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bossup2
08-18-2008, 02:34 PM
What do the tigers NEED to do this offseason??????

They need to sign K-ROD no matter the price because they need a proven closer and hes the best and hes young

they need to sign a SP like ben sheets and derek lowe
get a defensive SS (Jack Wilson)
cut robertson, renteria, sheffield, maybe rogers if he doesnt retire and jones
sign will ohman and luis ayala
trade guillen for a 3B or C like navarro then put inge back at 3rd
maybe a LF(bradley/Dunn) but that would be last goal because joyce could start

lineup
CF: Granderson
2B: Polanco
1B: Cabrera
RF: Maggs
SS: Wilson
LF: Bradley/Joyce/Dunn
DH: Thames
3B: Inge/Trade???
C: Navarro/Inge/Lo duca

Rotation:
Sheets
Verlander/Lowe
Lowe/Verlander
Galaragga
Garcia/Willis

Pen
Zoom
Rodney
Ohman
Ayala
A lefty
K-Rod

stanpapi
08-18-2008, 04:20 PM
I really don't think you'll see a lot of signings because of the blown money this year. So there's that, plus off-season sales are going to dry up. Worse, do people even want to come here right now? It's a mess. I think you figure out who has to go first, deal with that, and sign a guy or two. Before you get there, however, you have to decide who's going and what (if anything) you can get for them.

I don't think you get anything for Sheff or Renteria, so do you hang onto them in hopes of increasing their value? Or do you just release them? Or do you send them to the minors and hope they quit. You do not resign Jones or Kenny. But you do look at your system and promote some of those guys. As for SS, I don't know why they don't get over it and give Santiago a chance to play. However you fill these holes, plus the closer spot, I highly doubt we'll see more than one major signing.

smarkow
08-18-2008, 05:52 PM
I agree, i don't see too many major signings. The major needs are pitching. Is Lowe really that good? i'm not the hugest fan and I don't understand why everyone is so high on him. He's 9-10 with a 3.99 ERA. Unless we can cut some salary, i don't see us throwing any big bucks at guys like Sheets/sabathia/etc.
Rogers - do not resign him
Jones - do not resign him
As for short stop - either play santiago or one of the other guys in our minor league system. I agree with papi and i dont understand why they don't play him more often. REnteria has hit much better recently, but he is a major liability at short stop. i cant believe we replaced guillen because he has no range, with another guy with no range. what were our scouts/DD thinking on this one??
Finally, if we can get KRod, great. buti don't see it happening b/c i don't see Illitch tossing around the money like he did this offseason.

P.S. - Ordonez is batting third next year, followed by Cabrera, not the other way around.

bossup2
08-18-2008, 06:34 PM
ok well if theres only one or two signings they need to try for K-Rod and some kind of SP

Sheffies Chef
08-18-2008, 06:48 PM
as i made in scout.com's tigs town open formum (i'm STATMAN2012 on there) a big league quality proven closer is essential because that could net you 30+ wins to a season while he's closing down games.

stanpapi
08-18-2008, 11:02 PM
A closer is something you go out and sign when you're close to the final pieces. If we can get him for a couple years, sure, go get him. But you've got quite a mess to mop up before you get there. Last thing I want is to pay for what another guy did somewhere else. We did that with Pudge, Sheff, and Renteria. Team needs some value. Besides, there doesn't seem anything physically wrong with Zumaya, if they're telling us the truth. Send the guy to a councilor for the off-season and hope he does some growing up. I'm tired about hearing about the guy and his grandma deadheading it to spring training and whatnot. If he gets his noodle together and a halfassed change-up, he's the solution. I mean, let's take stock of what we could have. You don't rely on Zumaya, but you give him a shot to win that job. Same with Santiago, Joyce, and Thomas. At the very least, you give them all a shot at platooning. Too many guys have too much guaranteed here.

Epic89
08-18-2008, 11:47 PM
If there aren't major signings, I will NEVER forgive them.

stanpapi
08-19-2008, 09:27 AM
Well, I'll be shocked if there's more than one.

Bondomania
08-19-2008, 12:11 PM
WE DO NOT NEED K-ROD!!! christ.. that is an utter waste of funds.. especially if we only have room for one big signing. You HAVE to get someone to help Verlander, hell i would take Burnett in a heart beat.

There are other closers out there that are on the market that will be WAY cheaper and can still get you saves. I like Brandon Lyon, or Juan Cruz out of Arizona, i believe both will be FA's. I just can't see us tying up 15+ mill. into a closer.

Stan, you are so doom and gloom about it being a mess here, and i think you are blowing it out of proportion. Really, all we need to do is revamp the BP, we already have a pretty good offense, inconsistant, but none the less do have the potential to get you about 6 runs a game. Also, it helps that we play in an extremely pitcher friendly park.. I think that really all we need is to get some guys healthy, that has been our demise really.

I also think that we need to get guys up here that are going to be hungry, some of the younger guys that are going to be eager to proove themselves. I think if we make a trade, it should be for a SS, or Catcher, but i would like to see Dusty Ryan at the major league level first.. he has been amazing this year, both at AA and AAA from an offensive standpoint, and he is said to be the best defensive catchers in the system.. For SS, i like JJ Hardy of the Brewers.. i believe they have their future SS, waiting in their farm system, and i think they are going to look to get him into the lineup next year..

stanpapi
08-19-2008, 02:11 PM
Doom and gloom? You've got like 1-2 guys on this team that can lay down a clean bunt and steal a base. Virtually no ability to play small ball in a park designed for small ball. Sheff is better as of late, but his year has been a wash, and what do you do with him next year if he's slow out of the gate? Then there's the D-train, Inge, and Renteria. That's a lot of dough down the drain. Getting guys healthy is one thing. Getting them to drink from the fountain of youth is quite another. And hey, if you don't think it's a mess, whattaya think Illitch thinks?

mark1125
08-19-2008, 05:35 PM
Doom and gloom? You've got like 1-2 guys on this team that can lay down a clean bunt and steal a base. Virtually no ability to play small ball in a park designed for small ball. Sheff is better as of late, but his year has been a wash, and what do you do with him next year if he's slow out of the gate? Then there's the D-train, Inge, and Renteria. That's a lot of dough down the drain. Getting guys healthy is one thing. Getting them to drink from the fountain of youth is quite another. And hey, if you don't think it's a mess, whattaya think Illitch thinks?

I gotta agree with Stan. On paper, they look great, but on the field, they don't do the little things that win games. Holding out for the 3 run homer doesn't work like it used to. Their bullpen needs work and they needed less Sheffs and Renterias and more Cletes and Santiagos.

If we only make one significant signing, I would not want it to be for k-rod. Not that he isn't good, but he will command serious bucks and I think we have other needs. I would rather see another starter and some solid pen guys (someone mentioned Cruz or Lyon). I also feel K-Rod is going to crash into the injury wall soon. I am expecting him to look for a 5 year deal.

jphenix2002
08-20-2008, 01:17 AM
The whole bullpen needs to be fixed, no way around that. Dolsi is quality, but Zumaya goes onto the DL way too much. And Rodney is not the answer, period. Come crunchtime, he's a choker. Maybe he just needs a change of scenery, idk. I'd like to see Detroit pick up a guy that's dependable at getting out lefties. Bobby Seay isn't (OBA=.331). Will Ohman would be nice. Definately the BP needs help. Anyone think Robertson can get moved to an NL team? A lefty that isn't too expensive (less than $5 mil) and Joyce or Thames could bring in something. I haven't given up on D-Train yet, and lets see what Garcia can do. Verlander, Bonderman, Galarraga, Miner, Willis/Garcia would work, but adding Burnett would be amazing. too bad he gets hurt and is very expensive.

Bondomania
08-20-2008, 05:29 PM
we have a solid foundation though, and if a few things went the right way maybe we would be in a different situation this year.. as far as sheff goes, maybe he still gets picked up on waivers this year, if he continues to hit respectably, maybe a team gets in in the last few days of august to get him on the team for the playoffs.. IMO the core players that we need to build around are:

granderson
miggy
joyce
verlander
bonderman
Galarraga

We have some young talent, and i think with a signing or a trade this offseason, we could get some guys in here that can right the ship.. we really need a shortstop with some speed, and range, then i think we would have a pretty solid defensive infield, Guillen has looked pretty solid at the hot corner, miggy has really adapted to 1B quite nicely, Polanco is always solid, and then fill in someone that can contribute at shortstop with speed and range.. that is honestly all we really need, maybe a catcher that can hit over .240 and not strike out 200 times a year.. I think the team has underachieved, but I also think that Leyland didn't have the team ready coming out of spring training and that really set the tone for the rest of the year.. i think they need some to come in a bust some ***** and get people on the right page and firing on all cylinders

babygranderson
08-20-2008, 05:52 PM
Does anyone truly know what our 2009 payroll projects to be? I "think" I've read we are at $138 million this year, and if we save $41 million in the following manner:

Pudge: 12.3 mil
T Jones: 7 mil
J. Jones: 6.3 mil (did we pay him this year or did the Cubs???)
Kenny: 8 mil
Renteria: (after 3 mill buy out) 7 mill
Vance Wilson (1 mil)

We could put together one heck of a shopping list together in the offseason. IF Illitch is not so mad about the $ debacle this year. Since I am not a rich man and never will be, I tend to throw Mike's money around in my mind pretty freely. All joking aside, from a business standpoint, how could he NOT keep the payroll at the current level? This season's been over for a long time and yet the sellouts are STILL rolling in....40,000 in the stands for 81 games...I think he "broke even" despite our record.

I got a whole plan of what I'd do (try to do) if I was DD and could keep the players under contract for next year and spent the cool $41 million on the FA crop. But before my pipe dream begins - could someone educate me to our payroll going into next year?

If anyone cares, here's a link to the 2009 FA class:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/12/2009-mlb-free-a.html

I love this board. I don't post often, but I read it everyday. Even though I love the Lions, I hope you guys find enough Tiger discussion to keep things active in the offseason.

mark1125
08-20-2008, 07:56 PM
Does anyone truly know what our 2009 payroll projects to be? I "think" I've read we are at $138 million this year, and if we save $41 million in the following manner:

Pudge: 12.3 mil
T Jones: 7 mil
J. Jones: 6.3 mil (did we pay him this year or did the Cubs???)
Kenny: 8 mil
Renteria: (after 3 mill buy out) 7 mill
Vance Wilson (1 mil)

We could put together one heck of a shopping list together in the offseason. IF Illitch is not so mad about the $ debacle this year. Since I am not a rich man and never will be, I tend to throw Mike's money around in my mind pretty freely. All joking aside, from a business standpoint, how could he NOT keep the payroll at the current level? This season's been over for a long time and yet the sellouts are STILL rolling in....40,000 in the stands for 81 games...I think he "broke even" despite our record.

I got a whole plan of what I'd do (try to do) if I was DD and could keep the players under contract for next year and spent the cool $41 million on the FA crop. But before my pipe dream begins - could someone educate me to our payroll going into next year?

If anyone cares, here's a link to the 2009 FA class:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/12/2009-mlb-free-a.html

I love this board. I don't post often, but I read it everyday. Even though I love the Lions, I hope you guys find enough Tiger discussion to keep things active in the offseason.

Keep in mind that they will be having to pony up for some of the remaining players over the next couple years. They will be looking to cut payroll after this year. They will get a player or 2 that will have an impact, but I don't see a shopping spree. You don't have to spend a lot, you just have to spend smart.

I think the cuts and potential signings will keep things moving in here.

Bondomania
08-21-2008, 11:02 AM
yea, plus a few of the players contracts are heavily backloaded, so you will see a spike in payroll, right now i think you are looking at 110 mill. as of right now, somewhere in that ballpark... the one thing that could help is if Sheff continues to hit well down the stretch, then maybe we could find a team looking to get him... maybe sheff gets his BA up to .250 and finishes the year with 50-60 RBI's, and a couple more bombs.. some teams might want him for the 500 hr aspect too. I agree with Mark, there will probably be one possible big signing, but then after that, maybe a few moves here and there, but i don't see anything big happening

stanpapi
08-21-2008, 11:07 AM
Also keep in mind that those sellouts are largely the product of an off-season feeding frenzy. There will be no such frenzy this off-season, so I don't see him burning another wad of cash.

Bondomania
08-21-2008, 02:59 PM
eh, you never know.. if we go out and make some moves, there could be that frenzy again, you never know.. but as of right now, without any big additions or subtractions to show the fans that the tigers realized their mistakes and they are taking steps to correct them, then there won't be a frenzy.. but as long as they still put a product out there, that if they get things working for them, they could compete for the division then i think the fans could still support this team..