View Full Version : Predictions on first signing or trade?

12-04-2008, 08:36 AM
Anyone care to predict when our first move will be and who it will be?

I'm going with Joe Beimel by Sunday (Dec. 7th) this week.

Any one else care to guess?

12-04-2008, 09:46 AM
I really don't see us spending a lot on a SS if the price is right, ok. But I do like Wilson. I feel we need an impact closer more and DD will not tip his hand at this point whether he trades or a FA.

12-04-2008, 12:01 PM
Tigers will make a trade with Texas for one of their catchers - either Laird or one of the young ones like Saltalamacchia

12-04-2008, 01:37 PM
I really don't see us spending a lot on a SS if the price is right, ok. But I do like Wilson. I feel we need an impact closer more and DD will not tip his hand at this point whether he trades or a FA.

Looks as if you might have won. Newark Star Ledger is saying we've aquired Wilson.

12-04-2008, 01:37 PM
Jack Wilson :)

12-04-2008, 10:31 PM
The Pirates are saying no.

12-05-2008, 12:43 PM
Zach Miner to the Rangers for Laird....on Tuesday during the meetings.

Then, we'll grossly overpay in prospects for Jack Wilson by the end of the week. When all we really should need to do is trade them Marcus Thames, Rhymes and Hollimon and not worry about the salary eat from the Pirates.

And then to jump off into fantasyland, we'll package Laird, Wilson, and Magglio Ordonez to the Braves for Brian McCann and Yunel Escobar, take the money saved, sign Tex and move Miggy back to RF, and still be somewhere close to having our full offseason budget to answer other areas.

Matt Joyce and Fernando Rodney to the Mariners for JJ Putz.

If Casey Blake goes to the twins, we'll trade Inge to the Dodgers for "future considerations"

...and my personal favorite, Sheffield and 4 million dollars to the Blue Jays for BJ Ryan.

12-05-2008, 10:30 PM
Wow I like your imagination. Thing is it all makes sense.

12-05-2008, 11:46 PM
I've decided I don't like the idea of trading with Texas for Laird. A Free agent signing of Zaun makes more sense. He hits left handed, will cost about the same as Laird, as a Type B free agent, I don't think he costs us anything draft pick wise, it just gives Toronto a sandwhich pick between the first and second round, and that leaves us with Zach Miner to trade to someone else.

12-06-2008, 02:03 PM
I also wish Both the Tigers and Pirates would pull their heads out of their fannies and realize that they can help each other out here.

Originally I wanted to just make sure the Pirates took either Thames or Rodney in any deal that involved Jack Wilson, as what Thames or Rodney are budgeted to get will likely exceed 3 million anyway after arbitration, and if you subtract that 3 million from Jack Wilson's 7.85 Million, we would have only dipped into our off season budget by 4.85 million. To answer the shortstop question by reducing an outfield logjam on our team and only holding a net cost of 4.85 million for us seemed palatable enough for me given Wilson's medicority, so I'd expect that if we can't put Thames or Rodney onto the Pirates, well then I'd want to see at least 3 million dollars.

What I don't understand, is why the Pirates would hold reticent on preferring to pay part of Wilson's salary to trade him, when they could just get a player like Thames, or even Rodney, give us enough of a salary offset knowing that we won't need or want any money. It doesn't make sense to me.

I would think that these two ballclubs could come up with something that could include Grabow and Wilson, 2 salaries that the Pirates don't care for, and are 2 positions that we could use and are combined going to be just just short of 11 Million, If they took BOTH Thames (a slugging 1B replacement for LaRoche, or at the minimum a platoon with him) and Rodney (a bullpen replacement for Grabow who if he could screw his head on would be a player with a lot of upside), heck give them Joyce also, or throw them a Chris Lambert instead of Joyce, throw them hollimon (figure the 4 of them are going to end up around 8 Million) and boom, we'd actually be relieving THEM 3 million dollars, still giving them SOMETHING, and answering 2 areas for us that we need to answer.

If we got a different arm than Rodney...for Rodney, and answered shortstop all for 3 million out of our own pocket (when considering what was budgeted for the players we would be off-loading), how can't that look good to both clubs? Isn't that the right answer to find middle ground for both clubs?

We'd only be touching 3 million of our 15-20 Million that we have for off season spending and at least made a preliminary answer for the shortstop position and improved our left-handed bullpen depth, it would remove our necessity to hope that McBride can do the job coming back from an injury.

12-06-2008, 02:15 PM
For that matter for Grabow and Wilson and the 11 Million ish they command....

If they want pitching and prospects...fine...

Nate Robertson 7 Million this year, 10 million next.
Matt Joyce (cheap)
Rhymes (cheap)
Hollimon (cheap)
Chris Lambert (cheap)

They come out ahead on dollars a little, Nate will pitch better in the National League and the Pirates still get plenty of youth. We still answer the shortstop question and get a bullpen arm all for the cost of 4 million dollars out of our offseason budget.

That leaves 11 Million for a catcher and more pitching.

12-06-2008, 02:27 PM
So what do we figure, Zaun will cost no more than 4 million?

okay, 7 million for pitching

12-06-2008, 02:34 PM
Rodney, Cleven, & Aquilino Lopez to the Mariners for JJ Putz. (assuming the Pirates took the Nate Robertson option)

Net cost to us about 1.5 Million

5.5 Million left for pitching.

let's review

Adds: Jack Wilson - shortstop, Zaun catcher, Grabow and Putz one left hander and one right hander for the bullpen, both with closing experience.

12-06-2008, 02:49 PM
Money is getting a little tight

Sheffield and Zach Miner (because we didn't trade him to Texas) to the Blue Jays for BJ Ryan.

I figure if we include a young pitcher like Miner, we wouldn't have to pick the difference up between BJ Ryan and Sheff's contract. Sheff goes to them as a one year player (something they have done many times in the past), I think Sheff would waive his no trade clause to go back to the AL East as that is who he is probably auditioning for in this...his contract year.

This gets Toronto out from under a 10 Million dollar obligation to BJ Ryan for 2010 and a pitcher to help offset the loss of Burnett. While I understand Miner is no Burnett, it is a young starter and that is what they are looking for...along with an impact bat. They get an impact bat for a net cost to them of 4 Million dollars.

Now, we've added BJ Ryan, dumped Sheffield which opens up the DH slot for Guillen and saved 4 million dollars.

9.5 million for pitching, and how does our bullpen look now?

12-06-2008, 02:55 PM
According to the Detroit Free Press, the Tigers have become "more aggressive" in their efforts to trade for Gerald Laird.

The paper believes that the Rangers and Tigers could settle on an agreement before the winter meetings get underway on Monday. The Rangers reportedly have interest in some of the Tigers' young pitching prospects, but probably won't be able to land Guillermo Moscoso, Rick Porcello or Casey Crosby.


12-06-2008, 04:58 PM
Doesn't mean I want to give up Fein, or Blaine Neal even.

If it has to be Zach Miner then fine.

DR. Pepper
12-06-2008, 10:45 PM
Dontrelle Willis to the mets for Ryan Church, Scott Shoenewies and Cash
Ordonez the pirates for wilson and grabow

12-07-2008, 09:00 PM
As a Jays fan, let me just say:

...and my personal favorite, Sheffield and 4 million dollars to the Blue Jays for BJ Ryan.