not saying thats a bad idea, but if you think about that, and think about how they just drafted a big man in the top 5, locked up their star player in Jefferson, and STILL need to draft a big man, it should give you an idea of where Minnesota is right now. Minnesota needs a PG and another shooter or two, and still has to worry about drafting a big man because Love is not a good fit alongside Jefferson for an entire game.


good points. I can only speak for myself, but I was not happy when I went to bed draft night with drafting Mayo. I was not a fan of his at USC, I don't see the big deal in him. I never have. I was very happy when I found out we got Love and Miller, plus got rid of Jaric and Walker for him. You are right, what happens with Miller can dictate some of the end results. THat being said, he has had a down year, coming on as of late as normal Miller. I would be fine with keeping him. With Jefferson, Love, and whomever we draft down low, having a 6'8" shooter on the outside helps.
This doesn't come down to what I think about Love, or Miller, or whomever. It comes down to last year, when Mayo was a college player, I decided I didn't think he would live up to his name. He was the next LeBron 3 years ago. He has a huge name. If he turns into a 24/4/4 player, or Joe Johnson, he will command a max deal. I do not want that on our team. Unless you are Duncan, Kobe, LeBron, Wade, or Howard, spending the kind of money Mayo will probably get is a waste. And maybe I am wrong, and he will be gracious like Al Jefferson, and take what he is worth. But something tells me a kid who has been worshipped by the media and fans since he was 13 is not of that mold

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 12:33 PM
LOL. We overpayed for CRAP, not talent. Big difference. Fortunately, Walsh is doing a great job in getting rid of this crap so we have money to spend on talent. Get it ? :)




See comment above.

And he also made a comment claiming his commitment with Memphis after he was drafted by them so....

Just because he said he wanted to play for a big market before he was drafted, that means he's going to be disloyal to his team and run away? People have their preferences man. Yao Ming wanted to play for a big market team and hated being drafted by Houston, he's still around isn't he?

well, my point is, you're assesment of talent is about the same as the Knicks. If you really are sold on Mayo becoming a perrenial all star that is.

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 12:35 PM
Do you really not understand why people think he should be traded, or are you just saying that he's playing well and is a good contributor for the Wolves.

Because I think the general feeling is that by the time the Wolves are in a position to be a good team again, Miller will no longer be the productive player he is, and right now because his value is high, the pieces that could be obtained for him would be more likely to be able to contribute when the Wolves are in a position to be a good team.

But I know you understand that, so....

agreed. However, 2 things that help a player age well are A)height, and B)Shooting ability. If he can be resigned for a reasonable deal, he is a big help as that veteran shooter. But yes, if the right deal came along, you gotta trade him. He is in the last year of his deal next season at $9 million, best opportunity will be there.

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 12:37 PM
Exactly!!!!

How do you know he will take less money then he THINKS he is worth?
And how do you know OJ will demand a fortune?

People are quick to say Oj is Hollywood. He went to High School in West Virginia.When he could have easily transferred and moved to big cities. Do you really think Kevin wouldnt love playing on the big stage in somewhere like New York or LA? Of course he would. That doesnt mean he or OJ would like to play for the Knicks. Or that either one of them would bolt just to play there.

People say they know Love just because you have seen him in interviews and might have actually met him. Unless we hang out or see these people on a regular basis in day to day life we dont know any of them. We know only what they want us to see.

And i dont hate love i just dont see as much as other people see in him. I would be okay if he was drafted in the early teens. But not as a top 5 five pick. I think there were bigmen drafted later on that were better. Like Speights, Lopez or even Hickson.


Mayo has been followed around like a puppy dog since he was 13. I hope he doesn't burn Memphis, they took a chance on him. But I think he will either require too much money for you guys, or just leave. And you could tell by the look on his face when Minny drafted him, he wasn't happy. He wouldn't even come in for a workout for them. GOodbye

Hustla23
03-01-2009, 12:41 PM
well, my point is, you're assesment of talent is about the same as the Knicks. If you really are sold on Mayo becoming a perrenial all star that is.

All your arguments are subjective and baseless.

I reccommend everyone stop trying to "argue" with this guy. He'll just continue to insult you without reason and hide his stupidity with more baseless arguments. Real clever :rolleyes:

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 12:46 PM
All your arguments are subjective and baseless.

I reccommend everyone stop trying to "argue" with this guy. He'll just continue to insult you without reason and hide his stupidity with more baseless arguments. Real clever :rolleyes:

nah,, just with you bro. Read my other posts, I actually have coherent statememts in there. You are the one who crapped on Love, and wants to give Mayo a backrub, so I tried to reason with you at first, that didn't work, then you insulted my basketball intellegence, hence, why you lost credibility with me. I think if you read the PSD basketball threads, I am more than fair with others, and have plenty of basketball knowledge. If you think I am insulting you, that is funny.

Hustla23
03-01-2009, 12:52 PM
nah,, just with you bro. Read my other posts, I actually have coherent statememts in there. You are the one who crapped on Love, and wants to give Mayo a backrub, so I tried to reason with you at first, that didn't work, then you insulted my basketball intellegence, hence, why you lost credibility with me. I think if you read the PSD basketball threads, I am more than fair with others, and have plenty of basketball knowledge. If you think I am insulting you, that is funny.

Uhuh. Can you please point out where I insulted your basketball intelligence? And where I "crapped" on Love? I think I did mention that I liked Love's game and thought he was a good player. Just not as good as Mayo.

Big Quett
03-01-2009, 05:19 PM
Mayo has been followed around like a puppy dog since he was 13. I hope he doesn't burn Memphis, they took a chance on him. But I think he will either require too much money for you guys, or just leave. And you could tell by the look on his face when Minny drafted him, he wasn't happy. He wouldn't even come in for a workout for them. GOodbye

And what does him being followed have to do with anything? Is that his fault? And what does him not being happy have to do with Memphis?

And you say he didnt want to workout for the Wolves. He came in for the Grizz. So what exactly is your point?

Hawkeye15
03-01-2009, 05:48 PM
And what does him being followed have to do with anything? Is that his fault? And what does him not being happy have to do with Memphis?

And you say he didnt want to workout for the Wolves. He came in for the Grizz. So what exactly is your point?

At this point, you and the Grizz fans can be happy with Mayo, Wolves fans will be happy with Love. THis is a senseless argument. I think Love will be just as or more valuable, you don't. I am not covincing you otherwise, and you are not convincing me otherwise. cheers. sick of this. How about we revisit this in 3 years.