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View Full Version : Knicks trade Jamal Crawford to the Warriors for Al Harrington



JordansBulls
11-21-2008, 03:35 PM
Source: ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3717209)



The Golden State Warriors and New York Knicks have received league approval to complete a trade that will swap disgruntled Warriors forward Al Harrington for Knicks guard Jamal Crawford.


ESPN The Magazine's Ric Bucher confirmed the league's sign-off after reporting early Friday morning that the teams were nearing completion on a deal featuring Harrington and Crawford.

Although neither team has commented, NBA front-office sources told ESPN.com that the deal involves no other players and will be formally announced later Friday





Source: NYDailynews (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/2008/11/21/2008-11-21_knicks_trade_jamal_crawford_for_al_harri.html)



After dealing Jamal Crawford to the Warriors for Al Harrington, the Knicks are working on a trade that would land Zach Randolph in Dallas.

Jerry Stackhouse has expressed a desire to be traded but his contract is half the value of Randolph's deal.

Unless another player is thrown into the trade, there is a possibility that the Knicks will recruit a third team to make the Randolph deal work.

The Clippers, however, are still hoping to acquire Randolph for Tim Thomas and Cuttino Mobley.

JJ81
11-21-2008, 03:40 PM
The New York Knicks were expected to announce a trade for Golden State Warriors forward Al Harrington on Friday.

Media reports had the Knicks sending guard Jamal Crawford to Golden State, though it was unclear if he was the only player.

A trade was expected to be announced later Friday, according to a person with knowledge of the deal who spoke on condition of anonymity because it hadn't been completed.

Knicks coach Mike D'Antoni said on Friday that his roster was likely to change before the Knicks' game against the Bucks on Friday night, acknowledging reports that Knicks president Donnie Walsh was working on several trades.

"Let's wait until it happens -- if it happens," D'Antoni said before the morning shootaround. "Obviously, that would be tampering if I said something."

D'Antoni said he expected Walsh to make moves to reshape the team in hopes of clearing salary cap space before the summer of 2010, and this might be the first.

"The thing is, I think this will happen a few times during the year, because I think Donnie has got his plan, and he will execute it as he sees fit," D'Antoni said. "And we'll go forward. Now is this the first step? I don't know for sure."

Crawford said he first heard about the potential deal Thursday night and now considers it "more likely" than not that the trade will happen. But he wasn't letting it bother him.

"When I was younger, when I first got in the league and you hear trade rumors, (I was) nervous then," Crawford said. "But now? No. Because you can't worry about stuff you can't control."

D'Antoni acknowledged that a trade could dramatically shorten his bench for Friday's game and temporarily disrupt the team's focus.

"I think this is where you have to be professional," D'Antoni said. "This is where it's tough, and it's a hard part of the business."

http://www.nba.com/2008/news/11/21/harrington.trade.ap/index.html

Halladay
11-21-2008, 03:43 PM
What? Crawford is the last guy the Knicks should trade...that trade wouldn't make much sense to me and obviously clearing cap space is the key for N.Y but still. Boggles the mind.

JMan17
11-21-2008, 03:46 PM
wtf knicks? the team is actually playing pretty decent and they screw it up by giving up their best players for al Harrington, tim thomas and mobley? It's really obvious that they are just clearing cap up for lebron, but i they could of traded away curry instead of crawford or something for this crap :pity:

Halladay
11-21-2008, 03:46 PM
I said it in another thread and I just don't get the Crawford deal. That's one guy the Knicks should hold onto, the last guy they should look to deal even if they're clearing cap space. Trading Randolph is fine, he's a cancer but I just don't get the Crawford deal. Why wouldn't NY try and get a draft pick or a young player instead of Harrington?

JJ81
11-21-2008, 03:47 PM
On the face of it, I think it's a poor trade for both teams.

JMan17
11-21-2008, 03:48 PM
I said it in another thread and I just don't get the Crawford deal. That's one guy the Knicks should hold onto, the last guy they should look to deal even if they're clearing cap space. Trading Randolph is fine, he's a cancer but I just don't get the Crawford deal. Why wouldn't NY try and get a draft pick or a young player instead of Harrington?

soon lebron and some of the other free agents will just say screw it and either stay or join another team and knicks would suck for like 10 more years.

Donnie Walsh=Isiah :pity:

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:49 PM
It helps get Knicks into the Lebron Sweepstakes in 2010. That is all. It just ensures that they will suck until then

JMan17
11-21-2008, 03:49 PM
On the face of it, I think it's a poor trade for both teams.

how is it poor for the Warriors?

Cracka2HI!
11-21-2008, 03:50 PM
Yea that would be great if the Clippers traded our 2 biggest 2010 exprining contracts and all of our cap room for the next 4 years so we can get Randolph and get back into that precious 32-37 7th to 12th pick in the draft slot that we love so much :rolleyes: Clippers trade Mobley and Thomas for Randolph we are trading 2 lousy seasons with potential top 3 picks and $15 million in cap space in 2010 for 4 guaranteed 32 wins seasons! DON'T DO IT!!!

JMan17
11-21-2008, 03:50 PM
It helps get Knicks into the Lebron Sweepstakes in 2010. That is all. It just ensures that they will suck until then

and what happens if lebron does not sign with knicks and just goes to the nets or stays with the cavs?

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:51 PM
can we get a mod to combine some of these topics... forum is getting a bit cluttered

On another note: Randolph to the Mavs would put them in luxury tax position for years to come. Good move!

LAKERS 24/7
11-21-2008, 03:52 PM
I don't understand why the knicks want to get rid of Jamaal, especially for Harrington? And what good reason does stackhouse have to be disgruntled all of a sudden?

hyp21
11-21-2008, 03:52 PM
Well Harrington asked for his trade and he got it........probably didn't see the knicks in his future.

JMan17
11-21-2008, 03:53 PM
Yea that would be great if the Clippers traded our 2 biggest 2010 exprining contracts and all of our cap room for the next 4 years so we can get Randolph and get back into that precious 32-37 7th to 12th pick in the draft slot that we love so much :rolleyes: Clippers trade Mobley and Thomas for Randolph we are trading 2 lousy seasons with potential top 3 picks and $15 million in cap space in 2010 for 4 guaranteed 32 wins seasons! DON'T DO IT!!!

The Clippers want to win now dude. they got baron davis and marcus camby for a reason. if they wanted to suck this year and get a good pick, they would have never even attempted either of those guys.

and Randolph is playing amazing right now. with him at PF and Kamen at Center and Camby at backup! but then again the clippers record is still bad so even with this said, i see ur point.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:55 PM
I don't understand why the knicks want to get rid of Jamaal, especially for Harrington? And what good reason does stackhouse have to be disgruntled all of a sudden?

Knicks are trying to trade everyone with a large contract that does not expire in the next 2 years so they can make a bid for Lebron.

And stack is angry because he sucks.

hyp21
11-21-2008, 03:55 PM
Um....I thought Isaiah Thomas was given the boot??? wtf is going on with knicks management?

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:55 PM
The Clippers want to win now dude. they got baron davis and marcus camby for a reason. if they wanted to suck this year and get a good pick, they would have never even attempted either of those guys.

and Randolph is playing amazing right now. with him at PF and Kamen at Center and Camby at backup! but then again the clippers record is still bad so even with this said, i see ur point.

They sure aren't showing it right now...

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:56 PM
Um....I thought Isaiah Thomas was given the boot??? wtf is going on with knicks management?

Knicks are trading for shorter contracts now rather than Thomas trading for bigger contracts.

JJ81
11-21-2008, 03:56 PM
how is it poor for the Warriors?

I just don't think he's gonna fit in there. He doesn't defend, rebound, block. He's a streaky shooter.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 03:58 PM
and what happens if lebron does not sign with knicks and just goes to the nets or stays with the cavs?

Then they will go after Amare, Dirk, or whichever other superstar is a FA after 2 years, its a big class in 2 years.

Right now the Knicks have 35.5 million commited to the 2010-2011 season. A trade of Randolph would knock it under 20 million, thus putting them in bobcat territory from two years ago. They will suck until that FA class comes out

GiantYankKnicks
11-21-2008, 03:59 PM
I wish we would have kept him since he will probley opt out but W/e Donnie is looking towards the future/2010 and with Zach most likely gone 2 are shot at the Playoffs diminsh.O well Blake Griffin would look good in a Knick Uni

king4day
11-21-2008, 04:00 PM
I just don't think he's gonna fit in there. He doesn't defend, rebound, block. He's a streaky shooter.

For the Warriors, it at least gives them someone who will play and not complain.

hyp21
11-21-2008, 04:02 PM
Knicks are trading for shorter contracts now rather than Thomas trading for bigger contracts.

I see what they're doing and all....but why now? Shoulda did that in the offseason. They're 6-5 and not playing terrible basketball. Why disrupt the chemistry by trading Crawford and trying to deal Randolph who's LEADING the team in scoring???? Weird timing imo. Seems like they're telling everyone now that they're mailing it in now so they can make a splash in FA for the future

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:04 PM
I just don't think he's gonna fit in there. He doesn't defend, rebound, block. He's a streaky shooter.

When Ellis comes back it gives them a lineup of...

PG - Crawford
SG - Ellis
SF - Jackson
PF - Maggette
C - Biedrins

With Azubuike coming off the bench

Its a damn fun team to watch if nothing else

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:05 PM
I see what they're doing and all....but why now? Shoulda did that in the offseason. They're 6-5 and not playing terrible basketball. Why disrupt the chemistry by trading Crawford and trying to deal Randolph who's LEADING the team in scoring???? Weird timing imo. Seems like they're telling everyone now that they're mailing it in now so they can make a splash in FA for the future

That I can't tell you. You are right in that respect. Why not wait till trading deadline, when Crawfords value will be higher. At that point, you can reasses the team, maybe they arent above .500 but lingering in the basement of the Atlantic Division. There end goal is a good one, but how they are getting there is a bit suspect. No need to rush these trades, you have atleast 2 more years before you have any chance at being a legit contender.

JMan17
11-21-2008, 04:07 PM
I just don't think he's gonna fit in there. He doesn't defend, rebound, block. He's a streaky shooter.

he's a guard, why would he need to do those things? unless ur talking about randolph? but Crawford is actually a pretty decent defender. and i think he's much more then a streaky shooter.

hyp21
11-21-2008, 04:08 PM
^yeah, it's strange. I dunno what reason they have for being willing to perhaps tanking this season for? There's nothing really out there to scream and holla about in the draft and Golden State is completely raping them in this trade and Dallas certainly is gonna be doing the same. Poor knicks fans....

mantlefan07
11-21-2008, 04:10 PM
I know this has to happen in order to get under the cap for a run at LeBron but, I like Crawford.

I guess it's cool. There wasn't any hope for this team coming into this season so, going back to that idea won't be too hard!

madiaz3
11-21-2008, 04:14 PM
I said it in another thread and I just don't get the Crawford deal. That's one guy the Knicks should hold onto, the last guy they should look to deal even if they're clearing cap space. Trading Randolph is fine, he's a cancer but I just don't get the Crawford deal. Why wouldn't NY try and get a draft pick or a young player instead of Harrington?

Randolph is no longer a cancer. Crawford has been more hurtful to the Knicks this season than Randolph. By this, I simply mean that when he's not scoring, he shoots more, doesn't bother on defense, doesn't play to the system. Randolph, first off, I can't cite a game where he hasn't scored 14+ (without forcing, mind you) while he still rebounds great and continues to not be a pushover on defense, though not necessarily great.

superkegger
11-21-2008, 04:15 PM
I see what they're doing and all....but why now? Shoulda did that in the offseason. They're 6-5 and not playing terrible basketball. Why disrupt the chemistry by trading Crawford and trying to deal Randolph who's LEADING the team in scoring???? Weird timing imo. Seems like they're telling everyone now that they're mailing it in now so they can make a splash in FA for the future

Probably because no one would do the deals in the offseason. A lot of teams have unrealistic impressions of themselves thinking they can make some noise. Now they realize, "Oh ****, we suck." So they look to make moves.

As far as the knicks go, I like it.

But what no one else has brought up yet. Why would the mavs want randolph? Do they really think he's the answer to their problems thus far this year? I don't get that at all.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:15 PM
^yeah, it's strange. I dunno what reason they have for being willing to perhaps tanking this season for? There's nothing really out there to scream and holla about in the draft and Golden State is completely raping them in this trade and Dallas certainly is gonna be doing the same. Poor knicks fans....

It be nice if they atleast included a young role player in the deal because Harrington really doesn't have value at this point. He will bring down some boards and get you 14-15 points per game. But its not like they brought in a clean cut guy who is unselfish...

mrblisterdundee
11-21-2008, 04:16 PM
That trade will go down as one of the dumbest moves of a Knicks GM. He is the team's leading scorer, and one of their best distributors. Jamal Crawford fit great in D'Antoni's system.
On the other side, Al Harrington is unneeded. The Knicks already have David Lee and Wilson Chandler at the forward spot, with Zach Randolph filling out the frontcourt.

Why would a GM trade one of the two best players on a winning team for crap? We can now expect the Knicks' performance to suffer.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:17 PM
Probably because no one would do the deals in the offseason. A lot of teams have unrealistic impressions of themselves thinking they can make some noise. Now they realize, "Oh ****, we suck." So they look to make moves.

As far as the knicks go, I like it.

But what no one else has brought up yet. Why would the mavs want randolph? Do they really think he's the answer to their problems thus far this year? I don't get that at all.

Hyp's point was why not wait till the trading deadline, and I agree. You usually get more for players as you get closer to the trading deadline because there are teams who think they are on the verge of being a contender and one move can put them over that hump.

Giaps
11-21-2008, 04:19 PM
2010?

madiaz3
11-21-2008, 04:19 PM
Quoting myself from the other thread:

Randolph is no longer a cancer. Crawford has been more hurtful to the Knicks this season than Randolph. By this, I simply mean that when he's not scoring, he shoots more, doesn't bother on defense, doesn't play to the system. Randolph, first off, I can't cite a game where he hasn't scored 14+ (without forcing, mind you) while he still rebounds great and continues to not be a pushover on defense, though not necessarily a great defender.

Let's not forget a certain Stephon Marbury who is arguably still the best player on the Knicks at this point in time that can take his place, and unless you have been following the Knicks closely this season with Marbury and through the preseason, he's already proven a changed attitude (I think his fathers passing might have changed him.) and that he and Duhon make a great combo.

AND, 2010 of course.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:20 PM
Randolph is most likely going to be dealt.

As for worst move in Knicks history?

Signing Jerome James
Trading for Malik Rose
Trading for Starbury
Trading for Francis
Trading for Randolph
Trading for Curry
need I go on...

And another thing. There are 3 posts talking about this trade, do you really need to create another?

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:21 PM
Quoting myself from the other thread:


Case in point. SOME MOD MERGE THESE THREADS PLEASE!!!!!

DerekRE_3
11-21-2008, 04:21 PM
They have had too many swingmen before the Harrington-Crawford trade, what are they thinking? They have a TON of swingmen on their team.

Stephen Jackson
Corey Maggette
Jamal Crawford
Kelenna Azubuike
Marco Belinelli
Anthony Morrow

Not only that, they just extended Jackson, gave Maggette a big contract, and Crawford isn't cheap either. Both Maggette and Jackson are on the books for the next 5 years, and Crawford is signed for the next 3 years. Not to mention they just signed Monta Ellis and Biedrins to huge contracts.

I have to think this isn't the only trade the Warriors are going to make. But Jackson and Maggette are going to be tough to move with their contracts.

And who is going to start?

DreamShaker
11-21-2008, 04:21 PM
Walsh has been really bad the past few years....I really don't see why the Knicks wanted him after butchering the Pacers....this move makes no sesnse other than Walsh's strange man-crush with Harrington....

superkegger
11-21-2008, 04:21 PM
Randolph is most likely going to be dealt.

As for worst move in Knicks history?

Signing Jerome James
Trading for Malik Rose
Trading for Starbury
Trading for Francis
Trading for Randolph
Trading for Curry
need I go on...

And another thing. There are 3 posts talking about this trade, do you really need to create another?

Yeah, harrington may not be needed, but hes not a scrub, he's probably talent wise better than crawford.

and please stop making new threads about the same trade. :pity:

GiantYankKnicks
11-21-2008, 04:22 PM
2010

DerekRE_3
11-21-2008, 04:23 PM
Jamal Crawford isn't going to win the Knicks a championship, but maybe Lebron can. But they are going to have to move Randolph first.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:23 PM
OH MY GOD!!!!!!! Post in the other threads!!!!!!!!! We have 5 different freakin threads about this trade!!!!!!

To answer your question: Harrington wanted out. He requested a trade. Why keep a player who didn't want to be there?

MiamiHeat
11-21-2008, 04:23 PM
shorter contracts?

DerekRE_3
11-21-2008, 04:23 PM
OH MY GOD!!!!!!! Post in the other threads!!!!!!!!! We have 5 different freakin threads about this trade!!!!!!

To answer your question: Harrington wanted out. He requested a trade. Why keep a player who didn't want to be there?

Why trade him for ANOTHER swing man. And let a mod decide whether or not to merge the threads. Pretty sure a glaring need is a real point guard.

Jetsguy
11-21-2008, 04:24 PM
All awful moves by the Knicks...as a fan it makes me sick and the kicker is we are doing all this for Lebron but who is to say he even wants to come here? I know there is speculation but cummon this is insane what if we do all this and he doesnt come? Then what? oh yeah we will suck for another 10 years!! This is so irritating getting rid of quality players just to get under the cap and not even worrying about getting equal value. What is Lebrons problem now? He has no other good players! What wil be his problem in coming to NY? We have no other good players to draw him here and compliment him!

In 2 years all the FA's are gonna be 2 years older and tougher to build a franshise around at 28+ years old. Not to mention all it takes is 1 injury in the next two seasons to a d-wade or a bosh and all this racket of getting under the cap for nothing.We have 0 young talent and no draft picks!!!!

I hate being a knicks fan right now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MiamiHeat
11-21-2008, 04:24 PM
they need to trade Biedrins to the Heat :)

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:24 PM
Jamal Crawford isn't going to win the Knicks a championship, but maybe Lebron can. But they are going to have to move Randolph first.

exactly. big picture. the only criticism is that they could have waited till the trade deadline when Crawfords value may have been higher. The team was doing well, why not wait until they start to fall off to dish him.

superkegger
11-21-2008, 04:25 PM
Hyp's point was why not wait till the trading deadline, and I agree. You usually get more for players as you get closer to the trading deadline because there are teams who think they are on the verge of being a contender and one move can put them over that hump.

thats true, but I think at the trade deadline teams either make huge moves like we saw last year, or they make minor ones, and the knicks don't really have the huge move capability for the lack of a huge name. They do have the minor names (ala Kyle Korver last year) that they can move at the deadline. Crawford and harrington are both like inbetween the minor names but not big names, so yeah. Come the deadline the knicks will still have those guys people might want to just tweak some things. especially with the numbers some of their guys put up in D'Antoni's system.


Walsh has been really bad the past few years....I really don't see why the Knicks wanted him after butchering the Pacers....this move makes no sesnse other than Walsh's strange man-crush with Harrington....

Can you merge the plethora of threads about this DS?

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:25 PM
When Ellis comes back starting line up of Crawford, Ellis, Jackson, Maggette, Biedrins sounds pretty damn stellar to me.

DerekRE_3
11-21-2008, 04:25 PM
exactly. big picture. the only criticism is that they could have waited till the trade deadline when Crawfords value may have been higher. The team was doing well, why not wait until they start to fall off to dish him.

Crawford is a streaky player. Trade him while he's doing well. And maybe they are looking to tank. They are winning too much too fast.

DerekRE_3
11-21-2008, 04:27 PM
When Ellis comes back starting line up of Crawford, Ellis, Jackson, Maggette, Biedrins sounds pretty damn stellar to me.

Good luck trying to guard guys like Tim Duncan, Amare Stoudamire, etc with the lineup.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:30 PM
Good luck trying to guard guys like Tim Duncan, Amare Stoudamire, etc with the lineup.

Im to busy worrying about the sixers trying to work elton brand's halfcourt style into the sixers fullcourt, run and gun style of offense.

edit: thank you mods

nrmax88
11-21-2008, 04:34 PM
What? Crawford is the last guy the Knicks should trade...that trade wouldn't make much sense to me and obviously clearing cap space is the key for N.Y but still. Boggles the mind.

Are you guys freakin serious? Do you watch the Knicks? Crawford is the last guy the Knicks should trade? What? Crawford isn't good. He is a quasi-talented offensive player who does absolutely nothing else for the team. He doesn't even attempt to play defense, and he can't rebound and he cannot facilitate an offense. At least Al Harrington will de somebody and block some shots, grab some boards. Crawford is entirely replaceable. This should have been done before the season, and Steph should have been playing instead of Jamal. I really respect and like Jamal as a Knick fan, because he has been here and played well on bad teams for a long time, so I wish him luck but he is hardly irreplaceable.

Lions #81
11-21-2008, 04:35 PM
i dont think Crawford is that good anyways
he shoots way to much and doesnt pass the ball

trout1627
11-21-2008, 04:35 PM
That trade will go down as one of the dumbest moves of a Knicks GM. He is the team's leading scorer, and one of their best distributors. Jamal Crawford fit great in D'Antoni's system.
On the other side, Al Harrington is unneeded. The Knicks already have David Lee and Wilson Chandler at the forward spot, with Zach Randolph filling out the frontcourt.

Why would a GM trade one of the two best players on a winning team for crap? We can now expect the Knicks' performance to suffer.

Easy. If you took a careful look at Crawford, you would see that he is an inconsistent streak shooter that you can't count on. Sure, the 50 point games look great. But followed by 2 point games, he doesn't look good. He plays zero defense and is only an average distributor. He is a backup shooting guard who has been starting in New York. The Knicks do not want to spend 12 mill next year for a streak shooter.

Picking up Harrington is a short term move. Having him makes the Knicks more flexible up front. Expect Randolph to be traded soon - and the Knicks will still be in good shape up front.

This is like playing chess. You have to think a few moves ahead.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:36 PM
This is a crap for crap trade. Like when the Sixers did a 3 way deal to get rid of Van Horn and bring in Glen Robinson *cringes*

nrmax88
11-21-2008, 04:39 PM
I said it in another thread and I just don't get the Crawford deal. That's one guy the Knicks should hold onto, the last guy they should look to deal even if they're clearing cap space. Trading Randolph is fine, he's a cancer but I just don't get the Crawford deal. Why wouldn't NY try and get a draft pick or a young player instead of Harrington?

You obviously are not familiar with Knicks basketball. Randolph is much more valuable then Crawford. But sure, call him a cancer because you heard somebody else call him it one time. Z-Bo rebounds, scores, and is atleast attempting to play defense. Crawford can score, and his offensive value is negated by the fact that he is one of the worst defensive players in the NBA. I think Nate Robinson can replace most of Jamals production, and they do still have Stephon sitting on the bench. Who cares about what they do this year anyway.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 04:40 PM
Knicks are bloddy in the *** right now.

Crawford is much much better but I dont think he fits the Warriors too good, They needed a PF more then a Swingman.

The Knicks did it because of Salary Reasons, They want Lebron and Crawford goes for awhil.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 04:41 PM
i dont think Crawford is that good anyways
he shoots way to much and doesnt pass the ball

5 APG and Averages 15 Shots Per Game.

Kobe Averages 20..

trout1627
11-21-2008, 04:41 PM
This is a crap for crap trade. Like when the Sixers did a 3 way deal to get rid of Van Horn and bring in Glen Robinson *cringes*

"Crap for crap" is a little strong. But it is fairly lateral on both sides. The Knicks get help with their overblown salary and I really do not think they are worse without Crawford if you recognize he is just a streak shooter. The Warriors get some more speed and get rid of a disgruntled player. Frankly, I don't think this trade is that big a deal.

nrmax88
11-21-2008, 04:42 PM
I just don't think he's gonna fit in there. He doesn't defend, rebound, block. He's a streaky shooter.

Okay, so then why is it a bad trade for the knicks? They get an interior presence and get rid of a big contract.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 04:44 PM
"Crap for crap" is a little strong. But it is fairly lateral on both sides. The Knicks get help with their overblown salary and I really do not think they are worse without Crawford if you recognize he is just a streak shooter. The Warriors get some more speed and get rid of a disgruntled player. Frankly, I don't think this trade is that big a deal.

Averges 15 Shots Per Game, Hes not a Chucker. Kobe and Lebron average much more. He puts up 19 In 15 Shots on Average.

He also can dish the ball very well, Hes one of my Favorite Players. While he can be streaky at times, what shooters are not streaky? Name 1 player?

nrmax88
11-21-2008, 04:44 PM
he's a guard, why would he need to do those things? unless ur talking about randolph? but Crawford is actually a pretty decent defender. and i think he's much more then a streaky shooter.

Crawford is a decent defender? Do you watch the Knicks? He is probably the worst defensive player in the entire league dude.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 04:47 PM
Crawford is a decent defender? Do you watch the Knicks? He is probably the worst defensive player in the entire league dude.

Allen Iverson is Worse. Mike Dunleavy, I have name a few more.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:47 PM
Jerry Stackhouse is worse. As is Willie Green, thought not for lack of effort. I nominate Derrick Coleman for worst of all time though.

superkegger
11-21-2008, 04:50 PM
Averges 15 Shots Per Game, Hes not a Chucker. Kobe and Lebron average much more. He puts up 19 In 15 Shots on Average.

He also can dish the ball very well, Hes one of my Favorite Players. While he can be streaky at times, what shooters are not streaky? Name 1 player?

You're just making these arguments because hes on your redraft team. :pity:

tonyd3b54
11-21-2008, 04:50 PM
theses moves have to be preperation to get lebron...

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 04:51 PM
You're just making these arguments because hes on your redraft team. :pity:

Actually Not..Hes one of my Favorite Players.

15 Shots Per Game is too much shooting? Then Kobe Lebron and all the other Shooters are bad. Name 1 shooter who isnt streaky?

Hes been one of my Favorite Knicks for a Longg time.

nrmax88
11-21-2008, 04:53 PM
And no, Crawford is not a good passer. He throws so many balls away and passes the ball like 80 mph to a guy 8 feet away. I really do like Crawford, but comparing him to Lebron and Kobe? Are you stupid? Crawford can be replaced, especially on a team that is in rebuild mode anyway. Some of you are way to caught up in the 08-09 season, and some of you are just plain stupid.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 04:54 PM
Actually Not..Hes one of my Favorite Players.

15 Shots Per Game is too much shooting? Then Kobe Lebron and all the other Shooters are bad. Name 1 shooter who isnt streaky?

Hes been one of my Favorite Knicks for a Longg time.

Jason Kapono

greg_ory_2005
11-21-2008, 04:55 PM
Why would the Warriors want another shoot first guard? Doesn't make much sense to me.

NYMetros
11-21-2008, 04:55 PM
Crawford isn't very good...

He definitely is a "chucker"

greg_ory_2005
11-21-2008, 04:59 PM
Actually Not..Hes one of my Favorite Players.

15 Shots Per Game is too much shooting? Then Kobe Lebron and all the other Shooters are bad. Name 1 shooter who isnt streaky?

Hes been one of my Favorite Knicks for a Longg time.

Kobe and LeBron mentioned in the same breath as Crawford. :pity:

You basically know what you're gonna get from Kobe and LeBron each night. And if they're not scoring well that night, they do other things.

The same can't be said for Crawford. He could score 40 one game, then 4 the next. He doesn't rebound, pass, or play D. So if he ain't hitting shots that night, he's basically useless.

colinskik
11-21-2008, 05:04 PM
Getting rid of Crawford doesn't bother me that much, except it adds another forward to an already crowded front court. I really really don't understand shipping Zbo out, and I hope it doesn't happen. He's been the best player on the Knicks this year, hands down. With out him the Knicks would grab even less rebounds than the pitiful number they grab now.

niners395
11-21-2008, 05:09 PM
What the ****? Hoo the **** did this? jesus ****ing christ, donnie walsh go **** yourself. I dont care if psd ****ing bans me, how in ****** face hell did this happen? WHY? We just traded a team player who yes was only offensive minded for a ****ing **** face diva who doesn't even know that with the word offense, comes ****ing defense. Mike Dantoni go **** your self, knicks organization go get a life, Jamal was the city's favorite. And now we've got son of a ***** Al Harrington. I don't hate Al Harrington, I just love Jamal Crawford. The knicks organisation has no idea what it felt like to be a knicks fan over this last 6 crappy years. Its been a terrible decade, and all dolan is thinking about is how to save his ****** buisnesses from going down in the dump. The only thing that I has kept me watching every single knick game is my love for the new york city knickerbockers and Jamal Crawford. But now its gone. You may see me in 49er forums, yankee forums, may gs warrior forums now that j craw is there, I will still root for the knicks with a bittersweet *** agony, but inless something happens that really changes my mind, I will never post in these knick forums again.

shep33
11-21-2008, 05:10 PM
I'm one of the few who likes the trade. Crawford was a terrific scorer but lets face it... with that lineup how far are the knicks really gonna go. We're talking about maybe a first round exit at the 7-8 spot at best. Would you rather have the knicks barely making the playoffs for the next 2 years, or having a chance to get a great player in 2010 for 5-8 years? Randolph will likely get moved soon too i'm guessing to try and clear more cap space.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:11 PM
What the ****? Hoo the **** did this? jesus ****ing christ, donnie walsh go **** yourself. I dont care if psd ****ing bans me, how in ****** face hell did this happen? WHY? We just traded a team player who yes was only offensive minded for a ****ing **** face diva who doesn't even know that with the word offense, comes ****ing defense. Mike Dantoni go **** your self, knicks organization go get a life, Jamal was the city's favorite. And now we've got son of a ***** Al Harrington. I don't hate Al Harrington, I just love Jamal Crawford. The knicks organisation has no idea what it felt like to be a knicks fan over this last 6 crappy years. Its been a terrible decade, and all dolan is thinking about is how to save his ****** buisnesses from going down in the dump. The only thing that I has kept me watching every single knick game is my love for the new york city knickerbockers and Jamal Crawford. But now its gone. You may see me in 49er forums, yankee forums, may gs warrior forums now that j craw is there, I will still root for the knicks with a bittersweet *** agony, but inless something happens that really changes my mind, I will never post in these knick forums again.



^^^May I introduce the newest golden state warriors fan!

NYMetros
11-21-2008, 05:13 PM
What the ****? Hoo the **** did this? jesus ****ing christ, donnie walsh go **** yourself. I dont care if psd ****ing bans me, how in ****** face hell did this happen? WHY? We just traded a team player who yes was only offensive minded for a ****ing **** face diva who doesn't even know that with the word offense, comes ****ing defense. Mike Dantoni go **** your self, knicks organization go get a life, Jamal was the city's favorite. And now we've got son of a ***** Al Harrington. I don't hate Al Harrington, I just love Jamal Crawford. The knicks organisation has no idea what it felt like to be a knicks fan over this last 6 crappy years. Its been a terrible decade, and all dolan is thinking about is how to save his ****** buisnesses from going down in the dump. The only thing that I has kept me watching every single knick game is my love for the new york city knickerbockers and Jamal Crawford. But now its gone. You may see me in 49er forums, yankee forums, may gs warrior forums now that j craw is there, I will still root for the knicks with a bittersweet *** agony, but inless something happens that really changes my mind, I will never post in these knick forums again.

So what did you think of the trade? Did you like it?

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 05:14 PM
And no, Crawford is not a good passer. He throws so many balls away and passes the ball like 80 mph to a guy 8 feet away. I really do like Crawford, but comparing him to Lebron and Kobe? Are you stupid? Crawford can be replaced, especially on a team that is in rebuild mode anyway. Some of you are way to caught up in the 08-09 season, and some of you are just plain stupid.

1.6 TOPG, How is that throwing the ball away carelessly? Why wouldnt I? He takes alot of Shots just like them, If he is a chucked then they are. 43.2 FG % isnt bad at all..

Really? His numbers have been good forever..

BTownTeamsRKing
11-21-2008, 05:15 PM
What the ****? Hoo the **** did this? jesus ****ing christ, donnie walsh go **** yourself. I dont care if psd ****ing bans me, how in ****** face hell did this happen? WHY? We just traded a team player who yes was only offensive minded for a ****ing **** face diva who doesn't even know that with the word offense, comes ****ing defense. Mike Dantoni go **** your self, knicks organization go get a life, Jamal was the city's favorite. And now we've got son of a ***** Al Harrington. I don't hate Al Harrington, I just love Jamal Crawford. The knicks organisation has no idea what it felt like to be a knicks fan over this last 6 crappy years. Its been a terrible decade, and all dolan is thinking about is how to save his ****** buisnesses from going down in the dump. The only thing that I has kept me watching every single knick game is my love for the new york city knickerbockers and Jamal Crawford. But now its gone. You may see me in 49er forums, yankee forums, may gs warrior forums now that j craw is there, I will still root for the knicks with a bittersweet *** agony, but inless something happens that really changes my mind, I will never post in these knick forums again.

relax, yea it sucks bc u lost crawford and for hes your favorite player, which makes it worse, but Crawford has no defense.
Which is 1 reason for making this deal, EXCEPT they are playing run and gun so why i trade jamal? only answer: its the knicks...dont ask, just go with it.

basically the knicks are clearing house. no one is staying except Lee and Galinari.

Giaps
11-21-2008, 05:15 PM
LOL 2010 can't come fast enough. We can't judge any salary dump trades until then.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 05:16 PM
Kobe and LeBron mentioned in the same breath as Crawford. :pity:

You basically know what you're gonna get from Kobe and LeBron each night. And if they're not scoring well that night, they do other things.

The same can't be said for Crawford. He could score 40 one game, then 4 the next. He doesn't rebound, pass, or play D. So if he ain't hitting shots that night, he's basically useless.

He Averages 5 APG with 1.6 TOPG? He passes the ball pretty good.

Michael Redd can do the Same thing, Many shooters are "streaky".

Good, They average more shots, Saying hes a chucker isnt correct. We are not talking about 1 Game or Another but as a Whole.

NYMetros
11-21-2008, 05:23 PM
He Averages 5 APG with 1.6 TOPG? He passes the ball pretty good.

Michael Redd can do the Same thing, Many shooters are "streaky".

Good, They average more shots, Saying hes a chucker isnt correct. We are not talking about 1 Game or Another but as a Whole.

Crawford is a career 40% shooter. Kobe is a career 44% shooter. Lebron is a career 48.6% shooter. That is why Jamal Crawford is a chucker and Kobe and LeBron aren't.

And consistency is one of the most important characteristics in a basketball player. Crawford is anything but consistent. He can either go out and have a great game, or have a terrible game.

He isn't reliable like Kobe and LeBron are.

superkegger
11-21-2008, 05:24 PM
So what did you think of the trade? Did you like it?

:laugh2:


He Averages 5 APG with 1.6 TOPG? He passes the ball pretty good.

Michael Redd can do the Same thing, Many shooters are "streaky".

Good, They average more shots, Saying hes a chucker isnt correct. We are not talking about 1 Game or Another but as a Whole.

Now you're getting it, mentioning crawford and redd together, both chuckers. 43% is not that great either.

And if you're going to compare Jamaal Crawford to Kobe and Lebron, well then I just lost all respect for your basketball knowledge. If you really think they're comparable, then you really don't understand basketball. Kobe and Lebron are playing on another level than Crawford. Do both of them take bad shots? Yes. Are they the central focus of they're teams offense and the linchpin to success? Yes. Is Crawford? No. That's the difference, and that's part of the reason why hes a chucker, the other is because he takes 15 shots for 19ppg. Thats a chucker.

NYYCowboys
11-21-2008, 05:28 PM
Bottomline Crawford sucks. This is an awesome trade a classic example of selling high. No team will ever win with Crawford because he doesn't play any defense, and his stupid shots and turnovers waste so many possessions a game, that his 20 ppg don't really matter. Notice how every team he's been on has never made the playoffs. Al Harrington's ok I don't think he's anything great, but his contract comes off the book sooner than Crawford's does. It would be a genious move if he trades Randolph to clear salary and gets a pick in the process in the offseason he couldn't give him away now that his stock is high he could get exactly what he wants. You guys are stupid if you think Walsh is getting ripped off, he's getting what he's been wanting all along. And if you're pissed that we lose out this year you're an idiot we beat mostly horrible teams, and weren't going anywhere and at best would have been the 8th seed in the playoffs, so this trade makes so much sense.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:35 PM
1.6 TOPG, How is that throwing the ball away carelessly? Why wouldnt I? He takes alot of Shots just like them, If he is a chucked then they are. 43.2 FG % isnt bad at all..

Really? His numbers have been good forever..

Thats this year (a small 11 game sample)... He is a career 40% shooter.

Lakers4ItAll
11-21-2008, 05:37 PM
Exactly


Bottomline Crawford sucks. This is an awesome trade a classic example of selling high. No team will ever win with Crawford because he doesn't play any defense, and his stupid shots and turnovers waste so many possessions a game, that his 20 ppg don't really matter. Notice how every team he's been on has never made the playoffs. Al Harrington's ok I don't think he's anything great, but his contract comes off the book sooner than Crawford's does. It would be a genious move if he trades Randolph to clear salary and gets a pick in the process in the offseason he couldn't give him away now that his stock is high he could get exactly what he wants. You guys are stupid if you think Walsh is getting ripped off, he's getting what he's been wanting all along. And if you're pissed that we lose out this year you're an idiot we beat mostly horrible teams, and weren't going anywhere and at best would have been the 8th seed in the playoffs, so this trade makes so much sense.

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 05:38 PM
:laugh2:



Now you're getting it, mentioning crawford and redd together, both chuckers. 43% is not that great either.

And if you're going to compare Jamaal Crawford to Kobe and Lebron, well then I just lost all respect for your basketball knowledge. If you really think they're comparable, then you really don't understand basketball. Kobe and Lebron are playing on another level than Crawford. Do both of them take bad shots? Yes. Are they the central focus of they're teams offense and the linchpin to success? Yes. Is Crawford? No. That's the difference, and that's part of the reason why hes a chucker, the other is because he takes 15 shots for 19ppg. Thats a chucker.


The only think I have compared is the Amount of Shots they take.

Kobe Takes 20 and Gets 24 Points..Similar to 15 Shots Taken and 19 Points..I havent compared them in any other way, Dont see the problem?

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 05:39 PM
Exactly

Disagree, In that System defense isnt a large problem. Steve Nash played ZERO Defense on the Suns and Hes still a Top PG.

Is playing Defense huge? Yes. Is it worth moving a player for a Lesser player? No.

I get that they want Lebron tho, The real reason the Knicks wont win a Championship is because they are not a Elite Team, Not because Jamal Crawford their Ex-SG didnt play very good Defense.

greg_ory_2005
11-21-2008, 05:41 PM
He Averages 5 APG with 1.6 TOPG? He passes the ball pretty good.

Michael Redd can do the Same thing, Many shooters are "streaky".

Good, They average more shots, Saying hes a chucker isnt correct. We are not talking about 1 Game or Another but as a Whole.


Where do you see 1.6 TOPG? I see 2.4. And yes thats bad when you only get 4 assists a game.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:43 PM
He is a nice scoring threat off the bench. Could be a 6th man of the year candidate if put in the right position. This comparing to Kobe and Lebron REALLY needs to stop. I dont care if you are only comparing one stat, please stop!

NYYCowboys
11-21-2008, 05:44 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=Perdiem-081121


If that doesn't work check out Hollinger's analysis of the trade then tell me you hate it

superkegger
11-21-2008, 05:44 PM
The only think I have compared is the Amount of Shots they take.

Kobe Takes 20 and Gets 24 Points..Similar to 15 Shots Taken and 19 Points..I havent compared them in any other way, Dont see the problem?

Like I said, Kobe and Lebron are the focal point of their respecitve offenses. And yes, Kobe taking 20 shots to get 24 points is similar, as Kobe has taken on less of an offensive load and not had to take over games this year.

Crawford on the other hand is not the focal point of the offense. The offense is not based around his play. He's a secondary player, and he shoots a low percentage.

But I'm just going to leave it at that, if you really don't understand he's a chucker, that's fine. I know you're just arguing this point because he's on your redraft team. Say what you want, he's a chucker, and you'll find plenty of people who agree.

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:46 PM
Like I said, Kobe and Lebron are the focal point of their respecitve offenses. And yes, Kobe taking 20 shots to get 24 points is similar, as Kobe has taken on less of an offensive load and not had to take over games this year.

Crawford on the other hand is not the focal point of the offense. The offense is not based around his play. He's a secondary player, and he shoots a low percentage.

But I'm just going to leave it at that, if you really don't understand he's a chucker, that's fine. I know you're just arguing this point because he's on your redraft team. Say what you want, he's a chucker, and you'll find plenty of people who agree.

me

Boston Faithful
11-21-2008, 05:47 PM
Wow, new Knicks lineup:

C Al Harrington
PF Wilson Chandler
SF Quentin Richardson
SG Cuttino Mobley
PG Chris Duhon
6th Nate Robinson
7th Tim Thomas
8th David Lee

Not a bad lineup.

They now have 26 million on the books for 2010 so they can potentially go after TWO big free agents. Wade and LeBron on the Knicks in 2010 anyone?

Lakers4ItAll
11-21-2008, 05:48 PM
Crawford would be a bench player on a good team

superkegger
11-21-2008, 05:50 PM
Souce Yahoo!Sports (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AmdApSSELBt75X_psnj7T2g5nYcB?slug=aw-randolphclippers112108&prov=yhoo&type=lgns)


The New York Knicks have agreed in principle to send power forward Zach Randolph to the Los Angeles Clippers, two league sources said Friday afternoon.

The Clippers would send Tim Thomas and Cuttino Mobley to the Knicks for Randolph and guard Mardy Collins.

After trading Jamal Crawford to the Golden State Warriors for Al Harrington on Friday morning, the Knicks would’ve cleared approximately $27 million in salary cap space for the summer of 2010 when their obsession, Cleveland’s LeBron James, can become a free agent.


Randolph will be making $17.3 million and Crawford, $10.1 million, in 2010. For the Knicks, this would create significant flexibility as that historic free agent class of James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh hits the market

Vidball
11-21-2008, 05:50 PM
Like I said, Kobe and Lebron are the focal point of their respecitve offenses. And yes, Kobe taking 20 shots to get 24 points is similar, as Kobe has taken on less of an offensive load and not had to take over games this year.

Crawford on the other hand is not the focal point of the offense. The offense is not based around his play. He's a secondary player, and he shoots a low percentage.

But I'm just going to leave it at that, if you really don't understand he's a chucker, that's fine. I know you're just arguing this point because he's on your redraft team. Say what you want, he's a chucker, and you'll find plenty of people who agree.

Me

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:51 PM
Wow, new Knicks lineup:

C Al Harrington
PF Wilson Chandler
SF Quentin Richardson
SG Cuttino Mobley
PG Chris Duhon
6th Nate Robinson
7th Tim Thomas
8th David Lee

Not a bad lineup.

They now have 26 million on the books for 2010 so they can potentially go after TWO big free agents. Wade and LeBron on the Knicks in 2010 anyone?

:confused:

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:52 PM
LOL How is Tim Thomas still scurrying about the league. Cat Mobley!!! What a blockbuster!

superkegger
11-21-2008, 05:53 PM
So it looks like the clippers are getting randolph, and so I guess Kaman or Camby is on their way out?

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 05:55 PM
Either that or the biggest front court in the NBA

oak2455
11-21-2008, 06:04 PM
Well most of Isaiah Thomas's mess or garbage has been removed.....WOW this is some good :censored:!!!!!

oak2455
11-21-2008, 06:04 PM
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

MooseWithFleas
11-21-2008, 06:07 PM
Well most of Isaiah Thomas's mess or garbage has been removed.....WOW this is some good :censored:!!!!!

Jerome James Lives!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 06:19 PM
Like I said, Kobe and Lebron are the focal point of their respecitve offenses. And yes, Kobe taking 20 shots to get 24 points is similar, as Kobe has taken on less of an offensive load and not had to take over games this year.

Crawford on the other hand is not the focal point of the offense. The offense is not based around his play. He's a secondary player, and he shoots a low percentage.

But I'm just going to leave it at that, if you really don't understand he's a chucker, that's fine. I know you're just arguing this point because he's on your redraft team. Say what you want, he's a chucker, and you'll find plenty of people who agree.


Why do you Insist that Im doing this because Hes on my Re-Draft Team :laugh: Hes my Favorite Knick besides the Great Nate Robinson ;).

Okay, With what your saying every single player that isnt the Focal point of the Offense and Dosnt shoot at 45% Is a Bad Player?..

ragee
11-21-2008, 06:19 PM
What the hell were the Warriors thinking? Yes, Crawford is a great player but do they really need another small guy to fill their backcourt? They already have Ellis, Morrow, Maggette, Jackson... Put Crawford in the mix and that means less playing time for Morrow... Bad idea... He is doing great for this team and I think he needs experiece and playing time to keep it up and become a better player...

Westbrook36
11-21-2008, 06:24 PM
What the hell were the Warriors thinking? Yes, Crawford is a great player but do they really need another small guy to fill their backcourt? They already have Ellis, Morrow, Maggette, Jackson... Put Crawford in the mix and that means less playing time for Morrow... Bad idea... He is doing great for this team and I think he needs experiece and playing time to keep it up and become a better player...

Thats the Problem, They dont need any Wingplayers..

Someone said that Crawford would be a Bench player on a Good team? The Cavs, He would start Easily. The 76ers, He would most likely start. The Hornets, A Lineup of Chris Paul Crawford Peja West and Tyson :drool:. Shall I keep going on?

TMAC94
11-21-2008, 06:29 PM
warriors win in this and will start to win in games

oak2455
11-21-2008, 06:45 PM
Jerome James Lives!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

This is true but they got rid of a lot of crap... and they still have Curry:mad::mad: But as a Knick fan this is a really good start for 2010:clap::clap::clap:

Hustla23
11-21-2008, 09:04 PM
Wow you guys are clueless.

Crawford is garbage. I'm glad we got rid of him. But I hate Harrington. So I'm indifferent.

KB24PG16
11-21-2008, 10:06 PM
wow the warriors just go better

kobeonekenobe
11-22-2008, 06:07 AM
Wow, new Knicks lineup:

C Al Harrington
PF Wilson Chandler
SF Quentin Richardson
SG Cuttino Mobley
PG Chris Duhon
6th Nate Robinson
7th Tim Thomas
8th David Lee

Not a bad lineup.

They now have 26 million on the books for 2010 so they can potentially go after TWO big free agents. Wade and LeBron on the Knicks in 2010 anyone?


You are miles off with that lineup, it will more likely be

PG - Duhon
SG - Nate
SF - Chandler
PF - Harrington
C - Lee

6th - Mobley
7th - Q-Rich
8th - Thomas

Am i the only one that can see whatthe knicks are planning to do this season, they have assembled a team full of good shooter, even their bench players are very good shooters. Expect alot of 3's from the knickerbockers this season and no D. Lol. Should be fun to watch though

Nets fan 93
11-22-2008, 02:17 PM
Davis
Ellis
JRich
Jackson
Harrington
2 years ago

Ellis
Crawford
Maggette
Jackson
Biedrins
Now

I think Jackson will play the 4 again