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Dirty Dirk41
08-09-2008, 11:23 PM
Daisuke after pitching a gem against the White Sox is now 13-2 on the season. His road record is 6-0. Ill admit that almost EVERY game he's been shaky but seems to always get out of it. Hes currently 5th in the A.L in wins. He has 98 strike outs. ERA is 2.98. Basically im wondering what your thoughts our on the chances of Dice-K winning this years A.L Cy Young award. If he finishes the season with the most wins in the A.L will that be enough. Many think Cliff Lee is the clear cut choice. I think Dice-K certainly has to be in the conversation for the award. What do you guys think?



Thoughts????

Tragedy
08-10-2008, 12:08 AM
He has a shot at it.

Basically, they love: W-L, ERA, K, IP.

He'll be in a good position with ALL of those, despite him not being the best pitcher this year.

gcoll
08-10-2008, 12:10 AM
If he pitches well down the stretch, he'll be in the conversation....but I doubt he'll win it.

Tragedy
08-10-2008, 12:12 AM
Could you imagine how unhappy everyone but Boston would be?

ESPN east coast biased!~!!$!$

Sigh.

Run Gardner Run
08-10-2008, 12:33 AM
He should win it. He def has the numbers, but when talked about with CY Young his name never comes up, its just been Cliff Lee. But I think it will end with the top 3 being Lee DiceK and Mussina

bagwell368
08-10-2008, 12:42 AM
There are a lot of guys to consider:

Lee
Duchscherer
Halladay
Saunders
Dice-K
Danks
Lester
Burnett
Beckett
Mussina
Wakefield
Shields

The club finish will have a lot to say. Boston has too many guys - they'll split the vote and none of them will probably get top 5...

Sox Appeal
08-10-2008, 12:45 AM
There are a lot of guys to consider:

Lee
Duchscherer
Halladay
Saunders
Dice-K
Danks
Lester
Burnett
Beckett
Mussina
Wakefield
Shields

The club finish will have a lot to say. Boston has too many guys - they'll split the vote and none of them will probably get top 5...

:eyebrow:

KmB728
08-10-2008, 12:54 AM
I think he has a great chance at winning... but so far every time they mention cy young everyone has said lee

TheKid
08-10-2008, 01:24 AM
There are a lot of guys to consider:

Lee
Duchscherer
Halladay
Saunders
Dice-K
Danks
Lester
Burnett
Beckett
Mussina
Wakefield
Shields

The club finish will have a lot to say. Boston has too many guys - they'll split the vote and none of them will probably get top 5...

This is a list of good starters....CY young means the BEST pitcher, not just good ones... that's like talking about who is gunna win the the world series and mentioning half the league...

Towelie
08-10-2008, 01:30 AM
I think Lester deserves it more. Dice K has been a nightmare to watch this year. Every game I watch with him I'm always worried he's gonna self destruct. Only difference between this year and last is he completely fell apart for a inning where now he falls apart for the game but always gets out of the jams when he does fall apart.

papipapsmanny
08-10-2008, 03:17 AM
dice k doesnt have many innings pitched

gcoll
08-10-2008, 03:34 AM
dice k doesnt have many innings pitched

That's what will ultimately rule him out. His inability to go deep into the game.

lil'papi
08-10-2008, 08:37 AM
I think Lester deserves it more. Dice K has been a nightmare to watch this year. Every game I watch with him I'm always worried he's gonna self destruct. Only difference between this year and last is he completely fell apart for a inning where now he falls apart for the game but always gets out of the jams when he does fall apart.



What you just said makes no sense. But you knew that right? Who cares if you worry about it, what matters is results!

How can he get out of jams if he fell apart? Slight contradiction no? If you fall apart that MEANS you didn't get out of it. :confused:

But as much as I hate watching him pitch he does get it done somehow.

Unless Lee's arm falls off , Dicek is just part of the conversation. Lesters numbers are solid too. He needs more wins though.....

Tragedy
08-10-2008, 09:35 AM
dice k doesnt have many innings pitched
He has 114 IP. Lets see he makes 10 more regular season starts, and even goes 5 innings in each of then (I think we can assume he's going to go more than 5 IP in some of those. 114 + 50 = 174. That appears to be the absolute LOWEST total that he will end the season with. 180-200 seems reasonable/likely.

Wake's Fastball
08-10-2008, 09:43 AM
I think you've got to throw K-Rod's name into the discussion as well.

lil'papi
08-10-2008, 09:48 AM
He wins 7 of those he has a legit shot. ^^ Innings he seems to be getting better at eating them.



Player TEAM W L ERA G GS CG SHO SV SVO IP H R ER HR HBP BB SO

D Matsuzaka BOS 13 2 2.90 20 20 0 0 0 0 114.2 85 40 37 8 5 67 98
.
C Lee CLE 15 2 2.58 22 22 2 1 0 0 153.2 144 46 44 7 1 22 127

Tragedy
08-10-2008, 09:53 AM
Looking at those numbers, it's quite close. It will come down to the better W-L record, and where the ERA's lie. If Lee ends with 22-4 while Matsuzaka is 19-3, the only way Matsuzaka wins the Cy Young is if his ERA is much better (And I' mnot sure it will be).

Either way, it'll be close. I personally don't agree with how they judge a Cy Young Winner (Basically W-L, ERA), but whatever. It'd still be nice to see Matsuzaka win it.

I still hold my doubts that Lee will keep it up the final two months. But I've been saying this since April.

WilymoPena
08-10-2008, 11:18 AM
No way Cliff Lee wins the Cy Young this yr. He's had a dream season but theres still time for the wheels to fall off a bit. My choice? Fransisco Rodriguez CP - LAA Angels

bagwell368
08-10-2008, 11:26 AM
This is a list of good starters....CY young means the BEST pitcher, not just good ones... that's like talking about who is gunna win the the world series and mentioning half the league...

I didn't say they could all win. I meant to say they all have a shot at getting votes for the Cy. There is no clear cut SP - so this is a good year a closer to get it.

And yes, the Sox do not have a single nominee which will cut them down in the rankings.

All I am sure of is that Lee, Dice-K and Mussina will get in the top 6.

BrooklynBalla20
08-10-2008, 11:36 AM
dice-k is certainly in the conversation for cy young and could finish at least top 3 i feel but i dont even think he's been the best pitcher on the red sox this year, let alone in the league. i think lester has been the most dominent for us. evne though matsuzaka is 13-2 compared to lester's 10-4 record, i think lester has been better. he gets deeper into ball games which i think can help his cause to win.

blujaysrock
08-10-2008, 11:44 AM
Matsuzaka average 5.7 innings per game compared to lee 7.0 and Halladays 7.6

Osiagledknarf
08-10-2008, 12:36 PM
That IP stat is going to hurt him...and his K's/IP aren't amazing either. He'll have the numbers in W's and ERA. Ultimately I don't think it adds up for him. K-Rod has a huge chance, and Cliff Lee has better numbers than Matsuzaka and he's become kind of a feel good story too, which the BBWA love. I think at this point it's way too early for someone like me to venture a guess as to who gets it...too many names still in the hat.

blujaysrock
08-10-2008, 01:08 PM
That IP stat is going to hurt him...and his K's/IP aren't amazing either. He'll have the numbers in W's and ERA. Ultimately I don't think it adds up for him. K-Rod has a huge chance, and Cliff Lee has better numbers than Matsuzaka and he's become kind of a feel good story too, which the BBWA love. I think at this point it's way too early for someone like me to venture a guess as to who gets it...too many names still in the hat.

a closer with a 2.40 ERA and who has only pitched 48 innings and has only came on once with runners on base,? i highly doubt he will win it

Osiagledknarf
08-10-2008, 02:20 PM
a closer with a 2.40 ERA and who has only pitched 48 innings and has only came on once with runners on base,? i highly doubt he will win it

Good point, good point. I wasn't aware his innings were so limited.

JacobyIsMyHomie
08-10-2008, 02:23 PM
If K-Rod breaks the saves record I bet you he will either win it or be in the top 2 in voting.

NESports2004
08-10-2008, 02:53 PM
id vote lester over Dice-K any day.

I love Dice-K but watching him pitch makes me wanna throw up

Osiagledknarf
08-10-2008, 04:49 PM
id vote lester over Dice-K any day.

I love Dice-K but watching him pitch makes me wanna throw up

Haha...when has being a Red Sox fan ever been easy?

Tragedy
08-10-2008, 08:38 PM
id vote lester over Dice-K any day.

I love Dice-K but watching him pitch makes me wanna throw up
Well, yeah, I think everyone can agree with that.

But it's Matsuzaka, not Lester, that has the pretty numbers that voters would vote for.

RedSoxtober
08-11-2008, 09:47 AM
He has 114 IP. Lets see he makes 10 more regular season starts, and even goes 5 innings in each of then (I think we can assume he's going to go more than 5 IP in some of those. 114 + 50 = 174. That appears to be the absolute LOWEST total that he will end the season with. 180-200 seems reasonable/likely.

I need to buy you a calculator.

I really don't think that Lee and Dice-K are that close. Dice-K's ugly success is no secret outside Fenway. Lee, on the other hand, has only had three starts in which he's yielded more than 4ER and has fewer BB this season than Dice-K has had in seven starts since July 1.

Pulling for Dice-K is just wishful thinking IMO. Lester is the more deserving guy, but won't make it because his pitching was ugly for the first six weeks.


No way Cliff Lee wins the Cy Young this yr. He's had a dream season but theres still time for the wheels to fall off a bit. My choice? Fransisco Rodriguez CP - LAA Angels

K-Rod closes the way Dice-K starts. I don't see it happening.

lil'papi
08-11-2008, 09:53 AM
Beckett wins his last 9-10 starts and wins it. :D

10-0 0.00 era averages 12 K's per nine. Get'er done.....if not Cliff lee.....

celticfan
08-11-2008, 09:57 AM
I think that Cliff Lee deserves it. He has been on an awful team but still has like 14 or 15 wins and has an impressive era

Osiagledknarf
08-11-2008, 07:50 PM
Lee's definitely done a great job...I think he's got a great chance. He's got all the numbers.

Brandon Webb definitely takes it again in the National League.

futureheisman
09-10-2008, 07:13 PM
way too baserunners for him to win this ERA is there though

The Intimidator
09-10-2008, 09:50 PM
Cliff Lee has Cy Young wrapped up, IMO, even with the season that K-Rod is having.

BeAn 5 ToWnE
09-10-2008, 09:59 PM
I would still take Doc over Lee anyday. :shrug:

The Intimidator
09-10-2008, 11:11 PM
Rivers? :p

Osiagledknarf
09-11-2008, 03:14 AM
What?

RedSoxtober
09-11-2008, 08:27 AM
I would still take Doc over Lee anyday. :shrug:

I'd rather have Halladay on my team but Lee is having a better season, especially after Halladay took the loss last night (about the time you posted!).



Pitcher W L ERA G GS CG SHO SV SVO IP H R ER HR HBP BB SO WPCT TB BK WP IBB SB CS PK GO AO GO/AO WHIP SLG OBA
Lee 21 2 2.28 28 28 4 2 0 0 201.2 184 54 51 8 4 28 154 .913 247 0 2 0 2 0 0 228 213 1.18 1.05 .327 .273
Halladay 18 10 2.77 31 30 8 2 0 0 224.0 202 80 69 17 12 35 193 .643 295 0 3 3 12 5 0 297 172 1.84 1.06 .349 .278

Osiagledknarf
09-11-2008, 11:01 AM
When you put the numbers up like that...I think it becomes pretty clear.

crowdawg239
09-11-2008, 01:20 PM
Nice comparison, but Lee has basically rapped this thing up.

Osiagledknarf
09-12-2008, 10:19 AM
Nice comparison, but Lee has basically rapped this thing up.

Haha...Cliff Lee rapping is a funny thought. But I agree...he does seem have the Cy Young Award wrapped up. Haha.

RedSoxtober
09-12-2008, 11:05 AM
Haha...Cliff Lee rapping is a funny thought. But I agree...he does seem have the Cy Young Award wrapped up. Haha.

He raps like a cross between Bob Dylan and John Denver.

Osiagledknarf
09-12-2008, 11:15 AM
Unintelligibly and about humanitarian work, political activism, and public service?

tc2deuce
09-12-2008, 12:13 PM
the Indians vs Red Sox again !!! 2007 C.C vs. Beckett 2008 Lee vs. Dice-K
I say they pick Lee but Dice K has a very good arguement...13-2 ERA K's and the fact of the matter that the Sox have been beaten up and yet still have a very good chance of winning the AL east.

Osiagledknarf
09-13-2008, 01:20 PM
At this point, Matsuzaka has no chance. He's had a very good season, no doubt. There's no way he'll win the Cy Young though.

MagicBucsSox
09-13-2008, 01:38 PM
is it me or doesn't it seem wen Beckett pitches we barely score? And every freakin time dice-k pitches we get him 5-8 runs like what the hell

Osiagledknarf
09-13-2008, 02:56 PM
Beckett's definitely suffered from poor run support on a few occasions, notably that game against Joba Chamberlain and the Yankees. He's had a couple clunkers, and his ERA is higher than last year, but he's pitched better than his record reflects.