PDA

View Full Version : This May Be A Blessing In Disquise



Art Vandolay
07-01-2008, 02:15 PM
I was pretty upset when I heard that Ramirez was taking off three days for personel reasons. This was unheard of in the old days but because of the basic players agreement, this is now allowed. The thing is though, maybe this is a blessing with Ramirez and Zambrano out,maybe this will reenergize the team. I wish Lou could rest DLee so his swing would wake up. Clearly he needs some rest because his bat looks slow. Forcing another player like DeRosa to turn it up a notch is good. I still think that we have not seen the best of Fukadome yet and this second half may be better than last year's.
If Hendry can get us another starter and a permanent centerfielder, this playoff season could indeed be memorable

Chi-Town Finest
07-01-2008, 02:18 PM
I pretty much agree, a lot of people are already pushing the panic button but every good team goes through stretches of bad games and some key players out may be what the team needs to make a couple of player "step up".

Chazm
07-01-2008, 02:19 PM
it was one game. We could get shut out tonight and the threads will start up again about how we are in panic mode

JimHendrysTummy
07-01-2008, 02:21 PM
Why a permanent CF? I don't see anything wrong with Edmonds/Johnson platooning out there.

What is better on the market, that we could actually afford to get? To swing a frontline starter, it's gonna cost. I'm all for dropping 4 or 5 guys to nab a CC/Harden/Burnett, but I really don't see the reasoning behind emptying the system more for a CF, when the two we have are doing an above-average job.

Art Vandolay
07-01-2008, 02:48 PM
The Cubs are not going to get C.C. and Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen. Burnett is a possibility and beleive it or not Jake Peavy might be available. The thing is,you never know what you're going to get from Marquis or Lilly. Gallagher needs another pitch and has Dempster won on the road yet.
As far as centerfield,I don't know if a platoon will work. there's something about Edmonds that is driving me nuts and I can't put my finger on it. Reed Johnson is an excellent 4th outfielder and I read where Florida may be interested in the Red Menace,Murton. Take him please.I'd like to see the Cubs and the Fish in the NLCS. The fish can even bring their "hired gun" Bartman with them. We'll be ready for him, this time

windycityD
07-01-2008, 02:48 PM
it was one game. We could get shut out tonight and the threads will start up again about how we are in panic mode

Lincecum could blank us, even w/ Ramirez. Missing Sanchez was nice.

Last night's game was key to this trip and series. We needed to get off the schneid. Of course, it could all go south tonight w/ Marquis on the bump.

cowboydoc45
07-01-2008, 02:49 PM
Why a permanent CF? I don't see anything wrong with Edmonds/Johnson platooning out there.

What is better on the market, that we could actually afford to get? To swing a frontline starter, it's gonna cost. I'm all for dropping 4 or 5 guys to nab a CC/Harden/Burnett, but I really don't see the reasoning behind emptying the system more for a CF, when the two we have are doing an above-average job.

I have to agree with you here. The Johnson/Edmonds platoon has worked out well, and Edmonds has done well out there in Johnson's absence. I don't think there is a huge need to get a new CFer. As for the starting pitching, Wolfe is a possible option. His ERA is a little high, but he has a nice WHIP (1.39). Garcia is going to be working out for scouts, and from what I have read, it sounds like he is at about 80% which could fill a back of the rotation spot. If we trade for a Sabathia/Harden/Burnett, it will basically wipe our farm out, and still not guarentee anything.

There is a lot of potential in the team. Players do seem to be starting to pick up where needed, it is just a matter of getting our big guns back, and hoping they come back to form. If our season ends the way it started, we will be in a good position. I definately look for us to be one of the teams with home field advantage through the playoffs.

shrek
07-01-2008, 02:51 PM
The Cubs are not going to get C.C. and Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen. Burnett is a possibility and beleive it or not Jake Peavy might be available. The thing is,you never know what you're going to get from Marquis or Lilly. Gallagher needs another pitch and has Dempster won on the road yet.
As far as centerfield,I don't know if a platoon will work. there's something about Edmonds that is driving me nuts and I can't put my finger on it. Reed Johnson is an excellent 4th outfielder and I read where Florida may be interested in the Red Menace,Murton. Take him please.I'd like to see the Cubs and the Fish in the NLCS. The fish can even bring their "hired gun" Bartman with them. We'll be ready for him, this time

you can't have everything at once. I am sure every team wants a chase utley at 2B but it is not possible.

Right now Cubs need a dominant pitcher more than anything else.

CF is fine and platoon is working but pitching is not. So, i would concentrate and use all my energy into getting another dominant pitcher before doing or thinking about anything else.

Trade players like murton, cedeno, marquis, and lilly don't matter to me but just go and get another dominant pitcher

cowboydoc45
07-01-2008, 02:53 PM
The Cubs are not going to get C.C. and Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen. Burnett is a possibility and beleive it or not Jake Peavy might be available. The thing is,you never know what you're going to get from Marquis or Lilly. Gallagher needs another pitch and has Dempster won on the road yet.
As far as centerfield,I don't know if a platoon will work. there's something about Edmonds that is driving me nuts and I can't put my finger on it. Reed Johnson is an excellent 4th outfielder and I read where Florida may be interested in the Red Menace,Murton. Take him please.I'd like to see the Cubs and the Fish in the NLCS. The fish can even bring their "hired gun" Bartman with them. We'll be ready for him, this time

Who would we take in return?

windycityD
07-01-2008, 02:56 PM
you can't have everything at once. I am sure every team wants a chase utley at 2B but it is not possible.

Right now Cubs need a dominant pitcher more than anything else.

CF is fine and platoon is working but pitching is not. So, i would concentrate and use all my energy into getting another dominant pitcher before doing or thinking about anything else.

Trade players like murton, cedeno, marquis, and lilly don't matter to me but just go and get another dominant pitcher

...a good lefty in the pen would be nice as well. We simply do not have one.

chicagofan71
07-01-2008, 02:59 PM
The Cubs are not going to get C.C. and Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen. Burnett is a possibility and beleive it or not Jake Peavy might be available. The thing is,you never know what you're going to get from Marquis or Lilly. Gallagher needs another pitch and has Dempster won on the road yet.
As far as centerfield,I don't know if a platoon will work. there's something about Edmonds that is driving me nuts and I can't put my finger on it. Reed Johnson is an excellent 4th outfielder and I read where Florida may be interested in the Red Menace,Murton. Take him please.I'd like to see the Cubs and the Fish in the NLCS. The fish can even bring their "hired gun" Bartman with them. We'll be ready for him, this time


:laugh2:
You think Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen, but not Burnett?

guru
07-01-2008, 03:02 PM
you can't have everything at once. I am sure every team wants a chase utley at 2B but it is not possible.

Right now Cubs need a dominant pitcher more than anything else.

CF is fine and platoon is working but pitching is not. So, i would concentrate and use all my energy into getting another dominant pitcher before doing or thinking about anything else.

Trade players like murton, cedeno, marquis, and lilly don't matter to me but just go and get another dominant pitcher

Why Lilly, after starting 0-4, he has gone 9-1, if I am not mistaken. Some of those games havent been great and the offense scored a lot, but he has been consistent the past month and a half at least. Plus who would want to take on his contract?

BuckyBadger
07-01-2008, 04:06 PM
The Cubs are not going to get C.C. and Harden is a sore arm waiting to happen. Burnett is a possibility and beleive it or not Jake Peavy might be available. The thing is,you never know what you're going to get from Marquis or Lilly. Gallagher needs another pitch and has Dempster won on the road yet.
As far as centerfield,I don't know if a platoon will work. there's something about Edmonds that is driving me nuts and I can't put my finger on it. Reed Johnson is an excellent 4th outfielder and I read where Florida may be interested in the Red Menace,Murton. Take him please.I'd like to see the Cubs and the Fish in the NLCS. The fish can even bring their "hired gun" Bartman with them. We'll be ready for him, this time


Where have you heard that Peavy may be available??

C-ross12
07-01-2008, 04:07 PM
I still want aram and Z to play..

BricksAndIvy
07-01-2008, 04:16 PM
I think the Cubs should sign Freddy Garcia and then make a trade for a Harden/Burnett/Bedard/Sabathia....i know that Garcia is far from a guarantee considering his injury, but this would allow breathing room to give up gallagher and plus; if the cubs make the playoffs..they will only need 4 starters...Z, the guy they trade for, dempster, and lilly...i'll take that. If garcia does come back to form...it's a great signing...if not, they still have marquis/hill/marshall/lieber. The fifth man in the rotation is there to help get them to the playoffs, he shouldn't pitch at all during them.

cowboydoc45
07-01-2008, 04:27 PM
I think the Cubs should sign Freddy Garcia and then make a trade for a Harden/Burnett/Bedard/Sabathia....i know that Garcia is far from a guarantee considering his injury, but this would allow breathing room to give up gallagher and plus; if the cubs make the playoffs..they will only need 4 starters...Z, the guy they trade for, dempster, and lilly...i'll take that. If garcia does come back to form...it's a great signing...if not, they still have marquis/hill/marshall/lieber. The fifth man in the rotation is there to help get them to the playoffs, he shouldn't pitch at all during them.

I don't know that I would want to sign Garcia at the expense of Gallagher. Sure it is his rookie season, but I see him being a strong #2 down the road. Garcia probably only has a year or two left in him.

BricksAndIvy
07-01-2008, 04:33 PM
It wouldn't be at the expense of Gallagher, Garcia would be the guy taking over the 5th spot. I'm guessing that Gallagher will be used in any trade to get a top of the rotation pitcher and Garcia could provide a little breathing room to do so.

Art Vandolay
07-01-2008, 04:38 PM
Peavy is having a down year and I think San Diego is going to do a major housecleaning. Parring payroll is the idea. they are not going anywhere this year even though the western division is starting to resemble the West of a couple of years ago. I think they would like to load up on prospects. As far as Bedard,I'm glad we didn't get him Any pitcher that asks to be taken out of a game is worthless as far as I am concerned. Seattle got a diva and they are trying to rid themselves of him

BUD Bleachers
07-01-2008, 04:49 PM
I pretty much agree, a lot of people are already pushing the panic button but every good team goes through stretches of bad games and some key players out may be what the team needs to make a couple of player "step up".

Right. If you have the chance, go back and research the woes of the 2004 Red Sox.

Chazm
07-01-2008, 05:42 PM
Peavy is having a down year and I think San Diego is going to do a major housecleaning. Parring payroll is the idea. they are not going anywhere this year even though the western division is starting to resemble the West of a couple of years ago. I think they would like to load up on prospects. As far as Bedard,I'm glad we didn't get him Any pitcher that asks to be taken out of a game is worthless as far as I am concerned. Seattle got a diva and they are trying to rid themselves of him

You are smoking crack...Even if the Pads wanted to dump Peavy we would be way behind in the prospect return for him

joeshmo99987
07-01-2008, 05:47 PM
I think the Cubs should sign Freddy Garcia and then make a trade for a Harden/Burnett/Bedard/Sabathia....i know that Garcia is far from a guarantee considering his injury, but this would allow breathing room to give up gallagher and plus; if the cubs make the playoffs..they will only need 4 starters...Z, the guy they trade for, dempster, and lilly...i'll take that. If garcia does come back to form...it's a great signing...if not, they still have marquis/hill/marshall/lieber. The fifth man in the rotation is there to help get them to the playoffs, he shouldn't pitch at all during them.

No thanks :puke:

BricksAndIvy
07-01-2008, 05:58 PM
No thanks :puke:

Any reason why or just no thanks? Freddy Garcia proved he was a very good pitcher with the white sox in '05. Unfortunately injuries have effected him since. This is a no lose situation, kinda like the edmonds one. Don't get into a high stakes bidding war for him, but if you can get him at a reasonable price, why not? It won't hurt, you lose nobody, and it's a guy that has proven in the past he can pitch very well. If he doesn't work out, let him go. People are pushing for trading many prospects for harden and burnett, both of which are injury prone, when they can spend a few bucks and get garcia and then make a big push for sabathia.

Snydesdale
07-01-2008, 06:38 PM
Lee was 5 for 5 against the Sox.

kdog23
07-01-2008, 07:10 PM
You are smoking crack...Even if the Pads wanted to dump Peavy we would be way behind in the prospect return for him


That's pretty harsh dude. Everyone has a price. Peavy is on the worst team in the NL-if I was the GM I would trade him for 3 top shelf prospects and a couple low level guys (rated high of course) and maybe a MLB hitter. The Pads have no future with all those old geezer SP's-BAD team. They should rebuild and go young.

mortgageman
07-01-2008, 07:20 PM
Bricks and Ivy is dead on sign Freddy if he comes cheap and get a number one starter before the dead line funny how we love to just pick players off rosters Peavy? isn't going nowhere.

joeshmo99987
07-01-2008, 08:11 PM
Any reason why or just no thanks? Freddy Garcia proved he was a very good pitcher with the white sox in '05. Unfortunately injuries have effected him since. This is a no lose situation, kinda like the edmonds one. Don't get into a high stakes bidding war for him, but if you can get him at a reasonable price, why not? It won't hurt, you lose nobody, and it's a guy that has proven in the past he can pitch very well. If he doesn't work out, let him go. People are pushing for trading many prospects for harden and burnett, both of which are injury prone, when they can spend a few bucks and get garcia and then make a big push for sabathia.

And Garcia isn't injury prone. Besides just because he pitched good in 05 doesn't mean he is good now. Last year he was 1-5 with a 5.9 ERA. I would even put Lieber in front of Garcia.

The Stick
07-01-2008, 09:01 PM
Who would we take in return?

Of course any trade with Florida depends on them dropping out of the race, but I could see them moving Scott Olsen. He has good stuff but is a head case ala Rich Hill. If the price is right I really like his upside. I'd imagine the Marlins would start the talks with Wellington Castillo. Castillo,Murton, and a young arm like James Russell for Olsen.

BricksAndIvy
07-01-2008, 09:11 PM
And Garcia isn't injury prone. Besides just because he pitched good in 05 doesn't mean he is good now. Last year he was 1-5 with a 5.9 ERA. I would even put Lieber in front of Garcia.

I'm saying that Garcia is injury prone like Burnett and Harden so why not sign Freddy instead of trading the farm for one of them? And like i said...give Garcia some starts and see how it works out, if not you have marquis/lieber/hill/marshall to fill the five hole. The Cubs cannot lose whatsoever by signing Freddy Garcia. Everytime Marquis steps on the mound everyone is wondering whether he will give up 2 or 22, it would be an experiment that wouldn't be too much of a dare.

joeshmo99987
07-01-2008, 09:49 PM
The Cubs are the best in the N.L. They don't need to experiment. Granted they can improve their rotation, but Garcia is not the way they should do it.

Chazm
07-02-2008, 10:37 AM
That's pretty harsh dude. Everyone has a price. Peavy is on the worst team in the NL-if I was the GM I would trade him for 3 top shelf prospects and a couple low level guys (rated high of course) and maybe a MLB hitter. The Pads have no future with all those old geezer SP's-BAD team. They should rebuild and go young.

And im sure he does. The problem is we don't have the pieces that it would take to get peavy

Cub_StuckinSTL
07-02-2008, 10:56 AM
That's pretty harsh dude. Everyone has a price. Peavy is on the worst team in the NL-if I was the GM I would trade him for 3 top shelf prospects and a couple low level guys (rated high of course) and maybe a MLB hitter. The Pads have no future with all those old geezer SP's-BAD team. They should rebuild and go young.

Peavy is also signed through the next 4 years going right through his prime.

jedi1661
07-02-2008, 11:57 AM
That's pretty harsh dude. Everyone has a price. Peavy is on the worst team in the NL-if I was the GM I would trade him for 3 top shelf prospects and a couple low level guys (rated high of course) and maybe a MLB hitter. The Pads have no future with all those old geezer SP's-BAD team. They should rebuild and go young.

Of course if he's made available Hendry has to at least ask, but we're probably talking Gallagher, Veal, Murton, and Cedeno probably and then most likely 2-3 more I just don't see how it's possible, and even if Hendry were to gut the team, we still might not be ablt to compete with the youth of a lot of other teams.

Chazm
07-02-2008, 12:29 PM
Of course if he's made available Hendry has to at least ask, but we're probably talking Gallagher, Veal, Murton, and Cedeno probably and then most likely 2-3 more I just don't see how it's possible, and even if Hendry were to gut the team, we still might not be ablt to compete with the youth of a lot of other teams.

veal gallagher, murton and cedeno isn't even close to getting it done. It would have to be all of our top prospects and even then other teams could easily put together a better package

Dmac
07-02-2008, 05:06 PM
Peavy isn't going to be traded. He has several years left on his deal, and he just turned 28. He is a guy they would build around, not trade away to start over.

Signing Garcia wouldn't really make any sense either. The Cubs have plenty of #5 starters, and if they got anything out of Garcia, which would be doubtful, he would be a back of the rotation pitcher at best.


It really wouldn't make any sense to experiment with him and take starts away from Gallagher. With Edmonds it was a little different, he wasn't really going to take time away from anyone. Pie wasn't going to play anyway, and Johnson isn't an everyday player. If they are going to acquire someone, they need someone they would be a #1-3.