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View Full Version : Kobe making a stong case for the DPOY



Lakersfan2483
11-10-2008, 04:46 AM
I know it's early in the season, but Kobe is playing great defense for the Lakers. He played against Brandon Roy (all-star) on opening night and did an excellent job of guarding him, he held him to 5-15 shooting in a loss. He also played great defense tonight on both T-Mac and Artest (He primarily guarded Artest) and held Artest to 2-11 from the field. T-Mac was 1-11 from the field. The thing that separates Kobe from the rest of the pack is his willingness to guard the opposing team's best player. He has made it a point to guard every team's best player and has done a phenomenal job in guarding each opponent he has faced. So far, Kobe is making a strong case for trying to be the league's top perimeter defender and win the defensive player of the year. His leadership in this department has had a tremendous affect on his teammates, LA has the no. 1 rebounding and defensive team in the League, they have been holding opponents far below 100 pts. a game and to a low field goal pct. Kobe's goal for the team was to get stronger and become a better defensive team, so far, thinks are looking great. Thoughts??

DODGERS&LAKERS
11-10-2008, 04:54 AM
I dont think he will win defensive player of the year. I think its going to D Howard. Its really hard for perimeter players to control a teams defense cause they are usually locked in on one man with their backs to the rest of the floor.

He always plays great D on star players. He likes the challenge of shutting them down. That being said, if he does not respect the opposing 2 guard, he will sag off him and rest on defense. He has been that way for the past couple of years. To be the DPY, he would have to bring it every night. At his age and the Lakers dependence of him on offense, will not allow him to play this hard every night for 77 more games

AIMelo=KillaDUO
11-10-2008, 05:09 AM
I didn't read the whole post... I'm pretty sure Kobe won't win DPOY. Brandon Roy isn't really the best shooter in the league so Kobe "holding" Roy to 5-15 doesn't really impress me.

Ron Artest... doesn't create for himself so holding Artest to poor shooting does persuade me either.

TMac has been bothered by a shoulder injury all-season long.

Of course I'm playing Devils Advocate but, I also don't want Kobe to win it, If he were however, then that's just one more thing to compare him to MJ. And that's definetley something I don't want :)

baaf
11-10-2008, 07:08 AM
I didn't read the whole post... I'm pretty sure Kobe won't win DPOY. Brandon Roy isn't really the best shooter in the league so Kobe "holding" Roy to 5-15 doesn't really impress me.

Ron Artest... doesn't create for himself so holding Artest to poor shooting does persuade me either.

TMac has been bothered by a shoulder injury all-season long.

Of course I'm playing Devils Advocate but, I also don't want Kobe to win it, If he were however, then that's just one more thing to compare him to MJ. And that's definetley something I don't want :)

and shaq shoots blanks from 5ft out.....

what does that have to do with roy/shaq being great scorers??

im not saying that kobe will win it (or should, for that matter) but ur first "argument" is.... garbage?:o

stawka
11-10-2008, 07:10 AM
I dont think he will win defensive player of the year. I think its going to D Howard. Its really hard for perimeter players to control a teams defense cause they are usually locked in on one man with their backs to the rest of the floor.

He always plays great D on star players. He likes the challenge of shutting them down. That being said, if he does not respect the opposing 2 guard, he will sag off him and rest on defense. He has been that way for the past couple of years. To be the DPY, he would have to bring it every night. At his age and the Lakers dependence of him on offense, will not allow him to play this hard every night for 77 more games

You pretty much summed it up for me. Especially the part about how hard it is for a perimeter player to pick up DPOY honours

innovator
11-10-2008, 07:30 AM
he wont win it but he will finish in top 5 of the votings

madiaz3
11-10-2008, 07:39 AM
I didn't read the whole post... I'm pretty sure Kobe won't win DPOY. Brandon Roy isn't really the best shooter in the league so Kobe "holding" Roy to 5-15 doesn't really impress me.

Ron Artest... doesn't create for himself so holding Artest to poor shooting does persuade me either.

TMac has been bothered by a shoulder injury all-season long.

Of course I'm playing Devils Advocate but, I also don't want Kobe to win it, If he were however, then that's just one more thing to compare him to MJ. And that's definetley something I don't want :)

Did you watch the Houston/Portland OT game?

Lakers4ItAll
11-10-2008, 07:56 AM
Kobe's D has always been solid. I'm sure since he has gotten a MVP now he wants to win other awards

LakerzDQ
11-10-2008, 08:15 AM
Kobe's defense is very good this season, but I think it's always started out well.

in the middle of the season, he realizes that it's not worth playing defense, and starts to slack off a bit. he picks it up when he gets motivated, but I don't think he'll be a defensive stopper for the whole season.

he's not a good enough defender to actually win DPOY. maybe get a vote or two. but not win it.

JayW_1023
11-10-2008, 08:34 AM
It seems the defense he played in the Olympics have really rubbed off. He also looks far more efficient on offense and seems to force less shots. He is so good that he can get anywhere he wants on the floor so it is logical as he gets older that he will pick his spots, much like Jordan did in his later years.

innovator
11-10-2008, 08:41 AM
I didn't read the whole post... I'm pretty sure Kobe won't win DPOY. Brandon Roy isn't really the best shooter in the league so Kobe "holding" Roy to 5-15 doesn't really impress me.

Ron Artest... doesn't create for himself so holding Artest to poor shooting does persuade me either.

TMac has been bothered by a shoulder injury all-season long.

Of course I'm playing Devils Advocate but, I also don't want Kobe to win it, If he were however, then that's just one more thing to compare him to MJ. And that's definetley something I don't want :)

doesnt create for himself??? are you serious he averaged 20 ppg last season without someone to create shots for him, artest created most of his shots..

oh tmac is bothered by a shoulder injury, maybe thats why he has averaged close to 20 ppg coming in the game and 1-11 is still crap in anyway you say it.

dont be sour just because ur boy melo cant play defense

barreleffact
11-10-2008, 08:51 AM
ok ok...we all know the man can play defense. he has been 1st team all defense how many times??? DPOY?...well he can get it, but I doubt he will. If he keeps containing people then he has to definately be in the running, but Like someone said Its easier for post players like D12 to win because they can limit the entire oppositions offense instead of just 1 player. at this point the race to me is kobe, dwade, d12, and idk who else....


the real question tho is...can you shoot 3's w him in 2k9??? no matter how i try, i cant. idk his timing i guess. i can hit 2's all day but 3's no matter how open nor contested he never makes it unless its the 4th quarter. and overall he shoots 20-40% max for me....help!!! lol

JayW_1023
11-10-2008, 08:55 AM
D12 is averaging four blocks a game...does that say anything about his quality help defense or the atrocious perimeter defense the Magic play?

Defense isn't always in the statistics...why do you think KG won it last year?

barreleffact
11-10-2008, 09:05 AM
D12 is averaging four blocks a game...does that say anything about his quality help defense or the atrocious perimeter defense the Magic play?

Defense isn't always in the statistics...why do you think KG won it last year?

valid points, but what about camby??? he won because the nuggets sucked all around defensively. why cant howard get it then??

JayW_1023
11-10-2008, 09:08 AM
valid points, but what about camby??? he won because the nuggets sucked all around defensively. why cant howard get it then??

^^^

Because people always seem more fixated on numbers than actually seeing what happens out there on the hardwood.

JayW_1023
11-10-2008, 09:15 AM
Getting blocks is another stat...a guy like Howard or Camby can always attempt to swat away lay-up attempts as a result of constant gambing on the perimeter or bad defense on screen and rolls...but KG's quick footed help defense and court awareness on defense won't even allow the lay-up attempt in the first place...does that appear on the stat sheet? When a help defender is good enough to force opponents into bad shots instead of a high percentage attempt...that's better defense.

It's the little things, baby, the little things...

barreleffact
11-10-2008, 09:16 AM
still...someone has to bat clean up. not just anybody can be that defensive presence. but I understand...im just saying he has a chance. I havent seen enough games to actually know who will get it tho

BTownTeamsRKing
11-10-2008, 11:42 AM
yay more laker talk.

anyways so your telling me that if u had to bet $500 on someone making a stop on LBJ or Pierce or Melo, that u would rather have kobe instead of Artest or KG?

no way.

kobe>lebron
11-10-2008, 12:05 PM
bynum is averaging 4 blocks and 2 steals a game

FortyDubs
11-10-2008, 12:12 PM
bynum is averaging 4 blocks and 2 steals a game

No... he isn't.

Kabowdos
11-10-2008, 12:16 PM
I didn't read the whole post... I'm pretty sure Kobe won't win DPOY. Brandon Roy isn't really the best shooter in the league so Kobe "holding" Roy to 5-15 doesn't really impress me.

Ron Artest... doesn't create for himself so holding Artest to poor shooting does persuade me either.

TMac has been bothered by a shoulder injury all-season long.

Of course I'm playing Devils Advocate but, I also don't want Kobe to win it, If he were however, then that's just one more thing to compare him to MJ. And that's definetley something I don't want :)

So your trying to hide the fact that Kobe is great? He is going to be compared to MJ no matter what.

JayW_1023
11-10-2008, 12:39 PM
Unfortunately with Laker fans posting so many homer arguments, it's hard to take it seriously and when one of them actually makes a valid point for his team some even percieve it as a homer post. And I agree with what the threadstarter has said.

I think Kobe has been one of the defensive standouts so far this season. Good position defense isn't measured by statistics...and Kobe seems to really like the challenge to lock down the opposing teams best perimeter guys.

This Lakers team has enough offense anyway so that Kobe doesn't have to score 40 on a weekly basis, which allows him to use more energy on the defensive end.

CELTICS4LYFE
11-10-2008, 12:42 PM
i think its way too early 4 this talk

Raidaz4Life
11-10-2008, 04:51 PM
He's always a legitimate candidate being one of the best perimeter defenders in the league but he'll lose it to a big like usual. I would bet on Bynum over Kobe

BlondeBomber41
11-10-2008, 05:08 PM
No, Kobe isnt making a strong case for DPOY. Nobody is, because its only the 2nd week of the season.....

barreleffact
11-10-2008, 05:23 PM
so...im assuming nobody can shoot 3's w kobe in 2k9????

and what do you mean nobody is? it's early in the season but its 82 games. what makes the 1st 20 games any less important than the last? if you win the 1st 20 you have less pressure in the end.

Chronz
11-10-2008, 05:25 PM
D12 is averaging four blocks a game...does that say anything about his quality help defense or the atrocious perimeter defense the Magic play?

Defense isn't always in the statistics...why do you think KG won it last year?

KG:
Highest Adj. Defensive +/- in the league last year
Led the league in Defensive RTG
3rd in Defensive WinShares
Celtics ranked 1st in defending PF's (by PER)
Low Counter part numbers

I guess defense can be in the statistics?

Lakersfan2483
11-10-2008, 05:30 PM
No, Kobe isnt making a strong case for DPOY. Nobody is, because its only the 2nd week of the season.....

I understand it's early in the season, my title should have said, Kobe making an "early case for defensive player of the year." I don't think anyone can deny the Lakers are a different team in terms of how they defend this year and it all starts with their leader, Kobe Bryant. Last season, LA was a solid defensive team, but their main thing was to outscore opponents. This year, their philosophy has changed, defense is clearly the focus. The Lakers are no. 1 in holding opponents to a low fg%, ppg, and it all starts with their new attitude about taking pride in stopping teams. It's still early, but I feel like Kobe is making an early case that he will be a force to be reckoned with on the defensive end. This is some of the best defense I have seem him play since 2003. His intensity on defense and hustle plays have energized the lakers and as a result, LA is no. 1 in defense so far.

barreleffact
11-10-2008, 05:30 PM
KG:
Highest Adj. Defensive +/- in the league last year
Led the league in Defensive RTG
3rd in Defensive WinShares
Celtics ranked 1st in defending PF's (by PER)
Low Counter part numbers

I guess defense can be in the statistics?

so who has the best right now, and where do you go to look all this up?

alexander_37
11-10-2008, 05:36 PM
i say ron artest could be a strong contender for it this year

Zefflin
11-10-2008, 09:22 PM
so your telling me that if u had to bet $500 on someone making a stop on LBJ or Pierce or Melo, that u would rather have kobe instead of Artest or KG?

I like to gamble. I would. It'd be a good bet.

KB24PG16
11-10-2008, 09:36 PM
he wont win but he did have two nice blocks on yao and t mac

tru
11-10-2008, 09:38 PM
bro, what are you kidding???,they havent even played 10 games yet, dont get ahead of yourself, im sure kobe will finish in the top 5 voting but its entirely to early to say wait til at least 30 games have been played, kobe could tear his acl tomarrow(knock on wood), just be patient my man

ARMIN12NBA
11-10-2008, 09:40 PM
I dont think he will win defensive player of the year. I think its going to D Howard. Its really hard for perimeter players to control a teams defense cause they are usually locked in on one man with their backs to the rest of the floor.

He always plays great D on star players. He likes the challenge of shutting them down. That being said, if he does not respect the opposing 2 guard, he will sag off him and rest on defense. He has been that way for the past couple of years. To be the DPY, he would have to bring it every night. At his age and the Lakers dependence of him on offense, will not allow him to play this hard every night for 77 more games

I agree with a lot of what you said. It is hard for a guard to get DPOY, but the way Kobe has been playing defense, he is probably worthy of the award so far (BTW--Artest was 0 for 8 while Kobe was on him and Roy was 2 for 10). I think the Lakers depth may actually allow him to play harder on defense night in and night out. He is, after all, only playing 33 MPG. He will concentrate more on defense this year. Will that result in a DPOY? Maybe. Who knows? It's only 5 games.

One thing I truly don't agree with is D. Howard for DPOY. He is a very bad P and R defender and is pretty bad man on man. His blocks are impressive so far, but that won't stay.

Another thing about Howard is that his opponents are at an 18 PER. I don't really like PER because it doesn't tell the true measure of a player (defense, impact), but it can tell you some things. PER is a lot about offense and his opponents are going at an above average PER (I believe the average is like 14 or 15).

In comparison, Kobe Bryant is holding opponents to a 5 PER and Andrew Bynum is holding his opponents to a 2 PER (holy crap!).

Soto>Norris
11-10-2008, 09:52 PM
kobe is to DPOY as Danny Granger is to MVP at this point.

tru
11-10-2008, 10:30 PM
kobe is to DPOY as Danny Granger is to MVP at this point.

your joking about granger, right???

Lakersfan2483
11-10-2008, 10:45 PM
kobe is to DPOY as Danny Granger is to MVP at this point.

Are you kidding me? We shall see how it all ends up this season.

Lakers4ItAll
11-10-2008, 10:53 PM
Lol


kobe is to dpoy as danny granger is to mvp at this point.

AIMelo=KillaDUO
11-10-2008, 11:47 PM
doesnt create for himself??? are you serious he averaged 20 ppg last season without someone to create shots for him, artest created most of his shots..

oh tmac is bothered by a shoulder injury, maybe thats why he has averaged close to 20 ppg coming in the game and 1-11 is still crap in anyway you say it.

dont be sour just because ur boy melo cant play defense

Ok?

Look at Ron Artests shooting %

I guess he can create for himself... just isnt good at shooting when he does.

Who said anything about Melo? Damn Lakers fans. :pity:

AIMelo=KillaDUO
11-10-2008, 11:48 PM
Did you watch the Houston/Portland OT game?


Linas Kleiza scored 41 in a game... does that make him a great offensive player?

CELTICS4LYFE
11-11-2008, 12:10 PM
ok did any one see kg last night??? dpoy right there!!!! he is an animal!!!!

rosesbulls
11-11-2008, 01:32 PM
If kobe wins dpoy his offensive game will probably decline by 3-5 ppg

Lost Art
11-11-2008, 01:40 PM
I must admit, this is the best D I've EVER seen Kobe play. Will he win the DPOY? I don't know. But if he plays like this all season, he's definitely going to get a lot of consideration. He's playing D like every possession is the last of the game and he's playing the most physical perimeter D that I've seen in quite some time. Hell, he out-muscled Artest the other night!!! Made him look like a softy. I've said it for quite some time and I'll say it again, Kobe is the toughest player in the NBA. Period. His ability to play through injuries, his tenacity on D, and the fact that he won't back down from anyone makes him pretty special. I really think that its his huge ego that helps him out in the toughness department, he feels so much entitlement in this league that he doesn't back down from any challenge. Glad him, and his big ego, are on my team :D

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 02:25 PM
I have watched only 2 Laker games, but Kobe does seem to be making a great effort to slow the other teams best perimeter player. Now, having 7', 7', 610" in back of you helps a lot, guards don't want to drive into that, so shooting % is not what should be looked at. is he getting guys out of their comfort zones? Is he active in the passing lanes? Is he helping on the weakside? Are his man's shots all contested? And so far, from the games I watched, yes. Kobe is playing very good defense, and I would expect his offensive numbers to shrink just a bit. But the Lakers are deep enough it won't matter.

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 02:26 PM
ok did any one see kg last night??? dpoy right there!!!! he is an animal!!!!

It's his to lose. I fear he won't get enough minutes to defend the title, not enough stats to back up the assumption.

ARMIN12NBA
11-11-2008, 02:32 PM
I have watched only 2 Laker games, but Kobe does seem to be making a great effort to slow the other teams best perimeter player. Now, having 7', 7', 610" in back of you helps a lot, guards don't want to drive into that, so shooting % is not what should be looked at. is he getting guys out of their comfort zones? Is he active in the passing lanes? Is he helping on the weakside? Are his man's shots all contested? And so far, from the games I watched, yes. Kobe is playing very good defense, and I would expect his offensive numbers to shrink just a bit. But the Lakers are deep enough it won't matter.

Agreed. This reminds me of 2000-2002. Kobe sacrificing his stats (ultimately legacy) for the betterment of the team. He is playing great defense and scoring only when needed. He is picking his spots. This Laker team doesn't really need scoring and I think Kobe realizes that. The Lakers are #1 in offense without him scoring 30+ anyways. The difference is that they are #1 in defense this year.

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 02:39 PM
Agreed. This reminds me of 2000-2002. Kobe sacrificing his stats (ultimately legacy) for the betterment of the team. He is playing great defense and scoring only when needed. He is picking his spots. This Laker team doesn't really need scoring and I think Kobe realizes that. The Lakers are #1 in offense without him scoring 30+ anyways. The difference is that they are #1 in defense this year.

Well, those years, Kobe was the #2 man. Big difference. But he is a vet now, with a great supporting cast, and knows what to do. At the very least, he is saving it up for late season, and resting that pinkie by not shooting 30 times a game.
And my last couple of statements were not easy, most know that I sort of despise the Lakers, but I am trying to stay true to my claim that I look at basketball without bias

Lost Art
11-11-2008, 02:39 PM
Agreed. This reminds me of 2000-2002. Kobe sacrificing his stats (ultimately legacy) for the betterment of the team. He is playing great defense and scoring only when needed. He is picking his spots. This Laker team doesn't really need scoring and I think Kobe realizes that. The Lakers are #1 in offense without him scoring 30+ anyways. The difference is that they are #1 in defense this year.

The Lakers are the #1 in offense, #1 in defense, and #1 in rebounding. Pretty cool. Think about where we were at the beginning of last season and where we are now...........that is one hell of a quick turnaround. Way to go Mitch :clap:

hotpotato1092
11-11-2008, 02:50 PM
How can he not get it? He has shut down some of the NBA's best offensive players and made it look easy. And he doesn't do it like Bowen, he plays real defense not "I'm gonna kick ur surgically repaired knee when the refs aren't looking" crap that Bowen does. And for those who think only centers can get it, Artest won it and MJ did multiple times.

Lost Art
11-11-2008, 02:56 PM
How can he not get it? He has shut down some of the NBA's best offensive players and made it look easy. And he doesn't do it like Bowen, he plays real defense not "I'm gonna kick ur surgically repaired knee when the refs aren't looking" crap that Bowen does. And for those who think only centers can get it, Artest won it and MJ did multiple times.

Actually MJ only won it once.

........and we're only 5 games into the season

.......but if he keeps this up, I don't see how he wouldn't be in the running.

Here is an article about a recent hissy fit he had in a blowout win:


Kobe Bryant exited a recent game against the Clippers and punched the bench as soon as he sat down, causing the whole row of chairs to rock backwards. What was eating Kobe? He thought his team was giving up too many points to their hometown rivals.

"I was just pissed," Bryant said. "Offense is not going to piss me off, it's defense that is going to piss me off."

The Lakers are currently first in points allowed per game (84.4) and second in opponent's field goal percentage allowed (.390). I'd hate to see what he'd do if L.A. falls to second and third in those categories.

Keep him away from the Bobby Knight footage.

I love the fact that he is focusing on defense that much this year. We were winning by like 30 points and they only ended up scoring 88 points, and he still was upset about the D.......priceless :clap: This is EXACTLY what we needed from Kobe after years of subpar defense from this Lakers squad. Defense wins championships, and he seems to fully understand that now.

sportsfanblue
11-11-2008, 03:29 PM
It don't matter or mean much if Kobe wins DPOY. Team defense is what we need to focus on and we are doing a great job thus far. The accolade would be nice though.

Lost Art
11-11-2008, 03:32 PM
It don't matter or mean much if Kobe wins DPOY. Team defense is what we need to focus on and we are doing a great job thus far. The accolade would be nice though.

Very, very true. But it all starts with Kobe, he sets the tone for the rest of the squad. If he's working his tail off on that side of the floor, you better believe that everyone else on the squad will fall in line.

$ NyC $
11-11-2008, 03:37 PM
Actually MJ only won it once.

........and we're only 5 games into the season

.......but if he keeps this up, I don't see how he wouldn't be in the running.

Here is an article about a recent hissy fit he had in a blowout win:



I love the fact that he is focusing on defense that much this year. We were winning by like 30 points and they only ended up scoring 88 points, and he still was upset about the D.......priceless :clap: This is EXACTLY what we needed from Kobe after years of subpar defense from this Lakers squad. Defense wins championships, and he seems to fully understand that now.




Well, after losing to the Celtics because of that, he sure as hell better.

G-Funk
11-11-2008, 05:37 PM
This is Kobes chance to win it even though he doesn't like to gamble cause that breaksdown the D and is not good at coming from the weak side to make a block like Wade is. but he is stopping the foes. he has a shot.

da wood
11-11-2008, 06:38 PM
its too early to tell but if we are talking about him in psd then best believe that his effort have not gone unnoticed

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 07:31 PM
its too early to tell but if we are talking about him in psd then best believe that his effort have not gone unnoticed

lets be honest bro, PSD wouldn't miss Kobe picking his nose on the bench there are so many Kobe worshippers here.

barreleffact
11-11-2008, 07:34 PM
lets be honest bro, PSD wouldn't miss Kobe picking his nose on the bench there are so many Kobe worshippers here.

speaking of players doing unappealing things, does lebron still chew his nails in games? he still does in the video games, but i havent seen him do that much since maybe his 3rd season(when he did it A LOT)

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 10:14 PM
speaking of players doing unappealing things, does lebron still chew his nails in games? he still does in the video games, but i havent seen him do that much since maybe his 3rd season(when he did it A LOT)

a little. I watched 2 Cavs games, and he does it still, but its not liking he is digging for gold on the end of his fingertips anymore. God that was annoying. He is probably too busy yelling at Wally for letting anyone score at will!

Anthony Flores
11-11-2008, 10:26 PM
Seriously who watches Kobe play defense

Hawkeye15
11-11-2008, 10:33 PM
Seriously who watches Kobe play defense

people like me, who are trying to find anything to nitpick about that bad ***. Ha! Still looking

IBleedPurple
11-11-2008, 10:48 PM
Kobe will be top 10, but not even top 3. He is really good, but as noted, is an outside defender.

Plus he is an arrogant SOB, so the less awards he gets, the better

Zefflin
11-11-2008, 10:52 PM
Seriously who watches Kobe play defense

:eyebrow:

:bang:

People who appreciate good defense.

cahawk
11-11-2008, 11:36 PM
Matador defense, does that count as defense now?

DODGERS&LAKERS
11-12-2008, 12:49 AM
people like me, who are trying to find anything to nitpick about that bad ***. Ha! Still looking

LOL. That was a good one.

LAKERS 24/7
11-12-2008, 01:12 AM
Actually MJ only won it once.

........and we're only 5 games into the season

.......but if he keeps this up, I don't see how he wouldn't be in the running.

Here is an article about a recent hissy fit he had in a blowout win:



I love the fact that he is focusing on defense that much this year. We were winning by like 30 points and they only ended up scoring 88 points, and he still was upset about the D.......priceless :clap: This is EXACTLY what we needed from Kobe after years of subpar defense from this Lakers squad. Defense wins championships, and he seems to fully understand that now.

wow, i didn't know that. do you have a link to that article?

ink
11-12-2008, 04:18 PM
bump

G-Funk
11-12-2008, 05:08 PM
Kobe will be top 10, but not even top 3. He is really good, but as noted, is an outside defender.

Plus he is an arrogant SOB, so the less awards he gets, the better

Take those hater goggles off.