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View Full Version : Are we all missing the point?



star
07-01-2008, 12:42 AM
Just an observation,

Some of us a very excited about JO coming to toronto. With all of this excitement and rejuvenation of team spirit maybe we are missing the true genious and intended purpose of this deal.

We were shopping TJ around and that was no secret. We had offers reportedley from Det, Port, Phx, Cha and obviously INDY

Now MOST fans seem to think that BC was making a move to improve the team THIS YEAR as a playoff team.

I disagree.

What if this was the intention:

This year is a evaluation year mainly for Bargs, Jose, and to a lesser degree Moon, Kapono, Ukic.
-Lets see where bargs can play 5, 4, or 3.
- Can kapono get the shots he needs with an effective big (JO)
- Can calderon consistently lead a team for a full season (he has NOT proven he can play 35 minutes at a high level for all 82)

Inorder for BArgs to be evauluated (which is the #1 priority) he cannot be a focal point of the offence or in the starting 5) - it didnt work and too much expectations and pressure. The jo deal adresses this

So what BC is doing is allowing for this to be a trial year for the above and AT THE SAME TIME We are gearing up assets for the next year 09.

a 22M contract that expires in 2010 is HUGE. It is the biggest free agency year EVER and that space can instantly transform an entire franchise. We will be able to get not just 1 but TWO stars in return.

What would you give up if you have tim duncan and you want him to play with JAMES .... That alone almost gaurantees your trip to the final 4 over the next 6 years! Wouldnt you give up ginobili and another star?

If you could have a backcourt of JAMES and KOBE isnt that worth saying to the raps take WHATEVER you WANT!

Basically, whatever top 4 -5 teams that LEBRON or MELO want to go to, we would have a chance to give them JOs contract (for them to clear the space) and we would be able to pick out talent at our discretion.

I dont believe that there is a bigger contract (than JOs) that expires in 2010 ... this means that ANYTEAM (even one with a messy cap situation (like todays NYK) could potentialy swing a deal for JOs contract and be in the LEBRON sweapstakes.

This will take place NEXT summer .... so with that in mind dont you think that this deal was MORE about strategic contract planning? and at the same time will allow bargs to develop better?

I really dont think BC got JO to push for a championship i think he got him because his contract will be one of the most sought after comodities in summer 09. This contract alone will take us into a Championship callibre team for the 2010 season (via trade OR signing our own free agent to a max contract).



It maybe the vision that BC had with this trade

lovingTO
07-01-2008, 12:57 AM
I really like your "outside of the box" thinking. Bravo sir.

Dragan
07-01-2008, 01:29 AM
we cant win a championchip with oneal and bosh and an developing bragz.
I think this re-afirms my belief that the organization is still confident in the potential of Andrea. and are weiting for him to develop and onel is brought in to tutorhim, and allow him to develop more from the bench.

np6526
07-01-2008, 02:12 AM
I think you hit the nail on the head with this post; This is exactly what I thought of the deal, this is pure Colangelo genius in this trade. :clap:

JO is hitting the final two years of his prime, baring his injury. We get two solid years out of JO, plus it opens up room for another All star in the much anticipated 2010 off-season.

This trade also makes me as a Raptors fan (since day one in the Sky Dome) have a sense that we have a solid chance to make it to the Eastern Conference finals, instead of the maybe we'd make it to the second round feeling that I've always had even with our best teams (including the Sixers series).

On the same notion, I really hope BC makes a run at Marion because it gives us the opportunity to sign a big name next year when his contract expires, which would give us 3 potential All Stars once 2010 rolls around.

Can you tell I'm EXCITED for the next couple years? :D

Great Post by the way.

Fion
07-01-2008, 04:07 AM
I view it as a win win trade.

1. Either we get alot better with JO, and maybe sign him for less in 2010 if he likes it here to compete for a title.
2. we trade his contract as u say.
3. we let him expire and ourselves look at free agency in 2010.

carlo4444
07-01-2008, 04:26 AM
makes u think

AK-50
07-01-2008, 04:30 AM
yea i kinda figured there was a plot behind the trade BC is a genius when it comes to these things so thats why i trust him totally in whatever he does even though i didnt agree with it to begin with

hades
07-01-2008, 05:04 AM
Just an observation,

Some of us a very excited about JO coming to toronto. With all of this excitement and rejuvenation of team spirit maybe we are missing the true genious and intended purpose of this deal.

We were shopping TJ around and that was no secret. We had offers reportedley from Det, Port, Phx, Cha and obviously INDY

Now MOST fans seem to think that BC was making a move to improve the team THIS YEAR as a playoff team.

I disagree.

What if this was the intention:

This year is a evaluation year mainly for Bargs, Jose, and to a lesser degree Moon, Kapono, Ukic.
-Lets see where bargs can play 5, 4, or 3.
- Can kapono get the shots he needs with an effective big (JO)
- Can calderon consistently lead a team for a full season (he has NOT proven he can play 35 minutes at a high level for all 82)

Inorder for BArgs to be evauluated (which is the #1 priority) he cannot be a focal point of the offence or in the starting 5) - it didnt work and too much expectations and pressure. The jo deal adresses this

So what BC is doing is allowing for this to be a trial year for the above and AT THE SAME TIME We are gearing up assets for the next year 09.

a 22M contract that expires in 2010 is HUGE. It is the biggest free agency year EVER and that space can instantly transform an entire franchise. We will be able to get not just 1 but TWO stars in return.

What would you give up if you have tim duncan and you want him to play with JAMES .... That alone almost gaurantees your trip to the final 4 over the next 6 years! Wouldnt you give up ginobili and another star?

If you could have a backcourt of JAMES and KOBE isnt that worth saying to the raps take WHATEVER you WANT!

Basically, whatever top 4 -5 teams that LEBRON or MELO want to go to, we would have a chance to give them JOs contract (for them to clear the space) and we would be able to pick out talent at our discretion.

I dont believe that there is a bigger contract (than JOs) that expires in 2010 ... this means that ANYTEAM (even one with a messy cap situation (like todays NYK) could potentialy swing a deal for JOs contract and be in the LEBRON sweapstakes.

This will take place NEXT summer .... so with that in mind dont you think that this deal was MORE about strategic contract planning? and at the same time will allow bargs to develop better?

I really dont think BC got JO to push for a championship i think he got him because his contract will be one of the most sought after comodities in summer 09. This contract alone will take us into a Championship callibre team for the 2010 season (via trade OR signing our own free agent to a max contract).



It maybe the vision that BC had with this trade

WHAT IF it is all what you have just said, and trying to sneak up for a championship right now.
why not?
ITs BC, i wouldnt be surprised. HE's a genius
its already been given that its(JO deal) a power move for the future.
so, its not like we are getting excited that JO is JUST coming to town.
we are all getting excited coz we all see a bright future for this franchise.
and these THREADS are here for a reason, to express and share these feelings whatever they may be.

GOOD POST.
meaningful.

Tom Stone
07-01-2008, 08:13 AM
It's foolish to question if Jose can play 82 games all season....there was many times he was playing 40 mins a night and I sware to god he looked like the only guy that didn't lose a step....he may be one of the most fit people in the NBA...next to Rip Hamilton.
Your next comment on will barg play the 3,4,5....is once again foolish... barg at the Center spot, was patheic at the power forward we have Bosh and Hump...Oh and hump got disrespected all year by Sam Mitchell....when barg went down and hump took over... all of sudden we going even in rebounds and beating teams in rebounds for that strech of games....And it was key why we were playing well during that strech...barg came back and the same problems started again...all of sudden we were weak again..loseing in rebounds....and barg's offence from the center spot isn't good enough to balance that out....Now, his rookie year he played Sf and had a great rookie year chasing brandon Roy..oh he also got drafted #1 playing the Sf spot....so don't tell me he doesn't belong there......With his three ball and court vision he looked like a tall young larry bird.

hades
07-01-2008, 08:19 AM
dude i think u posted in the wrong thread.

Tom Stone
07-01-2008, 08:22 AM
People are sleeping on Nathan Jawari....he's 280 pounds... and can really get off the ground for dunks and blocks.....there is no one in the Nba with his size and weight with that kind of athletic ability...a perfect back up center to Jermaine o'neal.....Oh and every player I say is gonna be a big player...becomes a big player.....Im right 99% of the time....Truthly I can't remember the last time I was wrong....You don't become this confindent over night it takes years and years of being right.....Peace

D.Pumps
07-01-2008, 08:22 AM
I hope u all don't have that great of expectations for it. Stephon Marburys 21 Million dollar expiring contract is sitting there with no takers. Teams could have him for a couple old boots. Problem is, it takes a lot to match that large of a contract, your looking at 3 or 4 for one deals. Not many teams are in a position to do that.

D.Pumps
07-01-2008, 08:23 AM
Tom Stone second cousin of isiah thomas.

star
07-01-2008, 09:56 AM
I view it as a win win trade.

1. Either we get alot better with JO, and maybe sign him for less in 2010 if he likes it here to compete for a title.
2. we trade his contract as u say.
3. we let him expire and ourselves look at free agency in 2010.

You are absolutely right.

PURE WIN - WIN

if we DO do well with Jermain ... BC is a genious
if he is hurt and sucks *** ... We have a very valuable trade asset ... BC is a genious

there is NOW way this trade can hurt us ... even if JO plays 1 game and we finish last or 82 and we win a championship

What JO does is virtually meaningless

Bob_at_york
07-01-2008, 10:09 AM
It's foolish to question if Jose can play 82 games all season....there was many times he was playing 40 mins a night and I sware to god he looked like the only guy that didn't lose a step....he may be one of the most fit people in the NBA...next to Rip Hamilton.
But he did seem to get tired in the 2nd half of the season last year. Remember how he started to slump in February? He lost some of his aggressiveness and such. I am not saying it will happen again but star's comment is not that far out there when you look back on last season.

Beach Rock
07-01-2008, 10:40 AM
Star makes some real good points here...but as far as Jose getting tired I'd have to disagree. He dropped off as soon as TJ came back. I think it was a chemistry thing. Ego maniacs can play through stuff like that without a beat missed because they only see themselves anyway. Jose's a good guy and seemed really thrown off. I think it was all chemistry...he is going to be something to watch all year this year.

ramz.n
07-01-2008, 10:52 AM
interesting how you talked about Duncan..even though im young i remember when David Robinson was in San ANtonio and struggled byhimself until they drafted Duncan..and you know the rest of the storey..but instead replace the draft pick with the FA market..really excited.

B2theRY
07-01-2008, 12:52 PM
my theory on the JO trade.. yes because of the cap room but see i dont think BC actually thinks LBJ, WADE or Carmelo would even sign here i think what he is going to do is the fallowing..

he will either try to keep JO if he is healthy and wants to stay and it wont go against our cap OR he will trade JO to a team that wants to get LBJ and try to bring back a few great players to fill our franchise out. players who are signed for nice size contracts.

there is no way in hell LBJ ever signs in toronto.
so all we are going to do is use JO contract as trade bait like the lakers did to get gasol

ramz.n
07-01-2008, 12:54 PM
People are sleeping on Nathan Jawari....he's 280 pounds... and can really get off the ground for dunks and blocks.....there is no one in the Nba with his size and weight with that kind of athletic ability...a perfect back up center to Jermaine o'neal.....Oh and every player I say is gonna be a big player...becomes a big player.....Im right 99% of the time....Truthly I can't remember the last time I was wrong....You don't become this confindent over night it takes years and years of being right.....Peace

you forgot his 7'6 wingspan!!

JaysAddict43
07-01-2008, 01:38 PM
Great post, but i think teh jO thing gives Toronto a star power and gives and lets other cities know that HEY toronto isnt a scrub team, it's got some stars. Helps put Tdot in the map.. which is important for maybe SIGNING the lebrons/bosh's/wades/amare's/ because before the trade tehy may have beeN" whats toronto" [dotn underestimate the ignorance of amercians:P] so great signing alltogether.

TO Fan
07-01-2008, 02:09 PM
Not to rain in on the parade, but I think this what a lot of people have been saying for the past week...especially when others were hating on the deal. If it doesn't work out, we have an expiring contract. What's not to love about this deal?

ramz.n
07-01-2008, 03:13 PM
imagine in 2010

pg- Calderon
sg- ?
sf- ?
pf- CB4
c- Amare Stoudamire

_Sn1P3r_
07-01-2008, 04:49 PM
Great points and great post. Enjoyed reading your insight.