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View Full Version : Deng, Gordon contract talks not close



Jabbar
07-17-2008, 12:32 PM
The Bulls don't appear to be any closer to reaching deals with restricted free agents Luol Deng and Ben Gordon, although options available to the players are dwindling.

The Los Angeles Clippers were believed to be interested in Deng, but they exhausted their available salary-cap room Tuesday by acquiring Marcus Camby from the Denver Nuggets for a second-round draft pick. -- Chicago Sun-Times


Negotiations between the Bulls and representatives for Deng and Gordon are ongoing, professional and far apart. -- The Chicago Tribune



If the Bulls can't agree on contract terms or a sign-and-trade deal with Deng and Gordon, the two players have the option of signing a one-year qualifying offer and becoming unrestricted free agents next summer. -- Arlington Heights Daily Herald


Source: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/features/rumors

It just seems that we're gonna have a **** load of cap space for 2009 and maybe even 2010. This **** really pisses me off. **** Reinsdorf!!

playanomor
07-17-2008, 12:41 PM
I don't think it's Jerry's fault that these guys want WAY more than their worth. Deng is worth 11-12/year, and Gordon's worth 8-10... they both deserve four or five year deals, and that's what Reinsdorf is saying. Gordon and Deng somehow both think they're worth 13-15/year, which simply isn't true. Jerry is willing to overpay a bit, but he WILL NOT exceed the luxury tax, which makes things a little tricky.

Vincent
07-17-2008, 12:50 PM
Who cares, let them realize that NO teams are interested in them, and offer them low end deals that will turn into sound investments.

Nothing motivates players to play hard more than being shunned by the rest of the league.

ugottabjoshinme
07-17-2008, 12:50 PM
It just seems that we're gonna have a **** load of cap space for 2009 and maybe even 2010. This **** really pisses me off. **** Reinsdorf!!

Not being close isnt that big of deal to me...not many other teams can make them offers so we probably arent going to loose them...they can take all the negotiating time they need in my opinion

ugottabjoshinme
07-17-2008, 12:51 PM
Not being close isnt that big of deal to me...not many other teams can make them offers so we probably arent going to loose them...they can take all the negotiating time they need in my opinion

Question: When do they have to sign the QA by if thats what it comes down too?

JordansBulls
07-17-2008, 01:09 PM
Since no one apparently wants to trade for some stars now, then just let them walk so that we can be in the lottery fighting for the #1 pick for the next 5 years and end up like the Clippers in the 90's.

path2zion
07-17-2008, 01:10 PM
Not being close isnt that big of deal to me...not many other teams can make them offers so we probably arent going to loose them...they can take all the negotiating time they need in my opinion

It is costing us in lost opportnities elsewhere. Paxson has reiterated several times that he wants closure to the RFA's before we think about doing any other moves. By the time this is done, there may be no moves left to make, and we need to get rid of one of our guards...

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 01:15 PM
Since no one apparently wants to trade for some stars now, then just let them walk so that we can be in the lottery fighting for the #1 pick for the next 5 years and end up like the Clippers in the 90's.

are you serious? or better yet, lets be like the cavaliers in teh 90s and be a cosntant playoff contender, btu never win, cause clearly that's wha tyou prefer JB :rolleyes:.
seriously, you are literally the only poster in this forum who doesnt get that this team can easily be a dynasty by building on our young players like rose, deng, tyrus, thabo, and noah. no hope for your :rolleyes:

JordansBulls
07-17-2008, 01:21 PM
are you serious? or better yet, lets be like the cavaliers in teh 90s and be a cosntant playoff contender, btu never win, cause clearly that's wha tyou prefer JB :rolleyes:.
seriously, you are literally the only poster in this forum who doesnt get that this team can easily be a dynasty by building on our young players like rose, deng, tyrus, thabo, and noah. no hope for your :rolleyes:

The Cavs of the 90's had 3 players that were better than our best player. We aren't really compared to them. At best we could be the Bucks of the 90's.

My point isn't that we can't be a dynasty my point is that we may end up losing both Deng and Gordon for essentially nothing. So I'd rather trade them while we can to get a star in return.
Signing them for 1 year almost assures us that they will just go whereever they want next year because it would mean they have no faith in Bulls managment to give them what they think they are worth.

Some team would pay them the amount of money they are desiring. Just watch and see.

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 01:26 PM
The Cavs of the 90's had 3 players that were better than our best player. We aren't really compared to them. At best we could be the Bucks of the 90's.

My point isn't that we can't be a dynasty my point is that we may end up losing both Deng and Gordon for essentially nothing. So I'd rather trade them while we can to get a star in return.
Signing them for 1 year almost assures us that they will just go whereever they want next year because it would mean they have no faith in Bulls managment to give them what they think they are worth.

Some team would pay them the amount of money they are desiring. Just watch and see.

(a) you say you want a star, most of your trades arent realistic, because MELO ISNT AVAILABLE. and carter, dont get me started on how overrated he is and only you think he's good
(b)says who we wont get gordon and deng back? I guarentee to you right now that this simply negotiating process and deng will be back. with gordon? maybe not, but I hoep he will. point is they will be back. You are acting as if you never seen an offseason ebfore. restricted FA's also take awhile. what? is iggy, okafor, smith all arent going to return to their respective teams either? it doesnt happen like that dude. it's only july relax :rolleyes:

as fro bolded, not really considering no team has serious cap room anymore

IvyWentCrazy
07-17-2008, 01:45 PM
It just seems that we're gonna have a **** load of cap space for 2009 and maybe even 2010. This **** really pisses me off. **** Reinsdorf!!

**** Deng and Gordon... I'll take that cap space and spend it on real NBA Stars... we are going to suck next year anyway... it's not like signing them is going to get us a championship... jerry/Pax, listen to me... take the cap space, let these schmucks go somewhere else and take the draft compensation, PLEASE.

fabian11593
07-17-2008, 02:26 PM
I don't think it's Jerry's fault that these guys want WAY more than their worth. Deng is worth 11-12/year, and Gordon's worth 8-10... they both deserve four or five year deals, and that's what Reinsdorf is saying. Gordon and Deng somehow both think they're worth 13-15/year, which simply isn't true. Jerry is willing to overpay a bit, but he WILL NOT exceed the luxury tax, which makes things a little tricky.

I don't think deng is worth that much.

JordansBulls
07-17-2008, 02:28 PM
(a) you say you want a star, most of your trades arent realistic, because MELO ISNT AVAILABLE. and carter, dont get me started on how overrated he is and only you think he's good
(b)says who we wont get gordon and deng back? I guarentee to you right now that this simply negotiating process and deng will be back. with gordon? maybe not, but I hoep he will. point is they will be back. You are acting as if you never seen an offseason ebfore. restricted FA's also take awhile. what? is iggy, okafor, smith all arent going to return to their respective teams either? it doesnt happen like that dude. it's only july relax :rolleyes:

as fro bolded, not really considering no team has serious cap room anymore

Once Charlotte trades Gerald Wallace they will have the money for Deng and Gordon would just sign anywhere that needs a scorer.

You say Carter is overrated, but I say Rose is overrated. We are supposed to think this guy is going to be a star when he can't even shoot 30% in summer league?
:eyebrow:

bullsriver23
07-17-2008, 02:44 PM
The Cavs of the 90's had 3 players that were better than our best player. We aren't really compared to them. At best we could be the Bucks of the 90's.

My point isn't that we can't be a dynasty my point is that we may end up losing both Deng and Gordon for essentially nothing. So I'd rather trade them while we can to get a star in return.
Signing them for 1 year almost assures us that they will just go whereever they want next year because it would mean they have no faith in Bulls managment to give them what they think they are worth.

Some team would pay them the amount of money they are desiring. Just watch and see.

At least someone who cares about winning seriously. I agree with you Jordan Bulls.

Those one who thinks that we will be a dinasty with these players are overarting them, they are just average/good players, no All Star in this roster. How do you plan to build a dinasty without All Star????

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 02:53 PM
At least someone who cares about winning seriously. I agree with you Jordan Bulls.

Those one who thinks that we will be a dinasty with these players are overarting them, they are just average/good players, no All Star in this roster. How do you plan to build a dinasty without All Star????

DERRICK ROSE.
he was drafted number 1 expected to be a superstar. he is expected to be the leader, so you got your number one player. you also got your number 3 men in gordon and deng. that leaves you with a number 2 option, and it's either
(a) tyrus assuming he reaches his potential and becomes a great pf
(b) he busts and we have more than enough in 2010 to sign that stud pf in amare or bosh

seriously, why dont you or jb get it. this team has a great foundation already, why **** with it. it is VERY similar to teams like the 90s and current jazz, 90s sonics, current hornets etc.

Vincent
07-17-2008, 02:55 PM
Once Charlotte trades Gerald Wallace they will have the money for Deng and Gordon would just sign anywhere that needs a scorer.

You say Carter is overrated, but I say Rose is overrated. We are supposed to think this guy is going to be a star when he can't even shoot 30% in summer league?
:eyebrow:

Even if the Charlotte Bobcats trades away Gerald Wallace, they will receive salaries in return. This will still count against their cap, and they won't have any money to invest in free agents.

Rose played 2 games in summer league, one of those games, he sat out most of the fourth quarter.

Do you really want to base your entire logic on whether he'll be a star on 2 games?

Carter isn't overrated. He's a good player. Puts up great numbers. But he's not a winner, nor a superstar. Yet, he's making superstar money, and has a very long contract extending to an age where he'll probably be very ineffective. Overall, there's a reason why teams around the league aren't biting on trades for him.

bullsriver23
07-17-2008, 03:30 PM
DERRICK ROSE.
he was drafted number 1 expected to be a superstar. he is expected to be the leader, so you got your number one player. you also got your number 3 men in gordon and deng. that leaves you with a number 2 option, and it's either
(a) tyrus assuming he reaches his potential and becomes a great pf
(b) he busts and we have more than enough in 2010 to sign that stud pf in amare or bosh

seriously, why dont you or jb get it. this team has a great foundation already, why **** with it. it is VERY similar to teams like the 90s and current jazz, 90s sonics, current hornets etc.

You are suposing that Rose is an all star and he has not played a game yet. Let's see what he can do and let's if he will really be that star.

Also you should remenber that the last team who won a championship with their PG been the All star and leader was the Pistons in 1990.

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 03:40 PM
You are suposing that Rose is an all star and he has not played a game yet. Let's see what he can do and let's if he will really be that star.

Also you should remenber that the last team who won a championship with their PG been the All star and leader was the Pistons in 1990.

I expect him to eventually develop into one, yes. he was drafted and was expected to be a superstar. he was a number 1 pick for a reason.
nope last team to win with a pg as an allstar was spurs in 06-07, but last team to win a pg that's an allstar and leader were pistons in 04. not to mention you are saying as if it's that long, when you forget to mention that there were 6 years when we somehow won with a sg as a leader, which is pretty rare. point is, to say based on a position, chances are we wont win is dumb. if you have talent, you will be good. what are you proposing anyway, most championships win with a great center but last time I checked dwight or even oden arent exactly avaluable.

Vincent
07-17-2008, 03:45 PM
Those Lakers teams in the 80s had this really good PG too

fairandbalanced
07-17-2008, 03:49 PM
Funny how Chicago had the chance to draft Beasly, let Gordon go and sign and trade Deng for something. You already have some players such as Huges and Gooden that could fill in for both if you lose them. Deng is not worth $10 a yr, neither is Gordon worth $10.

JordansBulls
07-17-2008, 04:11 PM
Even if the Charlotte Bobcats trades away Gerald Wallace, they will receive salaries in return. This will still count against their cap, and they won't have any money to invest in free agents.

Rose played 2 games in summer league, one of those games, he sat out most of the fourth quarter.

Do you really want to base your entire logic on whether he'll be a star on 2 games?

Carter isn't overrated. He's a good player. Puts up great numbers. But he's not a winner, nor a superstar. Yet, he's making superstar money, and has a very long contract extending to an age where he'll probably be very ineffective. Overall, there's a reason why teams around the league aren't biting on trades for him.


A few things. No you don't base a players ability on 2 games, but 2 games in summer league doesn't give a good estimation that a player is going to be a star either especially if they played bad.

Carter is overrated depending on who he is compared to. If you want to say he would be the best on the Bulls then he is not overrated.
As far as making superstar money, well I think any player that makes 10 million a year is making superstar money.

Chi-Town Finest
07-17-2008, 04:12 PM
Why is everyone talking about Rose's summer leauge? Durant had a bad summer league shooting wise, Oden got injured and no one is questioning them. Heck, if I recall, James didnt have the best summer league or pre season and he is a top player. Thing is if he makes our players even slightly better we will be a dangerous team. I believe that we made it to the playoffs three straight years and a down year cant erase that. If you think about it, we have a better team now than when we went to the second round. Guys lets not look at last year and think we are that team, lets look at the last four years and the current players we have and realize that we are a better team.

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 04:33 PM
A few things. No you don't base a players ability on 2 games, but 2 games in summer league doesn't give a good estimation that a player is going to be a star either especially if they played bad.

Carter is overrated depending on who he is compared to. If you want to say he would be the best on the Bulls then he is not overrated.
As far as making superstar money, well I think any player that makes 10 million a year is making superstar money.

(a) again, it's SUMMER league. marcus banks has the highest scoring average ever in summer league, yet he's as big of a scrub as any. duncan had an awful summer league, so did james, and so did dwill and oden and durant, but all of them are very good now, except maybe oden since he didnt have a chance yet, but cmon to base a players career off 2 summer league games is silly. you are better than that.

(b) carter is probably the best on the bulls for 2 years at best. no point, since we are rebuilding this next 2 years and in 3 years he will be crappy yet getting a big contract and demanding big pt nonetheless when we'd have no need for him

(c) bit outdated arent you? 10mil being superstar moeny has long past. it's more like 20mil at this point unfortunately. you'd be lucky to get a good role player for 10mil these days...

Vincent
07-17-2008, 04:36 PM
A few things. No you don't base a players ability on 2 games, but 2 games in summer league doesn't give a good estimation that a player is going to be a star either especially if they played bad.

Carter is overrated depending on who he is compared to. If you want to say he would be the best on the Bulls then he is not overrated.
As far as making superstar money, well I think any player that makes 10 million a year is making superstar money.

There are a lot of non-superstar players making close to 10 million or more a year. Here are players who aren't even All-Stars making more than that clip.

Hinrich, Hughes, Bibby, Dampier, Terry, Kenyon Martin, Nene, Adonal Foyle, Al Harrington, Bobby Simmons, Ben Wallace, Lamar Odom, Wally Szczerbiak, Ilgauskas, Jason Richardson, Mike Miller, Kaman, Mobley, Zach Randoph, Curry, Crawford, Q. Richardson, Antoine Walker, Raef LaFrentz, Dalembert, Andre Miller, Troy Murphy, Mike Dunleavy, Tyson Chandler, Stojakavic, Boris Diaw, Redd, R. Jefferson, Andre Kirilenko, Brad Miller, Kevin Martin.

chicagowhitesox
07-17-2008, 05:02 PM
Get a deal done with Deng and worry about Gordon later.

JordansBulls
07-17-2008, 05:27 PM
There are a lot of non-superstar players making close to 10 million or more a year. Here are players who aren't even All-Stars making more than that clip.

Hinrich, Hughes, Bibby, Dampier, Terry, Kenyon Martin, Nene, Adonal Foyle, Al Harrington, Bobby Simmons, Ben Wallace, Lamar Odom, Wally Szczerbiak, Ilgauskas, Jason Richardson, Mike Miller, Kaman, Mobley, Zach Randoph, Curry, Crawford, Q. Richardson, Antoine Walker, Raef LaFrentz, Dalembert, Andre Miller, Troy Murphy, Mike Dunleavy, Tyson Chandler, Stojakavic, Boris Diaw, Redd, R. Jefferson, Andre Kirilenko, Brad Miller, Kevin Martin.


That's what I am saying, I don't think a nonsuperstar should get 10 million a year.

kozelkid
07-17-2008, 05:30 PM
That's what I am saying, I don't think a nonsuperstar should get 10 million a year.

but what he is saying is that it's ridiculous to expect that cause market isnt like that whether you like it or not. market, unfortunately inflated, and nowadays if you dont pay 10mil for an above average, non-superstar player, chances are your team wotn go very far unfortunately.

Vincent
07-17-2008, 05:34 PM
That's what I am saying, I don't think a nonsuperstar should get 10 million a year.

Then you're going to have a vicious cycle of developing your players, and then letting them walk, and then lottery again, and having no young free agents interested in dealing with you.

Putting you in the lottery, which will cause you to draft players, develop them, and then let them walk.

Horrible concept.