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View Full Version : Rockies Wanted Beltran For Holliday



phlp_bj
07-22-2008, 06:00 PM
SI.com - Rockies' GM Dan O'Dowd wanted Carlos Beltran as part of a package from the Mets for Matt Holliday, a request that was rejected by New York.

And, according to a report in the Los Angeles Times, O'Dowd sought second baseman Howie Kendrick, pitching prospect Nick Adenhart and either Ervin Santana or Joe Saunders for Holliday, a proposition the Angels also rejected.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/jon_heyman/07/21/heyman.scoop/index.html

viktor06
07-22-2008, 06:06 PM
Thats old...

Poncho_707
07-22-2008, 06:07 PM
interesting

Gmen824
07-22-2008, 06:09 PM
Beltran for Holliday... hmm

TheHoopsProphet
07-22-2008, 06:10 PM
If I were Reagins I would have done that trade minus Kendrick. Everyone always wants more from the Angels than any other team.

LuCCi
07-22-2008, 06:12 PM
yes they wanted boof lamb and hernandez for holiday

GBG2489
07-22-2008, 06:16 PM
Wow. O Dowd is a very very ambitious man.

vigilantex69
07-22-2008, 06:26 PM
After seeing what Rockies players do outside of Colorado it's surprising teams would even ever both asking about them. Hell, look at Preston Wilson, Jeromy Burnitz, Vinny Castilla, and many many more. Beltran is good but if the Rockies were willing to take ALL his salary I would have definatly done it. He's 31 and has a LONG time remaining on his contract and will wind up like Manny Ramirez by the time he's done. He'll cost 25 million a year and hit 20 HR's and drive in 90 Rbi's a year and bat 270.

blueNorange
07-22-2008, 06:27 PM
actually the deal was fernando martinez and carlos beltran for matt holliday and willy tavares

PhillyUD26
07-22-2008, 06:31 PM
After seeing what Rockies players do outside of Colorado it's surprising teams would even ever both asking about them. Hell, look at Preston Wilson, Jeromy Burnitz, Vinny Castilla, and many many more. Beltran is good but if the Rockies were willing to take ALL his salary I would have definatly done it. He's 31 and has a LONG time remaining on his contract and will wind up like Manny Ramirez by the time he's done. He'll cost 25 million a year and hit 20 HR's and drive in 90 Rbi's a year and bat 270.

Except Beltran is nowhere near Manny Ramirez as a hitter.

L-MiLLZ44
07-22-2008, 06:34 PM
Except Beltran is nowhere near Manny Ramirez as a hitter.

Beltran and Manny are like oranges and apples

Beltran plays defense and has speed and sucks in the clutch

Manny has no speed, no defense, and is super clutch

OnWisconsin2007
07-22-2008, 06:40 PM
Omar Minaya is a racist, he would never trade a latino for a white boy.

YankeeFan28
07-22-2008, 06:40 PM
Why would they want Beltran's contract if they could just pay Holliday?

quiksilver2491
07-22-2008, 06:44 PM
After seeing what Rockies players do outside of Colorado it's surprising teams would even ever both asking about them. Hell, look at Preston Wilson, Jeromy Burnitz, Vinny Castilla, and many many more. Beltran is good but if the Rockies were willing to take ALL his salary I would have definatly done it. He's 31 and has a LONG time remaining on his contract and will wind up like Manny Ramirez by the time he's done. He'll cost 25 million a year and hit 20 HR's and drive in 90 Rbi's a year and bat 270.

Uhmm please don't compare one of the greatest hitters of this generation to an extremely overated player who has posted one GREAT season in his career. Last year Manny had his worst full year as a hitter ever and he still did better than what Carlos Beltran is doing this season. Manny has been quitely having a pretty solid year too, sure he isn't his old form anymore but ill take his 143 OPS+ anyday of the week and im sure when we resign him he won't be getting 20 million a year.

Tragedy
07-22-2008, 07:10 PM
Why would they want Beltran's contract if they could just pay Holliday?
Exactly why this trade is a complete joke, and why sometimes we just can't believe all the rumors that sports writers come out with.

There is no reason for the Rockies to be ignorant enough to offer that to the Mets.

sportwiz628
07-22-2008, 07:22 PM
The Mets wouldnt do it anyway...Holliday is only good at home but on the road he absolutely sucks.

YankDEEZ
07-22-2008, 09:00 PM
well if this is true i cant understand why the mets would reject, holliday is deffinitaly more of an upshot than beltran, he will give you a better avg,more rbis, etc. beltran had 1 good year, hes an average ball player at best, holliday is putting up great numbers, but something tells me that if he was on a team that has playoff potential that he would explode, taverez is no pushover either, he can give you another great pair of legs behind reyes and the rest of their speedsters that led the majors in steals last year, in conclusion, **** the mets..LETS GO YANKEES

Seamhead
07-22-2008, 09:06 PM
well if this is true i cant understand why the mets would reject, holliday is deffinitaly more of an upshot than beltran, he will give you a better avg,more rbis, etc. beltran had 1 good year, hes an average ball player at best, holliday is putting up great numbers, but something tells me that if he was on a team that has playoff potential that he would explode, taverez is no pushover either, he can give you another great pair of legs behind reyes and the rest of their speedsters that led the majors in steals last year, in conclusion, **** the mets..LETS GO YANKEES

That was the dumbest sentence I've read in my life (where are the periods?). Carlos Beltran is an outstanding baseball player. Apart from 2005, he's always been very good offensively, along with being one of the best defensive CF in the game, and an incredibly good base stealer and baserunner.

Plus, Willy Taveras -- seriously? The same guy with the career 74 OPS+:laugh:

Get off that NY Yankees crack.

C-ross12
07-22-2008, 09:09 PM
Why would they want Beltran's contract if they could just pay Holliday?

It would make a little more sense if they didnt have a stud CF in the farm IIRC. I also dont understand why they would want F-mart with Beltran.. very strange. If I were Omar I would do Holliday for Beltran straight up though.

quiksilver2491
07-22-2008, 10:10 PM
It would make a little more sense if they didnt have a stud CF in the farm IIRC. I also dont understand why they would want F-mart with Beltran.. very strange. If I were Omar I would do Holliday for Beltran straight up though.

I think F-Mart projects more as a left fielder than a center fielder.

Sick Of It All
07-22-2008, 10:22 PM
I want to see some numbers in which you can show me Holiday is better than Beltran for those of you who seem to think Holiday is that much better of a hitter. Holiday OPS is driven by Coors field.


The last 3 years Beltrans OPS on the road is .916.
The last years Holliday OPS on the road is .809.

..and this includes 2005 when Beltran was horrendous. This would be a steal of a deal for the Rockies.

1. They get a gold Glove Center fielder who does everything and they get rid of a guy who avg is bloated by coors field and is horrendous on defense.

2. Beltran is owed only 57.5 over the last 3 years of his contract and Holliday would comand 150+ million over at least 7 years when he becomes a free agent. Tell whose contract you rather have? Beltran will be 34 when his contract is up, not 38 he wouls be winding up his prime.



This would be an insanely stupid deal from the Mets perspective, not the Rockies.

King Koopa
07-22-2008, 10:28 PM
i would of done it if i were the mets.... Holliday is way better then Beltran.

Sick Of It All
07-22-2008, 10:29 PM
i would of done it if i were the mets.... Holliday is way better then Beltran.

Show me numbers then.

I showed you how average Holliday is outside of Coors, just because he is able to hit .370 at home does not make him better than Beltran.

jetsfan89
07-22-2008, 10:55 PM
whats with this racism bull****?

Run Gardner Run
07-22-2008, 10:56 PM
whats with this racism bull****?

Its a joke, note the pink font.

cffl go cubs
07-22-2008, 10:59 PM
mets would be lucky to get that deal holiday is 35hr 115rbi 10 sb and willy taveres is a 50 base stealer as a starter

ThisIsTheYear
07-22-2008, 11:21 PM
mets would be lucky to get that deal holiday is 35hr 115rbi 10 sb and willy taveres is a 50 base stealer as a starter

We can get that with Beltran, plus better defence and speed. The only thing that Holliday has on Beltran is AVG.

cffl go cubs
07-22-2008, 11:42 PM
no way u can get 35 hr with beltran and im sayin this as a mets fan

Run Gardner Run
07-22-2008, 11:48 PM
no way u can get 35 hr with beltran and im sayin this as a mets fan

Go Cubs. Your a Met fan? He hit 34 in 2005 38 in 2006 and 33 last season. And has 15 already. He cant hit 35?

cffl go cubs
07-22-2008, 11:50 PM
yeah just a bigger cubs fan

jetsfan89
07-22-2008, 11:51 PM
anyways i bet holliday will fail once he goes to a different team (unless of course he goes to philly or cincy)

cffl go cubs
07-22-2008, 11:53 PM
he's amazing at Coors

gazu
07-23-2008, 12:05 AM
put beltran in the yankee order and look the destruction.beltran does not fit in the metes in the 3or 4 spot.look him in kansas and houston and look taht he was not hiting 3 or 4 he was hitng second

cffl go cubs
07-23-2008, 12:06 AM
gazu learn grammar

gazu
07-23-2008, 12:15 AM
foolish i am not american.i really try to learn english chat

Cubber
07-23-2008, 12:29 AM
I'd love to have him on the Cubs, too bad Soriano can't play center

Cubber
07-23-2008, 12:31 AM
foolish i am not american.i really try to learn english chat

Welcome to the chat homie. Don't listen to that crap and keep on doing what you are doing.

vigilantex69
07-23-2008, 01:29 AM
gazu learn grammar

LMFAO

C-ross12
07-23-2008, 03:07 AM
Show me numbers then.

I showed you how average Holliday is outside of Coors, just because he is able to hit .370 at home does not make him better than Beltran.

Well.. I look at it this way. I could be vastly wrong lord knows, but here it is. Ok., Holliday is a LF, not a CF. We all know he will lower to a .850 ops or so away from Coors. But you have F-mart whos value is obviously at CF. You Eliminate your block (beltan) and get a good solid LF. I dont know if he will cost 150.. thats pure speculation. I would say Carlos Lee money. So now you have Holliday, F-Mart + right fielder. Age goes down and production may drop a bit, but Fmart is not blocked anymore. Perfect scenario? Not exactly but not ludicrious IMHO.

Run Gardner Run
07-23-2008, 03:37 AM
he's amazing at Coors

Put someone like Sean Casey in Coors and he'll hit 35. Its a Hitters park 100%

ThisIsTheYear
07-23-2008, 09:50 AM
no way u can get 35 hr with beltran and im sayin this as a mets fan

2007- 33 HR
2006- 41 HR

Yes, you can get 35 HR with Beltran.

The Schmooze
07-23-2008, 09:55 AM
As a Mets fan, I'd never do this trade. Why downgrade defensively, and arguable offensively. Corner OF's arent as hard to find as a great CF.

Plus I think this is BS anyway. The Rockies would take on Beltran's contract? I dont think so

Cub_StuckinSTL
07-23-2008, 10:01 AM
As a Mets fan, I'd never do this trade. Why downgrade defensively, and arguable offensively. Corner OF's arent as hard to find as a great CF.

Plus I think this is BS anyway. The Rockies would take on Beltran's contract? I dont think so

Especially with the possibility of being able to acquire Bay or Nady

Nady OPS .910 with .816 at home and 1.001 on the road :speechless:
Bay OPS .914 with .977 at home and .842 on the road

compared to

Holl OPS 1.004 with 1.118 at home and .859 on the road

Tragedy
07-23-2008, 10:03 AM
As a Mets fan, I'd never do this trade. Why downgrade defensively, and arguable offensively. Corner OF's arent as hard to find as a great CF.

Plus I think this is BS anyway. The Rockies would take on Beltran's contract? I dont think so
I think you have to look at Holliday as a product of certain parks. If I'm the Red Sox, I'd take him on my team. His swing is made for the Monster. The Mets? No, that would be a serious downgrade, because that park is awful for him (I have no idea what the dimensions are for next year, though).

The Schmooze
07-23-2008, 10:10 AM
Especially with the possibility of being able to acquire Bay or Nady

Nady OPS .910 with .816 at home and 1.001 on the road :speechless:
Bay OPS .914 with .977 at home and .842 on the road

compared to

Holl OPS 1.004 with 1.118 at home and .859 on the road plus Holliday becomes a Fa fter what? next year? You lose all those spects(b/c I refuse to believe they would take on Beltran's contract) and possibly get nothing for it.


I think you have to look at Holliday as a product of certain parks. If I'm the Red Sox, I'd take him on my team. His swing is made for the Monster. The Mets? No, that would be a serious downgrade, because that park is awful for him (I have no idea what the dimensions are for next year, though). The dimensions are a little bit bigger, but Citi Field will still be a pitcher's park. Even if he didnt have that descrepency, you give up arguably the best defensive CF in the game right now, who can hit, for a corner OF who's hitting FA soon. I agree with you. The #'s show he's not as sharp on the road.

Cub_StuckinSTL
07-23-2008, 10:12 AM
plus Holliday becomes a Fa fter what? next year? You lose all those spects(b/c I refuse to believe they would take on Beltran's contract) and possibly get nothing for it.

The dimensions are a little bit bigger, but Citi Field will still be a pitcher's park. Even if he didnt have that descrepency, you give up arguably the best defensive CF in the game right now, who can hit, for a corner OF who's hitting FA soon. I agree with you. The #'s show he's not as sharp on the road.

Yeah IIRC he's got one more year left on his contract after this year.

IndiansFan337
07-23-2008, 10:25 AM
I assume they wanted the Mets to pay some of Beltran's contract as well?

The Schmooze
07-23-2008, 10:29 AM
I assume they wanted the Mets to pay some of Beltran's contract as well?

Personally I think this article is BS, but I would assume so b/c I dont think they can afford him. The whole point of trading Holliday is b/c they think they cant re-sign him....so they trade for a guy who is in the same ballpark of what Holliday will get? Doesnt make sense

and if they did it would make the trade even more unbalanced than it already is. Beltran has much more value than Holliday IMO, at least to the Mets he does.