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Frank_003
07-03-2008, 06:38 PM
I know this is just the very beginning of our summer-long coverage of this total non-event, however it is a big day, especially because it is right before the July 4th weekend, historically a huge free agent signing and deal making few days of the year in the NBA. So, as we get ready to watch NOTHING HAPPEN in the next few days, we should think about somethings that WON'T happen, and maybe we can think about why or think up some new ideas -- in the end, we can always say they made the right move by making no moves... even though we could probably improve the team with a few tweaks, there's just no doubt.

1. NO Corey Maggette (are you kidding me)
2. No Gerald Wallace
3. No Ron Artest
4. No James Posey
5. No Odom trade
6. No new PG
7. No Farmar trade
8. No Walton trade

and special news update:

No extension to Bynum
No new contract offers to Sasha or Turiaf, and no matching of any
contract offers from other teams.

Also, if they even get any offers, there will be NO negotiation of any sign
and trade.

More updates coming soon :)

LAStory
07-03-2008, 06:44 PM
It takes time to sign other players. They have to discuss the options before just doing something. Did you expect him to resign sasha and ronny in day 1?

Tymathee
07-03-2008, 08:30 PM
omg only two things have happened in the whole of the NBA. Baron has agreed (verbally) to sign with clippers and Chris Paul got an extension. No other teams's free agents have signed, there haven't been any trades since the draft. calm down dude wow. Magette's going to try and get as much money as he can he doesn't want to sign the MLE he thinks he's a star and tell me, why do we need Maggette again? why would he want to be 2nd or 3rd fiddle?

oscarescoe
07-03-2008, 11:11 PM
If we should happen to sign Sasha and Turiaf that will give us a full squad a total of 15 players. Let's say we stick with that. We have Fisher, Kobe, Gasol, Bynum, Farmar, Sasha, Vlad, Luke, and Ronny signed to extended contracts (2 years +). That means that at the trading deadline in February we would have 6 players with expiring contracts. This could be Viewed as a positive. If w re playing well, we trade for assets in order to shore up our weaknesses. If Odom isn't jelling with the way were using him he's expandable, same with the others. I'm sure there will be a team with a big contract that will try to get rid of it. I.E. Kidd, Shaq, Gasol. That's when you can package a Lamar Walton; Lamar, Radmanovic and Bring back a solid SF. For example (Josh Howard, Carmelo, Kirilenko, and etc. And if our season is taking a ****ter then we can always set ourselves up for the future. The biggest point is flexibility.

LakeRBaller007
07-03-2008, 11:14 PM
Did someone drop you in the ****ing head OP?

lakers4sho
07-03-2008, 11:20 PM
I know this is just the very beginning of our summer-long coverage of this total non-event, however it is a big day, especially because it is right before the July 4th weekend, historically a huge free agent signing and deal making few days of the year in the NBA. So, as we get ready to watch NOTHING HAPPEN in the next few days, we should think about somethings that WON'T happen, and maybe we can think about why or think up some new ideas -- in the end, we can always say they made the right move by making no moves... even though we could probably improve the team with a few tweaks, there's just no doubt.

1. NO Corey Maggette (are you kidding me)
2. No Gerald Wallace
3. No Ron Artest
4. No James Posey
5. No Odom trade
6. No new PG
7. No Farmar trade
8. No Walton trade

and special news update:

No extension to Bynum
No new contract offers to Sasha or Turiaf, and no matching of any
contract offers from other teams.

Also, if they even get any offers, there will be NO negotiation of any sign
and trade.

More updates coming soon :)

I've been noticing that most of the threads/posts you make seem to be about bashing Mitch Kupchak. Maybe you don't know this, but free agents can't be signed until July 9.

Frank_003
07-03-2008, 11:34 PM
If we should happen to sign Sasha and Turiaf that will give us a full squad a total of 15 players. Let's say we stick with that. We have Fisher, Kobe, Gasol, Bynum, Farmar, Sasha, Vlad, Luke, and Ronny signed to extended contracts (2 years +). That means that at the trading deadline in February we would have 6 players with expiring contracts. This could be Viewed as a positive. If w re playing well, we trade for assets in order to shore up our weaknesses. If Odom isn't jelling with the way were using him he's expandable, same with the others. I'm sure there will be a team with a big contract that will try to get rid of it. I.E. Kidd, Shaq, Gasol. That's when you can package a Lamar Walton; Lamar, Radmanovic and Bring back a solid SF. For example (Josh Howard, Carmelo, Kirilenko, and etc. And if our season is taking a ****ter then we can always set ourselves up for the future. The biggest point is flexibility.

that's cool. by doing nothing, we have ultimate flexibility, to either do something or nothing again in the future. we can always imagine that we can do all these other moves, in the future, but never actually take the plunge and try to make some trades, or discover that many of the "valuable pieces" are virutally worthless as trade bait

Frank_003
07-03-2008, 11:44 PM
I've been noticing that most of the threads/posts you make seem to be about bashing Mitch Kupchak. Maybe you don't know this, but free agents can't be signed until July 9.

yeah I just want to get in on the ground floor of the summer "bash Mitch" bandwagon.

having imploded during the finals... and exhausted from the refereeing to the point I just don't want to talk about it (you win, David Stern), I've finally emerged from my funk to realize that the Lakers were doing it all playoffs with

1. Kobe - Gasol - Fisher - Odom, in that order

2. extremely shaky guard play from Farmar and Sasha

3. extremely shaky, borderline worthless, forward play from Radmanovich, Walton and Turiaf

4. Not much else

I mean, who really cares if we re-sign Sasha or Turiaf? WHo really gives a crap if Houston offers Sasha $30M? But could we do some kind of a sign and trade or something... doubt it. Could we do ANYTHING? doubt it.

I only mentioned Maggette / Wallace / Artest cause I glanced at the forum and see one post after another about how these guys "might become Lakers"

I mean, fine, I feel the backlash. I am the negative jerk. How about, we continue this conversation on "Day 29" or "Day 59" or whatever, because I just feel that the philosophy of the team is to go slooooooowwwllly and develop players and that all these low low first rounders and mid second rounders that make up 3/4 of the team are somehow gonna get it done.

I really think we should just get some athletic, one dimensional type guys
how about a Kyle Korver to knock some threes? How about a Jumaine Jones to defend and be athletic? Kurt thomas to be big and defend? and some young badass rebounder how about?

Lakers are paper-thin up front ---- weak weak weak weak. Freakin Gasol shouldn't be the strongest player in your frontcourt. He's a finesse player.
All those other dudes are just worthless. [end rant]

King_ar15
07-04-2008, 12:35 AM
you got to be patient with Corey... Seems Like E. Brand is deciding between the Warriors and Clips... He Chooses the Clips Corey will go to GS... if he doesn't go to GS.. Then expect every team to throw mid levels at Corey!!

Mitch you better keep ya eyes open...

lakers4sho
07-04-2008, 12:38 AM
Corey Maggette at 6'6" is a little short for an SF IMO. But I guess he's big and buff enough to handle bigger SFs such as Pierce.

x_notorious
07-04-2008, 12:42 AM
Corey Maggette at 6'6" is a little short for an SF IMO. But I guess he's big and buff enough to handle bigger SFs such as Pierce.

If I had to choose between C.M or Sasha to give the full MLE, I would give it to C.M hands down. C.M isn't known to be a defender, but is a slasher and good rebounder. He also can shoot well from downtown at 38%.

Other teams are offering him MLE as well, so I see no reason why the Lakers shouldn't go after him as well with the same offer. Kobe and himself are known to be good buddies as well. It might sound weird for C.M or Odom to come of the bench, but that would incredibly give the Lakers a boost.

lakers4sho
07-04-2008, 12:45 AM
If I had to choose between C.M or Sasha to give the full MLE, I would give it to C.M hands down. C.M isn't known to be a defender, but is a slasher and good rebounder. He also can shoot well from downtown at 38%.

Other teams are offering him MLE as well, so I see no reason why the Lakers shouldn't go after him as well with the same offer. Kobe and himself are known to be good buddies as well. It might sound weird for C.M or Odom to come of the bench, but that would incredibly give the Lakers a boost.

We don't need to use the actual MLE on Sasha b/c we own his Bird Rights, so we can resign him for any amount even if we're over the cap. Which means we can sign Corey Maggette using the MLE and resign Sasha separately w/o needing to use the MLE.

Iron24th
07-04-2008, 01:58 AM
We don't need to use the actual MLE on Sasha b/c we own his Bird Rights, so we can resign him for any amount even if we're over the cap. Which means we can sign Corey Maggette using the MLE and resign Sasha separately w/o needing to use the MLE.

It's pretty good if we can do that.

plpfctn
07-04-2008, 02:41 AM
i'm praying to every god of every religion that we trade for ron artest and some high priced scrub for lamar odom. it's realistic and it'll bring the trophy back home.

dsonLAL24
07-04-2008, 02:47 AM
I know this is just the very beginning of our summer-long coverage of this total non-event, however it is a big day, especially because it is right before the July 4th weekend, historically a huge free agent signing and deal making few days of the year in the NBA. So, as we get ready to watch NOTHING HAPPEN in the next few days, we should think about somethings that WON'T happen, and maybe we can think about why or think up some new ideas -- in the end, we can always say they made the right move by making no moves... even though we could probably improve the team with a few tweaks, there's just no doubt.

1. NO Corey Maggette (are you kidding me)
2. No Gerald Wallace
3. No Ron Artest
4. No James Posey
5. No Odom trade
6. No new PG
7. No Farmar trade
8. No Walton trade

and special news update:

No extension to Bynum
No new contract offers to Sasha or Turiaf, and no matching of any
contract offers from other teams.

Also, if they even get any offers, there will be NO negotiation of any sign
and trade.

More updates coming soon :)

i would'nt say he's doing nothing. When we all thought he was sitting around doing nothing he makes the biggest trade last season bringing in Pau Gasol OUT OF NOWHERE there were no rumors nothing and it happened quietly. I've learned my lesson from last year and i have trust in Mitch.

vblewis
07-04-2008, 03:21 AM
I know this is just the very beginning of our summer-long coverage of this total non-event, however it is a big day, especially because it is right before the July 4th weekend, historically a huge free agent signing and deal making few days of the year in the NBA. So, as we get ready to watch NOTHING HAPPEN in the next few days, we should think about somethings that WON'T happen, and maybe we can think about why or think up some new ideas -- in the end, we can always say they made the right move by making no moves... even though we could probably improve the team with a few tweaks, there's just no doubt.

1. NO Corey Maggette (are you kidding me)
2. No Gerald Wallace
3. No Ron Artest
4. No James Posey
5. No Odom trade
6. No new PG
7. No Farmar trade
8. No Walton trade

and special news update:

No extension to Bynum
No new contract offers to Sasha or Turiaf, and no matching of any
contract offers from other teams.

Also, if they even get any offers, there will be NO negotiation of any sign
and trade.

More updates coming soon :)

Mitch did say that he would not be a big player in FA due to cap restraints.

Iceman_9
07-04-2008, 05:50 AM
patience is a virtue.. I feel that a deal is in the works.. This organization is so proud that it doesnt want to settle for another runnerup finish..

lakers4sho
07-04-2008, 01:58 PM
It's only been 4 days and you're already complaining. That's why they've got the whole summer to do things and figure stuff out. Relax.

Frank_003
07-05-2008, 11:54 PM
It's only been 4 days and you're already complaining. That's why they've got the whole summer to do things and figure stuff out. Relax.


Five days now and counting. Within the next two weeks there won't be any really good free agents left (actually by July 10 most likely), and all the sign and trade scenarios will be played out.

The point is, if something was gonna happen, it would've been planned, and then swiftly executed.

The fact that it is just "let's relax the whole summer and figure stuff out" tells you right away that nothing is happening, or will happen. Not saying that's bad necessarily... just stating the fact.

btw people here are now saying "Hinrich" and "vince carter". Ummmm, won't happen, and won't happen.

Tragic Johnson
07-06-2008, 01:23 AM
If we should happen to sign Sasha and Turiaf that will give us a full squad a total of 15 players. Let's say we stick with that. We have Fisher, Kobe, Gasol, Bynum, Farmar, Sasha, Vlad, Luke, and Ronny signed to extended contracts (2 years +). That means that at the trading deadline in February we would have 6 players with expiring contracts. This could be Viewed as a positive. If w re playing well, we trade for assets in order to shore up our weaknesses. If Odom isn't jelling with the way were using him he's expandable, same with the others. I'm sure there will be a team with a big contract that will try to get rid of it. I.E. Kidd, Shaq, Gasol. That's when you can package a Lamar Walton; Lamar, Radmanovic and Bring back a solid SF. For example (Josh Howard, Carmelo, Kirilenko, and etc. And if our season is taking a ****ter then we can always set ourselves up for the future. The biggest point is flexibility.

I agree with most of what you said. However, I think there's something extremely flawed in your point. By the time February rolls around, the Lakers could be doing extremely well and therefore giving people a false sense of security (like they did in the latter part of the season and the into most of the playoffs last season). If the Lakers do well in the regular season, there's no way people should see that as an indicator of what will happen in the Finals. As a matter of fact, the two regular season games against Boston last season were a clear foretelling of the Finals. They figured out how to defend Kobe and Perkins shined against us. People cried about how those regular season games meant nothing because Gasol wasn't around, yet they did. I say, next season, when the Lakers and Celtics meet in the regular season (with both Bynum and Gasol playing) keep and eye out, because it might be a clear indicator of things to come.

Tragic Johnson
07-06-2008, 01:32 AM
yeah I just want to get in on the ground floor of the summer "bash Mitch" bandwagon.

having imploded during the finals... and exhausted from the refereeing to the point I just don't want to talk about it (you win, David Stern), I've finally emerged from my funk to realize that the Lakers were doing it all playoffs with

1. Kobe - Gasol - Fisher - Odom, in that order

2. extremely shaky guard play from Farmar and Sasha

3. extremely shaky, borderline worthless, forward play from Radmanovich, Walton and Turiaf

4. Not much else

I mean, who really cares if we re-sign Sasha or Turiaf? WHo really gives a crap if Houston offers Sasha $30M? But could we do some kind of a sign and trade or something... doubt it. Could we do ANYTHING? doubt it.

I only mentioned Maggette / Wallace / Artest cause I glanced at the forum and see one post after another about how these guys "might become Lakers"

I mean, fine, I feel the backlash. I am the negative jerk. How about, we continue this conversation on "Day 29" or "Day 59" or whatever, because I just feel that the philosophy of the team is to go slooooooowwwllly and develop players and that all these low low first rounders and mid second rounders that make up 3/4 of the team are somehow gonna get it done.

I really think we should just get some athletic, one dimensional type guys
how about a Kyle Korver to knock some threes? How about a Jumaine Jones to defend and be athletic? Kurt thomas to be big and defend? and some young badass rebounder how about?

Lakers are paper-thin up front ---- weak weak weak weak. Freakin Gasol shouldn't be the strongest player in your frontcourt. He's a finesse player.
All those other dudes are just worthless. [end rant]

I gotta give you huge props for thinking outside the box. :up: Instead of coming up with yet another, self admitted, trade scenario that could NEVER happen (and therefore wasting page after page of needless arguing), you stuck your neck out and brought a different point to the table. I know from personal experience that a lot of people here, completely void of the ability to think critically, take the easy way out by just accusing you of being negative. Some just can't handle others thinking differently. If the Lakers management of the 1980's shared this do nothing attitude, so common among posters here, they would have never traded for Mychal Thompson in 1987 and therefore assuring the first back to back championships in the NBA for almost two decades and eventually securing the Lakers place in history as the team of the 80's.

Keep up the great posts. :cheers:

LA_Raiders
07-06-2008, 03:00 AM
Cupcake said that it was going to be a quiet offseason....

Why are you guys surprised he aint doing ****???

Tragic Johnson
07-06-2008, 03:55 AM
Cupcake said that it was going to be a quiet offseason....

Why are you guys surprised he aint doing ****???

Four words:

We lost the finals!

John408
07-06-2008, 04:07 AM
I dislike Vujacic, Turiaf,Radmanovic, and Walton! Pls do not resign the first two!

Vujacic shoots too many three even when he is off and cannot guard anythng

Turiaf shoots too many 20 footers and misses most of them.

Radmanovic is making too much money. Makes starting roster money and he doesnt even average 10 pts per game

Walton is slow and cannot make his layups. I hate his behind the back pass.

Trade two or three of these guys and try to get Artest while still trying to keep Odom.

This may work.

Frank_003
07-06-2008, 04:09 AM
I gotta give you huge props for thinking outside the box. :up: Instead of coming up with yet another, self admitted, trade scenario that could NEVER happen (and therefore wasting page after page of needless arguing), you stuck your neck out and brought a different point to the table. I know from personal experience that a lot of people here, completely void of the ability to think critically, take the easy way out by just accusing you of being negative. Some just can't handle others thinking differently. If the Lakers management of the 1980's shared this do nothing attitude, so common among posters here, they would have never traded for Mychal Thompson in 1987 and therefore assuring the first back to back championships in the NBA for almost two decades and eventually securing the Lakers place in history as the team of the 80's.

Keep up the great posts. :cheers:


Thanks for the support man. Although it did kind of sound like "I don't care what everybody else thinks about you, I think you're ok." *hah hah*

yah I guess I am being slightly antagonistic with this thread... and maybe I should just chill. The basic fact was that I was REALLY messed up by the way the Lakers lost... I would almost have preferred that they lost a close series to the Spurs or the Hornets.

The complete crush by the Celtics in the critical games of the series... it was so hard for me to watch that happen. I mean, I could see it coming... I could see that it was like an all-star team of players that could defeat Kobe...
I mean Allen, Garnett and Pierce, each by themselves, are each playes who could duel Kobe in a game or a series. All three at once... it was just brutal.
Gasol ended up looking like a third option... and Odom like Walton... Walton
turned into mbenga... Farmar turned into a 10 day NBDL player... it was just gross. And the officiating was so stupid, and Stern... just so f'ing gross

But my point is, there's no way I can go into this offseason on a high note.
That was the sickest, ugliest, grossest Laker defeat I've ever seen in the 30 years I've been watching the Lakers. It doesn't make it feel any better that it was in "The Finals" or that they got posterized by a supposedly (now) legendary Celtics team. Face it.

This was worse than the 84 series with the james worthy turnover, the mchale tackle and all the lucky shots. This was bad. I mean, if you get in a bad fight, you better win, or it's gonna be bad. And the Lakers lost that game SO badly, came apart SO badly, game 6 losing by 40+ points... I mean, it really could've been 60-70 points for all intents and purposes if they had just poured it on...

I'm just tired of the mediocre front-court players. yes we could've used Kwame brown. but geez. I can't watch Walton-Turiaf-Farmar-Sasha-Mihm-Radmanovich-Odom goof around out there anymore trying to "discover their potential". I've totally had it with the junior league guys. Enough of this crap.

Seriously, honestly, watching the finals, and so many other times... I just feel that those guys can't do ONE THING RIGHT. I mean, Odom can't even make a wide open layup, at the most crucial moments. He misses again and again and again and again... each miss leading to a 4 or 5 point turnaround.

Turiaf has got no offensive move at all. He catches the ball, just throws it or something... if it goes in it is complete luck.

Walton just can't do ANYTHING out there, it looks like he's just trying to get rid of the ball before he turns it over any second.

Sasha just throws up one brick after another. I mean, if that dude could actually SHOOT, like a Peja, a Deron, a Bibby, a Quentin Richardson for peetes sake... it would change the entire series. But he's just throwing bricks man.

And Farmar can't even seem to bring the ball upcourt without a turnover. I mean forget about "faciliating" or "playmaking" how about just "not turnover making" I'd be happy enough with.

I mean after that series I even have criticisms of Kobe but I won't say them because it's impossible for me to know how difficult it was out there or what he was trying to do. He is teh best so he gets benefit of the doubt... but it was hard to be a Kobe worshipper watching game 6.

So YES!!! Lakers need to make a move, and make a BIG MOVE this summer, I really think so. I don't think this is the time to get complacent. Lakers got PWNED this year. That's all I remember, worst loss in 30 years... worst finals loss EVER... no glory... sucked ***... that's what I think

So, let's see... I'm hoping they do something but I will keep ratcheting this up as the summer progresses... and I don't care if people are like "Mmmmmmmm Mitch said it would be a slow summer".

Tragic Johnson
07-06-2008, 04:35 AM
But my point is, there's no way I can go into this offseason on a high note.
That was the sickest, ugliest, grossest Laker defeat I've ever seen in the 30 years I've been watching the Lakers. It doesn't make it feel any better that it was in "The Finals" or that they got posterized by a supposedly (now) legendary Celtics team. Face it.

I guess it all depends on how you see it. Two years ago, so many people around here took the Lakers lost to the Suns in a "positive" way and decided to see that "We were one rebound away". Where, according to me, the obvious problem was that we blew a 3 to 1 lead. So what happened the next year? We got eliminated in 5 games instead of 7.

So, forward to now, and you have a whole bunch of mindless robots seeing this as "we were two wins away form the title" when in fact, the obvious issue is that, out of our four losses in the Finals, the last two were historically bad. We lost the biggest lead in NBA Finals history and we lost by the biggest margin in NBA Finals history. Yet, so many mindless morons around here seem to think that Bynum is going to fix everything, completely forgetting that Perkins owned Bynum's :moon: in their regular season meetings. Yeah, the best we can do is nothing. :rolleyes: :pity:

gagnefan38
07-06-2008, 11:03 AM
Four words:

We lost the finals!

To a team with a extremely good defense and that is simply an effort by product. I have yet to see in most of the posts I read where fans of the Lakers have said flat out Boston played better defense and deserved to win. We need to focus on the defensive end period end of story and the Lakers have a guy who we were missing vs. Boston that could have helped in that regard. I personally am all for tweaking not buying into all the FA frenzy and rumor mongering. Mitch has stuck to a plan all along and I for one am not going to heap undue criticism of a guy who put this current team together.

If all last season we had a knee jerk reaction to the turmoil in LA last summer we wouldn't have had the opportunity to be frustrated at losing to Boston. Kobe could have been gone, LO and Druw could have been sent to Jersey or Indiana for Kidd or JO. While I do commend Frank on his thinking outside the box it's way to premature (4 days after July 1) to post such a thread whose inference is that the Lakers won't do anything at all this offseason. Rumors 70% are just flat out wrong and the product of some fantasy of writers and so called "insiders" and fans. Remember the only team that has made an actual signing are the Clippers and frankly they are the Clippers enough said.

gagnefan38
07-06-2008, 11:13 AM
I guess it all depends on how you see it. Two years ago, so many people around here took the Lakers lost to the Suns in a "positive" way and decided to see that "We were one rebound away". Where, according to me, the obvious problem was that we blew a 3 to 1 lead. So what happened the next year? We got eliminated in 5 games instead of 7.

So, forward to now, and you have a whole bunch of mindless robots seeing this as "we were two wins away form the title" when in fact, the obvious issue is that, out of our four losses in the Finals, the last two were historically bad. We lost the biggest lead in NBA Finals history and we lost by the biggest margin in NBA Finals history. Yet, so many mindless morons around here seem to think that Bynum is going to fix everything, completely forgetting that Perkins owned Bynum's :moon: in their regular season meetings. Yeah, the best we can do is nothing. :rolleyes: :pity:

Perkins did own Druw no doubt but that was pre Pau and I'd like to see what this team has with Druw and how much of a factor was Perkins during the series? As far as being mindless morons I seem to recall alot of mindless morons not necessarily you wanted his Druw's arse shipped out. In regards to how they lost it was EXTREMELY frustrating I know but a losss by any other name is just that a loss. What it showed is that our front line was soft and with Druw it becomes better not automatically but we haven't found out how good it can potentially be without seeing them play together. As far as doing nothing it's July 6th for crying out loud and frankly the names besides Artest who has his own issues, don't play the kind of defense we NEED.

Frank_003
07-06-2008, 07:33 PM
Perkins did own Druw no doubt but that was pre Pau and I'd like to see what this team has with Druw and how much of a factor was Perkins during the series? As far as being mindless morons I seem to recall alot of mindless morons not necessarily you wanted his Druw's arse shipped out. In regards to how they lost it was EXTREMELY frustrating I know but a losss by any other name is just that a loss. What it showed is that our front line was soft and with Druw it becomes better not automatically but we haven't found out how good it can potentially be without seeing them play together. As far as doing nothing it's July 6th for crying out loud and frankly the names besides Artest who has his own issues, don't play the kind of defense we NEED.


Druw is still a huge question mark. To me, he is still like the big guy in boot camp in "Full Metal Jacket', BEFORE he becomes all crazed and hard. Will he ever become that "born again hard" guy who suddenly starts outperforming everyone and doing everything better than everyone? Who knows. Right now, we as fans, and apparently the coaches also, are just so overwhelmingly grateful when he scores 12 points and gets a few blocks.

Why? because we don't have that much expectation of him. So when he scores 20 points we are ecstatic. But that is MILE AND MILES from being a "next Shaq" or somebody like that, whom you could depend your entire franchise on.

And "D"... I mean, moving your feet and switching off or whatever is all good... but who on the Lakers, besides Kobe and (actually) Odom, can even play real major-league D? Hmmmmm? Most of the guys, when push comes to shove, are too small, too slow, too weak, to passive, to really get up there to the rim and smack down some shots, to really contest.

Uhhhhh, how many steals did Sasha have in the Finals? As compared to Rajon Rondo, how many steals he have?

How many blocks Turiaf have, compared to Perkins or Garnett? If I'm not mistaken Turiaf had zero.

How about Walton? How many steals and blocks did he have? Do they give out some kind of "defensive assists" that Walton could take credit for? Like
a really good switch off on a pick and roll or something, where he didn't get totallly pwned?

Farmar, same question. Steals? Blocks? Intimidation?

I mean, you wanna get real? Let's get real. You can't win the NBA title with your defense, if you are playing boys against men. Either these guys just decide they are men and starting doing it, or... I mean, look. We should judge them the way we judge players around the league. Would you TRADE for a Luke Walton or a Jordan Farmar right now? If they were free agents, would you be like "we gotta get Farmar"? Would there be a "Luke Walton might become a Laker" thread?

How about, if Luke signed with the Spurs. Would that worry you? Or would it just be like *whatever*. It makes no difference, right? It's because none of those guys are difference makers...

and PLEASE don't say that they can contribute by playing defense or something...

btw it's day 6 now...

gagnefan38
07-06-2008, 08:11 PM
Druw is still a huge question mark. To me, he is still like the big guy in boot camp in "Full Metal Jacket', BEFORE he becomes all crazed and hard. Will he ever become that "born again hard" guy who suddenly starts outperforming everyone and doing everything better than everyone? Who knows. Right now, we as fans, and apparently the coaches also, are just so overwhelmingly grateful when he scores 12 points and gets a few blocks.

Why? because we don't have that much expectation of him. So when he scores 20 points we are ecstatic. But that is MILE AND MILES from being a "next Shaq" or somebody like that, whom you could depend your entire franchise on.

And "D"... I mean, moving your feet and switching off or whatever is all good... but who on the Lakers, besides Kobe and (actually) Odom, can even play real major-league D? Hmmmmm? Most of the guys, when push comes to shove, are too small, too slow, too weak, to passive, to really get up there to the rim and smack down some shots, to really contest.

Uhhhhh, how many steals did Sasha have in the Finals? As compared to Rajon Rondo, how many steals he have?

How many blocks Turiaf have, compared to Perkins or Garnett? If I'm not mistaken Turiaf had zero.

How about Walton? How many steals and blocks did he have? Do they give out some kind of "defensive assists" that Walton could take credit for? Like
a really good switch off on a pick and roll or something, where he didn't get totallly pwned?

Farmar, same question. Steals? Blocks? Intimidation?

I mean, you wanna get real? Let's get real. You can't win the NBA title with your defense, if you are playing boys against men. Either these guys just decide they are men and starting doing it, or... I mean, look. We should judge them the way we judge players around the league. Would you TRADE for a Luke Walton or a Jordan Farmar right now? If they were free agents, would you be like "we gotta get Farmar"? Would there be a "Luke Walton might become a Laker" thread?

How about, if Luke signed with the Spurs. Would that worry you? Or would it just be like *whatever*. It makes no difference, right? It's because none of those guys are difference makers...

and PLEASE don't say that they can contribute by playing defense or something...

btw it's day 6 now...

Druw is a question mark with his knee for sure but he hasn't been given the opportunity to show his health which is the main point, it's too early. Have you forgotten this Laker team has the best record in the west? In your post you mention alot of Laker players who underperformed in the finals yet no credit is given to the Celtics (I nearly barfed writing that). Boston was a TEAM not only 4 players and they played TEAM defense something the Lakers have shown flashes of and it is well known defense is just as much about effort as talent. These are also the same players that got through the same WC teams to get to the finals, I don't remember complaints about them during that time only after that all too brief series.

IMHO I believe we are 1 player "shut down" defender away and a concerted effort to emphasize defense from now until the season. On your player evaluation I don't recall Turiaf playing significant minutes during the finals which was puzzling. Sasha has never been known as a steal guy and I don't think the series hinged on that stat. Walton is slow and will never be a great defender even IF he emphasized it but, here we go he plays a part in the team dynamic. Pau whom you did not mention was a disappointment but in his defense he was playing out of postion and would never be considered an intimidator like Druw has the potentional to be. I also was puzzled on why Trevor who looked brilliant during that Laker run in what game I don't recall, where was he? As much as the players lost this finals, the coaches had plenty of culpability as well. One more important factor in my mind is their age, these guys are still young enough to become better professionals and to base their future on 1 series is unfair.

Bottomline give the organization a chance they earned it.

lalakobe24
07-06-2008, 08:14 PM
lol mitch dont got balls thats why

hes more like the nerdy guy who does something once in a while if yu poke him enough

rhensley3
07-06-2008, 09:27 PM
how many critics were hailing mitch for the gasol for brown trade? mitch saw the same game 6 we saw, and i'm sure he is aware of our weaknesses. although it is our job to complain, it is HIS job to fix it! phil's job to evaluate the talent and compatability of available players, and dr buss' job to approve the expense. walton and radmanovic's contracts are indeed head-scratchers. they may be great guys, but their cap figures make it hard to sign real talent. everybody says they have the answer, but sometimes the simplest is the correct one. "CAN we play better defense" and "has anybody TRIED to coach a more effective defensive scheme" are good questions i havent heard answered by someone within the organization. this is a puzzle that will take some time to answer. i have to trust that mitch has his eyes on the ball. what else CAN we do?

btw, interesting sig, tragic.

Lakersfan2483
07-06-2008, 09:49 PM
I know this is just the very beginning of our summer-long coverage of this total non-event, however it is a big day, especially because it is right before the July 4th weekend, historically a huge free agent signing and deal making few days of the year in the NBA. So, as we get ready to watch NOTHING HAPPEN in the next few days, we should think about somethings that WON'T happen, and maybe we can think about why or think up some new ideas -- in the end, we can always say they made the right move by making no moves... even though we could probably improve the team with a few tweaks, there's just no doubt.


1. NO Corey Maggette (are you kidding me)
2. No Gerald Wallace
3. No Ron Artest
4. No James Posey
5. No Odom trade
6. No new PG
7. No Farmar trade
8. No Walton trade

and special news update:

No extension to Bynum
No new contract offers to Sasha or Turiaf, and no matching of any
contract offers from other teams.

Also, if they even get any offers, there will be NO negotiation of any sign
and trade.

More updates coming soon :)

huh????

Frank_003
07-06-2008, 10:20 PM
Druw is a question mark with his knee for sure but he hasn't been given the opportunity to show his health which is the main point, it's too early. Have you forgotten this Laker team has the best record in the west? In your post you mention alot of Laker players who underperformed in the finals yet no credit is given to the Celtics (I nearly barfed writing that). Boston was a TEAM not only 4 players and they played TEAM defense something the Lakers have shown flashes of and it is well known defense is just as much about effort as talent. These are also the same players that got through the same WC teams to get to the finals, I don't remember complaints about them during that time only after that all too brief series.

IMHO I believe we are 1 player "shut down" defender away and a concerted effort to emphasize defense from now until the season. On your player evaluation I don't recall Turiaf playing significant minutes during the finals which was puzzling. Sasha has never been known as a steal guy and I don't think the series hinged on that stat. Walton is slow and will never be a great defender even IF he emphasized it but, here we go he plays a part in the team dynamic. Pau whom you did not mention was a disappointment but in his defense he was playing out of postion and would never be considered an intimidator like Druw has the potentional to be. I also was puzzled on why Trevor who looked brilliant during that Laker run in what game I don't recall, where was he? As much as the players lost this finals, the coaches had plenty of culpability as well. One more important factor in my mind is their age, these guys are still young enough to become better professionals and to base their future on 1 series is unfair.

Bottomline give the organization a chance they earned it.


Lakers could just be so much better right now. They've got a LEGENDARY player right now, at the top of his game. One of the best ever.

This team could obviously be so much better than it is right now... look at some of the players who got minutes through the playoffs and finals, and their numbers.

I mean, Barry and Posey would be HUGE upgrades. And just the idea that the Lakers could get a Ron Artest should THRILL the team, just the possibility is so compelling, the team should be working 24-7 just for a chance at that possibility. Can you imagine:

Guards: Kobe, Artest, Fisher, Farmar
Forwards: Odom, Gasol, Posey, Radmanovich
Centers: Bynum, Mbenga

Lakers may have finished best in teh West, but it is deceptive. If they would've lost one or two more games, they could'v been sixth place in the West.

And yes they made the finals, but they looked pretty darn bad a lot of the time getting there. They did NOT look like an unstoppable monster of a team.

And they did play with heart against the Celtics... got jobbed by the refs in game 2... tough assignment. But it actually looked like the Lakers could'v won that series... actually should've won it... but ultimately, they just could'n't get 5 players on the court at one time who could play offense and defense in the Laker system.

yah let's see what they do

gagnefan38
07-06-2008, 10:36 PM
Lakers could just be so much better right now. They've got a LEGENDARY player right now, at the top of his game. One of the best ever.

This team could obviously be so much better than it is right now... look at some of the players who got minutes through the playoffs and finals, and their numbers.

I mean, Barry and Posey would be HUGE upgrades. And just the idea that the Lakers could get a Ron Artest should THRILL the team, just the possibility is so compelling, the team should be working 24-7 just for a chance at that possibility. Can you imagine:

Guards: Kobe, Artest, Fisher, Farmar
Forwards: Odom, Gasol, Posey, Radmanovich
Centers: Bynum, Mbenga

Lakers may have finished best in teh West, but it is deceptive. If they would've lost one or two more games, they could'v been sixth place in the West.

And yes they made the finals, but they looked pretty darn bad a lot of the time getting there. They did NOT look like an unstoppable monster of a team.

And they did play with heart against the Celtics... got jobbed by the refs in game 2... tough assignment. But it actually looked like the Lakers could'v won that series... actually should've won it... but ultimately, they just could'n't get 5 players on the court at one time who could play offense and defense in the Laker system.

yah let's see what they do

:clap: When you really look at the series yes we could have at least taken them to 7 games and it's anyone's series then. I'm glad we can find common ground and I thank you for bringing good analysis to your arguement. I can see that you care as much as I do about this team. :cheers:

Lakersfan2483
07-06-2008, 10:46 PM
:clap: When you really look at the series yes we could have at least taken them to 7 games and it's anyone's series then. I'm glad we can find common ground and I thank you for bringing good analysis to your arguement. I can see that you care as much as I do about this team. :cheers:

The lakers should have forced a game 7 in that series, we let game 4 slip away and that ruined our season, you have to be tougher then that mentally. I was dissapointed with Kobe's play in the finals, he needed to be more aggressive. Gasol looked scared to play out there and Lamar was lost. The bench was nowhere to be found when it mattered. Going to the finals is not guaranteed and the Lakers should have had more intensity and fire and wanted it more, they seemed content just being in the finals.

AllTheWay
07-07-2008, 12:44 PM
I like the arguements for making a big move instead of standing pat....i definatley would not mind having Odom, Sasha, and Turiaf on the team next season, but yeah, upgrades are definatley possible...

I would love Gerald Wallace because of his all-out mentality and great defense. Hes no floor spreader at the 3, but I think the lakers need to worry more about their "D" than "O". He is much more talented than LO and is still younger. The guy plays with heart

I would like corey maggette because he can put up point in bunches and be a floor spreader at the 3. A very good triangle 3, but the problem is defense still

I would like to keep Odom at the 3, or at least try it. If he doesnt do so well like at the beginning of the season, im all for trading him. Im also all for trading him now

I would like Shawn Marion at the 3. Hes a do it all dirty work type of player and solid man to man defender. He can hit an open jumpshot and get you a key stop on the defensive end. He has the ability to spread the floor and is super athletic(but hes 30).

I would love to bring in James Posey as it adds a good defender and floor spacer, as well as a vet who has been there done that

Brent Barry- I would like him to be here, he can hit open Js with consistency and has expirience. Problem here is Defense

All this being said, I still wouldnt mind resigning Sasha and Ronny and keeping Lamar, but upgrades are possible and I would be more than happy if we get one of the aforementioned players

LA_Raiders
07-07-2008, 01:00 PM
I just hope he can trade Puke, Keep Sasha & Turiaff, and bring CM or Posey with the MLE....

That would be an awesome OffSeason...

Tymathee
07-07-2008, 01:10 PM
I just want Luke and Vlad to go personally. I really hate having 4 SF's like this. We need to trade them both to a team that has a bunch of PF's or C's and pick up one that can do both. Mihm isn't the answer, and although i love roni he's just 6'9 (w/ shoes) and is more off a weak side defender than anything

LA_Raiders
07-07-2008, 05:05 PM
I really believe. Cupcake is going to trade at least 1 SF, we have 1 too many...

Odom/Ariza/Vlade/Puke...there is not enought playing time for the 4 to improve...

Tymathee
07-07-2008, 05:29 PM
I really believe. Cupcake is going to trade at least 1 SF, we have 1 too many...

Odom/Ariza/Vlade/Puke...there is not enought playing time for the 4 to improve...

Um, are you kidding? Odom hasn't improved since he came to Miami, basically has same game...Vlad all he WANTS to do is shoot, he can't do anything else, or doesn't want to do anything else, i can't tell cuz i've seen him play really good else where when he's on but if he can't he hit his shot he's totally useless. Luke um, he won't be improve anytime soon, trade him to Boston, make his dad happy lol only person i'm concerned about improving is Ariza, he's the only one with upside.

dyceman
07-07-2008, 06:59 PM
Um, are you kidding? Odom hasn't improved since he came to Miami, basically has same game...Vlad all he WANTS to do is shoot, he can't do anything else, or doesn't want to do anything else, i can't tell cuz i've seen him play really good else where when he's on but if he can't he hit his shot he's totally useless. Luke um, he won't be improve anytime soon, trade him to Boston, make his dad happy lol only person i'm concerned about improving is Ariza, he's the only one with upside.

Agree with you except for the LO part...would love to see the three headed monster at least until the trade deadline-then trade him and his expiring contract if the experiment is a bust. Keep Ariza, jettison Luke and Vlad and send vujacic on his way as well.