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  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by dabears34ft View Post
    I don't really think he's going to be Kahwi Leonard or Klay or PG or Jimmy. I just throw those reports out to show people that the same type of things have been said about all these guys. That's why they went after the 10th pick. It's just 4 instances where scouting was off. 4 times where more flashy swing for the fence guys were taken higher, and it didn't pay off.

    I truly don't know what kind of offensive player he will be in the NBA. I just know that based on his percentages, I'm willing to take a shot because we need a defender at the wing like him.

    Most in here just disagree that we are in a position to take a safe pick, and think we have to swing for the fences. I feel like our swing for the fences are Lauri and Lavine. Those are the 2 guys we need to be great if this group is going to be worth a damn. I want to draft defensive Wing or Big with upside to go with what we have. The reason I lean Wing is because we already have a solid vet in Rolo at C, and we already have 2 young projects in Portis and Lauri at the 4. Get great complements to get the most out of everyone we have in our young core.
    Yeah, I like being aggressive which is why I'm advocating for a trade up. That's swinging for the fences, IMO. I don't like the idea of taking a swing on guys like Young. Mainly, because I have extremely low conviction he ever lives up to his ceiling. And if I don't have conviction on that, why would I be ok with drafting him? The Bulls took a swing on Tyrus Thomas when Aldridge was available. And even though Aldridge has made a nice career for himself, Thomas had the higher upside. Of course, you could point to all different types of scenario throughout the history of the draft. Bottom line is, you draft a player you have the highest conviction on...not the guy with the highest ceiling. Unless perhaps the difference between conviction and ceiling is minimal.

  2. #722
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  3. #723
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    Quote Originally Posted by KG2TB View Post
    Yeah, I like being aggressive which is why I'm advocating for a trade up. That's swinging for the fences, IMO. I don't like the idea of taking a swing on guys like Young. Mainly, because I have extremely low conviction he ever lives up to his ceiling. And if I don't have conviction on that, why would I be ok with drafting him? The Bulls took a swing on Tyrus Thomas when Aldridge was available. And even though Aldridge has made a nice career for himself, Thomas had the higher upside. Of course, you could point to all different types of scenario throughout the history of the draft. Bottom line is, you draft a player you have the highest conviction on...not the guy with the highest ceiling. Unless perhaps the difference between conviction and ceiling is minimal.
    A trade up is one way to go. For me though, I'm good with any of the top 8 guys, that doesn't include Trae. I'd prefer to keep all our assets and if anything acquire more assets this draft.

  4. #724
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    Well, let me defend Trae again, lol. We saw him at his best and he was simply amazing, must see TV. When drafting an 18-19 year old, their current best should be their floor 2-3 years from now, let alone 5 years from now, when he has tons more experience and training. His best this year exceeded everybody else's best, including Ayton.

    Michael Porter was great a year ago against HS players, came back, played poorly, but he's still great. Trae played GREAT a couple of months ago against college players, led the league, broke records, and after a poor second half to the season, with entire defenses focused on him and no other players avg more than 10 pts, now he's a NBA role player?

    He probably won't dominate as early as some of the others, so you'll be able to say "I told you so" for a couple of years, lol. But when he's 23-23, with years of NBA experience? Watch out!
    Last edited by infinity2152; 06-12-2018 at 09:49 PM.

  5. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by imReallyCHI View Post
    who is opposed to taking parsons contract for pick 4????


    Yikessssss. That dude is getting 24 next year and 25 the year after 👀👀👀👀😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭. Idk if I’d be down with taking 50 mil in dead salary to move up 3 spots. Now if they offered parsons+4 for 22 then I probably would consider it. Lol

  6. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by KG2TB View Post
    I don't agree with there are plenty of players in every draft like Mikal. When you combine defensive prowess, shooting, efficiency, intangibles, attributes, and being a winner etc, I would say quite the opposite.
    If you're going to put that many qualifiers on it, then sure, lol.

    Mostly saying there are plenty of guys virtually every year with similar frame, measurables, type of skill set as Mikal Bridges. No, they're not exactly the same, but similar.

    However, I would say dabears thinks his ceiling is probably higher than I do.
    dabears literally thinks his ceiling is Kawhi, which is outrageous to me. I just don't see that at all.

    I think his ceiling is somewhere inbetween Otto Porter and PG.
    I think Otto Porter is even a little generous as far as his floor is concerned. I'd lean more towards a current day Ariza, which is a fine player. I don't believe his ceiling is anywhere close to a PG, Kawhi, Jimmy level talent though. We've beaten the reasons to death already, but I believe his ceiling is more limited than that.

    And I'm not advocating Bridges at #7. I'd like the Bulls to trade up.
    This is what I'd like too. There are at least 3 guys I'd be happy with moving up for. JJJ, Bamba, Doncic. I would be okay with MPJ as well, but still concerned about his back.

    But if it's between Bridges and say Young, I'm going Bridges.
    I'd prefer neither and probably just go for WCJ or even a trade down, maybe with the Clippers. I hope it doesn't get to this point though. That'll be a truly depressing draft for me.

    I think you need to have conviction on any player you draft.
    Definitely. It's why I hope they move up. I'm pretty sure they love Bamba. There's definitely mutual interest with MPJ. I'd assume they like/love JJJ, despite not meeting with him (probably due to thinking he won't be there at 7).

    To me, it would just suck to actively tank all season just to miss out on the first wave of players in this draft. Maybe someone like Bridges, Knox, Williams, whoever is that late mid-lottery steal that seems to happen every year, but I'd rather not take my chances with that scenario.
    Last edited by DamnGoat; 06-12-2018 at 10:04 PM.

  7. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoCansSam View Post
    Yikessssss. That dude is getting 24 next year and 25 the year after 👀👀👀👀😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭. Idk if I’d be down with taking 50 mil in dead salary to move up 3 spots. Now if they offered parsons+4 for 22 then I probably would consider it. Lol
    Was thinking the same thing, to have 4 and 7 in this draft would give us so much flexibilty. Been talking Trae up so much, I'm hyped! Imagine the spacing when your pg can launch effectively 3-4 feet beyond the arc, that opens up the floor sooooo much. Every PG guarding him will have to press him, no zone would work with him, Lavine, Markannen, and Portis on the floor. If we could get MPJ too, we'd be tough. Let Dunn play a lot of combo guard minutes like Smart for the Celtics. We need SF's anyway, Parsons could surprise evrybody and stay healthy and play well, that would be icing on the cake!
    Last edited by infinity2152; 06-12-2018 at 10:08 PM.

  8. #728
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    On the 4 + Parson for 7 note, I dont think i do it because there is zero chance I want anything to do with Parsons contract, It pushes our window for signing back a full year from next and his contract is so heavy its going to ruin any ability to sign till 2020, and while that may not seem that big to some, I would rather have 3 opportunities to sign big time guys in 2018, 2019 and 2020 then just have a shot in 2020. I am not sure if we will be able to attract anyone but i would rather attempt to than not have the opportunity to.

    FWIW I would be happy to move up using Portis Valintine Grant or 22 as ammo to o so. but taking on a huge contract i am not so into.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  9. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by infinity2152 View Post
    Well, let me defend Trae again, lol. We saw him at his best and he was simply amazing, must see TV. When drafting an 18-19 year old, their current best should be their floor 2-3 years from now, let alone 5 years from now, when he has tons more experience and training. His best this year exceeded everybody else's best, including Ayton.

    Michael Porter was great a year ago against HS players, came back, played poorly, but he's still great. Trae played GREAT a couple of months ago against college players, led the league, broke records, and after a poor second half to the season, with entire defenses focused on him and no other players avg more than 10 pts, now he's a NBA role player?

    He probably won't dominate as early as some of the others, so you'll be able to say "I told you so" for a couple of years, lol. But when he's 23-23, with years of NBA experience? Watch out!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9MAH0KAUyc

  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by dabears34ft View Post
    I like how people point out his lack of help, but he could have Jesus himself as a teammate and it wouldn’t help because his decisions and timing when getting doubled are atrocious. Now ask yourself, against longer, quicker, more athletic NBA defenders, will that improve or get worse? The answer is obvious. People point out his start of the season, but after tape and game planning along with better competition, we saw what happened. He’d be a terrible pick at #7.

  11. #731
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    Also forgot to add..and probably the most damaging for Young....41st percentile around the basket in COLLEGE. Yikes. Again, anyone think that will improve in the pros? And I haven’t even touched on his defense which is laughable. He’s been so overhyped because of his ridiculous usage which generates impressive raw numbers like PPG and APG. But beyond the smoke and mirrors, his game is ugly as sin.

  12. #732
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    Quote Originally Posted by KG2TB View Post
    Also forgot to add..and probably the most damaging for Young....41st percentile around the basket in COLLEGE. Yikes. Again, anyone think that will improve in the pros? And I haven’t even touched on his defense which is laughable. He’s been so overhyped because of his ridiculous usage which generates impressive raw numbers like PPG and APG. But beyond the smoke and mirrors, his game is ugly as sin.
    He’s still being hyped off his ridiculous non conference numbers. **** they had me watching, but as I watched more and more he got worse and worse

  13. #733
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    A lot of games I watched, Trae would take those patented early shot clock 32 footers and you’d watch the other team build leads in a hurry. Or he’d force himself into the lane and toss up airballs, bricks, or get blocked.
    Last edited by dabears34ft; 06-13-2018 at 12:42 AM.

  14. #734
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    I am not gonna lie Trae is not my ideal guy at all at 7. And truthfully i think he gets taken above us anyway so this argument is pretty moot. But i swear some of you act like thos 18 yo freshman is a finished product. I think there are valid reasons for concern. But seriously some of you are ridiculous.

    His lack of tallent around him was seriously astonishing. He was getting doubled 40+ % of the time (do people realize how ****ing high that is) and made the right play alot of the time. But seriously watch what happens when he does beat the double in any of these games. His teamates take 3 dribbles and look to pass to somebody else because nobody is capable. He literally by the end of the season had to beat a double. To get the ball back. To beat another double in order to get a look or an assist to somebody. It was terrible. And unfortunatly that may also have to do woth coaching because that was all iso ball. Question his decision making if you wish but seriously an 18 YO playing as lebron James on the college level and having success. And as far as his poor finishing around the Rim. Again. If he has to make plays on offense with a whole D focused on him it doesnt surprise me.

    Are there concerns about D. Yes. Am i concerned about TOs. Slightly. But i also see this kid make some incredible plays. Basically while being the focus of 5 defenders. Plays I am not sure i see anyone else in this draft making. Question him if you want. But as an 18 YO he carried that Oklahoma team on his back. Is impressive. And say what u want about its all about his usage. But he would not be used like that if he was not that good. And he would not be doubled 40+ % of the time down the court if teams were not scared of his tallent and wanted the ball out of his hands.

    Still again. Point is Moot. I think there is a good chance Trae goes top 3. And there is zero chance the Magic pass on him IMO. The real question is who falls.

    But i would still take a chance on Trae being great over the security blanket of a 3+D Jr/Sr. Teams now a days dont average themselves into contending. Mikal Bridges would be such a middle of the pack move.

    I meam god forbid.what if Trae young develops like Mikal and where he would be as a 4 year player.
    Last edited by Kyben36; 06-13-2018 at 03:52 AM.

  15. #735
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    I’m telling you more often than not it wasn’t Trae’s teammates blowing those games. It was Trae taking bad shots, driving out of control, and trying to force bad passes that built their deficits. He’d do it at points of the game where it didn’t need to be done. They were cringeworthy decisions. Take the Tourney game for example. They get to overtime due to him driving and drawing fouls late, then as soon as overtime starts he takes 2 terrible shots for no reason. He went right back to his early game antics that built the deficit, when they found something that worked. He shot his team out of games. For 2 months he never adjusted to the adjustments that teams made on him. Sure maybe it could be fixed, but what I saw was when the competition stepped up, he stepped back. He’s about to be in a league with big athletic PGs that I don’t think he could hang with and I wouldn’t draft him in the top 10 hoping that his shot could be consistent enough that it will mask his deficiencies, which are glaring.

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