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View Full Version : Ordonez back on trading block?



Dalionking
09-15-2008, 10:26 AM
Posted by Scott Warheit September 15, 2008 06:27AM
Categories: Top Sports
One of the biggest stories to follow this off-season is whether the Detroit Tigers trade who many consider to be their best player: Magglio Ordonez. Ordonez is set to make $18 million next season and may help the Tigers rebuild in a trade, one of the reasons the Detroit Free Press writes he may be moved despite his second consecutive great season for the Tigers.

September 14, Detroit Free Press: Yet, he is set to be the highest-paid player ($18 million) in 2009 for team that woefully underperformed in 2008. He is an expensive, productive player, which would suggest there is money to be saved and value to be gained by trading him.

The Tigers' woeful season has exposed areas of immediate need. They need a shortstop who covers more ground than Edgar Renteria. They need a closer, unless they are comfortable with Fernando Rodney (36 innings, 25 walks) protecting leads in the ninth inning. They need one more setup man, because of the uncertainty surrounding Joel Zumaya's health. They also need to improve their rotation.

The most appealing trade partners would be the Angels and Cubs, both of whom have good depth at shortstop and intriguing young arms. But they also lead their respective divisions and may not feel the pressing need to add a hitter -- even one as accomplished as Ordonez -- to their crowded outfields.

smarkow
09-15-2008, 10:33 AM
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I really don't want to trade Magglio. I love the idea of the middle of our lineup being Magglio and Cabrera.

That said, if we do trade him, we better get some guys that can step in and perform.

Hermie13
09-15-2008, 10:38 AM
I think the Dodgers could be players for Mags if they can't retain Manny Ramirez. And especially if they land CC for the rotation. They could they move a starter and a reliever....possibly even a young SS like Hu. Penny, Elbert, and Hu would make some sense for the Tigers. Penny has an option for $8-9M I believe. Elbert is a nice young lefty reliever who could close (former starter). Hu had great promise but has struggled in the bigs. Has the glove though for short or 2B. Dodgers would probably try and pawn Andruw Jones off on the Tigers....picking up a nice chunk of his salary for 2009 as well though. Still could work out in the Tigers favor. If they don't get a LOT of pitching help they'll be right back where they are this year.....

smarkow
09-15-2008, 10:41 AM
UGH, Andruw Jones is definitely a guy i don't want on this team.

Hermie13
09-15-2008, 10:51 AM
UGH, Andruw Jones is definitely a guy i don't want on this team.

ha, I think he's a guy no one wants on their team ;)


I just threw his name out there......HIGHLY doubt he can be moved at all....unless of course the dogers are willing to take on about $14M of his 09 salary.....

Epic89
09-15-2008, 08:40 PM
I will be ****ing livid if Ordonez is traded

mark1125
09-15-2008, 08:52 PM
I will be ****ing livid if Ordonez is traded

Agreed. He is one of only a few Tigers who earned thie pay this year. If they do deal him, they better get a bounty of talent. Not another Pudge for Farnsworth crap deal.

Epic89
09-15-2008, 09:46 PM
In unrelated matters, Bondomania- I want to apologize for blindly dismissing your "Verlander is no ace" argument. You were right; he has ace potential and I still say he has the best stuff of any of the young studs in the game but no ace yet.

And how you guys like Dontrelle tonight? I know he's in line to win through five, but he still can't throw strikes (only 47 of 88 pitches thus far).

Bondomania
09-15-2008, 10:24 PM
thanks for the apology.. haha.. that was a while ago.. anyway, it is a small step though, he was erratic in the strikezone but made the pitches when he needed to.. really it was the one inning when he walked two then gave up the homer that was his bad inning, but if you discount that, then he would have only walked three and given up 1 hit in 4 IP.. like i said, small steps at this point to rebuild the guys confidence

stanpapi
09-16-2008, 06:41 PM
I'm not against trading him, but as someone said above, we better damn well get a ton of goodies. To that end, it might not be a bad time to trade him. I'm not talking about dumping him, but by trading him to a team that figures it's one part away from contending, you should be able to fill some current holes and restock the farm system in one fell swoop. If you can get all that for a guy who really should be DH-ing, I'm all for it. But DD would have to bring home the goodies on this.

Bondomania
09-16-2008, 09:46 PM
I like the idea of trading him for a package that involves Matt Kemp of the Dodgers.. Kemp is young with power and speed, and he plays a nice RF... you gotta think that if the Dodgers don't retain Manny, they will be looking for another big bat for that lineup... Ordonez for Matt Kemp and a pitching prospect, or 3B prospect or SS prospect would be nice

smarkow
09-17-2008, 09:28 AM
that trade with the dodgers would need, in my opinion, kemp, a pitcher and someone else that is a prospect. I just can't argue for a trade unless we got a lot in return. Magglio has been nothing but great for the past few years, especially in the past two seasons. His HR numbers are down, but thats not really his thing. he hits.
I hadnt checked the stats recently, but Magglio is now tied for 2nd in the AL for batting average. There is a high probability that he wins the AL batting title two years in a row; no small feat

Bondomania
09-17-2008, 10:08 AM
i would do Magglio for Kemp and Broxton.. broxton is just flat out nasty, i think he is a bit dinged up right now, but i don't think it is anything serious.. and i think he is closer material

Hermie13
09-17-2008, 10:19 AM
Dodgers won't trade Kemp for Ordonez. Kemp could easily be better than Ordonez next year.....not too metion that they may very likely be couting on broxton as their closer for next year....neither is gettign shipped out for a high price OFer, even one as good as Ordonez.

Bondomania
09-18-2008, 05:26 PM
the Dodgers have considered shopping kemp in the past, and they have a surplus of outfielders... but i might even consider doing maggs for kemp straight up..

stanpapi
09-18-2008, 08:14 PM
that trade with the dodgers would need, in my opinion, kemp, a pitcher and someone else that is a prospect. I just can't argue for a trade unless we got a lot in return. Magglio has been nothing but great for the past few years, especially in the past two seasons. His HR numbers are down, but thats not really his thing. he hits.
I hadnt checked the stats recently, but Magglio is now tied for 2nd in the AL for batting average. There is a high probability that he wins the AL batting title two years in a row; no small feat

...I just don't think his value will ever be higher than it is now. I mean, the guy hit what he hit these past couple years -- and you can't argue with those numbers, no matter. And the only way I'd be willing to part with him at this point is, like I said, to get a lot of goodies in return (somewhat likely from a team that fancies itself from being this kind of player away from contending). The thing is he's a one-dimensional player. I see him as the DH of the future. Other thing is, how long do you think he can keep this up? Great as the year he's having, his numbers are down. I know, how could they go any other way? But when he starts turning in .290 and .300 seasons, he's just not that sensational by reason of he does not really help you in any other way. He can't run. Day in, day out, he's not exactly a great fielder. In fact, he's less than mediocre as a RF. Again, I'm not saying run him out of town. We can certainly use anybody who can hit .300-plus with power. I'm just saying, if you get a good looking package, take a sniff. Maybe you even throw in one of the several overpaid players beyond their best-before dates.

Hermie13
09-19-2008, 08:33 AM
Yeah, they pondered trading him for CC and other key pitchers....but he's now turning into what they thought he'd be. No way do they trade him for Maggs straight up. They're trying to save some money since they still have Jones and Pierre on the books. Not gonna happen.....most teams know that the reason the Tigers are considering trading Mags is for a salary dump, they aren't gonna part with that kind of talen (aka, Kemp) for him.....

Also, they do have a surplus of OFers...but they're not going to trade one of the young ones for Mags....it'll just put them in the same spot they already are....but with a much higher payroll....

Bondomania
09-19-2008, 12:29 PM
eh, it could be a salary dump, but at the same time, there are other routes they could go if they are looking to get rid of salary... Guillen, inge, robertson and willis are all options to trade (obviously the last two would be flat out salary dumps, and Willis and Robertson will have to proove themselves in spring training). And both would be salary dumps, Magglio still has 3 years left technically on his current contract, so you are still getting maggs for 3 years.

All that aside, i wouldn't be completely against trading maggs for 2 blue chip prospects.. mainly because i think 2009 isn't going to be a year in which we truly compete for the division, and i think that it wouldn't be a bad idea to cash in and get 2 solid pitching prospects.. Hell, if Saltalamachia can net the Ranger Clay Bucholz as being rumored, then i think we should be able to get something solid for the defending batting champ, with the possibility of being the repeat batting champ...

Hermie13
09-19-2008, 02:05 PM
yaeh....willis will be nearly impossible to move. Same with Robertson...even with good springs. You'd have to eat a LOT of their contracts to trade them....

cubsfan9124
09-19-2008, 03:14 PM
i would do Magglio for Kemp and Broxton.. broxton is just flat out nasty, i think he is a bit dinged up right now, but i don't think it is anything serious.. and i think he is closer material

Yeah the dodgers wouldnt give up either of those guys straight up for Ordonez.

Anyway other then Cabrera and maybe Verlander there isnt anyone who should be untouchable on this team.

Hermie13
09-19-2008, 03:31 PM
Yeah the dodgers wouldnt give up either of those guys straight up for Ordonez.

Anyway other then Cabrera and maybe Verlander there isnt anyone who should be untouchable on this team.

I'd add Granderson to that list.....

stanpapi
09-19-2008, 06:40 PM
I don't think you'd have to eat any of Ordonez' salary. He's last year's batting champ, maybe this years. I assume a lot of teams could use a guy like that. I'm not saying going after Ordonez would be smart, but it could be that piece someone needs. And while I'm not sure of what he would net on the market, there will be some takers, perhaps even desperate takers.

Bondomania
09-20-2008, 03:56 PM
yeah, plus his contract isn't that outrageous for the production you get from him... robertson's and willis's contracts are stupid... but Ordonez is getting paid what the market would probably pay him.. 15 or 16 mill. for a guy that routinely gets into the 20 hr 100 rbi range isn't bad.. i think that he has had a slow year for himself, but i think the oblique injury he suffered right before the break kinda set him back

stanpapi
09-21-2008, 12:03 AM
Set backs or not, he's had a great year, personally. But again, his value is high, and you're right, Bondo. For a guy that turns in those numbers, he's not outrageous. Whatever our reason for trading him or not, he should command something real in return for someone who thinks they can win now.

JackB
09-21-2008, 08:54 AM
I for one would hate to see Ordonez traded. But if he is traded it would have to be for a top starter plus something in a good prospect. We need pitching. The offense also sputtered but the pitching was a total disaster.

Nikolishin
09-23-2008, 04:34 AM
i would keep maggz

Hermie13
09-23-2008, 09:28 AM
Not many teams (if any) will be willing to give up a top starting pitcher for Maggs. Best you could probably hope for is Brad Penny and a prospect like Scott Elbert from the Dodgers (maybe an additional prospect like Hu thrown in). But a better starter than Penny isn't going to be had for Maggs, even with how good he has been.

drewbius416
09-24-2008, 05:05 PM
Would the Blue Jays be a team that you could make a deal with for Mags? We have a few arms in the leagues best bullpen that could solve your woes, up and coming prospects as well.. What players of ours would you want in return?

Bondomania
09-24-2008, 09:13 PM
i like league or whatever his name is... that kid is sick.. i would take him and a good prospect

serGeant
10-10-2008, 04:56 PM
"Surplus" of outfielders? I count Andre Ethier and Matt Kemp as their valid outfield options for next year (if Manny does not resign). Are you really counting Andruw Jones and Juan Pierre as "crowding" the outfield? Besides, if the Dodgers are going to take on $18 million next year, why not just offer it to Manny? Why pay Maggs the same amount AND give up one of their future stars in Kemp, Broxton, or whoever else?

serGeant
10-10-2008, 04:59 PM
I wonder if the Braves would be interested in Maggs. He is pricey, but they have money to spend next year, have expressed an interest to improve their outfield power via trade rather than free agency, and have infield depth. Packaging SS Yunel Escobar (a younger, cheaper alternative to Renteria) with some combination of young pitching (Tommy Hanson, Charlie Morton, etc.) and/or OFs (Brandon Jones, Gorkys Hernandez, Jayson Heyward) could be appealing for Detroit, while shrinking the payroll. Atlanta can have Brent Lillibridge or Martin Prado take over short for Escobar, while not upgrading their lineup immensely. However, a 3-4 combo of Chipper Jones and Magglio is a bit unsettling (health-wise).

JackB
10-10-2008, 09:42 PM
From what I have read Manny wants 75 million for 5 years. That is cheaper per year but does anybody give him that long of a deal?

Bondomania
10-10-2008, 11:02 PM
i would take escobar and schafer.. i know that schafer was suspended earlier for performance substances or whatever.. but in spring training they were saying that this kid is the real deal and the centerfielder of the future.. and i saw that he hit 10 homeruns in the time that he returned from that suspension.. he could be a player that i would like to see wearing the old english D.. i think Escobar and Schafer would be a fair deal

Nizzle20
10-11-2008, 02:25 PM
I dont want to go into next year without Magglio. How about Atlanta takes Sheffield for and new batting cage net?

Bondomania
10-12-2008, 10:22 AM
it definitly would be sad to see magglio go.. but if we can get a decent package of players in return, i wouldn't be opposed to it.. i think Escobar can play 3rd too.. that would allow us to bump Inge out of 3rd when either Worth or Iorg are ready to play SS at the major league level

stanpapi
10-12-2008, 11:45 PM
Inge will pull a poop fit. I don't know why it matters, but it apparently does, and he will.

braves95
10-14-2008, 06:00 PM
He will be a Brave call me an idiot now but he will be a brave before opening day

mark1125
10-14-2008, 07:53 PM
Inge will pull a poop fit. I don't know why it matters, but it apparently does, and he will.

He can poop all he wants. It would be a mirror image of his offensive production. I hold Inge in the same regard as I do Fernando Rodney and Nate Robertson.

stanpapi
10-15-2008, 12:34 AM
He will be a Brave call me an idiot now but he will be a brave before opening day

Ideally, we call you a prophet, but only if this comes true. If not, we'll call you somethin'.

Nizzle20
10-15-2008, 09:50 AM
He will be a Brave call me an idiot now but he will be a brave before opening day


OK. I can deal with that. But who would the Tigers get? Please tell me Jurrjens would be one. Would love to have him back.

Bondomania
10-15-2008, 10:52 AM
probably not.. Jurrjens is not coming back.. probably should just let it go.. it will probably be for a current starting position player and a prospect, or a package of prospects

stanpapi
10-15-2008, 11:25 AM
I don't care what we get, as long as we lose Inge's contract. He's a bad bench guy, doesn't want to catch. Makes him a bad team guy, period. And he's just flat-out too bad at the plate to be an every day guy anymore.

braves95
10-15-2008, 05:50 PM
Ideally, we call you a prophet, but only if this comes true. If not, we'll call you somethin'.


lol


OK. I can deal with that. But who would the Tigers get? Please tell me Jurrjens would be one. Would love to have him back.


Sorry tiger fans but the braves are probably gonna lock him up soon and hes gonna be a brave for a long long time

Epic89
10-15-2008, 09:21 PM
If the Dodgers don't resign Manny, they're going to trade for Magglio. I do like Andre Ethier

Bondomania
10-16-2008, 10:39 AM
i like matt kemp more than i like eithier, but hey, either or would be a nice addition.. matt kemp could be a nice leadoff hitter, and he can steal bases, i think he had more than 20

Epic89
10-16-2008, 11:23 AM
i like matt kemp more than i like eithier, but hey, either or would be a nice addition.. matt kemp could be a nice leadoff hitter, and he can steal bases, i think he had more than 20

I like Kemp better too, but could Ethier play CF in his stead? Or do they go with Andruw Jones then :speechless:

ThreeIfBaerga
10-16-2008, 02:44 PM
Originally Posted by Bondomania View Post
i like matt kemp more than i like eithier, but hey, either or would be a nice addition.. matt kemp could be a nice leadoff hitter, and he can steal bases, i think he had more than 20

Kemp has legit power potential. He's the kind of guy who will anchor the middle of the order when he reaches his potential.

Muttman73
10-16-2008, 06:30 PM
Trade Him...Maggs doesn't belong in Detroit...never did

JackB
10-17-2008, 07:22 AM
Hey Braves95 Check this out
A person familiar with the talks told the Atlanta Journal-Constitution that the Braves and Padres have discussed a Jake Peavy trade.

Dicussions supposedly involve at least three Braves prospects. The Padres would have to get either Jordan Schafer or Jason Heyward in a Peavy deal. They might also have interest in major leaguers Yunel Escobar, Kelly Johnson and Jair Jurrjens.
Source: Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Nizzle20
10-17-2008, 10:55 AM
Trade Him...Maggs doesn't belong in Detroit...never did

Sounds like some bitterness coming from Chicago...