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Chronz
07-24-2008, 07:23 AM
..............and make the playoffs?

An older past his prime Kmart, a broken down Nene, and Steven Hunter, those are the players they will rely on to slug it out against the West. Personally I dont think they stand a chance. They helped their cause by giving the Birdman another chance, especially if he can return to the form he displayed before his suspension, but do you guys think this core is enough to get the job done?

Just how important is the PF/C position, consider this fact; the top 4 teams in PER differential at the PF spot were the Mavs, Hornets, Jazz and Suns, the top 4 teams at Center were the Spurs, Rockets, Suns, and Lakers(ALL Playoff teams). 7 of the 8 Playoff teams had an overall net gain at both spots combined. The only one who didnt? You guessed it, these same Nuggets, they still ranked higher than most teams in the West, but that was WITH Camby.


Where did the Nuggets rank? This is why I think they dont stand a chance, they did have a positive rating at the 5 (+0.3) good for 6th in the West but they did a horrible job defending the power positions due to the high amount of help responsibility cast down on Camby and co. Obviously losing Nene for the season was a big reason for that but even with a healthy Nene do you see him having the same impact Camby did?

Top Western Teams in PF/C Differential
Jazz: +7.1
Suns: +7.0
Mavs: +6.3
Rockets: +5.9
Spurs: +3.8
Lakers: +3.6
Hornets: +2.9
Portland: +0.6
Twolves: +0.5
Nuggets: -1.3
Warriors: -2.7
Grizzlies: -5.7
Kings: -5.3
Clippers: -6.0
Sonics: -6.7

The Nuggets may have shot themselves in the foot by handing Camby over to the Clips, as they are the team most likely to improve at this position (Among non-playoff teams) along with the Blazers adding Oden, and the Twolves adding K-Love.

stawka
07-24-2008, 07:44 AM
They have no chance to make the Playoff's. This year will be even tougher out West then last year.

Teams that are a lock to make Playoff's:
- Lakers
- Spurs
- Hornets
- Jazz because they are the only really good team in their division

Teams that have a great chance of making Playoff's
- Suns
- Rockets
- Mavericks

That's 7 teams right there that if I were to place a bet who would make the Playoff's, i'd take them.

Next is 8. Denver? The team that cant defend, so they trade their only defender and DPOY for nothing?

Warriors? Got rid of B-Diddy but got decent in return. Enough to make Playoff's?

Trailblazers? A great young core, had an excellent run without their Rookie big-man Greg Oden. How will they do this year? BIG question!

Meanwhile, Memphis and the Clippers have also improved over last year (lets not forget, Brand didn't play last year) so how will they do? Former DPOY Camby and Baron Davis together? Wow.

JordansBulls
07-24-2008, 07:51 AM
If they ever played solid defense they would be the best team in the league.

DenButsu
07-24-2008, 09:05 AM
Anyone who watched Nene play in the 2006-07 playoffs against the Spurs knows he has a good chance of being a real impact player at the 5. Of course, this is absolutely conditional on his health, which is a massive question mark.

I really am getting a kick, though, out of the huge Marcus Camby pendulum swing. When he won DPOY and when he was named to the All-Defensive Team, he was totally overrated, a terrible one-on-one defender, marginally okay at help defense but often out of position, and good for little more than defensive rebounding and blocking 2-3 shots a game - not to mention that he was a massive offensive liability as he was soft, never posted up, always stood around at the top of the key and took bad jumpers with horrible form.

Then he was "traded for nothing", and BAM!

All of a sudden he's "Denver's best defensive player on a team that doesn't play defense", "the only reason we didn't give up 150 points a game", blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Make up your minds, people.

awr0430
07-24-2008, 09:46 AM
^^^I agree

JordansBulls
07-24-2008, 09:47 AM
They have no chance to make the Playoff's. This year will be even tougher out West then last year.

Teams that are a lock to make Playoff's:
- Lakers
- Spurs
- Hornets
- Jazz because they are the only really good team in their division

Teams that have a great chance of making Playoff's
- Suns
- Rockets
- Mavericks

That's 7 teams right there that if I were to place a bet who would make the Playoff's, i'd take them.

Next is 8. Denver? The team that cant defend, so they trade their only defender and DPOY for nothing?

Warriors? Got rid of B-Diddy but got decent in return. Enough to make Playoff's?

Trailblazers? A great young core, had an excellent run without their Rookie big-man Greg Oden. How will they do this year? BIG question!

Meanwhile, Memphis and the Clippers have also improved over last year (lets not forget, Brand didn't play last year) so how will they do? Former DPOY Camby and Baron Davis together? Wow.

I don't think any team out west is a lock to make the playoffs.

DreamShaker
07-24-2008, 09:58 AM
Anyone who watched Nene play in the 2006-07 playoffs against the Spurs knows he has a good chance of being a real impact player at the 5. Of course, this is absolutely conditional on his health, which is a massive question mark.

I really am getting a kick, though, out of the huge Marcus Camby pendulum swing. When he won DPOY and when he was named to the All-Defensive Team, he was totally overrated, a terrible one-on-one defender, marginally okay at help defense but often out of position, and good for little more than defensive rebounding and blocking 2-3 shots a game - not to mention that he was a massive offensive liability as he was soft, never posted up, always stood around at the top of the key and took bad jumpers with horrible form.

Then he was "traded for nothing", and BAM!

All of a sudden he's "Denver's best defensive player on a team that doesn't play defense", "the only reason we didn't give up 150 points a game", blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Make up your minds, people.

Yeah everything you said is the truth....

jtrinaldi
07-24-2008, 10:01 AM
Bucks Are

KB24PG16
07-24-2008, 02:59 PM
they signed chris anderson maybe that will help

KG#1
07-24-2008, 03:12 PM
i agree that the top 7 spots are taken and the nuggets will have a tough time making it in their GM might see that they have no chance and just blow their team up

cali72888
07-24-2008, 03:24 PM
chris anderson signing will help ALOT, fast athletic big who can shoot.

BigEric
07-24-2008, 03:31 PM
chris anderson signing will help ALOT, fast athletic big who can shoot.

He can't shoot ?!?!?!?!!?!?!

oldenpolynice
07-24-2008, 04:09 PM
They can always put together a trade offer for Emeka Okafor. With that $10 million trade exemption, they have a lot of room to work with, trade-wise.

JordansBulls
07-24-2008, 04:32 PM
They can always put together a trade offer for Emeka Okafor. With that $10 million trade exemption, they have a lot of room to work with, trade-wise.

But who would the bobcats take in return? Only Iverson I can see. Maybe a deal involving Iverson and Nene for Okafor and JRich.

Chronz
07-24-2008, 08:15 PM
They have no chance to make the Playoff's. This year will be even tougher out West then last year.

Teams that are a lock to make Playoff's:
- Lakers
- Spurs
- Hornets
- Jazz because they are the only really good team in their division

Teams that have a great chance of making Playoff's
- Suns
- Rockets
- Mavericks

That's 7 teams right there that if I were to place a bet who would make the Playoff's, i'd take them.

Next is 8. Denver? The team that cant defend, so they trade their only defender and DPOY for nothing?

Warriors? Got rid of B-Diddy but got decent in return. Enough to make Playoff's?

Trailblazers? A great young core, had an excellent run without their Rookie big-man Greg Oden. How will they do this year? BIG question!

Meanwhile, Memphis and the Clippers have also improved over last year (lets not forget, Brand didn't play last year) so how will they do? Former DPOY Camby and Baron Davis together? Wow.
Agree with your playoff locks and those are pretty much the only other contenders for the 8th seed. I think the Warriors have too many redundant players with not enough basketballs/shots to go around, but if anyone can make it work its Don Nelson. I think he may pull an old trick out of the bag and see if Stephen Jackson can run the offense. Warriors still have talent but I think losing Baron puts them below the Clippers.

I dont think the Blazers are ready to contend, theres plenty of evidence that suggests they overachieved last year and shouldnt have played .500 ball. But if Oden is for real they may sneak in. And then theres the Clippers, they improved the most out of any team in the West but they have the biggest hill to climb. There are plenty of questions being raised about Camby's ability to play the 4 and stay healthy in doing so, some even wonder if he was really much of an impact player for the Nuggs.



If they ever played solid defense they would be the best team in the league.
They were an average team on both sides of the court last year, I think they need more than just solid defense.

m26555
07-24-2008, 08:31 PM
If they ever played solid defense they would be the best team in the league.
You can't be serious. They'd be vastly improved, but best in the league? Not even close.

CHief_0_o_Wahoo
07-24-2008, 09:23 PM
Its going to be a tough season but that usually happens after you trade a key piece in a very unfair trade at least in my opinion.

DenButsu
07-24-2008, 09:26 PM
There are plenty of questions being raised about Camby's ability to play the 4 and stay healthy in doing so, some even wonder if he was really much of an impact player for the Nuggs.

Anyone ever wonder why nobody ever talks about Camby's offense?

There's really only two things he did well on that end of the court. The one he did really well was to feed the ball to Melo in the post. Denver will have to account for that by pushing Melo's teammates to do a better job of dishing inside to him. The other one he did reasonably well was set picks. Although, these didn't often come across as too effective, since he was usually standing around at the perimeter, these were usually set for AI who really doesn't play well off picks at all (he takes an additional 2-3 seconds to make a decisive shot or pass which undermines the effect of the pick in the first place as it gives the defender time to get back on him).

But here's a little reality check for you:


RNK NAME 2P%
1 A. Biedrins, GSW 0.63
2 T. Chandler, NOR 0.62
3 K. Perkins, BOS 0.62
4 D. Howard, ORL 0.6
5 A. Stoudemire, PHO 0.6
6 S. O'Neal, MIA/PHO 0.59
7 J. Foster, IND 0.55
8 R. Nesterovic, TOR 0.55
9 E. Curry, NYK 0.55
10 B. Haywood, WAS 0.53
11 N. Mohammed, DET/CHA 0.52
12 A. Bogut, MIL 0.52
13 S. Dalembert, PHI 0.51
14 Y. Ming, HOU 0.51
15 A. Horford, ATL 0.5
16 A. Jefferson, MIN 0.5
17 T. Duncan, SAS 0.5
18 A. McDyess, DET 0.49
19 C. Kaman, LAC 0.49
20 B. Miller, SAC 0.48
21 A. Blatche, WAS 0.48
22 M. Okur, UTH 0.48
23 Z. Ilgauskas, CLE 0.48
24 M. Blount, MIA 0.47
25 M. Camby, DEN 0.46
26 J. O'Neal, IND 0.44
27 D. Milicic, MEM 0.44


For a 6'11" starting center in the NBA who was as relied upon as Camby was for the Nuggets, that number is just inexcusable.

Now compare that with Nene's .570 in the 2006-07 season when he was (relatively) healthy for the latter part of it, and factor in that he ran a very solid pick and roll with Melo, and was also just a physical presence in the post that could not be ignored (like teams pretty much ignored Camby on the offensive end).

And in 06-07, Nene averaged 7 rebounds, 1 block, and was a FAR superior one-on-one defender to Camby, which to me makes him defensively an asset on par with Camby. (For example against the Lakers, if Nene is manning the paint and making it a lot harder for Gasol and Odom to get all those easy dunks, then K-Mart's D on Kobe becomes much more effective and Denver might not let some of those leads just slip away to ridiculous extremes).



The final sum of the Camby trade isn't known yet, since we still don't know how and when the Nuggets will use that $10 million trade exception. But if we get back a healthy Nene, it was at worst a move in which we don't lose any ground, and quite possibly gain some.

If Nene's healthy, I don't think the Nuggets are a worse team for this trade.

IF, IF, IF, IF, IF.... :bang:

It's those IFs that are Denver's biggest problem, not this trade. JB has a point. I'm not sure if we're the best in the league if some of these IFs fall into the postitive result category, but we're a force in the West for sure, and a playoff lock.

Chronz
07-24-2008, 09:47 PM
Anyone who watched Nene play in the 2006-07 playoffs against the Spurs knows he has a good chance of being a real impact player at the 5. Of course, this is absolutely conditional on his health, which is a massive question mark.
He did a real good job 1 on 1 with Duncan and has all the tools to be an outstanding defender for you guys. In fact a few posters I know have been saying for years that Nene is their best defender. Ever since he became a Nugget hes rated higher than Camby in defensive +/- including this injury plagued season though Im not sure if thats worth mentioning.

-- -- -- Nene -- Camby
03-04: -8.1 ---- +1.4
04-05: -3.6 ---- -0.9
06-07: -3.6 ---- +2.1
07-08: -1.7 ---- -1.1



I really am getting a kick, though, out of the huge Marcus Camby pendulum swing. When he won DPOY and when he was named to the All-Defensive Team, he was totally overrated, a terrible one-on-one defender, marginally okay at help defense but often out of position, and good for little more than defensive rebounding and blocking 2-3 shots a game - not to mention that he was a massive offensive liability as he was soft, never posted up, always stood around at the top of the key and took bad jumpers with horrible form.

Then he was "traded for nothing", and BAM!

All of a sudden he's "Denver's best defensive player on a team that doesn't play defense", "the only reason we didn't give up 150 points a game", blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Make up your minds, people.

What was your take on his season and the effect his departure will have on the team.
EDIT) NVM I just read your other post

Chronz
07-24-2008, 09:56 PM
Anyone ever wonder why nobody ever talks about Camby's offense?

There's really only two things he did well on that end of the court. The one he did really well was to feed the ball to Melo in the post. Denver will have to account for that by pushing Melo's teammates to do a better job of dishing inside to him. The other one he did reasonably well was set picks. Although, these didn't often come across as too effective, since he was usually standing around at the perimeter, these were usually set for AI who really doesn't play well off picks at all (he takes an additional 2-3 seconds to make a decisive shot or pass which undermines the effect of the pick in the first place as it gives the defender time to get back on him).

But here's a little reality check for you:


RNK NAME 2P%
1 A. Biedrins, GSW 0.63
2 T. Chandler, NOR 0.62
3 K. Perkins, BOS 0.62
4 D. Howard, ORL 0.6
5 A. Stoudemire, PHO 0.6
6 S. O'Neal, MIA/PHO 0.59
7 J. Foster, IND 0.55
8 R. Nesterovic, TOR 0.55
9 E. Curry, NYK 0.55
10 B. Haywood, WAS 0.53
11 N. Mohammed, DET/CHA 0.52
12 A. Bogut, MIL 0.52
13 S. Dalembert, PHI 0.51
14 Y. Ming, HOU 0.51
15 A. Horford, ATL 0.5
16 A. Jefferson, MIN 0.5
17 T. Duncan, SAS 0.5
18 A. McDyess, DET 0.49
19 C. Kaman, LAC 0.49
20 B. Miller, SAC 0.48
21 A. Blatche, WAS 0.48
22 M. Okur, UTH 0.48
23 Z. Ilgauskas, CLE 0.48
24 M. Blount, MIA 0.47
25 M. Camby, DEN 0.46
26 J. O'Neal, IND 0.44
27 D. Milicic, MEM 0.44


For a 6'11" starting center in the NBA who was as relied upon as Camby was for the Nuggets, that number is just inexcusable.

Now compare that with Nene's .570 in the 2006-07 season when he was (relatively) healthy for the latter part of it, and factor in that he ran a very solid pick and roll with Melo, and was also just a physical presence in the post that could not be ignored (like teams pretty much ignored Camby on the offensive end).

And in 06-07, Nene averaged 7 rebounds, 1 block, and was a FAR superior one-on-one defender to Camby, which to me makes him defensively an asset on par with Camby. (For example against the Lakers, if Nene is manning the paint and making it a lot harder for Gasol and Odom to get all those easy dunks, then K-Mart's D on Kobe becomes much more effective and Denver might not let some of those leads just slip away to ridiculous extremes).



The final sum of the Camby trade isn't known yet, since we still don't know how and when the Nuggets will use that $10 million trade exception. But if we get back a healthy Nene, it was at worst a move in which we don't lose any ground, and quite possibly gain some.

If Nene's healthy, I don't think the Nuggets are a worse team for this trade.

IF, IF, IF, IF, IF.... :bang:

It's those IFs that are Denver's biggest problem, not this trade. JB has a point. I'm not sure if we're the best in the league if some of these IFs fall into the postitive result category, but we're a force in the West for sure, and a playoff lock.

Agreed, his lack of O wasnt deemed an issue with most fans because of Denvers high per game averages but could you imagine how glaring of a weakness it could be if the Clippers continue to be so poor offensively.


I used to mention it all the time. Atleast when people would say Denver has enough scorers they dont need Camby to score. Well Ive always thought that stance was bogus but at the least they should NEED Camby to score effectively with the shots he does take. I hope playing in Dunleavy's system his defense can be maximized because outside of hitting that midrange jumper hes not going to provide much more.

DenButsu
07-24-2008, 11:28 PM
What was your take on his season

The stats speak for themselves. (http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/1130/camby0708ud9.png)


I was really pissed when I heard about the Camby trade. It's a really hard move to understand as making any kind of sense on the surface ("why would such a bad defensive team give away their DPOY?", etc.). I didn't get it at first. Took me a while.

And as I said before, until we find out what they do with that trade exception, we really won't know the final outcome. We do know that the Bulls seem more interested in a first and the TE for Hinrich than a first and Camby for Hinrich, so it does look like there's merit to the notion that there's value in the increased flexibility they've gained with this move. And the savings are indisputable.

So the devil is in the details.

But I do believe that a year or two from now when people see the full ramifications of this deal with a longer view and more distanced perpective, it won't look nearly as stupid as people think it looks now.

And it could even look pretty damn smart.

Nugget Tony
07-24-2008, 11:58 PM
every year is a new year.....you never know what could happen......The Nuggs could go off....or they completely fall apart.....and not even make the playoffs......It's all a big IF at this moment for me......Every team in the league is 1 injury away from a terrible season.....and sometimes magic just happens and you can't explain why a team is so good.....

JMO

durqtitan
07-25-2008, 12:22 AM
They were barely in the 8th seed of the wester conference last year. They have no chance this year. Survive the loss of Camby... I think not. The only player on that team that played hard defense every time down the court. No, Iverson rants please (i did say EVERY time). A.I. is maybe the best pound for pound player in the game, but he cannot put up the effort everytime down the floor on D, because he is killing himself trying to score on a lazy team. Camby was the only heart on the floor other than A.I. Melo is one of the most naturally gifted guys to every step on the court, but he gets lazy at times. K-Marts knees will never be the same again, NeNe has been the next big thing for at least 4 years now. Who else do they have??? "Birdman" and Chucky Atkins. Even Denver realizes what is happening with the so many teams in the West bettering themselves, thats why the dropped Camby. They have to plan for the rebuild now. The gave the A.I., Melo, Camby, and K-Mart experiment a try, but it failed. Time to move on

DenButsu
07-25-2008, 12:48 AM
They were barely in the 8th seed of the wester conference last year. They have no chance this year. Survive the loss of Camby... I think not. The only player on that team that played hard defense every time down the court. No, Iverson rants please (i did say EVERY time). A.I. is maybe the best pound for pound player in the game, but he cannot put up the effort everytime down the floor on D, because he is killing himself trying to score on a lazy team. Camby was the only heart on the floor other than A.I. Melo is one of the most naturally gifted guys to every step on the court, but he gets lazy at times. K-Marts knees will never be the same again, NeNe has been the next big thing for at least 4 years now. Who else do they have??? "Birdman" and Chucky Atkins. Even Denver realizes what is happening with the so many teams in the West bettering themselves, thats why the dropped Camby. They have to plan for the rebuild now. The gave the A.I., Melo, Camby, and K-Mart experiment a try, but it failed. Time to move on

So who gets in ahead of Denver?

The Clippers? You think Davis/Camby is going to work better for them than Maggette/Brand? I don't.

The Warriors? If anything, they've taken bigger steps back than Denver this offseason.

The Blazers? I love their potential, but if it pans out so well that they slip into the 8th spot, I'll be really, really surprised.

The Kings? Kevin Martin is getting better, that's for sure. As Beno seems to be as well. But if you think Denver's frontcourt was weakend by Camby's departure, why don't you try on Moore/Miller for size?


Even if the Nuggets don't make any more offseason moves (although they probably will), this is still most definitely a playoff caliber roster in the West, even as tough as the West is:

AI-Chucky-AC-Taurean Green
J.R. Smith-Dahntay Jones-Sonny Weems
Melo-Kleiza-Bobby Jones
K-Mart-Chris Andersen
Nene-Steven Hunter


And if you look at where that depth chart is stacked up, and whose contracts aren't guaranteed (Green, B. Jones, Weems), I think the smart money says Denver will be picking up at least one more big either via trade (using Green and Bobby as cap relief bait, with possibly a pick thrown in and the trade exception gained by trading Camby put into play) or via free agency (possibly Francisco Elson).


We might not have much more success in the playoffs than we have had in the last five years, but I think we'll be there in the postseason for sure.

Chronz
07-25-2008, 02:42 AM
every year is a new year.....you never know what could happen......The Nuggs could go off....or they completely fall apart.....and not even make the playoffs......It's all a big IF at this moment for me......Every team in the league is 1 injury away from a terrible season.....and sometimes magic just happens and you can't explain why a team is so good.....

JMO
True you never know what could happen in literal terms, but you almost always know what ends up happening and what has a good chance of happening(Like the Spurs making the playoffs atleast the NON-Dumb fans have a good handle on who the best teams will be year in and out) because the best teams in the league tend to stay at the top until the gradual decline comes and thats something thats evident as the season progresses. Its not like the Grizzlies are going to suddenly make the playoffs out of no where.


When it doesnt work out and your wrong its always a result of something else superseding it, its not magic its the natural balance of the game. Your best may not be good enough anymore, and most often than not the team with the best compliment of players and the right mix of talent win.

lavis
07-25-2008, 03:03 AM
So who gets in ahead of Denver?

The Clippers? You think Davis/Camby is going to work better for them than Maggette/Brand? I don't.


Remember Brand didn't play last season. Before that when he played they got into playoffs and did relatively well. I wouldn't write the Clips off.

If Nene stays healthy and K-Mart improves a bit I think Nuggz should be fine. Though definitely not any better than last season.

DenButsu
07-25-2008, 03:35 AM
Remember Brand didn't play last season. Before that when he played they got into playoffs and did relatively well. I wouldn't write the Clips off.

If Nene stays healthy and K-Mart improves a bit I think Nuggz should be fine. Though definitely not any better than last season.

I'm not writing off the Clippers. I think they do have a lot of talent on their roster. I'm just trying to backstep the hype they're getting from being on what appears to be the better end of a lopsided trade ("getting Camby for nothing") as it seems like a lot of people are using that, along with the Baron acquisition, as justification for saying "OMG the Clippers just got so much better!!!" when in fact, if you factor in losing Maggette and Brand, it's pretty hard to make a strong objective case for that. Sure, they didn't have Brand last season. They were also 12th in the West.

And I have some pretty serious doubts about Camby and Kaman playing alongside each other, especially on the defensive end. For one thing, their strengths overlap so closely that I imagine it will be a long time before they learn to not step on each others' toes. Camby is notorious for fighting his own teammates for defensive rebounds. I don't imagine that will go over very well with Kaman. Also, shot blocking is pretty much a one-man job. It's nearly impossible to have two teammates properly positioned so both of them can get good blocks in.

Also, Baron and Marcus are both coming from run-and-gun teams, but that's never really been the Clippers' system, at least not in recent years. What style of an offense are they going to put into effect? There just are a lot more unresolved questions than resolved questions about that team right now. And I'm not suggesting that all the answers will be negatives for them, but I do think some of the things people are excited about now - especially Camby and Kaman playing together - might not pan out as well as they're hoping they will.

Game_Over
07-25-2008, 04:25 AM
A few reasons why the Nuggs might be better.. First off Nene IF he can stay healthy is going to be a great player.. With his last health problem it has given his knees some extra rest and that may help.. Second JR didn't start to get real playing time till the end of the season and this kid is going to be something special!! Third like Den has said the Nuggs might not be done yet if we can finally get a decent PG in here it will open things up for us a lot.. I am not saying win it all but you can't say this team has no shot to make the playoffs!! Other reasons I don't think the Suns are what the Suns used to be I think they will drop off this year, yeah make the playoffs but not a top team.. How long will Ginobli and Duncan continue to be great I don't think that much longer mainly Ginobli.. Fluke injuries can happen to anyone on any team, how great would the Lakers be without Kobe?? Don't count the Nuggs out, on second thought go ahead I would love to rub it in lol!!

durqtitan
07-25-2008, 11:47 AM
So who gets in ahead of Denver?

The Clippers? You think Davis/Camby is going to work better for them than Maggette/Brand? I don't.

The Warriors? If anything, they've taken bigger steps back than Denver this offseason.

The Blazers? I love their potential, but if it pans out so well that they slip into the 8th spot, I'll be really, really surprised.

The Kings? Kevin Martin is getting better, that's for sure. As Beno seems to be as well. But if you think Denver's frontcourt was weakend by Camby's departure, why don't you try on Moore/Miller for size?


Even if the Nuggets don't make any more offseason moves (although they probably will), this is still most definitely a playoff caliber roster in the West, even as tough as the West is:

AI-Chucky-AC-Taurean Green
J.R. Smith-Dahntay Jones-Sonny Weems
Melo-Kleiza-Bobby Jones
K-Mart-Chris Andersen
Nene-Steven Hunter


And if you look at where that depth chart is stacked up, and whose contracts aren't guaranteed (Green, B. Jones, Weems), I think the smart money says Denver will be picking up at least one more big either via trade (using Green and Bobby as cap relief bait, with possibly a pick thrown in and the trade exception gained by trading Camby put into play) or via free agency (possibly Francisco Elson).


We might not have much more success in the playoffs than we have had in the last five years, but I think we'll be there in the postseason for sure.


Very good point, also, I will never count out a team with Iverson on the depth chart. We (almost, anything can happen year in and year out) know that the Lakers, Hornets, Jazz, Rockets, Spurs, Suns, and Mavs are at least going to make the playoffs. So, I could see the Blazers, Warriors, and Nuggets all fighting it out for the 8th spot. I think the Denver front office gets it: if all you can hope for is the 8th seed and getting knocked out in the first round, then why keep your roster? It is time to re-tool a bit, every team goes through it once every now and again.

P.S. sorry for the (the) instead of (they) in my origanal post, trying to type quickly at work. haha