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View Full Version : Please Release David Eckstein



subaltern
05-29-2008, 10:14 PM
I have watched approximately 85% of the Jays games this year and I am no player development scout but I am tired of watching David Eckstein flop around with his below average defense, his below average arm, his below average speed and his weak but consistent slap hitting.

I think this latest situation with the Aaron Hill collision has me concluding that I'd rather have a SS that is sound defensively that can quarterback the infield and except the offensive liability of the weak hitting McDonald.

We've seen Eckstein lose two games single-handedly with late inning errors and his lack of range. We've seen so many throws that short-hop to Overbay putting additional pressure on the first basemen. We have seen Eckstein's lack of range with his desperation "dives" (more like flops to the ground) that have continued innings with seeing-eye grounders turning one-run to multi-run innings. This is a killer considering the anemic team offense (which I agree with Riccardi, Denbo and the Law of Averages, that this will eventually balance out).

I know, I know, everyone loves an overachieving underdog. Yes, he works hard. Yes, it's nice when he works his way on base with a 12 pitch at bat. But he has a garbage game of hustle and 145 pound grit (if you can call it that).

The most serious and important case against the Eckstein is regarding starting pitching. I think as a starting pitcher you want to trust your defense to make plays and therefore you pitch with a little more confidence which is essential for success. Any hinderance to this (especially at the most important defensive position) can only cause pitchers to tighten up and want to strike everyone out with a runner in scoring position. Think of Burnett, McGowan, League, Accardo as work-in-progress-head-cases still evolving their craft from throwers to pitchers.

I am fan of the +/- stat in hockey. I wonder how many runs or big innings McDonald, Wells, Rios. Rolen have taken away by their excellent range and reliable glove and strong arms.

Question: Could the Blue Jays release Eckstein and payout his $4M?

JaysFan87
05-29-2008, 10:37 PM
u watched 85% of this seasons jays
this means u have watched 48 games this year
ECK has played only 32 games this year
so that means that u determined a players worth by watching anywhere from 24(u said u watched 85% of the jays games so u missed 8 games this year and those games could have been when ECK played)-32 of his games played. If only a season was 32 games long.....

:D

JaysAddict43
05-29-2008, 11:03 PM
^ For all those who never payed attention in math class ..

WillRain
05-29-2008, 11:18 PM
No matter how many games you win, somebody always got ta be *****in....

bomber0104
05-30-2008, 01:15 AM
Even if everything you said is true (it is obviously not), the man has won 2 world Series and a world series MVP. I guess the Angels and Cards pitching staffs did not have a problem with him playing defence behind them.

tuck25
05-30-2008, 01:51 AM
All i can say is WOW:confused:, I have watched ALL the games(cause I have a great job) and some how you managed to see different ones, can't figure that out. And a Willrain kind of pointed to it, stop your *****in and enjoy the wins.;)

P.S. Welcome to the forum. lol

R. Johnson#3
05-30-2008, 02:04 AM
He has a weak arm but other than that I agree with nothing you said.

frostilicus
05-30-2008, 03:21 AM
I like how he always hustles down the first base line even when he's been walked or has hit a routine ground ball. I wish more baseball players would do that. I also seem to recall Scott Rolen saying on Jays Connected that he could talk about David Eckstein the baseball player but that he thinks that would be doing a disservice to David Eckstein the person. Anyone who gets glowing praise like that is welcome on my team any day of the week!

bartlett2266
05-30-2008, 08:59 AM
eckstein risp in scoring position over .300
runners in scoring position with 2 outs .455
release him give me a break

Canadian hemi
05-30-2008, 09:24 AM
release him? "no".. sub in Johny Mac in the last innings for "d" help...I can see that!

boilerguy2412
05-30-2008, 12:21 PM
I beileve the jays have the perfect mix a short right now. Eck just knows how to get on base. I would say he has a little better then average speed and he does have a weak arm but he tried to make up for it with a quick release which works out most of the time he is a good player. I think your problem with him is his to shiney rings on his hand are blocking your few from seeing what he really is. A hardnosed hard working good ball player not great but good and i really believe that is what the jays needed. They need someone that can keep Wells Rios Hill Halladay and all those guys focused on what they are playing for because he has been there before and knows what it takes. Now saying that i love the fact that they started bring in johnny mac in the 8th i love having someone with macs glove on the bench to bring in. The blue jays have no problems a ss what so ever and it's even better now seeing how marco played the last couple days

subaltern
05-30-2008, 02:24 PM
Thanks for responding...


JaysFan87 - Congrats, you know how to multiply 56 by 0.85. Genius! Too bad english is your second language. It's a pretty stupid response given that I didn't say that Eckstein was in every game that I watched this year. I am just expressing my lack of enthusiasm when he is a starter. Try re-reading the post with a dictionary, it might help you to understand the bigger words. ;)

Dunny33 - I do play the game--2B, with minus minus range, minus minus arm ;)--so I understand the significance of defense. I am also a third base coach. By the way, I am NOT saying Eckstein is crap. I am saying the Jays are better without him in the line-up.

I really think you're under-estimating the importance of range and defensive liability in the field, but since you sound like you play the game: please elaborate on your experience. If you're right, you're right. I won't argue but if you say I am an idiot it makes me question whether you know anything at all.

Prove me wrong.

Also:
It was a year where no one really deserved the WS MVP. Maybe if Chris Carpenter had his second start he would've got it (8 scoreless innings in his first game). I think you could make a case for Rolen too.

2006 World Series
David Eckstein .364BA .391OBP .500SLG
Scott Rolen .421BA .476OBP .737SLG

WillRain - I don't think I am *****in... at all. Just curious what you peeps think. Big mistake! ;)

Bartlett2266 - I appreciate your comment. That is hard to contest! But the dude simply is not a run producer historically. But I like those numbers on the Jays. Okay, maybe don't release him, how about a trade. Wouldn't Billy Beane cream his pants for a Moneyballer like Eckstein? Maybe for a low-a ball prospect or a right-handed reliever (I am not loving Benitez, Frasor, Camp).

Boilerguy & Bomber0104 - The rings are definitely shiney. And he is gamer for the post-season. But so was Mark Lemke... think about it. ;)

tuck25 - Sounds like your enjoying your unemployment insurance thanks for welcoming me to the forum!

P.S. Get a job! ;)

McJoe
05-30-2008, 02:27 PM
No matter how many games you win, somebody always got ta be *****in....

this is what its like in Toronto Will...i know you dont live here and im pretty sure ive said almost this exact comment before but Toronto sports fans (mostly because of the media) are just waiting for the next losing streak. the jays could win a game 12-0 and they would want someone gone because of one play(funny thing ;)). i remember people were talking about how the Raptors suck when they were in the playoffs?? and before when the Leafs were good with Pat Quinn, i remember the Leafs went on a 10 game winning streak and came out of it with a 8-2 loss or something like that and there was an article in the paper about how Pat Quinn needs to get fired...kind of ridiculous

and ill follow that statement up with saying that i am quite often like that even tho i criticize it and i would like to see Gibbons fired after this hot streak ends but not because i dont like Gibby(which i dont) but because typically teams play way better right when a new manager comes in and it could be the push we need to get into the playoffs :D

subaltern
05-30-2008, 02:35 PM
McJoe - That is hilarious! It's true isn't it.

But first, the Leafs and the Raptors DO suck. The Jays are a different story. :)

Second, It's not one play that makes me lose faith in the Eck.

Third, for the record: I am a fan of Gibbons (maybe the only one), but he is tactically very good with pitcher match-usp he has the bullpen overachieving and he is has done this consistently over his career so it's no fluke.

JaysFan87
05-30-2008, 02:40 PM
Thanks for responding...


JaysFan87 - Congrats, you know how to multiply 56 by 0.85. Genius! Too bad english is your second language. It's a pretty stupid response given that I didn't say that Eckstein was in every game that I watched this year. I am just expressing my lack of enthusiasm when he is a starter. Try re-reading the post with a dictionary, it might help you to understand the bigger words. ;)

Dunny33 - I do play the game--2B, with minus minus range, minus minus arm ;)--so I understand the significance of defense. I am also a third base coach. By the way, I am NOT saying Eckstein is crap. I am saying the Jays are better without him in the line-up.

I really think you're under-estimating the importance of range and defensive liability in the field, but since you sound like you play the game: please elaborate on your experience. If you're right, you're right. I won't argue but if you say I am an idiot it makes me question whether you know anything at all.

Prove me wrong.

Also:
It was a year where no one really deserved the WS MVP. Maybe if Chris Carpenter had his second start he would've got it (8 scoreless innings in his first game). I think you could make a case for Rolen too.

2006 World Series
David Eckstein .364BA .391OBP .500SLG
Scott Rolen .421BA .476OBP .737SLG

WillRain - I don't think I am *****in... at all. Just curious what you peeps think. Big mistake! ;)

Bartlett2266 - I appreciate your comment. That is hard to contest! But the dude simply is not a run producer historically. But I like those numbers on the Jays. Okay, maybe don't release him, how about a trade. Wouldn't Billy Beane cream his pants for a Moneyballer like Eckstein? Maybe for a low-a ball prospect or a right-handed reliever (I am not loving Benitez, Frasor, Camp).

Boilerguy & Bomber0104 - The rings are definitely shiney. And he is gamer for the post-season. But so was Mark Lemke... think about it. ;)

tuck25 - Sounds like your enjoying your unemployment insurance thanks for welcoming me to the forum!

P.S. Get a job! ;)


i guess u missed the point when i said that u are basing ECks value on 32 games....clearly ur the one that needs a dictionary.....

Canadian hemi
05-30-2008, 02:50 PM
cool subaltern didn't pick on me..hehehe

boilerguy2412
05-30-2008, 03:02 PM
I don't care who u are or what you have done all year. As much as baseball is a team sport is is based on indivual plays. For Eck or anyone else to be able to win 2 worls series rings in only 8 years makes that person a winner. It is not like he was a bench player. I don't think about just his numbers this guy brings it in the clubhouse if that isn't 1A it's 1B. I honestly see where u are coming from but you honestly have to sit and think about what this guy brings to the Blue jays and not just the feild. I might be going over the line a bit but Johnny Macs D alone is never going to win us a game. It might help us win some but we have to score runs and right now we are struggling a lot at that and Eck is the man that can bring us those runs


P.S. as for the collision yesterday everyone knows the shortstop is the leader on the feild and gets finally say. If Eck was calling for that ball Hill has to get out of the way

subaltern
05-30-2008, 03:48 PM
i guess u missed the point when i said that u are basing ECks value on 32 games....clearly ur the one that needs a dictionary.....

Oh man, are you serious? No, really, are you serious? Nevermind, it's a wasted effort reponding to you.

subaltern
05-30-2008, 03:49 PM
cool subaltern didn't pick on me..hehehe

That's 'cause you like Wendell Clark!

subaltern
05-30-2008, 03:53 PM
P.S. as for the collision yesterday everyone knows the shortstop is the leader on the feild and gets finally say. If Eck was calling for that ball Hill has to get out of the way


Word up, that is specifically why I am calling him out. He should have called Hill off or see that the ball was on the 2B side and should give way.

Check it out:

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200805292794710

subaltern
05-30-2008, 03:54 PM
Thanks for the thread.

Ciao.

tuck25
05-30-2008, 05:23 PM
Thanks for responding...

tuck25 - Sounds like your enjoying your unemployment insurance thanks for welcoming me to the forum!

P.S. Get a job! ;)

WHO said anything about UNEMPLOYMENT you pinhead. READ the post I said GREAT job, not DEAD END job like you. I work in the winters in the OILFIELD in northern Alberta for a company called ConocoPhillips Canada. I make 40K+ a month for 6 months( do the math) and take the summers off to travel, play sports and be with my family( to most thats a GREAT job, don't you agree, if not please enlighten Me as to what is). They have Aircards for Laptops(MLBTV), Extra innings for games you can't afford to watch, XM broadcasts all the games and my Treo 700 gets MLB Mobile, so before you ask if I'm on the road (like yesterday cause I was at Volley Ball Nationals in Calgary with my 14 year old) i STILL get the game, just hard to post and drive the same time. Oh and I own 2 computer stores so if you need a job PM me i will see what I can't do.;) Idiot.

tuck25
05-30-2008, 05:24 PM
cool subaltern didn't pick on me..hehehe

LOL, he tried but I'm the one laughing.

nstojic
05-30-2008, 06:12 PM
TS, good post... i agree 100%... i can't stand the guy but my disgust is on D... he's awful!!!! people say he plays at 100%, duhhhh! he has to play that way just to be able to get the ball to 1B on every ****ing routine ground ball that jmac easily sidearms over there... and that was sooooooooo hill's ball yesterday... eck had NO business over there... at the plate, he's consistent like you said... but THAT'S IT! consistently weak... the ONE thing i do like about his is his hustle on ground outs because, as i've said in a previous post, it puts a lil pressure on the D to get the ball over there in time and sometimes their throws are ever so slightly off... but even that, will probably get him on base once or twice a year... big whoop...


as far as jaysfan, ignore that guy... he's a gigantic pain in da ***.... i've already said.. it's like he's got all this pent up anger inside and he unleashes it on this forum for the few hours a day that his grandma lets him on the internets... plus, his spelling/grammer is awful... hooked-on-phonics FTW

nstojic
05-30-2008, 06:13 PM
WHO said anything about UNEMPLOYMENT you pinhead. READ the post I said GREAT job, not DEAD END job like you. I work in the winters in the OILFIELD in northern Alberta for a company called ConocoPhillips Canada. I make 40K+ a month for 6 months( do the math) and take the summers off to travel, play sports and be with my family( to most thats a GREAT job, don't you agree, if not please enlighten Me as to what is). They have Aircards for Laptops(MLBTV), Extra innings for games you can't afford to watch, XM broadcasts all the games and my Treo 700 gets MLB Mobile, so before you ask if I'm on the road (like yesterday cause I was at Volley Ball Nationals in Calgary with my 14 year old) i STILL get the game, just hard to post and drive the same time. Oh and I own 2 computer stores so if you need a job PM me i will see what I can't do.;) Idiot.

you know where he works? lol, flex that internet muscle tuck.. i'll try... let's see...oh, i got one, i'm a CEO at a textile company in japan and i'm too busy to watch all the games.. but i do own 10 computer stores but we're not hiring at the moment

tuck25
05-30-2008, 08:45 PM
you know where he works? lol, flex that internet muscle tuck.. i'll try... let's see...oh, i got one, i'm a CEO at a textile company in japan and i'm too busy to watch all the games.. but i do own 10 computer stores but we're not hiring at the moment

What muscle you taking about ??. I'm just stating what he said as me being an unemployed bum is wrong and that when i said a GREAT JOB i was telling the truth. Did you even read the WHOLE thread, or just figure you would throw in your 2 cents worth anyway. Good for you and your job, and sorry you are to busy to enjoy life. How is Japan, I will be then Sept.:rolleyes:

P.S. Although I don't agree with Jaysfan87's opinions all the time, LOL, maybe you could comment on something more meaningful then someones GRAMMER, Try and argue his stats( like i have, and lost) MR. CEO. He and Willrain are always dead on, and i respect them for that, not about someones grammer, And yes i said He and. I think some people just want to start **** because there life sucks, so everyone else should too.

statquo
05-30-2008, 09:12 PM
WHO said anything about UNEMPLOYMENT you pinhead. READ the post I said GREAT job, not DEAD END job like you. I work in the winters in the OILFIELD in northern Alberta for a company called ConocoPhillips Canada. I make 40K+ a month for 6 months( do the math) and take the summers off to travel, play sports and be with my family( to most thats a GREAT job, don't you agree, if not please enlighten Me as to what is). They have Aircards for Laptops(MLBTV), Extra innings for games you can't afford to watch, XM broadcasts all the games and my Treo 700 gets MLB Mobile, so before you ask if I'm on the road (like yesterday cause I was at Volley Ball Nationals in Calgary with my 14 year old) i STILL get the game, just hard to post and drive the same time. Oh and I own 2 computer stores so if you need a job PM me i will see what I can't do.;) Idiot.

Nice to see a fellow rigger finding time in between 12 hour shifts to post on on PSD!

tuck25
05-30-2008, 09:18 PM
Nice to see a fellow rigger finding time in between 12 hour shifts to post on on PSD!

Thanks man, same to you. What company you work for, PD ???. I'm consulting on the service rig side, your on the drilling i guess ??? Going to be a good year.:D

JaysFan87
05-30-2008, 09:22 PM
TS, good post... i agree 100%... i can't stand the guy but my disgust is on D... he's awful!!!! people say he plays at 100%, duhhhh! he has to play that way just to be able to get the ball to 1B on every ****ing routine ground ball that jmac easily sidearms over there... and that was sooooooooo hill's ball yesterday... eck had NO business over there... at the plate, he's consistent like you said... but THAT'S IT! consistently weak... the ONE thing i do like about his is his hustle on ground outs because, as i've said in a previous post, it puts a lil pressure on the D to get the ball over there in time and sometimes their throws are ever so slightly off... but even that, will probably get him on base once or twice a year... big whoop...


as far as jaysfan, ignore that guy... he's a gigantic pain in da ***.... i've already said.. it's like he's got all this pent up anger inside and he unleashes it on this forum for the few hours a day that his grandma lets him on the internets... plus, his spelling/grammer is awful... hooked-on-phonics FTW

look here we are acting all tough behind a computer screen, if u and ur dumb *** friend read the posts i never insulted or made fun of in any way i just responded by saying that u can not
A) judge a player based on 32 games (even though he is actually posting a better OPS+ than his career avg at this point in the season) and
B) i think ur wrong.
For some reason u feel that everyone should agree with ur dumb *** opinions all the time. When in fact people don't have to. But w/e clearly ur *** is too dumb to actually have a a structured debate because u just don't know how.

OHH and BTW last time i checked Snider was tearing up AA pitching...so much for u saying that JP doesn't know how to manage his minor leagues. ;)

JaysFan87
05-30-2008, 09:23 PM
Oh man, are you serious? No, really, are you serious? Nevermind, it's a wasted effort reponding to you.

wasted because u dont know what to say or that because im not agreeing with u,i must be wrong?

JaysFan87
05-30-2008, 09:27 PM
you know where he works? lol, flex that internet muscle tuck.. i'll try... let's see...oh, i got one, i'm a CEO at a textile company in japan and i'm too busy to watch all the games.. but i do own 10 computer stores but we're not hiring at the moment

then go back to japan....

i really dont understand the purpose of u being here if u are always going to come back with personal insults to people who don't agree with u. If u are not civilized or smart enough to engage in actually debate without having to come back with insults then u are in the wrong place. Maybe the kids in school didn't beat u up enough for u to get the message about shutting up once in a while.....Maybe they can teach u that next year when u finally get into grade 3......

nstojic
05-30-2008, 09:46 PM
thanks for the tips, winner

i don't live in japan you dumbasses... that's called sarcasm and it was mocking the oil rig guy and his 2 computer stores

tuck25
05-30-2008, 09:52 PM
thanks for the tips, winner

i don't live in japan you dumbasses... that's called sarcasm and it was mocking the oil rig guy and his 2 computer stores

You can try and mock all you want, your dum worthless *** won't last a day where i work, why don't you come to Grande Prairie, AB and i will give you the free tour, you idiot. So try and talk baseball and see if you can keep up. And who was talking to you in the first place, I said I watch all the games because i have a great job and that guy though i was unemployed, the said get a job, and when i state what i do your dum *** comes i and stats shooting ****. Try this on for size and but out. Remember when your dad told you " I know your stupid and you know your stupid, but if you keep your mouth shut no one else will know your stupid" you should have listened, STUPID.

JaysFan87
05-30-2008, 09:54 PM
thanks for the tips, winner

i don't live in japan you dumbasses... that's called sarcasm and it was mocking the oil rig guy and his 2 computer stores

i know u dont live in japan u dumbass....thats called sarcasm and i was mocking ur dumb ***.......

subaltern
05-30-2008, 11:07 PM
wasted because u dont know what to say or that because im not agreeing with u,i must be wrong?

Wow, do all posts deteriorate to this banality?

It's not that I don't agree with you. First you have to have an opinion or an arguement to counter what I'm proposing for me to disagree with you.

The reason I didn't want to respond was because you have taken what I have written on such a referential and simplistic level that it makes me think you haven't hit puberty. But I think you have, if you've been a Jays Fan since 1987 (I am guessing the meaning behind your username).

-----

The thing is, David Eckstein's stats can be tracked all the way down to his 992 games played. So this gives me an overview of his past accomplishments. Which you could say might be something to expect again this year. I also look at his current numbers and project them over the entire year and then consider the factors that I stated in my original post. Based on the comparative numbers and then seeing his lack of athleticism and probably being a little influenced from previous media/professional criticism I figure there is a case to be made that perhaps the Jays might be a better team without Eck holding one of the roster spots.

Prove me wrong, or come up with a compelling argument on why he is so valuable instead of calculating the number of games I've watched compared with the number of games Eckstein has played as a Blue Jay. (What sort of comment is that any way?)

-----

Watch, tonight he will turn two unassisted triple plays and dive into the left field stands catching a pop up that stewart can't track down, while going 4 for 4 with 7 rbi (all with RISP with 2 outs) haha.

tuck25
05-30-2008, 11:17 PM
Wow, do all posts deteriorate to this banality?

It's not that I don't agree with you. First you have to have an opinion or an arguement to counter what I'm proposing for me to disagree with you.

The reason I didn't want to respond was because you have taken what I have written on such a referential and simplistic level that it makes me think you haven't hit puberty. But I think you have, if you've been a Jays Fan since 1987 (I am guessing the meaning behind your username).

-----

The thing is, David Eckstein's stats can be tracked all the way down to his 992 games played. So this gives me an overview of his past accomplishments. Which you could say might be something to expect again this year. I also look at his current numbers and project them over the entire year and then consider the factors that I stated in my original post. Based on the comparative numbers and then seeing his lack of athleticism and probably being a little influenced from previous media/professional criticism I figure there is a case to be made that perhaps the Jays might be a better team without Eck holding one of the roster spots.

Prove me wrong, or come up with a compelling argument on why he is so valuable instead of calculating the number of games I've watched compared with the number of games Eckstein has played as a Blue Jay. (What sort of comment is that any way?)

-----

Watch, tonight he will turn two unassisted triple plays and dive into the left field stands catching a pop up that stewart can't track down, while going 4 for 4 with 7 rbi (all with RISP with 2 outs) haha.

No, just when people make **** up and make it personal, then **** hits the fan quick. LOL

nstojic
05-30-2008, 11:25 PM
Wow, do all posts deteriorate to this banality?

It's not that I don't agree with you. First you have to have an opinion or an arguement to counter what I'm proposing for me to disagree with you.

The reason I didn't want to respond was because you have taken what I have written on such a referential and simplistic level that it makes me think you haven't hit puberty. But I think you have, if you've been a Jays Fan since 1987 (I am guessing the meaning behind your username).

-----

The thing is, David Eckstein's stats can be tracked all the way down to his 992 games played. So this gives me an overview of his past accomplishments. Which you could say might be something to expect again this year. I also look at his current numbers and project them over the entire year and then consider the factors that I stated in my original post. Based on the comparative numbers and then seeing his lack of athleticism and probably being a little influenced from previous media/professional criticism I figure there is a case to be made that perhaps the Jays might be a better team without Eck holding one of the roster spots.

Prove me wrong, or come up with a compelling argument on why he is so valuable instead of calculating the number of games I've watched compared with the number of games Eckstein has played as a Blue Jay. (What sort of comment is that any way?)

-----

Watch, tonight he will turn two unassisted triple plays and dive into the left field stands catching a pop up that stewart can't track down, while going 4 for 4 with 7 rbi (all with RISP with 2 outs) haha.

he was born in '87

nstojic
05-30-2008, 11:26 PM
You can try and mock all you want, your dum worthless *** won't last a day where i work, why don't you come to Grande Prairie, AB and i will give you the free tour, you idiot. So try and talk baseball and see if you can keep up. And who was talking to you in the first place, I said I watch all the games because i have a great job and that guy though i was unemployed, the said get a job, and when i state what i do your dum *** comes i and stats shooting ****. Try this on for size and but out. Remember when your dad told you " I know your stupid and you know your stupid, but if you keep your mouth shut no one else will know your stupid" you should have listened, STUPID.

you and jaysfan, same summer school english class? is that where you two met?

tuck25
05-30-2008, 11:31 PM
you and jaysfan, same summer school english class? is that where you two met?

No, but thats where I tapped your mom.:clap: If you don't believe me, ask her. Anyway I'm done commenting on your stupid shat, I have a life, and it's past your bed time so, later pinhead. Just keep the bold in mind next time you open your mouth.(or type)

subaltern
05-30-2008, 11:44 PM
No, just when people make **** up and make it personal, then **** hits the fan quick. LOL

LOL

:horse:

tuck25 - Sorry if I've offended you, I was just teasing you because even in your first post you had to reassure us that you have a great job in parentheses. Plus you made a slight jab at the fact I'm a Noob! So I had to return the ******-slap. Call it a balance thing. Haha.

You know if you would've just said you saw all the games I would be like "dude, now there's a fan."

My first suggest might be to try to have a little more self-asteem. You don't have to tell us how successful you are. I assume you are peers of Warren Buffett. So I guess it shocks me a little where I hear commentary that kind of leaves me with a WTF mentality. :)

Perhaps I should clarify: this thread is about DAVID ECKSTEIN and whether he is a valuable Blue Jay. tuck25, this is NOT ABOUT YOU, your employment status nor your income tax bracket.

Perhaps, I can start another post explaining why I think you'd be wrong as the Blue Jays starting shortstop and you can counter by telling me that your computer stores are turning a major profits in Grand Prairie because the inflation makes laptops, aircards and Big Macs ten thousand a pop. :)

Also, I just had to re-read the entire thread to see what sort of 'contribution' you made as I couldn't remember if you made any constructive commentary that you are claiming to have. The only thing you mentioned was that you saw all the games this year and you are dumbfounded that I think David Eckstein is mediocre and simply enjoy the Blue Jays being 4 games above .500.

Thanks everyone for posting, it's been entertaining. I might try it again some time.

Go Jays!

tuck25
05-31-2008, 12:01 AM
LOL

:horse:

tuck25 - Sorry if I've offended you, I was just teasing you because even in your first post you had to reassure us that you have a great job in parentheses. Plus you made a slight jab at the fact I'm a Noob! So I had to return the ******-slap. Call it a balance thing. Haha.

You know if you would've just said you saw all the games I would be like "dude, now there's a fan."

My first suggest might be to try to have a little more self-asteem. You don't have to tell us how successful you are. I assume you are peers of Warren Buffett. So I guess it shocks me a little where I hear commentary that kind of leaves me with a WTF mentality. :)

Perhaps I should clarify: this thread is about DAVID ECKSTEIN and whether he is a valuable Blue Jay. tuck25, this is NOT ABOUT YOU, your employment status nor your income tax bracket.

Perhaps, I can start another post explaining why I think you'd be wrong as the Blue Jays starting shortstop and you can counter by telling me that your computer stores are turning a major profits in Grand Prairie because the inflation makes laptops, aircards and Big Macs ten thousand a pop. :)

Also, I just had to re-read the entire thread to see what sort of 'contribution' you made as I couldn't remember if you made any constructive commentary that you are claiming to have. The only thing you mentioned was that you saw all the games this year and you are dumbfounded that I think David Eckstein is mediocre and simply enjoy the Blue Jays being 4 games above .500.

Thanks everyone for posting, it's been entertaining. I might try it again some time.

Go Jays!

No problem man, not offended really. In my first post i said i had a great job yes, the reason i said that was because the next person would have said DON"T YOU WORK ?? so i figured i would bet them to it. And i wasn't taking a jab at being a noob, I put LOL after the welcome as this is what to expect in the forum when questioning a Jay, like i do with Zaun and Gibbon's.
I wouldn't have stated what my job was if you hadn't said how is unemployment and get a job with a funny face. When you did i posted what my job was and that I'm proud and lucky I'm not unemployed.
Anyway as for ECK i think he brings alot more then his play on the field( which is good, IMO) so i don't think trading/releasing would be a good idea.:D So:cheers: Enjoy the game and lets hope Notsodic keeps his nose out of this one.lol

JermanJaysFan
05-31-2008, 12:29 AM
Everybody just take a breather and get away from all this personal stuff.

I totally disagree with the thread topic. I can understand subaltern's frustration, but releasing him is totally illogical. Eck is a good guy to have around. He has good clutch stats on a team that is lacking them. I know he isn't nearly as electric in the field as Johnny Mac, but he gets the job done. And about the Hill collision, we can't tell who was calling what, but that is the SS's ball all the way, assuming he was calling for it.

frostilicus
05-31-2008, 01:06 AM
For the record, I live in Japan.

tuck25
05-31-2008, 01:13 AM
For the record, I live in Japan.

LOL. Really, what part?? How is it there cause it looks like I will be in Sept. for a week or 2.

nstojic
05-31-2008, 01:14 AM
No problem man, not offended really. In my first post i said i had a great job yes, the reason i said that was because the next person would have said DON"T YOU WORK ?? so i figured i would bet them to it. Enjoy the game and lets hope Notsodic keeps his nose out of this one.lol

'bet' them what? lots of time to gamble up in the sticks, eh? yah, that notsodic guy sucks....?@??!

tuck25
05-31-2008, 01:19 AM
bet them what? lots of time to gamble up in the sticks, eh? yah, that notsodic guy sucks....?@??!
What sticks?? you mean TREES. Notsodic, our to stupid to know when someone is making fun of you, so look close, and ask your mom what swear word has 5 letters, and if you find out, post it, but i'm done typing to a 6 year old. Nite

nstojic
05-31-2008, 01:27 AM
What sticks?? you mean TREES. Notsodic, our to stupid to know when someone is making fun of you, so look close, and ask your mom what swear word has 5 letters, and if you find out, post it, but i'm done typing to a 6 year old. Nite

i think you mean 'you're too', son.... turn off the nightlight, there's no monster in the closet...

JaysFan87
05-31-2008, 01:36 AM
Wow, do all posts deteriorate to this banality?

No..just urs


It's not that I don't agree with you. First you have to have an opinion or an arguement to counter what I'm proposing for me to disagree with you.

if u knew how to read u would see it


The reason I didn't want to respond was because you have taken what I have written on such a referential and simplistic level that it makes me think you haven't hit puberty. But I think you have, if you've been a Jays Fan since 1987 (I am guessing the meaning behind your username).

If im taking what u said so simplistic then maybe u shoudl look at what u type b4 u read it. Cause i guarantee u that ur thoughts are not that complex....


-----

The thing is, David Eckstein's stats can be tracked all the way down to his 992 games played. So this gives me an overview of his past accomplishments. Which you could say might be something to expect again this year. I also look at his current numbers and project them over the entire year and then consider the factors that I stated in my original post. Based on the comparative numbers and then seeing his lack of athleticism and probably being a little influenced from previous media/professional criticism I figure there is a case to be made that perhaps the Jays might be a better team without Eck holding one of the roster spots.

Prove me wrong, or come up with a compelling argument on why he is so valuable instead of calculating the number of games I've watched compared with the number of games Eckstein has played as a Blue Jay. (What sort of comment is that any way?)

LOL i dont know what to tell u.....Eck has never been a great hitting shortstop. But he does a little of everything and has been on 2 WS teams and MVP on one of them. If that doesn't mean anything to u then i dont know what to tell u....

-----


Watch, tonight he will turn two unassisted triple plays and dive into the left field stands catching a pop up that stewart can't track down, while going 4 for 4 with 7 rbi (all with RISP with 2 outs) haha.

good one really, ur wasting ur time on PSD with that kinda of talent...if u never want to post here again because its apparent u have exceptional skills elsewhere then by all means go for it, don't let me stop u....

JaysFan87
05-31-2008, 01:40 AM
LOL

:horse:

tuck25 - Sorry if I've offended you, I was just teasing you because even in your first post you had to reassure us that you have a great job in parentheses. Plus you made a slight jab at the fact I'm a Noob! So I had to return the ******-slap. Call it a balance thing. Haha.

You know if you would've just said you saw all the games I would be like "dude, now there's a fan."

My first suggest might be to try to have a little more self-asteem. You don't have to tell us how successful you are. I assume you are peers of Warren Buffett. So I guess it shocks me a little where I hear commentary that kind of leaves me with a WTF mentality. :)

Perhaps I should clarify: this thread is about DAVID ECKSTEIN and whether he is a valuable Blue Jay. tuck25, this is NOT ABOUT YOU, your employment status nor your income tax bracket.

Perhaps, I can start another post explaining why I think you'd be wrong as the Blue Jays starting shortstop and you can counter by telling me that your computer stores are turning a major profits in Grand Prairie because the inflation makes laptops, aircards and Big Macs ten thousand a pop. :)

Also, I just had to re-read the entire thread to see what sort of 'contribution' you made as I couldn't remember if you made any constructive commentary that you are claiming to have. The only thing you mentioned was that you saw all the games this year and you are dumbfounded that I think David Eckstein is mediocre and simply enjoy the Blue Jays being 4 games above .500.

Thanks everyone for posting, it's been entertaining. I might try it again some time.

Go Jays!

please dont...

tuck25
05-31-2008, 01:43 AM
i think you mean 'you're too', son.... turn off the nightlight, there's no monster in the closet...

Your the one with the simpson muscle avatar, son, is that how you see your self ?? When you grow up and use roids, one day you can look like that, really. You must be at least 15, am I right??? Don't lie, i will tell your mom, oh i forgot, when i told you to ask your mom about me, i never told you i used the name Devon White, so no sorry, he is not your dad.:cry: like she though. Stupidity must be in the family cause I'm not even Black. Hmmm go figure. I the words of Ron White " you can't fix stupid"

nstojic
05-31-2008, 01:45 AM
Your the one with the simpson avatar, son. You must be at least 15, am I right??? Don't lie, i will tell your mom, oh i forgot, when i told you to ask your mom about me, i never told you i used the name Devon White, so no sorry is not your dad.:cry:

hahha where do you get this stuff?

statquo
05-31-2008, 01:57 AM
Thanks man, same to you. What company you work for, PD ???. I'm consulting on the service rig side, your on the drilling i guess ??? Going to be a good year.:D

Drilling for Ensign in southeastern alberta. ****ing rights its going to be a good year. haha.

tuck25
05-31-2008, 02:05 AM
Drilling for Ensign in southeastern alberta. ****ing rights its going to be a good year. haha.

Right on man, sounds good. Should be able to pay for that Bayliner after all. LOL. I got some friend down around Loyd and Provost working for PD, they said it is going to be a good year also. Cheers:cheers:

Halladay
05-31-2008, 03:16 PM
Everyone knew Eckstein wasn't a great player but he also wasn't a bad player when we got him. The fact is, he gets the job done. He's the best SS(overall) this team has had in a long time. He's also not a long-term solution. If you release him, who becomes our SS? John McDonald? No thanks, not full time anyway. Hector Luna? Royce Clayton? lol, this list of SS's used has been endless. The only other guy worth noting is Scooter and he's a super sub not a full time guy. Eckstein was brought in for a year so the Jays could bring in a better SS next off-season, it's not like he was signed to a 5 year contract or something.

nithanyo
06-01-2008, 12:47 PM
Eckstien isnt so special defensively, but atleast he's the best hitting ss we had in a long time. Plus that spark has been missing since O-dog got traded and every winning clubhouse needs that and Eckstien has it. I'd rather have a poor defensive but good hitting ss than a slick fielding ss who cant hit a beachball.(especially with this lineup)

fatkev78
06-01-2008, 05:43 PM
well that was an entertaining read.....thx guys!

StayOnBoard
06-04-2008, 03:26 PM
Threads like this is honestly why I don't post in this forum anymore....

Half of you are under the age of 15 and couldn't spark two IQ's together if your life(lives) depended on it.

This doesn't go to everyone of course, more to the childish folks who wouldn't even believe someone's job (because really, he has a reason to lie that he's been on an oil rig). Please...

BTW for the record, I also live in Alberta and I also know that guys up in Fort Mac DO make 30k+ a month for 6-9 months of the year. Get your facts straight before making yourself look like a complete ***. Yes that's at you nstojic, flame on I could care less

Oh and btw, I make $65/hr in Alberta and work from home... feel free to call me a liar too. Idiot.....

subaltern
06-04-2008, 09:35 PM
BTW for the record, I also live in Alberta and I also know that guys up in Fort Mac

Thanks for keeping it real dude. My intentions for the post were completely earnest. I even posed it as a question!!! But I can see how you've grow tired of the numb-nuts that call you an idiot for casting a proposition.

It's all in fun I guess.

:sigh:

con_artist
06-05-2008, 11:17 AM
Are u ****ing crazy? Why the hell would we release Eckstein?

malcolmclark
06-05-2008, 11:35 AM
What we gained with Eck was the type of play we lost from Reed. Flat out hard nosed player. The guy plays the game the right way. I like johny mac cause stellar defense and you would see him more in late inning games for defense if the Jays had played better early in the year. Now that they are playing good ball he is hurt. Eck and Rolen were great pick ups.

Mile High Champ
06-05-2008, 03:23 PM
As long as Scuturo gets in enough, thats all i care about..

subaltern
06-06-2008, 03:54 PM
"What if Jays shortstop David Eckstein had managed to snag Alex Rodriguez's grounder in the ninth inning instead of deflecting it between himself and third baseman Scott Rolen?"

-- Samantha Newman, associate reporter for MLB.com

tuck25
06-06-2008, 04:44 PM
"What if Jays shortstop David Eckstein had managed to snag Alex Rodriguez's grounder in the ninth inning instead of deflecting it between himself and third baseman Scott Rolen?"

-- Samantha Newman, associate reporter for MLB.com

I can't see ECK being blamed for that play when Rolen blocked him, really. Since coming off the DL Eck has been great. And he didn't deflect it between himself and Rolen, Rolen blocked him going after the ball and ECK defected it to the outfield, BIG difference, watch the replay.

bomber0104
06-06-2008, 05:42 PM
Yeah at least report the play correctly

subaltern
06-07-2008, 02:18 AM
"After Luke Scott reached on shortstop David Eckstein's error, Jones hit a two-run homer to left that barely scraped over the wall, making it 6-4."

-- The Associated Press News Service

subaltern
06-07-2008, 02:19 AM
"Blue Jays 2B Aaron Hill (concussion) missed his seventh straight game. Hill collided with Eckstein on May 29 in Oakland and is still suffering lightheadedness and headaches. Hill, who was checked by a doctor in Toronto on Friday, will likely land on the disabled list if he is unable to return soon."

-- The Associated Press News Service

subaltern
06-07-2008, 02:24 AM
watch the replay

hi tuck25, post it.

tuck25
06-07-2008, 03:26 AM
"After Luke Scott reached on shortstop David Eckstein's error, Jones hit a two-run homer to left that barely scraped over the wall, making it 6-4."

Very true ECK ****ed it up bad, can't say anything else.

-- The Associated Press News Service


"Blue Jays 2B Aaron Hill (concussion) missed his seventh straight game. Hill collided with Eckstein on May 29 in Oakland and is still suffering lightheadedness and headaches. Hill, who was checked by a doctor in Toronto on Friday, will likely land on the disabled list if he is unable to return soon."

-- The Associated Press News Service

Also true, but is it just me or is Hill a *****, my little girl hits harder then that for **** sake and he might need a DL stint. WOW HIS HEAD HIT HIS ELBOW i watched the replay several times, ive lost some respect for Hill on this one.



hi tuck25, post it.

I will if i can find it, i have it on my PVR if that helps, LOL, but im looking.

nstojic
06-14-2008, 01:41 PM
awesome play in the 2nd there... i despise eckstein....

JAYZFAN9
06-14-2008, 02:18 PM
Yeah, his D is very suspect. But in typical jays fashion, its a one year 'stopgap' solution.

nstojic
06-14-2008, 03:25 PM
Yeah, his D is very suspect. But in typical jays fashion, its a one year 'stopgap' solution.

Jmac would've made that play on his feet... keyword: made! anywho, since A-Gon, you're right, it's been one after another.... bring back tomas perez!!! hahaha... oh michael young... what could have been....

bomber0104
06-14-2008, 04:21 PM
I dont think the Jays can live with Macdonald's .150 avg everyday.

subaltern
06-14-2008, 06:18 PM
.150 is not making me very happy either but maybe some regular playing time would get his timing down. if he was hitting .250 I would gladly replace Eck's bat for Macdonald's glove.

Oh and by the way more trash talk that I didn't write! :) Check out the link below.

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080614&content_id=2924914&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

tuck25
06-14-2008, 06:50 PM
.150 is not making me very happy either but maybe some regular playing time would get his timing down. if he was hitting .250 I would gladly replace Eck's bat for Macdonald's glove.

Oh and by the way more trash talk that I didn't write! :) Check out the link below.

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080614&content_id=2924914&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

Interesting read. WOW, wouldn't that be something if he can't come back from this like Corey Koskie, i don't think it's that bad but just imagine, after the contract signing too.:(

nstojic
06-14-2008, 07:50 PM
.150 is not making me very happy either but maybe some regular playing time would get his timing down. if he was hitting .250 I would gladly replace Eck's bat for Macdonald's glove.

Oh and by the way more trash talk that I didn't write! :) Check out the link below.

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080614&content_id=2924914&vkey=news_tor&fext=.jsp&c_id=tor

****ing eckstein!!!!!! ****!!!

bidi_nash
06-15-2008, 10:54 AM
Id love to see Johnny Mac in there too bbut we already have enough players that cant hit with consistency so id rater see eck in hitting for like 7 innings and Johnny Mac in there for the 8th and 9th if we re winning

subaltern
08-08-2008, 12:36 PM
Toronto is 15-8 with a .652 winning percentage when John McDonald starts at shortstop. ...

blujaysrock
08-08-2008, 12:47 PM
thats pretty good^^ let's start him more! that proves his bat has very ltitle to do with it

MyJaysrock
08-08-2008, 01:40 PM
thats pretty good^^ let's start him more! that proves his bat has very ltitle to do with it

I agree! As long as the rest of the lineup is producing we should let him start every game. The guys is probably the best defensive SS in the AL

WillRain
08-08-2008, 07:35 PM
Releasing Eck would be stupid...he might be a type B FA this year which would net us a draft pick.

subaltern
09-01-2008, 03:04 AM
gone!

traded to arizona for a former 14th round draft pick.

sweet.

now let's focus on getting a good power-lefty DH.

carsonauto
09-01-2008, 03:08 AM
Oh god why would you revive this, why.

Though it is interesting to see what people thought the bulk of a month ago.

subaltern
09-01-2008, 03:17 AM
what can i say, i like closure.

:horse:

WillRain
09-01-2008, 03:38 AM
I stand by my last comment.
:dance:

Zaunnie
09-01-2008, 11:07 AM
why man, just why?