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View Full Version : Reinsdorf, Paxson Meet With Deng and Gordon



phlp_bj
07-03-2008, 09:31 AM
Bulls' chairman Jerry Reinsdorf and General Manager John Paxson met Wednesday with Luol Deng and his agent to stress their desire to re-sign the forward, according to The Chicago Tribune.

A similar meeting is scheduled with Ben Gordon on Thursday.

Chicago could extend an offer to Deng as early as Thursday, with only the 76ers, Grizzlies, and Warriors possessing the salary-cap space to extend an offer worth more than the mid-level exception of roughly $6 million.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-080702-luol-deng-chicago-bulls,1,5589099.story

JordansBulls
07-03-2008, 09:32 AM
I would be curious on how long it takes for a deal to happen where both parties agree.

Seventh King
07-03-2008, 09:34 AM
No kidding, I hoping it goes as fast as possible.

rico
07-03-2008, 09:40 AM
yeah i hope deng signs a 4-5 year irght away. as for gordon i know hes gonna want more than hes worth. - i dont want to let him walk and we get nothing so atleast a 1yr deal would be nice so we can use him for trade bait.

the real dose
07-03-2008, 09:48 AM
Forget Deng and Gordon and bring in two free agents there is enough talent out there Deng is overrated and Gordon is too greedy he wont work well with Rose

rico
07-03-2008, 10:44 AM
Forget Deng and Gordon and bring in two free agents there is enough talent out there Deng is overrated and Gordon is too greedy he wont work well with Rose
i opted to steal josh smith ;p, and if we had the cash for it try to buy out brand, but gsw dropped a 90-100 mil 5 yr deal on him (one site said 90 the other said 100) so yeah i dont see that happening. and i dunno if we can get charlotte to trade okafor ;/

JordansBulls
07-03-2008, 11:02 AM
Can we actually go after Josh Smith?

If so then why not just sign Josh and Deng and let Gordon go?

PG Rose/Hinrich
SG Deng/Thabo/Hughes
SF Smith/Nocioni
PF Gooden/Tyrus
C Noah/Gray

ChitownbullsBG7
07-03-2008, 11:08 AM
We dont have cap space. All we have to give is the MLE.

phlp_bj
07-03-2008, 11:46 AM
if we release gordon we will have cap space

i still say trade hinrich for camby and atkins

then sign a vet with the mid-level exception

roster:

rose, atkins
sefolosha, hughes, brown
deng, nocioni, nichols
gooden, tyrus, simmons
camby, noah, gray

ChitownbullsBG7
07-03-2008, 12:03 PM
If we let Gordon walk, it still doesnt give us 11+mil to sign Josh Smith.

Seventh King
07-03-2008, 12:19 PM
Forget Deng and Gordon and bring in two free agents there is enough talent out there Deng is overrated and Gordon is too greedy he wont work well with Rose

I suppose you want to sign and trade them both for Posey?

JordansBulls
07-03-2008, 12:44 PM
I suppose you want to sign and trade them both for Posey?

Having Posey would be almost as bad as having Starks or Jalen Rose on this team. Which we actually did.

Derrick_Rose
07-03-2008, 12:45 PM
Sign Deng to a long term deal, Gordon to a 1 year deal.

danimal
07-03-2008, 12:46 PM
If GSW fails to land a big fish fish with their newly aquired cap space, they can take a bigger contract back in a trade (i.e. Kirk Hinrich), while sending back a smaller contract to the bulls, in this case.

That along with renouncing Deng and Gordon (which I'm not sure is possible at this point), would give them cap space to negotiate with Smith.

Too many balls to juggle on that one and probably not possible anyways.

keshmoney
07-03-2008, 01:18 PM
So much love for Luol Deng. I don't understand why people are willing to give him 6/60. He has not proven anything in his career. He might be a 3rd option at best on a team. Trade him!!!

Blue Tiger
07-03-2008, 02:07 PM
Just hurry up and sign both of them up so that issue can be out of the way.

DamnGoat
07-03-2008, 02:54 PM
Can we actually go after Josh Smith?

If so then why not just sign Josh and Deng and let Gordon go?

PG Rose/Hinrich
SG Deng/Thabo/Hughes
SF Smith/Nocioni
PF Gooden/Tyrus
C Noah/Gray
I'll never understand why people think Deng can play SG.

He's not athletic enough and though he'd create some match up problems offensively, he'd be a liability defensively.

BullsNumber1Fan
07-03-2008, 03:13 PM
Can we actually go after Josh Smith?

If so then why not just sign Josh and Deng and let Gordon go?

PG Rose/Hinrich
SG Deng/Thabo/Hughes
SF Smith/Nocioni
PF Gooden/Tyrus
C Noah/Gray

I said the SAME EXACT thing in a different thread. You now how dynamic this team would be in 2-3 years.:speechless: I would say another 6 titles in 8years.:D

BullsNumber1Fan
07-03-2008, 03:14 PM
I'll never understand why people think Deng can play SG.

He's not athletic enough and though he'd create some match up problems offensively, he'd be a liability defensively.

On defense, if the guy gets past Deng, then they'll run into Smith, Tyrus, Noah and wouldn't score. Problem solved!:D

Bulls#1
07-03-2008, 03:33 PM
Dude are you crazy, deng is due for a good year, and since we have a pg in rose , rose is going to make deng a better player. "GET OUT OF THIS THREAD YOU FAIR WEATHER FAN"



So much love for Luol Deng. I don't understand why people are willing to give him 6/60. He has not proven anything in his career. He might be a 3rd option at best on a team. Trade him!!!

Starkonian
07-03-2008, 03:48 PM
^ I agree. I still think Deng is a keeper. Offer Deng low $50 mil contract and mid to low $40 mil with production incentives for Gordon. If Gordon won't accept a 6th man, spot up shooting role for those bucks then trade him this year.

kozelkid
07-03-2008, 03:53 PM
So much love for Luol Deng. I don't understand why people are willing to give him 6/60. He has not proven anything in his career. He might be a 3rd option at best on a team. Trade him!!!

and why isnt 10mil a year worth a 3rd option?
I probably wouldnt go more than 11, but as a 3rd option, you cant really complain there...

abe_froman
07-03-2008, 04:02 PM
and why isnt 10mil a year worth a 3rd option?
I probably wouldnt go more than 11, but as a 3rd option, you cant really complain there...

offer deng his money but be sure to have smith on speed dial incase deng wants much more than what you can get for smith.say going rate 11 for deng no more

Turtle55
07-03-2008, 04:57 PM
I don't understand the Smith love. I live in GA and he is not a franchise player. The combo of Deng and Tyrus fit together better and have better work ethics. He's a good player but he's not worth renouncing our rights to Deng and Gordon (which is the only way we can afford him). We should just re sign those two and clean out some of our log jam at the guard position. Tyrus is similar from a talent standpoint to Smith anyways.

kozelkid
07-03-2008, 05:04 PM
I don't understand the Smith love. I live in GA and he is not a franchise player. The combo of Deng and Tyrus fit together better and have better work ethics. He's a good player but he's not worth renouncing our rights to Deng and Gordon (which is the only way we can afford him). We should just re sign those two and clean out some of our log jam at the guard position. Tyrus is similar from a talent standpoint to Smith anyways.

I couldnt agree with you more. if you have smith AND tt, there's no balance, the guy depends PURELY on athleticism, reminds me a bit of marion, basically I dont expect him to play as well as he is now by age 30, alot like marion...
deng, uses fundamentals, and should play at a high level on age 33 or so. deng offers much better balance when you already have tyrus imo. we dont need 2 erratic players.

Turtle55
07-03-2008, 05:15 PM
I couldnt agree with you more. if you have smith AND tt, there's no balance, the guy depends PURELY on athleticism, reminds me a bit of marion, basically I dont expect him to play as well as he is now by age 30, alot like marion...
deng, uses fundamentals, and should play at a high level on age 33 or so. deng offers much better balance when you already have tyrus imo. we dont need 2 erratic players.

Deng's intangibles (leadership, attitude) more than make up for the gap between his talent level and Smith's so I think your post is pretty accurate. The stuff you have annoyed me :mad: into reading about Tyrus has me as one of the people waiting to see what he can do this year and expecting major strides.

kozelkid
07-03-2008, 05:23 PM
Deng's intangibles (leadership, attitude) more than make up for the gap between his talent level and Smith's so I think your post is pretty accurate. The stuff you have annoyed me :mad: into reading about Tyrus has me as one of the people waiting to see what he can do this year and expecting major strides.

ya, well we'll see :nod:
although as you said, deng's intagibles alone puts him WAY ahead

BG7
07-03-2008, 06:02 PM
I don't think it is going to come down to a dollar amount with Gordon. He is going to look for a guaranteed starter position, and he is going to look for probably 2 player opt outs for the last 2 years of his contract.

I think both will be completely fair demands.

I really don't get why he doesn't deserve to be guaranteed a starter spot. He led the team in scoring, led the team in scoring efficiency, 4th in passing, 3rd best player...slightly behind Deng on the team using PER (Drew Gooden is #1, but that should probably be thrown out from small sample size). He is #1 on the team in Offensive Win Shares. He is the best player on the team by using Win Shares. He has the best offensive rating on the team.

So looking at this, he is easily the best offensive player on the team. By one measure (PER) he is the 2nd best player on the team [that would go in line with the Gordon is the better scorer, Deng's the better all around player line], and is the best player on the team when using Win Shares.

How does that translate into Gordon should be a 6th man?

Just looking at his 4 main guard stats, PPG, TS%, APG and then overall PER, these are the players that did what Gordon did last year.

17 players in the NBA did this last year, only 7 of them were guards. The 7 guards were Kobe Bryant, Allen Iverson, Michael Redd, Chris Paul, Monta Ellis, Manu Ginobli, and Deron Williams.

Only one of those guys came off the bench, Ginobli. I think asking Gordon to come off the bench on a team that failed to make the playoffs (when they might have been able to if they started and played Gordon more) is quite a bit different than asking Ginobli to come off the bench and win a championship....

We should meet both stipulations, and sign Gordon for something like 58.5 million over 6 years (which would be Kirk's contract over 6 years).

Turtle55
07-03-2008, 06:54 PM
I don't think it is going to come down to a dollar amount with Gordon. He is going to look for a guaranteed starter position, and he is going to look for probably 2 player opt outs for the last 2 years of his contract.

I think both will be completely fair demands.

I really don't get why he doesn't deserve to be guaranteed a starter spot. He led the team in scoring, led the team in scoring efficiency, 4th in passing, 3rd best player...slightly behind Deng on the team using PER (Drew Gooden is #1, but that should probably be thrown out from small sample size). He is #1 on the team in Offensive Win Shares. He is the best player on the team by using Win Shares. He has the best offensive rating on the team.

So looking at this, he is easily the best offensive player on the team. By one measure (PER) he is the 2nd best player on the team [that would go in line with the Gordon is the better scorer, Deng's the better all around player line], and is the best player on the team when using Win Shares.

How does that translate into Gordon should be a 6th man?

Just looking at his 4 main guard stats, PPG, TS%, APG and then overall PER, these are the players that did what Gordon did last year.

17 players in the NBA did this last year, only 7 of them were guards. The 7 guards were Kobe Bryant, Allen Iverson, Michael Redd, Chris Paul, Monta Ellis, Manu Ginobli, and Deron Williams.

Only one of those guys came off the bench, Ginobli. I think asking Gordon to come off the bench on a team that failed to make the playoffs (when they might have been able to if they started and played Gordon more) is quite a bit different than asking Ginobli to come off the bench and win a championship....

We should meet both stipulations, and sign Gordon for something like 58.5 million over 6 years (which would be Kirk's contract over 6 years).

I actually think Gordon has as good a chance to start in Chicago as anywhere because it's a new coach that is not a Skiles follower. I don't think it should be Paxson's decision who starts when he's negotiating since it should be up to the coach. I understand him wanting to start but the most important thing is minutes.

Swish-Cab-Ob
07-03-2008, 07:18 PM
I hope Gordon isn't on this team next season.

BG7
07-03-2008, 07:20 PM
Which was a problem towards the end of the season for Gordon. Boylan really threw Gordon under the bus at the end of last season.

Just looking at March/April: 28 minutes, 29 minutes, 29 minutes, 14 minutes, 29 minutes, 23 minutes, 29 minutes, 20 minutes, 16 minutes, 29 minutes, 26 minutes, 26 minutes, 28 minutes, 21 minutes, 18 minutes, 27 minutes, 9 minutes.

That is way too many games for Gordon to play under 30 minutes. I can't believe Boylan-dousche played Gordon 9 minutes in what could have been his last Bulls game.

Also:

When Gordon Starts: 65-63 (.507)
When Gordon comes off the bench: 100-88 (.532)

Compared to:

When Deng Starts: 128-114 (.529)
When Deng comes off the bench: 21-21 (.500)

Gordon's WP% as a starter is so much lower because of the Skiles start to this season, which was the only period he started, which consisted of almost all losses.

Now someone mentioned letting Gordon walk, and signing Brand.

When Elton Brand Starts: 235-374 (.385)
When Elton Brand Comes off the bench: 1-4 (.200)

Turtle55
07-03-2008, 07:27 PM
Not as good a team for Elton. I have no problem with Gordon starting if he turns out to be the best fit for our new offense/Rose next year. I just don't want to overpay for a score only guard.