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View Full Version : Has Chris Paul reached his peak?



FOBolous
11-13-2008, 11:45 AM
cause I can't see him playing any better than he is now. he's averaging 23 points*, 12 assists*, and 3 steals per game. he also flirted with triple doubles three times already this season grabbing 7 rebounds in 2 of the games and 8 rebounds in 1.

and if he keeps this up, do you think he'll be consider one of the top 10 PGs of all time? If so, where do you think he'll be ranked?

current top 10 PGs of all time per ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-GreatestPointGuards

1. Magic Johnson
2. Oscar Robinson
3. Isiah Thomas
4. John Stockton
5. Bob Cousy
6. Walt Frazier
7. Jason Kidd
8. Tiny Archibald
9. Steve Nash
10. Gary Payton

what do yall think?






*I rounded up the stats

Joshtd1
11-13-2008, 12:22 PM
Is Nash really a top 10 PG of all time?

JordansBulls
11-13-2008, 12:40 PM
cause I can't see him playing any better than he is now. he's averaging 23 points*, 12 assists*, and 3 steals per game. he also flirted with triple doubles three times already this season grabbing 7 rebounds in 2 of the games and 8 rebounds in 1.

and if he keeps this up, do you think he'll be consider one of the top 10 PGs of all time? If so, where do you think he'll be ranked?

current top 10 PGs of all time per ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-GreatestPointGuards

1. Magic Johnson
2. Oscar Robinson
3. Isiah Thomas
4. John Stockton
5. Bob Cousy
6. Walt Frazier
7. Jason Kidd
8. Tiny Archibald
9. Steve Nash
10. Gary Payton

what do yall think?






*I rounded up the stats

Nash isn't better than Payton nor is Kidd better than Payton. Payton was better on both ends of the floor. Also Nash has had a good 3-4 years whereas Payton and Kidd has been great for 8-10 years.

FOBolous
11-13-2008, 12:41 PM
hey guys...it's not my rankings, it's ESPN's. if you have a problem with it, take it up with ESPN. please stay on the topic in my thread and discuss Chris Paul

DODGERS&LAKERS
11-13-2008, 12:53 PM
You would have to put him up there if he keeps averaging these numbers. But a lot of guys legacy's are made in the post season. He is going to have to have some monster games in the playoffs/finals to be put up high on that list. Nash has been great, but not long enough. CP3 might move him out of the top 10 once its all done. As well as move some of those great point guards back on the list. This kid is great!

KnicksorBust
11-13-2008, 12:54 PM
Paul has top 3 potential in my opinion. His peak as a statistical player is fast approaching but his peak as a star player is just beginning. He needs to prove that his teams will consistently be near the top of the league and he needs to breakthrough in the playoffs.

Chronz
11-13-2008, 01:48 PM
This is the best hes ever going to play, if he gets any better we're talking GOAT territory and I doubt any man of his stature gets THAT good.

29$JerZ
11-13-2008, 01:51 PM
Well He has been dubbed the Next Isiah Thomas so I guess he will crack the top 10 barring injury.

Faneik
11-13-2008, 01:53 PM
He could improve in order to limit his TO's (3.1/game).

DODGERS&LAKERS
11-13-2008, 02:27 PM
He could improve in order to limit his TO's (3.1/game).

I dont think thats that many. He handles the ball the entire game and is responible for creating that teams entire offense. After wathcing them. I noticed he is the only one that can ceate his own shot. West is very good but depends on Paul to draw his man off him to get an open jump shot. Peja cant. Chandler cant. Peterson cant. If they are going to score, its cause Paul probably set them up.

Hawkeye15
11-13-2008, 02:29 PM
If he finds a consistent three point shot, and cuts turnovers, and wins in the postseason, no reason he can't contend for the best point guard of all time. He will need some rings, and great postseason stats, but the potential is there at least. But those are lofty goals

Faneik
11-13-2008, 02:33 PM
I dont think thats that many. He handles the ball the entire game and is responible for creating that teams entire offense. After wathcing them. I noticed he is the only one that can ceate his own shot. West is very good but depends on Paul to draw his man off him to get an open jump shot. Peja cant. Chandler cant. Peterson cant. If they are going to score, its cause Paul probably set them up.


Yeah, I'm aware that he's the one who tries to create something.

I wasn't saying it was bad. It's just ok.

But sometimes I feel that he souldn't try risky passes, be more patient and wait for better spots. Right now his TO's average is ok, if he can limit them to 2 would be excellent.

saltLAKER
11-13-2008, 02:44 PM
Both Paul and Deron Williams (who are always being compared) are both at their peak. They are both in situations where their teams are as good as they are ever gonna be right now so they need to capitalize but thats not gonna happen with the Lakers, Rockets and Suns in the west.

They are very good PGs but they are no where near the greatst of all-time. I just think they are beneficiaries (sp?) of a league that has mediocre PG play in general. Fernandez out in Portland is a guy with a lot more upside than CP3 and Williams imo.

hotpotato1092
11-13-2008, 02:53 PM
I think Paul has a chance to tie Oscar Robertson on that list, but get no further. He's a fantastic player, but he doesn't have oscar or magic's versatility. Magic was a 6-9 PG who very easily could have been a PF and averaged 20-10. Oscar averaged a triple double for a full season. Paul has a chance to be the best "pure" point guard ever. Better than Isiah. But he's not versatile enough to pass Oscar or Magic.

phils07
11-13-2008, 03:02 PM
"Both Paul and Deron Williams (who are always being compared) are both at their peak. They are both in situations where their teams are as good as they are ever gonna be right now so they need to capitalize but thats not gonna happen with the Lakers, Rockets and Suns in the west.

They are very good PGs but they are no where near the greatst of all-time. I just think they are beneficiaries (sp?) of a league that has mediocre PG play in general. Fernandez out in Portland is a guy with a lot more upside than CP3 and Williams imo. "


What? are u....crazy? i flat out disagree with u about mediocrity at the Point. there are many solid points and a couple great ones, just like every era. Rudy Fernandez has more potential? hes not even a point guard. hes a 2 guard. i dont understand what ur getting at there. paul and williams are currently 3 to 4 times more valuable/better than rudy fernandez comparing them straight up.

the hornets should be the second best team in the west and they porbably will end up being that. ur mention of the suns is premature and the rockets as well given their odd play. any success the team has is because of paul. but i do agree, with the lakers being in the west and the general wealth of talent in the NBA, its gona be hard for him to get championships. therefore it will be hard for him to get the acclaim of being a top 3 or best PG of all time. although i dont championships should be the only barometer, it is pretty vital. he should be in the top 5 regardless, thats how good he is.

SteveNash
11-13-2008, 03:59 PM
I wouldn't put him in the top 10 if he keeps getting dominated by Deron Williams nearly every time they match up.

JAZZNC
11-13-2008, 06:42 PM
Both Paul and Deron Williams (who are always being compared) are both at their peak. They are both in situations where their teams are as good as they are ever gonna be right now so they need to capitalize but thats not gonna happen with the Lakers, Rockets and Suns in the west.

They are very good PGs but they are no where near the greatst of all-time. I just think they are beneficiaries (sp?) of a league that has mediocre PG play in general. Fernandez out in Portland is a guy with a lot more upside than CP3 and Williams imo.

That has got to be one of the most ignorant posts I've read to date:rolleyes:

Fernandez can't even carry Paul or Williams duffel bags much less be better at anything than they are. You said the PG play in the NBA is mediocre, well theres Nash, Iverson, Billups, Fisher, Baron Davis, Parker, Rondo, Mo Williams, TJ Ford, Calderon, Arenas, Kidd, but yeah, you're right none of those guys are any good. Maybe you should try watching basketball before you go making blanket statements about the NBA that are just simply unintelligent.

Sixerlover
11-13-2008, 06:45 PM
Paul is what 24? He hasn't touched his peak yet IMO. He can improve his 3pt shooting and his man to man defense. That is a very scary player seeing as he already is a good defender and a solid 3pt shooter.

Afridi786
11-13-2008, 07:37 PM
Both Paul and Deron Williams (who are always being compared) are both at their peak. They are both in situations where their teams are as good as they are ever gonna be right now so they need to capitalize but thats not gonna happen with the Lakers, Rockets and Suns in the west.

They are very good PGs but they are no where near the greatst of all-time. I just think they are beneficiaries (sp?) of a league that has mediocre PG play in general. Fernandez out in Portland is a guy with a lot more upside than CP3 and Williams imo.

Rudy is just a shooter...at his absolute best he'll be Ginobli.

Sportfan
11-13-2008, 07:40 PM
i think D-Will is reaching his peak but not CP3

barreleffact
11-13-2008, 08:49 PM
I could very easily see Paul being top 3 all time. And I mean that as period. not just PG's. call me crazy or w/e you want, but his game is close to unrivalled. His numbers are already comparable to Magic's. He is 6'0 and is cabable of averaging a triple double...the man is averaging less than 6 rebs, but as already mentioned he has grabbed 7 twice and 8 once. Paul is just a stud. If he gets 4 rings as teh best player, he will be the 2nd or 3rd best all time and no matter what, he wont be worse than top 20 all time IMO

PRETTY BIRD!
11-14-2008, 12:03 AM
He will drop off just like steve nash...........you see right now chris paul is just the flavor of the month!

Catfish1314
11-14-2008, 12:07 AM
With his god given talent and athleticism, not a chance. He's 23. NBA players don't usually peak until 26-27. He's got a few things he can improve on and he has plenty of time to do it.

dre1990
11-14-2008, 12:23 AM
he could improe on TO's................ he is ALmost at his peak and will be their for at least 4 years

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 04:42 AM
:D keep underestimating D-Will everyone.

Roy31
11-14-2008, 04:45 AM
Who cares if he gets pwned by Deron Williams hes still 10x better than most of the other players in his position across the league. Utah Jazz aint ****...

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 04:56 AM
Who cares if he gets pwned by Deron Williams hes still 10x better than most of the other players in his position across the league. Utah Jazz aint ****...

Thanks for that intelligent post. :clap:

valade16
11-14-2008, 06:03 AM
Rudy is just a shooter...at his absolute best he'll be Ginobli.

OK, I know this thread is about Paul and his potential, but I just can't take anymore ignorant statements like this...

yes, Fernandez is a 2 guard, and no, he is currently not nearly as good or as important to his team as Chris Paul, however, to put his ceiling at Ginobili (while a good player true) is discounting just how good Fernandez is and can be...

Right now he's averaging 15 points a game in a little under 30 minutes a game off the bench (in his rookie year). Something it took Ginobili 3 years to do, and he was older when he entered the league.

That's right, don't forget Fernandez is only just 23 years old, is currently shooting 48% FG, 45% 3pt, and 93% FT as a rookie not even starting.

Not to mention he's won numerous world championships and foreign league championships, collecting several MVP awards along the way...

Oh yeah, did I mention he's only 23

pmmr2113
11-14-2008, 06:19 AM
He will drop off just like steve nash...........you see right now chris paul is just the flavor of the month!
cmon dude, seriously? chris paul is a beast and will be a top pg of all time

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 01:43 PM
OK, I know this thread is about Paul and his potential, but I just can't take anymore ignorant statements like this...

yes, Fernandez is a 2 guard, and no, he is currently not nearly as good or as important to his team as Chris Paul, however, to put his ceiling at Ginobili (while a good player true) is discounting just how good Fernandez is and can be...

Right now he's averaging 15 points a game in a little under 30 minutes a game off the bench (in his rookie year). Something it took Ginobili 3 years to do, and he was older when he entered the league.

That's right, don't forget Fernandez is only just 23 years old, is currently shooting 48% FG, 45% 3pt, and 93% FT as a rookie not even starting.

Not to mention he's won numerous world championships and foreign league championships, collecting several MVP awards along the way...

Oh yeah, did I mention he's only 23

I think its funny that Ginobili is being used as a negative ceiling for a player. Maybe I overrate him but I feel like Ginobili really is one of the top 10 players in the NBA. He is unstoppable most of the time.

Lakers4ItAll
11-14-2008, 01:59 PM
Paul can only be as good as the players he will have around him in his career. He looks great now and seems as if he can only get better.

Also I think Stockton was #1 alltime

Flash812
11-14-2008, 02:02 PM
Paul could score 30 a game if he wanted to but he is unselfish and maybe sometimes too unselfish. He is a top 5 player in the league right now and #1 on the PG list. Williams is phyically dominent when they play each other but Paul is better when going against other PG's. D-will and CP haven't played each other yet this year though so lets wait and see how they match up this time around.

DerekRE_3
11-14-2008, 02:07 PM
Chris Paul can get into the lane any time he wants, even though he is an average 3 point shooter. Could you imagine trying to guard him if he improves his range? It would be nearly impossible. Not to mention the fact that the longer he plays, the smarter he gets, the more defenses he sees, and quicker he gets at reading defenses. He has the chance to be one of the best point guards to ever play the game. He has been playing incredible so far this year.

22.6 points, 12 assists, 5.4 rebounds, 3 steals on 55% shooting from field and 38% from 3.

Hawkeye15
11-14-2008, 02:09 PM
Paul can only be as good as the players he will have around him in his career. He looks great now and seems as if he can only get better.

Also I think Stockton was #1 alltime

agree with everything you said

DerekRE_3
11-14-2008, 02:11 PM
Paul can only be as good as the players he will have around him in his career. He looks great now and seems as if he can only get better.

Also I think Stockton was #1 alltime

Paul already has as many rings as Stockton does.

Hawkeye15
11-14-2008, 02:14 PM
Paul already has as many rings as Stockton does.

Stockton played in the Jordan era, onlly Houston did squat. All time leader in assists and steals, both by a landslide, are the definition of a point guard.

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 02:21 PM
Stockton played in the Jordan era, onlly Houston did squat. All time leader in assists and steals, both by a landslide, are the definition of a point guard.

:rock:

$ NyC $
11-14-2008, 02:23 PM
PLAY ON WHITE BOY. Stockton was a beast. Having Malone didn't hurt but i think Stock could make any big guy look like Malone.

hotpotato1092
11-14-2008, 02:24 PM
Both Paul and Deron Williams (who are always being compared) are both at their peak. They are both in situations where their teams are as good as they are ever gonna be right now so they need to capitalize but thats not gonna happen with the Lakers, Rockets and Suns in the west.

They are very good PGs but they are no where near the greatst of all-time. I just think they are beneficiaries (sp?) of a league that has mediocre PG play in general. Fernandez out in Portland is a guy with a lot more upside than CP3 and Williams imo.

Fernandez is a 6th man on a fringe playoff team, Paul and Williams are franchise players on contenders. They're gold medalists, all stars, MVP candidates and league icons. Fernandez is not. Right now, you might be able to pull of a Fernandez-Mike Miller comparison, but no more than that. Prove me wrong blazer fans.

$ NyC $
11-14-2008, 02:29 PM
^^ I was gonna comment on that guy but i thought it was too old. How in the world can Fernandez be compared 2 Paul and Williams?!

GSRaider
11-14-2008, 02:33 PM
When it's all said and done the majority will crown Chris Paul and declare him the greatest PG ever.

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 02:36 PM
^^ I was gonna comment on that guy but i thought it was too old. How in the world can Fernandez be compared 2 Paul and Williams?!

Well saltLaker is a Lakers fan from Utah..... trust me when I say this is not an intelligent group of fans.

DerekRE_3
11-14-2008, 02:36 PM
Stockton played in the Jordan era, onlly Houston did squat. All time leader in assists and steals, both by a landslide, are the definition of a point guard.

Well Chris Paul lead the league in steals last year if I'm not mistaken. And this year he is averaging 12 assists and 3 steals (on 55% shooting), if he keeps that up, who knows, he could surpass Stockton if he plays long enough. He also scores more points now than Stockton ever did. I don't think Stockton at age 24 was doing what Chris Paul is doing now.

GSRaider
11-14-2008, 02:36 PM
PLAY ON WHITE BOY. Stockton was a beast. Having Malone didn't hurt but i think Stock could make any big guy look like Malone.

your kidding right? Malone had a serious game. Strong defender and rebounder. He had a great mid range jumper and some of the best post moves I've ever seen.

Stockton is great. He's a hall of famer but he didn't carry Malone by any stretch of the imagination.

Lakers4ItAll
11-14-2008, 02:40 PM
Stockton/Malone > CP3/West for now...........

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 02:49 PM
Well Chris Paul lead the league in steals last year if I'm not mistaken. And this year he is averaging 12 assists and 3 steals (on 55% shooting), if he keeps that up, who knows, he could surpass Stockton if he plays long enough. He also scores more points now than Stockton ever did. I don't think Stockton at age 24 was doing what Chris Paul is doing now.

You think paul can beat 1,504 total career games. And a career 10.5 APG and 2.1 SPG average over 19 years?

Stockton had a career scoring average of 13.1 this is the only stat Paul with finish his career average higher than Stockton did.

How is this for a stat line for you-

Stockton from 1989-1991 (best 2 years) 17.2 PPG, 2.75 SPG, 14.3 APG

15,806 career Assists, 3,265 steals.

rabzouz 96
11-14-2008, 02:58 PM
Stockton/Malone > CP3/West for now...........

what should that show? of course malone is much better than west, whos not even under the best bigs of the league now. useless comparison

Lakers4ItAll
11-14-2008, 03:12 PM
Just like most other comparisons on here it's way too early to tell.


what should that show? of course malone is much better than west, whos not even under the best bigs of the league now. useless comparison


And theres no chance Paul plays as long as Stockton

DerekRE_3
11-14-2008, 04:19 PM
You think paul can beat 1,504 total career games. And a career 10.5 APG and 2.1 SPG average over 19 years?

Stockton had a career scoring average of 13.1 this is the only stat Paul with finish his career average higher than Stockton did.

How is this for a stat line for you-

Stockton from 1989-1991 (best 2 years) 17.2 PPG, 2.75 SPG, 14.3 APG

15,806 career Assists, 3,265 steals.

Chris Paul got off to a quicker start than Stockton did, it took Stockton 2-3 years. Also, Chris Paul came into the league at 20 years old. And he may not beat Stockton in assists and steals, but he will surpass him in points and and rebounds. Also...he has a chance to get some rings as well.

Lakers4ItAll
11-14-2008, 04:29 PM
Ouch what a low blow!


Chris Paul got off to a quicker start than Stockton did, it took Stockton 2-3 years. Also, Chris Paul came into the league at 20 years old. And he may not beat Stockton in assists and steals, but he will surpass him in points and and rebounds. Also...he has a chance to get some rings as well.

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 04:37 PM
No Paul will be lucky to catch Stockton on anything. The way Paul plays he will have a shorter career, much less 19 years. And your right he does have a chance to win some rings. But until he does I don't see the point in giving him any credit for that. :eyebrow:

DerekRE_3
11-14-2008, 04:41 PM
Not giving him any credit to him for it. I'm just saying even without the rings Paul already compares favorably statistically to John Stockton. He gets just as many steals, almost as many assists, more rebounds, and more points. If he keeps up his 22 points, 12 assists, 5.4 rebound performances on 55% shooting (keep in mind he's 24 and putting up those numbers), he would have to be up there with Stockton.

Also, keep in mind that Paul is still 3-4 years from his prime.

sportsnutzz
11-14-2008, 06:22 PM
Look!! I am a Jazz fan if you want me to admit that someone even has a chance to be better than Stockton FORGET IT!!!! :silly:

Vinny642
11-14-2008, 08:04 PM
Stockton/Malone > CP3/West for now...........

100% agreed

xxdc2tegxx
11-14-2008, 08:18 PM
100% agreed



whats the point in arguing about cp3 and stockton...??

anybody can assume this and that....but the bottom line is we cant really put anything in stone until cp3's career is over.

Its like saying after 2 weeks of his pro career--that Derrick Rose will be a top 10 pg just like chris paul. Drose stats are comparable to cp3's rookie year. But nothing can be said until laattteeeerrrrrrr

mrblisterdundee
11-14-2008, 08:32 PM
Does Chris Paul have a peak? You can never know until he actually starts getting worse.

barreleffact
11-14-2008, 08:52 PM
Does Chris Paul have a peak? You can never know until he actually starts getting worse.

24-28pts 15ast 8rebs and 3.5 steals 2.5 t/o's

Lakersfan2483
11-14-2008, 08:52 PM
cause I can't see him playing any better than he is now. he's averaging 23 points*, 12 assists*, and 3 steals per game. he also flirted with triple doubles three times already this season grabbing 7 rebounds in 2 of the games and 8 rebounds in 1.

and if he keeps this up, do you think he'll be consider one of the top 10 PGs of all time? If so, where do you think he'll be ranked?

current top 10 PGs of all time per ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-GreatestPointGuards

1. Magic Johnson
2. Oscar Robinson
3. Isiah Thomas
4. John Stockton
5. Bob Cousy
6. Walt Frazier
7. Jason Kidd
8. Tiny Archibald
9. Steve Nash
10. Gary Payton

what do yall think?





*I rounded up the stats


CP3 has a chance to be in the top 5 point guards of all time, he's that good.

Lakers4ItAll
11-14-2008, 10:23 PM
If if if.........

Hawkeye15
11-15-2008, 12:21 AM
Well Chris Paul lead the league in steals last year if I'm not mistaken. And this year he is averaging 12 assists and 3 steals (on 55% shooting), if he keeps that up, who knows, he could surpass Stockton if he plays long enough. He also scores more points now than Stockton ever did. I don't think Stockton at age 24 was doing what Chris Paul is doing now.

you are correct on the age thing, but the decline stage in modern basketball happens faster, cause guys come out now after 1-2 years, instead of finishing college Now, if Paul never suffers an injury, and can play to 35, he will pass John. And he is a better scorer. I think Paul may become the best point guard to ever play. He needs 2 rings, and the stats. But he is awesome.

Hawkeye15
11-15-2008, 12:23 AM
Ouch what a low blow!

Robert Horry has 7 rings. I still don't think he is a top 200 player ever. Rings add to a career, they don't define it.

sportsnutzz
11-15-2008, 01:22 AM
Britney spears makes carl malone hard like a oak tree

By the way idiot, its Karl Malone