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View Full Version : "Only one poll that matters" - Craig Ferguson on Election 2008



ink
09-11-2008, 02:22 AM
Watch as he gets serious at about the 2:45 mark in the video. Highly recommended commentary. A non-partisan slapdown of BS, and a call to vote.

http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=pdRVQ4xwwmQ

steelcityroller
09-11-2008, 02:48 AM
That was pretty good. It had some very good points and was very funny at the same time.

Good Points

- They say they dont want their family matters all displayed in front of the media. But then they parade their family around with them everywhere they go.

- The media and the polls are really pointless and biased. The only one that matters in the actual election itself.

Funny

"You have Sarah Palin who is hockey mom by day and naughty librarian by night."

"If you cant take your hands out of a bag of cheetos long enough to vote then dont complain when you get President Sanjaya"

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 03:04 AM
Yeah, that was really good.

I don't know anything about that guy. First time I saw him was when I watched this season's first Real Time with Bill Maher on youtube a couple weeks ago. But the BS is piling up deep now, and he cut right through it, so it's good to see that.

steelcityroller
09-11-2008, 03:33 AM
Yeah Craig Ferguson is pretty awesome. I dont know if its just a great act or what but he comes off as being a real person that is just completely honest. Here is a pretty good but serious monologue from him thats very refreshing coming from someone on a talk show.

http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=7bbaRyDLMvA

hoosiercubsfan
09-11-2008, 08:00 AM
He made some absolutely fantastic points. Problem with this country is that as a whole we are not smarter than media that covers them, and people don't pay enough attention to what is going on. The only way we are going to get the youth vote from either side is to have the ability to vote online. Otherwise there will be a 1000 different reason they are to busy to vote. I have voted every single time I have been able to since I turned 18 and the sad thing is I am the exception to the rule.

Though I do think his point about the families is completely off base. It does no harm and does not open the family up for discussion for the single reason that they are on stage. They are there to support their parent wife/husband. The only time they come up for debate is when they go out and stump for their spouse like Michelle Obama does.

SmthBluCitrus
09-11-2008, 11:02 AM
That was really good ... very powerful at the end (the last 45s or so).

"If you don't vote, you're a moron ... if you don't vote, you're stupid"

That should be my new sig.

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 11:14 AM
He made some absolutely fantastic points. Problem with this country is that as a whole we are not smarter than media that covers them, and people don't pay enough attention to what is going on. The only way we are going to get the youth vote from either side is to have the ability to vote online. Otherwise there will be a 1000 different reason they are to busy to vote. I have voted every single time I have been able to since I turned 18 and the sad thing is I am the exception to the rule.

Though I do think his point about the families is completely off base. It does no harm and does not open the family up for discussion for the single reason that they are on stage. They are there to support their parent wife/husband. The only time they come up for debate is when they go out and stump for their spouse like Michelle Obama does.

I agree about the families. I think there is a big difference between the family coming out for the photo op and a family member going on the stump for you. I think that is when the family becomes fair game, when they start giving speeches or interviews for the spouse/father/mother.

Also, to the point about voting; ideally more people should vote in this country, but at the same time, if you’re not going to pay attention and make an educated decision, maybe you shouldn't vote. I forget who it was on here that mentioned that he/she wished that you had to take a very basic quiz about the candidate's policies before you could vote. Obviously, that's not practical and will never happen, but I think it is a good point. I guess I'm saying that I'm not sure that an uninformed/uneducated/un-researched vote is better than not voting.

ink
09-11-2008, 11:55 AM
I think his point about families is right on the mark and I hope more and more people keep making it.

About the monologue: this guy is one of the best I've ever seen at riffing. Every now and then he just drops everything and talks straight. I think that was one of the best political speeches I've heard in the campaign. I loved the part where he says forget about all the garbage and distraction and get to know what the candidates stand for.

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 12:51 PM
I agree about the families. I think there is a big difference between the family coming out for the photo op and a family member going on the stump for you.

So which will it be when (as SLY pointed out to me - and thanks for the additional info about her Alaska trip) Palin attends her son's ceremony for his departure for his next tour in Iraq, and summons every available member of the press corps in Alaska (especially those with cameras) to attend? Is that "just a photo op" or is that using her son's service in Iraq (which I'll be the first to agree is highly commendable - on his part) to vis a vis "enhance" her foreign policy credentials and the impression that she "understands" what's going on in Iraq? Do you honestly think she's not trying to have it both ways? Do you really think she's not going beyond the usual mundane "this is my family, America - now back behind the curtain with you, kids" biography/introductions that all politicians do?

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 01:02 PM
So which will it be when (as SLY pointed out to me - and thanks for the additional info about her Alaska trip) Palin attends her son's ceremony for his departure for his next tour in Iraq, and summons every available member of the press corps in Alaska (especially those with cameras) to attend? Is that "just a photo op" or is that using her son's service in Iraq (which I'll be the first to agree is highly commendable - on his part) to vis a vis "enhance" her foreign policy credentials and the impression that she "understands" what's going on in Iraq? Do you honestly think she's not trying to have it both ways? Do you really think she's not going beyond the usual mundane "this is my family, America - now back behind the curtain with you, kids" biography/introductions that all politicians do?

She is a mother going home to see her son off. She would be doing it with or without the press coverage. Now, is she going to tell the press to **** off? No, because she knows it makes for a good story, but I don't think you can knock her for doing something she would have been doing anyways.

On a side note, I would say McCain has been very hesitant to use his two sons to his advantage who both serve. I don't think you could say that he pushes that.

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 01:06 PM
She is a mother going home to see her son off. She would be doing it with or without the press coverage. Now, is she going to tell the press to **** off? No, because she knows it makes for a good story, but I don't think you can knock her for doing something she would have been doing anyways.

On a side note, I would say McCain has been very hesitant to use his two sons to his advantage who both serve. I don't think you could say that he pushes that.

No, McCain has been very consistent about that, and kudos to him for it.

Palin on the other had - not so much. She is most definitely employing a double standard: "You are NOT allowed to talk about my family - except for those aspects of it which I IMPLORE you to talk about!"

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 01:07 PM
So which will it be when (as SLY pointed out to me - and thanks for the additional info about her Alaska trip) Palin attends her son's ceremony for his departure for his next tour in Iraq, and summons every available member of the press corps in Alaska (especially those with cameras) to attend? Is that "just a photo op" or is that using her son's service in Iraq (which I'll be the first to agree is highly commendable - on his part) to vis a vis "enhance" her foreign policy credentials and the impression that she "understands" what's going on in Iraq? Do you honestly think she's not trying to have it both ways? Do you really think she's not going beyond the usual mundane "this is my family, America - now back behind the curtain with you, kids" biography/introductions that all politicians do?

Talk about a loaded question. LOL are you serious? Do you have 1 ounce of proof that Palin summoned all the press or is it just more partisan speculation in the form of yet another Palin attack?

Where is your family outrage when Obamas little girls are part of an interview and speaking with their dad on a screen at their convention?

People including all the candidates have said not to attack candidates families. That doesnt mean the candidates cant show or mention their families regardless of what Craig Ferguson says. I like Craig Ferguson but he has been a USA citizen for all of a month and now he is going to dictate how our presidential campaigns are run based on a comedy skit?

By the way Chelsea was every where when Clinton was president and she was off limits.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 01:11 PM
No, McCain has been very consistent about that, and kudos to him for it.

Palin on the other had - not so much. She is most definitely employing a double standard: "You are NOT allowed to talk about my family - except for those aspects of it which I IMPLORE you to talk about!"

Discussing a persons family is not the same as attacking a persons family. I cant believe you are serious. Obama had his kids interviewed in the national press and talking to their dad on national TV at the convention. Where was your outrage then? Mccain showed his family at the convention and in people magazine this week as well. There is nothing wrong with any of that. I guess any chance some people get to attack Mrs Palin they will take it regardless of the facts.

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 01:12 PM
Okay, SLY, so let's just bare this down to the bare elements:

Are you saying that Palin ISN"T saying this:

"It's okay to talk about my son, but not my daughter."

???

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 01:15 PM
Obama did do an interview with entertainment tonight with his whole family and then the next day or so said he would never do it again.

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 01:17 PM
No one is talking about her son except to say that he is leaving for Iraq. That is ok, because it is a fact, just like saying her daughter is pregant is fine. It's getting into the who's the father, is her mother making her carry it kind of stuff that is the unacceptable stuff.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 01:23 PM
Okay, SLY, so let's just bare this down to the bare elements:

Are you saying that Palin ISN"T saying this:

"It's okay to talk about my son, but not my daughter."

???

Palin is saying that it is not OK to attack any of her family be it her daughter, son, husband etc. Candidates speak about their familes be it Palin, Obama, Mccain or Biden. It would be ridiculous to think otherwise. Obama mentions his wife and kids all the time but has said his family is off limits to attacks multiple times. Where is your outrage over that? What is wrong with that? There is nothing wrong with a candidate mentioning his or her family. That doesnt mean people have the right to attack their family.

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 01:33 PM
I'm not talking about "mentioning" her son. I'm talking about "using" her son's situation to beef up the appearance of her foreign policy credentials. If she doesn't do that, then great, no problemo. But somehow I suspect that we'll be hearing more of, "Listen, I have a son in Iraq, so don't tell me I don't know what's happening in Iraq." Things along those lines.

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 01:42 PM
I'm not talking about "mentioning" her son. I'm talking about "using" her son's situation to beef up the appearance of her foreign policy credentials. If she doesn't do that, then great, no problemo. But somehow I suspect that we'll be hearing more of, "Listen, I have a son in Iraq, so don't tell me I don't know what's happening in Iraq." Things along those lines.

So you are attacking her, or objecting to something, that she has yet to do, but something you anticipate her doing?

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 01:47 PM
I'm not talking about "mentioning" her son. I'm talking about "using" her son's situation to beef up the appearance of her foreign policy credentials. If she doesn't do that, then great, no problemo. But somehow I suspect that we'll be hearing more of, "Listen, I have a son in Iraq, so don't tell me I don't know what's happening in Iraq." Things along those lines.

I hope she mentions him as much as she wants. She is a proud mother of her son going to fight for America. It shows she is not one of the politicians that will just talk the talk and then say oh not my family. Ditto Mccain whose sons also serve. That has nothing to do with foreign policy credentials. That has to do with a mother being proud of her son.

I dont see Obama having any real substantial decision making experince as an executive or via foreign policy. The Dems handing him a committee position as a freshman senator doesnt mean he has any large decision making experience. How many actual foreign policy or executive decisions has he had to make? You know if he has to make one as president he cant just vote present. :)

ink
09-11-2008, 01:54 PM
So you are attacking her, or objecting to something, that she has yet to do, but something you anticipate her doing?

No, she has already drawn attention to him and she is holding him up as an example. Also, I watched her land in Alaska last night. When she got off the airplane, she literally went out of her way, changing direction to walk back and kiss her infant son in front of the cameras. She went out of her way to do that. Both of those things are fine at the "mom" level. She's proud of them, and she loves them. But this is a public display we're talking about, and she is a very crafty politician. She is a master at image appeal.

I completely agree with Craig Ferguson about families being off limits. There should be no double standard.


I'm not talking about "mentioning" her son. I'm talking about "using" her son's situation to beef up the appearance of her foreign policy credentials. If she doesn't do that, then great, no problemo. But somehow I suspect that we'll be hearing more of, "Listen, I have a son in Iraq, so don't tell me I don't know what's happening in Iraq." Things along those lines.

Completely agree.

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 01:54 PM
So you are attacking her, or objecting to something, that she has yet to do, but something you anticipate her doing?

Do I anticipate it? Yes. But only it would be perfectly consistent with how she and McCain have been running their campaign.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 01:59 PM
No, she has already drawn attention to him and she is holding him up as an example. Also, I watched her land in Alaska last night. When she got off the airplane, she literally went out of her way, changing direction to walk back and kiss her infant son in front of the cameras. She went out of her way to do that. Both of those things are fine at the "mom" level. She's proud of them, and she loves them. But this is a public display we're talking about, and she is a very crafty politician. She is a master at image appeal.

I completely agree with Craig Ferguson about families being off limits. There should be no double standard.
Completely agree.

A mom turning back to kiss her infant son? Thats horrible!!! OMG I cant believe her nerve. Whats next? Kissing her daughter or husband? I'm sure Obama has never kissed his daughters in public. That Palin is some crafty lady.

Did you condemn Obama for putting his daughters on national TV interviews and speaking before millions of people in a national tv convention? If you did can you link me to the posts where you condemned Obama for doing that? Thanks in advance. :)

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 02:01 PM
Do I anticipate it? Yes. But only it would be perfectly consistent with how she and McCain have been running their campaign.

Except that you've allready said McCain has done a good job in keeping his sons out of the conversation. Which is it?

DenButsu
09-11-2008, 02:07 PM
Except that you've allready said McCain has done a good job in keeping his sons out of the conversation. Which is it?

Both.

McCain and Palin are pursuing radically different approaches to how they handle their family matters. Palin's camp announced her daughter's pregnancy. Then they falsely accused the Obama camp of leveling personal attacks on her family when none had been made. She's the one who's deliberately made her family a campaign issue, not Obama. (And yes, the media have done their share, too). She has attempted to use her family as a campaign issue in order to attack Obama. That's why it would be consistent for her to use her son as a campaign issue as well. McCain on the other hand has always bent over backwards to keep his family in private, secreted away. There's a world of difference between the two.

ink
09-11-2008, 02:10 PM
A mom turning back to kiss her infant son? Thats horrible!!! OMG I cant believe her nerve. Whats next? Kissing her daughter or husband? I'm sure Obama has never kissed his daughters in public. That Palin is some crafty lady.

Did you condemn Obama for putting his daughters on national TV interviews and speaking before millions of people in a national tv convention? If you did can you link me to the posts where you condemned Obama for doing that? Thanks in advance. :)

Did you read my post? :confused: You are responding emotionally to all of these issues. I said that of course as a mom she could do these things. But she is an extremely talented politician and she walked out of her way to kiss him in front of the cameras. Ferguson's point is that you just keep the families out of the photo ops period. Any families on either side.

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 02:15 PM
Did you read my post? :confused: You are responding emotionally to all of these issues. I said that of course as a mom she could do these things. But she is an extremely talented politician and she walked out of her way to kiss him in front of the cameras. Ferguson's point is that you just keep the families out of the photo ops period. Any families on either side.

But you didnt answer his question. Did you or anyone on the left ridicule Obama for having his kids come on stage during the DNC?

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 02:26 PM
Did you read my post? :confused: You are responding emotionally to all of these issues. I said that of course as a mom she could do these things. But she is an extremely talented politician and she walked out of her way to kiss him in front of the cameras. Ferguson's point is that you just keep the families out of the photo ops period. Any families on either side.

Yes I'm emotional because like many other Americanse I'm sick of the bs attacks on Mrs Palin.

Going and kissing your infant son doesnt make somebody a talented politician. Walking out of her way? She walked to her son. Her son cant walk to her. That is just a backhanded slam in my opinion. If she didnt kiss her son people would complain about that. They put her in a no win situation.

You say that kids shouldnt be allowed in any pictures. So I'm asking you to show me the links to you condeming Obama when he had his daughters doing national tv interviews and speaking on national tv at his convention. Isnt that a legit request based on your opinion? :)

ink
09-11-2008, 02:27 PM
But you didnt answer his question. Did you or anyone on the left ridicule Obama for having his kids come on stage during the DNC?

I don't think I posted about it, but I didn't like it when one of his kids was passed the mic at the convention. I also remember some posts about how the back and forth via video was pretty lame. I don't care who said what when. Ferguson's point is not overly complex, and he's right. If you don't want your kids to be scrutinized, don't bring them with you when you're campaigning. Get them off the stage. And it's very noticeable that Palin's family are continuing to be in all of these photo ops. It is very transparent.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 02:29 PM
I don't think I posted about it, but I didn't like it when one of his kids was passed the mic at the convention. I also remember some posts about how the back and forth via video was pretty lame. I don't care who said what when. Ferguson's point is not overly complex, and he's right. If you don't want your kids to be scrutinized, don't bring them with you when you're campaigning. Get them off the stage. And it's very noticeable that Palin's family are continuing to be in all of these photo ops. It is very transparent.

She is a mom standing with her kids. How is that any more transparent to Obama actually having his kids interviewed on national tv and then speaking in front of millions of people at the convention. Nice even standard you have there. Just like the media and their even standards. :)

ink
09-11-2008, 02:30 PM
Yes I'm emotional because like many other Americanse I'm sick of the bs attacks on Mrs Palin.

Going and kissing your infant son doesnt make somebody a talented politician. Walking out of her way? She walked to her son. Her son cant walk to her. That is just a backhanded slam in my opinion. If she didnt kiss her son people would complain about that. They put her in a no win situation.

You say that kids shouldnt be allowed in any pictures. So I'm asking you to show me the links to you condeming Obama when he had his daughters doing national tv interviews and speaking on national tv at his convention. Isnt that a legit request based on your opinion? :)

It doesn't matter who said what when. I've always held exactly the same opinion. My point about emotions is that you are being manipulated. That is exactly what Palin is in this campaign for - to manipulate people's feelings. It is a complete distraction away from McCain (remember him, the actual presidential nominee) and the issues. Den is completely right when he said she is more like a political stunt than a candidate. In fact, she's still using the same lines from her RNC speech.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 02:38 PM
It doesn't matter who said what when. I've always held exactly the same opinion. My point about emotions is that you are being manipulated. That is exactly what Palin is in this campaign for - to manipulate people's feelings. It is a complete distraction away from McCain (remember him, the actual presidential nominee) and the issues. Den is completely right when he said she is more like a political stunt than a candidate. In fact, she's still using the same lines from her RNC speech.

Actually Ink you cant decide for me what is important. If you claim a position that Palin should not be showing her kids standing near her I think it is only fair to ask if you condemned Obama for not only doing the same thing but going a huge step past that by having them interviewed on national TV and speaking at his national TV convention.

I dont feel manipulated at all. I havent gone by what Palin or Mccain said. Ive watched with open eyes how she is attacked non stop. I have also watched with open eyes how the media has propped up Obama. This si not only my opinion. The Rassmussen polls show I'm far from alone in these opinions.

Doc Fluty
09-11-2008, 02:41 PM
Actually Ink you cant decide for me what is important. If you claim a position that Palin should not be showing her kids standing near her I think it is only fair to ask if you condemned Obama for not only doing the same thing but going a huge step past that by having them interviewed on national TV and speaking at his national TV convention.

I dont feel manipulated at all. I havent gone by what Palin or Mccain said. Ive watched with open eyes how she is attacked non stop. I have also watched with open eyes how the media has propped up Obama. This si not only my opinion. The Rassmussen polls show I'm far from alone in these opinions.

ohh sly... thems the truth.. thems fighting words... them ummm...

lets see dem der try n git themselves out dis...

ink
09-11-2008, 02:43 PM
Actually Ink you cant decide for me what is important. If you claim a position that Palin should not be showing her kids standing near her I think it is only fair to ask if you condemned Obama for not only doing the same thing but going a huge step past that by having them interviewed on national TV and speaking at his national TV convention.

I dont feel manipulated at all. I havent gone by what Palin or Mccain said. Ive watched with open eyes how she is attacked non stop. I have also watched with open eyes how the media has propped up Obama. This si not only my opinion. The Rassmussen polls show I'm far from alone in these opinions.

I'm not deciding anything for anyone. I've already answered your question about what I think about kids being involved in the campaign. As I've said, I've always had exactly the same thoughts about families being used in election campaigns: they don't belong except during the acceptance speeches. Why do you try to dig up something that isn't there?? The point about family is one of the points from Craig Ferguson's monologue, which by the way, had a lot more content, and a lot of very positive content to it.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 02:47 PM
I'm not deciding anything for anyone. I've already answered your question about what I think about kids being involved in the campaign. That's one of the points from Craig Ferguson's monologue, which by the way, had a lot more content, and a lot of very positive content to it.

Ink I feel we are going in circles but the main question remains.

Why do you feel it is OK to condemn Palin for showing her family standing next to her but you did not condemn Obama for his kids national TV interviews and kids speaking at the nationally televised Democrat convention.

Is that not a fair question?

Doc Fluty
09-11-2008, 02:48 PM
ink your right about the video...

yet totally hiding from the point he made about obama doing interviews with his kids and you bashin palin fro "using" her..

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 02:49 PM
I'm not deciding anything for anyone. I've already answered your question about what I think about kids being involved in the campaign. Why do you try to dig up something that isn't there?? The point about family is one of the points from Craig Ferguson's monologue, which by the way, had a lot more content, and a lot of very positive content to it.

Well you can understand why we are acussing you of the same "phony outrage" that is being thrown at the repubs in the lipstick thread (note: i never said it offended me in the least, just that it was a slip up politically by Obama). You claim that you are against it on all sides but you record shows that you've only brought it up when it was the Republicans that are doing it.

b1e9a8r5s
09-11-2008, 02:51 PM
In the spirit of full disclosure, I should mention that I haven't watch the video of Ferguson (I can't view videos at work) and am just responding to the posts on here.

ink
09-11-2008, 02:53 PM
Ink I feel we are going in circles but the main question remains.

Why do you feel it is OK to condemn Palin for showing her family standing next to her but you did not condemn Obama for his kids national TV interviews and kids speaking at the nationally televised Democrat convention.

Is that not a fair question?

Do you not read my posts???? :confused: I already said it is wrong from both sides.

SLY WILLIAMS
09-11-2008, 02:56 PM
Do you not read my posts???? :confused: I already said it is wrong from both sides.

LOL Ink apparently several of us did not read your posts because many of us did not see you condemn Obama by name but we did see you condemn Palin by name. :)

OK I'm done for now. Only so much politics I can take. Enjoy your day. :)

ink
09-11-2008, 02:57 PM
Well you can understand why we are acussing you of the same "phony outrage" that is being thrown at the repubs in the lipstick thread (note: i never said it offended me in the least, just that it was a slip up politically by Obama). You claim that you are against it on all sides but you record shows that you've only brought it up when it was the Republicans that are doing it.

That's the circular nature of this nonsense. I really genuinely honestly couldn't give a flying **** about the family stuff. :laugh: I gave an example of something that had just happened that supported Craig Ferguson's point.

I don't care about the kids, the lipstick, any of it. It's just trash. There is no double standard. I have been completely consistent about this stuff. Family no. Issues yes. In this thread I've said that Palin has a right to be a Mom. But she has to stop using the kids in photo ops. I've said that I didn't like the stuff with the kids at the DNC when Obama's daughter took the mic. That kind of stuff. I didn't see any of the interviews with Obama's kids from before. I don't agree with those either, although, if he or Palin or McCain or Biden had done that in the pre-election phase, in a more peaceful setting, then that is not so bad. It's a "getting to know" the family kind of thing, a profile. The acceptance speeches are kind of like a graduation or commencement exercise. It's traditional for the whole family to go to those. But during the actual election, Ferguson is absolutely right: if you don't want your family to be brought up, don't put them on the stage. It's really feeble for people to even attempt to claim double standard. Obama's family has not even been seen since the convention.

-----------

But you really should watch the Ferguson clip because this family remark was just about 20 seconds in an 8 minute monologue. I think anyone who is interested in politics would like what he has to say. It's actually a very impassioned, bipartisan call to vote. That's really what it's about and we just got sidetracked ....

Enjoy.

arkanian215
09-11-2008, 03:49 PM
regardless of bias, it's whichever one has been more historically accurate. i believe the gallup poll was the most accurate back in 05. i dont know what it is now.