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  1. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    I think DeRozan improves his defense this offseason. Now that he's draining 3's and passing the ball, it's the only area we can beat up on him about. I will say however that I noticed a big defensive improvment last season from him. He jumped out to intercept a lot of passes. I think his issue on defense is just conditioning. Dude gets tired.
    I hope so, too. I think he needs to be taught what to do. He's not good enough on offense to play Harden on D.

    As for draining 3s... I think you and I have a different definition of "draining" . He's shooting more of them, I'll give you that.

  2. #362
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    It will be interesting to see how DC schemes his defense against the Raptors next season if there isn't a massive turnover on the roster...


    People thinking Derozan doesn't have value need to give their head a shake. He was still voted as the 2nd All NBA team SG this season. Ibaka and Lowry may be tough to get quality for due to performance and contract (respectively), but if they trade DD in his prime for kids and scraps that will be almost as bad as trading VC for garbage back in the day. If you don't get a legit offer that could make you better, you don't get rid of someone who is only 28 and been an all star 4 of the last 5 seasons. (And the only reason it isn't 5 straight seasons is because he missed a good chunk of the first half in 2014-15.) He should be an all-star for the next 5-7 years in the Eastern Conference for crying out loud.

    Lowry wasn't the reason why they lost in the playoffs either. He showed up and played great efficient basketball. Exactly what you want your leaders to do. This team had a rookie and a 2nd year player who didn't even start this year trying to guard the 2nd best player to ever play this game..( behind MJ of course).. and he played out of his mind to beat them (and a very good Celtics team). I mean, how many times has Lebron ever been able to shoot contested 20 ft fade away jump shots from all over the floor like he did this year in the playoffs. I can't ever remember him being able to shoot like that. I mean, they managed to hold him to 3 for 18 from behind the arc, and only gave him 10+ FTA's twice. They almost beat him twice (and really should have won game 1)..and then they essentially caved in game 4 when they knew the outcome was inevitable.....just like Cleveland did in the Finals against Golden State in game 4.


    This is still a very young team that won 59 games playing a totally new system. I don't think they need to "blow it up" at all. I mean, if you can get something like a mid first round or future 1st round pick or something for Ibaka you do it. Or if you can take Ibaka and one or two young players and turn them into a 3rd all-star you do it, but other than that I say you just give this team a new coach who knows how to run a better offense than Nick Nurse.

    Lowry, Derozan, OG, Siakam and JV is still a very good starting 5 imo the way OG and Siakam looked in the playoffs. Those two kids can really play defense, and the 3 vets know how to put the ball in the basket. There is still a TONNE of room for organic growth on this team too. Look how much better Pascal was this year compared to last year on both sides of the ball. Look how much better JV was this year. OG will be going into his second season and one more year removed from knee surgery. I expect we will see an even better defender and a more explosive player going to the basket next year. You know Derozan will be improved in some fashion again next year as he has consistently improved every other off season.


    I say they go into the tax to bring back FVV and keep this train moving forward.
    Derozan has value, just not the kind proposed in that trade scenario. Potential goes unrealized all the time but I've got to think the Lakers have hopes that both those players could equal or be even better than Derozan. the fact they are still kids makes it hard to believe they would consider.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  3. #363
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    Batum for Ibaka

  4. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    Derozan has value, just not the kind proposed in that trade scenario. Potential goes unrealized all the time but I've got to think the Lakers have hopes that both those players could equal or be even better than Derozan. the fact they are still kids makes it hard to believe they would consider.

    Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk
    Derozan is a perennial all star in his prime who can def be a 2nd or 3rd option on most teams. Hasnít been successful in taking a team to the finals as a first option but heís still a valuable piece and there are plenty of teams that would love to have him.

    Iím willing to bet the lakers trade one of Ingram or Kuzma if not both this offseason. If they want Lebron they are going to need pieces outside of their young core. They will have enough cap space to add two stars and trade for a 3rd one. If they strike out on KL and George then I can see them going for a Derozan type. Itís not that far fetched..

    itís not like Ingram is Tatum or Simmons. Letís not over rate their players if weíre going to be fair.

  5. #365
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    Quote Originally Posted by pulzar View Post
    I hope so, too. I think he needs to be taught what to do. He's not good enough on offense to play Harden on D.

    As for draining 3s... I think you and I have a different definition of "draining" . He's shooting more of them, I'll give you that.
    Lol who is ?
    Last edited by smith&wesson; 06-12-2018 at 10:13 AM.

  6. #366
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Derozan is a perennial all star in his prime who can def be a 2nd or 3rd option on most teams. Hasnít been successful in taking a team to the finals as a first option but heís still a valuable piece and there are plenty of teams that would love to have him.

    Iím willing to bet the lakers trade one of Ingram or Kuzma if not both this offseason. If they want Lebron they are going to need pieces outside of their young core. They will have enough cap space to add two stars and trade for a 3rd one. If they strike out on KL and George then I can see them going for a Derozan type. Itís not that far fetched..

    itís not like Ingram is Tatum or Simmons. Letís not over rate their players if weíre going to be fair.
    as good as some raps fans think he is, Derozan and Lowry have sort of tarnished their reputations in the playoffs, fair or not. the number of embarrassing playoff losses has definitely knocked their value. sure there are teams that'd love to have him, but those are the lower and mid-tier markets, not the bigger franchises. I sure as **** don't think the Lakers want Demar Derozan for Ingram lol...


  7. #367
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sadds The Gr8 View Post
    as good as some raps fans think he is, Derozan and Lowry have sort of tarnished their reputations in the playoffs, fair or not. the number of embarrassing playoff losses has definitely knocked their value. sure there are teams that'd love to have him, but those are the lower and mid-tier markets, not the bigger franchises. I sure as **** don't think the Lakers want Demar Derozan for Ingram lol...

    I disagree bro. Maybe fans canít defrientiate between the team and itís players but GMs certainly can. I think people are smart enough to understand the impact of LeBron James. Being eliminated by him every year says more about his greatness then what Derozan may lack as a player.

    Also I think you guys are over rating Ingram. Thereís like 10 young players I prefer to have over him. You guys make it seem like heís untouchable and I really donít think magic views him that way.

  8. #368
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    That is stupid. Ingram is not that good and will never come close to DeRozan. V

  9. #369
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sadds The Gr8 View Post
    as good as some raps fans think he is, Derozan and Lowry have sort of tarnished their reputations in the playoffs, fair or not. the number of embarrassing playoff losses has definitely knocked their value. sure there are teams that'd love to have him, but those are the lower and mid-tier markets, not the bigger franchises. I sure as **** don't think the Lakers want Demar Derozan for Ingram lol...
    Also thereís absolutely nothing embarrassing about losing to Lebron. Thereís a reason why he is being put in the GOAT argument.

    No team has beat him on route to the ECFís in what 7-8years? ... by that logic an entire eastern conference should be embarrassed for the decade

    i have a hunch that other GMs donít view or scout players based on their ability to surpass Lebron in the playoffs. If anything Derozan has a reputation for being a hard worker and dedicated to his kraft.

  10. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Derozan is a perennial all star in his prime who can def be a 2nd or 3rd option on most teams. Hasnít been successful in taking a team to the finals as a first option but heís still a valuable piece and there are plenty of teams that would love to have him.

    Iím willing to bet the lakers trade one of Ingram or Kuzma if not both this offseason. If they want Lebron they are going to need pieces outside of their young core. They will have enough cap space to add two stars and trade for a 3rd one. If they strike out on KL and George then I can see them going for a Derozan type. Itís not that far fetched..

    itís not like Ingram is Tatum or Simmons. Letís not over rate their players if weíre going to be fair.
    I'm not overrating their players. I said right in the post I have to believe the Lakers are hoping that one or both of those players will surpass Derozan as a player. implied in that statement is that they might have overly optimistic hopes for their young guys - as every team always does.

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    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 06-12-2018 at 03:34 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  11. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    I'm not overrating their players. I said right in the post I have to believe the Lakers are hoping that one or both of those players will surpass Derozan as a player. implied in that statement might have overly optimistic hopes for their young guys - as every team always does.

    Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

    Yeah but everyone knows that the lakers are not sticking with the rebuild and youth movement. Outside of Ball I think everyone is available this offseason considering Lebron is their target. I donít imagine they try to sign him to simply play along side a bunch of 22 year olds. Thatís where I got the idea to trade with LA.

    It was just a trade idea and it could be that Iím completely wrong and youíre right but mainly what I was trying to put in to perspective is what the team could do if they wanted to go young and rebuild. If our stars canít net you Ingram and Murray then maybe you stay the course with what you have because I donít think those guys are corner stone type talents.

  12. #372
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Also thereís absolutely nothing embarrassing about losing to Lebron. Thereís a reason why he is being put in the GOAT argument.

    No team has beat him on route to the ECFís in what 7-8years? ... by that logic an entire eastern conference should be embarrassed for the decade

    i have a hunch that other GMs donít view or scout players based on their ability to surpass Lebron in the playoffs. If anything Derozan has a reputation for being a hard worker and dedicated to his kraft.
    It is not the losing, it is the way they lost that is hard to stomach. A less talented Pacers squad took them to game 7 and an injury riddled Celtics squad took cavs to game 7. Raptors couldn't even win one bloody game. DD completely disappeared as he normally does during the playoffs. So a true contender can truly use DD as an option. But we will be hard to find good value for DD.

  13. #373
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Lol who is ?
    Harden.

  14. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Also thereís absolutely nothing embarrassing about losing to Lebron. Thereís a reason why he is being put in the GOAT argument.

    No team has beat him on route to the ECFís in what 7-8years? ... by that logic an entire eastern conference should be embarrassed for the decade
    Teams that are generally weaker than Raptors have taken him to 7 games this year. If we lost putting up a good fight it'd be very different from getting swept again.

    And, yeah, you can argue that two games were close, but the breakdowns in game 1 are exactly the kind of problems that Lowery/Derozan exhibit every game -- cracking under pressure of playoff games. And the other game that was close became close only after Demar was benched.

    I don't know if they need to be embarassed or not, but their playoff performance has been consistently sub-par and worse than most of the competition, Lebron or not.

  15. #375
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    Quote Originally Posted by pulzar View Post
    Teams that are generally weaker than Raptors have taken him to 7 games this year. If we lost putting up a good fight it'd be very different from getting swept again.

    And, yeah, you can argue that two games were close, but the breakdowns in game 1 are exactly the kind of problems that Lowery/Derozan exhibit every game -- cracking under pressure of playoff games. And the other game that was close became close only after Demar was benched.

    I don't know if they need to be embarassed or not, but their playoff performance has been consistently sub-par and worse than most of the competition, Lebron or not.
    But at the end of the day thatís a team loss. Other GMs still look at losing teams and try to nab their best players. Itís not like losing makes GMs turn away. They look at how the piece theyíre getting fits on their team rather than looking at what said player accomplished with the team heís currently on.

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