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View Full Version : Pitching: Enough screwing around already!



hoog
08-01-2008, 08:18 AM
Enough with the teeter-todder games going on with our pitching staff. Who's in, who's out? Here's what needs to happen for us to get back into this thing or at least stay with the leaders:

Zumaya- Closer (He's NEVER been given a chance at this role and will thrive)

Farnsworth/Cruceta- Set up role (Cruceta has been wonderful lately in AAA and I think is finally where the Tigers thought he'd be when they signed him.)

Fossum/Seay- Lefty specialist (Although, I like Fossum in some long relief as well.)

Dolsi/Rodney- Extra arms when needed (Both have had their moments but have failed of late. Use them only when needed.)

Rapada/Lopez- See in triple A boys! Gone.

Verlander, Rogers, Galaraga, and Minor- Starters every turn. Who would have thought the Armando Galaraga would be our stopper?

Robertson- On the fence. If he doesn't pick it up send him to the pen and bring up Lambert (He has been very consistant and very good for Toledo. I think he deserve a shot.) I'd have to say that Fossum would end up the odd man out in the pen if Nate is moved in. In 2009, I think you'll see Nate as a long reliever anyway.

In my opinion, this set up gives us our best chance to win. I say quit screwing around and get a set plan together. I'm tired of these knee jerk changes with our pitching staff. Settle it and come what may.

Lionsforlife
08-01-2008, 08:41 AM
I think you have to give Farnsworth the closer role right now. Zumaya is the closer of the future, but I would give him the offseason to grow into the role. Farnsworth has experience closing and should be serviceable.

I would also keep Lopez up, because he is seemingly effective. Rapada only came up for the Thursday day game, before Farnsworth got to the team, and is being sent down.

Unless the Tigers make a serious run and Robertson is a part of it, I think he needs to go after this season. However, right now, although he's been horrible, he is serviceable for a 5 starter. However, I am curious if Freddy Garcia is ready to go. I know the Tigers are interested. Could be a good free agen pick up if he's healthy.

hoog
08-01-2008, 09:31 AM
Not to be rude, LFL, but we've been saying Zumaya is the closer of the future for two years now. When do we get to see if he is? I'm telling you, when I watch him he seems like a different guy with the game on the line, fans going crazy, he just puts a little extra on his talent. He's ready, he's been ready, and he's been waiting long enough, IMO. As for Lopez, yes, he's seemingly effective because he doesn't get credited for the runners left on base that he consistantly let's in and let's the pitcher replaced dissappointed. I bet his runner's inherited scored count is off the ceiling. Also, I forgot about Freddy. If Nate doesn't step it up then why not try Freddy? With Nate's deal he signed this year there is no way we can trade him without loosing a bunch of cash but I do think he'd be an effective bullpen guy and that's where I think you'll see him next year.

JackB
08-01-2008, 09:32 AM
Zumaya may be the closer of the future but not the immediate future. He can throw gas but can't find the plate.
Word is he will get some chances after this latest Rodney failure to get it done.
Farnsworth has pitched well this year.I think he should get the first look.He also throws very hard but has controled his fast ball.
I'm not sure about Garcia. How long has it been since hes pitched to a major league hitter?
Robertson has been terrible.I know they keep running him out there to see if one day he can get his act together.I hope he can dig deep and find enough to help us the rest of the season. We are only loking at maybe 10-11 starts.
Fossum is a short man. Hes been shaky. Thats what his whole career has been.
Looks like the Tigers will have their hands full this off season trying to address at least two relief pitching spots. But for now we just have to hope for the best.

Bondomania
08-01-2008, 04:30 PM
I think that Farnsworth will be the closer.. he needs to get closing opportunities.. that will pump up his value and therefore make him a type A free agent.. Nate needs to go, either Nate or Willis, we just can't have that much money tied up in starters that aren't getting the job done.. now if that means that we have to eat 2 or 3 mill then that is fine.. i think we will have to cut dead weight to make a signing in free agency because we lack talent at the upper minor league level, at least in the starting area.. but we HAVE to make a big splash in free agency or we could be looking at another frustrating year.. i think the rotation next year is:

Verlander
Bonderman
Galarraga
Miner/Willis (i think it depends on how well miner pitches down the stretch)
FA

One Nut Kruk
08-01-2008, 05:32 PM
Not to be rude, LFL, but we've been saying Zumaya is the closer of the future for two years now. When do we get to see if he is? I'm telling you, when I watch him he seems like a different guy with the game on the line, fans going crazy, he just puts a little extra on his talent. He's ready, he's been ready, and he's been waiting long enough, IMO. As for Lopez, yes, he's seemingly effective because he doesn't get credited for the runners left on base that he consistantly let's in and let's the pitcher replaced dissappointed. I bet his runner's inherited scored count is off the ceiling. Also, I forgot about Freddy. If Nate doesn't step it up then why not try Freddy? With Nate's deal he signed this year there is no way we can trade him without loosing a bunch of cash but I do think he'd be an effective bullpen guy and that's where I think you'll see him next year.

Definitely the closer of the future and we've been saying that for so long because the cement head keeps hurting himself and delaying his development.

~Troy
08-01-2008, 05:58 PM
IMO, Zumaya isn't nearly ready enough to be a closer. His 100mph Fastball is nice, but he can't seem to locate it. We need a closer who has a big strikeout pitch and doesn't put batters on the bases.

Dalionking
08-01-2008, 09:25 PM
this is a prime example of why he isnt our closer. first pitch in the dirt and brings the man in from 3rd. then walks the batter as well.

stanpapi
08-01-2008, 10:20 PM
The only way this Farnsworth thing pans out is if he runs off an incredible string, somehow vaulting us above mediocrity and into the wild card. Me, I don't see it happening, but you might as well give it a try. All right, let Farnsworth close, see what happens.

JackB
08-01-2008, 10:29 PM
Closing isn't just about throwing heat. It is about locating that heat as mentioned above. Most good major league hitters can catch up to a 95-100 mph fastball. But put in the right spot MOST of the time the hitter is dead meat. And the fast ball sets up a slider or a good breaking ball. Look at Soria from KC. He isn't a flame thrower.Low 90's but has an awesome slider and off speed pitch. He doesn't walk people. He gets ahead and its over. Doesn't nibble just does the job.His numbers are right there with Paplebons.
I really could give two craps who closes. I just want to see some results. These are major leaguers we are talking about. Not low level minor leaguers we are tuturing. This is getting old.

scottie
08-02-2008, 12:29 PM
Closing isn't just about throwing heat. It is about locating that heat as mentioned above. Most good major league hitters can catch up to a 95-100 mph fastball. But put in the right spot MOST of the time the hitter is dead meat. And the fast ball sets up a slider or a good breaking ball. Look at Soria from KC. He isn't a flame thrower.Low 90's but has an awesome slider and off speed pitch. He doesn't walk people. He gets ahead and its over. Doesn't nibble just does the job.His numbers are right there with Paplebons.
I really could give two craps who closes. I just want to see some results. These are major leaguers we are talking about. Not low level minor leaguers we are tuturing. This is getting old.

Most Major leaguers can't catch up to a 95-100 mph fastball.

~Troy
08-02-2008, 01:15 PM
Most Major leaguers can't catch up to a 95-100 mph fastball.

Ya that's when set pitcher can locate it over the plate. Zumaya is having trouble doing that right now.

JackB
08-02-2008, 02:30 PM
A major league hitter CAN catch up to a 95-100 mph straight fastball. But if it has movement and is located many cannot.Of course the better hitters can hit most good pitching.:) Hell I could hit one that is straight. Scottie . I don't think you could hit the broad side of board using an ironing board for a bat. You're to negetive. You would let the pitcher get in your head.:)

Zoomlander
08-02-2008, 04:33 PM
Whos better at the moment?

Porcello or Robertson

Perry Or Roberston

i think it is clear who needs to good sooner than later.

Zoomlander
08-02-2008, 04:35 PM
they need to ask Zumaya if he would like to be a starter or a Closer right now........cause if you wanna be a starter you cant be a closer........well you can but thats rare.....example...smoltz, ex

JackB
08-02-2008, 09:06 PM
Derek Lowe another example of closer to starter. Only Lowe was pretty damn good for a couple of years as a closer. Not just a few games.
Zumaya is having shoulder problems and won't be pitching for a few days.
They way the Tigers are going right now they are better off just resting him and not rushing.Two or three days or even a week from now.Longer if needed.If he gets worse it won't help in the future.
The Rays are taking it to the Tigers .Looks those guys are for real. Honestly I'm very happy they are doing so well. If they can keep that team together and add a good vet. starter they will be tough for a long time.

scottie
08-03-2008, 10:00 AM
A major league hitter CAN catch up to a 95-100 mph straight fastball. But if it has movement and is located many cannot.Of course the better hitters can hit most good pitching.:) Hell I could hit one that is straight. Scottie . I don't think you could hit the broad side of board using an ironing board for a bat. You're to negetive. You would let the pitcher get in your head.:)

FACTS ARE: Most major league hitters can't catch up to a 95-100 mph fast ball, no matter where they throw it. Ask someone who has played, you don't know! And I'm not negative, i don't live in fairy tale land like you do, and make stupid statments. If you want to make a point, then do it, but when you make statements that are wayyyy offf base, then someone in the know will set you straight.

JackB
08-03-2008, 03:49 PM
At what level did you play? Little league second string?Only because your father was a coach. You are probably a year or two from being in little league. At least judging by the way you write . Sorry my brother but I have faced pretty decent pitching having played in the Cape Cod league.And no not the potatoe chip. I DO know what I'm talking about.
You also said Soria throws 95 mph + Would you like me to prove you wrong AGAIN?
You add nothing to this forum or the Pistons forum. You always come accross as Mr Know It All . But you don't havw a clue.
Your best bet is to just go away. Your posts aren't welcome nor do they add anything we can have a posistive discussion with.
Don't go away mad. Just go away.

scottie
08-03-2008, 04:58 PM
At what level did you play? Little league second string?Only because your father was a coach. You are probably a year or two from being in little league. At least judging by the way you write . Sorry my brother but I have faced pretty decent pitching having played in the Cape Cod league.And no not the potatoe chip. I DO know what I'm talking about.
You also said Soria throws 95 mph + Would you like me to prove you wrong AGAIN?
You add nothing to this forum or the Pistons forum. You always come accross as Mr Know It All . But you don't havw a clue.
Your best bet is to just go away. Your posts aren't welcome nor do they add anything we can have a posistive discussion with.
Don't go away mad. Just go away.

I don't know who Soria is, old man! But i do know "most" major league players can't catch up to a 95-100 mph fastball. you add nothing but make believe, and crab cakes to this forum. your best bet is to go away!
Admit yoour wrong. Don't make into something it isn't. You said most major league players can catch up to a 95-100mph fastball. That is BULL ****! Stop pretending you know it all and just post your right scottie, most can't, some can, but most can't. And for the record old man, who played in Cape Cod, you nor most can't "catch up" to a 95-100mph fastball. Everyone knows you need to swing early to hit those. Stupid post by an old man, who has never caught up to anything in life.

JackB
08-03-2008, 06:07 PM
I'm going to end this with PLEAS READ what I said. I said MOST major leaguers can catch up to a fast ball. A STRAIGHT fast ball. That was your arguement about Zumaya and Rodney.
Now your boy Rodney BLEW another one. Thats three for three.
Now I'm not going to stoop to your level and end this with you just repeated what I said in my last post. Try being somewhat creative little boy and write something on your own.
Must be you wrote this in between feedings.

JackB
08-03-2008, 06:09 PM
Group Memberships
N/A scottie is not a member of any public groups
Nor will any let him join.

scottie
08-03-2008, 06:55 PM
I'm going to end this with PLEAS READ what I said. I said MOST major leaguers can catch up to a fast ball. A STRAIGHT fast ball. That was your arguement about Zumaya and Rodney.
Now your boy Rodney BLEW another one. Thats three for three.
Now I'm not going to stoop to your level and end this with you just repeated what I said in my last post. Try being somewhat creative little boy and write something on your own.
Must be you wrote this in between feedings.

Todd jones is my boy, not zumaya nor rodney. Learn how to read old man

scottie
08-03-2008, 06:56 PM
Group Memberships
N/A scottie is not a member of any public groups
Nor will any let him join.

Actually scottie is a lobbyist, thats a public group

DetTigers
08-03-2008, 09:31 PM
im pretty sure that scottie is the actual todd jones haha

JackB
08-03-2008, 10:16 PM
:clap:

Bondomania
08-04-2008, 10:17 AM
if major leaguers can't catch up to 95 to 100 mph then why do they even step into the batters box?? Oh yea and did you see that HR in Baltimore off of Zumaya to lead off the inning.. when zoom throws 100 and 101 it is straight as an arrow, which is why i prefer him to work in the 96 to 98 range because it seems to have way more movement.. if hitters know the fastball is coming then they can cheat and turn on a 100 mph fastball and all they are looking to do is make contact and let the pitcher supply all the power.. one of zoom's problem is the lack of control of secondary pitches.. if he could command a changeup then he would be primed to be a closer.. because then he could go first pitch changeup, just to get the hitters timing off and thus not allow them to sit on the ole' number 1

Bondomania
08-04-2008, 10:25 AM
scottie, you are the one that is wrong like 99% of the time.. seriously dude, what the hell is your problem? you come on here and fight with everyone and you think you know all.. when turns out you are much inferior from an intelligence stand-point than pretty much everyone on here.. Soria is the closer for the KC Royals.. he throws 91 to 93 with excellent movement and paints the corners with it.. with excellent secondary offspeed pitches.. It is the secondary pitches that make 95 to 100 mph hard to hit.. but if you constantly are just throwing fastball after fastball after fastball then yes.. MOST major leaguers can get the timing down and usually can hit it pretty far