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ndfan23
11-28-2008, 03:12 AM
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=556~575~356~3032&teams=4~4~23~23&te=&cash=4:23

Suggestions????

Blindmolerat
11-28-2008, 04:07 AM
Sorry, but that trade is really one-sided in favor of the Kings. The Bulls would really have to have a great desire for Brad Miller in order to get this done because nobody wants Mikki Moore.

As for Larry Hughes coming to the Kings, with a healthy complement of Salmons, Martin, Garcia and Green I'm not quite sure how the rotation would work.

Either way this trade is really one sided and won't happen.

ndfan23
11-28-2008, 04:26 AM
Just wanted to let you know that I am a bulls fan and I thought it would be better with Mikki Moore. So Brad Miller for TT and Thabo Shefolsha?

Blindmolerat
11-28-2008, 06:47 PM
Man, both those trades seem really good for the Kings, but they also seem really one sided, imo.

That's just my opinion.

I hope John Paxon is thinking like you, lol

Are you guys really that big on Brad Miller? I mean, he is a very versatile big man and could help make that offense more smoothly, but he is starting to get a little old and definitely isn't as athletic as he used to be.

ndfan23
11-28-2008, 07:22 PM
If you seen our frontcourt we really need a center and Miller contract expires in 2010 when I think we will be big players for Amare or Wade. Also Thabo doesnt play and Tyrus is just crap

FarOutIos
11-29-2008, 06:11 AM
The trade does not look that one sided. In fact, it could actually be a decent trade for both clubs. Tyrus has been shooting horribly, but you really get him for a long term potential. Chicago is looking to contend, so Brad would greatly help their team. I think Hughes would play point guard if included, but I would rather get Thabo. I think he has higher potential and we would be able to put Salmons on the trading block...

Kings Faithful
11-30-2008, 05:28 AM
The problem of salaries comes into play regarding the Miller for Thabo and Tyrus trade. Miller has 11 mil on his contract while thabo and tyrus only combine for about 5 mil.

FarOutIos
11-30-2008, 10:00 AM
The problem of salaries comes into play regarding the Miller for Thabo and Tyrus trade. Miller has 11 mil on his contract while thabo and tyrus only combine for about 5 mil.

Looks like Chicago has some bad contracts, too... plus we really need a long term option at point guard, IMO. Something more like this http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=356~3028~3000~556~3040~3195~27 94&teams=23~29~4~4~29~23~23&te=&cash=

FarOutIos
11-30-2008, 10:21 AM
... or something like this would be fun...
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2772~509~2006~802~556~849~510&teams=23~23~18~14~14~18~6&te=&cash=

Kings Faithful
11-30-2008, 07:01 PM
That isn't happening unless someone sends a 1st round pick Memphis' way. I have been intrigued at receiving Conley, who doesn't get as much minutes with the addition of Oj Mayo. I think he might explode into a Deron Williams, Chris Paul ISH point guard eventually in this league. He has the potential.

FarOutIos
12-03-2008, 05:58 AM
That isn't happening unless someone sends a 1st round pick Memphis' way. I have been intrigued at receiving Conley, who doesn't get as much minutes with the addition of Oj Mayo. I think he might explode into a Deron Williams, Chris Paul ISH point guard eventually in this league. He has the potential.

I agree. Conley would be the focus of my making a trade. He is definitely someone with long term potential to be a top 5 starting PG. Only problem is that our most likely to move player is Miller... and the Griz don't need Miller.

I could see them going for a player like Salmons though...

That would give Donte a chance to play more...

bleedpurple93
12-03-2008, 03:10 PM
It has been a long time since I posted anything on in PSD just because it has been such an abysmal season. But after watching every minute of every game, I have finally figured out what is going on with the Sacramento Kings.....

They Are Tanking Games

I know you may not believe it, or want to hear it, but please read my points as to why below-- Keep in mind I love the Kings and want to see them succeed, so I'm not a bitter fan, and I've been following the Kings for 10 years. Here we go, in order of sequence:

1) Petrie's track record shows only one signigicant FA Signing in the Kings era: Vlade Divac (whom I loved but lets face it, he was not a real star). Every other Star Player we've ever had (i.e. Webber, Bibby, Peja, Miller,) was obtained in trade or through the draft. Why? Because big name FA as you've all agreed in other threads are NOT coming to small market sactown. Even Webber who was traded here, whined the whole time until the fans embraced him. ***Thus, point #1 is that Petrie knows the only true way to get a superstar in the NBA is to draft high (see Portland w/back to back high picks) and how successful they are now.

2) Management has been pushing Theus to play the Youth....Develop the young guys, and help build a foundation. But then a week later he is being crucified on the radio by Joe Maloof for not winning? I don't buy it. That was a brilliant PR move in order to make it look like they actually care about winning so it doesn't appear that they are okay with losing. Over the last few years the Maloofs have always been vocal, but Petrie has always made sure those guys don't say something stupid to embarrass the organization. Also, at a 5 and 15 record, most other coaches with no proof of a winning history would be fired by now. (See PJ Carlisemo)

3) Inexplicable Coaching Moves by Theus. I don't know about you guys, but I actually think Reggie Theus is a good coach, and even in his rookie campaign, I saw him make some good decisions. This year, he is making very strange timeout calls, subsitutions, and play calls...Last night for example, was insane- I've been around coaches for several years and the one thing I know is that you never put a completely cold body into a game in crunch time, that is just ludicrous...and Reggie is NOT that stupid. He is a smart coach and there is no way I believe he puts in Douby OVER Garcia whom he has always favored since Louisville. No way. Not now, not ever, not on purpose. And a timeout at 3:59 in the 4th to draw a post up play call for Martin? Post Up? Again...no way...Theus is not making decisions that dumb.

4) Injury Bug... Hhhhmmmm, 4-5 Weeks for a Calf Strain (Garcia), 3 Extra Weeks for an Ankle (Martin), Garcia and Martin come back and all of a sudden Salmons is unavailable? Don't get me wrong, I believe of course all these guys were very injured, but the delay in rehab, and softness of Salmons thigh injury has me very intrigued.

5) Close Game Losses... Miller, Martin, Moore, Bobby Jackson- these guys are all Veteran players and have been on the floor in most end of game situations, and they know how to win-- the young guys have not been making the mistakes-- these guys have. Did anyone else find it strange that Miller didn't even step up on Deron Williams jumper last night, or that all of our bigs let hime waltz in the lane without so much as breathing on him in crunch time? I'm not saying that they are in on the big plot, but they are NOT putting in the effort that THEUS has been known to squeeze out, and under normal circumstances Theus would be furious-- but if you look at him on the sidelines-- even with his contract situation-- he seems calm, poised, and collected. Even his post game conference is subdued and low key. I know Theus is always poised and put together because he is that type of guy---but at 5-15 and inexplicable meltdowns, I would have to think we'd see a hint of frusteration-- and we haven't. Why? Because I don't think he is overly concerned with his job status.

6) The Wrap Up:

Theus has been given a directive by upper management (i.e. the Maloofs, Petrie) to play the young guys as much as possible to speed up the franchises development for next year and 2010. Knowing they will never land a FA outright without paying Gilbert Arenas money, they can tank games without actually having to say it. Theus does what he is told because he wants to stay around and grow with these young guys. He plays Donte, Quincy, and Thompson at in-opportune moments so that Petrie can evaluate what he has for future trades/signings, and waive options (See Miller, Moore, Williams). Theus is told that he needs to put these players in prime time situations - thus Quincy for 2 game winning shot attempts, and big shots last night. Thompson playing in the 4th making rookie mistakes (see fouling jumpshooters against detroit in the fourth).

Joe/Gavin make it appear like they are very concerned with winning by going to the games (even traveling for most- Gavin), and talking to the media about Theus' job security. This way, they have the option of firing or keeping Theus at any point and can still make it look like they weren't taking games.

Lastly, in the NBA, you don't choke this many games out by two points if you have Veterans on the team. Especially to the Nets. Or get blown out by a very bad Memphis team. Bad defensive schemes, timeouts, and play-calls are all easy ways to throw games without the fans or players being able to really accuse the organization of anything concrete. Only speculate.

I personally think this is the BEST thing for the organization and am in full agreement with this because quite frankly, until we get a star player, and a really athletic big man, we aren't going anywhere- and in the NBA no team ever lets those guys go-- see Orlando (Howard), Atlanta (Smith), Minnesota (Garnett), Cleveland (James), Denver (Anthony), Miami (Wade)....on and on and on. They give those guys extensions in their prime, and if you are lucky, the only thing you can do is a pull a Boston and hope the aged stars have gas in the tank.

I see Ricky Rubio/Brandon Jennings, or Blake Griffin in our future. I also see a later pick such as Hansborough in our future as well. And I think we have seen the last of Miller and Moore.

PS-- Two Years ago I told everyone in this forum how great Hawes would be, and 50% of you said I was crazy and that he was a slow, unathletic, jumpshooting Center who couldn't play defense. Thanks to the 50% who agreed with me, and thanks to Hawes for proving me right.

The future is bright for us--- Hawes Starting, with a high draft pick at the PF and/or Point positions next year with a healthy Martin and Salmons. Bringing Brown, Thompson, Garcia off the Bench. Perhaps picking up a FA such as Joe Johhson or Shawn Marion in trade.

Tank away I say...Tank away.

FarOutIos
12-03-2008, 06:01 PM
1) I agree 100%... i've been saying the same thing.

2) Agreed.

3) Only makes sense assuming #4

4) A little bit of a stretch, but why not.

5) Close game losses do make the game more enjoyable... lose, but don't lose the fans... I agree.

6) I agree totally. We do need to get better via draft... Wade, LeBron, and other great will not sign as a FA with us. Too small of a market. We do need to get a high pick and maybe another player via trade. I love Brad Millers improvement the last year, and he will be greatly desired by playoff teams. Also, he would be a great fit for teams like Miami, Chicago...

Kyle916
12-03-2008, 07:23 PM
That's ridiculous. Sure, playing Douby when he did is a head-scratcher, but to accuse of tanking is absurd. Rebuilding means developing guys like Hawes, Thompson, Bobby Brown, and Greene, even if that unfortunately means significantly more losses. We need to develop those guys that have a future in the organization. To say that we're tanking is nuts, we're just playing the guys that need time to get ready so we can move on from the rebuilding stage even if that means not giving the team the best chance to win.

Kings Faithful
12-03-2008, 08:11 PM
I'm actually not sure they are tanking....If we were tanking and trying to build youth Jason Thompson would be getting much more minutes. He only gets major time in garbage games lately, but in close games he barely averages 12 mpg....And the draft this year is REALLY weak, so i just don't see it, nor do i want to see it. Reggie will be gone by the end of the month. If he isn't then ill be more inclined to believe you.

DerekRE_3
12-03-2008, 08:15 PM
I'm actually not sure they are tanking....If we were tanking and trying to build youth Jason Thompson would be getting much more minutes. He only gets major time in garbage games lately, but in close games he barely averages 12 mpg....And the draft this year is REALLY weak, so i just don't see it, nor do i want to see it. Reggie will be gone by the end of the month. If he isn't then ill be more inclined to believe you.

Um...Brandon Jennings, maybe Rubio, BJ Mullens, Griffin (who is going to be SICK). We need a top 5 pick. Then we can get Jennings, who fits the style of play we want to do perfectly. A Jennings/Martin backcourt would be one of the quickest in the league.

Kings Faithful
12-03-2008, 09:20 PM
Um...Brandon Jennings, maybe Rubio, BJ Mullens, Griffin (who is going to be SICK). We need a top 5 pick. Then we can get Jennings, who fits the style of play we want to do perfectly. A Jennings/Martin backcourt would be one of the quickest in the league.

Yeah, those guys aren't ridiculously special, aside from maby Griffin. Rubio is only getting attention because he can play and he's only 18...but he's no Chris Paul. Judging by his numbers on his Euro team Jennings doesn't look to great either, 9 ppg and 2 apg.....idk, i think this was a really bad season for the Kings to suck.

DerekRE_3
12-03-2008, 09:26 PM
Yeah, those guys aren't ridiculously special, aside from maby Griffin. Rubio is only getting attention because he can play and he's only 18...but he's no Chris Paul. Judging by his numbers on his Euro team Jennings doesn't look to great either, 9 ppg and 2 apg.....idk, i think this was a really bad season for the Kings to suck.

First off, stats are so overrated, even more so in Euro leagues. The style of play is completely different there. On a good Euro-League team, their best player may average 15 ppg. They distribute the minutes and the points much more evenly in the Euro-Leagues. Not to mention the fact that Jennings is 19 years old, and the level of competition he is facing playing in the Italian League is a good amount tougher than what he would be facing in the Pac 10 and in college.

Brandon Jennings is an insane athlete and is one of the fastest players with the ball I have seen. Think of Brandon Jennings as the black version of Steve Nash, but quicker.

Agent008
12-03-2008, 10:17 PM
I would go with Rubio over Jennings, but that's just me. Here would be my current wish list (I'm sure it will change by draft time though):

1. Ricky Rubio
2. Blake Griffin
3. Brandon Jennings
4. Jrue Holiday
5. Demar DeRozan
6. Al-Farouq Aminu

Kings Faithful
12-04-2008, 02:48 AM
First off, stats are so overrated, even more so in Euro leagues. The style of play is completely different there. On a good Euro-League team, their best player may average 15 ppg. They distribute the minutes and the points much more evenly in the Euro-Leagues. Not to mention the fact that Jennings is 19 years old, and the level of competition he is facing playing in the Italian League is a good amount tougher than what he would be facing in the Pac 10 and in college.

Brandon Jennings is an insane athlete and is one of the fastest players with the ball I have seen. Think of Brandon Jennings as the black version of Steve Nash, but quicker.

Yeah i know stats are overrated, but i can't help but think Jennings is just going to turn into Bobby Jackson/Bobby Brown/ Ronny Price V2....Just a highly athletic shooting guard with a point guard body you know. I'm skeptical. I wish we wouldve sucked this bad when Carmelo, Bosh, Paul, Williams, Lebron were all available. This draft just isn't close compared to that, you gotta admit that at least.

Agent008
12-04-2008, 03:35 AM
I don't know how this draft is going to stack up talent wise compared to other drafts, but one good thing is the depth at PG in this draft. There's around 10 PG's and combo guards expected to go in the first round. Barring any trades, I would be really surprised if we didn't pick up a PG in this year's draft, no matter where we pick.

Kyle916
12-04-2008, 03:45 AM
The only thing holding Jennings back from blowing up is: a) he needs to make sure his head is screwed on straight (focused on basketball and not all being a basketball star entails) and b) he needs to develop a better basketball IQ. he's a bit raw on the intangibles part on the court.

athletically he has it all.

DerekRE_3
12-04-2008, 04:29 AM
Yeah i know stats are overrated, but i can't help but think Jennings is just going to turn into Bobby Jackson/Bobby Brown/ Ronny Price V2....Just a highly athletic shooting guard with a point guard body you know. I'm skeptical. I wish we wouldve sucked this bad when Carmelo, Bosh, Paul, Williams, Lebron were all available. This draft just isn't close compared to that, you gotta admit that at least.

Jennings is a much more creative passer than all the guys you mentioned. Not to mention he's more athletic than all of them, and quicker. Plus, at the age of 19, none of those guys were even close to being at the level Jennings is at right now.

FarOutIos
12-04-2008, 06:09 AM
i watched some of the highlights for Jennings and you can tell that he is a special player. His court awareness and ability to control and pass the ball was amazing. He will be a player with nash/magic/kidd type of skill potential.

Playing in europe is tougher than you may think, like the previous poster stated. Here is a kid graduating high school and goes to play with grown men... and while players like lebron did it... the euroleague is a lot more physical. AND he is having to adjust to being in a foreign country... without his family and friends. AND his is having to try and communicate with his teammates, who most likely speak broken english. AND he is probably competing for minutes with a player from the country he is playing in... thus feeling like an outsider on his own team. AND when he goes to other arenas, the opposing crowds can get REAL ROUDY. Think Raider Game black hole roudy... thats European basketball.

I would love to have him play here. His oversees experience will undoubtedly give him maturity beyond the pampered college experience he bypassed.

M's Fan2411
12-04-2008, 07:24 AM
There's a lot of talent in next years draft we just got to look closer off the top of my head I can count a bunch
Jennings, Rubio, De Rozan, Mullens, Griffin, Holiday, Harden( Harden has fantastic start so far)

Stephen Curry talent is also available from the 10-20 picks....There isn't as much talent as past years but when was the last time the Kings started 5-15...it's been a while so we should get a top 5 pick!
We will end up with around 20 wins But I do understand what some of you guys are saying about the talent in next years draft....

Bring on either Griffin or Jennings huh!

bleedpurple93
12-04-2008, 10:27 AM
Kings Faithful...I should have mentioned at the beginning of my post that I was basing this on exactly what you just said--- if Reggie Theus is still here at the end of the year.

This is only a theory of mine and it does hinge around Theus sticking around. So I respect your view to wait and see.


I heard Reggie on the radio last night and I just don't get the sense that he is going anywhere, but then again, anythings possible.

5-15 is horrendous though, and he is still here. Albeit he has had some major injury problems.

Kyle916
12-04-2008, 03:45 PM
Jennings relies on his freak athleticism right now. I think is decision to go to Europe will help him develop discipline and help him gain a better basketball IQ. Basically, I think he would be a great pick up if he doesn't just rely on his talent alone.

Kings Faithful
12-04-2008, 07:57 PM
Kings Faithful...I should have mentioned at the beginning of my post that I was basing this on exactly what you just said--- if Reggie Theus is still here at the end of the year.

This is only a theory of mine and it does hinge around Theus sticking around. So I respect your view to wait and see.


I heard Reggie on the radio last night and I just don't get the sense that he is going anywhere, but then again, anythings possible.

5-15 is horrendous though, and he is still here. Albeit he has had some major injury problems.

Well I see your point then. And as far as Jennings goes, i'll respect your guys' knowledge of that kind of stuff and root to get him. He's definitely the best PG available aside from Rubio maby and is the kind of player we need, if your words about his passing skills being good are true. Alot of the early mock drafts have us taking him at the #5 spot in the draft....I honestly think we'll go on a win streak at some point and get somewhere in the 9-15 range again thoe.

dick butane
12-05-2008, 03:58 AM
The trade does not look that one sided. In fact, it could actually be a decent trade for both clubs. Tyrus has been shooting horribly, but you really get him for a long term potential. Chicago is looking to contend, so Brad would greatly help their team. I think Hughes would play point guard if included, but I would rather get Thabo. I think he has higher potential and we would be able to put Salmons on the trading block...

What long term potential could a "horrible" shooter have?

FarOutIos
12-07-2008, 10:40 AM
What long term potential could a "horrible" shooter have?

Not sure which player you are referring to... Thabo is not a horrible shooter, so I would assume that it is Tyrus. And to answer the question, he has more potential as a PF than a SF. He would need to bulk up and work on his low post moves. He could become a defensive presence in the post. Even if he is not a great shooter, he has potential to become valuable.

...and he has been shooting horribly of late. Does not mean he is a horrible shooter... could just be a cold patch in his career.